S01.E03: A Gig’s A Gig

[peachmangosteen]

Quote

Ava gains insight into Deborah’s past.

Airs May 20th.

[arc]

Deborah's fans are "little Debbies", ha!

Marcus is awesome. And it's super obvious he won't cut the sprinklers cause he wants to see the water cop again.

Ava's mini-meltdown over her ex is too relatable.

That fight at the pizza grand opening was harsh. If not for that it would have ended the show prematurely, I would have thought Deborah would have fired Ava on the spot.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Fuck, I'd go to pizza openings too if I got paid $100K. No shame in my game!

[pennben]

I guess I’m outing myself as an old, but is there really any reason to root for Ava?  What has she shown here but an unearned entitled attitude?  Clearly not researching until now a woman who I’m assuming is a stand in for Joan Rivers, meaning a groundbreaker, a grinder who works & works & works, even when not at the level she wants to be at or deserves to be at.  

I will watch each and every minute of Jean Smart on screen, but they woefully misfired on the level of distain initially shown by Ava if they want me to ever care about her.  Know your history before you mock the legends. 

of course she’ll come around and ‘save” the old, but woof, can’t stand her right now and rather see her fired than some half-baked redemption where they save each other. 
 

[Irlandesa]

I think this show could get rid of Ava and it'd be just as watchable.  Heck, it'd be even better.  Jean Smart is amazing.  Deborah is compelling and rootable. 

Not only is Ava coming off as entitled but the actress isn't bringing an extra something to the role that could elevate the material. 

[arc]

In ep 2, Deborah said you have to be great and lucky and even then you have to fight all the time, but is that really true? Sure, she has a fight now that Marty wants to cut her shows. But she’s had a bunch of years - maybe a few decades by now - where she was coasting. Doing a not-that-fresh act in Vegas residency where the audience is mostly rubes, plus a steady gig on QVC.

BTW, based on current ticket prices, Carrot Top’s residency at the Luxor probably does around $25K a night (not including the pandemic), and he only does 200 shows a year. Deborah might do north of 300. Now, I have no idea what the venue’s cut is, but if it’s 50%, that’s still like $3.7M a year in income, before the 10% for the agency and whatever she pays Marcus. $100k and some stock for a daytime grand opening that doesn’t even take her away from a nightly show is still pretty good though.

[Irlandesa]

20 hours ago, arc said:

In ep 2, Deborah said you have to be great and lucky and even then you have to fight all the time, but is that really true? Sure, she has a fight now that Marty wants to cut her shows. But she’s had a bunch of years - maybe a few decades by now - where she was coasting. Doing a not-that-fresh act in Vegas residency where the audience is mostly rubes, plus a steady gig on QVC.

I thought she said you still have to work hard all the time not fight all the time.  That's what they've showed her doing.  She doesn't want to pull back on her sets.  She does QVC to sell some merchandise.  She takes on a restaurant opening.  She tries to hone her skills---and I think this bit happened in this episode but I can't remember so I'll spoiler tag it--

Spoiler

for free on a tour bus.

 She puts up with Ava because Ava turned out to be an unintentionally good sounding board. 

[arc]

1 hour ago, Irlandesa said:

I thought she said you still have to work hard all the time not fight all the time. 

I misremembered, but I don't think I was entirely wrong. From ep 2:

Quote

You have to be so much more than good. And even if you're great and lucky, you still have to work really fucking hard! And even that is not enough. You have to scratch, and claw, and it never fucking ends. And it doesn't get better. It just gets harder.

 

[Irlandesa]

3 minutes ago, arc said:

I misremembered, but I don't think I was entirely wrong. From ep 2:

I forgot the claw part.  I do think the casino guy is indicative of that because she's doing the good/lucky/work hard part and is still subject to the whims of the people paying the money.

I wouldn't say that she's coasting. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I agree that she's still working pretty hard. She could just sit back and count her money and then show up at the casino to do her shows, but she's trying to maximize her business opportunities with QVC, that pizza opening, the MC gig that her manager mentioned, etc. This all underlines the fact that even though she's an established name, she is still not just lying around doing nothing in between shows. We saw that she gets up early, reads lots of newspapers/magazines to stay informed, swims to stay in shape, and books extra appearances outside of her regular job. In contrast, Ava can barely bring herself to make an effort at this job even though she needs the work.

[txhorns79]

6 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

In contrast, Ava can barely bring herself to make an effort at this job even though she needs the work.

A thousand times this.  I get that organizing and digitizing an archive can be mind-numbing, but maybe save your nude selfies for when you aren't working. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

2 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

A thousand times this.  I get that organizing and digitizing an archive can be mind-numbing, but maybe save your nude selfies for when you aren't working. 

I think not taking nude pictures at work is a pretty good rule of thumb no matter where you work or how much you like/dislike your job! Of all the things that Deborah has been snippy about, finding her employee topless in her basement when she was supposed to be working was grounds for being cranky. Take pictures of your naked boobies on your own time, Ava.

[arc]

Deborah is right about a bare minimum of professionalism about not getting naked at work, but WRT babysitting the digitization process, it seems to me like there would be a lot of downtime to read Twitter or IG-stalk an ex.

[Melina22]

I'm baffled by the scene where Deborah asks for jokes about pizzas as they're walking into the gig. How was that even supposed to work when they were surrounded by people? And then she settles for the comment "Throw it in the air and let it fall on your head"? Seriously? She's paying her for this? I don't buy it. 

Final complaint, and not a new one, but how in a show about comedy can they not write Deborah even one joke to perform that makes me laugh, or even smile? I get that she's cheezy and old school, but that doesn’t mean not funny. 

Has Ava written a single genuinely funny joke yet? Not that I've seen. 

I agree that Jean Smart perfectly embodies a big personality / tough / insanely hardworking female comic like a Joan Rivers or even a Roseanne (if she were better organized). But she needs some funny jokes for this show to work. (And apparently she won't be getting them from complainey, entitled, sad sack Ava.) 

Sorry to be so negative, but I was disappointed in this episode. 

Edited May 26, 2021 by Melina22

[ElectricBoogaloo]

2 hours ago, Melina22 said:

I'm baffled by the scene where Deborah asks for jokes about pizzas as they're walking into the gig. How was that even supposed to work when they were surrounded by people?

I thought the same thing. If you want some good material, you might want to give your writer more than 30 seconds notice.

[EtheltoTillie]

15 hours ago, Melina22 said:

I'm baffled by the scene where Deborah asks for jokes about pizzas as they're walking into the gig. How was that even supposed to work when they were surrounded by people? And then she settles for the comment "Throw it in the air and let it fall on your head"? Seriously? She's paying her for this? I don't buy it. 

Final complaint, and not a new one, but how in a show about comedy can they not write Deborah even one joke to perform that makes me laugh, or even smile? I get that she's cheezy and old school, but that doesn’t mean not funny. 

Has Ava written a single genuinely funny joke yet? Not that I've seen. 

I agree that Jean Smart perfectly embodies a big personality / tough / insanely hardworking female comic like a Joan Rivers or even a Roseanne (if she were better organized). But she needs some funny jokes for this show to work. (And apparently she won't be getting them from complainey, entitled, sad sack Ava.) 

Sorry to be so negative, but I was disappointed in this episode. 

I agree with this, but I will still like the show. This is the same problem I have with Mrs Maisel. The jokes in a fiction show are not as funny as real jokes in a real standup show. 

[Melina22]

5 minutes ago, GussieK said:

The jokes in a fiction show are not as funny as real jokes in a real standup show. 

I always wonder why though? With the money available to them for writers and stars, you'd think it would be something they could do. 

[Irlandesa]

On 5/24/2021 at 9:16 AM, txhorns79 said:

A thousand times this.  I get that organizing and digitizing an archive can be mind-numbing, but maybe save your nude selfies for when you aren't working. 

What doubly kills me is that there are librarians/archivists who would sell their souls to get a job like this. Stuck in the basement of the mansion of a celebrated entertainer watching and cataloging classic material?  Sell. their. souls. 

17 hours ago, Melina22 said:

Final complaint, and not a new one, but how in a show about comedy can they not write Deborah even one joke to perform that makes me laugh, or even smile? I get that she's cheezy and old school, but that doesn’t mean not funny.

I'm sort of torn.  I am not watching this for the stand up.  I am watching it because Jean is amazing as Deborah.  So it doesn't bother me that they don't write her funny material.  I do think writing stand up is hard because it's often about building stories leading to the punchlines.  The show isn't really going to dedicate the time to let Deborah build her routine in front of us.  They have other things to do.  So we get 30 seconds, at most, of a routine.  A lot of funny comedy routines will be much less funny if you just pull 30 seconds of them out of context.

[Melina22]

59 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

A lot of funny comedy routines will be much less funny if you just pull 30 seconds of them out of context.

I can't disagree with this. 

[arc]

8 hours ago, Melina22 said:

I always wonder why though? With the money available to them for writers and stars, you'd think it would be something they could do. 

Standup is hard AF to write. As I loosely understand it, real standups mostly write their own material and it usually starts off bad. They work it out in small scale comedy clubs and refine the jokes and the whole act until it’s all great and that can take months to a year. The polished shows in large venues and filmed for comedy specials are the end point of that creative process. Whereas a scripted TV show can gestate for months or years but the actual writing of a season is a few short months, wrestling with a lot more than just the jokes. They’ve got to handle character arcs and plot sequencing, rewrite scenes for budget issues, etc. And, even if you are a script doctor punching up the comedy, it must be really tough to come up with something brilliant and put it in to the show rather than keep it for your own standup act (if you’re there to add funny, you’re probably professionally funny).

[SomeTameGazelle]

On 5/27/2021 at 5:56 AM, arc said:

Standup is hard AF to write. As I loosely understand it, real standups mostly write their own material and it usually starts off bad. They work it out in small scale comedy clubs and refine the jokes and the whole act until it’s all great and that can take months to a year.

When Ava gave Debra new material and expected to hear it in the show that night I expected Debra to explain that her act was a set and she wasn't doing a daily monolog like a late night host. 

 

On 5/26/2021 at 8:27 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I thought the same thing. If you want some good material, you might want to give your writer more than 30 seconds notice.

Especially when she hasn't been getting what she needs from Ava yet, so it seems extra foolish to assume she can rely on her for anything. 

I was also surprised to see Ava leaving Ruby a voicemail after only recently having pitched a joke about how obviously nightmarish voicemails are. 

 

[Iseut]

I also have some trouble getting past the bad standup on this show and Marvelous Mrs. Maisel. I give a little more leeway to this one, since it's literally supposed to be hacky, and also because Jean Smart's character is hilarious in the non standup scenes. 

That said, it was pretty cheesy to show Ava laughing so hard at the old videos...Deborah may have been funnier in her day, and Ava's coming to appreciate her more, but I still don't find it believable that young comic snob Ava would find anything in those old jokes that would warrant those huge laughs. When this show and Maisel depict audiences reacting over the top like that, it takes me out of the show. 

Still enjoying the show a lot, though. I want to see Marcus get with the water cop! That chemistry between them was really well-established in just a few seconds. 

Edited June 3, 2021 by Iseut

[LisaM]

Jean Smart is wonderful and I completely understand her showing up at a pizza parlor opening for $100,000 and stock. Shrewd business move. Definitely reminiscent of Joan Rivers. 

The character of Ava does nothing for me. She could leave the show and I'd be thrilled. So far, all I do is cringe at her. 

I like Marcus and nice to see Gypsy from Gilmore Girls. 

Edited June 22, 2021 by LisaM

[Kel Varnsen]

On 5/23/2021 at 2:22 AM, arc said:

In ep 2, Deborah said you have to be great and lucky and even then you have to fight all the time, but is that really true? Sure, she has a fight now that Marty wants to cut her shows. But she’s had a bunch of years - maybe a few decades by now - where she was coasting. Doing a not-that-fresh act in Vegas residency where the audience is mostly rubes, plus a steady gig on QVC.

I think she probably still has to fight. Even if this is the first time the casino boss has suggested cutting her shows that threat is always there. Plus maintaining the lifestyle she lives is far from cheap. So if she wants to keep it up a lot of money has to keep coming in at a steady rate. Especially if you are doing things like giving away a slightly used Rolls to your personal blackjack dealer. And if this is kind of a Joan Rivers thing, I remember watching a documentary thing where Joan paid college tuition for the kids/grand kids of all the staff who worked in her home.

As for Ava, I think I would like her more if we saw more of how she was actually funny. Only time she has really shown that she is good at comedy is in the first episode when she was telling Deborah off after the failed job interview. 

[Ursula Parrott]

On 5/26/2021 at 8:58 PM, Irlandesa said:

What doubly kills me is that there are librarians/archivists who would sell their souls to get a job like this. Stuck in the basement of the mansion of a celebrated entertainer watching and cataloging classic material?  Sell. their. souls. 

Yes! Not to mention that there are actual skills that go into this kind of work. Metadata schemas, anyone?

[LuvMyShows]

On 5/26/2021 at 6:09 AM, Melina22 said:

Has Ava written a single genuinely funny joke yet? Not that I've seen. 

I agree, and it matters because we the audience are being asked to be sympathetic to Ava's character because of what happened to her.  But if we don't even see that she has the skill necessary to have done the comedy writing job, then it removes the entire source of the sympathy.

On 6/3/2021 at 12:45 PM, Iseut said:

That said, it was pretty cheesy to show Ava laughing so hard at the old videos...Deborah may have been funnier in her day, and Ava's coming to appreciate her more, but I still don't find it believable that young comic snob Ava would find anything in those old jokes that would warrant those huge laughs. When this show and Maisel depict audiences reacting over the top like that, it takes me out of the show. 

This is what I was going to post, but Iseut said it much better!

[LuvMyShows]

On 5/24/2021 at 10:16 AM, txhorns79 said:

A thousand times this.  I get that organizing and digitizing an archive can be mind-numbing, but maybe save your nude selfies for when you aren't working. 

I feel like the writers aren't quite sure how to portray Ava.  Is she really that stunted, that she thought her ex's "I miss you" meant not only do I miss you in a romantic way, but I want to immediately jump back into something hot and heavy with you right now, and apparently even though the ex was with someone else?  If so, I don't feel like that level of cluelessness, or even desperation, has been demonstrated.