Raya and the Last Dragon (2021)

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Quote

Long ago, in the fantasy world of Kumandra, humans and dragons lived together in harmony. However, when sinister monsters known as the Druun threatened the land, the dragons sacrificed themselves to save humanity. Now, 500 years later, those same monsters have returned, and it's up to a lone warrior to track down the last dragon and stop the Druun for good.

Trailer:

Release date: 3/5/21

[Brn2bwild]

Thought it was really good, with great visuals, but what really struck me was how much this felt like a Pixar movie.  No musical numbers, sassy baby ninja, darker themes/outcomes than you might normally see in Disney.  I liked Raya and her relationship with the Fang princess as the focal point of the movie.  Don't know if this will be a very memorable installment, but it was definitely worth shelling out some extra money on Disney+. 

[Scarlett45]

On 3/7/2021 at 10:54 AM, Brn2bwild said:

Thought it was really good, with great visuals, but what really struck me was how much this felt like a Pixar movie.  No musical numbers, sassy baby ninja, darker themes/outcomes than you might normally see in Disney.  I liked Raya and her relationship with the Fang princess as the focal point of the movie.  Don't know if this will be a very memorable installment, but it was definitely worth shelling out some extra money on Disney+. 

I wasn't planning seeing this for a few months, but since I am the person that paid for 3yrs of Disney+, one of my friends who has a profile bought it so her twins could watch it, and I thought "cool I will give it a shot". 

It DID feel like a Pixar movie. Lately Disney animation studios has been alternating between "Traditional fairytale" and "untraditional animation", think Zootopia, Moana, Ralph Breaks the Internet then Frozen II, so I expected this to be untraditional, but I still felt Pixar. You can see every dollar on the screen, it was visually beautiful, and I loved the inspiration of various Southeast Asian cultures in the film- but I dont think Awakafina as Sisu really brought tons to the story.... "trust" a good theme, but should Raya have trusted the Fang princess, Namaari? I thought Kelly Marie Twan did a great job as Raya, I see more voice work in her future.

Did anyone else notice the credits section acknowledging the completion of the film during WFH life and the "You're on mute." joke? It thought that was endearing. 

[arc]

Looked beautiful. Wonderful to see all their research and inspirations onscreen. But the story felt like if this was a videogame, the movie was a speedrun of it. Namaari’s face turn felt rushed. The whole thing where Sisu got shot felt rushed. I don’t think it’s just my inherent pro-TV bias to say this could have been better as a TV show, maybe 6-12 hours total.

I read that the writers wanted to subvert the idea of Sisu being the savior, that it should be up to the humans to come together. Great in theory but just a little off in execution overall, not that I can see how to do it better.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Visually, I loved this movie. It was so beautiful - the colors, the movement, everything was just gorgeous.

[Spartan Girl]

Watched tonight. Once again, Disney gave us a very timely movie about a broken world with a plague and people who can’t trust each other. Visually gorgeous and a great voice cast. Kelly Marie Tran deserves everything coming her way after all the crap she went through.

On March 8, 2021 at 2:22 PM, Scarlett45 said:

"trust" a good theme, but should Raya have trusted the Fang princess, Namaari?

This was my issue of the movie too. The Namaari and the people of Fang might not have meant to cause any destruction but they still caused it. And Namaari saying Raya was as much to blame for Sisu getting shot was out of line. Bitch, YOU were the one who betrayed her all those years ago, Raya was right not to trust you, and even when Sisu encouraged her to give you another chance, YOU were the one who brought the crossbow anyway. Take responsibility for your own actions! Sheesh.

Awkafina’s Sisu reminded me so much of Genie.

Wish I could have seen this in theaters. It deserved to get more than it’s getting at the box office.

Edited March 14, 2021 by Spartan Girl

[Wiendish Fitch]

I really enjoyed this. Visually stunning with gorgeous, inventive world-building and creatures (I loved the shrew/butterfly hybrids), and I'll chime in on the vindication of Kelly Marie Tran. Eat it, trolls, she's a fucking Disney Princess now! Raya might be the most badass princess to come along in a while. She has to navigate through a dystopian world, and she'll do whatever she has to to survive. The moral of the movie was similar to Wonder Woman: Humans suck and aren't worth saving... save 'em anyway. Simultaneously hopeful and nihilistic. 

Sisu was irritating at first, but grew on me (coincidentally, Awkwafina has the same effect on me). Did anyone else get kind of a My Little Pony vibe from her character design? 

Tuk Tuk is wonderful. That is all.

The con-baby felt a little "Dreamworks-y", but thankfully didn't detract from the story.

Honestly, there was one big, fat, glaring flaw that kind of keeps me from loving this as much as I should, and that's Namaari. No joke, I got some horrible Catra from She-Ra and the Princesses of Power vibes from her. Kelly Marie Tran recently said in an interview that she believes that Raya is gay, and the instant I read that, I suddenly got flashbacks to the disgustingly toxic, codependent, not remotely romantic Catra/Adora 'ship from the aforementioned show. Now, the movie does not seem to be hinting at a romance between Raya and Namaari (unless I'm too dumb to see it), and we don't even see them interacting all that much at the end...

But the Internet's gonna Internet. I'm sure, at this moment, there are already thousands of fanfic and fanart 'shipping the hell out of these two. Far be it from me to spoil anyone's fun, but for God's sake, Raya and Namaari knew each other for all of an hour when they were 12, and have spent the last six years with dangerously conflicting goals and barely in the same vicinity,  and they nearly kill each other in the climax. As much as I loathe the Catra/Adora 'ship, at least there was some foundation for it.

Please don't get me wrong, I want more LGBTQ representation in media, but Raya is so far out of Namaari's league, she's in another solar system. Raya, sweetie, you're a gem, and the human race has been saved. You have options now, and better ones than friggin' Namaari!

Besides, if they ever got together, Namaari would have to prepare to lose every argument because of what Raya has on her.

Namaari: Ugh, you always get mud on the floor!

Raya: Oh, I'm so sorry I got mud on the floor! How thoughtless of me! Say, remember that time you manipulated me and took advantage of my naïveté and trust, helped cause the near apocalypse, and forced me into exile for six years while my precious father was turned to stone?

Namaari: Never mind...

 

7 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

 

This was my issue of the movie too. The Namaari and the people of Fang might not have meant to cause any destruction but they still caused it. And Namaari saying Raya was as much to blame for Sisu getting shot was out of line. Bitch, YOU were the one who betrayed her all those years ago, Raya was right not to trust you, and even when Sisu encouraged her to give you another chance, YOU were the one who brought the crossbow ant my way. Take responsibility for your own actions! Sheesh.

I knew you could put this more succinctly than I could, Spartan Girl.  It could be argued that Raya made a foolish mistake as a kid showing Namaari the crystal, but she was just a kid, and spent years trying to make up for it. 

And, hey, Namaari? If you want to convey you don't want fight, how about dropping your fucking weapon?! 

[Spartan Girl]

2 hours ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

But the Internet's gonna Internet. I'm sure, at this moment, there are already thousands of fanfic and fanart 'shipping the hell out of these two. Far be it from me to spoil anyone's fun, but for God's sake, Raya and Namaari knew each other for all of an hour when they were 12, and have spent the last six years with dangerously conflicting goals and barely in the same vicinity,  and they nearly kill each other in the climax. As much as I loathe the Catra/Adora 'ship, at least there was some foundation for it.

Please don't get me wrong, I want more LGBTQ representation in media, but Raya is so far out of Namaari's league, she's in another solar system. Raya, sweetie, you're a gem, and the human race has been saved. You have options now, and better ones than friggin' Namaari!

THANK YOU.

You're right, the Internet is gonna Internet, and yes they have been shipping Namaari and Raya. It's so annoying for all the reasons you mentioned, including the resemblance to the Catra bullshit. 🙄🙄🙄

Forgot to add how much I loved Tuk Tuk, not to mention how Benedict Wong's character was the only one who checked the monkey baby's clothes to find our her name.

[Ravenya003]

Totally agree with upthread. Look, it was a beautiful movie, and Raya was a fantastic character. And to a certain point, I can take the message in the spirit with which it was intended: that there is no life or happiness if people don't trust each other.

But MAN they botched the delivery of this, which is part of a greater pattern that's so prevalent throughout entertainment these days: that good people are morally obliged to give endless second chances to the people who hurt them. It's just fiction, but the constant reiteration of this theme across media is getting kinda creepy. This movie would have worked so much better if Namaari had spent her adulthood feeling guilty for what she did as a child with the dragon stone, desperately trying to make amends with Raya, and Raya steadfastly refusing to forgive her. 

As it is, Namaari pretty much gets off scot-free. At least Kylo Ren had the decency to die and not come back again. 

This review said it nicely: "Here is the Raya’s most intractable problem: It’s a story about the importance of trust that spends nearly all its running time establishing that trust is for chumps and you’ll get suckered every time. Then it asks its characters to turn around and trust everything to someone who betrayed their trust again and again. It’s about redemption without work and reconciliation without reckoning."

Also this YouTube review: Raya's Moral Isn't a Good Lesson. Please, can we make bad guys WORK for their redemption, instead of having it constantly handed to them on a silver platter? I promise, the story will improve!

[Bill1978]

13 hours ago, Ravenya003 said:

Please, can we make bad guys WORK for their redemption, instead of having it constantly handed to them on a silver platter?

I actually miss the classic Disney villain. Where they are evil because the story says they are and they are evil from the start until their death. I think Dr. Facilier was the last true Disney villain (I'm ignoring those twist villains like the ones we got in Frozen and Wreck It Ralph). Actually maybe I just miss a really good villain song.

[AimingforYoko]

3 hours ago, Bill1978 said:

Actually maybe I just miss a really good villain song.

 

[Wiendish Fitch]

18 hours ago, Ravenya003 said:

Totally agree with upthread. Look, it was a beautiful movie, and Raya was a fantastic character. And to a certain point, I can take the message in the spirit with which it was intended: that there is no life or happiness if people don't trust each other.

But MAN they botched the delivery of this, which is part of a greater pattern that's so prevalent throughout entertainment these days: that good people are morally obliged to give endless second chances to the people who hurt them. It's just fiction, but the constant reiteration of this theme across media is getting kinda creepy. This movie would have worked so much better if Namaari had spent her adulthood feeling guilty for what she did as a child with the dragon stone, desperately trying to make amends with Raya, and Raya steadfastly refusing to forgive her. 

As it is, Namaari pretty much gets off scot-free. At least Kylo Ren had the decency to die and not come back again. 

This review said it nicely: "Here is the Raya’s most intractable problem: It’s a story about the importance of trust that spends nearly all its running time establishing that trust is for chumps and you’ll get suckered every time. Then it asks its characters to turn around and trust everything to someone who betrayed their trust again and again. It’s about redemption without work and reconciliation without reckoning."

Also this YouTube review: Raya's Moral Isn't a Good Lesson. Please, can we make bad guys WORK for their redemption, instead of having it constantly handed to them on a silver platter? I promise, the story will improve!

BINGO.

As much as I enjoyed the movie, warts and all... that particular wart  is too big and ugly to ignore. 

Namaari showed (and clearly felt) no remorse, contrition, or sorrow for the misery (the near-Apocalypse, basically) she helped cause and her cruel betrayal of Raya's trust. Why didn't they have it so, from Raya's point of view, Namaari appeared to be up to no good, but then it turns out she's been trying to help all along, driven by crippling guilt, and  Raya realizes that her quest has hardened her and she needs to learn to forgive Namaari as well as herself? That way, they could have both been sympathetic.

But, like I said earlier, Namaari is basically Catra: She gets heaps of second chances and forgiveness, but doesn't so much as lift a finger to earn them. But, hey, she has a nice haircut, and she kinda sorta helps out a little.

 "Come on, doesn't everyone deserve a second chance?" some might mewl at me. 

I'll put this as succinctly as I can: NO.

No. Absolutely not. Some people can earn another chance, and then there are those who commit crimes and transgressions so vile, that to give them another chance would be just as great a sin. If you think that's too harsh, ask yourself this: Do you want Keith Raniere back on the street? Larry Nassar? Chris Watts? The surviving members of Charles Manson's Family? I sure hope not.

Sorry, didn't mean to get heavy, but I agree with Ravenya003 that easy, indiscriminate forgiveness and blithe acceptance of mistreatment aren't the healthiest things to impart to our kids. I mean, for crying out loud, the character of Starlight Glimmer on My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic is a former cult leader, but we're supposed to buy she's on the side of good now?! WTF??? (Sorry, but that bothers me way more than it should, probably because my niece used to love that show).

Please don't misunderstand me, I think forgiveness is an important, necessary, absolutely vital component to life, but it must be given mindfully with great care and caution. Harold S. Kushner loves to iterate how forgiveness is ultimately something you do for yourself, not the other person. I wish more writers would keep this in mind.

As Stephen Sondheim said, "Careful the things you say/Children will listen..."

[Spartan Girl]

Unfortunately Disney pulled this same crap with Tangled the Series, with Casandra going evil and blaming Rapunzel for everything that ever went wrong in her life, and Rapunzel bending over backwards to keep giving Cassandra chances that she neither earned nor deserved by that point -- even by the usual Disney Princess standards for infinite forgiveness it was pretty pathetic. All it took was a few eleventh hour tears and everything Cassandra did was forgiven.

Though in fairness, Cassandra and Rapunzel had been friends for longer before the writers messed it up. Namaari and Raya? Not so much.

My standards for forgiveness is if this person suffered consequences and/or tried to make amends. In Namaari and the kingdom of Fang's case, it was nope and nope. They were just upset that people blamed them for something that really was their fault.

[BetterButter]

 

[Spartan Girl]

15 minutes ago, BetterButter said:

 

See? Even Honest Trailers is calling out Namaari on her crap! "Actually, NO. NO. We've been watching the movie. YOU'RE the one that shot her." THANK YOU!

But calling her Zuko is an insult to Zuko. He had a much better redemption arc! 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

On 3/22/2021 at 9:45 AM, Wiendish Fitch said:

I think forgiveness is an important, necessary, absolutely vital component to life, but it must be given mindfully with great care and caution.

In addition, you can forgive someone and still not trust them or want them to be part of your life or give them the opportunity to betray you again.

Sure, some people deserve a second chance but not everyone does. There's a big difference between "she called me a mean name and hurt my feelings ten years ago" and "she lied to my face, manipulated me, and actively tried to destroy my people."

[Wiendish Fitch]

1 hour ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

In addition, you can forgive someone and still not trust them or want them to be part of your life or give them the opportunity to betray you again.

Sure, some people deserve a second chance but not everyone does. There's a big difference between "she called me a mean name and hurt my feelings ten years ago" and "she lied to my face, manipulated me, and actively tried to destroy my people."

Again, someone phrased it much better than I could, so thanks, ElectricBoogaloo.

I forgive the kids who bullied me growing up, but that doesn't mean we're bestest pals now. I forgive them, wish 'em well, but that's all they're getting from me. I don't owe them any more than that.

Back to the movie, I wonder if this is one of those Disney rush jobs, where they were on such a tight deadline that they didn't have time to polish the script? I really feel they could have edited the story here and there so it would have been stronger. As I keep saying, it would not have been that difficult to make Namaari more sympathetic (if that is indeed what they were going for), but it really feels like they threw up their hands and said, "y'know, we got the princess and the pretty dragon, what more do the little rugrats want?!"

 

Yeah, Disney? Your movies are not just for kids, and some of us adults take a little bit of umbrage with this particular plot.

 

If I were playing script doctor...

Why not have Namaari's mom turn to stone the same day as Raya's dad? It would not only be a cruel irony, but then it would have been like a parallel quest for Namaari as well? Maybe she'd have to be a leader at a young age, and losing her childhood to such a terrible event would have opened her eyes to her hateful treatment of Raya? Then maybe for years she's been trying to help Raya, or at least get her attention to apologize and make amends? Yeah, that's not perfect, because it's the classic "shoe's on the other foot" situation, but considering how pretty Namaari's been sitting for six years, it's at least something. After all, it feels like Fang plotted to do this in the first place because Heart was doing so darn well and, y'know, jealousy's a bitch (and so's Namaari). 

 

 

[Spartan Girl]

7 hours ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

If I were playing script doctor...

Why not have Namaari's mom turn to stone the same day as Raya's dad? It would not only be a cruel irony, but then it would have been like a parallel quest for Namaari as well? Maybe she'd have to be a leader at a young age, and losing her childhood to such a terrible event would have opened her eyes to her hateful treatment of Raya? Then maybe for years she's been trying to help Raya, or at least get her attention to apologize and make amends? Yeah, that's not perfect, because it's the classic "shoe's on the other foot" situation, but considering how pretty Namaari's been sitting for six years, it's at least something. After all, it feels like Fang plotted to do this in the first place because Heart was doing so darn well and, y'know, jealousy's a bitch (and so's Namaari). 

Yeah it would have been nice if she and her kingdom suffered any kind of consequences from the gem splitting instead of basically living the good life for all those years. And no, Namaari’s mom and the kingdom turning to stone after she shot Sisu doesn’t count because then she got to pass the buck to Raya.

[tennisgurl]

There is a lot to love about this movie, especially the animation, which is utterly gorgeous, and the world they created is unique and engaging, I loved the emphasis on the cultures and folklore of Southeast Asia. I thought Kelly Marie Tran was great (suck it trolls) and in general the voice cast did a great job. I recognized a lot of people right away but other people sounded really different in a way that worked really well. I thought that Raya was a great lead, it had a lot of fun supporting characters, set up an interesting world, and her armadillo buddy was flipping adorable. In fact, for a pretty dark movie by Disney standards, it had a real abundance of cute critters and future plush toys, but not in an annoying way. For the most part, I really liked this a lot. It was my first time in the theaters in over a year, and I am glad that my first movie in ages was such a beautiful one to see on the big screen.

That being said, I agree with a lot of people here that the message could have been done a lot better. Its a good message, that you have to trust people and reach out to people you might otherwise not trust to get anything good accomplished, but I think it could have been done a lot better, mainly because it fell into the same thing a lot of media has been repeating for years, that bad guys should always be given chance upon chance and all of their crappy behavior should be overlooked if they do the bare minimum to not be a colossal dick and the good guys should never hold a grudge against them ever. I cant blame Rava or any other the others for not trusting the Fang princess and her people, they really did totally screw everyone over out of selfishness. They went to a peace conference to steal the hosts stuff, and even if they didn't know they would be unleashing an ancient evil that turned over half the population to stone, that is still a really awful thing to do. I cant blame anyone for not giving them the benefit of the doubt. They did finally come around in the end, but seemingly only when they're own home was threatened and at the last minute. I wanted to see more of Namaari showing more remorse and growth as she saw what she had done and actually tried to make up for it and make peace. Even when she shows up to give them the last peace of the stone, she still pulls a crossbow on them, even if she didn't actually mean to fire the shot that hit Sisu. They wanted to show that Raya lost her ability to trust and that she needed to get it back, which is fine and was often handled well otherwise, but it was like they wanted her to immediately be cool with Namaari after she caused her to lose her people and her father and generally screw the world over without Namaari even having to do much of anything to earn that trust.

I thought at first that the message would be more about how people need to work together to achieve things, even people that are really different and who's people have been previously in conflict, and that was there as well, and in fact worked a bit better than the trust thing. The whole metaphor where Rava's dad makes her the yummy soup made from exports from each tribe which tastes great while her jerky she makes on her own tastes awful and she makes it again when she opens up to her Fellowship of the Dragons, its on the nose but it works, especially for kids. You could also say its about how peace is hard, it cant happen just because of one big speech or one meeting, you have to get to know people and you have to work at it. That's why when the dragons stopped the evil bad vibes spirits they all turned to stone and everyone stayed separate while the problem was just locked up and not destroyed, it was a band aide instead of a fix, it needed humans to really come together to really deal with their problems, so Raya needed to gather her Fellowship of people from every tribe to complete the quest and really understand that people from the other tribes could be trusted. Or I thought maybe it could even be about how you shouldn't stereotype people based on broad generalizations, like when Raya at the beginning only knew about the fighting style of every tribe while her dad talked about their cooking and exports, and that all cultures are more nuanced than they can appear and you need to really try to understand them to achieve peace. But while the broad idea of the message of trust was good, it can easily be seen as yet another villain apology-a-than where bad guys can do whatever they want then give some sad eyes and its all good and anyone who has a problem with that is the REAL villain. So slow your roll there Namaari with the "your just the same as ME!" crap to Rava towards the end, that is just not true. I am just annoyed by this message that media keeps dumping on us, that bad guys can do any horrible thing they want and can be forgiven right away but if a hero makes one mistake or has some understandable issues, they're now Just As Bad as the villains, even when the equivalency is clearly false. Rava is cynical and struggles with trust issues and that made her a bit trigger happy. Namaari and her mother broke the trust of their whole continent at a peace summit to steal their hosts resources for their own personal wants which would go on to just about destroy the world and then they built up their own happy little island kingdom while their neighbors were all destroyed and they continued to try and screw over Raya as she tried to save everyone until almost the very end. Its really not the same thing. Forgiveness or even just moving on from anger is great, but it should be either because the other person really is trying to be better, be for the sake of the person forgiving, or some combination.

The ending gave me some Avengers Endgame vibes, especially when Raya's father was un-stoned and he saw his now adult daughter. That's going to be a lot to deal with, especially for people who have been stone for the whole time. 

Edited April 6, 2021 by tennisgurl

[Wiendish Fitch]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

There is a lot to love about this movie, especially the animation, which is utterly gorgeous, and the world they created is unique and engaging, I loved the emphasis on the cultures and folklore of Southeast Asia. I thought Kelly Marie Tran was great (suck it trolls) and in general the voice cast did a great job. I recognized a lot of people right away but other people sounded really different in a way that worked really well. I thought that Raya was a great lead, it had a lot of fun supporting characters, set up an interesting world, and her armadillo buddy was flipping adorable. In fact, for a pretty dark movie by Disney standards, it had a real abundance of cute critters and future plush toys, but not in an annoying way. For the most part, I really liked this a lot. It was my first time in the theaters in over a year, and I am glad that my first movie in ages was such a beautiful one to see on the big screen.

That being said, I agree with a lot of people here that the message could have been done a lot better. Its a good message, that you have to trust people and reach out to people you might otherwise not trust to get anything good accomplished, but I think it could have been done a lot better, mainly because it fell into the same thing a lot of media has been repeating for years, that bad guys should always be given chance upon chance and all of their crappy behavior should be overlooked if they do the bare minimum to not be a colossal dick and the good guys should never hold a grudge against them ever. I cant blame Rava or any other the others for not trusting the Fang princess and her people, they really did totally screw everyone over out of selfishness. They went to a peace conference to steal the hosts stuff, and even if they didn't know they would be unleashing an ancient evil that turned over half the population to stone, that is still a really awful thing to do. I cant blame anyone for not giving them the benefit of the doubt. They did finally come around in the end, but seemingly only when they're own home was threatened and at the last minute. I wanted to see more of Namaari showing more remorse and growth as she saw what she had done and actually tried to make up for it and make peace. Even when she shows up to give them the last peace of the stone, she still pulls a crossbow on them, even if she didn't actually mean to fire the shot that hit Sisu. They wanted to show that Raya lost her ability to trust and that she needed to get it back, which is fine and was often handled well otherwise, but it was like they wanted her to immediately be cool with Namaari after she caused her to lose her people and her father and generally screw the world over without Namaari even having to do much of anything to earn that trust.

I thought at first that the message would be more about how people need to work together to achieve things, even people that are really different and who's people have been previously in conflict, and that was there as well, and in fact worked a bit better than the trust thing. The whole metaphor where Rava's dad makes her the yummy soup made from exports from each tribe which tastes great while her jerky she makes on her own tastes awful and she makes it again when she opens up to her Fellowship of the Dragons, its on the nose but it works, especially for kids. You could also say its about how peace is hard, it cant happen just because of one big speech or one meeting, you have to get to know people and you have to work at it. That's why when the dragons stopped the evil bad vibes spirits they all turned to stone and everyone stayed separate while the problem was just locked up and not destroyed, it was a band aide instead of a fix, it needed humans to really come together to really deal with their problems, so Raya needed to gather her Fellowship of people from every tribe to complete the quest and really understand that people from the other tribes could be trusted. Or I thought maybe it could even be about how you shouldn't stereotype people based on broad generalizations, like when Raya at the beginning only knew about the fighting style of every tribe while her dad talked about their cooking and exports, and that all cultures are more nuanced than they can appear and you need to really try to understand them to achieve peace. But while the broad idea of the message of trust was good, it can easily be seen as yet another villain apology-a-than where bad guys can do whatever they want then give some sad eyes and its all good and anyone who has a problem with that is the REAL villain. So slow your roll there Namaari with the "your just the same as ME!" crap to Rava towards the end, that is just not true. I am just annoyed by this message that media keeps dumping on us, that bad guys can do any horrible thing they want and can be forgiven right away but if a hero makes one mistake or has some understandable issues, they're now Just As Bad as the villains, even when the equivalency is clearly false. Rava is cynical and struggles with trust issues and that made her a bit trigger happy. Namaari and her mother broke the trust of their whole continent at a peace summit to steal their hosts resources for their own personal wants which would go on to just about destroy the world and then they built up their own happy little island kingdom while their neighbors were all destroyed and they continued to try and screw over Raya as she tried to save everyone until almost the very end. Its really not the same thing. Forgiveness or even just moving on from anger is great, but it should be either because the other person really is trying to be better, be for the sake of the person forgiving, or some combination.

The ending gave me some Avengers Endgame vibes, especially when Raya's father was un-stoned and he saw his now adult daughter. That's going to be a lot to deal with, especially for people who have been stone for the whole time. 

Beautifully put, tennisgurl.

I'm fine with Raya's arc about learning to trust again. Here's the truth: trusting no one is just as dangerous as being too trusting, because, like it or not, we need each other. Still, trust is a precious commodity; if you break it, you should go through a trial by fire to earn it back, because it's your own fault that you violated another's faith in you. 

That being said, I don't like that the onus of growing as a person seems to be resting entirely on Raya. Does she have flaws that need to be addressed and overcome? Of course, that's true of all of us. Is she the one who caused the near-apocalypse? No, that's our pal Namaari's doing. Like you said, writers need to have a little perspective and stop giving horrible characters easy outs on the path to forgiveness. Similarly, heroes ought to be allowed to be imperfect and not be so friggin' hippy-dippy with people who repeatedly hurt them (seriously, Thor, stop giving Loki second chances, he's done crap all to earn 'em!). 

 

[Bill1978]

My main issue with the plotting of the film was the double prologue exposition at the start that then got repeated during the movie. There was so much repeating of the opening prologues within the main story that in the end something should have been removed - either we got the opening expositions OR we got flashbacks not both. And I feel maybe we should have lost the prologues and just been thrown into this unknown world and learn about it as we went along. BUT I do understand from a young kids point of view why they wanted the prologues, so therefore we should have lost the flashbacks - mainly thinking of the dragon's original loss in battle.

Alternatively. both Prologues could have been included with Raya telling Sisu how the last stone broke and then Sisu's explanation would not sound repetitive when she told the dragon's involvement in Kamandra etc.

[blackwing]

Just saw this movie over the weekend, and I thought it was great.  Great storytelling overall.  

I wonder about the timing of the release though... will it be remembered for Best Animated Feature come next year's Oscars?  I actually enjoyed this movie a lot more than "Soul" and would have voted for it over "Soul" this year.

[zoey1996]

On 3/13/2021 at 11:00 PM, Spartan Girl said:

Wish I could have seen this in theaters. It deserved to get more than it’s getting at the box office.

I saw it in a theater this afternoon. Well worth it!

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Kelly Marie Tran singing You and Me (But Mostly Me) from The Book of Mormon at Miscast 21

 

[AnimeMania]

I watched this on Disney+ and had a few questions.

Why did the dragons come back the second time and not the first? That was way more dragons than I thought there would be.

Why did Namaari's mother give Namaari the stone without having every soldier in Fang making sure that Namaari didn't lose it, and retrieved the other pieces of stone?

Did the Druun turn all animals to stone or did they make an exception for the monkeys?

What was harder to believe existed dragons or con baby?

[Camera One]

I finally watched this, and I'm glad I'm not alone.  

I enjoyed most of the movie and found it quite fun.  The moment that made me roll my eyes ever after was when Namaari declared that Raya was just as much to blame as her for the shooting of Sisu.  Namaari showed little to no remorse for what she did and continued to do, yet the lesson of the day was you have to put your complete full trust in a backstabber and they will impress you with making the right choice!  I could have grown to like Namaari but I didn't appreciate being manipulated into feeling like she deserved another chance (unearned).

Overall, though, the beauty of the movie and the fact it was quite engaging still wins out overall, but probably limits the rewatch potential a bit.

[Spartan Girl]

Made its cable debut this last weekend, and now I’m pissed off all over again. The kingdom of Fang can ROT.

Okay, okay not the innocent civilians, just their leaders, namely Namaari and her bitch mother.