S01.E04 You Can't Rule Me

[AimingforYoko]

Quote

Following the assassination of a suspect, Clarice and VICAP are investigated by Krendler's rival at the Bureau. When Ardelia is recruited to assist him, it causes friction between the two friends.

Ardelia sees things for how they are, but couldn't see Herman was using her for her connection to Clarice? Really? 

I'm glad they're making Clarice flawed, it makes her more interesting.

[sempervivum]

4 minutes ago, AimingforYoko said:

Ardelia sees things for how they are, but couldn't see Herman was using her for her connection to Clarice? Really? 

I was having trouble understanding the whole confrontation between Ardelia and Clarice, actually. Ardelia was willing to throw Krendler under the bus in hopes of getting Herman to promote her (I guess), but what was her issue with Clarice and her 'feelings'?

There was a reference to the Terry Schiavo case (in relation to the care facility for vegetative -state patients), but that didn't happen until 1998.

I was kind of warming up to this show, but the ending of this episode (and the previews for next week) were stupid. Clarice has been told more than once not to go charging in with no backup, but she just doesn't learn.

[preeya]

The old twin sister caper. I called it the moment she said she was a twin.

[Annber03]

3 hours ago, sempervivum said:

I was having trouble understanding the whole confrontation between Ardelia and Clarice, actually. Ardelia was willing to throw Krendler under the bus in hopes of getting Herman to promote her (I guess), but what was her issue with Clarice and her 'feelings'?

I think it's mainly the idea that Clarice may sympathize with Ardelia, or claim to, at least, but she doesn't really, truly seem to get what Ardelia's had to go through. And the fact she kept ignoring Ardelia's requests to stop talking to her about the case and everything showed she had trouble really listening to what she was saying. Basically, Ardelia seemed to be saying, "Actions speak louder than words", and wanted Clarice to keep that in mind in the future. 

I did like the tension between them-it made for an interesting wrinkle in the situation they were both dealing with. And I liked Ardelia's interaction with Agent Garrett as well. I wonder if she'll ultimately take him up on his invitation to join that group. 

Also liked seeing Clarice and Shaan working together this episode. 

[AnimeMania]

3 hours ago, preeya said:

The old twin sister caper. I called it the moment she said she was a twin.

Same, one not being seen for over 5 years and the picture of one of them in a wheelchair made it even more obvious.

[Dowel Jones]

Note to all field agents:  Watch some television once in awhile.  You'll find out that whenever there is a surprise twist, the bad guy/girl is waiting there behind you to clobber your dumbass for not paying attention to your surroundings.

[tennisgurl]

Come on Clarice, everyone all episode kept lecturing you on how you shouldn't go off into possibly dangerous situations by yourself and need to learn to rely on your team, and then you immediately go off into a potentially dangerous situation by yourself without your team? And then got caught with the old "bad guy sneaks up behind you and knocks you out" bit? Really? 

Despite that, I did like this episode and I am glad they are fleshing out the supporting cast more. We even got some decently funny banter between the agents, which I think helped give the episode some life. 

I also knew right away what was going on the second we found out that the doctor was a twin. Nobody in a mystery is ever "just" a twin without it being a major plot point, usually involving a twin switch. 

[Cotypubby]

12 hours ago, preeya said:

The old twin sister caper. I called it the moment she said she was a twin.

Same. The moment she said the missing woman was her twin I thought "Nuh uh! You're that woman and you're pretending to be your sister!"

I also caught the anachronistic mention of Terry Schiavo. I didn't think that case would have been that early because I remember hearing about it and I was just a little kid in 1993, so I checked and it didn't make the news until 1998-2000, which fits my memory.

[CountryCrazy]

So far this is my favorite new series ! I like all the cast and characters 👏! I like the interaction between Clarice and Tomas and like their chemistry too!! 

[mythoughtis]

I must be really obtuse.  I did not get that this show was based in 1993 until I read all the comments for this series  in this forum tonight.  now I will have to start paying  attention to things like the peice of equipment Murray using to text with etc

I thought Ardelia was out of line.  Clarice wasn’t trying to sabotage her investigation into the murder of their suspect. She was trying to get Ardelia to help her with the original investigation. There was no conflict there.   To me it just seemed like Ardelia had a chip on her shoulder and was blaming Clarice for the actions of  FBI management that resulted in discrimination against Ardelia. 
 

My ability to follow along with Clarice’s history is hampered by the fact that I did not watch Silence of the Lambs or any offshoots of it .... and have no desire to do so. 

[ShellsandCheese]

56 minutes ago, mythoughtis said:

I thought Ardelia was out of line.  Clarice wasn’t trying to sabotage her investigation into the murder of their suspect. She was trying to get Ardelia to help her with the original investigation. There was no conflict there.   To me it just seemed like Ardelia had a chip on her shoulder and was blaming Clarice for the actions of  FBI management that resulted in discrimination against Ardelia. 

I’m on Ardelia’s side. Ardelia isn’t going to be extended the same grace as Clarice if there is even a hint or a remote possibility that she (Ardelia) was letting her personal relationship with Clarice impact her being told to investigate VICAP.

If Clarice would listen and pay attention she would have realized what a tenuous position Ardelia was already in, as a black woman delegated to working cold cases. I don’t blame Ardelia for not risking everything to help Clarice with the original investigation; she wasn’t obligated to do so, it could have been used against her, and it absolutely could have let some twist it and portray it as a conflict - as in Ardelia can’t do her job. 

[AnimeMania]

I think Ardelia's problem is that she has to show the who, what, where, when and why of how she got any information she obtained in her investigation. She can't just hand them a folder full of facts that she can't prove that she obtained herself. Anyway, Ardelia already found all the information (and more) that Clarice was trying to give her hours ago, she is a way better investigator than Clarice, she just needs an opportunity to prove it.

[dshgr]

It might be because I'm old, but I don't have a problem with Krendler.  There are rules for a reason, most of which apply to safety and legal procedure.  Once they find Clarice in the care facility, she should be terminated from the FBI.

[Rambler]

On 3/5/2021 at 9:54 AM, tennisgurl said:

Come on Clarice, everyone all episode kept lecturing you on how you shouldn't go off into possibly dangerous situations by yourself and need to learn to rely on your team, and then you immediately go off into a potentially dangerous situation by yourself without your team? And then got caught with the old "bad guy sneaks up behind you and knocks you out" bit? Really? 

These were two completely different situations though. What they were lecturing her on was in the Buffalo Bill case, after she found out who he was, she pursued a dangerous criminal into his basement dungeon without first calling for backup while she was still a cadet and not fully trained as a field agent. However, as Hannibal Lecter famously exposed in Silence of the Lambs, Clarice had been having nightmares about seeing lambs being slaughtered when she was little and hearing their screaming in her head. Lecter suggested that she believed by saving Catherine the nightmares would come to an end. Krendler and the others don't know about this, which is why they keep lecturing her about working as team and Clarice is having a tough time adapting.

In the current case, how could Clarice anticipate that she was walking into a dangerous situation? After all, what self-respecting criminal mastermind, who can call up highly skilled assassins that can kill a witness in the middle of FBI headquarters and seemingly has connections to the highest level of the government, be doing working all day as a nurse in a dingy coma hospital? Even I had to roll my eyes at that one. I hope there is an explanation later. Again she was so hyper-focused on saving the victim in the bed that she missed evil nurse sneaking up behind her. Anyways it was the early 90's before cell phones were in wide use (I think), so she couldn't exactly whip a phone out of her purse and call for backup.

[Dowel Jones]

Or at least turn around and put her back to the wall in a defensive position, instead of leaning over the bed and talking to the sister.

[Tachi Rocinante]

I have liked Natalie Brown in just about everything I've seen her in.  That's all I got.

[candall]

You know what drives me completely bonkers?  They're in FBI Headquarters, with giant florescent light boxes installed every 30 inches in the ceiling, dozens of desk lamps, wall sconces and floor-to-ceiling windows.  So WHY THE HELL am I squinting at my tv trying to decipher the murky activity?

 

In that supposedly efficient professional office, there is never a face that isn't at least 50% swathed in shadow.  Even the computer keyboard is shadowy.  If that representation were the least bit accurate, the Fibbies would all be peering at each other like so many Mr. Magoos.

 

It's just so artificially "atmospheric," it takes me completely out of the show.

 

grumble grumble

 

 

 

[Simba122504]

20 hours ago, candall said:

You know what drives me completely bonkers?  They're in FBI Headquarters, with giant florescent light boxes installed every 30 inches in the ceiling, dozens of desk lamps, wall sconces and floor-to-ceiling windows.  So WHY THE HELL am I squinting at my tv trying to decipher the murky activity?

 

In that supposedly efficient professional office, there is never a face that isn't at least 50% swathed in shadow.  Even the computer keyboard is shadowy.  If that representation were the least bit accurate, the Fibbies would all be peering at each other like so many Mr. Magoos.

 

It's just so artificially "atmospheric," it takes me completely out of the show.

 

grumble grumble

 

 

 

I know what you mean. I don't know why they shot the office scenes that way?