S05.E12: The Balls

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Quote

Margo sees a purse she hates; Alice writes a letter.

Promo:

Original air date: 3/25/20

[Poltargyst]

Everyone singing and dancing like this...is Sweet in town?  You know you know that reference.

Hah, great suitcase.

I noticed the facial expressions of the actors when they're singing, especially Olivia's and Hale's in their duet.  They have to sing the song, but they have to also stay in character and emote what their characters were feeling and do it with only facial expressions.  They really do a good job with this.

But that lady isn't Penny23's mom.  Penny23's mom is in timeline 23, right?  So we just assume that her history is the same as Penny23's mom's history?  We're not going to tell Penny40's mom that her son is dead?

I like Zelda's enthusiasm for all of the songs....and Marina's lack thereof.

Jade can really belt out a tune.

Fen's solution for safeguarding the seed was...creative.  I couldn't have done it.

[TexasGal]

I’m a little zonked out on allergy medicine so I’ll have to rewatch, but my first impression is meh.  I have loved the other musical episodes but this didn’t do anything for me.  Although Alice and Eliot sounded lovely together on Don’t Give Up.

[oompa]

Eliot: "So repress the overwhelming urge to sing while stealing shit. It's eighth grade all over again."

Gonna miss this show. More for the actors and the chemistry instead of the writing.

Fogg really needs to learn how to pronounce ISLAY!

Edited March 26, 2020 by oompa
Added nitpick of Fogg

[JonasArm]

1 hour ago, Poltargyst said:

But that lady isn't Penny23's mom.  Penny23's mom is in timeline 23, right?  So we just assume that her history is the same as Penny23's mom's history?  We're not going to tell Penny40's mom that her son is dead?

I was tinking this as well, she isn't the same mum. However historywise, they have the exact same as Penny23 & Penny40's story only starts diverging when he enters Brakebills, and as far as we know, they have not contacted their mother since.

 

The excuse to have them sing was weak at best and the heist felt pretty easy for a place so secured.

 

I would have liked a smarter way to take out PsychoFog, rather than dumbing him down with this insulting trick. Obviously that will lead to Fog40 coming back since PsychoFog has more pain than Fog40. Whom/How will he help?

I wonder if Julia leaning how to severe the psychic link could help untie DK from the tree of Fillary without blowing the place.

 

Last question: have they ever made use of Quentin's blood?

[owenthurman]

Several of the songs seemed nearly random; they didn't advance the story or even relate to it. I usually love the musical episodes.

Marina was the highlight of the musical numbers, for me.

The final scene really got to me, in the best way. I'd had a difficult week and that just uncorked the laughter and possibility and cheerfulness.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I got a little sad when this episode began because I knew it was the last musical episode ever. Unfortunately, I felt disappointed after watching because most of the numbers were just okay in terms of fitting into the plot. The Alice/Eliot song went on far too long. Although I'm glad that they had on song with the entire cast, it seemed like a pretty weak excuse to include Sean Maguire.

As always, the small moments always remind me why I love this show. And of course Josh tripped over the luggage cart.

[iMonrey]

I concur this was the poorest musical entry in the series. The songs just did not fit into the story organically. That first number with Sir Effingham felt especially jarring and out of place. And I only recognized two of the songs they performed. I didn't care for any of the others. 

Did they explain why singing subdued the bellhops? If they did, I missed it.

Quote

But that lady isn't Penny23's mom.  Penny23's mom is in timeline 23, right?  So we just assume that her history is the same as Penny23's mom's history?  We're not going to tell Penny40's mom that her son is dead?

Good point! I didn't even think of that. I bet the writers didn't either. Of course, JonasArm is correct that there was only one Penny until Jane Chatwin started re-setting the timeline, but still, technically that's not "his" mother.

Quote

Last question: have they ever made use of Quentin's blood?

No and I think it's safe to give that up as a dropped plot point.

[festivus]

Zelda made this episode for me. She was so happy to be singing. ❤️

Kady sounded great on I Wanna Be Sedated. Not familiar with Alice and Eliot's song. As usual, Fen is just the best.

 

[Prower]

I always love me some musical episodes. But yes, I agree, this was the weakest one so far.

Still, so sad that this show is cancelled. I love it so much.

I guess there is no chance that this one might be rescued by amazon, like the expanse was after SyFy cancelled it? Why does SyFy have to cancel great shows before their time? Is some exec getting off on it?

16 hours ago, Poltargyst said:

But that lady isn't Penny23's mom.  Penny23's mom is in timeline 23, right?  So we just assume that her history is the same as Penny23's mom's history?  We're not going to tell Penny40's mom that her son is dead?

The timeline only splits at the beginning of the show, where Jane Chatwin changes shit to get different outcomes. So yes, it would be the same history.

And as far as experiences with his mother are concerned all the Penny's are the same, so I'd say in that sense Penny 23 is her son.

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Did they explain why singing subdued the bellhops? If they did, I missed it.

They are empaths and got overwhelmed by their combined emotions.

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Good point! I didn't even think of that. I bet the writers didn't either. Of course, JonasArm is correct that there was only one Penny until Jane Chatwin started re-setting the timeline, but still, technically that's not "his" mother.

I mean she gave birth to him before the timeline split, so technically, she is.

[iMonrey]

Quote

I mean she gave birth to him before the timeline split, so technically, she is.

This is the sort of timey-wimey thing that makes my head hurt but . . . technically, Penny 23's mother is in timeline 23. In other words, there are 40 versions of Penny's mother just as there are 40 Pennys. So it is and isn't his mother. It's also weird they have the magical tether too.

[Prower]

15 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

It's also weird they have the magical tether too.

It's really not. It is a bit head-hurty, but like I said, she did give birth to this Penny (and every Penny), since the timeline didn't split until the beginning of this show. So it only makes sense that the teather is there.

[festivus]

You know, I could have done without the pig singing. I would have rather it been Charlton because only Eliot would know. Shit, just thinking about Charlton joining in just because he could and irritating Eliot would have been hilarious. Dammit. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Making magic:

 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Opening scenes:

 

[The Companion]

On 3/25/2020 at 10:16 PM, Poltargyst said:

 

But that lady isn't Penny23's mom.  Penny23's mom is in timeline 23, right?  So we just assume that her history is the same as Penny23's mom's history?  We're not going to tell Penny40's mom that her son is dead?

 

This was all I could think about.  This isn't Penny 23's mother. There is another version out her that would have split with the timeline. This makes no sense. Why didn't they at least address this? Do they think we forgot? It was really distracting.

 

On 3/26/2020 at 12:22 PM, iMonrey said:

I concur this was the poorest musical entry in the series. The songs just did not fit into the story organically. That first number with Sir Effingham felt especially jarring and out of place. And I only recognized two of the songs they performed. I didn't care for any of the others. 

Did they explain why singing subdued the bellhops? If they did, I missed it.

 

I agree. The transitions weren't done as well and I didn't love the song choices.

On 3/26/2020 at 3:19 PM, festivus said:

 

Kady sounded great on I Wanna Be Sedated. Not familiar with Alice and Eliot's song. As usual, Fen is just the best.

 

She really was fantastic. I wanted more of her and less of Alice.

On 3/26/2020 at 4:06 PM, iMonrey said:

This is the sort of timey-wimey thing that makes my head hurt but . . . technically, Penny 23's mother is in timeline 23. In other words, there are 40 versions of Penny's mother just as there are 40 Pennys. So it is and isn't his mother. It's also weird they have the magical tether too.

I agree. A different version of her would have been created with every timeline, just like a new Penny was created. They cannot be tethered unless all Pennys and all the versions of his mom across the multiverse are tethered together. 

On 3/26/2020 at 4:24 PM, Prower said:

It's really not. It is a bit head-hurty, but like I said, she did give birth to this Penny (and every Penny), since the timeline didn't split until the beginning of this show. So it only makes sense that the teather is there.

But she is a copy. Just like 23 is a copy of Real Penny (still salty). If the tether exists between her and Penny 23, the tether would have to extend between all Pennys and app versions of his mother. I don't think that is a logical conclusion. The reset of the timeline duplicated everyone at the point of reset. She is not the woman who gave birth to Penny23. 

The entire plotline just pissed me off because it reinforced that Penny23 doesn't see the people from his timeline as distinct, which brings us back to the fact that he clearly doesn't like Julia for Julia. 

I tried to enjoy this one despite its flaws because I am going to miss this episode. I swear, Hale Appleman can give me all the feels with just one look. The way he softened and sat next to Alice was so great. I love that we aren't shoehorning Margo and Josh drama in. We get good, mutual respect and affection. The heist feel was enjoyable, and I will miss the quirkiness of a show that has a pig man join in a musical number and Santa rescue a group of thieves (and somehow the episode is a bit boring 😆).

I don't think anything will ever match Under Pressure for me. And seeing Quentin in the previouslies threatened my enjoyment of the show. I don't want this show to be over but it does feel like they lost a lot of the things that made this must watch for me.

[Prower]

1 hour ago, The Companion said:

But she is a copy. Just like 23 is a copy of Real Penny (still salty).

Nobody is a copy. These are all the same people, just with different life experiences.

1 hour ago, The Companion said:

If the tether exists between her and Penny 23, the tether would have to extend between all Pennys and app versions of his mother. I don't think that is a logical conclusion.

Yes, that is the logical conclusion. Why wouldn't it be?

1 hour ago, The Companion said:

She is not the woman who gave birth to Penny23. 

Yes she is. She is the woman who gave birth to all versions of Penny. And there aren't even any ifs or buts about it, since that happaned loooooong before the timeline split.

[The Companion]

2 minutes ago, Prower said:

Nobody is a copy. These are all the same people, just with different life experiences.

Yes, that is the logical conclusion. Why wouldn't it be?

Yes she is. She is the woman who gave birth to all versions of Penny. And there aren't even any ifs or buts about it, since that happaned loooooong before the timeline split.

I disagree. She is not the same person any more than the Julias or the Pennys are the same person. They share life experiences, but they diverge into other people as of the time reset. Regardless, it was ridiculous not to address it at all. It felt like the writers forgot about it. 

[iMonrey]

Quote

I guess there is no chance that this one might be rescued by amazon, like the expanse was after SyFy cancelled it? Why does SyFy have to cancel great shows before their time? Is some exec getting off on it?

Bottom line, money. Assuming everyone is under five year contracts, once those contracts are up they have to be renegotiated and everyone wants more money. It's just cheaper to start a brand new show, even if the ratings are still decent. And in this case, the ratings have tanked this season. It doesn't make sense for SyFy to give everyone a raise and bring the show back for another season when ratings are tanking.

Netflix does license this show, though, so if anyone is going to pick this up it will be them. I'm not holding my breath, though. Five seasons is probably good enough for them.

[Whimsy]

On 3/26/2020 at 1:22 PM, iMonrey said:

I concur this was the poorest musical entry in the series. The songs just did not fit into the story organically. That first number with Sir Effingham felt especially jarring and out of place. And I only recognized two of the songs they performed. I didn't care for any of the others. 

Did they explain why singing subdued the bellhops? If they did, I missed it.

Good point! I didn't even think of that. I bet the writers didn't either. Of course, JonasArm is correct that there was only one Penny until Jane Chatwin started re-setting the timeline, but still, technically that's not "his" mother.

No and I think it's safe to give that up as a dropped plot point.

The Eliot and Alice songs is one of my all-time favs by Peter Gabriel and Kate Bush. 
 

 

[Poltargyst]

Penny's mothers had different experiences since the divergence of their timelines and are therefore now different people the same way the Penny's are now different people.

[AAEBoiler]

On 3/29/2020 at 6:37 PM, Whimsy said:

The Eliot and Alice songs is one of my all-time favs by Peter Gabriel and Kate Bush. 

Thank you!!! I was wondering where that song was from!

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Opening scenes:

Penny's reunion:

 

[mammaM]

On 3/29/2020 at 6:37 PM, Whimsy said:

The Eliot and Alice songs is one of my all-time favs by Peter Gabriel and Kate Bush. 
 

 

I always liked Peter Gabriel but all I can think of when I see this video is at one time I had hair like both Peter and Kate 😂. Ah the 80's, big hair, big shoulders, is it too early to start drinking

[festivus]

I had looked up that song and it turns out I did know it but it's been a long time since I heard it. I'd never seen the video before though that I remember. Very interesting. 

On 3/28/2020 at 3:38 PM, The Companion said:

I swear, Hale Appleman can give me all the feels with just one look. The way he softened and sat next to Alice was so great.

He really is great, so much charisma. I think he'll do well after this show ends. 

I don't care about the Penny/Mom timeline thing. Penny40 isn't original Penny either and since it looks like Penny hadn't seen his mom since before the timelines diverged I don't think it matters that this one isn't 40. 

[The Companion]

6 hours ago, festivus said:

 

I don't care about the Penny/Mom timeline thing. Penny40 isn't original Penny either and since it looks like Penny hadn't seen his mom since before the timelines diverged I don't think it matters that this one isn't 40. 

What bugs me is that Penny doesn't care. He claims he loves Julia and recognizes she isn't the same person, but he never actually shows that. So to have him treat another character as interchangeable pissed me off

[festivus]

11 hours ago, The Companion said:

What bugs me is that Penny doesn't care. He claims he loves Julia and recognizes she isn't the same person, but he never actually shows that. So to have him treat another character as interchangeable pissed me off

No, I feel you on that part. I also don't care about Penny & Julia, despite the show's best efforts. The show did 23 to keep Arjun on the show but it hasn't really worked for me. I miss the Penny that cared about other people even though he acted like a dick most of the time.

I'm just saying that I don't care about whatever plothole is created by this mom not being the same as 23's mom. I don't think we would have ever even seen Penny's mom if it wasn't for Stella getting pregnant in real life. 

[lorddubvader]

Am I the only that wonders, this is not this dimention's Penny right? How's Neela his mother and also has a cord with him?

[AudienceofOne]

Boy they're just phoning it in at this point, aren't they? 

This was some of the most laboured, clunky writing I've ever seen on this show. Some song choices were good but the others were just... there. If they want to do a musical episode every season then at least put some decent thought into it.  

On 3/29/2020 at 7:38 AM, The Companion said:

This was all I could think about.  This isn't Penny 23's mother. There is another version out her that would have split with the timeline. This makes no sense. Why didn't they at least address this? Do they think we forgot? It was really distracting.

I think they forgot. I don't think they even know what show they're writing at this stage. This woman did not give birth to this man. Why would they have the connection? She's a version of his mother who gave birth to a version of him. Why would they have a magical connection? It made no sense.