S04.E13: Whenever You're Ready

[LilJen]

On 1/31/2020 at 10:26 AM, LBS said:

My twin sister is dying of stage 4 cancer.  She has a loving husband and 3 kids under 6.  We are only 41.  Death has become a reality and not a concept for me this last year.   It scares me and and makes me sad.  This show and especially this finale made me less scared and less sad.  I can picture her up there in the Good Place and then eventually becoming a spark of hope when she is finally completely at peace.   I hope and pray that it's not for Bearimy's and Bearimy's and Bearimy's from now but life throws you for loops.  

The scene between Chidi and Eleanor before he leaves was heartbreaking in its simplicity.  I sobbed.  It hit hard for lots of reasons but it is one I will watch over and over because it was so comforting.  I can believe that.  I can understand that.  I'm going to miss this show.   

Picture a wave. In the ocean. You can see it, measure it, its height, the way the sunlight refracts when it passes through. And it's there. And you can see it, you know what it is. It's a wave.

And then it crashes in the shore and it's gone. But the water is still there. The wave was just a different way for the water to be, for a little while. You know it's one conception of death for Buddhists: the wave returns to the ocean, where it came from and where it's supposed to be

I came at this as one who works in hospice. The idea that your end happens only after you have had the chance to be at peace with everything—confronting your shortcomings, reconciling with family/friends and truly repairing those relationships, having the opportunity to revisit dreams you hadn’t fulfilled— was very appealing to me. Some people come on our service ready to confront their unfinished tasks, and others continue with fighting, bitterness, anger, etc. of course in real life everything can’t be tied up neatly but I find it a lot easier to work with the former than the latter. If you have to go, why not make that time meaningful?

[MJ Frog]

Well, that was beautiful. And now it's over.

Poop.

[Dobian]

On 1/30/2020 at 7:27 PM, thuganomics85 said:

Ted Danson was amazing as always, this turned me into a huge Kristen Bell fan (I was kind of indifferent to her in the past)

I felt the same way.  I never watched Laura Mars, and I always saw Kristen Bell as this romcom chick.  I was iffy on watching this show because of that.  Then in the first episode she blew me away.  Clearly she had needed an agent who would get her out of the drek she was doing and into some good projects.

Okay my review of the show...

I really enjoyed this show and found it funny and endearing.  The six main cast members were all great, as well as the turns by Maya Rudolph, Marc Evan Jackson, Tiya Sircar, and others.  Even Michael Mckean, a longtime favorite of mine, showed up for a cameo.

I agree that season 4 was a little uneven compared to the other seasons, mainly because they were getting away from the comedy and more into the introspective stuff toward the end.  Season 2 was the best season IMO, and then season 3.

I get the ending.  It was bittersweet, but what this show did very well was ask questions I have asked my whole life.  Like, why does a person spend all of eternity in paradise or damnation based on things they did over the course of a mere 75 years or so?  Why can't they learn and grow in this new reality?  And what is the purpose and meaning of spending billions of years essentially being on vacation?  The Good Place answered those questions. 

And I can see why someone would choose to check out after a good long time in paradise.  It was apparent from things that were said that they had been in the Good Place for thousands of years when the time came, and a quick Google came up with 320,000 years based on the JB calculation.  320,000 years is essentially an eternity.  Think about the fact that you haven't even lived one-tenth of the first 1,000 yet.  Walking through the door is sad, but it's not death like we think of it.  They become part of the energy of the universe, and probably are reborn as someone else, starting the process all over again.

There was no God in the Good Place.  I wondered about that all through the show.  Would they meet God in the end?  I think it was good that they didn't have God in it.  With a God character, then the whole thing either turns into a puppet show, or God is this deus ex machina character who swoops in and answers all the show's questions.  The way they did it was right.  The six main characters figured out on their own how the universe should work based on everything they learned.

Great job, one of the memorable comedies.

Edited August 20, 2021 by Dobian

[Danny Franks]

Okay, I finally finished this show after becoming a bit bored with it in season three, while the humans were alive again. I have to say, I really liked this finale. It was sad, sweet, heartfelt and clearly written with love and affection for all the characters, from Eleanor to Shawn.

I notice a lot of people weren't happy with the apparent nihilism of 'just ending it all' but to me this was the opposite of nihilistic. The message was that death is nothing to fear, when you've had a life that was fully lived.

The characters weren't giving up, they were at peace with their existence and had decided that it was time to go. Isn't that something we'd all want, when the time comes? Rather than raging against the dying of the light, feeling content and knowing we'd done everything we wanted to do? There's something really beautiful in that message.

I'm not going to pretend that the revised system for the afterlife made a whole lot of sense, because it seemed like there were no consequences for being a bad person other than being continually tested, rather than tortured. I guess it might be considered similar to Catholic Purgatory. And the Good Place itself was rather limited in its depiction of what paradise could be, but I guess it has to be.

There were lots of sad moments, but the one that really got to me was when Janet asked Eleanor, "do you mind if I stay here until you're gone?" The way Darcy Carden's voice almost broke just floored me.

And I loved that Michael called his dog Jason, and also gave him a bowtie in Jaguars colours.

[bros402]

6 hours ago, Danny Franks said:

Okay, I finally finished this show after becoming a bit bored with it in season three, while the humans were alive again. I have to say, I really liked this finale. It was sad, sweet, heartfelt and clearly written with love and affection for all the characters, from Eleanor to Shawn.

I notice a lot of people weren't happy with the apparent nihilism of 'just ending it all' but to me this was the opposite of nihilistic. The message was that death is nothing to fear, when you've had a life that was fully lived.

The characters weren't giving up, they were at peace with their existence and had decided that it was time to go. Isn't that something we'd all want, when the time comes? Rather than raging against the dying of the light, feeling content and knowing we'd done everything we wanted to do? There's something really beautiful in that message.

I'm not going to pretend that the revised system for the afterlife made a whole lot of sense, because it seemed like there were no consequences for being a bad person other than being continually tested, rather than tortured. I guess it might be considered similar to Catholic Purgatory. And the Good Place itself was rather limited in its depiction of what paradise could be, but I guess it has to be.

There were lots of sad moments, but the one that really got to me was when Janet asked Eleanor, "do you mind if I stay here until you're gone?" The way Darcy Carden's voice almost broke just floored me.

And I loved that Michael called his dog Jason, and also gave him a bowtie in Jaguars colours.

I agree with you on the finale's message - some people still don't get that.

The moment that broke me was when Eleanor woke up to the calendar on the bed

[possibilities]

I liked how the "release" led to becoming sparkles-- to me it wasn't about loss or nihilism, it was about expansion and oneness with the whole.

Edited August 29, 2021 by possibilities

[Paloma]

Just finished a couple of weeks of rewatching all 4 seasons. I was in tears through this entire episode, even in the funny moments. This rewatch made me appreciate more than ever how great this series was on so many levels--creativity, characters, comedy, and a perfect understanding of the human condition. And there was so much happening in every episode and every background that I still did not get all the little jokes, so I guess in another few months I will watch it again. But for now it brought some much-needed joy to life in the pandemic. 

[Bastet]

I just binge-watched this series on Netflix, and am surprised by how much I enjoyed it.  As an atheist, I'm not terribly interested in a series centered around the idea that something happens after death, but I heard so much praise I finally decided to give it a whirl.  (I'm glad I hadn't heard any specifics, though, so all the twists were a surprise to me; I wasn't spoiled for anything [I mean, I saw that it was four seasons and knew they couldn't sustain season one's premise all that time, so something was going to happen, but I didn't know what]).  But the whole afterlife thing was largely just a setting for exploring our obligations to each other while we're actually living, so I liked it.

And, while I don't have afterlife fantasies, I understand why people do (death is a pretty big thing to cope with), and as those fantasies go, this was a good one - you get the chances you need to become the best version of yourself, and are then rewarded for learning those lessons with as much time as you want to do anything and go anywhere, but you don't have to deal with eternity; if and when you're ready to be done, you'll feel an incredible sense of calm, completion, and total peace and you get to end, with that feeling being the last thing you ever know.  (While I have a lot of specific goals, some altruistic and some selfish, possibly the thing I want most to feel in my life is contentment, particularly since I have chronic depression and anxiety, so I love the notion of that as the final state of awareness.)

I have never in my life seen a TV couple with less romantic/sexual chemistry than Eleanor and Chidi, so season three had me worried that relationship was going to ruin the show for me, but thankfully it never took up a disproportionate amount of story time.  And at least they had great friendship chemistry, so I believed the love between them, just of a different kind than the show wanted me to. 

What I most appreciate is that romantic relationships were not prioritized over others; it was about the value of human bonds, period, so family and, especially, friends (one's formed family) were every bit as important, and those not coupled up were never described as "alone", and certainly weren't presented as not getting a happy ending because of it.  (And even those who were coupled up were ready to end at different times; that relationship was one aspect of their lives, but not the determining factor in when they'd reached completion.)  When I saw Mary Steenburgen playing Michael's guitar teacher, I thought Eleanor's speculation as to how his human life was going was going to include falling in love, and was pleasantly surprised when that wasn't mentioned. 

There was such deliciously sly humor throughout, and I love all the snarky commentary on humans ("they're just mobile turd factories" may be my favorite description of people ever).  I also love all the big questions about what we owe each other as members of a society.

I also like how many different philosophies Chidi drew from in teaching how to live a good life and get into "the good place" - it's about being considerate, helpful, and compassionate, not following the "right" belief.

I know there are a bunch of little touches I missed, just because there are so many of them, so I'll definitely watch this again at some point. 

Bonus, I added fun stuff to my vocabulary, like "holy forking shirtballs" when I need to exclaim without cussing.

Edited October 6, 2021 by Bastet

[Paloma]

15 hours ago, Bastet said:

the whole afterlife thing was largely just a setting for exploring our obligations to each other while we're actually living

I didn't think of it explicitly in those terms while watching, but I agree that was a major theme.

15 hours ago, Bastet said:

while I don't have afterlife fantasies, I understand why people do (death is a pretty big thing to cope with), and those fantasies go, this was a good one

Also agree with this. Although it would be nice to think there is a heaven for good people (or those who try to be good) and a hell for bad people, as a rational person it's hard to believe in the typical portrayals of those concepts. It's easier to believe that our essence returns to the universe, at least in the physical sense (as our bodies decompose) and hopefully in some metaphysical sense (not as a ghost but maybe as something akin to Eleanor's "stardust" that influences someone to take a certain action, or maybe just living on as a memory until the last person who knew and cared about you is gone). Either way, as someone who also deals with depression and anxiety, I loved the idea of feeling at peace and contented when you are ready for it all (physical life or eternal life) to end.  

15 hours ago, Bastet said:

I have never in my life seen a TV couple with less romantic/sexual chemistry than Eleanor and Chidi, so season three had me worried that relationship was going to ruin the show for me, but thankfully it never took up a disproportionate amount of story time.  And at least they had great friendship chemistry, so I believed the love between them, just of a different kind than the show wanted me to. 

Agree 100%.

15 hours ago, Bastet said:

Bonus, I added fun stuff to my vocabulary, like "holy forking shirtballs" when I need to exclaim without cussing.

Good idea, and here is a little video to remind you of some of the choice vocabulary: