S10.E04: Silence the Whisperers

[iMonrey]

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Wow, musical montages at the beginning and end of the episode?

They really have run out of things to say.

OMG. First of all, that awful song, the vocalist whispering "onetwothree onetwothree onetwothree onetwothree" . . . it was like torture having to endure it, I almost shut the damn show off right there. Second of all, musical montages of the various folks going about their daily routines are something I would have once considered unworthy of a show like this. But now it just speaks to the drop in quality the show has suffered over the last few seasons. I mean this is the sort of thing you expect to see on Grey's Anatomy, not The Walking Dead.

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 I skipped last season so I really don't know who half of these people are and don't much care. 

I didn't skip last season, and I still know how who half these people are or care. 

Siddiq has been around since the final days of Carl and I still don't know a damn thing about him. Where did this PTSD come from all of a sudden? They've never given me a reason to care. The character development on this show is crap.

So is the cinematography, for that matter. I couldn't see what the hell they were trying to show happened at the very beginning. I take it a tree fell into the wall and took part of it down but for the life of me I couldn't see what was going on, it was so damn dark.

[heisenberg]

5 hours ago, Lambsilencer said:

What Daryl and the rest should have done is grab the two remaining boys and chase them out of their community, never to return. That would have set an example that what these three kids to that girl was absolutely and entirely unacceptable. People like that should not have a place in the(ir) world.

The risk in doing that is to put the ones getting along with the boys against the ones who throw them out.

[AngelaHunter]

5 hours ago, TattleTeeny said:

I also don't care if they shave; as far as I'm concerned, they found grooming supplies at a store somewhere and stocked up.

They had the perfectly shaved pits and legs even when they were on the road, dressed in rags, eating dogs and worms and in a desperate state. Show us murder and mayhem! Beheadings and torture! Throats cut and guts on the ground! Whatever you do, do not ever present us with a woman's unshaved armpit. Oh, the horror and obscenity.

[Audpaud]

Welp, just going to chime in that I still love and look forward to this show. 

I'm not sure what that says about me, lol. It has its ups and downs, but still entertains me.  And as long as I'm putting this out into the universe, as a woman of a certain age, I would love to see a torrid boat night of passion with Daryl and Carol.  It's the apocalypse...I need them to go for it!

Edited October 30, 2019 by Audpaud

[raven]

16 minutes ago, Audpaud said:

It has its ups and downs, but still entertains me.  And as long as I'm putting this out into the universe, as a woman of a certain age, I would love to see a torrid boat night of passion with Daryl and Carol.  It's the apocalypse...I need them to go for it!

The show has had some decent moments this season and some long awaited character interactions.

As one of the few people who liked the romantic pairings of Glenn/Maggie; Michonne/Rick and Carol/Ezekiel, I'm not opposed to Carol/Daryl though I prefer them as friends and would rather see Connie/Daryl.  I like the possibility of Michonne/Ezekiel too.

In a universe where the dead walk shamble, I can handwave the unrealistic stuff and poke fun. 

I like that we're seeing some PTSD - not just Siddiq but what Lydia is going through is some of it as well.  Aaron's anger is a form of it also.  I think as people start to feel like they're not in a fight every 5 minutes, these feelings will show.  Or the writers are running out of ideas, LOL.

The Negan thing - JDM is a good actor and some of his line deliveries make me laugh.  I like when he and Fr Gabriel snark at each other.  I hate the talk about shitting pants and dicks.   If the show is going to send him into the wild to continue to do morally questionable things that's a better choice than to try to convince us that he was a secret good guy this whole time.  

[AngelaHunter]

3 hours ago, raven said:

If the show is going to send him into the wild to continue to do morally questionable things that's a better choice than to try to convince us that he was a secret good guy this whole time.  

I'm pretty sure they're sending him off to something heroic and self-sacrificing. He has Seen the Light, repented his Wicked, Wicked Ways learned the Golden Rule. I guess.

[rmontro]

On 10/29/2019 at 2:03 PM, Lady Iris said:

I love JDM, he makes Negan watchable with his innate charisma but I will never buy the redemption arc with Glenn's bashed in head in my head.

You have to remember that from Negan's perspective, he wasn't killing "fan favorite Glenn", he just randomly chose one member of Rick's group to serve his purpose - to keep them in line and paying tribute to the Saviors in exchange for protection.  It was a horrific act that was morally wrong of course, and a corrupt form of "government".  But even the name "Saviors" shows that in Negan's twisted mind he was helping in some way. 

I thought it was smart that Kirkman (and the writers) kept Negan alive.  Because in comic books, and in a continuing series, you never want to kill off your best villains.  I always thought it was a mistake to kill the Governor. Like it was a mistake to kill the Green Goblin in the Spider-Man movie, and to kill the Joker in the Michael Keaton Batman movie.  In both cases, they had to bring those guys back (even if it was in reboots).

[amazinglybored]

Me: forgets to watch ep 4. Goes to watch it. Is confused. Also forgot ep 3. Must see TV it is not.

13 hours ago, Lambsilencer said:

The situation with Lydia was handled wrong on many levels. First, Aaron, after he saw the way they treated Lydia, didn't tell the three kids to stick their hate where the sun don't shine, then Daryl gave Lydia terrible advice. After the attack, all everyone did was attack Negan for killing Margo. Yes, it was unfortunate that she died, but she only has herself to blame. What Daryl and the rest should have done is grab the two remaining boys and chase them out of their community, never to return. That would have set an example that what these three kids to that girl was absolutely and entirely unacceptable. People like that should not have a place in the(ir) world.

Things like that potentially bite you in the ass badly. The next thing you know they’re returning as a real threat.

33 minutes ago, rmontro said:

You have to remember that from Negan's perspective, he wasn't killing "fan favorite Glenn", he just randomly chose one member of Rick's group to serve his purpose - to keep them in line and paying tribute to the Saviors in exchange for protection.  It was a horrific act that was morally wrong of course, and a corrupt form of "government".  But even the name "Saviors" shows that in Negan's twisted mind he was helping in some way. 

I thought it was smart that Kirkman (and the writers) kept Negan alive.  Because in comic books, and in a continuing series, you never want to kill off your best villains.  I always thought it was a mistake to kill the Governor. Like it was a mistake to kill the Green Goblin in the Spider-Man movie, and to kill the Joker in the Michael Keaton Batman movie.  In both cases, they had to bring those guys back (even if it was in reboots).

Nah, I’d rather have a good villain go a little early than linger too long. The Governor had a solid arc as a character and it made sense that he died when he did. It’s a similar story with Shane. They reached the point where he had to die and if he didn’t it would have gotten frustrating, which has been one of the key problems with Negan. He should have died at way too many points but he’s got comical plot armour.

I could handle Negan killing Glenn even though I loved him. They played with fire and got burned; Rick was planning a coup of Alexandria way back when and wanted to murder what's his face. I can’t deal with his fucking rape harem, and that’s always been his irredeemable, unjustifiable monstrous behaviour.

Edited October 31, 2019 by amazinglybored

[AngelaHunter]

9 hours ago, amazinglybored said:

I could handle Negan killing Glenn even though I loved him. They played with fire and got burned; Rick was planning a coup of Alexandria way back when and wanted to murder what's his face.

Same. As much as I despise Negan, he could hardly let Rick&Co get away with murdering so many of his people. He would have seriously lost face that way. I thought he was remarkably restrained by only killing two of CDB. He picked Abe because he was bigger and stronger than the insecure Negan and defiant as well, and Glenn was merely random. Of course it made no sense that he didn't kill Rick right off, knowing he was the leader but whatever.

9 hours ago, amazinglybored said:

 I can’t deal with his fucking rape harem, and that’s always been his irredeemable, unjustifiable monstrous behaviour.

Exactly the problem I have. Seeing him talking to Lydia is very creepy to me.

[Lady Iris]

I get the idea that CDB had something coming to them from their attacks on the Saviors but the maniacal glee with which Negan dispensed his justice is what keeps me from giving in to a "aww he's not so bad after all saving Lydia/Judith and crap".

[amazinglybored]

1 hour ago, AngelaHunter said:

Exactly the problem I have. Seeing him talking to Lydia is very creepy to me.

It is. It's probably not supposed to be, but it's a serial rapist getting close to a damaged and isolated girl. Gee, I wonder if his intentions would be pure?

59 minutes ago, Lady Iris said:

I get the idea that CDB had something coming to them from their attacks on the Saviors but the maniacal glee with which Negan dispensed his justice is what keeps me from giving in to a "aww he's not so bad after all saving Lydia/Judith and crap".

Yeah. Negan definitely enjoyed all of his terrible actions. They took him too far to redeem for me. It just makes it more ridiculous that Rick kept him alive and they're letting him have access to people like Lydia and Judith.

[AngelaHunter]

3 hours ago, Lady Iris said:

but the maniacal glee with which Negan dispensed his justice

Exactly. The jpure orgasmic pleasure he took in murdering, torturing and raping is not something from which he can be rehabilitated to the point where he could be trusted, ever.

1 hour ago, amazinglybored said:

It's probably not supposed to be, but it's a serial rapist getting close to a damaged and isolated girl.

Absolutely, and one of his victims was maybe a year or so older than Lydia, so why not her? She's a very easy target for someone sadistic, manipulative and amoral like him. Seeing this smarmy predator getting her to trust him is gross to me.

[Lambsilencer]

On 10/30/2019 at 8:18 PM, heisenberg said:

The risk in doing that is to put the ones getting along with the boys against the ones who throw them out.

That is true, but that risk is always there when you punish someone. When a child is doing atrocious things, their parents will probably still fight for them and love them, no matter what. But that's a risk that should be taken, because not punishing those kids and getting rid of them not only sets a dangerous precedent, but will give the impression that there is not a zero tolerance for that kind of behaviour.

I know my opinion is not a perfect solution, but most often, in case of excessive bullying, the punishment of the bullies is toned down too much because of fear of retaliation from someone close to them, or some other individual who, wrongly, still feels any kind of compassion for them.

[meep.meep]

I have to say it - who are Gage and Earl?

I'm really late to the party, but why are the writers continuing to portray these people as the stupidest clowns at the circus?  It's like they continually wake up in the morning and go, "There's zombies out there!!!!!"   but never think of anything to do about them except hide behind the walls.

Why haven't they learned to divert them away from the walls?  If the Whisperers can herd the walkers, so can CDB+.  Instead of the new guys bravely going out to kill the hordes, why not bravely go out and herd them away from Hilltop?

Why isn't everyone learning to use the slingshots?  That way they can stand on top of the walls and shoot the walkers.  And you only need rocks, not arrows or bullets which are hard to replace.

If you've got big trees around your fence, put something in them that could be triggered from behind the walls when horde gets there and drops rocks or logs on them.

Be creative not stupid.

[amazinglybored]

5 hours ago, meep.meep said:

I have to say it - who are Gage and Earl?

I'm really late to the party, but why are the writers continuing to portray these people as the stupidest clowns at the circus?  It's like they continually wake up in the morning and go, "There's zombies out there!!!!!"   but never think of anything to do about them except hide behind the walls.

Why haven't they learned to divert them away from the walls?  If the Whisperers can herd the walkers, so can CDB+.  Instead of the new guys bravely going out to kill the hordes, why not bravely go out and herd them away from Hilltop?

Why isn't everyone learning to use the slingshots?  That way they can stand on top of the walls and shoot the walkers.  And you only need rocks, not arrows or bullets which are hard to replace.

If you've got big trees around your fence, put something in them that could be triggered from behind the walls when horde gets there and drops rocks or logs on them.

Be creative not stupid.

They’ve never been the smartest group but things got dumbed down to make the whisperers work just like they got made comically incompetent to keep Negan alive.
 

- They know they can use the walker guts to hide themselves. They did it in season 1, Daryl hid a bleeding T dog under a dead body in season 2, I’m pretty sure Carol did it during her extra badass phase, they have Lydia and they’ve seen the whisperers.

- They used cars making noise to lead a herd them back in... whatever season. Season 1 had it a bit, too. At the beginning of last season Daryl was using things that made noise to distract them.

- The bullet factory magically disappeared.

- The Kingdom previously has adapted things like bows and staffs. They’d be all over slingshots.

[Kims Cha0s]

This my first walking dead meme.

[AngelaHunter]

22 hours ago, meep.meep said:

I have to say it - who are Gage and Earl?

Wasn't Earl the blacksmith who was supposed to teach Prince Henry how to do something useful but Henry was too busy poking his beak into everyone's business, sassing the grownups and panting after Lydia to learn anything?

No idea who Gage is.

[meep.meep]

I know!  Gage is Jeff Lewis' ex!

How did he get to the Zombie Apocalypse?

[CletusMusashi]

The problem with just exiling the little shits is that the only living people who witnessed the fight are them, and of course they will say that they were trying to have a nice conversation with Lydia when suddenly she flipped out and attacked them and then Negan joined in to help her, and, of course, Lydia and Negan, who, regardless of whether they happen to currently be telling the truth right now or not, are not exactly loved or respected pillars of the community.

[CletusMusashi]

That said, however, I don't think the council is doing themselves any favors by deciding everything in secret "Important Characters Only" meetings while the boys are still free to run around shit-stirring and rabble-rousing. I guarantee King Zeke wouldn't make that mistake. The man understands optics.

Edited November 4, 2019 by CletusMusashi

[rmontro]

On 11/3/2019 at 12:51 AM, Kims Cha0s said:

This my first walking dead meme.

I can't say I totally understand it, but I thought it was funny.

[rab01]

I stopped watching after Rick's farewell and just started catching up last week (it is a much less frustrating show to semi-binge than watch one episode a week).  Devoting entire episodes to the villain's perspective (whether the Governor, Negan or Alpha) is such a staple of the show and still so very very annoying.  That said, and this may be an unpopular opinion but these latest seasons have been a big improvement over Gimple's Saviors arc.  That shit was Bugs Bunny level stupid and there were no dialogue scenes with our protagonists (just monologues and grunting) for like two years - blech.

Put me on team-Lydia. She didn't kill Henry.  She didn't even choose to do anything that led to his death.  Her mother killed Henry and the only other people responsible for his death are Henry himself and Darryl. Henry refused to accept her sacrifice for the community at Hilltop and Darryl is the person who thought it would be a bright idea to put a hormonal teenage boy in the cell next to an attractive damsel-in-distress to get intel.  The bond the kids formed is on him, not Lydia.  (Lydia even went to the authorities immediately after her mom let her go and warned them there was a psycho inside the Kingdom.)

As for the ASZhats' treatment of Lydia, that's some serious bullshit and is on the bullies themselves,  on the schoolteacher who didn't stop it (Aaron), the parent who didn't protect her (Darryl), and the administration who enabled them (Gabriel and the others).