statsgirl

After the terrible twos and threes, adolescence is possibly the most selfish time in a person's life, probably for good evolutionary reasons (time to leave the tribe and diversify the gene pool by joining another?). There are kids who reach other to help other, the Kielburger brothers for example) but most of the kids who do are set the example by their parents. I can't see either Robert or Moira Queen, much less Oliver, setting Thea on the path to altruism or reaching out to the poor of Starling City. At the Dallas Comic Con, Manu Bennett talked about the effect on his life of losing both his mother and brother at 15 He shut down from the trauma and had to drop out of school because he couldn't learn anything. Thea would have been about 13 when the Queen's Gambit went down, and after that Moira probably spoiled her silly out of grief. She was pretty annoying at the start of s1, but by the end, she's out trying to save people with Roy.

I'll be interested to hear what they have to say at Comic Con, but I'll be surprised if we get a definite direction on Oliver's love life. They'll want to tease everything, and it's too soon for Oliver's endgame relationship to happen. I don't know if the EPs have told Stephen Amell where the show is headed but in all his interviews, he says pretty much the same two things: told that the Olicity fans were upset that the ILU was a fake, he says "I don't know. Was it?"; and repeats the line from Keep Your Enemies Close that he told Felicity, that because of when I/we (sometimes it's 'I', sometimes it's 'we') do, I can't be with someone I really care about. Meanwhile, Marc Guggenheim is tweeting confirming that the 'unthinkable' is Oliver risking the woman he loves to defeat Slade. If Katie Cassidy weren't saying in all her interviews that Laurel and Oliver are Made For Each Other, would we even be wondering?

And it's only recently that she's back in love with Oliver. Other than their one moment last season, she's been either dismissive of him or indifferent to him or angry at him when she realized Sara was sleeping with him again.. But now that she knows that he's the Arrow and a hero, she loves him more than ever, just like she was willing to turn a blind eye to his cheating and reluctance to move their relationship on when he was a rich, attractive frat boy.. If the Oliver/Felicity story is hitting all the right beats, Oliver/Laurel is hitting all the wrong ones. I think she's not really interested in them except as it concerns her character, and she doesn't put together the show as a whole if she even watches it. That's an awfully harsh thing to say and I feel bad for saying it but we all watch the show and try to get it to make sense, and we're not even being paid. I think Felicity would continue to be supportive because she believes that Laurel is the one who Oliver loves and she'd try her hardest to make Laurel's integration comfortable for his sake as well as because she (Felicity) is a naturally nice person.. And then I'd want to smack her upside the head for being such a goose. I'd forgotten her loyalty to Walter, it was that long ago, but it makes sense. I think what sells it for me is that I can see how the abandonment affected Felicity, and how she fights it to do what she feels it right. I can see the emotional scars on Oliver and Sara too and how they struggle to get any kind of normal life. I can even see it on Dinah in season 1, the guilt and loss and the betrayal when Quentin lost himself in his job and the bottle instead of helping her. But I can't see it on Laurel, either physically or emotionally, and other than when no one believed her about Sebastian, I can't see her doing any fighting to get beyond it. It's all being handed over to her on a platter, or rather a leather jacket.

In Heir to the Demon, Felicity had two short scenes, one with Moira and one later with Oliver, less than four minutes in total, and I completely believe that she has a fear of abandonment and that it is a very real scar. And I see that she is willing to risk that hurt again to do the right thing, especially for someone she cares about. Why does that work and not Laurel's 'crucible'? Maybe because while it's okay to hurt other people, ones you don't care about, to keep those you love safe, it's been shown that Oliver does care about Felicity whether it's just as a friend or pre-romantic. You don't hurt or put into danger people you care about to save someone else you care about. At least you don't if you're not a sociopath. Diggle is right to be mad that Oliver bailed on him to play knight errant to Laurel but at least Oliver didn't have any idea that Diggle would get hurt when it happened. Setting up Felicity to be kidnapped by Slade was guaranteeing that she would be in grave danger. ""No love," quoth he, "but vanity, sets love a task like that.""

Thea has gone through worse, and it going through worse right now. Roy has gone through worse, now he's lost Thea, and it's going to hit him again when he realizes he killed a man. I remember Abby's addiction arc on ER. It took over a season and destroyed her marriage. Shouldn't an island change you? I don't see how Laurel is changed in any way, other than she appears to be getting everything she wants now that Oliver is truly the hero and she can claim him. And she'll probably be the DA next season, having blackmailed herself back into the office. But she's still as delusional as ever, and still expecting the world to revolve around her. That's not what makes a superhero. If losing someone, depression and addiction makes you into a superhero, Quentin should be the first in line.

I need to make a resolution not to listen to or read her interviews. So she's smiling as Sara goes off to risk her life, but losing Quentin would be devastating.

It was Oliver's progress though, not Felicity's. I think they did a good job this season of writing her her own hero arc, going from scared to being willing to take Slade on. But in terms of her relationship with Oliver, she still thinks that either he was faking at Queen Manor, or while he's fond of her, it's not in a romantic way. I hope she's not the kind of person to sit around waiting for the guy to finally notice her instead of going out to seek her own destiny. She wasn't like that when she went to MIT. I think dating someone else would undercut Oliver's progress, especially since his story is that he can't be with someone he cares about. Felicity, on the other hand, deserves someone who cares about her when he's awake (although it was cute when Oliver said Barry was probably dreaming about her). ETA: In these EPs hands..... I'm already having nightmares about that episode. Season 3 is my guess if they start getting together at the end of it, because these things are better done when the couple isn't together yet. I really the idea of her inventing things and patenting them to help out money-wise.

I think they actually have to show Felicity having an outside life because otherwise people who think that her only interest is Oliver are going to continue thinking that way. It doesn't have to be much, maybe the guy who used to stand outside her window at MIT comes to town for a bit, or have her try on-line dating and be screening guys at the new Cave, or Oliver can't find her because she's having drinks with friends, but it's got to be something, if only to establish her as a rounded person so that her life doesn't revolve aroubnd Oliver. Even Laurel got to have a friend at CNRI.

That's what I was thinking about when I wondered if there was a downside to being Hollywood royalty. Stephen Amell and Manu Bennett worked their (gorgeous) butts off acting their roles and you can bet that Caity Lotz didn't wait till she was cast as the Canary to start doing the martial arts and fitness training. But with Katie Cassidy, it's like she just stands back and waits for it all to come to her ... the Canary persona, Oliver's OTP ... secure in the knowledge that it all will without having to do the research (comics) or the training for it. I was talking to someone about KC and how she doesn't fit into the show and this person said that if it's in her contract to be the Black Canary, it could cost the show a lot of money in penalties to get out of it. I thought that contracts bound you to a show and not a character but this other person is in the business so she knows what she's talking about. The budget for Arrow is stretched tight already. Unless her becoming the Black Canary is going to tank the show (and if they can keep Caity Lotz I don't think it will), I can see them being reluctant not to follow through on it as a business decision.

If Laurel is anything like Katie Cassidy's fans, she's going to assume that Oliver deliberately risked Felicity's life in order to save Laurel because Laurel is the one he really cares about. I've read it even in some reviews. I don't know if we can avoid seeing Felicity date someone else. One of the big complaints about her character has been that she's only about Oliver and that she has no life outside of Oliver. I would have liked something this season, maybe just a remark about going to lunch with an old friend from the IT department and how the gossip hurts her. But we got nothing because the show is All About Oliver and everything ties into him, whether it's Thea turning to Malcolm or Diggle's baby,which I'm sure will end up being about Oliver's child in the end. I'm not optimistic that Felicity will have a life outside of Oliver, and that means that any social life she gets will be fodder for Oliver's reactions.

I can understand his family wanting to gloss over the five years and not even question whether he has PTSD because the rich don't necessarily worry about emotions, they move on to making money and the fund raiser for the opera house. I mean some do, but generally it's more the middle class that goes into family therapy. For Moira especially it would have been even more uncomfortable since she was complicit with Malcolm Merlyn who sunk the Queen's Gambit and caused Oliver to be on the island. She would have wanted to just to move on and forget that Oliver may have had any trauma. She's good at taking care of herself and Oliver wasn't asking for help. Hee. And he shouldn't have slept with Sara or Shado either. While they were both good people, it was the wrong time, wrong place for both of them. Growth for Oliver is learning not to sleep with the pretty woman. I don't think that the Oliver/Diggle/Felicity dynamic is in the writing as much as it is in the actors. Felicity's skeptical head tilt when Oliver told her his coffee shop is in a rough neighborhood is pure EBR, as is David Ramsey's dead pan delivery for Diggle.

So true. When I took adult ballet, the hardest thing was to be able to remember the sequence of dance moves, and then to make it look natural on top of that. So here's my question: Katie Cassidy said that she's started working with a trainer in anticipation of next season. But if she knew from the time she was hired that she was going to be the Black Canary, why the hell didn't she start training then? It's not something you can pick up over a month or two. Plus, maybe if she'd been training for a couple of years, we might not be arguing if she has the physique to be the BC because she'd have it. That's one of the (many) problems with Laurel and KC's portrayal of her. Laurel is fixated on Ollie/Arrow/Oliver and what it means to have him a string on her bow. There was a moment in Streets of Fire when she actually paid attention to Sara, but by the jacket scene, it was all about her again and how Oliver needs her. That was the name of the Black Canary when AK was writing the GA/BC comics. I don't understand how she's a professional actress at all if she can't separate what's in the script from what's in real life. I although thought it was unprofessional of her to call Jensen Ackles and Jared Padalecki dicks because they kept trying to break her out of character on set. Yes, it was a nasty thing to do, but you don't say things like that when the world is watching. When she's in a scene, it's like she isn't aware of what anyone else is going through other than her character, and her character is a reflection of herself and her personal interpretations of her own experiences. I wonder if there is something to this Hollywood royalty thing after all. Maybe she got handed roles because of her family that other people had to fight for or never got at all. I haven't seen her in anything other than Arrow and a couple of Ruby clips but I'm not impressed by her acting. She's beautiful in a kind of blank-expression way but if she's channelling her real life on the screen, that's not acting.

I think it makes sense in terms of TV show vs comic books. It's been a long time since I read the comics, but I love the Arrow TV show so to have Barry start out on Arrow is a way to draw people like me in. Also it was a way of testing the character out before the expense of a pilot or backdoor episode. Maybe it was also to push Oliver into worrying that he was going to lose Felicity, on the team if nothing else. SA talked about the scenes in Unthinkable being the culmination of their (Oliver & Felicity) arc. Barry was cute but too much like Felicity for good TV romance. They were like the Bobbsey Twins. If Iris does turn out to be Laurel V2, his Felicity will be Caitlin, given their chemistry on the 5 minutes trailer. Yes , to both. They have to give it another try, if only to end the Lauriver ship for all but the most die-hard fans. And then they should give it up because if it hasn't worked in 3 seasons, it's not going to. I'm on the slow-burn wagon for Oliver and Felicity for two reasons: 1. Right now Oliver is not at a place where he can sustain a serious longterm relationship. When he gets there, I want it to be Felicity but I don't want them to get together now, and then break up, and then get together again, and then break up.... that being Marc Guggenheim's idea of a well-written romance. 2. This is a TV show and it's too soon to put the endgame couple together yet because they would just break up again by the end of next season. One of the reasons I want it to be Felicity is that I think she would bring the least drama into the relationship and the show could just concentrate on crime fighting but I know the CW will milk it for all its worth. I wouldn't be surprised if the casting of KC as Laurel came from CW rather than the EPs. Why would you not chemistry test your lead male with your lead female otherwise? I don't know about KC but I think the EPs are well aware that many in the audience don't think Laurel is BC stuff, especially after Caity Lotz in the role, and they are scrambling to find a way to keep CL and put Laurel in the role that is expected of her, or at least a role that she can play.

It was in the comics. There is a series of comics written by AK and MG about what happens after the finale, and after season 1 Oliver give Diggle and Felicity each $1 million as severance pay before he went to mope on his island (and get all sweaty but that's another topic). I saw an ad for the new one after Unthinkable. Has anyone read it? I can believe that the art and jewelry could have been bundled into the general Queen fortune and thus lost when Isabel called in the loans. But the furniture would probably still have been his because no one thinks of valuing the furniture like that (individually too small), and given the look of those antiques, worth enough to live on for a while. Not enough to get QC back, which is probably going to be the arc of the beginning of the season, but enough for him to live on for a while.

Speaking of entitled brats, another thing I liked was when Thea was was behaving badly, Oliver told Moira that Thea needed more maternal discipline based on his own experience, and Moira listened.

I'd like to see Felicity date, because Oliver needs some sauce for the gander. But Oliver, not so much. It makes sense for Felicity to date because she thinks Oliver doesn't care about her in that way and as EBR said, Oliver isn't the only guy on the planet. But Oliver knows Felicity likes him, and knows he could have her if he'd just reach out, so for him to start a relationship with someone else feels wrong. That was the advantage of Isabel, it was a FWB (or maybe Enemies With Benefits), and we knew Oliver didn't really care about her. She wasn't someone he "could really care about".

Hang in there. She gets better, although it takes till s2 to do it. I did like it when she lit into Oliver for pushing the family away when he got back, when they were so devastated when the boat went down. Oliver needs to be smacked upside the head regularly.

I think I need to be in better shape before I attempt Krav Maga. That picture of all the female athletes is amazing! Thanks for posting it, Zalyn. (Why does nobody there have hips? If you have hips, does that mean you can't be an athlete?) I'm going to print out the work-out too (skipping to part about getting 60% of your calories from fat). This is a good place to get motivated to get into shape.

I wonder if she took something, or if that's CGI enhanced because that's an awful lot of arm muscle.. (Manu Bennett is open about taking things for some of his roles.) sakura, do you recommend Krav Maga? I got up to a green belt in judo but that was years ago. I'm not sure I'm up to sparring now.

I can see him acting surprised, but with very bad acting. Given that he knows who Sara is and that she was hanging out with Oliver, and that when he wants to talk to the Arrow he phones, Felicity, there's no way he can't know. After the debacle with Dinah and getting his heart broken, I hope Quentin gets a love life next season.

The only way I'd want to see Oliver and Laurel get together is if they were the last two people left on earth and th ere was a need to repopulate. I think the show does need to go there, and it will, but I'm afraid it will be a half-ass effort like they did with Sara isn't going to show why they are so dysfunctional together and that they just don't fit. But they're probably afraid that it will turn off all the Laurel and Laurel/Oliver fans, so it will be left dangling. Maybe Laurel can find a nice ADA to date.

I think this is what I like the most, since Oliver said that she was the best of them. It would be a good twist, and tie in to Oliver's determination to keep secrets. Other than that, I'm meh on more of the DC world showing up because the comics are not why I started watching the show in the first place and there's the risk that it could get too crowded on scree. Already they had a problem balancing everyone this season. But I do appreciate that they need more of an audience. Did the numbers really go down that much this season? I thought the show was doing better than in s1. Henry Cavill who? Since the movies are not doing that well on their own (justified in terms of Man of Steel) unlike the Marvel movies, I think having Stephen Amell bring along the Arrow fans would be a draw, not a liability.

Diggle acted as a mentor to help Oliver realize many things -- it was about more than just the list; his responsibility to other, what it takes to be a hero; and hey, Felicity is having a hard time with Sara in the Cave. I can see the same thing happening later in the season when Oliver jr. makes himself known.

I fanwank that they met in school. Dinah as an academic would know that one of the most important determinants of success is a good education with a group of people who value it. They could have managed a private school on both their salaries (I know people who went into debt so their kids could go to a good private school) or since Laurel was so bright (so the show tells me), maybe she got a scholarship. In the school, however, she got a taste for the rich life and decided she was going to marry Oliver to have it for herself, even if it required her to be oblivious to his cheating. The first part is still in question?

wonderwall, that was what Andrew Kreisburg said in the interview quarks linked to. I think he was too chicken to tell Laurel he didn't want to move in with her. Pre-island Ollie always took the easy way out.