FlickChick

@AwesomO4000, we all understand that Sam is your guy. And I'm sure that most know that Dean is mine. But here's the thing, you keep mentioning Sam's traits, personality, and other descriptors from seasons long past. Where you see one character trait as in-character and positive, I see another that makes me want to shake him and tell him to grow up. In recent seasons, really, none of this matters because with the exception of our horrendous showrunner, none of the current writers were there when he has those characteristics. So, there can't be any regression when they don't know much about Sam anyway. They write what they are told, and IMO at least try in their inept way to keep Sam as the human hero as much as possible while their true goal is to give the very special nephilm - or whatever he currently is - the main focus while he's onscreen. In the meantime, Dean is given the crumbs, ignored, or ignorant. The only reason, IMO, why Dean may seem to come out a little better is that Jensen has the ability to add more to the script with subtle acting. I'm sorry, but I don't think Jared does that - he plays it as written. And when the writers are trying to prop Sam up in dialog, when Jared plays it as it's written, Sam frankly comes across as an ass. That's what I'm seeing anyway, even though it is not the writers' intent. I understand your frustration with these current writers, because I feel the same way about how Dean is being written. Since Dabb took over, and all the talented writers left, we really can just expect more of the same. It's a sad state of affairs and I wish they had ended the series at the end of S11 with Sam and Cas coming back to the bunker and seeing Dean sitting there, smiling, with Mary. End scene...

@Aeryn13, I agree 1000%. The put-downs and digs are coming fast and furious and increasing with each episode. The writers should be truly embarrassed with going along or creating these jabs at one of our lead characters. Shame on all of them, but it's obvious that Dabb is the leader in this regard. Sometimes I wonder what Jensen must think when he reads the scripts - full of ass-kissing for other characters and insults (including dialogue that he has to say himself) to his character that he has tried to take such good care of for over 14 years. It is infuriating to watch!

Cartoonish really fits the bill, doesn't it? Look who we're talking about here as the writer of this story. It would make me ill if this comes to pass.

I suspect the answer is that "they" didn't choose the vessels. The Boss did to represent what He thinks they should look like to humans. 😉

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding you, but I don't think that this world everyone (including the Winchesters) lives in now is anything but the "real" world - our world. What concerns me is if they decide to end our world with some massive apocalypse with NougatJack killing God, and then have Jack replacing God and recreating our world into "paradise on Earth" which is the vision Castiel saw. So, in short, real world for 15 seasons, new paradise world at the end of the show that would include everyone - including the Winchesters just wandering about because there are no forces of evil to fight. Let's face it, Dabb wants to destroy the concept of the show and remake it in his own (horrendously insipid) way. This is how he could do that IMO. He's been working on destroying Dean for three and half years, so now he could take on the whole show. Again, yuck...

I hope with everything in me that you are wrong, but sad to say, you may be right on target. That would satisfy two things we've seen - Jack's view of "Paradise on Earth" that Castiel believes in, and our S15 title card which often foreshadows the finale (or at least the theme of the season). If that is the ending, I could see why Jensen wouldn't like it - Dean doesn't want a "memorex" life. Yuck indeed.

Well, we just started a six week hiatus, and you are in S11, so it's a possibly to catch up before the finale. Good luck!

Yes, and we also know that the balance in the universe has to have either BOTH of them or NEITHER of them. And technically, we never really saw that the soul bomb would kill Amara as they settled their differences and went off peacefully after she cured God. So in short, no one should be supporting Jack killing God - because that only leaves Darkness in the world and the balance would be off.

I'm not sure that Dean is really "welcoming" Jack back. We didn't see Dean hug Jack, just sort of check to see if he thought he was the "real" Jack. Later, at the table, he didn't seem very happy - just listening to what Jack said. I would love it if they used the "friends close, enemies closer" thing with Dean and Jack, but then I'm not drunk enough at this hour to honestly believe that they would actually tell that story.

I don't believe that anyone thinks you are simple-minded. I think many of us are just frustrated to no end about the state of the show. I agree with you that I don't want to hate-watch the show either. I just wish with all my heart it wasn't so difficult to like as I did before.

I don't think the network cares about the ratings since the show is ending this season. Otherwise, they wouldn't have them taking off the "sweeps month" of February and moving them to a different day in the middle of the final season.

I don't believe he likes the ending. I think that Kripke just made him realize that what he thinks isn't going to matter and it probably is best to just suck it up and do the best he can to finish out his contract. Yes, both he and Jared have indicated that the "Butch and Sundance" ending is what they think would be a realistic ending for characters who for 15 seasons, have said that hunters usually die younger than most. It's the way Dean has always thought he would end up - not growing old with his brother. But our current crew only cares about NougatJack saving the day and don't give a fuck about the guys that kept this show going for 15 years.

I'm dreading the ending because I know in my heart that if Jensen doesn't like, neither will I. When it's over, I think that Jensen will move on to different projects and slowly, but surely, get over whatever fate befell his character. I'm through with The CW when Supernatural ends since Arrow also ended this season. I have absolutely no interest in Jared's project.

Welcome to the club. I believe it will be growing even larger until they finally put the final nail in the coffin. So sad...

Let me say, these two ladies love the show - and all of fandom - with a passion. So reading that review makes me so very sad, that even they are seeing Dabb's pettiness strewn about into the story to make our "heroes" - especially Dean, seem like idiots and puppets. It is mean-spirited, and certainly not funny. I really wish that Dabb would read it - maybe someone should send him a copy from that lover of the show. ETA: Scroll down after the review in the above link and look for two comments from "Mer" - wow, she's pissed and with good reason IMO. 😞

I'm sure that this vid was recommended somewhere, but after this past lousy episode, I wanted to see the real Dean Winchester. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOLf2w3lqXA&list=FL31XrTqXp2BlELehR0kIKDA&index=24

@Aeryn13, thanks for the info. Normally a long break makes me anxious for the return of new episodes, but I'm not sure that I'll feel the same way this season. 😞

I knew it would happen this season. Frankly, I'm surprised it took this long with the "story" they've been telling. I believe it will go even lower as the season goes on. So sad for the cast/production crew. And as @gonzosgirrl said, Dabb can suck it!!! On another note, I see that the show is not scheduled for Feb. 6th. Does anyone know if that is a one/two week break or if it is going to be until they switch days in, I believe, March.

This is exactly what I've been feeling since the beginning of this season - every time I see what a brilliant actor Jensen is to overcome this so-called story. I keep thinking to myself, what am I going to do without seeing something new from Dean? And some other new talent/expression/etc. from Jensen. I hope I have many opportunities to see the latter.

I agree 1000%. But, who is going to shelve the idiot boss' script? The lunatics are running the asylum.

I'm assuming you mean will Dean live to see another birthday? I'm still pondering that one. LOVE THE PIC!!!

I believe that Crowley helped them because it gave him the opportunity to make his mother, Rowena, kill the only thing she ever loved. He even spoke about the fact that he believed that the reason Rowena didn't love him was because she couldn't love anyone, but then found out about Oskar. So, Crowley knew she wanted her freedom, so she would kill him and in his mind, he would have his revenge for her not loving him all his life.

Dabb was a comic book writer. Why the hell would they put a comic book writer in charge of a horror/supernatural series that had eleven years of story already shown?

Last week I thought it wasn't possible to hate Dabb more than I already did. I was wrong. This was the biggest waste of 20 minutes I've ever had. Yes, 20 because I used the ff button that much. I also deleted it as soon as I finished. I agree that the entire episode probably belongs in the BvJ thread. The lengths this pissant Dabb will go to in order to insult Jensen is off the charts. Nothing was funny, the music was atrocious (with the exception of Werewolf of London), there weren't characters on screen - they were caricatures. Also, the only thing that kept me sane while watching it, was that I believed NOTHING WAS NORMAL. I believe that Chuck was manipulating everything, especially their normal fighting skills, lockpicking skills, Baby's smooth-running engine, their credit card, and hell, apparently even Sam's thinking skills or why the hell would he pickup that pot! What I don't understand is why the guys are accepting that Chuck gave them those hard-won skills, instead of thinking that he was taking them away as punishment for challenging him. I don't know or care what Dabb's purpose was in writing this, but as far as I'm concerned, he can shove it all up his ass.

@The Companion, add me to the list of those absolutely furious at these writers killing off Charlie in such a horrendous way. In fact, here we are some five years later and I still am! I also believe it was the reason that Robbie Thompson left at the end of his contract. I am aware that Charlie and Robbie have both fans and those who were glad to see them go. Regardless, the view of Charlie lying in a bathtub with blood splatters everywhere was totally unnecessarily gruesome.