luckyroll3

Exactly. As I've said before, there's something about India and her overly scripted reveals that doesn't rub me the right way. Particularly all her, "I knew this was wrong, but then I went along with it anyway; I recruited slaves anyway; I was proud of my brand anyway." I get everyone's misgivings about the folks on The Vow, because they are really self-congratulatory about a lot of things, but I more readily buy their, "We thought this was good and ignored the signs until it was too late" because I can see how they could rationalize everything else away if they really and truly believed. And I personally think India was a true believer and all this other stuff about "I felt uncomfortable, but....", "this wasn't right, but....", was all included in her script to make her seem more sympathetic. It honestly makes me feel like they're trying to pull one over me and I would have appreciated this more, if she was a bit more authentic. I do thank them, however, for being able to tell what felt like a complete story in 4 episodes. Producers of The Vow, I hope y'all were paying attention for next season. The Vow did mention it a few times, but given all the fluff, especially in the episodes where Frank was introduced, I can see how it could have been missed.

But neither does Candiace. I thought they were going to mainland Portugal, but I'm sooooooo jealous their trip is to Madeira. That, Cape Verde, and the Canary Islands are on my bucket list. Karen did not come to play with Gizelle during this episode or on WWHL. And Gizelle didn't even know what to do with herself. I also watched a bit of that other after show with Gizelle, Porsha, the lady from yacht show, and some other chick I've never seen before in my life, and Gizelle was still like Karen's right. She can't come on with a fake storyline, based on her fake-ass relationship, and never make it a part of the conversation all while putting everyone else and their relationships on blast.

Not sure why Toni's trying to be Janet Jackson. As Tamar is fond of saying, you are "Toni Braxton, Living Legend!" Be Toni! That Bachelorette party was......something else. Not sure why strippers were the finale when all the openers were buck ass naked. But I'm still chuckling over "You're getting juice all over me!" cause that was just ridiculous.

On WWHL, Karen said Gizelle's awful wardrobe/style is her trademark!

I'm dead! 😂

And reportedly done because Keith told them to.

They also mentioned his homophobia in "The Lost Women of NXIVM", particularly in regards to the woman from Alaska (Kristin) who committed suicide/went missing, as she was a lesbian. Susan (I think that was her name, the one who ran the Seattle Center before she left the group) said that Keith saw Kristin being a lesbian as a challenge and he made it a goal to basically "break" her/fuck her. Kristin's partner said that when she returned from Albany, she was different and just before her breakdown she said she was pregnant. In fact, that's what she was screaming in the middle of the training before they dragged her away only for her to "commit suicide" later on that day.

I don't believe Susie or Sarah, particularly because Susie was just as much as a bully, sometimes nastier, than those guys were, and Sarah was more interested in getting in with the cool kids than stopping a lot of the shit going on. I kinda feel that they're sticking hard to their version of the story because if it was just this other thing, it doesn't make those guys seem as bad and by association, they (S&S) aren't as bad by having and keeping friendships with people who would do that. And I haven't seen that season in a very long time, but I have the memory that Susie wasn't even around for the entire incident, so Johnny pushing her to speak up because of her "experience" always rubbed me the wrong fucking way because he was trying to use her and that experience to absolve the shit his dumb-ass friends did. It's also one of the reasons I have never been a fan of Johnny's because I also totally believe he was there watching the whole thing go down and probably egging them, but keeping his distance so that his hands were "clean".

Is it really a 120 years if he doesn't believe it is, but society says it is?

I see she's moving on from athletes.... And Marc Anthony is a big catch. Stay away Marc!

Yeah, I caught that too and was like: I totally wouldn't put it past him though given all the shit they've shown him saying.

You can clearly see Bonnie's jaw clench in that scene, but the rest of her face remains stoic.

I watched "The Lost Women of NXIVM" from the ID channel last week, and it followed Frank Whats-his-face investigating the death of the woman in Alaska. Interesting that this show didn't touch on that many people think she was actually murdered because she may have been impregnated by Keith! And that the "suicide in the bay" was a set up to throw people off the trail. That's how I feel as well. They're only giving us short bits of the folks with actually interesting stories and who didn't have lots of power in the organizations. And as much as I am not a fan of Mark, I give India side-eye every time she talks about him because I keep wondering if the women she recruited and/or made her slave feel the same way about her. And she is very performative.

Finished it earlier this week. She left out a whole lotta shit! No talk about learning she was bipolar and how that diagnosis may have provided any additional context for some of the experiences she's had. No talk about Eminem or even a vague reference to him. No talk about the debacle that was Management by Stella or the reality show in general. Just not enough tea overall. I wish she had duplicated that chapter from near the end where she spoke about all the men she's worked with professionally, and done the same for her love life (especially during the time when she was just "having fun") and her feuds (cause I know she has more than just J-Lo).

Lol at Keith's highest IQ score evah! only existing in the Australian version of The Guinness Book of World Records. Oh, and his 3 degrees....that he barely graduated with a C-average. But how could they forget his Judo championship??? What was up with all that fingertip nuzzling and lip grazing in the animation depicting India learning about DOS from Allison? India comes across as very disingenuous to me. I'm not sure what it is. It could be because, as many of you have pointed out, that her segments seem to be very scripted. But I don't know...She couldn't even come up with tears during her "crying scene". I wanted to hear more from the woman who talked about being uncomfortable with all the rape grooming because of what happened to her as a child. I'm interested in how much longer she stayed after participating in the JNESS/SOP, since her chyron said she was in the program through 2016 or 2017. And if she stayed, why and how did she rationalize it. But they jumped so quickly onto something else.

Yes, Tamar is a drama queen, but I blame Mona and her people. From the first meeting, It was pretty clear that Tamar was hesitant, but Mona Scott-Young started pushing with her bargain basement therapy session talking about how the only way for Tamar to move past her issues is to air all of them in front of the camera. It was a bunch of manipulative bullshit. And then during her first session with Goli, she was willing to share up to a point and was also being resistant on allowing other things to film and they kept pushing. The EP who was there knew, and he looked like he was constantly seconds away from pulling his hair out every episode. But I'm sure his directive from up top was to continue to push. I get she signed a contract, but there were lots of signs that they weren't gonna get exactly what they needed despite the prodding. And I agree with Tamar - she's expressed her discontent and distrust, she's broken ties with WE, and she didn't continue filming once GYL was done....why is she still the focus. Also, I think Mona is an acolyte of the hell....

OMG Catherine's mom! Loved her!

Tic is technically an ancestor now, so he could possibly exist in that space with the flames that was created when the original ancestor tried to bind the book.

Look like he also did the same thing to Jenn from RW Denver....allegedly.

Thank you! Found this as I was looking for more info:

I don't really follow the cast outside of the show, so I hadn't heard about this. Which cast members were involved?

It makes it even more disturbing that she would sign up for a class about Gender, Sex, and Power.

I haven't seen the episode yet, so I'm not prepared to comment on much, but I'm also not sure why Traci blames Tamar other than Tamar is the easiest person to target because she always has issues with everyone. Why isn't she upset with Trina, who I believe got pregnant not long after Traci did, yet wasn't asked to leave the group? Or Towanda (cause I believe Towanda is ALWAYS doing something shady, and probably was doing shady shit back then too)? I don't think I would like coconut margaritas. But, I have been thoroughly enjoying (and hoovering) toasted coconut cashews that I found in my parents house....fucking delicious!

Goli's batshit crazy. All her talk about how she loves Tamar and all that bullshit is nonsense, but I don't think she's a snake. I feel she just got really defensive at being called a witch and doesn't know how to handle it. Her tryin to use Tamar's twerking as an example of something that's not in the bible that Tamar embraces (Lol!) was a miss. But she's right when she said to the producer that she was hired to work with Tamar, not with David. She needed to reiterate that to David and say that she understands he doesn't get it or believe it, but oh well. She'll stop the work when Tamar asks her to, not him. And then leave Tamar to deal with David's issue. All the extra theatrics are unnecessary. I did enjoy watching her get plastered though. There's something about David, that just feels wrong and I can't quite put my finger on it. When Tamar said she was tired and wanted time away from the guests (yes, she's a brat), his response was that he's gonna send everyone home. When Vince "disrespected his house" by putting Logan to bed in one of the earlier episodes, his response was to have a fight with Tamar in front of Logan, then pack up his stuff to leave all while Logan is crying and begging him to stay. His talking head when he's detailing how he was so calm, so he can't understand why Goli was getting upset cause he's only asking simple questions - I wanted to knee him in the balls. So many gaslighting-esque moments with him. Someone like Tamar with such low self-esteem and desperate to be wanted/loved/included by her family is ripe for the picking.

I'll tell you one thing, it wouldn't have been so easy to quick Travis off the team if Melanie was in town! She would have torn all three of them, the lawyer, John, and Katherine, new ones! And then tore Travis another one for not thinking. The scene between Travis and his mom was gut wrenching! I'm still over here crying like a baby. Freeform has not been cooperating with me at all this last week, so it's taking me forever to watch this damn season. Only one ep to go....