Zalyn

That's how I read it as well. There is also value in saving face - sure, there are times to be unsure and weak with your friends so they can help pick you up. But there was no way to counter whatever Slade had planned, so the dithering was just going to sap everyone's morale and undermine Oliver as their leader. Sending him off with support was the best decision for everyone's sanity as well - what else could they have done that would have accomplished something or sprung the trap?

I like the potential for Roy as well; even though he's younger than the others, he's had a tough life on the streets, so he has potential to just cut to the core of things and call them like they are. I cracked up at his "well you're boning her" line - it was to me a perfect delivery for the scene and the audience. He kind of reminds me of Michael in Roswell - lots of trust issues with developed survival skills that make him likely to withdraw if he doesn't feel loved. Not in a spoiled way, but in a "I need to move on to a safer place if this place isn't okay" way. Maybe there can be a partial cure that tones down the obsession and takes him to 70% of full Mirakuru. That should fit both the story and within the special effects budget.

Agreed. I tend to enjoy Sara as a character most when she is either 1) put into conflict or disagreement with Oliver (to emphasize their differences) or 2) standing with Oliver against someone else (like Roy). Either way, there needs to be something active happening so she doesn't just seem like an Oliver double.

Awesome title! I'm glad that we get to see Celinda Jade some more, even if it's as Head!Shado. I'm curious to see whether she does end up manifesting as a remnant of conscience or as just diabolical.

Good episode! Slade is truly a magnificent bastard. Then again, since Ghost!Shado is his strategist, it's not surprising that he's soundly beating Oliver in DramaChess. I love this image, especially when I add Easter bunny ears in my mental picture. Not that I claim any directorial expertise, but I'd have filmed that last scene with Slade calmly closing the door after delivering the line and walking away, then cutting to Laurel leaning back against the door; more flexibility and less eye tracking. This is a good bit of irony... or just a case of "Good is dumb." Clearly, sparings people's lives is overrated and will allow your nemesis to grow an army. Moira wins for the house quote, but I'm intrigued by Isabel's "sins of the father" comment. Did Robert Queen screw over her family at some point? (it was nice to see Summer Glau with fight moves, however brief!) One more observation: nice parallel of Team Slade and Team Arrow - both have the main guy (Oliver/Slade) with two partners at the end of the ep.

It looked like it was in the ignition, so I'm pretty sure the most they'd have to do would be to work on the steering column. Not a mechanic, but that's what it looked like. Good point though on the cost of parts vs. cost of labor. Regardless, should it matter how much it costs to fix what is wrong? Even if it's just issuing a notice and allowing a recall (which if not legally required is certainly morally required), something substantive should have been done to address their mistake so more people wouldn't have to die. I guess I'm more cynical and saw "car-gal" as being the "Here, we'll hire a woman exec... for 3 months to be legally clueless, after which she can take the fall for us" spite-move. *waves cane*

Oof. Last night's coverage of the GM ignition problem was amazing (and terrifying/infuriating). I am so tempted to cancel my Friday class topic and just let them watch that ep. It's hard to top Jon when he's on his game pointing out the problems with corporate personhood and responsibility. Also, does anyone else think that GM put Mary Barra in as CEO so she could be the "throwaway" scapegoat exec? I'm currently teaching on gender inclusion in workplaces and STEM, so that's the first thing that came to mind watching that segment (including the timing on them informing her of this "little" problem).

Stephen Amell posts some great ones on his FB. It's almost enough to make me reactivate my account. Almost. https://www.facebook.com/stephenamell

I watched so much WW during GWB's presidency that when I saw him talking on the news, I'd think, "Who's that guy?" I swear that I had somehow imprinted on Jed Bartlet. I still perk up when I hear Martin Sheen narrate something; I expect him to start nerding out about economics or theology.

Podcast, baby ! D'awwww, bunnies!

I watch all the nighttime cable news stuff the next day since I don't have cable (and it's ridiculous that I have to upgrade to get the news channels and Comedy Central, WTF?). It's a nice excuse to savor my coffee.

For TWoP immigrants: The TWoP recaps will stay up in archived form, but the forums will still disappear. http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.com/forum-529/announcement-92-twop-content-staying-online;-site-still-closing/ http://recode.net/2014/04/01/after-fan-complaints-nbcu-to-keep-television-without-pity-and-dailycandy-archives-public/ Inaccuracy in reporting, as usual. I've been looking at the Internet Archive for info. It looks like the forums are being archived. http://archive.org/web/ http://archiveteam.org/index.php?title=Main_Page

Oh Josh, him and his "New York" sense of humor. To be honest, I preferred Josh to Sam as a "protagonist growing up on the show" because there was something more... real to him. That included real buffoonery at times, of course. But he had an emotional timbre that came from a deeper place; perhaps he had more relevant connections to the other staffers.

Happy Harpy: Another possibility for Felicity could be I sympathize with all the sad HIMYM fans; I never got into that show, so I was spared. Hopefully that can be a lesson for all showrunners... I would actually prefer that we got more Felicity backstory in Season 3 - maybe someone from her past (please not ) shows up and we get to develop her more. Any development now would be drowned out by Slade's awesome Aussieness.

Exciting! First Clip: Does this mean that Slade is going to try to Mirakuru a busload of convicts? Also: Bus had "O.O.C." on it? Is there ever an IC bus? Second Clip: It's good to see Isabel working actively at something constructive rather than just being a mustache twirler... at least at first!

Thank you, Carrie_Ann, for the full comment. I was about to get hooded up if they tried to Joss / fridge our IT girl. I would prefer if MG was thinking in terms of comics-canon vs. non-comics-canon people rather than shippers, although that could be the one thing more explosive than shipping wars... HH: I like your point about how Felicity shouldn't be (and isn't) Oliver's reason to be a hero; she's not a goal. But I do like that she and Diggle help to inspire Oliver to remember his human side in an aspirational way. In that vein, if Felicity's (and Diggle's) absence/lowered visibility can be seen as part of a downward spiral for Oliver the rest of this season (entirely likely, given that his past - as Slade and Sara - is back to haunt him and draw him away from his present), that could help emphasize their importance to him.

Toby Ziegler - the guy so smart and so driven that he's frustrated wherever he goes by the limitations of this world. I'm not sure if I would like Toby's character so much if he weren't played by Richard Schiff, who brings everything to the part. He savors his lines as one would finely aged whiskey. ----- President Bartlet: “You’re are a wise and brilliant man, Toby…. did you mean what you said? My demons were shouting down the better angels in my brain?… You think that’s what is stopping me from greatness?” Toby Ziegler: “Yes.” President Bartlet: ”I suppose you’re right.” Toby Ziegler: ”Tell you what, though, in a battle between a President’s demons and his better angels, for the first time in a long while, I think we just might have ourselves a fair fight.”

Thanks for the data. In trying to make sense of the data, I wonder if it would be meaningful to contrast musician guests with other guests. I'm not trying to minimize the disparity (I teach gender studies), but I'm curious about whether we could get more useful information when we look at types of guests. I know that I tend to tune out with musician guests because it's not as interesting for me compared to a new author or activist, and I tend to see the latter two are more "authoritative" people where gender parity has some valuable impacts. Actors seem to have been fairly balanced. (not trying to make you do more work, just thinking aloud)

Hi! This still is top of my list for "Most Cracklicious Show." I can't believe how much I binge-watched this several years ago on DVD. I just could not stop watching because of the dang cliff-hangers. I haven't gotten around to a rewatch yet; maybe when seasons wrap up in May I'll try.

CJ is so awesome, between "Flamingo" and "paranoid Berkely shiksa feminista." I have a feeling that her character also started the "camisole + suit" trend for women in the workplace. I am glad that she was able to stay on through the whole run because she just added so much and was a great role model for lots of people. I agree that Janney's comedy was great too; completely fearless in being completely dorky. Janney also had incredible chemistry with Richard Schiff; my favorite scenes had the two of them together because they played so well.

Discuss the arcs of Season 2 here! Please use spoiler tags for material from Season 3-4 for new viewers.

I really enjoyed the transformations of the Cylons and their society in S4 because of the brutality and conflict, and Natalie and other Sixes definitely were right in the thick of things. "Six of One" is one of my favorite episodes.

This thread is for Season 3 arc discussion. Please tag spoilers for Season 4 so new viewers can come discuss with us! Personally, I had the hardest time coming to enjoy this season. I think it was because it started out so very depressing (and character maiming is something I have a lot of trouble with). But with a few rewatches, I came to enjoy it because it had a great theme of the characters trying to come back together after going separate ways on New Caprica. And the end of the season was such a rollercoaster of intensity between the trial and the reveals of the finale. (I shamelessly admit to keeping a clip of the last few minutes of the finale around to rewatch for a burst of "wow." And McCreary's cover of "Watchtower" is on my frequently used playlist.)

This thread is for discussing the larger arcs of Season 4, both in content and in writing/directing. Some people did not like Season 4 because it departed heavily from Moore's "Naturalistic Science Fiction" mantra and from established plot threads from previous seasions. However, some (like myself) enjoyed it in its discontinuity because of a strong and intense pathos that it brought out in various characters. It seems that depending on what people value in a show (especially sci-fi), they would have different evaluations of this season. We're going to have lots of different opinions here, so let's do our best to avoid getting into arguments and keep things at "passionate debate" level.

This thread is for discussions about the arcs in Season 1 as well as writing/stylistic observations. Feel free to start specific episode threads as well for more in-depth discussion. As a courtesy to new viewers, let's put spoiler tags on things that happen outside of this season so someone could come here after watching Season 1 to discuss themes. (Assuming that liberal use of spoiler tags is allowed - I have been a "delayed viewer" many times and have appreciated being able to participate without having seen the entire show) One thing I really enjoyed about this season was how it drew from Moore's "Naturalistic Science Fiction" manifesto and maintained a high-energy, desperate, gritty feel throughout. I started watching this show a few years after I left the Navy, and I was continually impressed with how real it felt and how well he portrayed nuances of being in a military climate. Links to the NSF essay: http://en.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Naturalistic_science_fiction http://badassdigest.com/2011/01/26/read-ron-moores-original-battlestar-galactica-show-bible/ (PDF)