Luckylyn

I'm fascinated by Thea getting training from Malcolm and the I assume tense father/daughter relationship that will enfold. I have a major soft spot for John Barrowman and so am completely biased in support of things that give the man screen time. One area I think the show failed is with Walter and Thea. I was hoping to see more of their father/daughter dynamic and how Moira's death and Malcolm's return would impact it. Season 1 showed that there was a solid bond between Walter and Thea but the show just dropped it. I think the writers don't understand how important Walter could have been to this story line. Of course, I just adore Walter and want more of him. There should be more of his dynamics with Oliver and Thea that could be so interesting to explore.

I think KC needs to court the fans, but she doesn't seem to get that. There's an attitude of entitlement about her role on the show which is somewhat understandable since she was hired for it but still is off putting because she's not gelling in the part. She's not acknowledging that there's a problem but instead getting defensive when asked about it. She has to be gracious in public even if she's privately pissed at how things are turning out. Saying she's the Black Canary isn't enough. She has to earn it in the fans eyes, and I don't think she and the writers understand that. I do think the writers need to either commit to making Laurel Black Canary or totally back off. Playing coy about it isn't going to help the situation. Giving false hope that Sara can be the Black Canary and then handing it to Laurel only breeds more resentment towards Laurel. They need to show Laurel actively training. There tons of scenes of Oliver, Diggle, and Sara training, and Laurel should have had scenes like that too. They could have thrown in a father/daughter scene of them talking while Laurel works out. Maybe we could have had a scene of Sara and Laurel working out together, and Laurel being surprised by Sara's skill since Laurel was the one taking karate classes while they were growing up. That could have been the beginning of Laurel figuring out that Sara is the woman whose been working with the Arrow. There should be childhood trophies in Laurel's apartment showing the character has a history with martial arts. They could have developed a pattern where Laurel copes with stress with training instead of the poorly done drug story line. Maybe they could have had her get involved in more and more risk taking activities that got her into trouble as part of her struggling with Tommy's death. They should have done more with Laurel trying to help others through her work as a lawyer. Instead of going to the Glades to get documents, Laurel should have been there trying to help clients who were too destitute to evacuate on their own. If she'd been trying to save people instead of files, Tommy's death wouldn't make Laurel come off so poorly to me. This way viewers are shown and not just told Laurel can develop into the Black Canary.

I feel bad for KC. She was hired to play a particular role. Laurel should be the person on the side of the law that is willing to secretly work with Arrow. She should be kicking ass and developing into the Canary. She should be the love interest. The writes have given those traits to Quentin, Sara, and Felicity. KC's position in the show is threatened, and I'm not surprised she's defensive about it. Still, I think she needs to be more professional about it. I think people can dislike a character but still like the actress if she handles public appearances in a charming manor. She needs to not let her professional fears show in public.

I have to mention Breakin 2's break dance version of Fred Astire's dance on the ceiling. Every dance scene in Dirty Dancing. I just love it. The club scene in Dance With Me where they keep trading partners is such fantastic fun.

I remember watching The Tommyknockers with Jimmie Smits. I didn't really find it that compelling.

I feel like we should have less flashbacks and more character interactions like that.

The quote I'm paraphrasing is from the movie Trust (A family is like a gun, you point it in the wrong direction you're gonna kill someone). I thought is was fitting for this show and the complicated familial and platonic relationships. Moira is a devoted mother but her choices haven't been in her children's best interests. Thea should have been warned about Malcolm. Moira's choice to keep his being alive a secret was a selfish choice because she didn't want Thea to know he was her father. Meanwhile Malcolm is a major threat that Thea and Oliver who Moria knew was the Arrow needed to know about. Also, Moira letting Oliver believe his child was dead rather than giving him the chance to grow up and be a father was an awful thing to do. As for friendships, I love Diggle and his relationships with both Oliver and Felicity. I also love that Roy/Sin stayed platonic and there was no Thea/Roy/Sin triangle. I just hope we'll get more Sin/Thea friendship in season 3 but since Sin seems closer to Roy that might not work. The show needs female friendships. The camaraderie between Sara/Felicity was great to see. I hope that Roy being part of Team Arrow allows for Felicity/Sin interaction. I could see Felicity looking after her for Sara's sake.

We'll Fall Until We're Free - Oliver's story Oliver & Sara - Coming Home Oliver & Felicity - Here With Me Oliver & Felicity - One Last Time

I think Ianto survived the trauma of Canary Wharf because of his belief that Lisa could be saved and that she needed him. I think being needed is a coping mechanism that continued after losing Lisa. In CJH, Ianto stresses that Jack needs him. At that point, being needed mattered more than being loved.

@indeed , thanks for starting these episode threads. I agree about the WTFness of this episode. The immaturity of the writers showed in the seen when the girl kisses Gwen. When Jack and Owen ogle instead of immediately going to save Gwen. They know she's deadly and that a kiss from her is like a villain drawing a gun. They want to show that Torchwood is more grow up than Torchwood but it comes off so juvenile.

Mousey! Hi. Ianto really is someone who loves with everything he has even to his own detriment. I get his denial about Lisa even while thinking his mistakes were horrendous.

It has always bothered me how Kieran's family insisted he sit at the dinner table with them and pretend to eat. They are fine with him when he tries to fit in the mold they want for him but can't handle him being fully himself. So, I'm not totally surprised that they aren't totally on his side. I do think they should be more conflicted about it. They are so certain that Kieran's lying and aren't giving him a chance at all. I think Kieran as first risen is a red herring. @sjohnson I like your theory that Amy may be the real first risen.

Thanks to you guys I learned how to better post youtube videos. Oliver & Felicity - Fix You Oliver + Felicity - How they fell in love with each other Oliver & Felicity - Please Don't Say You Love Me

I love that Get Over It opening. He's so miserable after being dumped and all this singing and dancing is going on behind him with him oblivious. I love She Loves Me playing in the background in Some Kind of Wonderful when Keith and Watts kiss.

"That's the Canary..."- Sara Lance - Her journey to becoming a hero

I wanted to share some videos I've liked and hope others share their favorites too. This could also be a thread for fan art and gifs. Arrow Team: Oliver, Diggle, Felicity - How the team got together. It's a Gift - Team Arrow Felicity Smoak - Your Girl - a fun character study. The Funeral (Oliver Queen) - great character study. Diggle Ships Olicity!- This one cracks me up so much. 101 Reasons to Ship Oliver and Felicity Hitler Reacts to Oliver and Felicity - so hilarious Oliver and Felicity (Olicity): Home Oliver & Felicity - Hey Na Na (funniest moments) Felicity & Oliver - New York

I found another Team Arrow I really love this team. For me the shows at it's best when the main trio are being featured.

I really love the ABC adaptation from years ago which lead me to read my first Stephen King novel, and so I'm weary about a new version. I do like the director's enthusiasm and appreciate his focus on character. Still I think it's a story better suited to a miniseries which they seem to realize since they are making it a 3 hour movie instead of the usual hour and half or two hour film. Plus, I loved the cast of the miniseries so much. I think the fact that I saw the miniseries before reading the book makes me biased.

I found this great video that really captures how they came together as a team.

I remember being super excited to watch this because I was such a fan of Jack because of Doctor Who. I think this first episode was promising. I liked Gwen's curiosity and determination. But for the most part I was all about Jack at this point although I did notice Ianto as well. The only thing that struck me in a negative way was Owen raping that couple.

I hate how predictably untrustworthy Simon is.

I just dropped by TWOP because a little part of me was in denial and saw the community unavailable sign. I am glad we found a good home here and hope all the old Torchwood TWOP crew makes it over here eventually. I am glad to see so many familiar screen names already. Thanks to Captanne for leading us here.

I feel like Fragments improved on Cyberwoman and filled in some of the blanks for me.

There really is some great fanfiction that did the job of developing the Jack/Ianto dynamic in ways the writers didn't bother to on the show. There's one whose title I don't remember where Ianto's about to have sex with Jack for the first time, and he keeps repeating to himself that he's doing it for Lisa. The subtext is that he wants Jack but can't admit it to himself because it would be betrayal of Lisa. There's a lot of complicated issues that Cyberwoman brought up that should have been dealt with on screen but was just glossed over.