DittyDotDot

I latched on to Margot's "You're an unusual therapist."

I echo your love of Something Wicked, mostly because that's when I finally understood why Dean always followed his father's instructions. Seriously, I have to choose between these two? They're both so fantastic. What to do, what to do... -- Pilot + Scarecrow 53 - Pilot 47 - Scarecrow GANKED: Route 666 Bugs Provenance Dead Man's Blood Hook Man Nightmare Asylum Wendigo Hell House Bloody Mary Home Salvation Shadow Phantom Traveler Devil's Trap Skin Dead in the Water The Benders Something Wicked Faith

Oh, I don't think he wants to anyway--smart man, if you ask me.

Down to the final two, eh? Truly hardest decision. -- Pilot + Scarecrow -- Faith 53 - Pilot 50 - Scarecrow GANKED: Route 666 Bugs Provenance Dead Man's Blood Hook Man Nightmare Asylum Wendigo Hell House Bloody Mary Home Salvation Shadow Phantom Traveler Devil's Trap Skin Dead in the Water The Benders Something Wicked Faith

I think its one of those unwritten rules of the universe...Jensen Ackles can do anything! I really like this selfie (which as a photographer I usually loathe them.) I especially like Misha's goofy grin and John Barrowman in the back like he snuck in without anyone noticing. Edited because auto correct sucks and photography and photographer aren't really the same things.

How about "Stepping outside the rude" Sorry, I suck at titles, I'm sure someone else will come up with something better.

I recently got caught up as well--I don't think they ever said how the Earth Republic learned about the ship...maybe that's some of the backstory they will be giving us this season. There were quite a few things that I wouldn't exactly call plot holes, but there was some definite backstory that they never covered in the show proper. There was a bunch of information they released for the video game that gave the backstory and explained this world better. I was so late to the party, that I instead read the thread over at TWoP to fill in some of these things. But I believe they are planning to delve into the history of this universe in the second season. And yes Mayor Nikki was a hybrid, just like the astronaut guy--didn't he have red blood as well, though. He needed to be able to blend in and not get noticed when he had physicals, maybe just assumed his blood was red.

+ Scarecrow -- Faith -- Dead In The Water 53 - Pilot 50 - Scarecrow 07 - Something Wicked 05 - Faith 01- The Benders GANKED: Route 666 Bugs Provenance Dead Man's Blood Hook Man Nightmare Asylum Wendigo Hell House Bloody Mary Home Salvation Shadow Phantom Traveler Devil's Trap Skin Dead in the Water

I do agree that the POV started with Sam, but I feel like it shifted in S2 and I've never really felt like I've seen much through Sam's eyes since then. I'm pretty firm believer that TPTB disservice both characters fairly evenly and routinely, just in different ways. It is funny that they give Dean his own personal issue and it turns out to be totally nonsensical and kinda sad and depressing...I guess its a be careful what you wish for scenario.

I don't either, I think they both were crappy actions. But the fact that we got consistent sympathetic POV on Dean this season makes it easier for me to feel for him...in S4, we rarely saw Sam's actual POV. We saw Sam sneaking around and lying through Dean's POV, which means I felt Dean's betrayal not Sam's lack of self-worth. They purposely were withholding what was going on and Sam's POV for the mystery of it all. Not until Sam got locked in the panic room (the second to last episode of the season) did we ever see things through his eyes. We didn't even see him sucking on Ruby's arm until On The Head Of A Pin (16 episodes in), up until that time we had no idea that he was under the influence of demon blood. We never saw how he felt so worthless after Dean died; we never saw how he felt like an outcast and a freak; we never saw it as Sam saw it. Again, I understood it and could infer it intellectually, but I didn't feel how it was weighing on him like I did with Dean. BTW: I never once hated Sam or Dean; but I have hated what they were doing many, many times.

It's not that I couldn't understand Sam's motivations in S4--and yes I think it was mostly about vengeance and him being tired of being a pawn for demons--I just had a hard time sympathizing with all his decisions. It's hard to sympathize with someone who is sneaking around behind his brother's back and lying to him so that he can get vengeance and feel in control of his own life. Especially when we never see him feeling bad about the lying and sneaking. Even though I didn't agree with many of Dean's decisions this season, I still almost always could sympathize with him. It's easy to sympathize with someone who is lying and sneaking around behind his brother's back when he does it mostly because he doesn't want to live without his brother and wanted to save him. Especially since each and every episode shows how all this is tearing him up and how much he hates the lying and sneaking. I think it would have been much easier to sympathize with Sam in S4 if we had had some actual POV of his time without Dean earlier in the season. I realize they were trying to hold out until fall sweeps, but it really would have helped me to remember that it all started because these demons had taken Dean away from him. For me it was so hard to understand why he still so vengeance-y thinking when Dean was back and standing right beside him. I mean, intellectually I get it, but it's harder to feel all that sympathetic about it.

Oh SueB, now you've gone and done it...my Bizarro Supernatural radar has now been suffiently pinged...expect a long post on that in the near future. ;) You make some very fine points SueB, and I totally agree they blew it with Sam's motivations in S4. I could follow along and mostly understand him, but really was hard to stand beside him sometimes. I think they were trying to be so very coy and cute and mysterious with Sam in S4, so the big revel would be ever so ::gasp:: shocking, but they had to sacrifice Sam's character to do it. I wish I had the time and energy to discuss all your points, but I'm afraid with my meandering mind it wouldn't make sense anyway. ;)

I'm in no way saying that I thought Dean should throw up his hands, walk away and let Sam die--just wanted to get that out of the way--I'm saying the way he did it seemed out of character to me. I don't think Dean would have lied to Sam and made the decision without Sam's input. This is basically what Dean did in S2--although he at least bargained his own soul and not Sam's--and even then Sam told him he shouldn't have done it. But Dean learned that this was a very bad thing and that they should stop doing stuff like this. It always ends bloody and with a lot of other folks dead. In S6, Dean seemed to accept "life is short, and ours is shorter than most." Also, I think he stopped making these kinds of decisions for Sam back in S5 when he realized Sam wasn't a little kid anymore and could make his own decisions. The only time Dean's done something like this since was when he made that deal with Death to put get Sam's soul back. But I would argue that Sam wasn't really around to have input at that juncture so Dean did what he felt he needed to in-order to keep SoulessSam from hurting innocent people--it was less about saving Sam and more about protecting folks, IMO. Even when Sam was dying from the stupid Hell pain, Dean wasn't running around desperate just to save his little brother. He made calls and tried to help Sam as best he could, but also was aware that he might have to accept the inevitablity of the situation. In the end it led to finding Cas, but he was still wary of Cas and what Cas would do. I appreciate that time was short and Cas vouched for the guy, but it just feels like he was a lost little kid and made the decision out of desperation. And, I could have swallowed him just making the decision and then coming clean after the danger passed, but he continued to lie to Sam and make one impulsive decision after the next and falling farther down that rabbit hole--which is what I think Dean of S1 or S2 would do, but not the Dean of S5, S6 or S7. I do agree its not to the same degree as it was in S1 or S2, but still not the Dean I had come to know since. It's not just this episode, but the way he was written most of the season. The way he did nothing proactively to find a way to have an edge over Gadreel if/when things went south. He allowed an angel to possess his brother and trusted that he was a good guy based on the recommendation of Cas and then allowed that same angel to kick Cas to the curb. That alone should have raised flags that he needed to be wary. That spell (which we've never heard nary a word of since) that Kevin found to depower an angel was in a MoL book, something Dean should have found months earlier. I just have a hard time lining up this Dean with the Dean that planned a fake text to his own brother "just in case he needed it" last season. Sorry, meandering once again...

I'm entirely bi-bro, so I adore both of them for different reasons. I think TPTB maybe see and understand Sam more than the audience does so they don't think they need to explain him to us--which is unfortunate because even though I can usually follow along, it does make it hard to get inside his head sometimes. Sometimes I feel like Dean gets so much POV because they don't really understand him themselves, so they spend a great deal more energy trying to make sure that we will "feel" him and sympathize with him. It could be a nice change of pace for us to walk with Sam once in a while though too.

+ Scarecrow -- Faith -- Dead In The Water 52 - Pilot 49 - Scarecrow 13 - Something Wicked 08- The Benders 07 - Faith 03 - Dead in the Water GANKED: Route 666 Bugs Provenance Dead Man's Blood Hook Man Nightmare Asylum Wendigo Hell House Bloody Mary Home Salvation Shadow Phantom Traveler Devil's Trap Skin

Part of the reason In My Time Of Dying works so well is it's the first death, so the idea of Dean finally accepting it because the alternative was far worse was much more powerful. Plus, Dean knew he had been brought back and his asshole-of-a-father was gone because of him. The whole thing had weight. By this time Sam has died and been brought back so many times that it just carries no weight. He should have been an old hat at dying by now, there really is nothing to come to terms with or ponder. Add to it that he doesn't even know what happened and has nothing to grapple with, no consequences that he can deal with--I don't know, but this episode just feels like masterbation, to me. Dean's story here also annoys me because he just feels rather out of character since Carver took over. This is the Dean from S1 and S2--hastily making deals and acting on impulse. I just felt like they really wanted to have an angel inside of Sam and fill the oppressive angst quota, that they didn't really figure out how to make this happen organically. So much of it feels forced to me. I would have rather they had Sam fully understand what was happening and accept the angel. It would have set up so much better story and would have made Sam an active participant in his possesion. Sam and Dean could have been proactively working together throughout the first half of the season rather than the pathetic secrets and lies that in the end kept them from being proactive and really moving forward against the angels and/or demons. Plus, they could have still had Gadreel lying to them to have them end up in the same place without the oppressive brotherly angst. Gadreel could have still killed Kevin and Dean could have still taken on the MoC. They didn't need to break the boys up to get Dean to accept the Mark of Cain, Dean's always been willing to step up to the plate and accept the hard work. But they could have had Dean be more enlightend to the effects of the Mark--again, he could have been proactive in his story rather than the story happening to him. Oops, I just realized I was meandering again and this might be better suited in the All Season's thread. I'll stop now.

Yeah, I was totally thrown by this as well. I was thinking that instead of Bobby, either Jessica or Mary would have been a better choice to play the voice of acceptance. All the Sam's head stuff was way over-played and mostly nonsensical. I remember thinking that they were trying to redo In My Time Of Dying, but with Sam coming to terms with dying only to be jerked back at the last second. I also remember thinking, I don't think they know why In My Time Of Dying worked.

+ Scarecrow -- Faith -- Dead In The Water 52 - Pilot 48 - Scarecrow 14 - Something Wicked 12 - The Benders 10 - Faith 05 - Dead in the Water GANKED: Route 666 Bugs Provenance Dead Man's Blood Hook Man Nightmare Asylum Wendigo Hell House Bloody Mary Home Salvation Shadow Phantom Traveler Devil's Trap Skin

I'm assuming they will delve into this more next season with him on the run and the FBI probably looking into his past more. It seems like the logical time to do his backstory anyway. It makes sense that they haven't delved into it too much yet--them wanting to keep Hannibal somewhat mysterious until the jig was up and all. I mean, we all knew what he was, but the other characters didn't and now I think we might see some of it through the other characters learning about it. Side note--I have a friend I tried to get to watch the show last year and she couldn't get past the eatin' people thing, but after seeing only a couple episodes she thought that it was Will Graham that was the copy cat killer. So, I guess there is someone out there that didn't know who he was.

I won't say that this is all Will's fault--it being actions of a mad man and all--but I bet that Will's sitting in that kitchen thinking that if he had only had the guts to pull the trigger when he had the chance, a lot more people would be alive. So, even though I don't blame Will, I imagine he blames himself. I think, in his own way, Hannibal did care about her--as much as any psychopath can care about someone, anyway--but in the end, lashing out at Will was more important. ETA: I think this was entrapment in the same way it's entrapment to approach a prostitute and proposition her with the intent of busting her rather than letting her proposition you. So, yes nobody can force anyone to kill someone, but they were engaging Hannibal and asking him to do something with the express idea they would catch him at it and bust him. If they had instead just waited patiently until Hannibal revealed himself, it wouldn't be entrapment, just following a lead. But then most likely someone would have had to be dead to get that reveal...either way people die.

+ Scarecrow -- Faith -- Dead In The Water 52 - Pilot 49 - Scarecrow 19 - Something Wicked 16 - The Benders 14 - Faith 09 - Dead in the Water GANKED: Route 666 Bugs Provenance Dead Man's Blood Hook Man Nightmare Asylum Wendigo Hell House Bloody Mary Home Salvation Shadow Phantom Traveler Devil's Trap Skin

+ Scarecrow -- Faith -- Dead In The Water 52 - Pilot 50 - Scarecrow 21 - Faith 20 - Something Wicked 16 - The Benders 15 - Dead in the Water GANKED: Route 666 Bugs Provenance Dead Man's Blood Hook Man Nightmare Asylum Wendigo Hell House Bloody Mary Home Salvation Shadow Phantom Traveler Devil's Trap Skin

I hear ya...I'd say this is why I also have a certain love for S2. It's like S4 starting grasping for bigger and bigger straws and even though they might be able to suck more story, they never really fit the lids quite right. Oh, look at me an my really bad metaphors and such, someone should really stop me from doing these things, right?

+ Scarecrow + Something Wicked + The Benders 53 - Pilot 51 - Scarecrow 25 - Faith 21 - Something Wicked 18 - Dead in the Water 16 - The Benders 01 - Skin GANKED: Route 666 Bugs Provenance Dead Man's Blood Hook Man Nightmare Asylum Wendigo Hell House Bloody Mary Home Salvation Shadow Phantom Traveler Devil's Trap

This was posted over at TWoP...this picture was tweeted by someone who works on the show: https://twitter.com/...0084608/photo/1 - it's Abigail, missing an ear.