ILoveReading

Jared mentioned both in the panel and in his meet and greet (I can say this because Jared mentioned on stage it was something he talked about) about how he sees Sam as someone who steps when needed but doesn't see himself as a leader and Sam prefers to be in the background. So I really don't get this big push to put him in that position when even the actor said it doesn't really fit the character. So the sudden, I need to lead because I was too scared really was as forced as it came across.

I'm even more annoyed because we're right back to Dean just fussing over Sam

So Dean's not possessed anymore and the entire Michael story really did fizzle out because we barely got to see Jensen play Michael Sounds like this entire storyline takes place off screen.

I agree. There is a reason all this leader stuff is being done.

Sound like once again Jensen is using past tense. that's why I don't believe that michael is still possessing Dean.

Now its all Vampires and werewolfs. They rarely go for other monsters. I remember when they introduced the storage locker in s3. I wanted an ep that was just Sam and Dean going through it and reliving old memories. I wish they had done an episode like that of Sam and Dean exploring the bunker.

If Michael wanted Sam and Co. dead he could have just snapped his fingers. So if the storyline is part of a long con there has to be something Michael wants. Like others have pointed out if he truly wants it nothing should be able to stop him from taking it. The bunker being the safest place is a joke. The only reason, IMO, that makes sense for Michael to leave Dean, pretend to leave Dean, or give Dean back temporary control, would be for psychological torture. Michael would know how strong Dean is and that he would try to stop him of when it came time for Michael to do whatever it it is he's doing so Michael needs to make sure he breaks Dean before he goes for that final step. This is another way this storyline could end on a positive note for Dean. He could realize that he's strong then he thought when he doesn't' break. That Michael didnt' break him when Alastair did. But this can't be about Michael trying to hurt Sam. Thais just showing that Dena is only strong when Sam's life is on the line. The show missed a perfect opportunity to show Dean being thorn in Michael's side. The writers really need to prioritize. We did not need five different pep talks with poor Jack and his feelings. The scene with Jack and his grandparents could have taken place in any episode. There is so much set up here to actually adress all of Dean's trauma's if the writers care too.

Who knew humming could be so sexy. It looks like he also sang it wearing Dean's jacket. I find he usually finds a new way to spin the song each time he sings it.

Then he gets accused of not opening up and sharing and being emotionally closed off. So he does and he gets told to suck it up.. And around and around the merry-go-round we go.

Even this has been handed to Sam. All I saw after episode one was "Leadership looks good on Sam" "Sam F'ing Winchester" "Sam really is strong to hold everything together." He's been doing it for 3 weeks. Dean's been doing it since he was four but that's rarely acknowledged on screen as Dean being strong or a leader and its the same round of excuses. "Dean doesn't need it mentioned." Sam didn't have to be the one holding it all together. There was a bunker full of people. Mary could have handled the AU stuff. Bobby could have dealth with Nick since he had no personal history. Then Sam could have had plenty of time to search for Dean. Good leaders delegate. But the writers clearly had an agenda and it looks like it finally worked when that oxygen sucker was finally taken off screen. I'm tired of the excuses. None of them are acceptable anymore. Sure have Mary bond with Sam, but show her bonding with Dean too. Big Bang Theory has 4x as many lead characters and half the time to tell the story in, yet they manage. Why is it so hard to write for both brothers at once.

Its no longer an acceptable excuse for me. It's like in e 12.22 when the writer just had Dean emphasize Sam's trauma. "Dean doesn't think he matters." With that kind of writing its no wonder because apparently he doesn't. We're 14 seasons in. Were is Dean's character growth? It can't just be Dean being made to learn lesson after lesson about he doesn't treat other people right. All that does is reinforce the message. Dean's rarely shown any compassion. Ex. If Dean went blind on a hunt, everyone would fall all over Sam to make sure he was holding up okay. Dean would get told, suck it up and deal with it.

"But we owe it to him to try." Maybe someone should have reminded him that Dean sacrificed himself for Jack. Maybe people need to stop coddling jack and tell him to stop acting like a spoiled brat. If Dean had that many pity parties, the number of boo hoo speeches he would have had would be too high to count. The fact that Cas paused made it look liked he agreed with Jack The argument didn't end with Michael needs to die, it ended on Dean doesn't matter. There is no excuse to let those words stand. It fits with how this show has been writing Dean lately and

Then why not have Cas actually say he does. Or he's worth enough to try. If they can fit five pep talks to tell Jack over and over why he matters that can fit one line of dialogue to say Dean does too. The fact that they let that stand, without contradicting it, speask volumes. It's like when Sam said that Dean only scarfices when he doesn't get hurt and the writer of that ep even tweeted Sam was coming from a place of honesty. So it seems like they put their opinion in the scripts.

I don' t think anything ERL mentioned in those articles were foilers. So far everything about the Michael story is half-assed and about everyone expect Dean. The search for Dean was about 98% done off screen. He wasnt' the focus of either episode. If Dabb had long term plans he would have given Jensen direction because he would have needed Michael to behave a certain way. He said the exact same thing about demon Dean and admitted it was a just a one time thing, not part of a long arc. The fact that he couldn't speaks volumes about how much he didn't care. As to why Michael would pic another vessel (spec not spoiler) was answered loud and clear at the end of this episode with Jack, the writer mouth piece. Dean doesn't matter. Dabb makes that message loud and clear.

Dean is Michael's ideal vessel. Why would he give it up?

He has done this. I was at Jersey con. Every time he refered to the Michael story he used the past tense. "It was fun." "It was challenging and I had a lot of fun with it." He also said he saw nothing in the scripts about it coming back to haunt Dean, or about emotional aftermath. The synopsis for ep 3 said while they're investigating what happened to Dean they end up on the same case as Jody. When she mentions being "it feels like being stabbed by a meat fork, that strongly suggests she's seen a body with the same scar. So whatever it is doesn't sound like its just about Dean. So IMO, I feel like there is also a strong case to be made that she's not giving a foiler.

Exactly. Even when he was with John he still had his own way of rebelling. He would let Sam do normal things, and he told Cassie what they did, despite John.

Unfortunately, even if Jensen isn't on the show it still wouldn't stop Dabb from trashing Dean.

So if the arch angel blade doesn't' kill humans shouldn't Dean stab himself with it in a non-lethal place , just to make sure. I mean, there is no downside.

This wouldn't surprise me since Dabb still seems bitter it wasn't' picked up.

This is so simple yet so powerful. I think Misha is at just using his voice to utter threats and make Cas seem menacing. You always have such a way with words, @Bergamot You usually say what I'm thinking, just so much more eloquently. It wouldn't bother me if Jack did like Sam better than Dean. Because not all relationships are equal. It's why I always find the interactions between Cas and Sam forced. I think Sam likes Cas well enough but I've never found them particularity close, and find they mostly tolerate each other for Dean's sake. I hope they aren't going in this direction becasue that would show Jack learned nothing.

I wish I could believe that the Michael Dean story line isnt' over. But I have a feeling it it is. LOLCanon aside,shouldn't Cas be able to see Michael's true form? Anael could see it an she's just a regular angel like Cas is. There is a clear lack of interest behind the scenes. We get two measly episodes of Michael Dean and he wasnt' the focus of either episode. Of the 4 storylines in the premier his was D plot and the C plot of the of second eps 3 storylines. It's clear the writers are interested in Lucifer, Sam and Jack with a brief side of Cas. So many contradicting stories since comic con. The Dean doesn't matter line. If it wasn't' meta why not give Cas some lines and allow him to defend Dean. Sure, the setup is there. but how many times have the writers ignored that. So, IMO, I'm guessing its will just end u0p on the pile of dropped Dean storylines.

He had enough conscious control to decide to be born an adult because it was too dangerous to be a kid. That showed he had full awareness.

Synopsis for episode 5. I might get excited if I didn't think they were going for the obvious. Sam- his fear will be about Lucifer. Probably gets the majority of focus. Then they can use this as an excuse to bring back Pellegrino. Bobby- ending up back in apocalypse world. Mary- they'll try to sell her fear is something happening to Sam and Dean. (This doesn't work when she shows no interest in her sons when she's around them. Dean- So obvious I don't even need to write it I'd love to be wrong but none of these writers have any imagination. Why use this opportunity to reveal something new about the characters when you can be lazy and take the easy way out.

Found the picture I was looking for. Its Dean's messy room that we see (if it isn't' cut) in episode 4. So is this a sign that Dean isn't really Dean? Because normally Dean is kind of a neat freak. His favorite thing about his room is that it was clean. But the episode is written by Perez, who according to episode 12.15 thinks Dean is a gross slob. This is why I have so many doubts about how Dabb and co. are going to handle the post possession story, when I shouldn't.