ILoveReading

I know ad revenue isn't the only source. It doesn't even make enough during one episode to even cover Jared and Jensen's salaries. But nostglia will only go so far. The CW/Warner brothers might be willing to pocket losses for one 13episode season to wrap the series properly but they arent' going to do it for multiple seasons. They network bleeds too much money as it is. Jensen said 20 is the magic number for the CW to make filming a season worth it for the net work in terms of finances. I figured that included all sources not just ads. This is sweeps month. Used to establish ad rates for next year. Its not a good time to be getting ,3 no matter what way its spun. I don't think the show is in danger, unless ratings start dropping to .2 or .1

Or it will be exactly like Amara and Dabb and co. will tells fans they can make up their own minds about what the Djinn saw. He certainly doesn't care about any aspect of this story (other than it getting Dean off screen). That is obvious. I submitted this question to a spoiler column. Lets see if it gets picked.

I think a bigger problem than ratings would be production costs. Jared and Jensen's salaries alone are probably higher than some of casts on other shows. Last I heard they made 175,000K an episode. That was before their last contract negotiations so its probably higher. Comparing that with salaries of 40K an episode for Riverdale. There was an article on ad revenue and despite having the 2/3 highest ratings they make the 2nd lowest about of money for the CW in terms of add prices. Demo is far more important than number of viewers. I wonder what the unrounded ratings were? Jensen talked about how they had to find a compromise with the CW. He said that the number of episodes that would allow them more time off but still made it financially worth it for the CW was 20. Costs will only go up. So unless its the last season in which they get 13 eps to wrap up the story, I don't see the CW being willing to do that many eps.

Sadly, in the episodes he's not. Sam does it all now. He's the researcher, the weapons expert, the genius at lore, trainer, mentor, "big brother" to the entire band of AU's.and now the greatest leader ever. Not a single thing has changed in the bunker since Dean got back. It didn't become easier for Sam. Dean's actually just another burden on Sam's plate and its now harder that he's only sleeping 2 hours a night. Before Dean he at least got three. So when the inevitable break down comes it won't be Dean dealing with his Michael trauma. It will be poor wounded baby bird Sam. The season has primary focused and Sam's struggle to be the greatest leader in the history of the universe. Even Dean's accomplishments in this episode were handed over to Sam. Dean just roams the halls like a lost puppy. There is no room for him anymore. He not integral to any plot that we've seen so far. Maybe the Michael stuff but that seems more about TMNS now. Michael is after Kaia not Dean. Sure, we got something small at the end of this episode. I should be speculating on what it could all mean but the biggest thing that keeps crossing my mind, is do any of the other writers actually know about it. Beren's certainly didn't know or care about monsters thinking Dean is Michael or not wanting to damage his vessel. The biggest question I have isn't what did it mean but does it mean something, and will they follow up on it. Or is it going to be like Michael's I own you, or Billie's "see you soon Dean." or Amara's as long as I'm around you can't be hurt. and joined the pile of dropped story lines. I've asked what his role was and Dabb's only answer is that he's supportive of his brother. That's not a role because that isn't new In the past Deans' been supportive and a leader, plus other htings,They're not even really letting Dean do that. Dean could easily take over some bunker duties like training or mentoring. But Dabb knows if he does that then Jensen's natural screen presence is going to make him seem like a leader. He even said he needed to give Sam, Dean free, breathing room. We know Dabb doesn't want that. It's only Sam that must be seen and talked about in that capacity. If Dean offered to help, he's only get the babying Sam lecture and the show couldn't tell the poor poor pitful me story they so obviously want to tell. At least playing Michael, Jensen would have a purpose since Dean doesn't . We arent' even getting the flashbacks were were told we would.

https://faridamestek.blogspot.com/2018/11/supernatural-s14e4-review-with-spoilers_10.html Here is a really good review of the ep and points to a lot things I've been feeling. The only thing I really disagree with is that the show is trying to erase Sam and Dean. I feel like its just Dean but that is a topic for another thread.

The last time Jensen live tweeted was that horrible 11.17. I think Jared might have tweeted a couple of times since then but I can't remember how many or which ones.

I can't think of one either. There is also another moment I really like. It's a small one. It's in Provenance, and while Sam is talking to the librarian you see Dean kind of geeking out while looking at a magazine. Then when the camera angle changes you see Dean's looking at a picture of a gun. It's the prefect example of how Jensen is always on even when he's not the focus. Your eye is just drawn to him. That's why Dabb admitted that the only way other characters can shine is to get Jensen off screen.

This wouldn't be Sam's fault. He would have no way of knowing. We really don't see Sam getting to know them or spending time with them. He doesn't really seem that attached to them. He tells them what to do and sends them on their way. Even last ep it was clearly Dean who was checking up on Maggie to make sure she was okay. He certainly doesn't seem to be letting them help him. Does he even know them outside their names? I doubt the show will do this, but if Dean takes out all the other AU hunters, I would think Sam's primary concern should be crushed about losing his brother rather than all those people he barely knows. Even if Dean is a bomb it doesn't mean it would go off and kill everyone. I'm sure the show would have Sam stop it in time.

I personally think we're seeing Dean. If (big if) Michael never actually left then I think he gave Dean control back and is just lying dormant, like Gadreel did and he's gathering intel. I wonder if the Djinn saw Michael's plan for hunters. We know he's laying traps. With all the AU hunters in the bunker, and and having them all in one place Michael's plan is to talk them all, or as many as he can get in one shot. What if Dean himself is a trap, a literal ticking time bomb.

This is how I remember it too. Its a forced situation. Dabb's been trying to make Sam the leader for two years. But its so out of left field because I can't recall one scene of Sam ever wishing to be a leader or some kind of mentor to other hunters. Other than one scene where Dabb decided it was time for Sam to have an epiphany. Sam joined the Men of Letters because he saw it as a way out of hunting, not as a way to tie him to it further. As others have said Bobby was their leader and Mary was going to abandon her sons because "her people need her" So I'm thinking Mary used that as an excuse she wanted to stay and make goo goo eyes a Bobby. Also these people just got out of a war they didn't' ask for. Would all 30 really want to just jump right back in? If they want to hunt, Sam should teach them to find cases and do research. These people are all soldiers. We were told Monsters existed in there world and they were more savage. They already should have the basics. They have the survival skills. There was a scene in 5.02 where Dean was mistaken for a solider so hunters and soldiers share a lot of traits. So they don't need the hand holding that the show is trying to sell. Why are they suddenly loyal to Sam. Its his fault Michael even got into their world in the first place becuase of his deicision to leave Lucifer behind. Why wouldn't they want Michael dead. Bobby lost his son. If anyone would want Michael dead it should be him, and im sure others lost loved ones. So their loyalty to Sam makes no sense. They should be loyal to Bobby and stopping Michael. Not Dean and Sam. They skipped that critical 3 week period so they didn't have to deal with the important stuff. its bad showing running and bad story telling and that is why everything just feels so forced an inorganic. The poor wounded overworked baby bird routine their selling is not working either becuase its so unnesscearly and its making it look like everyone is either incompetent or Sam doesn't trust them. But this is not how the writers are acting. I don't think they realized the tell didn't match the show. The writers have been saying that Sam is a natural born leader. They even put these words in Mary's mouth. They're acting like Team Free Will was leaderless all along so thank God, along came Sam. The amount of pimping and propping was out of control. So I don't think authorial intent was to show Sam was struggling. Honestly, I believe the only reason the Michael story was green lit because Dabb saw it as an opportunity to finally make the leader Sam thing work. Get rid of Dean to give Sam "breathing room" There was a reason that the main focus of the premier and why nothing has changed since Dean came back. There is room for Dean in this story and room for the show to acknowledge Dean's past leadership. But Dabb doesnt' see Dean that way. He's just the "funny guy"

Last season had 26 episodes. Four of those were filmed the year before, so they had to try and figure out a way to fit them in. They were good eps but they did interrupt the flow of the season and dragged down the pacing. So I will admit that hurt the season somewhat but that's not exactly the writers fault. So I think 10 eps is actually going to help the show. The writers have already said that each ep is going to move the story along with no filler.

Just curious if you watch the show? For me personally, I disagree with this description. I watch Lucifer and there was only one storyline I would term soapy. And it wasn't a main arc. There is a reason why Chloe just found out. He had planned to tell her but something happens at the end of season 2 that prevented it. It was a huge story line. Lucifer tackles things like identity and free will far better the Supernatural does it. Lucifer's relationship with Chloe isn't just Fee-Fees. Its a lot more complex. Actually this season Lucifer and Chloe spent a lot of time apart. The show trusts the relationship between the two main leads and doesn't feel the need for them to be attached at the hip. They don't hesitate to mix up the pairings which leads to some interesting stuff. The episodes build on each other. The writers obviously talk to each other. The multiple plot points are addressed and tie together. They balance multiple characters giving them something to do. This is not all on the writers, unfortunately, Lucifer was hampered by a lot of behind the scenes stuff. They wanted to go darker but were told by the net work they had to keep things light and procedural. They didn't want the writers to go much into the Supernatural. There was a big arc involving Lucifer's My favorite episode A Priest Walks into a Bar, not only Lucifer but of TV period, was almost nixed completely becasue of Network interference. The writers fought for both and IMO and for me episode 1.6 put the show on a new level. I can't wait too see what Netflix does with it, because they're not hampered by Network TV's standards and practices. I think it will move out more toward the darker elements. Tom Ellis is on record about wanting Lucifer to go darker. No, they're not perfect. I do think Dan needs more material than just comic relief. But given what they're up against, I think they do a great job, and I do think SPN could learn a lot about the way the run things.

I don't mind the bunker because I like that Dean has a home. I just hate all the other people in it. I don't like the gagets either. I liked when the show had to come up with out of the box solutions, like how Dean killed Zacheriah and Eve. I miss that out of the box thinking the show used to do. \ I also don;t like the gagets. I liked the blue-collar feel and I miss that. This is what I love about Dean too. It's part of the reason why I feel like he no longer fits into this show. When Dean tries to tell someone what hunting is really like he's accused of being bossy and controlling and people tell others to ignore Dean, or say he doesn't matter or that he's no longer part of the story. It seems like Dabb buys into this too. This is why I always felt Dean is the better mentor. He doesn't sugar coat things.

For me there is too much inconsistency to have any kind of hope. I remember when Billie told Dean she would see him soon. Nothing came of that. It seems like next week we are right back to the monsters not caring about or recognizing Dean.

Could it be Family Matters? There is a an abandoned house at the end of town. There is a scene at the end that sounds similair to watch your describing, but not exactly. There is a character named Danny, whose name Dean calls.

I wonder if they didn't mean for Dean to come out the way he did. Because Dean telling Sam that he was responsible for bringing Maggie home. I wonder if Sam going to the attic and pulling the needles out of Maggies neck was supposed to be saving her and not Dean stopping the monster. His killing of the Djinn was a lot of overkill, and a repeat of the scene from Ask Jeeves after he killed the shifter.

I feel like this whole Leader Sam arc can only end badly for Dean. It feels like they need to push the "Sam had it worse" narrative once again, so when Sam inevitably collapses or burns out, Dean will be accused of not being there for Sam and not taking some of the burden off his shoulders. But if Dean does offer to help and do some stuff he'll be accused of not trusting Sam and treating him like a kid. There is no good outcome for Dean here. This further makes me believe Dabb has an agenda against Dean. He makes it impossible for him to succeed.

We saw that Bobby was in charge of that but now that he's gone I'm sure it will just end up other thing on poor put upon Sam's plate. So he'll only get one hour of sleep. There doens't seem to be anyone else in the bunker capable of helping Sam with this stuff.

That's what bothers me. The writers have always gone with brains/brawn but now they seem to need to make Sam both. Even if Dean isn't interested in the day to day stuff. (I agree that doesn't interest him). I can really see Dean thriving at teaching young hunters. Because he doesn't sugar coat or glamourize what hunting actually is like others do. Ever since the ep Bad Boys that was kind of my dream ending for Dean, with him turning the bunker into a home for those who lost their parents due to hunting. The other thing I really dislike is martyr Sam routine their trying to shove down our throats because it doesn't have to be that way. Now that Dean isn't hibernating in his room anymore what exactly is he doing all day? The others hunters can't take turns monitoring footage and body cam footage? Are they incompetent or does Chief not trust them. Either way that doesn't' speak to Sam's effectiveness as a leader. When someone said they didn't know how do to something, Sam didn't teach them, he just did it himself. I've always felt Sam is the more controlling brother, despite the tell. We see shades of this here. He can't let go of that control. I've said before. There is a difference between been a leader and being in charge. What I'm seeing is Sam being in charge, not leading. What Dean did in his ep is leadership. I get Sam's need for control, given his history but that doesnt' necessarily mean Sam is born for leader ship or an effective one. He's not based on what we saw here. Since Michael is giving monsters upgrades that changes their powers Sam's lectures and telling the hunters to do their homework is useless. They didn't even consider the possibility of a Djinn because it didn't fit the pattern. The only reason is because Dean recognized the rig. Even, Sam and Dean as prepared as they are could never have prepared for that hunt. On a hunt, knowledge is important but so if flexibility. You have to be able to adapt on the fly. Like when their plan for the hell house went sideways. This is why I felt they were effective as a team in the early seasons. But not its seems like the gap is widening because its coming across as a competition that knowledge vs experiences rather than them complementing them for working together. Experience is what solved this case. Dean may not want to think about Michael and what he did, but Dean would never shy away from it if he felt it could help. Unfortunately, its also in character for Sam to accept credit when its not his and to not acknowledge the part Dean played. See the amount of back patting Sam gave himself in 9.01. The problem with Sam is that power goes to his head. Ruby, Lucifer, The Brits. It's actually dangerous for the world if people tell Sam he is special. I can see this happening again with Sam thinking that if he doesn't do it, it won't get done right. Again, that's control not leadership. Sam's seems to have lost his personality. He's had more of personality when he was souless. Now hes like a robot or someone on my timeline described him, a list of correct test answers. The problem is that Sam Smith really does think she seems to be playing Mary as a loving mom. With that whole, if you need me i"ll be there. Jensen's facial expressions didn't really come across as Dean finding that comforting, but more as resigned that its a nice thought but she probably would have some excuse why she couldn't make it, or more important things to do. He still loves his mom, of course, and he genuinely wants her to be happy but I think he's given up on Mary being in his life in any real meaningful way. He genuinely didn't care that she was leaving. He expects it at this point.

I was answering your question about how we know that Dabb didn't talk to Jensen. Its because Jensen told us.

The reason Jensen called Dabb was to get some advice on how to play Michael. He admitted he was struggling to find the character and asked for help. Dabb gave him nothing. There was no conversation because Dabb couldn't even give Jensen that.

Because he said he called Dabb to talk about Michael, Dabb said "do whatever. You remember how Christian played Michael?" So when Jensen asked if he should play Michael like that Dabb was like "no, do whatever." Jensen said the one thing he was relying on Dabb took away and then actually used the phrase, an island unto himself. So no, Dabb didnt' talk to Jensen about anything. Not to mention his blatent lies about how long Jensen would be playing Michael. We aren't even getting the flash backs we were promised. We had one flashback.

Yes Dabb said this. Paraphrasing. He said getting Dean off screen gave other characters breathing room.

I do to. Jensen just has that screen presence. I'd follow Dean off a cliff, because I know he'd be going over with me. Sam, I wouldn't follow to the kitchen because i'd have to tell him how awesome he was that he got me there safely and listen to a 20 minute lecture on how to properly use a knife, and give him credit for the how fresh the store bought bread was and how well wrapped the package cheese was. Then despite that fact that I made the sandwich, I'd have to give credit to Sam for how good it tasted.

Is it me or does Sam/Jared seem to be getting a lot more screen time than Dean/Jensen. It's almost like Jared signed a full time lead contract and Jensen signed a part time lead contract. or does it just feel that way because the Sam scenes are so dull this year? I'm not trying to start a debate on who had more screen time in the past. I'm strictly talking about this season.