Got Questions?: We've Got Answers!

[minirth]

What was "night time Hope"? Was it as bad as mime sex? (As if HOPE BRADY would shag some random mime. Really?)

ETA: Thank you JBC for the answer, but really? A vigilante while high? I can't decide if that's worse than mime sex. I'm honestly baffled by this conundrum.

Edited February 17, 2016 by minirth

[JBC344]

I didn't watch at the time, but I think that Night Time Hope was the storyline where Hope was addicted to pills and she would become a vigilante while high.  I think there was a point where she doused Bo in gasoline and almost set him on fire.  So yeah, on par with Mime Sex or in other words "Batshit Crazy".

[tribeca]

Has there ever been a grandmother so cold to her grandchild ?  Does Hope not like Claire ?  Does she remind him to much of Belle?  I never thought Hope liked Belle for some reason.

[SanDiegoInExile]

Has there ever been a grandmother so cold to her grandchild ?  Does Hope not like Claire ?  Does she remind him to much of Belle?  I never thought Hope liked Belle for some reason.

 

Hope was rather antagonistic toward Isabella Black from time to time, especially when Belle became all wishy washy and was bouncing between ShawnD and Philip.I think one of the biggest misfires of the Claire SORASing has been the GrannyHope angle.  Hope worshiped her grandmother Alice and it seems as if she has no interest at all in her own granddaughter Claire.

 

I sorta wonder if KA has it written in her contract that they minimize the Grandma Angle

[Apprentice79]

I hated that they have aged Claire, Theo, Chase, Ciara and Joey.  It was unnecessary..They should have remained tweens for a bit..We still have alot of legacy children that we have yet to see come back as adults: For example, Andrew Shawn Donovan. He was the focus of so many stories during the Kim and Shane love story..I always wanted him to come back and join Eric, Shawn-Douglas and Brady to take over for their dads....Andrew was such a mini Shane as a kid....The show has failed to develop the majority of the legacy children..Eric is still a nonentity after all this time...

Edited March 14, 2016 by Apprentice79

[SanDiegoInExile]

One of the reasons Eric is such a non-entity was that (aside from 2 years of Jensen Ackles) he was off-screen until his mid- to late-30s.  And his backstory was never mentioned (ie becoming a priest). Add in bland performances and weak (non-existent?) charisma, and Eric = Yawn.

 

The show has done the mega-SORAS a few times in history and it's always a jolt.  Even moreso now that the internet documents every single frame of programming and every single thought from every single fan.  I blame most of the awkward transition on what we now know was the behind-the-scenes trauma/drama that was happening (writer changes/network renewal interference).   The last time we had a mega-SORAS, it seemed to happen more slowly and independently.  ShawnD was always on screen and was naturally aging.  Belle and Brady went from toddler to homebody teens during a J+M honeymoon week.  Chloe came from out of nowhere. And Philip went from 3 years old to 17 without ever being seen.  

 

Viewers knew that all the group would mesh together at some point -- with Mimi popping in as bestie, Jan Spears as Mean Girl Extraordinaire, and even a handful of dayplayer teens (Gigantor, Kevin, and Jason).  Yet during that mega-SORAS, the producers/writers kept the group initially apart for independent storylines.  Brady was the laughable rebel, battling with Marlena, blasting generic rock music before transforming into a sappy showtune crooner extraordinaire, filing lawsuits against his stepmom's ex-, and rescuing Belle from train tracks (and into a coma so Kirsten Storms could film her Disney movie). Belle clung to her mom, worried about makeup, defended her big brother, kibitzed with Mimi, and played the pampered princess.  Chloe was dealing with her just-found mother and Ghoul Girl persona.  ShawnD was battling Princess Gina or dealing with other Brady Family Drama.  All of them had memorable independent storylines and were interacting heavily with older cast members.

 

This time around, they did try to give thrice-seen Joey a somewhat independent storyline, but it appears that much of Ava-Joey was torn apart and rebuilt, thanks to behind the scenes drama.  Deranged rapist Chase came from out of nowhere, and arguably no one cares about him.  Bope and Jarlena granddaughter Claire seemingly doesn't even know her grandparents, instead warbling around Salem with amazonian FakeEve.  Ciara and Theo have always had a great friendship/bond and it does seem to be the only somewhat realistic/consistent relationship.  Ciara was a bully growing up and watched over the older Theo.  Now, Theo seems to want to watch over her.  That's potential gold.

 

SORAS is always a jolt, and toss in Murder, Rape, and Adult Autism as storylines for newbies to handle.  That's rarely done well.

Edited March 15, 2016 by SanDiegoInExile

[tribeca]

I have always like the actress playing Summer.  Could be I have soft spot for the character of Meg Synder.  Anyway I don't know what is going on with her story with Maggie.

   Actually I adore Maggie.   I find her sweet and kind of loved when she sent Lujack out her house with a bottled water LOL

Anyway my question (s)

 

Is  Summer really bi-polar or is it an act ?  I missed the backstory of who the father is and why she was given up.  Can someone fill me in?

Is there a reason why the show won't bring back Maggie's other children?

TIA

[DisneyBoy]

I've been wondering whether Days really came under enough fire from Conservatives to warrant writing out the gays on this show...I mean, Will and Sonny had already become a couple by the time Guy replaced Chandler. Why would they kill Will off in such a dismissive fashion more than a year after Guy arrived? Wouldn't anti-gay outcry have settled down by then?

...I know Guy wasn't popular in the role and they had written Will as a jerk in his final months, but that doesn't seem like enough to warrant writing him out so dismissively.

...yet I don't remember much anger over "teh gays!1!" on the show in the months prior to the 50th....

...so were they really killing him to appease bigots?

Edited April 24, 2016 by DisneyBoy

[SanDiegoInExile]

I've been wondering whether Days really came under enough fire from Conservatives to warrant writing out the gays on this show...I mean, Will and Sonny had already become a couple by the time Guy replaced Chandler. Why would they kill Will off in such a dismissive fashion more than a year after Guy arrived? Wouldn't anti-gay outcry have settled down by then?

...I know Guy wasn't popular in the role and they had written Will as a jerk in his final months, but that doesn't seem like enough to warrant writing him out so dismissively.

...yet I don't remember much anger over "teh gays!1!" on the show in the months prior to the 50th....

...so were they really killing him to appease bigots?

 

I doubt that we will never know for sure. I believe that Corday/NBC/Sony are constantly conducting focus groups to rate popularity of actors/storylines.  The whole "Gay Will" saga began years and years and years ago.  I recall that folks on message boards were suggesting "Gay Will" as far back as when Christopher Gerse was playing the character. When Dylan Patton moped his way through the role, his lack of chemistry with Mia only made certain folks clamor for a Gay Will.  Once Will was recast with Chandler Massey, the clamor grew and grew.  I have no way of knowing CM's true eventual orientation, but his portrayal just sent my gaydar way way way off the meter. He was a young actor who fully embraced the role, especially in the first months of the evolution to Gay Will.

 

Initially, I do believe that there were many long term viewers who wanted nothing to do with any gay DOOL character.   DOOL skews heavily in the bible belt and among rural viewers. I hate to be overly stereotypical, but I think a major part of its fanbase are evangelical older females, the type whose social life revolves around church, and sewing bees, and family potlucks in the park, the types who never use foul language, believe that marriage is for one man and one woman for all lifetime, that woman must be subserviant to her leader/husband, and who have dared to watch an R rated movie only a few times in their lives.  There's a big chunk of America who are just that way.  My aunt and uncle fall into that category (though the dont watch DOOL)

 

It's never been "trendy" to watch (like GH often is), nor does it have a broad diverse audience (like YR).  

 

DOOL did an excellent job with much of the Gay Will storyline.  Yet, it was clear that the producers/writers did not know what to do with a happily content couple.  This criticism is often blasted at nearly every "happy" couple in Salem, For some reason, DOOL does a lousy job writing couples unless they have obstacles keeping them apart. This isn't new either.  It's always been the case.  Happy couples = no ratings.  At least that is what the Corday infrastructure believes.  It happened with Doug-Julie.  It happened with Bo-Hope. It happened with Jack-Jennifer. It happened with Steve-Kayla.  It happened with Kim-Shane.  It happened with Elvis-Samanther. Honestly, the only happily married couple who could carry storylines were Tom and Alice.  And for the most part, each of them were often heavily supporting actors in other storylines, not carrying their own.  Will-Sonny was just Version 37.0

 

As for Will being body-slammed into premature death, I think it was mostly two reasons.  One, there needed to be a major death.  Given all the behind the scenes turmoil that we know about (renewal, writer changeups, storyline confusion), there is also a lot we probably don't know.  DOOL did a sucky job with the aftermath of Will's death. In theory, his grandmothers would have had some knockout scenes.  His parents would have been shown as devastated.  And his husband would have been given the respect that any Salem Widower would have been.  Something was clearly wrong when they put the grieving husband in the second row. 

 

Then again, I think back to the Melaswen Death Spree.  DOOL did a lousy job with the aftermath for all those folks as well. Some were mourned for just an episode or had their funerals combined (?!?). I think the Death Of Mickey was the last time the show did death well. 

 

To me, the second reason Will met his maker had to due entirely with the actor and the acting choices he was making.  I was recently watching some of the post-dead-EJ, off-to-Hollywood shows.  And GW was just dreadful.  He made Will 100% unlikable, which was never the character of Will we knew.  As I was watching, I actually said to myself, "God, am I glad you are dead now."

 

It makes 100% sense to me that that those reasons trump any anti-gay or homophobic rationale.

 

DOOL -- and Corday -- has always been way gay friendly behind the scenes.  Wesley Eure (Mike Horton in the late 70s-early 80s) has written about his breakup with Richard Chamberlain and how the show stood behind him and supported him -- and this was in the early 1980s.  There were several other openly gay actors in the cast through the 80s and 90s and they all had seemingly had good experiences.

 

Greg Meng is openly gay.  And I am sure he isn't the only one behind the scenes who is.  As the Killer Ben story was being crafted, they knew they needed at least one or two major deaths.  And they likely had data to support how loathesome the actor (and by extension, the character) had become.  In theory, killing Will should have made outstanding TV, especially since his cousin was involved with the Killer.  In actuality, it fell flat.

 

They could have added some oomph to the aftermath by having Abigail name her son Thomas William.  

 

This is DOOL.  Every worthwhile character has been wrongly presumed dead at  least once.  I fully expect Will to appear at some point.

Edited April 25, 2016 by SanDiegoInExile

[Apprentice79]

I doubt that we will never know for sure. I believe that Corday/NBC/Sony are constantly conducting focus groups to rate popularity of actors/storylines.  The whole "Gay Will" saga began years and years and years ago.  I recall that folks on message boards were suggesting "Gay Will" as far back as when Christopher Gerse was playing the character. When Dylan Patton moped his way through the role, his lack of chemistry with Mia only made certain folks clamor for a Gay Will.  Once Will was recast with Chandler Massey, the clamor grew and grew.  I have no way of knowing CM's true eventual orientation, but his portrayal just sent my gaydar way way way off the meter. He was a young actor who fully embraced the role, especially in the first months of the evolution to Gay Will.

 

Initially, I do believe that there were many long term viewers who wanted nothing to do with any gay DOOL character.   DOOL skews heavily in the bible belt and among rural viewers. I hate to be overly stereotypical, but I think a major part of its fanbase are evangelical older females, the type whose social life revolves around church, and sewing bees, and family potlucks in the park, the types who never use foul language, believe that marriage is for one man and one woman for all lifetime, that woman must be subserviant to her leader/husband, and who have dared to watch an R rated movie only a few times in their lives.  There's a big chunk of America who are just that way.  My aunt and uncle fall into that category (though the dont watch DOOL)

 

It's never been "trendy" to watch (like GH often is), nor does it have a broad diverse audience (like YR).  

 

DOOL did an excellent job with much of the Gay Will storyline.  Yet, it was clear that the producers/writers did not know what to do with a happily content couple.  This criticism is often blasted at nearly every "happy" couple in Salem, For some reason, DOOL does a lousy job writing couples unless they have obstacles keeping them apart. This isn't new either.  It's always been the case.  Happy couples = no ratings.  At least that is what the Corday infrastructure believes.  It happened with Doug-Julie.  It happened with Bo-Hope. It happened with Jack-Jennifer. It happened with Steve-Kayla.  It happened with Kim-Shane.  It happened with Elvis-Samanther. Honestly, the only happily married couple who could carry storylines were Tom and Alice.  And for the most part, each of them were often heavily supporting actors in other storylines, not carrying their own.  Will-Sonny was just Version 37.0

 

As for Will being body-slammed into premature death, I think it was mostly two reasons.  One, there needed to be a major death.  Given all the behind the scenes turmoil that we know about (renewal, writer changeups, storyline confusion), there is also a lot we probably don't know.  DOOL did a sucky job with the aftermath of Will's death. In theory, his grandmothers would have had some knockout scenes.  His parents would have been shown as devastated.  And his husband would have been given the respect that any Salem Widower would have been.  Something was clearly wrong when they put the grieving husband in the second row. 

 

Then again, I think back to the Melaswen Death Spree.  DOOL did a lousy job with the aftermath for all those folks as well. Some were mourned for just an episode or had their funerals combined (?!?). I think the Death Of Mickey was the last time the show did death well. 

 

To me, the second reason Will met his maker had to due entirely with the actor and the acting choices he was making.  I was recently watching some of the post-dead-EJ, off-to-Hollywood shows.  And GW was just dreadful.  He made Will 100% unlikable, which was never the character of Will we knew.  As I was watching, I actually said to myself, "God, am I glad you are dead now."

 

It makes 100% sense to me that that those reasons trump any anti-gay or homophobic rationale.

 

DOOL -- and Corday -- has always been way gay friendly behind the scenes.  Wesley Eure (Mike Horton in the late 70s-early 80s) has written about his breakup with Richard Chamberlain and how the show stood behind him and supported him -- and this was in the early 1980s.  There were several other openly gay actors in the cast through the 80s and 90s and they all had seemingly had good experiences.

 

Greg Meng is openly gay.  And I am sure he isn't the only one behind the scenes who is.  As the Killer Ben story was being crafted, they knew they needed at least one or two major deaths.  And they likely had data to support how loathesome the actor (and by extension, the character) had become.  In theory, killing Will should have made outstanding TV, especially since his cousin was involved with the Killer.  In actuality, it fell flat.

 

They could have added some oomph to the aftermath by having Abigail name her son Thomas William.  

 

This is DOOL.  Every worthwhile character has been wrongly presumed dead at  least once.  I fully expect Will to appear at some point.

The whole serial killer storyline was stupid and it was totally unnecessary..It was just a way to showcase Chabbie as a supercouple..They are far from that in my opinion..Will's death was gratuitous and offensive...If they wanted to recast the role, they should have just sent Will to go patch things with Sonny offscreen. Years later they can bring them back again...It was too coincidental that Gabi was released in time to take custody of Arianna after Will's death..It would have been more poignant, to have Sonny come back for his daughter and leave Salem to start anew, after Will's death...Will and Gabi both wanted Sonny to have custody of her, if anything were to happen to them..Tomsell did a good job of showing a Gay family with Will, Sonny and Arianna Grace..I remember getting verklempt, watching the scene of  Arianna clinging to her daddy Sonny after he came back from Arizona..She would not let him go. I still have that episode on the DVR because of that..

 

It was Ken's Corday stupid to turn Will into a Sami clone and that backfired on the character's likability and ultimately led to his gruesome death...Will was never like his mother...Plus, Tomsell never wanted Will to cheat on Sonny.  Ken Corday did, he wanted to turn Will into a love to hate character like Sami was....The cheating storyline was meant for Sonny..All of the actors in the storyline, expressed shock after reading their scripts saying that Will would cheat instead of Sonny..Ken Corday is horrible and he is the reason that the show has been in the toilet for so long...Viewers are leaving in droves week to week....

 

I do feel that Will's death was homophobic and that Ken Corday was pandering to those that hated the Gay storyline on Days..He exorcised the Gays from the show..There was a finality to Will's death that sealed it for me..Not to mention, that Will was literally put in a garbage bag. The picture of the Wilson family being blown away on Will's grave was like a knife to the heart...We have had deaths of popular characters before and the show always left it ambiguous to wiggle their way out of it in the future...There were no flashbacks of the Wilson love story, it was like they never existed...Yet, that horrible Daniel  Jonas is still being mentioned and people are still crying over that piece of shit..Nobody remembers Bo and Will..It is truly revolting...

Edited April 25, 2016 by Apprentice79

[SanDiegoInExile]

It's not revolting.  It's a daytime drama.  It's a soap. It's pretend.  As a gay man, I have watched the show for 30+ years and was glad that it finally had a gay character.  Sadly, the gay characters were horribly portrayed -- and badly written. There isn't a gay man in this country who marries the only guy he has ever slept with and only the second guy he ever kissed.  

 

Jackson and Will had some wonderful, beautiful moments, especially in the first few months. After that, it was pretty horrid, storywise, post wedding.  The producers big mistake was letting the weaker actor take precedence.  Had they used the stronger Freddie Smith as the protaganist, then the characters may have had a different fate.  

 

Every "murder" in Salem is gratuitous. I thought the Will murder was well done, from a production point of view.  And it also left a very easy way for Will to re-appear live again.  It's also fiction.  Will wasn't murdered because he was gay, he was murdered because he discovered the truth about Ben. So, in a way, he was a prop to his cousin's storyline, just like pointless Serena and Beige Paige. 

 

I will agree that the whole serial murder spree was a bust.  I blame that mostly on the turmoil that was boiling all around the show during 2015. I do think Will Horton will be back in Salem at some point.  And with a story that actually makes sense.

Edited April 25, 2016 by SanDiegoInExile

[swtrgrl]

I vehemently disagree. Will's death was revolting in every way imaginable. On screen and behind it.

[DisneyBoy]

I agree with you, SanDiego, in that it was a combination of factors that lead to Will's death. It's the funeral and aftermath that say to me "we bowed to the homophobes". I can't believe Sonny was in the second row and I can't believe how often Daniel and Bo and Stefano are referenced while Will's name has been said what...five times in the last six months? That to me is jarring. Even if they killed him off to get the gay characters off-canvas he should still matter to his surviving relatives enough to be mourned and remembered.

It's good to hear the production has been overall supportive of their gay members, but this Will thing is really a stain on their record. He may not have died on-camera because he was gay...but we can't say that the decision didn't hinge on it.

Edited April 25, 2016 by DisneyBoy

[Apprentice79]

It's not revolting.  It's a daytime drama.  It's a soap. It's pretend.  As a gay man, I have watched the show for 30+ years and was glad that it finally had a gay character.  Sadly, the gay characters were horribly portrayed -- and badly written. There isn't a gay man in this country who marries the only guy he has ever slept with and only the second guy he ever kissed.  

 

Jackson and Will had some wonderful, beautiful moments, especially in the first few months. After that, it was pretty horrid, storywise, post wedding.  The producers big mistake was letting the weaker actor take precedence.  Had they used the stronger Freddie Smith as the protaganist, then the characters may have had a different fate.  

 

Every "murder" in Salem is gratuitous. I thought the Will murder was well done, from a production point of view.  And it also left a very easy way for Will to re-appear live again.  It's also fiction.  Will wasn't murdered because he was gay, he was murdered because he discovered the truth about Ben. So, in a way, he was a prop to his cousin's storyline, just like pointless Serena and Beige Paige. 

 

I will agree that the whole serial murder spree was a bust.  I blame that mostly on the turmoil that was boiling all around the show during 2015. I do think Will Horton will be back in Salem at some point.  And with a story that actually makes sense.

I do agree that the Paul storyline should have been a way to showcase Sonny and explore his background. They could have brought back one of his brothers and explore the dynamic of his family with Justin and Adrienne...Guy Wilson was not a popular recast and turning him into a crazy asshole did not endear him to the masses....Sonny cheating on Will with Paul could have made him more sympathetic....If they wanted Will to go off the rails, Sonny's affair with Paul could have been the impetus for that...I never understood Will's convoluted reasoning to go after Paul, when he was the one that cheated on Sonny with him...

Edited April 25, 2016 by Apprentice79

[swtrgrl]

I never understood Will's convoluted reasoning to go after Paul, when he was the one that cheated on Sonny with him...

Bad writing. 

[DisneyBoy]

Why did the show spend several episodes discussing people's reactions to Belle buying Claire a club to sing in...if we've still never seen her perform an act there for adults?

She sang there for Ciara's birthday and at Prom...and that's it. Two private events.

Edited May 21, 2016 by DisneyBoy

[DisneyBoy]

Can anyone tell me in which episode last fall (2015) did Theresa show Maggie her fashion sketches at the pub and get her encouragement?

Can't figure it out for the life of me and the recaps I keep finding are SO LONG I can't seem to easily pin-point that one episode...thanks!

[minirth]

I'm watching random DAYS clips, and happened upon Victor's stroke in 6/16/1997.  Kate (Lauren Koslow by this point) is freaking out and seems genuinely distraught at the idea of him dying, and his fuzzy thoughts are of forgiving her and he also seems genuine.  Were they still really in love at this point? What happened after the stroke?  Is this when Victor and Kate split up?  I really loved them as a power couple.

Another question -- I'm now in 1996 watching to Sami blackmailing Kate and the aftermath of Jack shooting Peter.  How in hell was Jack not convicted of Peter's murder?  (I wasn't watching during this time at all -- I've never actually seen Kristen before she was crazy.  I didn't realize she was a sympathetic character back in the day.

Edited July 18, 2016 by minirth

[DisneyBoy]

Jack did go to jail, IIRC. But people knew/suspected Peter was alive. I think that's why the laser was used to erase Laura's memory. She saw Peter alive and well, and that would have exonerated Jack, which would have freed him up to be with Jennifer, which the DiMeras did not want.

Or something. I missed too much of Peter's storyline to really know.

Kristen was awesome as a good gal. She worked to convince neighbors not to force an HIV patient out of the Horton House. She taught baseball to kids. She helped deliver Belle at the cabin. She refused to believe Stefano, the kind soul who had raised her, was evil.

Her gradual shift to the dark side was really well done. I don't know if it's still online, but the scene of Kristen threatening to jump to her death at the John/Mar engagement party and her ensuing tirade towards Stefano really brought it all home - Kristen was shattered and no longer able to be the good girl.

Edited July 18, 2016 by DisneyBoy

[minirth]

Thank you so much, DIsneyBoy!  I will try to find that online -- I'd like to see it!

[DisneyBoy]

On 10/06/2016 at 11:50 PM, DisneyBoy said:

Can anyone tell me in which episode last fall (2015) did Theresa show Maggie her fashion sketches at the pub and get her encouragement?

Can't figure it out for the life of me and the recaps I keep finding are SO LONG I can't seem to easily pin-point that one episode...thanks!

Edited because I found it myself.

4 hours ago, minirth said:

Thank you so much, DIsneyBoy!  I will try to find that online -- I'd like to see it!

There used to be all the chapters - Lady in a Cage, Pillow Baby, Secret Room, etc - on YT. Might have been taken down though.

Edited July 19, 2016 by DisneyBoy

[JBC344]

5 hours ago, minirth said:

I'm watching random DAYS clips, and happened upon Victor's stroke in 6/16/1997.  Kate (Lauren Koslow by this point) is freaking out and seems genuinely distraught at the idea of him dying, and his fuzzy thoughts are of forgiving her and he also seems genuine.  Were they still really in love at this point? What happened after the stroke?  Is this when Victor and Kate split up?  I really loved them as a power couple.

Another question -- I'm now in 1996 watching to Sami blackmailing Kate and the aftermath of Jack shooting Peter.  How in hell was Jack not convicted of Peter's murder?  (I wasn't watching during this time at all -- I've never actually seen Kristen before she was crazy.  I didn't realize she was a sympathetic character back in the day.

I believe Kate and Victor were still in love at this point.  This stroke actually sparked one of my favorite Days scenes ever.  Kate and Lucas go to visit Victor in the hospital, while they are holding vigil they take Victor's hands and vow to him that they will kill Sami for what she has done to their family.  Outside of the declaration for murder it is an incredibly "sweet and touching" family scene between Kate, Victor, and Lucas.  That was back when the show remembered that they were a family and Victor was actually a character back then as opposed to the caricature he is now.

[minirth]

Thank you, JBC.  I would love to find that scene.  The current writing for Victor is breaking my damn heart.  I've loved him for so long, and I hate what he's been reduced to.

[Apprentice79]

19 hours ago, JBC344 said:

I believe Kate and Victor were still in love at this point.  This stroke actually sparked one of my favorite Days scenes ever.  Kate and Lucas go to visit Victor in the hospital, while they are holding vigil they take Victor's hands and vow to him that they will kill Sami for what she has done to their family.  Outside of the declaration for murder it is an incredibly "sweet and touching" family scene between Kate, Victor, and Lucas.  That was back when the show remembered that they were a family and Victor was actually a character back then as opposed to the caricature he is now.

I loved the Victor/Kate romance...It was written wonderfully...I loved their unity, love for each other and love for Lucas...I hated that the show ruined their love story to make Kate more sinister and selfish...Kate was such a multidimensional character back in the day and it pains me that she has been reduced as a bed warmer for the men in town..

[minirth]

Kristen was awesome as a good gal. She worked to convince neighbors not to force an HIV patient out of the Horton House. She taught baseball to kids. She helped deliver Belle at the cabin. She refused to believe Stefano, the kind soul who had raised her, was evil.

Her gradual shift to the dark side was really well done. I don't know if it's still online, but the scene of Kristen threatening to jump to her death at the John/Mar engagement party and her ensuing tirade towards Stefano really brought it all home - Kristen was shattered and no longer able to be the good girl.

DisneyBoy, roughly what year was that party?  I spent an enjoyable evening watching early Kristen/John, including when they made love in the cabin and the Stefano reveal.  I was really surprised by how sympathetic I found her.

 

 

Edited July 20, 2016 by minirth
technical difficulties

[DisneyBoy]

Is the Saint Luke's set more expensive than the others to put up? I remain amazed that it wasn't brought back for the many funerals last fall, or for the Haiden wedding. Was the issue that there wasn't enough room in the soundstages?

[JBC344]

Can someone tell me why the writing can't be like this anymore?  Is it really that hard?  The show has a 50 plus year history that gets shucked aside for plot contrivances.

One of my favorite scenes.  Tony, Marlena, and Anna reunited back in 2007.  So much history between these characters all sprinkled through without outrageous fanfare.

Part 1  :

Part 2:

Part 3:

Part 4:

[Apprentice79]

Thank you for that! I laughed and I cried ..Tony and Anna forever....

[JBC344]

40 minutes ago, Apprentice79 said:

Thank you for that! I laughed and I cried ..Tony and Anna forever....

As much as I love the Tony and Ann reunion and flashback.  I equally appreciate how ecstatic Marlena is to see her old friend Tony. You forget how close they were back then.

[Apprentice79]

11 minutes ago, JBC344 said:

As much as I love the Tony and Ann reunion and flashback.  I equally appreciate how ecstatic Marlena is to see her old friend Tony. You forget how close they were back then.

That is so true..I forgot to mention the Marlena/Tony..Marlena was always so good with the guys on the show..I always loved her dynamic with Bo and of course Eugene....

I have always wanted the gemini twins Rex and Cassie to have been Tony and Anna's....They lost their baby boy due to a jealous Renee..It was shortsighted on Dena to have made them Roman's and Kate's via Marlena when she was missing..What a lame story for the missing years of Marlena, when she was held captive by Stefano...

Alternatively, Rex and Cassie could have been Orpheus' children bent on exacting revenge on Jarlena by messing with their kids..So much history has been ignored, in favor of shallow  and vapid characters like Deimos, Summer and the Hernandez clan...It is a damn shame...

Edited July 27, 2016 by Apprentice79

[Rick Kitchen]

Wasn't Deimos responsible for Bo having been kidnapped and locked away for years?  Has Show conveniently forgotten that?

[Apprentice79]

5 hours ago, Rick Kitchen said:

Wasn't Deimos responsible for Bo having been kidnapped and locked away for years?  Has Show conveniently forgotten that?

Yes..I think Griffith wanted him to be a villain, whereas Dena wants him to be a grey character...So, it will not be mention...The show is in Dena's control now...

[minirth]

I'm working through 2013, with heavy emphasis on the Brady/Kristen relationship.  I've got a gap between the middle of May and the middle of June, during which they broke up.  Can anyone please tell me why they broke up (that time)?  Did it come out that Kristen hired the mugger in the park?  And am I correct that this breakup is what leads to the Kristen/Eric/Flashdrive/PriestSex escapade?

[DisneyBoy]

Yes and yes. Through a bunch of contrivances, Mar stumbled upon photos of Kristen paying off the dopey mugger and revealed them to Brady the morning of his would-be wedding. Look up Eileen's glorious Emmy demo reel on YT for the scenes of the aftermath, where Kristen swears revenge and informs Marlena that John has been throwing himself at her and wanted to bang her to prove to Brady that she was lying all along about her devotion to him. It's awesome.

Sadly after that the writers started smoking crack and had her rape Eric for no reason.

[minirth]

I *heart* you, DIsneyBoy!  That sounds glorious -- I will look it up!

[DisneyBoy]

There used to be more of the storyline on YT, including the creepy/strangely satisfying scenes of John trying to seduce Kristen the night before her wedding to Brady, and both of them on the brink of texting Brady so he'd walk in on them, LOL. She, wisely, turned him down, finally getting that Brady's actual love for her was the real ultimate revenge she'd been seeking. And tired old John left in a huff with blue balls.

He sure was an ass in 2012/2013/2014.

Sadly that all seems to have been pulled off YT, last I checked.

[nilyank]

Here is a question, did Stefano and Sami ever find out that Clyde was the one that killed EJ? Or do they still think he was the victim of an apparent mugging.

[LeftPhalange]

No one ever found out about Clyde's role in EJ's murder, Sonny's stabbing, or that he beat Ben and Jordan and raped Jordan.

[DisneyBoy]

I wonder how much of that will be resolved in the future, if anything...Sami's not on the radar as a possible return and she cared more about EJ than anyone....

[JBC344]

According to the new promos, we may in fact get some answers to those questions.  We will see.

[JBC344]

I'm pretty sure this is actually a question that doesn't have an answer but I always like pondering it every once in a while.  I've always been very curious if we will ever know what Austin and Billie's original names were.  Has anyone else ever wondered?

We know Curtis renamed them when he stole them from Kate and faked their deaths.  We know Billie was named after Billie Holiday because Curtis was a huge fan.  I don't know if we ever got an origin for the name Austin?

Now of course their names being changed was a plot point to keep Kate and Marlena from recognizing them in the 90's but I've always wondered why we never got a passing scene of Kate telling them what their original names were or even of her and Marlena discussing the kids by name. 

[Apprentice79]

7 minutes ago, JBC344 said:

I'm pretty sure this is actually a question that doesn't have an answer but I always like pondering it every once in a while.  I've always been very curious if we will ever know what Austin and Billie's original names were.  Has anyone else ever wondered?

We know Curtis renamed them when he stole them from Kate and faked their deaths.  We know Billie was named after Billie Holiday because Curtis was a huge fan.  I don't know if we ever got an origin for the name Austin?

Now of course their names being changed was a plot point to keep Kate and Marlena from recognizing them in the 90's but I've always wondered why we never got a passing scene of Kate telling them what their original names were or even of her and Marlena discussing the kids by name. 

I don't even think the show even knows at this point..lol I do think that if Sheri Anderson was still there , we would have gotten that answer....Sheri was the best writer and I still miss her.....

[DisneyBoy]

Did she pass on or simply retire?

Edited September 15, 2016 by DisneyBoy

[Apprentice79]

2 hours ago, DisneyBoy said:

Did she pass on of simply retire?

I think she left due to creative differences with her co-headwriter at the time James E. Reilly about the direction of the show..Shery Anderson wanted more character-driven stories, while he wanted more fantastical,shocking, plot driven stories......He brought back the Dimeras full time, she would never have done that..He wrote off Jack, and was pushing Peter Blake as the ideal man for Jennifer.. He wrote the Marlena possession story and he turned Tony into a psycho, that he had to be retcon as being Andre, by subsequent writers....Tony was always the white sheep of the Dimera family. It is what made him an anomaly and so damn interesting..I doubt that she would have made Sami as evil as James E. Reilly..If she did, she would have connected Sami to her aunt Samantha Evans and delve into Marlena's turbulent history with her late twin sister... She never would have made Sami the interloper for Carrie/Austin...I liked her version of Carrie/Austin than James E. Reilly....He made them stupid and gullible, so that Sami would prevail...

Sheri would  let the characters drive the story and not the plot.. She had a great ability of planting the seed of a story and letting it build slowly and organically, then it would crescendo..Once it climaxed, it would enter into another phase...Everything had a purpose in her stories, no stone was left unturned...Marlena's affair was  a great example of that....I remember Sami was suffering from bulimia, dealing with the stress of seeing John and Marlena's sexual romp at Titan. That added to Marlena's guilt and shame about how her selfish act was affecting her family, yet, she could not keep herself from loving John and wanting him.....That kind of complex writing is typical Sheri Anderson, it is why she is missed and beloved by longtime fans..

The Hope/Bo/Billie triangle would not have been so horrific....I hated how JER tried to make Billie on the same level as Hope....That was insulting on so many levels... I did not like how Bo acted when he knew that Hope was alive. She was the love of his life and he would have done anything for her. Billie and Carly were not on Hope's level in Bo's life, so his dismissal of Hope didn't ring true for me. It would have made more sense, if Bo had such utter, extreme guilt that he didn't find Hope after the explosion and that he believed she was dead so he couldn't deal with that guilt when she was found to be alive. JER was incapable of that type of writing. Sheri Anderson would have written it that way! JER's writing of Bo and Hope really bothered me. 

Hope's and Steve's return from the dead would have been written much better with more depth and she would have not have tied their missing years to Stefano.. I can see her making John, Roman again, after Wayne left for good..She was always against doing the tale of the two Romans...I also think that she would have integrated the legacy children into the fabric of the show and pass the torch over to them as the future of the show and not constantly rely on the vets to carry the show, when the ratings go south.... She would never twist establish characters' histories to create new characters like Deimos and Summer.....

Edited September 15, 2016 by Apprentice79

[minirth]

I'm back in 2013, during the heyday of Kristen/Brady, and everyone keeps lamenting "Madison" as if she was the love of Brady's life.  Who the hell was Madison? Was she played by the same actress who played Ava?  

[Apprentice79]

11 minutes ago, minirth said:

I'm back in 2013, during the heyday of Kristen/Brady, and everyone keeps lamenting "Madison" as if she was the love of Brady's life.  Who the hell was Madison? Was she played by the same actress who played Ava?  

No, she was played by Sarah Joy Brown who played Carly on General Hospital..The actress who played Ava, also played Carly after Sarah left the role...

Edited September 20, 2016 by Apprentice79

[DisneyBoy]

Yeah, I know what you mean. She was the previous love interest for Brady, and I think she died in an explosion or cave-in or something.

As you can tell, she was hugely important to the people of Salem *eyeroll*

[minirth]

An explosion or cave-in or something... Hahahaha!  Fantastic!

[JBC344]

2 hours ago, minirth said:

An explosion or cave-in or something... Hahahaha!  Fantastic!

Brady and Madison were a couple.  Madison actually wasn't a bad character after all.  She was played by the amazing Sarah Brown (trust me, this woman can really act).  Just to summarize Madison was an old friend of Sami's, she owned Mad World cosmetics which was a rival to Countess Whilemina, so Madison and Kate became business rivals.  Madison's estranged husband Ian was also an old flame of Kate's.  Stefano set up Kate to have an affair with Ian, that is how they divorced.  Ian was also responsible for kidnapping Stefano. 

Madison also convinced Sami to double cross Kate and act as a spy for her, just when Kate and Sami were starting to get along and become actual friends.  Anyway Brady and Madison were a decent couple.  She died during the Salem explosion a few years ago, the same one that killed Jack.  This was in a roundabout way started by Gaby.  Gaby was jealous of Melanie and Chad, so she hired a guy to temp Melanie away from Chad I believe.  The guy turned out to be crazy and became obsessed with Melanie and kidnapped her.  Pursuing the guy in the tunnels below Salem is what lead to the explosion.

When Madison died Brady went to Kate and asked her if she would take over Mad World.  Even though Kate and Madison were rivals Brady knew Madison's company would be in good hands with Kate running it.  It was actually a sweet moment/full circle moment because when Brady was young Kate was the one who mentored him at Basic Black.

[minirth]

Thank you so much, JBC!  I was away from the show during that entire storyline, and I really appreciate the context.  I love Sarah Brown; I'll have to see if there are any clips out there.