Cast in Other Roles

[caracas1914]

Her album did mediocre sales and wasn't a big critical darling

 

 

I will grant you her album (from reviews I read) didn't receive a lot of  critical praise, but mediocre sales is relative, she didn't get a gold certification (500,00 copies sold) but if she sold a few hundred thousand copies I wouldn't say with no touring or extensive marketing Columbia thought it was a bad freshman effort or "mediocre".   Not all albums have to have Katey Perry/Swift Taylor numbers to be successful.

Edited March 23, 2015 by caracas1914

[Florinaldo]

I think it's still too soon to say the album is DOA.

Even if "Dead On Arrival" is definitely an overstatement (they worked on it for a long time, way past the "arrival" point), I think that the most probable status of things at this point is that both parties are not on the same wavelength and if he ever puts out a record, it will not be with Columbia's main label. If it is revived, I see it as happening under another brand.

 

If I had to guess, Columbia wanted Darren to be the current version of Teen Beat's cover feature and he wanted to be Adam Levine.

Columbia's goal for him was perhaps not Teen Beat fodder exactly, but very probably something very pop-sounding; disappointing sales results for someone like LM would also have figured in the balance. His 2013 tour may have led him to realise that this was not where he is the most comfortable in light of the results with the few newer numbers he was testing; people can change their take on things as facts and situations evolve.

 

I obviously do not know when their various options expire(d) and what exact provisions cover each of them. I think however that part of the cageyness may be due to the fact that they are trying to sort out some rights issues, like the versions of his older songs that he recorded while under agreement with Columbia, not wanting to lose out on the production work already in the can. Considering past behaviour from music labels, he has his work cut out for himself if that is the case.

 

Parting ways with Columbia may turn out to be a blessing in disguise for them if he along with others not named Lea Michelle can find musical homes with smaller labels, more open to a sound that leans towards the indie, the R&B, or whatever other genre each of them favours. As other posters have said, it sometimes takes a few attempts before finding the label that is the best fit.

 

DC was reported as saying this at the convention in Paris: "The cool thing about music is that you can always work on it, it’s always there. You can always go home and play the piano whereas you have to be a little more timely for projects you’re selection [sic] as an actor. I also realized I wasn’t into being, you know, pitted against Glee. So whenever I put something out, it’ll be on my own terms, in my own time so it’s fun and I can be passionate about it as opposed to trying to make a deadline and sell records which is not a good way to make anything." Assuming this transcript is exact, it leaves open the possibility that he might eventually put out an album, perhaps after his option runs out and legal matters get figured out.

 

Another thing that was mentioned by the cast in Paris was apparently the possibility of a Glee reunion tour or movie.  But it may have been them being facetious with the audience.

 

Edited March 23, 2015 by Florinaldo

[Ceeg]

 

 

Lea Michele and Kate Upton to star in 'The Layover'

Movie Description: When their plane is re-routed due to a hurricane warning, two single female best friends find themselves competing for the same guy during an extended layover in St. Louis. Produced by Keith Kjarval and Directed by William H. Macy. Filming will take place in Vancouver, Canada, St. Louis, Missouri, and Miami, Florida beginning April 27, 2015.

 

http://www.myentertainmentworld.com/

[caracas1914]

Whitney Houston covered I Will Always Love You, and her version is the one that most people remember and is probably what she's best known for.

 

 Dolly Parton, who actually wrote that song, said she didn't mind that people thought Whitney's was the definitive version (I also love Dolly's recording) because every-time they bought Whitney it puts cents into her pocket...LOL. 

I guess that's the best argument for being a songwriter!

[dizzyizzy01]

I will grant you her album (from reviews I read) didn't receive a lot of  critical praise, but mediocre sales is relative, she didn't get a gold certification (500,00 copies sold) but if she sold a few hundred thousand copies I wouldn't say with no touring or extensive marketing Columbia thought it was a bad freshman effort or "mediocre".   Not all albums have to have Katey Perry/Swift Taylor numbers to be successful.

I agree.  Honestly, her album did pretty well for little promo/marketing, and no radio play.  She barely released any singles from the album too.  Also, labels could not care less about reviews if sales are happening.  

 

For a reference point, Lea's album did better than Kristin Chenoweth's last two.  She isn't going to post Taylor Swift numbers or even Selena Gomez numbers, but her album did pretty decently all things considered.  

 

Anyway, I guess my point is, Lea's doing ok as a recording artist so far, and I think she's meeting what her label expects at the moment.  I don't think she's ever going to be some big pop star though.  Especially since I don't think that's her primary focus, and she's not going to make that the focus of her career.  I would like to see her do some small tours though.  

Edited March 23, 2015 by dizzyizzy01

[Cranberry]

Oh great, another movie about two supposed best friends fighting over something guy-related. We all know that's more important than friendship, and the last movie with a similar theme was so good...

 

Maybe it'll be good, I don't know. I hope it is, because I like Lea. But yikes, that's a stupid premise.

[fakeempress]

 

Even if "Dead On Arrival" is definitely an overstatement (they worked on it for a long time, way past the "arrival" point),

The arrival point is when he delivered the album to Columbia. Not when he signed on. The latter is completely nonsensical. 

 

 

Columbia's goal for him was perhaps not Teen Beat fodder exactly, but very probably something very pop-sounding;

This is what Columbia was Looking For, for him, as already mentioned twice on the forum:

 

Artist: DARREN CRISS

Record Label: Columbia

Looking For: Co-writer and musician that stars in Glee. Looking for beats with hooks and character. Think Maroon 5 type records

A Link for Who's Looking: [linked to a private Youtube video, but the song/performance was It's Time]

A&R: Ashley Newton / Maria Egan

 

If anyone here thinks Adam Levine is a sound and career Darren would frown on as a recording artist, I have a bridge to sell to you in the Gobi Desert. 

 

 

 

DC was reported as saying this at the convention in Paris: "The cool thing about music is that you can always work on it, it’s always there. You can always go home and play the piano whereas you have to be a little more timely for projects you’re selection [sic] as an actor. I also realized I wasn’t into being, you know, pitted against Glee. So whenever I put something out, it’ll be on my own terms, in my own time so it’s fun and I can be passionate about it as opposed to trying to make a deadline and sell records which is not a good way to make anything.

Yet a few months back he was still saying that he was just waiting to finish with Glee to sink his teeth into the album and finish it. It's just more spin. No deadlines, not selling records = Columbia is out of the Darren business. My own time = whenever he gets down to it depending on what else with definite timelines and guaranteed income is on offer. On my own terms = indie label or self-release. 

Edited March 23, 2015 by fakeempress

[caracas1914]

Even if "Dead On Arrival" is definitely an overstatement (they worked on it for a long time, way past the "arrival" point), I think that the most probable status of things at this point is that both parties are not on the same wavelength and if he ever puts out a record, it will not be with Columbia's main label. If it is revived, I see it as happening under another brand.

 

The DOA tag was specifically referenced to the probability under the Columbia label from the previous posts.  Since you just stated basically  the same thing i guess we are all in agreement.    Nobody said Darren might not release an album eventually under another label.

[dizzyizzy01]

Oh great, another movie about two supposed best friends fighting over something guy-related. We all know that's more important than friendship, and the last movie with a similar theme was so good...

 

Maybe it'll be good, I don't know. I hope it is, because I like Lea. But yikes, that's a stupid premise.

 

Movie premise sounds awful, but it's pretty cool for Lea to be co-starring in a movie with Kate Hudson.  Almost Famous is classic.

 

ETA:  Leaving original post so the subsequent posts make sense, but clearly I cannot read and it's Kate Upton not Kate Hudson.

Edited March 23, 2015 by dizzyizzy01

[Ceeg]

I think there might have been some wires crossed. She's in a movie with Kate UPTON. The link from Cranberry is to an old movie with Kate Hudson called Bride Wars. Lea's new movie is called The Layover, and it's being directed by William H. Macy. The description is in my post above.

[ancslove]

Kate Upton not Hudson. Lea will be the bigger acting name.

[caracas1914]

Kate Upton is the model/actress no?   I seem to recall a recent movie with her.

[ancslove]

But William H Macy is a great and well-respected director who could open a lot of doors for Lea.

[Ceeg]

Yeah she's a model. I wasn't aware until just now that she even acts, though. Apart from that commercial for that video game that's on tv every 5 minutes.

[jaytee1812]

Kate Upton is the model/actress no?   I seem to recall a recent movie with her.

Yeah she was in The Other Woman.

[dizzyizzy01]

Kate Upton is the model/actress no?   I seem to recall a recent movie with her.

Oops.  Misread that.  My bad.  Yea, Kate Upton was in the Cameron Diaz movie The Other Woman.  Another terrible sort of rom/com , but it did very well at the box office.  

 

But that is far less cool.  William H. Macy is awesome though.

 

ETA:  I knew it did well, but I didn't realize how well The Other Woman did.  Nearly $200M WW.  Jeez.

Edited March 23, 2015 by dizzyizzy01

[dlyn]

Movie premise sounds awful, but it's pretty cool for Lea to be co-starring in a movie with Kate Hudson. Almost Famous is classic.

Kate Upton (the model) not Kate Hudson. Has Kate U. even acted before? This could be bad.

Slow typer. :) You all answered my question.

Edited March 23, 2015 by dlyn

[Pink ranger]

Strong start for Finding Neverland. It grossed over $ 1 million in its first week.

http://www.broadwayworld.com/grosses.cfm#.VRBp7oGQGK0

[Hana Chan]

Hmmm... it's not listen on IMDb yet. If it's true, good for Lea getting another film role but Gods... that sounds like an awful premise.

[caracas1914]

Well for all we know it's a 180 from Glee, and it's not a RIB production and the Director is a respected name,  so there's that.

 

FWIW, I think Lea is a good actress/comedienne so we have to wait and see how it pans out.  

 

So far this year, second TV series, second album, second book to be released, and a movie project also.

Not too shabby for post Glee's first year.

Edited March 23, 2015 by caracas1914

[fakeempress]

But William H Macy is a great and well-respected director who could open a lot of doors for Lea.

He is a great and respected actor, has done some directing, definitely a good name to be associated with. 

 

Anyway, Lea is getting co-starring credit, and movie work. Good for her. 

 

 

Movie premise sounds awful, but it's pretty cool for Lea to be co-starring in a movie with Kate Hudson.  Almost Famous is classic.

She may co-star with Kate H. down the line. They are close friends, and Glee on-screen ex-frenemies

Edited March 23, 2015 by fakeempress

[Ceeg]

I'm just selfishly glad that it seems like all my faves are busting their asses to keep working and are lining a lot of things up for the future.

Edited March 23, 2015 by Ceeg

[tom87]

I bet this movie ends up being more about friendship than the guy in the end.   It is  3 fold William H. Macy wants to direct more, Kate Upton is  trying to establish an acting career and Lea wants to dabble in movies.

 

It could be a mild hit or a complete miss, like 90% of movies.

[jaytee1812]

I bet this movie ends up being more about friendship than the guy in the end.

I love your optimism, but have you met Hollywood?

[fakeempress]

I'm just selfishly glad that it seems like all my faves are busting their asses to keep working and are lining a lot of things up for the future.

I'm rooting for the whole Glee cast to line 10 projects each by the mid-year. The ONTD motherboard will spontaneously combust. Oh the schadenfreude will be sweet. 

[caracas1914]

Harry Shum Jr.  for the win!

 

Maybe it's my Glee colored glasses, but I would  think that the reputation Glee had for having the most brutal TV work schedule of any series out there (Recently Chris again mentioned 80 plus hour working weeks the first year on the show and doubts he will ever have that type of schedule again ) puts the Glee cast with good cred/rep among casting people.

 

The professional work ethic they learned certainly  could be a huge boon for all their post Glee careers.

Edited March 23, 2015 by caracas1914

[tom87]

Harry Shum Jr.  for the win!

Harry Shum for the guy Lea and Kate are fighting over in the silly movie.

 

I really wanted some Cherry on glee.

Edited March 23, 2015 by tom87

[dizzyizzy01]

Harry Shum for the guy Lea and Kate are fighting over in the silly movie.

 

I really wanted some Cherry on glee.

I'd watch that.  

[Sara2009]

I'm just selfishly glad that it seems like all my faves are busting their asses to keep working and are lining a lot of things up for the future.

Who are your faves( besides Naya)?

[Ceeg]

Who are your faves( besides Naya)?

 

From a pure overall talent standpoint, Naya, Matt, Lea, and Chris.  There are more that I like on a personal level, though. Also more that I like vocally, but I'm not sure how successful they'll be.

[camussie]

My feeling is for any of the cast of Glee or most other musical artists until the album is actually released it is an iffy proposition.  That goes for Darren, Amber, Naya, and even Lea.  Obviously Darren recorded an album's worth of material but it seems like it isn't going to be released unless he signs with a different label. For that matter take Lea.  I have no doubt she is going into the studio in April to work on another album but I wouldn't say it is 100% that album will be released or if it is, that it will be released under the main Columbia label.  If indeed it is more Broadway based it could be under one of their boutique labels.  

[MizStaken]

Quite honestly none of us really know what the deal with Darren and Columbia is. Maybe they didn't like what he had, maybe he didn't like what they wanted from him. Maybe, maybe maybe. I saw his tour and the songs he did that were new, were okay, but nothing that would end up being top ten. But they were definitely listenable.

 

IF he wants to get a record out at some point in time, i'm sure it will happen. He seems to be in no great hurry at this time and with Hedwig tying up his next few months, he probably won't have time for much else. I'm hoping he can get something out in the relative future that he will be happy with and proud to have his name associated with. In the end, I want him to do well, but on his terms. 

[caracas1914]

With the Glee cast who can make a living by acting, you wonder how much they really want to invest in time and money and choices in a recording career, with no guarantee of a payback.

Jared Leto, an established actor with an impressive body of work, put acting on hiatus for at least 3-4 years, including giving up a role offered to him in a Clint Eastwood movie to dedicate time to his band.

A Lea, or Naya or Darren might be better off in an indie label with lower expectations. I'm sure the Labels charge the singers for their studio time and other 'incidentals' at an exhorbitant rate and a modest endeavor may actually be more profitable for them.

[fakeempress]

Didn't Darren and Chord say they have their own home studios they took the panelling for ? They can at least do their demos there. 

 

Since Darren has mentioned not compromising, not chasing big acts sales etc., I checked the record sales for my favourite indie band who for an indie are quite successful, took them over 10 years. Their breakthrough album from 2005 has sold over 200K copies, I'm guessing until now. Next record has sold 300K by now in the U.S. alone. Next one sold 285K in the U.S. / 600K worldwide, and the most recent one from 2013 - 250K in the U.S. by now, and got a Grammy nomination. The figures are from Wiki for a rough look at what a successful indie act record sales looks like. I can't say anything about what they make from touring. 

 

Again from Wiki, Lea sold 62K copies in the first week alone, to a total of 102K copies in the U.S. by the end of last year. Compared to the indie band, and with no real promotion and touring / radio play -- not too bad at all. 

Edited March 24, 2015 by fakeempress

[caracas1914]

As mentioned, most bands/recording stars make their money from touring.  The huge stars gets endorsements, better record deals, appearance fees, etc, but I'd say 99 percent of musicians, even well known ones have to tour to actually pay the bills.

 

Spoon characterizes themselves as a lot of touring with  albums in between.

Edited March 24, 2015 by caracas1914

[Florinaldo]

I certainly agree that the Glee alumni, even those who were on the show for only a short time, demonstrated to the industry that they are not afraid to work very hard in order to achieve the necessary results; industry people would know how long and grueling rehearsal and shooting days must have been, not to mention the live tours (especially the second one). Of course, some people might be tempted to take advantage of such a willingness to fully invest yourself in a project, but after a few years on the show even the younger cast members should have witnessed enough and learned from it, while taking relevant advice, in order to avoid such pitfalls.
 

The arrival point is when he delivered the album to Columbia. Not when he signed on.

Reviewing the past exchanges, I think a problem may be in the idea of how the recording process goes. Labels rarely let beginners and even some experienced performers work independently in a closed bubble, until they deliver a finished product for which the label would have no idea of the contents. That is one thing staff production people are for; to keep an eye and ear on what is going on, making progress reports to management and providing them with examples of what is being recorded, even regularly assessing it in conjunction with the artist and the producers. In the case of an untested new signee, I think that they would have been well aware all along of where it was going and what the resulting sound was exactly. The "delivery" would not have been in a single turn-key chunk and would have been on-going from the moment producers and the singer started working in the studio; the label did not suddenly discover in one fell swoop where the album was going and the decision would have been arrived at progressively as work went along, because management would be able to build  their judgement continuously regarding what the final results would eventually be and whether it would fit their release plans.

[Ceeg]

That's not really the way Naya described the process at all. She basically said that Columbia was pushing her to do something she didn't want to do and were giving her these demos she didn't like, so she went and did her own thing and worked with people she wanted, and then told them, 'this is what I'm doing so either you're in or you're out' and they were out.

[shoregirl]

Well considering the masterpiece that was Sorry Not Sorry...

I wasn't aware you could make what basically amounts to my way or the highway demands when your first single doesn't even sell that well. Which is fine , it's her album and she should have say in how she wants it to sound but I also don't fault Columbia to back off either.

Edited March 24, 2015 by shoregirl

[Ceeg]

Well considering the masterpiece that was Sorry Not Sorry...

I wasn't aware you could make what basically amounts to my way or the highway demands when your first single doesn't even sell that well.

 

This was before Sorry. She brought the studio Sorry and said 'this is what I want to do and this is the sound I want'. I think they probably released it under the condition that if it flopped, they were done. And that's what happened.

 

On one hand, I'm sure the people at Columbia know what they're doing. On the other, I can't blame Naya for not wanting to make a record that she doesn't fully support with a sound that she doesn't like. Flop or not, at least she was doing what she wanted, artistically.

[dizzyizzy01]

This was before Sorry. She brought the studio Sorry and said 'this is what I want to do and this is the sound I want'. I think they probably released it under the condition that if it flopped, they were done. And that's what happened.

 

On one hand, I'm sure the people at Columbia know what they're doing. On the other, I can't blame Naya for not wanting to make a record that she doesn't fully support with a sound that she doesn't like. Flop or not, at least she was doing what she wanted, artistically.

I give her a props for that, but many Sorry was so so so awful.  I don't know what she was thinking.

[tab19]

I presume she was getting help/advice from her rapper boyfriend - wasn't he on that song or something?  Unfortunately (for me, since I'm not a rap fan) - I have to think that Columbia's sound was probably more what I'd've liked to hear from Naya - something more mainstream.  Maybe now that she's not dating a rapper she'd be open to other things?

[dizzyizzy01]

I presume she was getting help/advice from her rapper boyfriend - wasn't he on that song or something?  Unfortunately (for me, since I'm not a rap fan) - I have to think that Columbia's sound was probably more what I'd've liked to hear from Naya - something more mainstream.  Maybe now that she's not dating a rapper she'd be open to other things?

It's probably a fair conclusion that Big Sean had a pretty big influence on it.  He's actually pretty popular, but I find most of his stuff really annoying.  Bad choice to collaborate with your significant other!  Lol, I don't think those go well most of the time.  

 

Girl's got talent, but I don't think music is her priority right now.  I got the feeling she kinda fell into the idea of recording an album because of Glee.  I kind of wonder if she'd venture into it without that backdrop.  I think acting is more her focus, but that could always change.  Girl can sing though.

Edited March 24, 2015 by dizzyizzy01

[tom87]

Big Sean or not having a song about your BF's exes is not my thing. 

Edited March 24, 2015 by tom87

[caracas1914]

What do I know, I was hoping Naya would be a Latina Amy Winehouse .,,,

Personally while I don't think she has the voice of a generation I think Naya has a distinct and attractive singing style, she's not cookie cutter.

I liked Sorry, not Sorry, ( don't judge me!) it was a catchy single but it took away what makes her unique, and it was, to put it mildly, fairly disposable.

Edited March 24, 2015 by caracas1914

[dizzyizzy01]

What do I know, I was hoping Naya would be a Latina Amy Winehouse .,,,

Yea.  That's a sound I could have gotten behind.  Sorry was a weird mess.

[fakeempress]

 

Reviewing the past exchanges, I think a problem may be in the idea of how the recording process goes. Labels rarely let beginners and even some experienced performers work independently in a closed bubble, until they deliver a finished product for which the label would have no idea of the contents. That is one thing staff production people are for; to keep an eye and ear on what is going on, making progress reports to management and providing them with examples of what is being recorded, even regularly assessing it in conjunction with the artist and the producers. In the case of an untested new signee, I think that they would have been well aware all along of where it was going and what the resulting sound was exactly. The "delivery" would not have been in a single turn-key chunk and would have been on-going from the moment producers and the singer started working in the studio; the label did not suddenly discover in one fell swoop where the album was going and the decision would have been arrived at progressively as work went along, because management would be able to build  their judgement continuously regarding what the final results would eventually be and whether it would fit their release plans.

You think, or you have inside knowledge how Columbia works, especially in Darren's case?

 

Because I know from interviews of the band I spoke about, what you opine here is not how their label works with them. But because I don't know how Columbia works, I cannot make such detailed descriptions of their working process with either new or established artists on their roster. That's why I rely on what Adam Anders said, assuming that out of me, you and him, he is the person who is actually qualified to know the situation. 

Edited March 24, 2015 by fakeempress

[Higgs]

...I checked the record sales for my favourite indie band who for an indie are quite successful, took them over 10 years. Their breakthrough album from 2005 has sold over 200K copies, I'm guessing until now. Next record has sold 300K by now in the U.S. alone. Next one sold 285K in the U.S. / 600K worldwide, and the most recent one from 2013 - 250K in the U.S. by now, and got a Grammy nomination. The figures are from Wiki for a rough look at what a successful indie act record sales looks like. I can't say anything about what they make from touring. 

 

Again from Wiki, Lea sold 62K copies in the first week alone, to a total of 102K copies in the U.S. by the end of last year. Compared to the indie band, and with no real promotion and touring / radio play -- not too bad at all.

Overall CD sales have dropped on the order of 75% since 2005, so conclusions based on direct comparisons of album sales numbers over time can be very misleading.

http://blog.thecurrent.org/2014/02/40-years-of-album-sales-data-in-one-handy-chart/

The other ongoing trend affecting Lea is the infantilization of pop music. These days a "too-perfect voice" (Rolling Stone) and "like Celine Dion" (local post) are considered insults. The dystopian endpoint of this is described near the end of the 2011 Pulitzer Prize novel, "A Visit From the Goon Squad" by Jennifer Egan, which uses as its background the pop music industry from the 60s to the +2020s. The near future brings the "Pointers", the term for toddlers whose tastes determine "popularity", as they can easily download music they hear by merely pointing a tiny hand-held device at the source of the sound. When pop stars perform in public, they are ordered to play the toddler-favored songs that gained them their fame. So, yes, it CAN get worse than Katy Perry.

Lea is a horizontally-integrated, global micro-conglomerate. Companies place bets on her future synergized earnings. She'll be released on a boutique or indie label as surely as she is now a recurring character on "Scream Queens", in a "supporting" role that Ryan isn't used to writing for her.

[fakeempress]

 

 

Overall CD sales have dropped on the order of 75% since 2005, so conclusions based on direct comparisons of album sales numbers over time can be very misleading.

http://blog.thecurre...ne-handy-chart/

 

I wasn't making a direct comparison, just giving another, and I mentioned rough, perspective because sometimes people seem to compare Lea and/ or the other Glee guys with recording artist ambitions, to the big pop acts to say she flopped as a recording artist. Big is different depending on the genre, how and if there was marketing, radio play, touring, lots of factors. 

Edited March 24, 2015 by fakeempress

[caracas1914]

Naya has IMO the look of a pop star ( or what passes for one these days) so I thought of all the Glee cast she had the best shot at mainstream recording success.

It goes without saying I think she has a good commercial voice, just listen to her versions of " Girl on Fire" , " Fade to Black" and vocals on " Constant Craving".

[dizzyizzy01]

Naya has IMO the look of a pop star ( or what passes for one these days) so I thought of all the Glee cast she had the best shot at mainstream recording success.

It goes without saying I think she has a good commercial voice, just listen to her versions of " Girl on Fire" , " Fade to Black" and vocals on " Constant Craving".

I would agree, but I don't know if Naya's really all that interested in a recording career.  At least not as a primary focus.  I always kind of got the sense that she was more of an actress that could sing, rather than being focused on becoming an artist as her primary goal.  I think she seized the opportunity Glee brought to get a recording contract, but I never got the sense that was something she was actively pursuing before or after.  I could be wrong though.  

 

I feel like Amber is someone that is much more focused on becoming an artist.