S07.E04: Level Two

[bethy]

I'm wondering if we're seeing two different Earths. The present is Earth-1, where we have been all along, and the future is actually Earth-2. Not-Laurel said that the Earth-2 Felicity was the head of her own company - Smoak Enterprises (or whatever it's called) - and ruthless. That might explain how she would "abandon" William whenever that happened. Although Oliver is dead on Earth-2, right? Presumably, anyway? Or maybe it's another Earth. I don't know. I just don't see how they deal with all this grim future stuff and leaving the audience with a feeling that everything happening in the present is futile if there's not some sort of twist to what we're seeing.

[Mary0360]

6 minutes ago, bethy said:

I'm wondering if we're seeing two different Earths. The present is Earth-1, where we have been all along, and the future is actually Earth-2. Not-Laurel said that the Earth-2 Felicity was the head of her own company - Smoak Enterprises (or whatever it's called) - and ruthless. That might explain how she would "abandon" William whenever that happened. Although Oliver is dead on Earth-2, right? Presumably, anyway? Or maybe it's another Earth. I don't know. I just don't see how they deal with all this grim future stuff and leaving the audience with a feeling that everything happening in the present is futile if there's not some sort of twist to what we're seeing.

Oliver died in the gambit on earth 2 and Robert was the Green Arrow so the future flash forwards can only be from earth 1 unfortunately.

[bethy]

What if Oliver wasn’t really dead in Earth 2? :) And there are other Earth, too, aren’t there? At least there are on Flash, right? (I may be misremembering, though!)

[apinknightmare]

33 minutes ago, bethy said:

What if Oliver wasn’t really dead in Earth 2? :) And there are other Earth, too, aren’t there? At least there are on Flash, right? (I may be misremembering, though!)

I don’t think they’re on another earth. Beth said we’d see how their decisions in the present affect the future. 

[bethy]

1 hour ago, apinknightmare said:

I don’t think they’re on another earth. Beth said we’d see how their decisions in the present affect the future. 

Well, rats. :) 

[MissLucas]

Praise Beebo! Not much else to add except: I'm not bothered about depro future - some timey wimey stuff and it all goes away. But I am bothered by the fact that neither Rene nor Dinah were trying to get NGA's identity when s/he was momentarily drowsy/knocked out.

[tennisgurl]

The best thing Curtis as ever done is respect our lord Beebo. Praise Beebo! 

[GHScorpiosRule]

8 hours ago, apinknightmare said:

I don’t think they’re on another earth. Beth said we’d see how their decisions in the present affect the future. 

We’ve already seen in this episode , how whatever their decisions were, affected this future. So what do I have to look forward to now? More stupid Dinah with glopped on makeup?

I just need this show to do a Days From Future Past and fix this shit.

Edited November 11, 2018 by GHScorpiosRule

[Chyromaniac]

21 hours ago, immortalfrieza said:

I'd like to at least once see that the efforts of the heroes lead to a utopian future... and there's some nutjob from the future who goes into the past to ensure that it changes to a dystopian one. With at least one of those plotlines it would seem like a good future would be a POSSIBILITY, thus make it feel like there's some point to what the protagonists are doing.

Ooh!  Here’s an idea... What if a group of time travelers get stuck in segregation era Alabama- and in order to preserve the civil rights movement, they need to ensure that Rosa Parks gets arrested off a bus. Maybe there’s also some future racist who keeps trying to ruin things, and our team has to undo his interference.  I’m just spitballing here, but I think that could be pretty good...

[BkWurm1]

2 hours ago, Chyromaniac said:

Ooh!  Here’s an idea... What if a group of time travelers get stuck in segregation era Alabama- and in order to preserve the civil rights movement, they need to ensure that Rosa Parks gets arrested off a bus. Maybe there’s also some future racist who keeps trying to ruin things, and our team has to undo his interference.  I’m just spitballing here, but I think that could be pretty good...

Yeah, that was an odd episode of Doctor Who.  Felt more like Quantum Leap or Timeless.  Arrow should NOT IMO tackle another Issue episode.  Thank goodness they dropped it last year.  

[tennisgurl]

I’m still dying over that super awkward “Felicity Smoak is dead” line drop. Like, what other Felicity would she possibley be referring to? It’s such an awkward line that clearly existed for “Previously On Arrow...” bits, and drop some drama for fans to buzz about. 

[insomniadreams88]

4 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

I’m still dying over that super awkward “Felicity Smoak is dead” line drop. Like, what other Felicity would she possibley be referring to? It’s such an awkward line that clearly existed for “Previously On Arrow...” bits, and drop some drama for fans to buzz about. 

The thing is, even during Previously Ons, "Felicity" would be enough. It's not like Dinah was talking about (a) Ray, Roy or Rory. Then I could understand using the full name.

"Rory's dead."

"Which Rory?"

"Roy's dead."

"Uh, I'm Roy."

"Hold on, maybe there was a typo. Ray maybe? Or Rory?" 

"Ray or The Ray? Mick Rory or Rory Regan?"

"UGH." 

[apinknightmare]

20 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

I’m still dying over that super awkward “Felicity Smoak is dead” line drop. Like, what other Felicity would she possibley be referring to? It’s such an awkward line that clearly existed for “Previously On Arrow...” bits, and drop some drama for fans to buzz about. 

She’s gonna say it again tonight before she leads the group on a trek to Felicity’s grave at which time she will reveal that eight years ago she was also acting coroner and personally embalmed Felicity’s definitely dead body herself, and then triple confirmed with the cemetery that her body was def still in the coffin when it was lowered into the ground. 

[tv echo]

704 (Level Two) – Oliver Queen’s voiceover intro:
Oliver (voiceover): "My name is Oliver Queen. After six years of being a vigilante, the only way to achieve my goal and save my city was to confess to being the Green Arrow. Now my family and friends must carry on my mission without me. I am no longer a hero. I am Inmate 4587."

704 (Level Two) – Felicity interrogates the Silencer; Felicity and Rene discuss using extreme measures to get info from the Silencer:
Felicity: “Where is Diaz?”
Silencer: “No food or water. Heat on blast. Call this an interrogation?”
Felicity: “It can only get worse for you.”
Silencer: “You don’t have the stomach to do what you need to do. Diaz is only getting stronger. You have no idea what’s coming.”
Rene: "Any luck?"
(Felicity walks over to talk to Rene.)
Felicity: "No. I actually think she might be enjoying herself. We're going to need to turn up the heat."
Rene: "Any hotter, it'll turn into soup."
Felicity: "I meant, turn up the stakes. Do whatever it takes to make her give us the information."
Rene: "You don't mean torture."
Felicity: "I don't not mean it."
Rene: "Felicity, you don't know what you're saying. Torturing someone is a line you do not want to cross. When the Navy discharged me for what I did to a prisoner, I learned a lesson about the cost of my humanity, 'cause I still have nightmares of what I did, even though I saved lives. So when Tobias Church tortured me for over 20 hours, it was the universe paying me back. That's evil for evil."
Felicity: "I'm sorry about that. I am. Church broke you. You gave up Oliver's identity, Rene. It worked. She tried to kill Dinah and Laurel and us. Diaz hired her and he isn't going to stop coming after us until we are all dead."
(Rene’s phone rings.)
Rene: “Oh shoot. I was supposed to meet with Dinah five minutes ago for a town hall. She’s not going anywhere, so we are going to take a break, and we’re going to figure this out later.”
Felicity: “Okay.”
Rene: “Alright.”

704 (Level Two) – In a flashforward scene, Adult William and Older Roy are back in Star City:
Older Roy: “Star City’s seen better days.”
Adult William: “Ah, this place. I swore I’d never set foot here ever again.”
Older Roy: “Yeah, me too.”
Adult William: “Sounds like I’m not the only one with bad memories. (His device beeps) The coordinates have changed since Lian Yu. Something must’ve triggered it.”
Older Roy: “Felicity. She must know we’re here. Well, let’s see where she wants you to go.”

704 (Level Two) – Oliver is interrogated by Dr. Parker in prison:
Dr. Parker: "The question is, when was the moment the playboy son of a billionaire became the man known as the Green Arrow?"
Robert Queen (flashback): "You can survive this. Make it home, make it better, right my wrongs. But you got to live through this first."
Dr. Parker: "You're struggling. What do you see?"
Oliver: "I'm with my father at sea."
Dr. Parker: "Are you on The Queen's Gambit?"
Oliver: "No. We're on a life raft. Gambit's already gone down."
Dr. Parker: "Was there anyone else there? With you and your father?"
Oliver: "Yes. His - his bodyguard, Hackett. There were three of us who survived.”
Oliver (flashback): "Dad?"
Robert Queen (flashback): "Survive."
Oliver (flashback): "Nooo!"
Dr. Parker: "What? What did you see?"
Oliver: "I see my father asking me to right his wrongs - right before he shot himself in the head. He sacrificed his life for mine."
Dr. Parker: "Is that why you became a vigilante?"
Oliver: "Yes."
Dr. Parker: "Because he put his sins on you?"
Oliver: "Would you please stop?"
Dr. Parker: "A father passes on more than just his name to his children. He provides them their legacy. What became of Hackett?"
Oliver: "There was only enough food and water for one person. My dad shot him."
Dr. Parker: "Your father shot him? Then what? Like he doesn't matter in this story? Just collateral damage? People without the last name 'Queen' are human beings, too. They have hopes, dreams, lives. Your father wasn't a hero. Mr. Queen, he was a murderer."
Oliver: "He saved me."
Dr. Parker: "He condemned you. He is gone, but here you are caught in the same vicious cycle, paying for his crimes."

704 (Level Two) – Felicity is forced to seek help from E2 Laurel:
(Felicity knocks on the door of Laurel's D.A. office.)
E2 Laurel (sighing): "How'd you get past my S.C.P.D. detail?"
Felicity: "You know I went to MIT, right? It's like Harvard for computer geeks, with an acceptance rate of 6.7%. So if I can get in there, I can get in pretty much anywhere. Except for here, which is why I had to resort to saying that we were sorority sisters. (Off Laurel's look) Yeah, right. Wow! So you are actually practicing law."
E2 Laurel: "Why does everybody find that so hard to believe?"
Felicity: "Oh, probably because you're not the real Laurel or a real lawyer. Uhh, try saying that three times fast. What a tongue twister."
E2 Laurel: "I am doing this for Quentin. So if you don't mind, I'd like to get back to work now."
Felicity: "Yeah, I get it. I mean, prosecuting criminals must be a lot harder than being one."
E2 Laurel: "You're still here."
Felicity: "I have a case that you might be interested in."
E2 Laurel: "Your Laurel might've done the whole pro bono thing, but this Laurel doesn't."
Felicity: "Hypothetically, if there was a female assassin who went by - I don't know - the name The Silencer, who had, for purposes of this illustration only, attacked the D.A. with a belt device that cancelled sound. Well, if someone had captured said assailant and was holding her hostage, do you think the D.A. in this perfectly random hypothetical might be interested in serving justice?"
E2 Laurel: "You kidnapped and imprisoned the Silencer?"
Felicity: "No. Not me. Just asking for a friend."
E2 Laurel: "And you want my help."
Felicity: "Yeah, I never thought this day would come either, but here we are."
E2 Laurel: "You're a hell of a lot more interesting than I thought. Where is she?"

704 (Level Two) – Oliver is further interrogated by Dr. Parker in prison:
Dr. Parker: “When we last spoke, you mentioned your father killed a man, Hackett, so you could live.”
Oliver: “That's right. I feel like my father had to make an impossible choice.”
Dr. Parker: “An impossible choice?”
Oliver: “Yes.”
Dr. Parker: “How do you think your son would feel if he knew his grandfather was a murderer?”
Oliver: “Dr. Parker, please leave my son out of this, please.”

704 (Level Two) – Felicity lets E2 Laurel interrogate the Silencer:
E2 Laurel: “Tell me exactly what she said.”
Felicity: “Besides telling me to go frak myself, nothing.”
E2 Laurel: “Well, lucky for you, I’ve been working on my cross examination.”
Felicity: “Your witness.”
E2 Laurel: “Hello. Remember me? What’s the matter? Cat got your tongue?”
Silencer: “You have no idea who I am. What I survived. You’re in way over your head.”
E2 Laurel: “I don’t think I am. A little advice from someone who used to work with that psychopath Diaz, you think you’re being loyal. The only loyalty he knows is to himself. He’ll kill you without a second thought.”
Silencer: “I’d do the same thing to anyone who got in my way.”
E2 Laurel: “I don’t think you’re hearing me. Maybe I need to talk a little bit louder.”
(She uses her sonic cry on The Silencer.)

704 (Level Two) – In a flashforward scene, Older Roy and Adult William go to the abandoned Smoak Technologies offices:
Older Roy: “So this was Smoak Tech.”
Adult William: “Must’ve been something in its heyday. So this was Felicity’s office. You know, it makes sense that she would lead us here. But wouldn’t it be easier just for her to reach out to me? Why is she playing games?”
Older Roy: “I have no idea.”
Adult William: “I mean, ironically, she was the one who influenced me to go into the tech field, even after everything that happened.”
Older Roy: “Well, you’re a lot more forgiving than me.”
(William goes over to an electronic wall display.)
Adult William: “Looks like a system Felicity showed me when I was a kid. Back then, it was just a set of designs.”
Older Roy: “Can you fix it?”
Adult William: “It’s an extremely outdated model, so... yes. Just a simple recursive algorithm, followed by a little Felicity special.”
(Panel opens to reveal a small bag inside an alcove.)
Cop: “Freeze! This is a restricted area! What are you doing here?”
Adult William: “I’m sorry about this guys. I – I was supposed to meet an investor and, um, obviously I got the wrong address.”
Older Roy: “You’re such a bad liar. Shut up.”
(Older Dinah attacks and knocks out the cop.)
Adult William: “Please don’t kill us!”
Older Dinah: “I’m not going to hurt you. You shouldn’t have come back here, Roy.”

704 (Level Two) – Felicity and E2 Laurel discuss how to get information from the Silencer:
Felicity: “You scared the crap out of me. You find out where Diaz is?”
E2 Laurel: “No. She’s not being very chatty.”
Felicity: “Of course she’s not. Make her chat. That’s why you’re here.”
E2 Laurel: “I tried. And if I keep trying, I’m going to kill her.”
Felicity: “Since when did you care about anybody’s life?”
E2 Laurel: “I don’t. But if she’s dead, then she can’t talk. And then we have nothing.”
Felicity: “Which is what we have now. We need that information:”
E2 Laurel: “And you’re gonna get it with a rusty screwdriver? If Diaz taught me anything, it’s patience. He waited 30 years to get revenge on one person.”
Felicity: “We don’t have 30 years.”
E2 Laurel: “This isn’t you.”
Felicity: “This is the new me. This is the me who doesn’t wait around to get murdered. This is the me – this is the me that fights back.”
E2 Laurel: “I respect that. In fact, I can actually stand being around this new you. It’s just, once you do this, it’s really hard to get back to who you were before. And I don’t know if you ever can.”
Felicity: “Well, I’ve already accepted that my old life is over, so I don’t have anything left to lose.”
E2 Laurel: “Hey. I used to be just like you.”
Felicity: “Well, that I find hard to believe.”
E2 Laurel: “On my Earth, I loved my father and my Ollie, but they were taken away from me because they were murdered. It’s when you lose the people who matter most, once you get through the grief, you get angry. You want revenge, and I took it. But the darkness, it swallows you the more you feed it. And digging yourself back out to the light, it’s… it’s really hard. In fact, I wish someone would’ve warned me before I got blood all over my hands the first time. Maybe that way, I would’ve been more like your Laurel.”
Felicity: “I don’t know what else to do.”
E2 Laurel: “We need to play the long-term game here. I need you to use that big brain of yours - and think.”

704 (Level Two) – In a flashforward scene, Older Dinah tells Older Roy and Adult William what’s happened in Star City:
Adult William: “You took out those cops.”
Older Dinah: “They would have killed Roy for being a former vigilante, just like they would have killed me.”
Older Roy: “I don’t understand. You were police captain. What happened?”
Older Dinah: “That was a long time ago.”
Older Roy: “Yeah, there were police everywhere, and you just dragged us through the sewer to get here. What the hell happened to Star City?”
Older Dinah: “Star City fell when the Glades rose. They built a wall. They closed their borders. No one outside the Glades is allowed to enter. The S.C.P.D. are basically hired guns. They protect the Glades from what’s outside their wall.”
Older Roy: “I think maybe we should’ve stayed on Lian Yu.”
Adult William: “But then we wouldn’t have gotten this.” (Removes a Rubik’s Cube from the bag)

704 (Level Two) – Felicity tricks the Silencer into escaping:
Felicity: “Where is Diaz?”
Silencer: “If your friend isn’t getting it out of me, you definitely aren’t.”
Felicity: “Diaz took everything from me. My husband, my family, my life. I don’t have anything to lose!”
E2 Laurel: “Felicity!”
Felicity: “I’m getting that information!”
E2 Laurel: “Upstairs.”
(Felicity throws down the screwdriver and goes upstairs.)
E2 Laurel: “What the hell is wrong with you?”
Felicity: “You told me to use my brain.”
E2 Laurel: “Your brain? That was you using your brain? You need to stop with your little games and let the grownups handle this.”
(They hear metal scraping sounds and rush over to the railing to look down. The Silencer has escaped and taken her device belt with her.)
Felicity: “She’s gone.”
E2 Laurel: “How’d you know she was going to take the belt?”
Felicity: “Lucky guess. The RIFD chip I installed in it is gonna lead us straight to Diaz.”
E2 Laurel: “Wow.”
Felicity: “What?”
E2 Laurel: “You’re different. You remind me of the Felicity from my Earth.”
Felicity: “We know each other on Earth-2?”
E2 Laurel: “Everybody knows you. You run your own empire.”
Felicity: “This girl?”
E2 Laurel: “Yep. Except for she’s ruthless. Are you prepared to be ruthless? Because once the Silencer leads us to Diaz, we won’t just be torturing him. We’re gonna have to kill him. Can you handle that?”

704 (Level Two) – In a flashforward scene, Older Dinah tells Adult William and Older Roy that Felicity is dead:
Older Roy: “This is a waste of time. How much longer are we gonna be trapped in here?”
Older Dinah: “You used to be a lot more patient. Shouldn’t be too much longer.
Adult William: “Felicity told me that making a pattern on a Rubik’s Cube is like running an algorithm. My favorite was cube in the cube. Because it’s a puzzle within a puzzle.”
Older Roy: “A cube in a cube. Still, no answers.”
(The Rubik’s Cube suddenly projects a hologram of a city scape map.)
Older Roy: “Wait, what just happened? Is that some sort of map?”
Adult Zoe (entering): “It’s the Glades.”
Older Dinah: “You two remember Zoe?”
Adult Zoe: “Hi, Roy. William.”
Adult William: “What are you doing here?”
Adult Zoe: “I’m with the Vigilante Resistance. One of the few left fighting to save Star City.”
Older Roy: “Is your dad here too?”
Adult Zoe: “My dad wouldn’t be caught dead in Star City.”
Older Dinah: “This map shows secret routes in and out of the Glades. Where did you get this?”
Adult William: “Felicity. She’s the one who sent us to Star City.”
Older Dinah: “No, that’s impossible. William, I’m so sorry to be the one to tell you this, but Felicity Smoak is dead.”

Edited March 22, 2020 by tv echo