The Blotter Presents

[Sarah D. Bunting]

hee hee! I was just thinking of doing an ICB episode...or rather, a Robert Blake ep, as suggested in another thread. So that would be a good pairing.

[FormerMod-a1]

@Sarah D. Bunting - I hear you on Jim Clemente!  Especially after meeting him in person.

[Nanna]

If any of you are interested in false confessions you should check the out the case of "Thomas Quick": https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sture_Bergwall
Several very interesting books are written about him in Swedish, I don't know if they're translated, but it is probably the most extreme false confession case ever. (Hint: if you give a very mentally ill and drugabusing man drugs a positive attention + coach him enough, he'll confess to be a serial killer)

[Sophia Brooks]

I am a long time lurker-  I have been reading and listening to all y'all since Dawson's Wrap, and this is the first thing I HAD to comment on!  I am only about half way through the first episode of The Confession Tapes, and I am appalled at that detective.  I haven't gotten into it enough to even see if I think the kids did it, but using the fact that the HAD AN ALIBI as evidence to support their guilt, as well as the play The Rope!!!!  Maybe lead with any actual forensic evidence.  And just the smug way he presents it like he is Sherlock Holmes or something.  Gah!  So angry!  As a teenager, I behaved pretty appallingly when my grandpa who raised me died, and I wasn't even traumatized by seeing a body.  

 

Also, they would have to be geniuses to set up that alibi, so if they were that genius, I am pretty sure they could be genius enough not to act appallingly and play greif stricken and traumatized people!

[KlavdiaVavilova]

Is "Partners in Crime" on US netflix?  It's on Australia and they had me at "Hello Kitty Murder" in the description of the first episode.  It's basically Forensic Files Asia, I've watched episodes from Hong Kong, Taiwan and Singapore so far.  Episode 2, Season 1 in Taiwan was my favourite, I would watch a whole series of "Taiwan's most famous forensic pathologist" Dr Shau just busy bodying his way into solving murder investigations.  They do three cases in 25 minutes so they go through them at a serious clip.  Very bizarre cases some of them.  Anyway, just putting it out there. 

[Primetimer]

Mark Blankenship is back to discuss Yance Ford's formal and personal Strong Island, plus American Masters and Mysteries & Scandals on Sam Cooke.

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[ReallySpecial]

Finally located the suggestions thread :)  Reposting:

Quote

I have a case suggestion.  How about Bonny Lee Bakley?  Her murder is still unsolved, but her widower (Robert Blake) was tried and acquitted.

[Pogojoco]

Dozens of artists have covered Billie Holiday's God Bless the Child- every soul singer has a version.

Sam Cooke's version, even though the harps and the choral backing is a little too Lawrence Welk or something, the way he phrases this damn song and the way his voice just glides over it- it's just so clean and smooth.

His murder was and remains total bullshit. "Lady, you shot me." are great last words, though.

[Rlb8031]

Watched Strong Island this weekend and it was affecting to say the least. When we finally got to the point of Yance being told that the cops were comfortable with William's death because of the prior incident, and knowing she was carrying all this GUILT for having not mentioned it to her parents was just tremendously painful to watch. At the same time, I kept wishing they had tried to hunt down Mark Reilly or the guy who owned the chop shop to see where they are today. The idea that you could just kill a guy in cold blood, and that there were zero consequences is mind-boggling. And while I understand Yance's position of "he is every white person that I see", as a viewer, I would have liked to have given that boogeyman a face, even if it was an old one.

[MCMLXXVII]

On 8/17/2017 at 10:34 AM, veronicamers said:

An interesting book on men murdering their wives is Erased: Missing Women, Murdered Wives
by Marilee Strong. I read it years ago. She discusses Peterson, Hacking, our old pals Robert Durst and Jeffrey MacDonald, and one of my all time "favorite" cases: Ira Einhorn and the murder of Holly Maddux.

Thanks for the recommendation, I just finished the book. A FB friend had just posted about a young pregnant teacher in Maryland or VA who was murdered a few weeks ago (turned out to be the boyfriend) so I got to refer to it and explain Eraser killers.

[veronicamers]

1 minute ago, MCMLXXVII said:

Thanks for the recommendation, I just finished the book. A FB friend had just posted about a young pregnant teacher in Maryland or VA who was murdered a few weeks ago (turned out to be the boyfriend) so I got to refer to it and explain Eraser killers.

Sure! Yes, the Laura Wallen case has been big news here where I live in D.C. (she was from Columbia, MD which is pretty equal distance from D.C. and Baltimore). Pretty much a text book case of what we've come to expect in these instances. Very sad. 

[Sarah D. Bunting]

...Sooooo Katharine McPhee is starring in "The Lost Wife Of Robert Durst" on Lifetime 11/4. 

[formerlyfreedom]

6 hours ago, Sarah D. Bunting said:

...Sooooo Katharine McPhee is starring in "The Lost Wife Of Robert Durst" on Lifetime 11/4. 

Oh, this is going to be awful, isn't it?

[Sarah D. Bunting]

Probably. But it does look like we're going to have a cavalcade of guest stars on to discuss it! If they don't all have strokes rolling their eyes.

[Primetimer]

Tara Ariano returns to discuss the most prestigious take yet on the Menendez case, plus a disgraced Canadian airman. CHUNG CHUNG!

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[FormerMod-a1]

I've missed the CHUNG! CHUNG! (on new eps, as I do faithfully watch the various L&O networks :-P ) so I'll keep watching.  Plus I didn't think it was half bad, either.  

Loved the coverage of the Canadian accents on the Russell Williams case. :-D

[FormerMod-a1]

I may have to watch just for your coverage.

[Earmuffs Mom]

I'm three quarters of the way through the final Scott Peterson episode positing all of their reasonable doubt theories.  I am genuinely baffled, however, that his CA appellate proceedings haven't even started yet and the conviction was over 12 years ago.  WTH?  I'm an appellate attorney in a different state that imposes the death penalty and am well-versed in the process.  I thought for sure most of his direct appeal and possibly ineffective assistance of counsel claims were adjudicated already as I watched the earlier episodes.  Habeas can drag out for years, but the direct appeal discussing the jury selection and trial court errors should have been decided by now.

[Tara Ariano]

Russell Williams update: there WAS a Lifetime Original Movie! STARRING GARY COLE!!!!! It's available on Amazon and iTunes.

[MCMLXXVII]

Speaking to Sarah's question of why the Menendez case is so popular- aside from them being rich and all the publicity, I think it's that they dishonored the "social contract" of raise your kids right and they'll care for you in old age. It's probably deep down every parent's worst nightmare (especially wealthy ones) that they raised a sociopath who'll do exactly what the brothers did. 

[Dohknutty]

I couldn't get enough of Court TV back in the day! Along with the Menedez brothers, the other trials I remember being engrossed in were the Betty Broderick case (boy that one had TV movie written all over it) and the Robert Bardo murder of Rebecca Schaeffer which was prosecuted by a pre O.J. Marcia Clark. Coincidentally, all 3 of these murders happened in 1989.
The thing that always stayed with me about the Menedez killings was that Kitty was shot in the face. How much do you have to hate someone to shoot them point blank in the face with a shotgun?

[veronicamers]

On 9/27/2017 at 10:25 PM, Dohknutty said:

I couldn't get enough of Court TV back in the day! Along with the Menedez brothers, the other trials I remember being engrossed in were the Betty Broderick case (boy that one had TV movie written all over it) and the Robert Bardo murder of Rebecca Schaeffer which was prosecuted by a pre O.J. Marcia Clark. Coincidentally, all 3 of these murders happened in 1989.

Yes! Are you ever right about the Betty Broderick case. That was a whole lot. 

1989 must have been around the time I really started paying attention to true crime cases. In addition to the memorable ones you mention, the Diane Downs made for TV movie came out that year which I was obsessed with. By this point I was visiting my local used book store buying all the true crime mass market paperbacks babysitting money could buy. 

Back to L&O, it was a lot better than I expected. The cast is quite good and I'm truly enjoying the camp Charles and Graham are laying down. Looking forward to your continued coverage Sarah!

Edited October 2, 2017 by veronicamers

[dwarmed]

Why is this case so compelling?

First, there’s the shock factor. Kids just opening fire on their parents with shotguns is an unusually brazen act. There was not much cleverness in trying to disguise the crime, except trying to pretend the mob was responsible by shooting their parents knee caps. Then, there’s so much sociopathic behavior all around in this story. Everyone in the family is pretty unsavory. Depending on what you believe about the facts, it’s hard to decide if any of them are victims and/or if they all got what they deserved. Finally, if the defense was completely fabricated and no sexual abuse actually existed, that is a level of sociopathy and cold-blooded calculation that is mind-blowing.

I think most people are in agreement about basic facts:
- The parents raised their sons to be horribly entitled sociopathic monsters, who relied on extreme wealth for their identity and power.
- The father was certainly abusive in some way, at least verbally and physically.
- The parents sealed their fate when they threatened to cut off their sons financially.
- The murder was premeditated and planned for some time.

In my mind, the major mystery is the sexual abuse claim and that doesn’t seem relevant to the ultimate outcome of the case. The self-defense imminent danger defense is obviously crap, even if claims of sexual abuse are absolutely true. The brothers planned the murder, whether out of anger or just for money. They should be in jail. If they were in real fear for their safety, they were old enough to leave. It’s only relevant in judging the parents, if they were really victims or if they got what they deserved in a moral sense. This also goes to the motive of the killing and how much sympathy you have for the perpetrators. The more you believe about the abuse claims, the more their anger might be understandable and the more sympathy you might have. Even then, they are still guilty and got the correct sentence for what they did. If they were only motivated by money and their entitlement to it, then they are not sympathetic at all. One could certainly believe that given their spending spree after they committed the murders. Even then, the parents created that and they reaped what they sowed.

I think our culture is fascinated by wanting to blame (particularly victims), wanting to judge, as well as by horrific sociopathic behavior and how humans are capable of such things. There are no good guys or innocent victims in this case, so plenty of judgement to go around. It’s such a weird feeling to have no sympathy for victims of such an egregious crime. That’s the most intriguing part of all.

[Flamingo]

Jeff Goldblum episodes of CI are my favorite episodes. It's the first time I liked him an anything.

[Earmuffs Mom]

I did some research to answer my own question - the CA Supreme Court is apparently extremely backlogged and it takes "decades" to get a death penalty appeal heard and adjudicated.  

http://beta.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-death-penalty-decision-prop-66-20170824-story.html

[ecarley]

I came here and signed up for an account specifically to suggest American Vandal, but I see someone else beat me to it. I enjoyed the whole thing except the last couple minutes where they went all John Hughes. 

[Pogojoco]

Bob McKeown's accent is so chewy. Also, welcome to the joys of the Fifth Estate, Sarah. It is a bit like the 20/20, but it's also quite a bit like Frontline. McKeown's chewiness is not as sinister/soothing as Will Lyman, those.

And yeah, that dude who said, "eh". He basically had to be on the national broadcaster.

[Sarah D. Bunting]

...Wow.

[Sarah D. Bunting]

I'll check it out!

[pomme de terre]

Could there be an Again w This/Blotter crossover event where you and Tara watch the Homicide: Life on the Street movie? Besides being a HITG-fest, I completely forgot that the shitty new rookie everyone hates is Jason Priestley. He gets beaten up by a homeless guy, undermined by Pendleton, and patronizingly called 'a fiesty little guy' by Peter Geraty in the first 10 minutes.

Not strictly true crime, although H:LOTS was a nonfiction book and the furor over a black Baltimore mayor floating the idea of legalization was based in fact.

[Sarah D. Bunting]

I can probably find a way to bend that into our mandate. See also: The Corner.

[txhorns79]

Quote

Betty Broderick case (boy that one had TV movie written all over it)

Those movies were a tour de force of acting for Meredith Baxter.  I think she expertly captures the woman's pure narcissism, and even managed to make Betty appear somewhat sympathetic without downplaying what a monster Betty turned into.  Also, not only does she kill RevCam, but she drives a car into his living room.  (Apparently, Betty did drive a car into her ex-husband's house, but the movie makes it seem much campier than it should be.)  I would love to see a Blotter on Broderick. 

Edited October 3, 2017 by txhorns79

[Sarah D. Bunting]

A Brotter? (I'll let myself out. But it's on the list!)

[Primetimer]

Sarah and Tara discuss what worked (trail mix) and what didn't (wigs) in E02 of Law & Order True Crime: The Menendez Murders as we debut The Blotter Presents: Summary Judgment.

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[Primetimer]

Stephanie Early Green is back to discuss one of the internet's most enduring, and annoying, Reddit herrings -- plus a legendarily dumb episode name for a pretty good 48 HRS.

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[iMonrey]

I'm so glad you guys are covering the whole series! I wish you had done this with A&E's Scott Peterson story because that one got more and more absurd as it went along. Hopefully this one will be better but I love your commentary on this!

[maxineofarc]

Sweet MERCY, Renner is exhausting. It's never been more clear that this isn't about Maura Murray for him, it's about... well, him. Has he ever even bothered to consider the most likely possibility, which is that she MOST LIKELY was drunk, scared of being arrested, walked off and got lost? That we have him to thank for Tim and Lance, and the ongoing attempts of internet "detectives" to harass Murray's family, is just icing.

[Sarah D. Bunting]

...He just emailed me, FYI. Said it was tough to listen to, "in the most surreal way." Perfectly pleasant, but: dude. Don't read/listen to the comments. :)

[starri]

@Sarah D. Bunting, you're doing the Lord's work.

I clearly need to be reading The Blotter more often, because I had no idea that there were people who hated Tim, Lance, and Renner more than I did.

[veronicamers]

3 hours ago, Sarah D. Bunting said:

...He just emailed me, FYI. Said it was tough to listen to, "in the most surreal way." Perfectly pleasant, but: dude. Don't read/listen to the comments. :)

Oh bless his heart.

Y'all. I hate watched this mess because I could not wait to hear what Sarah and Stephanie had to say about it. Stephanie's review of the MMM podcast on The-Blotter is legendary. The only saving grace of this show is U.S. Marshall Art who I do have some faith in as a reasoned, seasoned professional. I may keep watching just for his analysis. 

Super excited for Sepinwall on Mindhunter! Also, I LOLed at "word casserole."

[starri]

Although I do want to share vis a vis "The Psychiatrist and the Selfie":  Untreated mania can last for months.  The episodes of depression last even longer.

Although to truly be mania, a person has to have his or her functioning in day-to-day life impaired.

[Hambone]

James Renner is the name of my beloved father, who passed away approximately 18 months ago at age 72. I want so desperately to watch this series, as I have long been fascinated by this case, but Renner is so irritating that I hate to see his name. My dad was the complete opposite, so it's a massive distraction and a bummer that this James Renner seems to be nothing like him. Mad apologies for the personal ramble. Just had to vent.

[Sarah D. Bunting]

I'm sorry for your loss. And...for its compounding, sigh.

@veronicamers, even the great Sepinwall could not pry screeners loose for that property, grr, so he's actually going to be discussing Dick Wolf's Criminal Confessions, plus we're going to have a twist in the Cold Case section. Hope that makes up for it! (I'll get to Mind Hunters the week after.)

[veronicamers]

1 hour ago, Sarah D. Bunting said:

@veronicamers, even the great Sepinwall could not pry screeners loose for that property, grr, so he's actually going to be discussing Dick Wolf's Criminal Confessions, plus we're going to have a twist in the Cold Case section. Hope that makes up for it! (I'll get to Mind Hunters the week after.)

Ah, no worries. A joy to hear you and Sepinwall interact no matter what the topic!

[swimmyfish]

My only experience with Missing Maura Murray is other properties discussing how insufferable it is. Which actually makes it kind of intriguing, but mostly because of the train-wreck appeal. I mean, I also am not a doctor, but I kind of think they may be crackpots? They are spinning wild yarns out of nothing, yet are fully convinced that they've uncovered the "truth;" they are obsessed with minor details that they believe have major significance; and they have so much attachment to a case that is certainly terrible for the people involved, yet do not recognize that it doesn't involve them in the slightest. Maura Murray is their PizzaGate, and it's very weird.

[monocles]

I sent Sarah where the Nolan-Weiss civil suit currently stands and she asked me to share it here (yay, unlimited Lexis use due to law school!)

• In 2014, Weiss sued Nolan and Buchbinder for assault, battery, slander and defamation, intentional infliction of emotional distress, medical malpractice, and negligence. The IIED charge was dismissed for being duplicative of the other claims.
• In December 2015, there was a family court order which found that Weiss proved, by a preponderance of evidence, that Buchbinder had conspired with Nolan to kill Weiss (this finding was made as part of a visitation decision - I will let people who have more experience with family courts than my one semester of family law comment on how binding this is on the civil court. From reading the 2017 opinions, it looks like it was very persuasive)
• In April 2016, the court granted partial summary judgement to Weiss on the assault and battery claims, so those are done and decided in Weiss's favor.
• In April 2017, Buchbinder tried to get punitive damages and attorney's fees off the table, and tried to undo the 2016 partial summary judgement for Weiss. Both motions were denied.

And nothing since then, or at least nothing that involved a judicial opinion. Given the rate at which cases settle rather than go to a jury, I'm guessing that's where this is headed, especially if she is already thinking ahead to damages.

Also, fun fact, one of the keywords for the 2014 opinion is "sledgehammer," which I guess means this comes up enough that Lexis felt the need to highlight it.

[jenrising]

On 10/4/2017 at 4:34 PM, maxineofarc said:

Sweet MERCY, Renner is exhausting. It's never been more clear that this isn't about Maura Murray for him, it's about... well, him. Has he ever even bothered to consider the most likely possibility, which is that she MOST LIKELY was drunk, scared of being arrested, walked off and got lost? That we have him to thank for Tim and Lance, and the ongoing attempts of internet "detectives" to harass Murray's family, is just icing.

It's really too much. Renner is obsessed (and obsessed with his obsession) with this fictional Maura he created. The scared pregnant girl fleeing the monstrous men in her life. Like this fiction is the only way he can be sad she's gone, or the only way she deserves attention. To me, the drunk troubled young woman is still tragic and still worthy of sympathy. And being honest about who she was honors her memory (and respects her family) a lot more than creating fairytales. 

[starri]

9 hours ago, swimmyfish said:

I mean, I also am not a doctor, but I kind of think they may be crackpots?

As it so happens, I AM a doctor, and while--unlike Tim, Lance, and Renner--I refrain from diagnosing patients I haven't actually examined myself, I think you're probably okay.

2 hours ago, jenrising said:

Renner is obsessed (and obsessed with his obsession) with this fictional Maura he created. The scared pregnant girl fleeing the monstrous men in her life

Don't forget, that's his SECOND fictional Maura.  She was originally some kind of evil genius predator.  

I wonder how he can square her being so desperate to protect her unborn child, so worried about how alcohol would effect it, with the fact that she was obviously drinking and driving the night she disappeared.

[Sarah D. Bunting]

The malign influence of whatever serial killer picked her up, no doubt. Except when he dropped her off in Montreal, because he was part of a plan to escape?

[maxineofarc]

On 10/4/2017 at 4:38 PM, Sarah D. Bunting said:

...He just emailed me, FYI. Said it was tough to listen to, "in the most surreal way." Perfectly pleasant, but: dude. Don't read/listen to the comments. :)

I find it... difficult to believe that this is the first time he's ever heard this kind of criticism of his personal brand of crackpottery? Shouldn't he be used to it by now and decrying us all as haters or the Illuminati or something?

Yeah, I can't imagine why her family doesn't want to talk to him.

Edited October 6, 2017 by maxineofarc