S11.E03: He Peed! He Peed!

[Kohola3]

janey99, that sounds like a sensible way to do it with the youngsters.    They need little bits of reinforcement for little bits of progress or they lose interest.

[SMama]

Sorry I was MIA for a while. I have family in Puerto Rico and was consumed by not knowing. They are OK, so I can breath, although I still hurt for everyone on the island. Thank you for those who felt for my daughter, your thoughts warmed my scared and broken heart. We fed SBaby like she was a turkey we were going to have for Thanksgiving. The girl was a blank slate and that worked on our favor. Anything we put in front of her she ate. We kept her three bottles of formula a day due to bonding. Did a lot of skin to skin contact when feeding her, while looking at her and kissing her. Her first dinner with us I fed her pumpkin soup to gage what she could handle (never had solid food). My husband returned to table with a plate with duck in orange sauce, fried noodles, and rice. She scarfed that down in no time. everyone in our travel group was surprised at the things she ate. By the time her visa picture was taken a week later her face was visibly fuller. It's truly amazing to see what just one week of actual feeding can do for a child.

Today, at ten, she is still a very eclectic eater. She has never had a fish stick, but loves salmon, lobster, shrimp, crab, seafood in general. Has been eating Indian food since we came home. The owners of our local Indian restaurant loved it every time we visited, and would just watch her eat tandoori chicken and anything that was not spicy. She is crazy about sushi to the point that it is worth to pay the all you can eat price for her. On her last birthday she ate 20 large sushi rolls. Puerto Rican food is her comfort food, rice, beans, avocado, and amarillitos (fried ripe plantains). Once she realized food was plentiful her eating slowed down somewhat. We call her a feast or famine eater. Some days she eats so much we think she'd get sick (has never happened), other days, very little. On the famine days we supplement with Pediasure, and protein shakes masked with berries. She is a micro preemie, coupled with malnourishment and genetics she will always be small. But thank goodness she is healthy.

Before leaving for China we had set up Early Intervention and International Adoption Clinic appointments. Due to the lack of environmental stimulation we had to work really hard with her. The morning after we met I handed her a Baby Einstein rattle, and he wrist went limp. She had no idea what to do with a toy. We gave her lots of tummy time, had so many educational and simply fun toys, and she caught up. We made the very difficult decision that I would not return to my job (I was the main bread winner by a lot). We didn't bring her half way across the world knowing her horrible first sixteen months of life, only to turn her over to daycare. It was a tough choice, and not for everyone. I've worked since I was 14 years old, it was gut wrenching, and a tremendous financial sacrifice. We are not as well off as we should be, but it works for us. We don't drive new cars, we don't take lavish vacations, we are just grateful to have our daughter. Maybe once she reaches middle school (next year) I will return to work.

A big concern was that her life before coming home would result in big developmental delays. Ironically, she did not qualify for Early Intervention. I had told my husband beforehand that it would most likely be the outcome. As a social worker I had so many kids clearly in need not qualify (have to have certain % of delays in three areas). The first thing the evaluator gave our daughter (she had been home for two months) was a string a beads. We had been doing many things with her for dexterity but not that. Imagine our surprise when SBaby put the string through the beads like she had been doing it for months. I knew at that moment she would not qualify. Anyway, this is getting long and boring. Yes, we took care of her, but like I said, it came at a cost. sometimes I feel like an absolute failure because I would love to give her so much more financially. But we knew she needed one on one, comprehensive care if she was going to make progress. At least she has been able to take art, karate, archery, and now swimming. But she is not a Jolie-Pitt or an Arnold-Klein, although she does have hyphenated last names.

One more thing, there were a lot of struggles, such as her night terrors, and certain things that just did not make sense to anyone, us included. I cringed every time someone would deride Will for wearing a diaper, someone even said he is five and still shits his pants. One thing I have learned from the "special need" announcements is that there is never just ONE issue with a child. I doubt Will was in the special needs list ONLY due to dwarfism.  No one knows what these children have been through. Some are mellower than others, some catch up slower. What I try to keep in mind is that when we met our daughter she was physically intact. However, once we were home we realized that emotionally, she came to us shattered in a million pieces. Even now we are still working on getting those pieces together.  Sorry about the rambling manifesto. 

Edited October 13, 2017 by SMama

[BW Manilowe]

18 hours ago, SMama said:

Sorry I was MIA for a while. I have family in Puerto Rico and was consumed by not knowing. They are OK, so I can breath, although I still hurt for everyone on the island. Thank you for those who felt for my daughter, your thoughts warmed my scared and broken heart. We fed SBaby like she was a turkey we were going to have for Thanksgiving. The girl was a blank slate and that worked on our favor. Anything we put in front of her she ate. We kept her three bottles of formula a day due to bonding. Did a lot of skin to skin contact when feeding her, while looking at her and kissing her. Her first dinner with us I fed her pumpkin soup to gage what she could handle (never had solid food). My husband returned to table with a plate with duck in orange sauce, fried noodles, and rice. She scarfed that down in no time. everyone in our travel group was surprised at the things she ate. By the time her visa picture was taken a week later her face was visibly fuller. It's truly amazing to see what just one week of actual feeding can do for a child.

Today, at ten, she is still a very eclectic eater. She has never had a fish stick, but loves salmon, lobster, shrimp, crab, seafood in general. Has been eating Indian food since we came home. The owners of our local Indian restaurant loved it every time we visited, and would just watch her eat tandoori chicken and anything that was not spicy. She is crazy about sushi to the point that it is worth to pay the all you can eat price for her. On her last birthday she ate 20 large sushi rolls. Puerto Rican food is her comfort food, rice, beans, avocado, and amarillitos (fried ripe plantains). Once she realized food was plentiful her eating slowed down somewhat. We call her a feast or famine eater. Some days she eats so much we think she'd get sick (has never happened), other days, very little. On the famine days we supplement with Pediasure, and protein shakes masked with berries. She is a micro preemie, coupled with malnourishment and genetics she will always be small. But thank goodness she is healthy.

Before leaving for China we had set up Early Intervention and International Adoption Clinic appointments. Due to the lack of environmental stimulation we had to work really hard with her. The morning after we met I handed her a Baby Einstein rattle, and he wrist went limp. She had no idea what to do with a toy. We gave her lots of tummy time, had so many educational and simply fun toys, and she caught up. We made the very difficult decision that I would not return to my job (I was the main bread winner by a lot). We didn't bring her half way across the world knowing her horrible first sixteen months of life, only to turn her over to daycare. It was a tough choice, and not for everyone. I've worked since I was 14 years old, it was gut wrenching, and a tremendous financial sacrifice. We are not as well off as we should be, but it works for us. We don't drive new cars, we don't take lavish vacations, we are just grateful to have our daughter. Maybe once she reaches middle school (next year) I will return to work.

A big concern was that her life before coming home would result in big developmental delays. Ironically, she did not qualify for Early Intervention. I had told my husband beforehand that it would most likely be the outcome. As a social worker I had so many kids clearly in need not qualify (have to have certain % of delays in three areas). The first thing the evaluator gave our daughter (she had been home for two months) was a string a beads. We had been doing many things with her for dexterity but not that. Imagine our surprise when SBaby put the string through the beads like she had been doing it for months. I knew at that moment she would not qualify. Anyway, this is getting long and boring. Yes, we took care of her, but like I said, it came at a cost. sometimes I feel like an absolute failure because I would love to give her so much more financially. But we knew she needed one on one, comprehensive care if she was going to make progress. At least she has been able to take art, karate, archery, and now swimming. But she is not a Jolie-Pitt or an Arnold-Klein, although she does have hyphenated last names.

One more thing, there were a lot of struggles, such as her night terrors, and certain things that just did not make sense to anyone, us included. I cringed every time someone would deride Will for wearing a diaper, someone even said he is five and still shits his pants. One thing I have learned from the "special need" announcements is that there is never just ONE issue with a child. I doubt Will was in the special needs list ONLY due to dwarfism.  No one knows what these children have been through. Some are mellower than others, some catch up slower. What I try to keep in mind is that when we met our daughter she was physically intact. However, once we were home we realized that emotionally, she came to us shattered in a million pieces. Even now we are still working on getting those pieces together.  Sorry about the rambling manifesto. 

Small point: Will & Zoey just use Klein as their last name, not Arnold-Klein. In 1 of the new eps, Jen asks Will what he likes about school. He says "Burps." Then she says "William Klein!", sort of trying to chastise him since it's not a very positive behavior. And, they've been running the adoption eps during the afternoons lately; they get Zoey's US passport in 1 of those eps & either Bill or Jen says the name inside of it is "Zoey Klein", with her Indian last name (I think it was), Nidhi, as her new middle name (they also kept Will's Chinese last name, Rijin, as his American middle name).

[alegtostandon]

On 10/4/2017 at 7:25 AM, Bellalisa said:

This dog normally pees on everything in the house? 

I wonder why they expect him to pee on this pad. I would have taken it outside.  Usually when they first get outside they pee on something right away. 

They had it in the bedroom?  Why not the garage? I don't get it.

Male dogs "mark" in the sense that their bladder is not full, they don't really have to go but they pee or mark on a spot to show other dogs and the world they were there. A dog normally doesn't mark in his own home- unless another dog shows up, and not the dog they normally live with. It's strange that after all these years Rocky would be marking all over their house. Or when they go out they know he is going to pee inside? Terrible!

My step mom had a male Corgi who marked on everything his whole life, even in his own home (reason I refuse to have a male dog). He "marked" her white drapes so badly, she had to replace them. He was housebroken.  I would babysit him, and had since he was a baby, and he would mark everything in my house, including my female dogs! I had always been told that a male would stop doing this once they were neutered, which he was. Told my stepmom that I would not watch him until this was resolved, that my girls were not his property.. Turned out the little guy had a bladder infection.

I did think the "pee pads" were an interesting idea because my experience from above,  they do like to aim onto something.

I loved how proud Zoey was of Rocky.

Edited October 14, 2017 by alegtostandon

[SMama]

@BW Manilowe, I know the kids are Kleins, I was just being silly. It’s common in international adoption to keep their name as a middle name. We did the same with our daughter.

[BW Manilowe]

5 hours ago, SMama said:

@BW Manilowe, I know the kids are Kleins, I was just being silly. It’s common in international adoption to keep their name as a middle name. We did the same with our daughter.

My apologies. Sometimes it's hard to get how somebody means something on the internet since you can't hear them say it, & hearing is a very big help in determining meaning behind words, tone of voice, etc.

[SMama]

NO need to apologize.  ?

[CousinAmy]

14 hours ago, alegtostandon said:

My step mom had a male Corgi who marked on everything his whole life, even in his own home (reason I refuse to have a male dog). He "marked" her white drapes so badly, she had to replace them. He was housebroken.  I would babysit him, and had since he was a baby, and he would mark everything in my house, including my female dogs! I had always been told that a male would stop doing this once they were neutered, which he was. Told my stepmom that I would not watch him until this was resolved, that my girls were not his property.. Turned out the little guy had a bladder infection.

I did think the "pee pads" were an interesting idea because my experience from above,  they do like to aim onto something.

I loved how proud Zoey was of 

How did the dog know that he had to go on the pad, if he normally goes all over the house? They left him alone for the camera to record, why wouldn't they just have waited and watched him?

[gonecrackers]

I thought he was pad trained, but missing so it runs off the pad due to the leg lifting, so that's why he made the target. The little dog lifts at the target (kind of instinctual I guess) then since the target is in the middle it runs off but still onto the pad, hence no mess on the floor. Not a bad idea if they'll use it.

I have a pad trained little dog, but female so this isn't an issue. (She can go outside as well).

Edited October 15, 2017 by gonecrackers

[RemoteControlFreak]

On 10/10/2017 at 11:40 AM, Absolom said:

Been there, done that.  That's not what drove Bill to design the pad, though.  They have a dog who was trained to a pad because apparently the apartment made it too tough to train the dog to outside.  This is designed for a small niche market.

Who the hell does that?  If you live in an apartment and choose to get a dog, you find a way to take it out multiple times a day.  Lots of people have dogs in apartments and many in far less hospitable climates than Houston, Texas and they all manage fine without some stupid 21st century invention for lazy people.

And before everyone jumps in about how small Jen is and unable to manage a dog on a leash, certainly they can afford to hire a dog walker just like they've hired nannies, private swim teachers, a custom dress designer, etc. 

Edited October 16, 2017 by RemoteControlFreak

[gonecrackers]

Not everyone who has a pad trained dog is lazy. We have special needs kids & having her pad trained allows us to handle everyone & enjoy having our sweet dog as well. And ours has no issues going outside as well, so it's a win-win. Having a pad trained dog doesn't equal being lazy at all. I'm sure others have many reasons, including various disabilities, where having them pad trained is ideal for their family/living situation, & then they can enjoy having a dog as part of their family. I think a blanket statement as pee pads being for 'lazy' people is quite harsh & unfair.

Edited October 16, 2017 by gonecrackers

[Foghorn Leghorn]

My friends use them at night when they don’t often hear their dog.  Whatever works to keep the house clean!!  Outside is preferred but not always possible for many reasons!

[Mollysmom]

I have a 6 lb Morkie and she was pee-pad trained by her previous owner. I have gotten her to finally go outside more, but when I'm at work, and she can't hold it as long as my bigger dog, she uses the pee pad. It isn't laziness. It is actually more work I think because you have to pick up the pad and throw them away, and clean up any misses. 

[RemoteControlFreak]

On 10/16/2017 at 10:54 AM, gonecrackers said:

Not everyone who has a pad trained dog is lazy. We have special needs kids & having her pad trained allows us to handle everyone & enjoy having our sweet dog as well. And ours has no issues going outside as well, so it's a win-win. Having a pad trained dog doesn't equal being lazy at all. I'm sure others have many reasons, including various disabilities, where having them pad trained is ideal for their family/living situation, & then they can enjoy having a dog as part of their family. I think a blanket statement as pee pads being for 'lazy' people is quite harsh & unfair.

You're right.  Not everyone who uses a dog pee pad is lazy.  Some people have circumstances that keep them housebound and otherwise unable to arrange for the dog to go outside.  I was responding to the post saying that Bill and Jen's dog was not house broken because he was in an apartment. That's just lazy, for the reasons I outlined in my post. 

Edited October 18, 2017 by RemoteControlFreak

[LadyStClaire]

On October 8, 2017 at 5:51 AM, BW Manilowe said:

Since Jen has mentioned in previous eps that her parents were willing to take her to out of town doctors, if it would get her the best care for her "medical complexities", as she tends to call them, & we've seen that she & Bill are apparently also willing to travel, & have traveled, with at least Will to get certain procedures done by the best doctors available (he sees the same doctors/goes to the same children's hospital in Delaware, I think it is, for his dwarfism that Jen went to as a child & I'm pretty sure that's where he also had the surgery to place his ear tubes & to remove his tonsils & adenoids; I can't remember for sure if we've seen Zoey with the same doctors yet or not), it's entirely possible they might've kept at least some of their Texas doctors for now, if they thought they were the best to treat whatever the issue is.  I mean, both as a patient with a form of dwarfism & as a doctor herself, Jen would know where the best doctors to help her children (& Bill, probably, as he went to a doctor/hospital in NYC to have his back surgery done after they returned from adopting Zoey in India) would be &, since it appears they can afford it, she & Bill would likely be willing to give their kids the best care they can get for their conditions; especially since they're used to that standard of care when it comes to their own health.

Not for nothing, but I also grew up with "medical complexities" & parents who were both in the medical/nursing field. If they felt it was better I, in particular (as opposed to me & my "healthy" younger brother), went to a doctor or hospital out of town to treat something (or if my local family doctor/pediatrician recommended it), or if the condition could only be treated out of town, then that's where I went for treatment.

Bill is "NOW" having trouble with his back and, had to have a myleogram performed, to pin point the problem!!! So you see he may have faired just as good or better, by having his surgery performed in Texas!!!

[DianeDobbler]

I walk my dogs three times a day at the minimum, and leave the wee wee pad in the house because I work. I am not the least bit lazy in how I care for and exercise my dogs. They're small, if they drink a lot of water during the day or they just need to go, they can go on the pad. My previous dog, who has now passed away, refused to use the pads and would hold it until I came home, which I hated. I hated to think of her waiting if I were held up on the subway. When she got ill I had pads everywhere and she'd still go inside. I had a neighbor take her out to give her breaks, etc. She was housebroken, but as she got older, her lack of training/interest in the pads meant I had a lot of clean-up. 

Then, too, if it's Saturday and I want to be "lazy" and sleep past 7am, they can use the pad, although they usually sleep in with me and don't. But it's there if they need to be an early bird. There is no odor, and the pad throws away easily like a diaper. Mine are biodegradable. 

My current two dogs - If they don't feel well or have an intestinal upset that leads to frequent pooping in the middle of the night, for example, or at dawn, they use the pad. If they're stuck at home and they have to go, they can go. 80% of the time they wait for me, but I work longer than I feel dogs should reasonably have to wait. I wouldn't have a big dog for that reason, but the little ones can go on the absorbent pad, and they do. Usually not. But they know if they have to, they don't have to suffer in discomfort.

I am very happy because when I got the second dog (the first definitely needed a canine role model) he picked up her "aim" right away and goes right in the center. Dogs act out with their poop and peeing - it's not as if they have a lot of ways to act out. The pad with the mini-hydrant is a good idea for male dogs. BTW, female dogs also mark. My first dog did, until she chilled and stopped caring anymore. My next dog marked like he was a damn fire hose - he seemed to have an inexhaustible bladder.  Now he's more "eh" about it. But the little female I got to role model for him is also a tough nut and not only tries to mark everywhere, she also kicks dirt over any sign of another dog that she smells. Only difference is she squats and he lifts his leg.

Anyway, nothing lazy about wee wee pads. The best trained dogs have been known to pee when they notice it's raining outside (See, I went! We can go back in now!). When they're mad. To get your attention. If it's warm out and they had a lot of water. My home is very clean, I only use one pad because both dogs are very diligent about their aim, and their use is infrequent. But I think they're great.

[florida2]

I like watching the show if nothing else for its entertainment.  I have watched from the beginning nothing has really changed.  Dr Jen laughs at everything.  No discipline with the children, they pretty much do what they want say what they want.   They do something they should be disciplined for and Jen laughs.  The kids will grow up with the sense they can do anything say anything.  When they are anywhere they touch, move run around in any area.  No respect for anything, tipping cannons over why don't they teach them some manners, they are old enough for that.  Jen, Bill says something to them they say NO very bad not a good way to start out a childs life, again just shows no respect being learned.  SAD VERY SAD.  I guess and this is being kind being a little person you can do anything and think its right.  They better put some discipline in their parenting or they will be sorry in a few years.