These Spoilers Suck: Bitter Speculation About SPN Spoilers

[juppschmitz]

15 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

Michael`d own fault for not just snapping his fingers and dealing with TMNS on the spot. He could have broken her legs just like that. I`d love to have seen her ridiculous flipping and posing then.  I would have Black Knight-Monty-Pythoned her ass just for shits and giggles if I was him. 

Couldn't help myself...

[ILoveReading]

If Dean is going to feel guilt for how he treated Jack, are we going to see guilt from Jack for saying Dean doesn't matter?

[ILoveReading]

 

Jensen talking about tonights episode.

Does the show really need to go down the the "Dean needs to learn he was an ass to Jack" route again? 

He hasn't been a dick to him since episode 4 of last season.   A couple of episodes later he called him family.  He even literally scarficed himself to save Jack's life.  But none of that matters I guess.

Edited November 29, 2018 by ILoveReading

[catrox14]

1 hour ago, ILoveReading said:

If Dean is going to feel guilt for how he treated Jack, are we going to see guilt from Jack for saying Dean doesn't matter?

If Dean feels  guilt about Jack then they will have essentially made Lucifer more heroic than Dean. Also even I Dean feels guilty where is the understanding of compkicated overwhelming grief and loss that sent Dean into that tailspin(even though he had a completely reasonable worry that Jack being Lucifer's son could go bad , and without much of a push. they had Jack grin pretty malevolently in a couple of episodes to play the whole he might go darkside thing. If they throw Dean under the bus for that then I give up.

[Aeryn13]

Quote

Does the show really need to go down the the "Dean needs to learn he was an ass to Jack" route again? 

He hasn't been a dick to him since episode 4 of last season.   A couple of episodes later he called him family.  He even literally scarficed himself to save Jack's life.  But none of that matters I guess.

They were buddy-buddy in the last freaking episode so why the need to drag this up again? Just to get some gratuitous Dean-bashing on over poor nougat baby`s deathbed? Come on.  

Dean has "come around" a long time ago on Jack. And being wary of him was a totaly valid position, things only escalated because Sam wanted to have his way and pushed the issue. But Dean needs to apologize some more and again to infinity. His grief wasn`t valid last Season, why would it be now? Bucklemming sucks. 

[ILoveReading]

https://www.eonline.com/news/991880/supernatural-stars-answer-your-burning-questions

According to this, we're supposed to get more Michael Dean.  I'll believe it when it happens.

There will a confrontation between Michael and Sam.  Because its not like he and Dean have a connection.  This was the feeling I had from the episode 9 description.  That Sam will get the Michael confrontation, because he'll look like Pellegrino,  adn Dean will get to be a bully and get beat up by Teenage Mutant Ninja Sue again. (This is a Berens ep).

When asked about the most exciting thing for his character this season, Jensen can only say the unforseeable future.

The AU hunters will be in the bunker for the unforseeable future.  Translation, we're never getting rid of them.

[Aeryn13]

Urgh, if Sam gets a confrontation, Michael will have a vessel. So of course Pellegrino. That's a slap in Jensen's face. Can't wait to see how Michael will trash-talk Dean to Sam since that is what people do.

Because getting a Dean Michael confrontation would be out of line.

Stupid AU hunters, of course they need to stay for Leader McChief.

[Res]

22 hours ago, Myrelle said:

I thought this also from the last episode.

It seems to me that the Michael!Dean sl has been fourth to LeaderSam, WoobieJack, and TraumatizedNick/Lucifer.

So YUCK! to that, and I hope things change drastically in the second half-like from Soapernatural back to Supernatural-to begin with.

I hope things change too but I wouldn't count on it.

[ILoveReading]

Im not sure how to take this.  Is he guessing or cofirming

[devlin]

3 hours ago, ILoveReading said:

https://www.eonline.com/news/991880/supernatural-stars-answer-your-burning-questions

According to this, we're supposed to get more Michael Dean.  I'll believe it when it happens.

There will a confrontation between Michael and Sam.  Because its not like he and Dean have a connection.  This was the feeling I had from the episode 9 description.  That Sam will get the Michael confrontation, because he'll look like Pellegrino,  adn Dean will get to be a bully and get beat up by Teenage Mutant Ninja Sue again. (This is a Berens ep).

When asked about the most exciting thing for his character this season, Jensen can only say the unforseeable future.

The AU hunters will be in the bunker for the unforseeable future.  Translation, we're never getting rid of them.

Why does sam even need a confrontation with Michael??!!

[ILoveReading]

https://www.thetvaddict.com/2018/11/29/supernatural-interview-cast-dean-jack-nick/

This throws cold water on the Michael/Dean stuff. 

Quote

Meanwhile, star Jensen Ackles warned that “This is not a fading problem. This is a problem that is festering. So it’s definitely going to rear its ugly head and probably in a way that’s the worst way possible.”

Quote

Sam doesn’t become aware of it for a while and we don’t play it every episode. But I think we raise the question in the minds of the fans and we’ll get around to solving it, but not right away

Bolding mine

It sounds like Jensen has no idea and hasn't seen anything in the scripts.  Sound like this storyline is going to take place largely off screen. 

Edited November 30, 2018 by ILoveReading

[AwesomO4000]

54 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

It sounds like Jensen has no idea and hasn't seen anything in the scripts.  Sound like this storyline is going to take place largely off screen. 

For me this isn't much different from some other big stories we've had in the past on this show. We get hints, but don't see the whole picture right away, and sometimes not for a long while. We didn't find out what was really going on with Sam until episode 16 in season 4. We didn't find out about the Crowley / Castiel plot until episode 19 in season 6. That second one actually worked for me, because we got an explanation in the next episode for exactly how things came to be that way. The Sam one didn't work as well for me, because we didn't really get an explanation for how things came to be that way, and a few very important details and at least one major event horizon were just left out altogether.

It remains to be seen which category this one will fall into.

Edited November 30, 2018 by AwesomO4000

[gonzosgirrl]

11 hours ago, SueB said:

No.  No he doesn't.  We've already figured that one out Mr. Buckner. His "I own you."

And it IS just like Dean to try and actively ignore a dizzy moment.  He probably won't connect it to Michael for a while.  Once he does, I think he'll fess up.  He was pretty candid about being compromised by Amara.  If he thinks it's a threat, he'll say something.  If he thinks he's simply ill, he'll be quiet.  

Thanks @Lemuria for the article.  Between that and Jensen confessing we haven't seen the last of Michael!Dean, I think this is definitely coming out at mid-season.

Again, I HOPE the spear is the Spear of Destiny.  I know it's unlikely but that's what I hope for (and will take full credit for if it happens). 

Seriously, if Dean doesn't connect his 'spells' and the Djinn's reactions to him, or at least be suspicious of them, then he's dumb as a bag of hammers. And Dean (at least pre-Dabb*) is not dumb. He's the King of de Nile when it comes to his own safety, but the Dean Winchester I know would never put his family and friends at risk by ignoring it. They have no idea why Michael left him or where he is, but these flashing neon signs that Something. Is. Wrong. don't even raise a flag? I call bullshit.

As to Jensen's 'answer' in that ET spoiler: could he be be less enthusiastic?! Jensen loves to tease, and IMO the fact he has nothing to say, not even a glint in his eye, tells me there is nothing good for him (or Dean) coming up.

Edited November 30, 2018 by gonzosgirrl

[catrox14]

51 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Seriously, if Dean doesn't connect his 'spells' and the Djinn's reactions to him, or at least be suspicious of them, then he's dumb as a bag of hammers

My only hope is that Dean doesn't remember these moments because Michael doesn't want him to remember thus he won't be dumb about it.  But if he does know he has these spells and he does remember the Djinn's reactions then I agree. I will say this.  Nick seemed to not remember when he did that Lucifer finger snap thing with Cas back in the premiere.  Since Nick woke up Lucifer (LOLOLOLOLOL GTFO OUTTA HERE, WRITERS) in the Empty, we know Lucifer was gone or at least mostly gone so it's AAPTSD in Nick so maybe, if Michael really did vacate Dean, then it will be AAPTSD for Dean....but then that requires that the show be consistent and it actively ignored that Rowena already knew about Jack.....sooooo.   yeah....

[Aeryn13]

The spoilers already say Dean doesn`t say anything because he doesn`t want to be a burden so yeah, he knows and keeps it to himself. My only hope is that isn`t going on for too long. Because seriously, why would he not get suspicious he is being Mandchurian Candidated here? The Djinn thing, I can understand though the ep didn`t even clarify if he told anyone offscreen or not. Because it would indicate a good thing, a useable thing even if Dean is a) immune and b) might get monsters to talk, pretending to be Michael. But having dizzy spells? 

And yes, Jensen didn`t look enthusiastic. He would be up to episode 300 or 13 in reading scripts so IF anything even happens than further out than that. 

I was happy to read at least that the bunker might get a bit emptier, as per Scriggia. So, the AU-hunters won`t leave per se but be more permanently "deployed". Translation: they will be around offscreen and we`ll probably get phone call check ups and stuff but they will largely be out of sight. 

Am dismayed that they are draggging the woobie dying Jack out. For what purpose? Noone dies permanently on this show unless the actor really, really doesn`t want to come back.  The promo did spoil who the unexpected ally is - Lily Sunder. That`s obscure but okay. So whose life will that dealing with her affect? Jack is a given. Who is person number 2? I doubt either of the brothers to be honest. Which would leave Cas. 

[Myrelle]

I wish I could get or become even a little bit excited by some of this stuff, but nothing is going to work for me in that regard, and at this point, except actually seeing something truly worthwhile for Dean/JA and his connection with Michael and that sl on-screen.

All of the lying  and half-truths from Dabb and co. has even taken the fun out of looking/waiting for spoilers for me-and tbh, that, more than anything else has been an aid in helping me to let go of a lot of the show-related fandom stuff lately.

I mean because of these asinine writers I'm much more interested in what's going on with JA on the social media front than Dean, at this point in the season and the entire series, for that matter. 

Edited November 30, 2018 by Myrelle

[ILoveReading]

I don’t know how to link in my phone but they posted the annual cast photo on Twitter. Mark P has a leather jacket on, just like the one Lucifer wears. He’s definitely coming back. 

Edited December 1, 2018 by ILoveReading

[Lemuria]

ILoveReading, I’m not sure if this will work:

Cast and crew photos

Apparently, neither Misha nor Alex are in the photos and there’s some complaints about that, which I can understand as it’s supposed to be the season 14 cast and crew. 

[ILoveReading]

Can Jack just die already.  I'm so tired of this drama. 

[BabySpinach]

33 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

Can Jack just die already.  I'm so tired of this drama. 

Oh great, once again Dean's gotta suppress and put his feelings aside to be there for someone else. And be lectured about it, as if he hasn't been doing just that his entire life. I thought Cas was Jack's dad, too? What's he harping on Dean for?

Can Michael get his feathery ass back into the narrative, already? Save us from the soapy mopies, PLEASE.

[Aeryn13]

This is getting mega-weird. Up until two episodes ago Dean and Jack had the least emotionally close relationship out of all of them. And now everyone acts as if Dean is THE one thing in the universe Jack can`t live (or die) without. What the hell? 

[ILoveReading]

35 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

This is getting mega-weird. Up until two episodes ago Dean and Jack had the least emotionally close relationship out of all of them. And now everyone acts as if Dean is THE one thing in the universe Jack can`t live (or die) without. What the hell? 

Its because the writers know Jensen is the best one of all at these emotional scenes. 

[Myrelle]

42 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

This is getting mega-weird. Up until two episodes ago Dean and Jack had the least emotionally close relationship out of all of them. And now everyone acts as if Dean is THE one thing in the universe Jack can`t live (or die) without. What the hell? 

This seems So. Friggin. Stupid.

And Lame, too.

47 minutes ago, BabySpinach said:

Can Michael get his feathery ass back into the narrative, already? Save us from the soapy mopies, PLEASE.

This X 10!...*HUGE! SIGH*...

5 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

Its because the writers know Jensen is the best one of all at these emotional scenes. 

ITA.

At this point, they likely know that he's the only one of three who could even come close to selling this lame-ass and SO! OTT soapy writing of theirs.

Edited December 5, 2018 by Myrelle

[Bobcatkitten]

That is like a 10 second scene that really said nothing. Why are they choosing promo material so badly?

[Aeryn13]

Maybe we all missed a shadow-Season 13.B where Jack started writing love poems to Dean and held up a boombox outside his room in the bunker.  And Dean waffled endlessly about his feelings on the matter. Hey, if they wanted to, they could have asked Julie Plec for advice, she would have helped them make it a love triangle with Cas. Maybe a quadruple with Sam. 

 

Quote

That is like a 10 second scene that really said nothing. Why are they choosing promo material so badly?

For all we know it could be the most exciting scene in the episode. 

Though this week I gotta give the cake to the DCTV crossover promotion. They seriously put the same clip at the end of every single show involved. Which sucks for someone who watches all of them. 

Edited December 5, 2018 by Aeryn13

[catrox14]

My only hope is that this is setting up a big Michael!Dean reveal.i mean if I really pushed myself to find it, I could make a case for this having been Michael pretending to be Dean to get close to Jack so that Dean does some crazy sacrifice to save Jack and lo and behold it's Michael. I mean I'm sure that isn't going to happen  but it's what I'm stupidly hoping for.

[BoxManLocke]

2 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

This is getting mega-weird. Up until two episodes ago Dean and Jack had the least emotionally close relationship out of all of them. And now everyone acts as if Dean is THE one thing in the universe Jack can`t live (or die) without. What the hell? 

 

100% this.

What's crazy is that all they had to do was carry Michael/Dean as the main plot to the midseason finale, and use Jack's illness as the B-plot and Sam could have taken the emotional toll.

Dean fans get what they want, Jack's reverts back to a supporting character as he should, and Sam gets to meaningfully interact with a character with whom he shared a genuine bond not so long ago. Everybody would have been happy.

This goddamn show writes itself, but PTB have been in their own little bubble for a couple of years now.

 

1 hour ago, ILoveReading said:

Its because the writers know Jensen is the best one of all at these emotional scenes. 

 

Jensen can act his ass off as much as he wants to, it's still going to be shallow and feel forced when the writers are acting like they're fucking soulmates all of a sudden.

Once again this is just about getting some sweet sweet fangirl tears without putting any work that's not very short-term. It's all these writers can achieve nowadays.

[ZennyKenny]

9 hours ago, ILoveReading said:

Can Jack just die already.  I'm so tired of this drama. 

"Next week, on a very special episode of Soapernatural: Dean gets scolded for feeling his feelings wrong. Again."

[devlin]

Just wondering with luci not being dead and coming  back from the empty, does this mean that the empty is full of dead angels waiting to come back? If this is the case I would much rather it if  Zachariah came back. He was 10 times the character luci is and played by an actor who acts circles around Pellegrino 

[catrox14]

So Michael's been in that werepire chick all along if the preview means a damn thing.

And no follow up on Dean's visions in tonight's episode....so what the fuck.

I give up. 

[ahrtee]

21 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

So Michael's been in that werepire chick all along if the preview means a damn thing.

I thought we assumed that when someone pointed out that the character was returning.

Question:  do angels have to get consent from monsters before possessing them? Michael apparently didn't need permission to force-feed them his grace.  And monsters don't seem to follow human rules, because dead monster souls don't go to heaven (or hell) but to Purgatory, even "good" monsters like Lenore and Benny. :)  (once upon a time I thought how interesting it might be if they had demons possessing vampires or werewolves.  They'd be SuperVillains...)

And who's running Purgatory now that Eve's dead?  (not to mention most of the Alphas).  

Inquiring minds want to know.  Sort of.  

Edited December 7, 2018 by ahrtee

[BoxManLocke]

30 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

So Michael's been in that werepire chick all along if the preview means a damn thing.

I don't even recognize her. What episode is she from ?

 

Also, when you're struggling to set up a villain, the one thing you should avoid doing is constantly switching the actors playing that character. There's already very little to hold on to when it comes to Michael's story. Different interpretations only muddle things up even further. The only good and tangible thing Michael had going for him was Jensen.

 

I think the crazy personality of The Empty was a stupid choice, but at least it's recognizable. Michael is nothing but a name they've been trying to scare us with for over a season.

Edited December 7, 2018 by BoxManLocke

[Bobcatkitten]

I saw this on Twitter. So Christian is available and THEY DON'T CARE. I mean if Nick's suit can be alive why can't Michael's? Why do I need another rando playing Michael. 

 

[Aeryn13]

Bucklemming doesn't drool over the actor. So they don't think of him.

And why did Michael possess that werewolf? She was such a random character in the episode. If anything I would have thought he`d possess the Pack Alpha. In that vein, why did he pick a female vessel? I know we have seen Cas in a female vessel before and other angels have switched, too, but they usually seem to go with a certain type of gender.

Also, in the prome you can see the brothers and Cas and Jack walking down some hallway. Cas clearly gets beat up, as per the promo and his bloodied face in that other snippet. At that point it is only Sam, Cas and Jack who are standing there, presumably confronting Michael. Where the hell did Dean disappear to? 

He featured the least in the promo and yet we know from shooting Jared missed the most time for the episode while Jensen and Misha filmed some stuff. 

 

edit: Watched the promo again and found Dean in that other clip, he is the figure in front of them, facing them. I thought it was the Werewolf chick but she has notable earrings on in all her clips. And I think the figure is Dean. Too broad-shouldered for Garth from what I can see. Everyone is wearing those light-coloured jackets so a bit hard to tell. 

Now the pose is weird if it is Dean because it looks confrontational. It is, however, not from the same clip as when Sam says "Michael" because the background doesn`t match. When he says it, there is writing on the wall behind him, when they are standing opposite Dean, there is a wooden door behind them.

No idea what`s gonna happen here. 

Edited December 7, 2018 by Aeryn13

[catrox14]

9 hours ago, ahrtee said:

I thought we assumed that when someone pointed out that the character was returning.

I think there was spec it would be a flashback vs her being Michael's vessel.   It's all such a waste.  I mean why give us Dean's wonky vision and not have it followed up on.   I won't be surprised if we find out Michael!Dean had sex with the werepire woman and that's how he possessed her LOL especially if it's a Buck Lemming episode.  

That said, maybe she ended up being the angel/werepire super monster Michael wanted and maybe with any luck it will still be revealed that he's still in Dean or watching through Dean.  I just don't want Michael!Dean to be completely over cause what a lame ending for it if he just ....left.  But now that I think about it, i think it is Berens writing....so basically I have no theories at all other than I expect more Jacky Sue, more Dean and Sam doing....something... and a big dose of Kaia Sue.    

[Aeryn13]

Quote

 But now that I think about it, i think it is Berens writing....so basically I have no theories at all other than I expect more Jacky Sue, more Dean and Sam doing....something... and a big dose of Kaia Sue.    

Yes, it is Berens. And I did expect a big dose of more KaiaSue but so far the actress isn`t listed, not mentioned in the press release nor shown in the promo. Provided Dean is the one who goes after the spear (while Sam goes after another weapon that suddenly comes up), she is the one who had it last. 

Or is the werewolf chick not supposed to be Michael in the promo but super-dupered up due to his experiments and she took the Alpha position and tries to get werewolfs under her thumb now? Enter Garth and the likes.

The promo is cut so it could be either way. Sam clearly sees Michael but the promo could be misleading in terms of the vessel. I know the woman`s eyes flashed but that seems to be something the new supermonsters do. The Djinn did.    

So far the press release doesn`t fit with the promo and the promo doesn`t fit with the things we know from shooting. 

Even if Michael was in Dean somehow in this ep, it would mean he leaves again in the mid-Season Opener at the latest because of upcoming filler eps. At this point, I`d prefer for Michael to not show himself bodily, other than speak through Dean and remain connected to Dean.  

[Myrelle]

2 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

Even if Michael was in Dean somehow in this ep, it would mean he leaves again in the mid-Season Opener at the latest because of upcoming filler eps. At this point, I`d prefer for Michael to not show himself bodily, other than speak through Dean and remain connected to Dean.

ITA with this sentiment, but we know that Dabb said that Sam can't face Michael while he's in Dean(his perfect vessel) because Michael would obliterate him, so IF Michael is still in Dean or returns to him(more likely this, IMO-again IF it happens-which I highly doubt it will) it won't be in the scene where Sam meets him-and I'd bet the ranch that THIS will be the "big" fight scene that JP spoiled at one of the cons-and that there will only be Sam, Jack, Cas, and Michael as the combatants.

I'm fully expecting Dean to be little more than an on-looker in this next episode, tbh.

It's what he's been for most of the first half of this season to me so I doubt that these asshat writers will change that part of it up at this point.

Edited December 7, 2018 by Myrelle

[ahrtee]

1 minute ago, Myrelle said:

ITA with this sentiment, but we know that Dabb said that Sam can't face Michael while he's in Dean(his perfect vessel) because Michael would obliterate him, so IF Michael is still in Dean or returns to him(more likely this, IMO-again IF it happens-which I highly doubt it will) it won't be in the scene where Sam meets him-and I'd bet the ranch that THIS will be the "big" fight scene that JP spoiled at one of the cons-and that there will only be those two combatants.

OTOH, since we now know that the archangel blade won't kill the vessel (even when stabbed in the heart!) there shouldn't be any hesitation about having someone stab Michael-in-Dean.  Of course, they'd need an archangel to wield the blade...

My head hurts.

[Myrelle]

They could make it more interesting for Dean if Dean somehow "dies" in this one only to be resurrected by Michael; or for Dean to show some kind of supernatural self-healing ability even.

[Myrelle]

1 minute ago, ahrtee said:

OTOH, since we now know that the archangel blade won't kill the vessel (even when stabbed in the heart!) there shouldn't be any hesitation about having someone stab Michael-in-Dean.  Of course, they'd need an archangel to wield the blade...

My head hurts.

Mine too.

And I thought further on just Sam and Michael as the only two combatants and even then, Michael should still just be able to snap his fingers and make anyone and everyone go poof!

So it's more likely to be the three of them vs Michael on second thought and, again, IMO. 

[juppschmitz]

Just now, Myrelle said:

Michael should still just be able to snap his fingers and make anyone and everyone go poof!

Michael could just turn his back and roll his eyes and make everyone go poof! But, well, that happened in episodes 1 and 2 and none of the writers would remember anyway.

[ahrtee]

Just trying to think through what the writers have given us to work with:

Only an archangel can kill another archangel (and only with an archangel blade?  Though the "spear" apparently works as well.)  Apparently it can wound an archangel when wielded by a "lesser" being, but can only another archangel (or Prince of Hell) use it to kill?

The only archangels left in play are AU Michael and OriginalMichael, still stuck in the cage.  There's also Luci in The Empty and Jack without his grace.  

Kaia has a spear, and IIRC the Winchesters have a broken spear.  

So...how can they kill Michael?  (none of the options are appealing, are they?)  

Can they send him back to the AU?  They'd need archangel grace to open another rift, EXCEPT....(ta-DUM):  Kaia can apparently open rifts at will and wherever she feels like going.  

So...we can have circular Catch-22-type things (let a bad archangel possess you in order to kill the worse archangel, and then have no archangels left to get rid of the bad one...) or stick the worse archangel in the AU and probably use one of the heroes to put him there, which means they have to get back to the AU to rescue him and thus allowing the bad one to escape again, and...

Crap.  Or (more likely) they'll pull something completely out of their asses that has never been mentioned before.  

I'm going to leave things here for others to theorize.  And remember that canon only lasts as long as a writer wants it to, so nothing I said above may actually be true.

[ILoveReading]

Berens is the worst writer on staff. 

7 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

In that vein, why did he pick a female vessel?

It's Berens.  He's all about THE GURHL POWWA. 

If Michael is still engaging in hand to hand combat it strengthens my conviction that Jensen indeed remind Dabb that as an arch angel Michael has powers. 

2 hours ago, Myrelle said:

And I thought further on just Sam and Michael as the only two combatants and even then, Michael should still just be able to snap his fingers and make anyone and everyone go poof!

Maybe Sam can stomp his foot and yell boo and Michael will run screaming.

[Lemuria]

That line about Sam not being able to confront Michael when Michael is wearing his perfect vessel because Michael would decimate him makes absolutely no sense. Michael should be able to decimate Sam even if he’s wearing a lesser vessel.

Unless, of course, Sam is being worn by another power. Lucifer?  (Which would seriously make me wonder about the state of Sam’s brains.) OG Michael?  (Which would piss me off no end.)

[Aeryn13]

I think this quote from Dabb only relates to the first two episodes of the Season when the reasonable expectation would be for Michael!Dean to have some encounter with Sam. This was his excuse for why it didn't happen.

But obviously they will have no baring on the future as it has already been spoiled that Sam encounters some version of Michael in whomever. And of course Sam won't be killed for the same reason the Winchesters regularly are in the vicinity of powerful hostile beings and survive. Last Season Sam was killed by some random AU-vamps and not Lucifer. Noone is getting killed by power players.

[ILoveReading]

23 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

Yes, it is Berens. And I did expect a big dose of more KaiaSue but so far the actress isn`t listed, not mentioned in the press release nor shown in the promo. Provided Dean is the one who goes after the spear (while Sam goes after another weapon that suddenly comes up), she is the one who had it last. 

I don't think this matter since she wasn't listed for episode 3.  The only reason I knew she showed up was because it was mentioned at comic con. 

 

23 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

The promo is cut so it could be either way. Sam clearly sees Michael but the promo could be misleading in terms of the vessel. I know the woman`s eyes flashed but that seems to be something the new supermonsters do. The Djinn did. 

I saw this pic posted on twitter.

 

It looks like that could be Dean confronting Sam, Jack and Cas. 

My guess is that Michael doesn't need Dean's permission to possess him again, and it seems the fight is between the four of them.   I'm guessing TMNS* will jump through a window or break down the door in a slow motion combat roll and save them all again without a hair out of place.  Michael will take off again.  Then there will be some "spell" pulled out of someone's posterior to ward Dean so Michael can't possess him again.  Then that will be the end of Dean's part in the story.  And when its time for OG Michael to enter the picture Dean won't be able to say yes.   So it will be Jacky-Sue or Sam.

I'm guessing Dabb told Jensen that Michael Dean would last until episode 9. 

Edited December 8, 2018 by ILoveReading

[Aeryn13]

I think it`s Dean they are facing but undecided if Michael!Dean or whatever-wrong-with-Dean. They are clearly facing off so it`s not like Dean is just a couple steps in front of them and has turned around for whatever reason. It`s not blocking for a conversational scene, it is a confrontation, what with the "buzzuh" faces on the three guys.

And if it were just Dean, that would make no sense. Even if he did something they disapproved of, they would be standing closer and sport those snotty-disappointed looks Dean often gets. Injured Dean would make no sense because they`d be rushing to his side. Dean being held hostage would make sense but there is clearly no person behind him holding him at gun/knife-or whatever point. 

So the most logical conclusion would be something with Michael. But is it truly possession or is it just Michael speaking through Dean somehow? They are making up cockamamie rules all the time so I do expect something possession-ish. 

I seriously hope they don`t have another lame, nonsensical fight scene. And especially that Kaia!Sue`s poser ass stays far, far away from the proceedings. Maybe the fight scene is jacked-up monsters against the guys (minus Dean who is already somewhere else at this point). 

 

edit: I like that in the clip Dean is in front. Berens is a superleader!Sam stan so this was probably directorial choice. Can someone make out what Dean is holding in his hand? Cas has an angel blade, Sam carries a duffel bag (likely containing whatever weapon he was after) and Dean carries a weapon also. Not a gun, doesn`t look like an angel blade. It looks wooden and not metallic and longer than any knife/blade. Could be the spear with the majority hidden behind his back. 

It is obvious he will be the one going after the Spear in the episode and if so, he will be the one interacting with KaiaSue. If he has the spear in the final confrontation, that would mean that KaiaSue won`t turn up. Hopefully.  

Edited December 8, 2018 by Aeryn13

[Wateroflife]

Quote

Not a gun, doesn't look like an angel blade. It looks wooden and not metallic and longer than any knife/blade. Could be the spear with majority hidden behind his back.

I think you are right about the spear. If you zoom in on Dean's left shoulder in that gif, you can see something that looks like the bone-shaped end of the spear moving behind his back.

@ILoveReading. I hope you are wrong, but it does really sound like something the writers would do. How can they pull the trigger on Michael!Dean again when we have episode 300 coming up soon. Unless that whole episode is flashbacks?

[Aeryn13]

It is difficult to say. Apparently this wonky vision thing/Michael probably spying on him/though him will continue. It won`t be in every episode and Dean will keep it a secret at first. That all sounded like it played out in the second half. If there was a super-warding spell, this wouldn`t be a thing. 

In general terms, I`d say the fight against Michael goes something like the mid-Season Finale of Season 5:  search for a special weapon (Spear, ? , Colt) - check; getting said weapon from shady character (KaiaSue, Crowley) - check. Now I expect using it against the villain and it doesn`t have the intended effect. We have seen the spear harming Michael but maybe he did something to counteract its use or some mumbo jumbo while it`s no longer an option. 

Now how to bring in any kind of sudden possession? No idea. Michael just randomely jumping back into Dean for a five minute confrontation scene isn`t beyond these writers. But why would Michael do it? Just to say "muhaha, I can do this whenever I want"? And how do you conclude this, he just lets them all go and fucks off? The logistics don`t make sense. 

Oh, and of course there was this stuff about Michael presumably wanting God`s attention back and that`s why he is doing it all. Yeah show, no villain ever had that motivation. Like ever. How original. 

And who is werewolf chick talking to when she says "all this death and destruction, all on you"? Dean? More blaming him as is Berens` wont?

Can`t even begin to speculate how Nickifer fits into it. Unless spoiler tumblr is wrong about him being in the episode. 

[catrox14]

2 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

Oh, and of course there was this stuff about Michael presumably wanting God`s attention back and that`s why he is doing it all. Yeah show, no villain ever had that motivation. Like ever. How original. 

Wait, what?  I missed this spoiler. So it's like Amara 2.0? Or Lucifer 2.0? I'm confused!