S06.E23: For Better or Worse

[TWP]

 I will say that I've vented to them about all manner of things wrong with Revenge, OUAT, and Nashville and that, yes, it did seem they addressed issues there.  In those cases, they seemed to know what the problems were, though, and the surveys were specifically addressing those issues. This was more general than some others have been, but they seemed to focus specifically on the last half of the season, so I'll bet they're aware of the response the finale got.

Yes, they were apparently directly targeting certain aspects of the show that they were already going to fix and just wanted confirmation from the audience.  I suspect though, that if you introduced something they weren't interested in fixing, they wouldn't fix it.  I think these questionnaires are about making fans think they're having an impact on their show.  They are at least as much about perception as about the reality that viewers have input.  I would say, waste of time, unless it makes you feel better to vent.

[tljgator]

I didn't say that I expected anything to change, and, yes, it did make me feel better (that's precisely what my original post says). I just thought folks might want to know that the studio was bothering to ask questions.

[TWP]

That's good.

 

 

On another subject, the question at ABC.com and TWOP about Nathan and Stana not doing joint interviews. (Moderators, do yo suppose we could get a post-season thread so I can be on-topic?)  I unfortunately can't post this over at TWOP (too late to join the site), so I'm posting here.

 

Someone posted at ABC.COM suggesting that the reason Stana and Nathan don't do joint interviews is that they are repelled by each other.  In response, someone who was an obvious ABC insider, posted that they observed several shooting days and also went to Paley and the cast has great chemistry.  The reason why Stana and Nathan couldn't do a joint interview at Paley (even though they did individual interviews there) was because they were tired.  The reason no joint interview or pic of just the two of them at the 100 episode party -- even tho ABC press requested it -- was due to similar problems, I guess.  But they're great on the set, they finish each others' sentences, yata, yata.

 

Someone at TWOP suggested that even if they hate each other, they are actors and maybe they should pretend to enjoy each other at least for interviews.  Someone else suggested they don't need to do joint interviews this far in a show run, that the joint interviews were just about getting the show off the ground...even though Patrick Dempsey and Ellen Pompeo were still doing joint interviews in Season 5 (and maybe longer) in their vastly more popular ABC show.  Someone in turn suggested that Stana/Nathan don't have anything to say in a joint interview this far in the show, anyway, so why do it? (But what that means is the show has gotten bland too!)  And why pretend to like each other if they don't?

 

I think for many of us, the reason that their not doing joint press together sticks in our craw is lack of trust for Marlowe.  Season 7 brings actor contract renewal. Because of the perceived animosity between the two actors (which I think is real), it's at least as likely the show will not be renewed as that it will be. If we perceived that the actors had a good relationship (via something that resembled friendship off-screen), the success of the show would be the driving force behind renewal.  But now we have the actors' relationship to consider as well as show ratings when judging the continuation of the show.   And I do think that for whatever reason, the off-screen chemistry between the two actors drives the on screen chemistry.  When they had better off-screen chemistry, they had better on-screen chemistry, for me at least.  And the lack of on-screen chemistry is more than likely affecting show success.

 

I personally question whether I should continue watching a show that's highly likely to end next season and very possibly due to issues with the cast which potentially affect ratings as well....I wouldn't wonder so much with a better show runner.  But putting my satisfaction in a series finale in the hands of the guy who wrote "For Better/Worse"?  It is risky, to say the least.  This is why I question the off-screen chemistry and why I have good reason to.  I do think the ship has sailed now, so doing fake interviews probably wouldn't matter now.  People have ingrained views about how the couple feel and now even if they pretended something different, we wouldn't believe it.  I do not care about the actors' love lives, travel plans, personal projects, etc.  I only care about how the two actors feelings about each other might impact the show I watch.  I've been watching since Season 1, and am seriously wondering it's time to invest my entertainment time in something else.  FBFW was a bit of the nail in the coffin.

 

Anyway, I guess I'm just venting.  Thanks for giving me a place to do so.

[merylinkid]

I heard a rumor that the reason they don't do joint interviews is because of the perception then of them as a "couple."   Apparnetly -- again just rumors I have heard -- Nathan Fillion's significant other has gotten some threats for being with him instead of allowing him to be with Stana.   Some people cannot separate the actors from the role.   If Beckett and Castle are together then anyone dating Nathan or Stana is interfering with that.   Yes there are weirdos like that out there.   

 

Heck, if you read Alison Angrim's autobiography (she was Nellie on Little House), the first and only time she and the actress who played Harriet Olsen did a joint appearance together in costume they were physically attacked by people who hated their characters.   ANd that was the 1970s.   That is why I give some credence to the explanation of why Nathan and Stana don't do joint interveiws.  

[TWP]

I heard a rumor that the reason they don't do joint interviews is because of the perception then of them as a "couple."   Apparnetly -- again just rumors I have heard -- Nathan Fillion's significant other has gotten some threats for being with him instead of allowing him to be with Stana.   Some people cannot separate the actors from the role.   If Beckett and Castle are together then anyone dating Nathan or Stana is interfering with that.   Yes there are weirdos like that out there.   

 

I've heard this ridiculous reason more than once.  If it's truly the reason (and I doubt that it is), then apparently the romantic leads on other shows have more of a backbone? or are better able to take care of themselves?  All the shows have crazed fans. Every single one does. 

 

And if they're that afraid, maybe it's an excellent reason to not have a Season 8, meaning I definitely should stop watching the show.

Edited May 26, 2014 by TVWithPity

[Samantha84]

Nathan and Stana aren't the first actors who's fans think their dating in real life. It's happened and happens to most actors who play onscreen lovers. Is it right or even sane? Nope but it's happened. It's happened/happens to bigger stars than Nathan/Stana w. bigger shows than Castle. Suck it up, do your job, and promote the damn show. 
 

They were specifically asked by a reporter [ the one from OnTheRedCarpet.com; who's has a rapport w. Stana, as he's interviewed her several times] for a joint interview when all the press was there for Castle's 100th episode celebration and they said no! A perfect occasion/time to do a joint interview w. the press. It's ridiculous at this point and only feeds into the rumor that they don't get along. Though w. this past season, who could blame them for not wanting to go out and promote that! 

[GeorgieNY]

Is it possible to start a general discussion folder so that we can talk about the show in general during the hiatus? Also, it would be great if the spoilers and speculation were seperate folders. I try to avoid spoilers but don't mind digging into some speculation. (Though after that finale, not sure how much I will care about either tbh!)

Edited May 27, 2014 by GeorgieNY

[Lena]

Hey everyone! I'm Lena, and I'm new here! I introduced myself back in March over in the introduction thread. I've been a fan of Castle since it's beginning, but I've only been involved with the online "fandom" for about a year. I have migrated over from TWOP. I have read every post over on the Castle thread over there, but I've never posted. I enjoy reading and following the discussion and I hope that when it closes at the end of this month, that the great discussion will continue over here. 

 

I wanted to share my two cents on the finale. I think my opinions are fairly similar to most of the fandom. I did not enjoy it. I went into it "spoiled," so I knew on some level that I wasn't going to be wow'ed by it, but I wasn't expecting to out right dislike it as much as I did. I, like most people here and at TWOP, think the Beckett prior marriage angle was and IS just down right ridiculous. As soon as I read that that was going to be apart of the story line I was hoping that it was going to be either a dream or a joke like many speculated. I find it completely unbelievable that someone who is as intelligent as Beckett (yes, she's done some stupid things, but she is not an idiot) would believe that her marriage wasn't real just because she got married in Vegas. I mean, even Rogan knew they were married and he was a complete moron. Marlowe said he wanted to bring her down a peg and he certainly did that. Not knowing you're married may work for characters like Phoebe from FRIENDS and Penny from TBBT, but it does not work for Kate Beckett. Plus, as many others have mentioned, how she went 13 plus years as a police detective and then a special agent without finding out that she tied the knot, is beyond ridiculous.

 

I mentioned to someone on tumblr that often with TV shows you can suspend reality in order to enjoy a program. Everything can't be perfect all the time, story lines can deviate and have plot holes, etc, but with this finale, IMO, Marlowe asked for his audience to completely disregard six years of character development and backstory. I have no idea how he and the writing team are going to climb their way out of this hole. There is still a big part of me that is hoping that the marriage story line is a dream, but I fear that it is now just apart of Beckett's history and we have to live with this new facet to her character. 

 

Regarding the cliffhanger - I have to say that I'm not that bothered by it. It is pretty cliche to have a main character "die" in a season finale, but to me the prior 38 minutes of shoddy writing was the real problem with this episode. I have to say that I am interested in seeing what they have planned for the beginning of season 7. We know Castle isn't dead. I am hoping that we don't have to have a long drawn out kidnapping arc or having Castle be in "peril" for too long at the start of the season. I guess we'll see in September. 

Edited May 27, 2014 by Lena

[alldressedup]

Question: why was Castle on tour for a Derek Storm book? I thought he killed off that character? Or is Wild Storm about another character named Storm?

[McManda]

Question: why was Castle on tour for a Derek Storm book? I thought he killed off that character? Or is Wild Storm about another character named Storm?

 

Should there be a thread for the Nikki Heat/Derrick Storm books/graphic novels? There's another Nikki Heat in the fall that it might prove useful for.

 

But the short answer is that Castle ressurected Derrick Storm two summers or so ago. He/they(ABC) released 2 novellas at that time and there have been a few books/novellas since then. I don't know much about them; the first 3 Storm novellas were e-books only, and I read the first one and maybe the first half of the second. They're ... not great and I found it hard to get on board with the idea that Castle's characters are so badly named. (The female is named April Showers ... to Derrick's Storm? It got to be a bit too much.) I don't know if they got better. Part of the appeal of the Nikki Heat books were the references to the show - I read the Nikki Heat books knowing that it's supposed to be a character's version of essentially fanfiction and that makes it more enjoyable than reading it like it's the next Harry Potter or something.

[Deeda]

Just to let people know, I've started a general discussion topic for Castle.  So, if you want to talk about things that don't really have to do with Episode 23, or any episode, for that matter, there is a place to do so!

 

How exciting!

[Deeda]

I watched it again, and I am pretty sure that the finale is totally a dream. It has to be. There are so many truly unbelievable things that went on in this episode--one right after another.  It seems that everything stems from from Beckett's insecurities and fears of ALL that could go wrong. If looked at with that premise in mind, the whole episode is pretty hilarious.

 

Making Kate stupid and weak has to be fake.  She 'didn't know the marriage was legal' is too far fetched, since her parents were lawyers and she herself was pre-law.  Not to mention the IRS would have noticed her single filing status.  And the AG office would have totally done a background check and would have wanted to investigate her husband.  She gives all the power to Rogan, and does anything he wants when he won't sign the papers, even breaking into a car!  That would never happen for reals.  Tough Kate Beckett would tell him to do it and he would!

 

Particularly amusing was the demise of the ugly dress. Lanie said a 'pipe broke' at Kate's apartment. They only show the dress for a moment, but it seems to be a SEWER pipe that broke all over the dress, because it looks way darker than just water.

 

Everything that happened is too far-fetched, ridiculous, and basically not believable to be real.  It has to be a dream!

[WendyCR72]

It has to be a dream!

 

Maybe it is, maybe it's not. But that would be the height of utter shit-pulled-out-of-Andrew-Marlowe's-ass laziness and ineptitude.

 

That said, however, I hope everyone is preparing themselves for Option #2, that this was NOT a dream, but just fuckery on a grand scale. There's nothing worse in TV land than getting one's hopes up, only to be crushed and ground into dust.

[Deeda]

 

But that would be the height of utter shit-pulled-out-of-Andrew-Marlowe's-ass laziness and ineptitude.

 

No, that would be if Marlowe had the last couple of seasons be a dream, beginning when Beckett fell off the side of the building and was in a coma!

Edited May 27, 2014 by Deeda

[KaveDweller]

Honestly, I don't see it being a dream.  Marlowe was talking a lot about setting up a new mythology in those interviews.  That doesn't sound like someone who is going to make it all not be real.  

 

Unless he actually realizes how upset the fans are and changes his mind.  But I don't think that was the intention.  If the old husband stuff was supposed to be a dream it would have made sense to reveal it as a dream at the end of the episode.  Letting us think that was real all summer is just jerking fans around.  It would be better than what we got, but it still wouldn't be great.

[Samantha84]

It won't be a dream. As stated already Marlowe talked about a new mythology; that doesn't sound like it all will not be real. 

 

Marlowe needs to clean up the crap he's made and has made before he goes into a "new mythology". Why do we need a new mythology? The only writer that handled the JB case perfectly was Will Beall and he left season 3. Marlowe doesn't know when to leave well enough alone. Why can't this show be what it was in seasons 1 and 2; w. the exception of Castle/Beckett together and married?  

 

This show started changing when Marlowe was left to run it by himself [when Rene Echevarria left], in my opinion.

[McManda]

I don't think they wrapped up the JB arc badly.

 

But as far as this sinale being a dream ... Marlowe's changed his plans before. He admitted the Alexis arc didn't go the way he plotted because of fan feedback, nor did the wedding dress drama. Sounds like Marlowe's getting some sort of message.

 

But I don't think he'll go the way of a dream. It's much more likely that he'll have Castle tuck and rolling out of the car, or Castle's dad showing up, or something. Castle will make it and they'll be back to solving crimes, probably with a new big bad and hopefully married, by the end of the the S7 premiere.

[KaveDweller]

I don't see how they can not be married by the end of the premiere (or the second episode, if they do a two-parter again).  It would have to be more contrived than the Lois and Clark frog-eating clone thing.

[Samantha84]

For me Marlowe ruined the specialty of the wedding, the location, the dress, the gift from Martha. It's all marred now. Good if they get married by season premiere end or the next episode but it won't be the same for me. 

[Elysium1973]

Hey guys.

I'm going to confess that I re-watched this episode and it was even worse than I remember. How is that possible? How could this shit show get worse? It can and it did. I felt actually embarrassed for the actors that they had to even say these lines. It's truly cringeworthy.

[schnauzergirl]

I just do not want a Caskett baby to enter the picture ever.  

[Deeda]

I watched it again, and I like it more.  Maybe it's because I already know not to expect a wedding.  I can appreciate how 'out of character' Kate is acting, and Castle's scream, and just all the ridiculous things that happen in the episode.

[Lena]

I just do not want a Caskett baby to enter the picture ever.  

schnauzergirl - I hope they don't go the baby route. As much as I think a Caskett baby would be cute, I think it's something they should save for the end of the series, or at least until the end of season 8 if it goes past next season.

 

I watched it again, and I like it more.  Maybe it's because I already know not to expect a wedding.  I can appreciate how 'out of character' Kate is acting, and Castle's scream, and just all the ridiculous things that happen in the episode.

Deeda - I've watched it again too, and it's was not as annoying the second time around. The little bits of comedy, like Castle's scream, etc, were the best bits of the episode. It doesn't make up for the crap they did to Kate's character for me, but it was nice to be able to appreciate the episode for what little there was in terms of good writing. 

[TWP]

I watched it about a week after it aired, and after being spoiled.  That's how I've come to watch Castle, because I've learned to distrust the show runner so much.  It definitely had it's more funny and entertaining moments and I like the Warehouse 13 guy.

 

Unfortunately, the ep was still full of all that toothpaste that is never going back into the tube.  It's sad and unfortunate, but that's TV for you.  It's also a sign that we TV viewers need to get a flippin' life, LOL. ;-).  We need to turn off the garbage that TV has increasingly become and get some more interesting hobbies.

 

I do not understand why Marlowe incorporated a teaser wedding into the episode.  It would have been so easy to leave it out.  Why not just have the couple go get their marriage license and find out about being already married?  Make the marriage a scam so it wouldn't kill canon, resolve the scam, and then do the car crash cliffhanger on the way to a vacation in the Hamptons.  Nobody would have been mad.  But I guess Marlowe is so desperate for publicity that he competed for the ultimate in darkly complimentary races to the bottom -- worst finale.  Prepare yourself for next year when he'll certainly be vying for the even more special: "worst finale EVER".  He's gotta top himself doesn't he?

 

I do not care if the couple ever gets married.  In fact I'm hoping they break up.  They could have been so great too, but the Marlow curse killed their love.....

[Samantha84]

I haven't watched this episode since the night it aired and I don't plan to. I haven't even watched a Castle episode since that finale. Thanks Marlowe. 

[femmefan1946]

I have always thought the Bobby Ewing in the shower storyline was a cop out but damn if I don't want the opening scene of season 7 to be Beckett waking up and saying "I had the worst nightmare!"

We can find a way to get rid of the dress again somehow.

 

I thought the 'married before' storyline was funny as a story but unbelievable as whatever reality is on TV. So the whole thing being a dream/nightmare reflecting Beckett's fears would be acceptable.

 

But she better wake up next to Bob Newhart.

[KaveDweller]

It would be totally hilarious if Marlowe did an interview where he said, "Okay, everyone hated the finale. That's my bad. But I hear what you're saying and I'm going to undo it by making that episode a dream.  I know it's weak, but just go with it, and then we never have to mention this again."

 

There's no way that would happen though.

[GeorgieNY]

Omg, KaveDweller,

I my respect for MillMar would grow by leaps and bounds if that could ever possibly happen!!

[turnitwayup]

KaveDweller, I so wish that would happen.

[TWP]

It would be totally hilarious if Marlowe did an interview where he said, "Okay, everyone hated the finale. That's my bad. But I hear what you're saying and I'm going to undo it by making that episode a dream.  I know it's weak, but just go with it, and then we never have to mention this again."

 

There's no way that would happen though.

 

It's possible with a less egotistical person, but with Marlowe?  Mr. New Mythology? Mr. Organic Storytelling? Only if the network makes him do it.

[verdana]

 

 

Everything that happened is too far-fetched, ridiculous, and basically not believable to be real.  It has to be a dream!

Or just a really bad nightmare, that was a clusterf**k of an episode and badly written from start to finish. It felt like something Marlowe pushed out at the last minute because he suddenly realised he had another episode he had to give ABC.  

 

I know some fans are assuming that because it was so full of plot holes and utterly ridiculous that there has to be some grand plan behind it all and everything will become clear in the premiere. I doubt that very much, that episode was a case of shitty writing pure and simple and I can't see how they're going to correct any of it or want to for that matter since that would mean owning up to making a cock up and they'll never to that.

[verdana]

Ask Matt: Fargo, Glades Rage (and Other Cancellations), Case Histories at TV Guide.

 

Questions still coming in for Matt about that finale:

 

Question: Why does everyone keep bagging on the Castle finale, saying it was ridiculous and had zero emotional impact? I for one thought Stana Katic did an amazing job in that last scene; her facial expressions alone can bring me to feel that emotion the writers want us to feel. As far as no one believing Richard Castle is dead, obviously, when it comes down to it it's not about whether or not he's dead, its about "Where is Castle?" "Who was in the SUV?" "Did the people in the SUV kidnap Castle or is he passed out in a ditch nearby?" "If he's kidnapped, will they time jump to September and not found him yet?" Those are the questions I have that I believe have set up a great Season 7. I know Caskett is a strong couple and I know Andrew Marlowe will eventually give us a wedding in true Castle fashion and I'm looking forward to that. - Tiffany

Matt Roush: Of course no one was meant to think Castle had been killed. That's not the point. The issue here is that there's only so long many fans will put up with delayed gratification, and while I'm sure you're right that eventually there will be a happy ending and a memorable ceremony of some sort (perhaps not traditional) for Beckett and Castle, this latest bump in the road felt like an unnecessary and cheap twist, and I pretty much have to agree with that assessment.

 

I agree with Matt completely, it felt like a cop out by the writers and a cheap stunt inserted at the end to simply delay the inevitable. 

[Samantha84]

I agree w. Matt as well. It was like, 'let's throw any and eveything out there in order to stop this wedding'.  It was contrived, unbelievable, ridiculous, and a complete cop out! 

 

The writers are back today and I find myself not really excited about that prospect. 

[KaveDweller]

I agree w. Matt as well. It was like, 'let's throw any and eveything out there in order to stop this wedding'.  It was contrived, unbelievable, ridiculous, and a complete cop out! 

 

The writers are back today and I find myself not really excited about that prospect. 

The saddest part is that Marlowe basically admitted that's what they did.  He said they needed something to delay the wedding.  Someone needs to tell him he wouldn't have needed to delay the wedding if he hadn't spent all year planning it.  Just have them decide on a long engagement and then introduce this new mythology crap through a case.  Or have them go to the Hamptons for vacation and kidnap Castle there.  Spending the whole season planning a wedding you had no intention of giving people is just mean.

[Samantha84]

The fact that Marlowe knew the wedding wouldn't happen but spent all season planning it is such bullshit. 

 

At this point I don't give a crap about a wedding or a marriage. Marlowe has tainted and ruined it for me. 

[TWP]

Seriously.  The wedding planning scenes were cringe-worthy and could have been cut.  I see no reason why Marlowe had to even pretend they were getting married this season. The relatively rushed wedding planning may be another sign that Season 7 is the end? Or at least they want the actors to think so.

Edited June 3, 2014 by TVWithPity

[Elysium1973]

Since he's so into making comparisons between Bones and Castle, maybe he should steal another Bones plot line and have Caskett get married in a gorgeous ceremony with their friends and family there, sometime other than sweeps and the finale. I thought that was ballsy and awesome.

Or, hell, I don't know. Just figure out a way to dig yourself out of the well of crap you built for yourself.

[verdana]

The fact that Marlowe knew the wedding wouldn't happen but spent all season planning it is such bullshit. 

 

At this point I don't give a crap about a wedding or a marriage. Marlowe has tainted and ruined it for me. 

Yeah to find out that he knew all along and had no intention of going there made it even worse, admitting you've screwed the fans over all season long shows you the kind showrunner you're dealing with. I agree with KaveDweller the fact he admitted what he had done made me sad for the show and the actors who have to deal with his constant bullshit. I was embarrassed for Stana especially during that scene where Kate has to sit down and admit she didn't know her Vegas wedding was legal. That scene was cringe worthy to watch I can't imagine what it was like for Stana to have to try and sell that crap like she believed it could happen.

 

I still want them to get married but I'm nowhere near as excited about it now as I was in the build up to the finale, when I admit I had convinced myself it was going to happen. Everything looked lovely, we had the build up all season and the time felt right for the characters and now that's all ruined. Whatever they do serve me up as a replacement is going feel like half baked goods and contrived because it should have happened in 6.23. 

 

As for what's going to happen to Castle I really don't care that much right now. I also don't give a toss about any new mythology that Marlowe is going to tease with me with. It's bound to be trite and predictable since it's coming from him. 

It won't be a dream. As stated already Marlowe talked about a new mythology; that doesn't sound like it all will not be real. 

 

Marlowe needs to clean up the crap he's made and has made before he goes into a "new mythology". Why do we need a new mythology? The only writer that handled the JB case perfectly was Will Beall and he left season 3. Marlowe doesn't know when to leave well enough alone. Why can't this show be what it was in seasons 1 and 2; w. the exception of Castle/Beckett together and married?  

 

This show started changing when Marlowe was left to run it by himself [when Rene Echevarria left], in my opinion.

I so wish they could go back to having Caskett behave as they were back in those first two seasons too, seriously how difficult would that be to achieve? That's all they needed to do once they hooked up! Keep the best bits of their teasing and sexy banter and meaningful little moments when they discovered things about each other and then add on to that with their new found physical closeness and love. But no Marlowe had to take it away and replace it with chaste kissing in the dark, hardly any banter, stupid interruptions, slapstick comedy and often boring gimmicky cases. 

Edited June 3, 2014 by verdana

[KaveDweller]

As for what's going to happen to Castle I really don't care that much right now. I also don't give a toss about any new mythology that Marlowe is going to tease with me with. It's bound to be trite and predictable since it's coming from him. 

 

I don't really care what happens to Castle either, mainly because I'm sure he'll be back, and things will be back to normal within a couple episodes.

It's just going to be a time waster to stop the wedding and set up the 2 high-stakes drama episodes we get next season.  No matter what happens, I am just not looking forward to seeing it resolved.  I may be looking forward to what happens after they get back to normal, but that's cause I am an optimist and think we'll get some cute Caskett stuff eventually.  But the explanation of the car fire?  I don't care enough to speculate.

[Samantha84]

ABC Castle account asked the question: what do you miss most about Castle? I think it was meant as in since it's on hiatus,not what's missing from the show, period.  This response summed up my feelings exactly:

What I miss most about Castle? The "in love" Rick Castle, the witty sexy banters between Castle & Beckett. The Caskett spark

[turnitwayup]

I saw that too. So many "everything" suck up replies, but I did see "Beckett's 1 & done" reply and "he and Becca sparing". I loled at the last one cause it was probably autocorrect problem.

[Samantha84]

I saw some of those responses. Rolled my eyes. Perhaps some do feel like the show is great but no show is perfect and this show definitely isn't. It's like some feel like if they criticize it means their not a fan.  I feel the opposite. We all know this show was really good at one time and we all want it to return to that glory. We bitch b/c we care. To suck up and ass kiss to Marlowe and co. does the show a dis-justice. If they don't think anything is wrong they'll never fix it. Just my opinion though. 

[TWP]

We bitch b/c we care. To suck up and ass kiss to Marlowe and co. does the show a dis-justice. If they don't think anything is wrong they'll never fix it. Just my opinion though. 

 

Yep, if it was up to all the Yes-people who accepted any cockamame idea Marlowe dished out, Pi and Alexis would be hearing wedding bells themselves by now, LOL.  And knowing Marlowe, no car accident in that case ;-).  Oh, and Castle and Beckett wouldn't be together yet....whoops, maybe we should shut up because they seemed like more of a couple as a non-couple.

Honestly, I don't see it being a dream.  Marlowe was talking a lot about setting up a new mythology in those interviews.  That doesn't sound like someone who is going to make it all not be real.  

 

Marlowe says all kinds of things in interviews that don't come to pass.  Remember the wedding talk? ;-).

Edited June 4, 2014 by TVWithPity

[verdana]

Marlowe says all kinds of things in interviews that don't come to pass.  Remember the wedding talk? ;-).

True although his supporters would tell you he never technically said there would be a wedding so he wasn't lying to anyone and it's your fault for being naive. Yeah well may be so but the build up had been going on all season long so it was only fair for many to assume there was at least a strong possibility they could get married by the end of it especially given comments about the episode being lighter from cast and crew.  To have that ripped away and in the way that it happened with such an obviously contrived cliffhanger really got fans upset and with good reason.

I don't really care what happens to Castle either, mainly because I'm sure he'll be back, and things will be back to normal within a couple episodes.

It's just going to be a time waster to stop the wedding and set up the 2 high-stakes drama episodes we get next season.  No matter what happens, I am just not looking forward to seeing it resolved.  I may be looking forward to what happens after they get back to normal, but that's cause I am an optimist and think we'll get some cute Caskett stuff eventually.  But the explanation of the car fire?  I don't care enough to speculate.

Best case scenario for me is they'll have found him in the premiere and he'll have forgotten all about his "trauma" by 7.02 and they're back to fun and fluff at least for a while which is what Castle does best. As for the new mythology Marlowe is on about I couldn't care less and if it's anything like the old one it will be a once or twice a season event. 

[justanoldDJ]

https://twitter.com/AndrewWMarlowe  And so the New Mythology begins.  He is proud of the writers on June 6 when they just got back to work?  Excited about everything they talked about?  I think Season 7 is in trouble already unless Marlowe gets shipped somewhere and loses his passport for about 8 months.  I am really interested in seeing what ANY writer, even the good ones can do with the pile of crap left for them by Organic Andrew and Respect the Process Terri

[Hipshooter]

For Better or Worse has to be in the top 3 worst episodes ever. I put it at #1.

 

Yes! It is an abomination to God and man and all the foolishly loyal fans that have stuck with this show  form the beginning. I absolutely refuse to re watch it..I still can't believe we were subjected to this steaming pile. I always heard that you can't make peanut butter out of pure shit and this episode is unadulterated proof of that.

The only thing keeping me from saying what I really feel is purely out of respect for all the loyal fans that still harbor salvation for our DD through the change in show runners. We can only hope D.A. gets free reign and MilMar are banished to whatever "new projects" ABC can dream up for them.

[WendyCR72]

We can only hope D.A. gets free reign and MilMar are banished to whatever "new projects" ABC can dream up for them.

 

But by all reports, this isn't the case and DA just seems to be show runner in name only or taking up Marlowe's slack.

 

Unless this new series based on Storm novels comes into play, maybe...

[Hipshooter]

But by all reports, this isn't the case and DA just seems to be show runner in name only or taking up Marlowe's slack.

 

Unless this new series based on Storm novels comes into play, maybe...

Bummer Dudette !

[BkWurm1]

Rewatching.

 

You know, despite the silly and the tropey and the over the top, I still found this episode entertaining as hell.

 

I still find Castle and Beckett cute and shipworthy, still adore Alexis and Martha, still think Lanie is underused, still find the bromance between Ryan and Esposito wonderful, and still even find Gates the perfect blend of supportive and scary. 

 

I like this show. 

 

No, I still LOVE this show.

 

There are times when I'm tempted to criticize it for what its never tried to be, but for what it is, it does a rock solid job and more than anything, it makes me happy to watch it. 

 

I can't wait for next week.  I'm betting Kate will get her chance to say her vows in a much more intimate setting, whatever (and whenever) that will be.  :D

 

In the meantime, I'm ready to enjoy the ride. 

Edited September 16, 2014 by BkWurm1

[WendyCR72]

I can't wait for next week.  I'm betting Kate will get her chance to say her vows in a much more intimate setting, whatever (and whenever) that will be.  :D

 

Make that two weeks! A sneak peek of Forever is on next Monday night.