"Oh HELL No!": TV Moments That Make You Irate

[magicdog]

On 3/5/2023 at 12:29 PM, Bastet said:

they were out of good ideas, so wrote an "it was all a dream" episode.

But that's just it.  Did it HAVE to be a dream episode?  The idea itself was solid enough (kid has divorced parents and needs to bond with Dad who needs to try harder).  Maybe the Jonathan as dog part was silly, but assuming the episode wasn't changed due to Victor French's health (be died before the episode even aired!), it could have been done differently.  Then again, the show was pretty sappy even then!

[Grrarrggh]

I just watched the end of the NCIS episode "Love Thy Neighbour" and remember all the reasons I have hated this programme since about series 6. Gibbs and Co bring in the suspect they think is a serial killer. While Gibbs and Bishop interrogate him Jack is watching behind the two-way mirror going on and on about how it definitely is him because he's too cool and only a true psychopath would act like that. Then Gibbs pointlessly (and if this programme existed in a world with logic and laws, stupidly) pulls out a knife and violently stabs it into the table. He walks out of the room and they all congratulate themselves on catching this obviously dangerous killer. Until Casey gives them info that it's not the man, it's his wife that is the serial killer. And nothing else is said about Jack and Gibbs 100% surety that Mr (not Mrs SK) is obviously a psychopath. They were 100000% wrong, but nothing more is said. Ugh. Once again, I can't stand these people and their writers.

[Blergh]

2 hours ago, Grrarrggh said:

I just watched the end of the NCIS episode "Love Thy Neighbour" and remember all the reasons I have hated this programme since about series 6. Gibbs and Co bring in the suspect they think is a serial killer. While Gibbs and Bishop interrogate him Jack is watching behind the two-way mirror going on and on about how it definitely is him because he's too cool and only a true psychopath would act like that. Then Gibbs pointlessly (and if this programme existed in a world with logic and laws, stupidly) pulls out a knife and violently stabs it into the table. He walks out of the room and they all congratulate themselves on catching this obviously dangerous killer. Until Casey gives them info that it's not the man, it's his wife that is the serial killer. And nothing else is said about Jack and Gibbs 100% surety that Mr (not Mrs SK) is obviously a psychopath. They were 100000% wrong, but nothing more is said. Ugh. Once again, I can't stand these people and their writers.

I agree but at least the writers DID acknowledge that the protagonists WERE wrong that one time- unlike on L&O:SVU in the course of over 20 seasons which somehow Benson NEVER gets called out for being wrong even once (much less that the whole show has been perp porn  for years despite its handwringing claims of wanting to help victims).

[Grrarrggh]

21 minutes ago, Blergh said:

I agree but at least the writers DID acknowledge that the protagonists WERE wrong that one time- unlike on L&O:SVU in the course of over 20 seasons which somehow Benson NEVER gets called out for being wrong even once (much less that the whole show has been perp porn  for years despite its handwringing claims of wanting to help victims).

But the writers only acknowledged it to themselves, and barely. The characters went on acting as if they'd made no mistake whatsoever. If Kasie hadn't done her job properly, Gibbs and Jack and Co would have happily put an innocent guy in prison. Everybody kept acting as if G/J & Co were always right. After such a HUGE and obvious example of their egregiously bad skills I would be seriously questioning everything else they say. No one does. 

Edited March 12, 2023 by Grrarrggh

[Spartan Girl]

The end of the latest season of You pissed me off, but to be be fair, I’m probably at fault. I said over and over again that I wish Joe would just be honest about being a monster instead of acting like he’s a misunderstood tragic hero. Cue the monkey’s paw. 

Spoiler

He’s finally embraced his darker half, framed poor Nadia for his many crimes, and has been rewarded by getting away with everything AGAIN, and now he has Kate, who is rich willing to overlook and cover up his many crimes. She’s not even crazy like Love, she just doesn’t care that he kills people. So now he’s even more evil and dangerous than before.

There better be one more season because this CANNOT be how it ends.

Edited March 15, 2023 by Spartan Girl

[Grrarrggh]

On 3/14/2023 at 8:11 PM, Spartan Girl said:

The end of the latest season of You pissed me off, but to be be fair, I’m probably at fault. I said over and over again that I wish Joe would just be honest about being a monster instead of acting like he’s a misunderstood tragic hero. Cue the monkey’s paw. 

Just the fact that there IS a programme like You on the air pisses me off. Why is the media glorifying men like that?

[Spartan Girl]

The Simpsons episode where Lisa takes up babysitting and Bart winds up sabotaging her business first by acting like a horrible little brat, then injuring himself. The ending pissed me off on two levels:

1) Bart is easily forgiven after offering a halfhearted apology—not by clearing her name or doing anything whatsoever to make it up to her

2) Dr. Hibbert had the gall to beg Lisa to babysit for him even after he publicly blamed her for Bart’s injuries and ruined her reputation 

[Wiendish Fitch]

1 hour ago, Spartan Girl said:

The Simpsons episode where Lisa takes up babysitting and Bart winds up sabotaging her business first by acting like a horrible little brat, then injuring himself. The ending pissed me off on two levels:

1) Bart is easily forgiven after offering a halfhearted apology—not by clearing her name or doing anything whatsoever to make it up to her

2) Dr. Hibbert had the gall to beg Lisa to babysit for him even after he publicly blamed her for Bart’s injuries and ruined her reputation 

I have never, ever, ever hated Bart more than in that episode. I actually cheered out loud when he injured himself. Karma, bitch!*

*Full disclosure: I was in middle school when I saw that episode for the first time (and last, because it's so awful it's not worth a rewatch), so my reaction was a little more acceptable  back then than if I were to see the episode at my current ripe old age.

[Spartan Girl]

27 minutes ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

I have never, ever, ever hated Bart more than in that episode. I actually cheered out loud when he injured himself. Karma, bitch!*

*Full disclosure: I was in middle school when I saw that episode for the first time (and last, because it's so awful it's not worth a rewatch), so my reaction was a little more acceptable  back then than if I were to see the episode at my current ripe old age.

I really don’t know what Homer and Marge were thinking, leaving Lisa in charge when they knew full well Bart would cause trouble.

And it was that kind of crap that put me firmly on Lisa’s side years later when she finally snapped and put a restraining order on Bart, even though other viewers apparently thought Lisa had gone “too far.” Oh no, going “too far” would have been dumping the little jerkass at the quack Dr. Nick’s and never look back.

[Wiendish Fitch]

14 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

I really don’t know what Homer and Marge were thinking, leaving Lisa in charge when they knew full well Bart would cause trouble.

100% agree. It never occurred to them that Bart, the oldest sibling, might deeply resent being looked after by his younger sister? Don't get me wrong, I'm firmly Camp Lisa now and forever, and Bart was completely in the wrong, but sibling relationships are fraught enough as it is, especially at that age. I don't care how good a babysitter Lisa is, I don't care what an irresponsible little monster Bart is (and how theoretically right it might be to have Lisa babysit him), when you upset the sibling dynamic like that, you're just begging for trouble!

[Spartan Girl]

1 hour ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

100% agree. It never occurred to them that Bart, the oldest sibling, might deeply resent being looked after by his younger sister? Don't get me wrong, I'm firmly Camp Lisa now and forever, and Bart was completely in the wrong, but sibling relationships are fraught enough as it is, especially at that age. I don't care how good a babysitter Lisa is, I don't care what an irresponsible little monster Bart is (and how theoretically right it might be to have Lisa babysit him), when you upset the sibling dynamic like that, you're just begging for trouble!

Wouldn’t have been a better idea to just tell Bart that they thought they were old enough to handle themselves for the night—and then secretly tell Lisa that she was in charge so try to keep Bart under control? Bart probably still would have caused trouble, but at least that way  Lisa might have had the mental advantage over him.

I expect this kind of shortsightedness from Homer, but Marge? I mean, this was back before her flanderization, she ought to have known better.

[Egg McMuffin]

Marge and Homer should be investigated by CPS for leaving ten year old, an eight year old, and a toddler home alone for the night.

[Spartan Girl]

1 hour ago, Egg McMuffin said:

Marge and Homer should be investigated by CPS for leaving ten year old, an eight year old, and a toddler home alone for the night.

That would made made more sense instead of the whole town turning on Lisa for supposed negligence.

[Egg McMuffin]

It’s one of the reasons I don’t watch the show anymore: they’ve frozen the kids’ ages, yet they have stories built around them as if they were teenagers. I always thought they should have started gradually aging them years ago. Not that one season needed to equal one year of time. But I thought that tween and teenaged Bart and Lisa would open up some desperately needed story potential. New teachers, new friends, new situations. Not to mention being able to use Maggie more.

[magicdog]

On 3/23/2023 at 12:55 PM, Egg McMuffin said:

It’s one of the reasons I don’t watch the show anymore: they’ve frozen the kids’ ages, yet they have stories built around them as if they were teenagers. I always thought they should have started gradually aging them years ago. Not that one season needed to equal one year of time. But I thought that tween and teenaged Bart and Lisa would open up some desperately needed story potential. New teachers, new friends, new situations. Not to mention being able to use Maggie more.

Not to mention how many times they retcon the eras Marge and Homer met/dated!  It went from the early 70s - to the 90s !! 

 

For anyone who has ever had a "Hell no!" for bratty little DW on the PBS kid's show, Arthur, may I introduce you to this guy!

Edited March 25, 2023 by magicdog

[Egg McMuffin]

There was a Flintstones Christmas Carol special in the 90s. Pebbles and Bamm Bamm were still toddlers, yet the voices for Fred and Wilma sounded like they were in their 80s. The Simpsons reminds me of that.

[Bethany]

On 3/23/2023 at 3:55 PM, Egg McMuffin said:

It’s one of the reasons I don’t watch the show anymore: they’ve frozen the kids’ ages, yet they have stories built around them as if they were teenagers.

The last Simpsons episode I watched in real time was the one where Bart is about to get married (??) and the girl is pregnant (obviously, thankfully, by someone else).  Anyway that was it for me.  I'll still watch the older episodes that I love but that episode really ruined The Simpsons for me.

[Spartan Girl]

“Mom and Pop Art” is one of my all-time favorite Simpsons episodes, but as usual, the fly in that soup is Marge. When Homer’s barbecue disaster is hailed as abstract art, Marge spends the whole episode being a jealous bitch because art is her thing and she acts like Homer stole it from her on accident.

Never mind the fact that it was her choice to give up painting in the first place because she was so thin-skinned that her art teacher didn’t like it. Or that she never kept up with her art after she painted Mr. Burns in the buff, even after RINGO STARR praised her portrait of him—never tried to earn any success after that. She’s not called out on any of that. Nope, just blame Homer for stealing/ruining her dreams as usual, that’s far easier than admitting that she never had the gumption to follow through on things not related to being a housewife.

Edited March 31, 2023 by Spartan Girl

[Spartan Girl]

Well, just when I think The Simpsons couldn’t piss me off me any more, last nights episode had Lisa join a rabid fandom group of her favorite singer in torturing Homer just because made a mean comment about said singer. Now, Lisa has been Flanderized just as much as everyone else, but I never thought she would harass her own father over some pop star she never even met.

Oh, it gets worse. Bart joins in on for the lultz—I’d say it was a new low, but sadly for him, it’s just a new middle—and even Marge sells him out by unwittingly blabbing all her grievances about their marriage when the pop singer invites her out for dinner, and the singer turns it into a music video. And REEKS of hypocrisy considering how much grief she gave him over his blabbing in “Secrets of a Successful Marriage.” The fact that she was drunk is no excuse when she knew the singer and her fandom had basically declared war on him and should have seen it for the trap it was. 

Homer should have just filed for divorce and left right then and there. But instead he makes a music video expressing how much they hurt him…and only Lisa apologizes for the hell she put him through. Not Bart or Marge, just Lisa.

Fuck this show, seriously.

 

Edited April 26, 2023 by Spartan Girl

[magicdog]

Here's a new Hell No:  From Highway to Heaven it's "Heaven Nose, Mister Smith" (1988).

The plot:  Jonathan and Mark go to salvage a rich man's marriage.  He married the maid about a decade earlier and she is hoping to start a family, he wants to just run (apparently he took up the hobby and decided to run in a local race).  A complication is that his father (who died the day of the wedding while trying to warn him he was marrying the wrong woman) has come back as an angel - in the form of a butler.  He is determined to break up and marriage and have him marry his son's childhood sweetheart (old money and "well bred").  Jonathan was sent to stop the butler from doing this and get the marriage back on track. 

Then the race comes, and due to a fall, he breaks his toe so he essentially can't run much less win.  Jonathan guilts him into running and finishing the race otherwise he'd be a quitter!  He does so, and stumbles over the finish line to find his wife there waiting for him.  They reconcile, Butler Angel Dad realized his son married the right girl after all, and goes back to heaven.

I was so peeved at the son being guilted into running while on a broken toe!  It's not like he skinned his knee!  Serious issues could develop running on a broken bone.  Second, I think it would have been much more interesting if the story had proven the father was right!    What a different episode it could have been if the maid was looking for a meal ticket, married the guy, enjoyed spending his money, etc. while his true love really was the other woman!  

The intro to the episode was also annoying, as Jonathan was driving the car, when a divine superior (played by Bob Hope!) decide to take him up to Heaven then and there!!  Hello??  The least he could have done was either wait until Jonathan stopped the car or had the car drive itself until he returned.  He nearly caused an accident!

[Blergh]

10 hours ago, magicdog said:

Here's a new Hell No:  From Highway to Heaven it's "Heaven Nose, Mister Smith" (1988).

 

The intro to the episode was also annoying, as Jonathan was driving the car, when a divine superior (played by Bob Hope!) decide to take him up to Heaven then and there!!  Hello??  T

Having the late Bob Hope actually play 'a divine superior' is an automatic (if not literal) Oh, Hell No! for me!  Even though a lot of his behind the scenes creepiness,joke-stealing and cheapness didn't become public knowledge until after his passing, IMO, he always had that smarmy creep vibe, IMO. Moreover and I don't think ML having worked in California for the previous 30-odd years would have been totally genuinely ignorant of said creepiness!

[magicdog]

5 hours ago, Blergh said:

Having the late Bob Hope actually play 'a divine superior' is an automatic (if not literal) Oh, Hell No! for me! 

Methinks Bob Hope's relationship with NBC (the network on which HTH aired) since his radio days was a big reason.  He may have had a special coming up as well at the time.  I'm sure ML (who had a skeleton closet of his own) knew some of the skeleton's in Bob Hope's closet as well.  

[Blergh]

34 minutes ago, magicdog said:

Methinks Bob Hope's relationship with NBC (the network on which HTH aired) since his radio days was a big reason.  He may have had a special coming up as well at the time.  I'm sure ML (who had a skeleton closet of his own) knew some of the skeleton's in Bob Hope's closet as well.  

I think you could be right (and I don't put Mr. Hope past knowing about ML's closet skeletons and perhaps the two comparing notes about said closets). However, IMO, given Mr. Hope's somewhat full closet, it seemed more than a bit mawkishly hypocritical to cast him as that!

[Spartan Girl]

Family Matters: Myra can’t go to senior prom because she comes down with pneumonia, and Laura and Steve wind up going together. Now I’ve already ranted about how the show screwed over Myra to hamfist the Steve/Laura endgame. But it really bugs me how came off as Steve more upset that he might have to miss prom than the fact that his girlfriend was seriously sick.

Don't get me wrong, I’d understand the disappointment. But Myra had been looking forward to the prom too, and she was going to miss it because she was sick!

You guys remember how in Saved By the Bell, Kelly was going to miss prom because she gave up her money to help her unemployed dad, and when Zack found out, he made up their own little prom just to make her feel better?

It is a sad, sad day when even Zack fucking Morris is a better boyfriend than Steven Q. Urkel. But I’m sure he would have done some similar gesture if it had been Laura in the hospital with pneumonia. 🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄

Edited May 1, 2023 by Spartan Girl

[Blergh]

And I hated how the audiences were expected to think Zack and Urkle were adorable and entitled to bulldoze all the other characters' lives  instead of considering them the creeps they were!

[Spartan Girl]

On 5/1/2023 at 7:00 AM, Blergh said:

And I hated how the audiences were expected to think Zack and Urkle were adorable and entitled to bulldoze all the other characters' lives  instead of considering them the creeps they were!

I didn’t think Steve was as bad in the beginning, perhaps because he was just a kid and we tend to be more forgiving of kids…but maybe that was part of the problem, because once he hit puberty his antics where Laura was concerned only got more obnoxious and at times bordered on sexual harassment.

I wish back in the first season or so, Estelle* had gently taken him aside and told him that badgering Laura and wearing her down was not going to endear him to her, and that he was too young to obsess about one girl. Then the showrunners could have shit that shut down and just refocused Steve as hanging around the Winslows because his own parents neglected him** and not because of Laura.

*Whatever issues I have with Steve, I did like the relationship he had with Estelle.

**Also his parents were awful.

Edited May 5, 2023 by Spartan Girl

[Blergh]

11 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

I didn’t think Steve was as bad in the beginning, perhaps because he was just a kid and we tend to be more forgiving of kids…but maybe that was part of the problem, because once he hit puberty his antics where Laura was concerned only got more obnoxious and at times bordered on sexual harassment.

I wish back in the first season or so, Estelle* had gently taken him aside and told him that badgering Laura and wearing her down was not going to endear him to her, and that he was too young to obsess about one girl. Then the showrunners could have shut that shut down and just refocused Steve as hanging around the Winslows because his own parents neglected him** and not because of Laura.

*Whatever issues I have with Steve, I did like the relationship he had with Estelle.

**Also his parents were awful.

If Urkel had just met Grandma Winslow outside the Winslow Home and left everyone alone, that would have been fine.

However, even from the start, he made himself a pest to everyone else in the family who clearly didn't want him around. And, it seems he blew off Grandma Winslow's well-intended advice.

Yes, his own (unseen) parents were no prizes but even that didn't justify him constantly imposing himself on the other Winslows much less vandalizing their stuff. As per the show, they may have been slightly neglectful (as in wanting as little to do with him BUT making sure he was provided for and thoroughly educated) but not to the point where outsiders like the Winslows needed to intervene. Hence, his lousy homelife was NOT the Winslows' problem but Urkle made sure to impose it on them!

And I say all the above as someone who'd been considered a bit nerdy as a preteen- yet still didn't consider him as sympathetic as the showrunners attempted to compel!

[Spartan Girl]

There was one joke in the first season about his parents only feeding him once a day, hence him going to the Winslow’s for something to eat. Nevertheless, all valid points, @Blergh

1 hour ago, Blergh said:

And, it seems he blew off Grandma Winslow's well-intended advice.

 

Well, all she ever actually told him was “Give Laura time, she’ll come around” which  was well-intended but not the same thing as leaving her alone.  Because that only validated his idea that if he kept on trying, he’d eventually win her—which was NOT the right way to do it.

And in fairness, he never vandalized the house on purpose, those were (mostly) accidents.

My point is the writers could have let Steve be in the show without turning him into a repellent hypocritical jerkass. Heck, maybe there WOULD have been a good way to make Steve/Laura happen if he’d just started the show as her nerdy best friend instead of a stalker (and left Myra out of the mess completely). But they didn’t do any of that, so that was what we were left with.

Edited May 5, 2023 by Spartan Girl

[Blergh]

FWIW, I don't believe that most of Urkel's so-called 'accidents' WERE entirely accidental. Note his shtick was 'Did *I* do that?' instead of 'I'm sorry I did that' and rarely if ever seemed to compensate the Winslows for the damages- despite quickly proving easily capable of earning a large income!

[Spartan Girl]

1 hour ago, Blergh said:

FWIW, I don't believe that most of Urkel's so-called 'accidents' WERE entirely accidental. Note his shtick was 'Did *I* do that?' instead of 'I'm sorry I did that' and rarely if ever seemed to compensate the Winslows for the damages- despite quickly proving easily capable of earning a large income!

And eventually it changed into "Look what you did."

This reminds me of another episode that irked me: the clip show where they all go to the shrink to tell Steve exactly how much he drives them crazy. At first he's in complete denial ("You mean you were SERIOUS?!"), but after they recount all the flashbacks, he's shaken. Then of course Harriet brings up all the good things he's done for them (all the times he saved Carl's life, etc), all is forgiven and the status quo is maintained.

It was such a lost opportunity for them to say: "Yes, you have done a lot of good things for us, which we are extremely grateful for, but if you want to keep being a part of our lives, then you need to start respecting our boundaries, especially Laura's, and give us space. And please stop bringing over your inventions because they always wind up destroying our house."

You know what they say: sometimes, the best apology is changed behavior.

[andromeda331]

11 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

And eventually it changed into "Look what you did."

This reminds me of another episode that irked me: the clip show where they all go to the shrink to tell Steve exactly how much he drives them crazy. At first he's in complete denial ("You mean you were SERIOUS?!"), but after they recount all the flashbacks, he's shaken. Then of course Harriet brings up all the good things he's done for them (all the times he saved Carl's life, etc), all is forgiven and the status quo is maintained.

It was such a lost opportunity for them to say: "Yes, you have done a lot of good things for us, which we are extremely grateful for, but if you want to keep being a part of our lives, then you need to start respecting our boundaries, especially Laura's, and give us space. And please stop bringing over your inventions because they always wind up destroying our house."

You know what they say: sometimes, the best apology is changed behavior.

That would have been really nice and it would have made the show better. 

[Yogisbooboo64]

The Cosby Show

I hated Denise…the kind of hate where you want to smack the television!  Along with Theo, she was selfish AF yet got away with it due to her being ‘free spirited’.  FOH!!

Anyway, there are three Denise episodes that are hard for me to watch….

Denise:  The Saga Continues

This heiffa comes home with a husband and stepdaughter and as her MO expects her parents to bail her out.  If I were Cliff and Clair, I would have paid for a one-year lease at Sondra and Elvin’s apartment building, filled their fridge with food, given a hearty Mazel Tov then gotten the fuck outta dodge!  Oh, and when she chastised them ‘for being rude’ to their new son-in-law?  Chileeee!

Denise Kendall, Navy Wife

Her selfishness knows no bounds in this eppy….because she is afraid of having to care for her husband and stepdaughter (like a frickin’ wife!), she ‘forgets’ to send an agreement letter that would have had the Kendalls moving into an apartment on the base.  Martin handled her stupidity better than I would have; I would still be cussing her dumbass out.

Grampy and Nu-Nu Visit the Huxtables

All because of a misunderstanding by Martin, Denise assumes that her mother-in-law, WHO NEVER GOT TO KNOW HER, can’t stand her. 

UO, but I was never a Clair fan….I thought she was pompous and hated the way she would treat Cliff on occasion.  Once Clair finds out about Lorraine from Denise, she goes into full pomposity mode.

Why have Denise, Martin and Olivia leave so she could talk to Lorraine alone?  Why didn’t she kick everyone out but Denise so that the two of them could speak with Lorraine and straighten things out? 

[Dr.OO7]

17 hours ago, Yogisbooboo64 said:

Denise Kendall, Navy Wife

Her selfishness knows no bounds in this eppy….because she is afraid of having to care for her husband and stepdaughter (like a frickin’ wife!), she ‘forgets’ to send an agreement letter that would have had the Kendalls moving into an apartment on the base.  Martin handled her stupidity better than I would have; I would still be cussing her dumbass out.

Selfishness, stupidity, and cowardice. She KNOWS she didn't send in the housing request, yet she keeps her mouth shut during the whole drive to the base and lets Martin look like an idiot in front of his SO and only then does she speak up.

The Cosby Show really ruined Denise's character. She was a free spirit, but she was INTELLIGENT. They turned her into a complete moron.

On 5/5/2023 at 7:21 AM, Spartan Girl said:

didn’t think Steve was as bad in the beginning, perhaps because he was just a kid and we tend to be more forgiving of kids…but maybe that was part of the problem, because once he hit puberty his antics where Laura was concerned only got more obnoxious and at times bordered on sexual harassment.

That's EXACTLY the problem. Then those kids grow up into obnoxious teens/young adults/adults and their parents have the nerve to act shocked and confused as to how that happened.

After the Parkland shooting (where one of the victims was a girl he'd been harassing for months), a woman described a conversation she'd had with her nephew, who'd been turned down by a girl he asked out:

Aunt: You know what to do now, right?

Nephew: Yeah, keep trying.

Aunt: NO. She gave you her answer. LEAVE HER ALONE.

She said he was completely shocked because NO ONE had ever told him that before, then ended her post with a very emphatic "TEACH YOUR BOYS".

Something has to counteract the myriad of TV/movie examples of stalking a girl eventually working out for the best.

[Dr.OO7]

On 5/5/2023 at 12:10 PM, Spartan Girl said:

Yes, you have done a lot of good things for us, which we are extremely grateful for, but if you want to keep being a part of our lives, then you need to start respecting our boundaries, especially Laura's, and give us space. And please stop bringing over your inventions because they always wind up destroying our house."

I hate that episode where he reveals to a locker room full of Eddie's friends that Eddie's a virgin.

Aside from the fact that he had no business even KNOWING this--he learned this from EAVESDROPPING on a private conversation between Eddie and Carl--he had no business telling everyone else. I'm surprised Eddie didn't blast him for doing that.

I hate the Designated Hero trope--person is lauded as a hero even though they're just as bad as the villain, if not WORSE, and I think Urkel's a prime example of that.

[Spartan Girl]

1 hour ago, Dr.OO7 said:

I hate that episode where he reveals to a locker room full of Eddie's friends that Eddie's a virgin.

Aside from the fact that he had no business even KNOWING this--he learned this from EAVESDROPPING on a private conversation between Eddie and Carl--he had no business telling everyone else. I'm surprised Eddie didn't blast him for doing that.

I hate the Designated Hero trope--person is lauded as a hero even though they're just as bad as the villain, if not WORSE, and I think Urkel's a prime example of that.

Indeed. His big self-righteous speech in the locker room about respecting women in that episode rang false, since respecting women means actually listening to them and not stalking them. And his attitude back in that season was that he’d keep chasing Laura whether she liked it or not and Myra should just be happy that they’re dating. Respecting women my ass.

The episode where Laura gives up going to Harvard despite all the hard work she did to get in because the Winslows sadly couldn’t afford it makes me sad AND angry, because in hindsight that was the beginning of the downward spiral that led to the abominable finale. Laura becomes disillusioned with her good girl status and starts rebelling in a quarter life crisis, winds up getting drunk at the frat party and winds up kissing Steve… and just because he’s wearing different clothes and has always been “there” for her, all of a sudden she’s in love with him—enough to go to Polkapalooza and crazy dress-up dates, which was something the Laura of old NEVER would have done. She ends the show as nothing more than Urkel’s trophy.

How romantic. NOT!!!

God, I wish the show had just ended when Steve made a Stefan clone. Or even with that silly time-traveling pirate episode. Both were ridiculous, but they still would have been MARGINALLY better endings than that shitshow final season.

Edited May 10, 2023 by Spartan Girl

[Dr.OO7]

3 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

Indeed. His big self-righteous speech in the locker room about respecting women in that episode rang false, since respecting women means actually listening to them and not stalking them. And his attitude back in that season was that he’d keep chasing Laura whether she liked it or not and Myra should just be happy that they’re dating. Respecting women my ass.

Remember that scene where a gang member was making advances to her and kept trying to touch her even though she explicitly said "Don't touch me?" Urkel angrily slapped his hand away, snapping "The lady asked not to be touched."

Yeah, the lady has also been asking you to LHTFA for several years, so. . .

I hate--with ANY show--the way stalking behavior is considered romantic when it's one of the main characters, but dangerous when it's someone else.

[Mabinogia]

45 minutes ago, Dr.OO7 said:

I hate--with ANY show--the way stalking behavior is considered romantic when it's one of the main characters, but dangerous when it's someone else.

So much this it should be shouted from the rooftops. Stalking behaviour is NEVER romantic. It is creepy, it is threatening and it is dangerous. 

 

6 hours ago, Dr.OO7 said:

Aunt: You know what to do now, right?

Nephew: Yeah, keep trying.

Aunt: NO. She gave you her answer. LEAVE HER ALONE.

She said he was completely shocked because NO ONE had ever told him that before, then ended her post with a very emphatic "TEACH YOUR BOYS".

It is heartbreaking, and explains soooo much, that boys are taught to be persistent in romantic pursuits. Good for Auntie for telling him the right way to behave. If someone is not interested in you, find someone who is. I despise the trope that if you keep asking someone out eventually they will give in. No, and if they do, it isn't because they suddenly like you, it's probably because they are afraid if they don't go out with you, you will kill them and wear their skin as a suit. (okay, slight exageration, they'd probably just stuff you and use you as a no longer living doll. (eeeew I need to get off this train of thought before it crashes.) Boys, men, take no for an answer, and know that relationships are so much more fun when the other person actually likes you. 

[Egg McMuffin]

17 hours ago, Dr.OO7 said:

The Cosby Show really ruined Denise's character. She was a free spirit, but she was INTELLIGENT. They turned her into a complete moron.

I couldn’t agree more. And the destruction of the Denise character began in season 1, with the sudden appearance of eldest daughter Sondra (in the pilot, the Huxtables explicitly state they have four children, not five). Dull, superfluous Sondra got the intelligence as the eldest, responsible daughter, so they made Denise ditzier in response to that.

[kathyk24]

I think Bill Cosby made Denise dumb to get back at Lisa Bonet for starring in Angel Heart.

[Blergh]

On 5/11/2023 at 9:41 AM, kathyk24 said:

I think Bill Cosby made Denise dumb to get back at Lisa Bonet for starring in Angel Heart.

It may have been done for more sinister reasons. Zoe Kravitz has said that her mother will NOT talk about Cosby to her.

[magicdog]

On 5/11/2023 at 7:41 AM, kathyk24 said:

I think Bill Cosby made Denise dumb to get back at Lisa Bonet for starring in Angel Heart.

Understandably at the time he thought it would be a bad reflection towards the show (and Cosby by extension).  He generally tried to keep his public image clean and that included his TV children.  IIRC those two were at odds a lot before getting booted to "A Different World".  I think the actress' pregnancy pushed it to the edge.

[Dr.OO7]

On 5/10/2023 at 5:31 PM, Mabinogia said:

Boys, men, take no for an answer, and know that relationships are so much more fun when the other person actually likes you

That's the key thing that I've never understood with both fictional and real life examples of stalking. Why are you wasting all this time and energy on someone who has explicitly stated that they don't like you?

Three months into the year that I was stalked by an ex, I wrote him a letter in response to his latest love letter, making it abundantly clear that I wanted him to LMTFA and that his behavior was upsetting me. A few days later, my mother called to tell me that he's shown up at my house (I was away at college) with my letter in hand, hysterically wailing "What does this mean?!", as if I hadn't been completely clear.

For every woman who's been through this, there's a moment when it goes from annoying to scary, and that was it for me. I remember thinking "Oh, my God, I'm never going to get rid of this guy." 

I wonder how many TV writers look back and cringe at the kind of things they've written and wonder how much of a bad influence they've had on people 

[Spartan Girl]

49 minutes ago, Dr.OO7 said:

That's the key thing that I've never understood with both fictional and real life examples of stalking. Why are you wasting all this time and energy on someone who has explicitly stated that they don't like you?

Three months into the year that I was stalked by an ex, I wrote him a letter in response to his latest love letter, making it abundantly clear that I wanted him to LMTFA and that his behavior was upsetting me. A few days later, my mother called to tell me that he's shown up at my house (I was away at college) with my letter in hand, hysterically wailing "What does this mean?!", as if I hadn't been completely clear.

For every woman who's been through this, there's a moment when it goes from annoying to scary, and that was it for me. I remember thinking "Oh, my God, I'm never going to get rid of this guy." 

I wonder how many TV writers look back and cringe at the kind of things they've written and wonder how much of a bad influence they've had on people 

I’m so sorry you had to go through that. I would have been scared out of my mind.

I think the exact moment Urkel’s behavior crossed a serious line was when he started following Laura and Ted on their dates. That was when they set him up with Myra to get him off their backs and it still didn’t work.

Of course, he never got called out on any of that, and yet when Myra pulled the same stunts years later, Urkel treated that as some large Moral Event Horizon and treated her like the evil crazy ex girlfriend.

Edited May 13, 2023 by Spartan Girl

[Dr.OO7]

1 hour ago, Spartan Girl said:

Of course, he never got called out on any of that, and yet when Myra pulled the same stunts years later, Urkel treated that as some large Moral Event Horizon and treated her like the evil crazy ex girlfriend.

That's what infuriates me the most about the Stalking Is Love trope--the blatant double standard that when a woman acts like this, she's a nutcase, but when a man does it, he's a hero. 

Like on "Wings":

Joe's old crush locking him in a basement and declaring that his and Helen's upcoming wedding is "OUR wedding!" and actually making him act one out?

She's crazy.

Funny, a year prior when Joe basically trapped Helen in an elevator and declared that she couldn't marry her boyfriend because "That's OUR marriage!", we were all supposed to swoon at how romantic it was.

I can tell you right now, I didn't find it romantic when my ex capped off a year of harassment by showing up at my house uninvited and basically held me prisoner for almost three hours while he tried to browbeat me into marrying him. The fact that I'd spent the entire previous year repeatedly telling him to LMTFA was completely irrelevant to him.

1 hour ago, Spartan Girl said:

I’m so sorry you had to go through that. I would have been scared out of my mind.

Thank you.

I was.

To this day, everytime I hear about some poor girl or woman killed by a man she had the audacity to rebuff--read the webpage "When Women Refuse"--, aside from being sad/angry, I think about how fortunate I was to not have ended up like them.

Back on topic:

I HATE the way cop shows treat IA like they're scum and have no business investigating them. They wouldn't be investigating you without good reason, jackass.

Edited May 13, 2023 by Dr.OO7

[Blergh]

14 hours ago, magicdog said:

Understandably at the time he thought it would be a bad reflection towards the show (and Cosby by extension).  He generally tried to keep his public image clean and that included his TV children.  IIRC those two were at odds a lot before getting booted to "A Different World".  I think the actress' pregnancy pushed it to the edge.

FWIW, Zoe Kravitz was born after her parents Lenny and Lisa Bonet had been married an entire year.

Hence, considering how Cosby's glaring ugly shadowside  that has since emerged re how he admitted in court to having drugged then raped at least one woman, forgive me for not buying into the claim of him  trashing Miss Bonet's character on his show solely due to his feeling morally offended over her having performed in an intense movie role then later getting married before bearing  a child- a year later.

Edited May 14, 2023 by Blergh

[magicdog]

11 hours ago, Blergh said:

FWIW, Zoe Kravitz was born after her parents Lenny and Lisa Bonet had been married an entire year.

I don't even remember when Kravitz and Bonet married or how long before she got pregnant although I could see it if the character of Denise was not married (yet) and the actress getting pregnant during production.  That means they marry the character off or play "hide the belly" until the end of the pregnancy.  

Much of what I do remember was from ET reports and tabloid coverage at the time.  I have no doubt there were backstage shenanigans between the two (perhaps a personality conflict or something similar).

[Mabinogia]

13 hours ago, Blergh said:

Hence, considering how Cosby's glaring ugly shadowside  that has since emerged re how he admitted in court to having drugged then raped at least one woman, forgive me for not buying into the claim of him  trashing Miss Bonet's character on his show solely due to his feeling morally offended over her having performed in an intense movie role then later getting married before bearing  a child- a year later.

See, I totally buy that he would be the kind of asshole who puts a different set of standards on young women than on himself and would totally punish a young woman for daring to do a "smutty" film and then get pregnant when her character isn't meant to. If I've learned anything about The Cos, it's that he is a controlling, domineering asshole who doesn't believe in the rights of young women to live how they choose. 

[Bruinsfan]

Joss Whedon flipped his lid over Charisma Carpenter getting pregnant without his "permission," and she was a married woman in her early 30s who'd already had two demonic pregnancy storylines on his show that were accepted just fine by the audience. Convicted serial sexual assailant Bill Cosby gets no benefit of the doubt from me in any conflict with any woman.

[Dr.OO7]

2 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

See, I totally buy that he would be the kind of asshole who puts a different set of standards on young women than on himself and would totally punish a young woman for daring to do a "smutty" film and then get pregnant when her character isn't meant to. If I've learned anything about The Cos, it's that he is a controlling, domineering asshole who doesn't believe in the rights of young women to live how they choose. 

Even before the "Cosby's a rapist" stories came out, I'd heard about his ill treatment of Bonet and remembered being very angry that he thought he had any right to be pissed off at how she was living her life, something that was none of his business. 

[paulvdb]

On 5/13/2023 at 7:37 PM, Spartan Girl said:

I think the exact moment Urkel’s behavior crossed a serious line was when he started following Laura and Ted on their dates. That was when they set him up with Myra to get him off their backs and it still didn’t work.

Of course, he never got called out on any of that, and yet when Myra pulled the same stunts years later, Urkel treated that as some large Moral Event Horizon and treated her like the evil crazy ex girlfriend.

I think I can only remember one show that actually had a stalkerish character acknowledge their bad behavior and change it. On the Nickelodeon show Bella & the Bulldogs one of the male characters was acting like that towards one of the female characters who was not at all interested in him. In an episode in the second season he ended up on the other side of this with a girl who was interested in him and that made him realize his own bad behavior.