S08: All Stars

[Whimsy]

Here is your Survivor S8 topic.

[fishcakes]

Bringing this over from the Borneo thread:

19 minutes ago, simplyme said:

And if that's true, that money is well deserved, because that was handled really horribly.  They treated it like it was a joke and she was overreacting by being upset, yet in most (all?) US states it is illegal to rub up against someone in that manner without consent.  You can't punch someone, but Hatch got away with that. It was bs.  *gets off her soapbox*

I agree that Sue was entitled to money damages and I hope she got a decent settlement out of it. As for treating it like a joke, I think it was only Rupert, Tom, and Kathy who acted like assholes about it. After she left, Rupert and Tom were singing "Ding Dong, the witch is dead" and whooping it up, and Rupert was pontificating about how Sue was faking how upset she was specifically so she could sue someone. Rob was smiling at their jackassery, but didn't seem to be joining in. Amber and Alicia looked really uncomfortable with their celebrating and Alicia gave a pissed-off confessional saying she thought the guys were being "crummy," which made me love her a little because I agreed and also who even says "crummy" anymore? Meanwhile on the other tribe, Kathy gave the most self-involved confessional ever, saying how she didn't like Sue for bringing Kathy into her "circle of hate" and how Sue needed to "contain her emotions." (Then at the next reward challenge, Kathy sobbed and wailed like a spoiled brat because her tribe lost a food reward.) Shii Ann also did a confessional where she tried to give Richard the benefit of the doubt about his intent, but she didn't minimize Sue's feelings at all, and since she had said she didn't see what happened, I think that was fair of her.

As for the show runners, Jeff seemed surprised and genuinely at a loss when Sue was yelling at him and quit the game, and I think he handled it as well as he could. It does make me mad though that Richard was a candidate for HvV and wasn't on only because of his legal problems, and that he'll probably be brought back in a future season. The guy's a criminal and a sociopath and his 15 minutes should have been over years ago. I know Survivor has an interest in whitewashing his behavior because he's so closely associated with the show, but I think it would be smarter to try to distance themselves from him.

[LadyChatts]

Rich is a has been legend.  He'll get his ass handed to him if he ever returns.  Yet, I also think he'll return again.

The E! channel featured the Sue/Rich moment on one of their 'outrageous reality show moments' shows once, and Jenna Lewis was interviewed.  Actually, I think Gervase or someone that wasn't on AS was interviewed, too, but I don't know why they would be giving their two cents.  Anyway, Jenna said she was trying not to laugh when Sue was going off and thought she was being over dramatic.  This from the woman who made a sex tape and leaked it with her quickie marriage husband, then pretended she had nothing to do with it, but kept telling people where they could find it online.  So Jenna's blurb about that wasn't surprising.

Sue seems to have disappeared off the Survivor radar.  That moment is one of many why I have no desire to ever watch this season again.  Such a crappy season all around.  You can tell that Jeff was still finding his Survivor groove back then, because I think he would have handled it differently if it happened today.

[Lamb18]

So this incident happened in the All Star season. I've been watching for it in season 1. Is this the same Richard and Sue?

[ForeverAlone]

I tend to think that Sue did settle with CBS privately, which if so, is certainly understandable. She didn't file any public lawsuit, and Jeff really glossed over everything at the reunion. 

[ljenkins782]

5 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

So this incident happened in the All Star season. I've been watching for it in season 1. Is this the same Richard and Sue?

Yes, same people but on a second season. 

Quote

As for treating it like a joke, I think it was only Rupert, Tom, and Kathy who acted like assholes about it. After she left, Rupert and Tom were singing "Ding Dong, the witch is dead" and whooping it up, and Rupert was pontificating about how Sue was faking how upset she was specifically so she could sue someone. Rob was smiling at their jackassery, but didn't seem to be joining in. Amber and Alicia looked really uncomfortable with their celebrating and Alicia gave a pissed-off confessional saying she thought the guys were being "crummy," which made me love her a little because I agreed and also who even says "crummy" anymore? Meanwhile on the other tribe, Kathy gave the most self-involved confessional ever, saying how she didn't like Sue for bringing Kathy into her "circle of hate" and how Sue needed to "contain her emotions." (Then at the next reward challenge, Kathy sobbed and wailed like a spoiled brat because her tribe lost a food reward.) Shii Ann also did a confessional where she tried to give Richard the benefit of the doubt about his intent, but she didn't minimize Sue's feelings at all, and since she had said she didn't see what happened, I think that was fair of her.

Kathy was the queen of hypocrisy in that season. She talked out of both sides of her mouth the entire time and truly seemed to believe everything that she was saying no matter how much it didn't add up. Truly insufferable and only overshadowed by Lex who did all the same stuff times 2. 

[enlightenedbum]

@LadyChatts

Responding to your Jenna thoughts from S1 in here: Jenna played All-Stars exactly right for that version of the game.  Create a couple of arbitrary boots early that are not you, build a solid alliance, get to the final immunity challenge against two people the jury is annoyed by.  Just lifted her foot.

[LadyChatts]

8 hours ago, enlightenedbum said:

@LadyChatts

Responding to your Jenna thoughts from S1 in here: Jenna played All-Stars exactly right for that version of the game.  Create a couple of arbitrary boots early that are not you, build a solid alliance, get to the final immunity challenge against two people the jury is annoyed by.  Just lifted her foot.

See, I just don't get the logic of targeting the winners so early (and only because they won).  However, it clearly didn't backfire on her.  And I guess considering some of the winners out there, it probably wasn't a bad idea to go after the likes of Tina and Ethan.  I considered them more of a threat than someone like Rich.  I will say that I would have respected a win from her a lot more than Amber.  It seemed like she had a lot of things go right for her, which no doubt helped her make it through, but she didn't seem to just sit back and wait for things to happen, either.  I can give her credit for at least trying to play a different game and learning.  Though I'm still not her biggest fan from her AS stint.  She's an interesting one for me!  I'd actually like her to play again, though I doubt it'll ever happen.  But I'd like to see her play the game now as it's evolved, because I think she would at least try to adapt, and not just stick with the old school way.

[ljenkins782]

16 hours ago, enlightenedbum said:

@LadyChatts

Responding to your Jenna thoughts from S1 in here: Jenna played All-Stars exactly right for that version of the game.  Create a couple of arbitrary boots early that are not you, build a solid alliance, get to the final immunity challenge against two people the jury is annoyed by.  Just lifted her foot.

Yeah, I think that was a solid strategy as well. As for the logic of targeting winners, that early in the game, you don't have that much ammunition to use to convince people to target someone. The argument of "hey, they already got a million dollars from this game, let's make sure someone else gets a chance this time" is fairly compelling to the 14 or so people out there who fell short of the million.

Especially in Jenna's case, where I suspect she's annoying enough IRL that she could be an early boot just to make camp life more peaceful/less annoying. 

I forgot how close she came to actually upsetting the Romber apple cart, that foot lift was a potentially costly move. Although I think the fantasy recasting vote at the reunion had her losing by a vote (Shii Ann), though those can't really be trusted. 

Quote

See, I just don't get the logic of targeting the winners so early (and only because they won).  However, it clearly didn't backfire on her.

What's the specific danger of targeting the winners though? Is it because this particular tribe had two winners on it? (Which I always thought was weird, why did they have one tribe with two winners and a third tribe with zero winners OR runner ups?) I think on a tribe with just one winner, this would be a near perfect sell to the others, but agree that with two winners here, it was dicier. 

[LadyChatts]

On 1/24/2017 at 11:23 AM, ljenkins782 said:

Yeah, I think that was a solid strategy as well. As for the logic of targeting winners, that early in the game, you don't have that much ammunition to use to convince people to target someone. The argument of "hey, they already got a million dollars from this game, let's make sure someone else gets a chance this time" is fairly compelling to the 14 or so people out there who fell short of the million.

Especially in Jenna's case, where I suspect she's annoying enough IRL that she could be an early boot just to make camp life more peaceful/less annoying. 

I forgot how close she came to actually upsetting the Romber apple cart, that foot lift was a potentially costly move. Although I think the fantasy recasting vote at the reunion had her losing by a vote (Shii Ann), though those can't really be trusted. 

What's the specific danger of targeting the winners though? Is it because this particular tribe had two winners on it? (Which I always thought was weird, why did they have one tribe with two winners and a third tribe with zero winners OR runner ups?) I think on a tribe with just one winner, this would be a near perfect sell to the others, but agree that with two winners here, it was dicier. 

I always thought that was weird, too, especially since Chapera had none (and Mogo Mogo had the other two).  In addition, Jenna's tribe had 2 people from Borneo and 2 people from Outback, while the other tribes seemed to have more of a mix.  Since there were 4 Outback people and 4 Borneo people, obviously they were going to have to double up somewhere, but just surprising Jenna's tribe was it (along with 2 winners).  Of course she got lucky since having Tina and Jerry together meant those two would not vote together.

I don't think there's any danger to targeting winners because they won, I guess I just never saw the point.  But someone had to go first, and in a tribe of six, it would make a more compelling argument to target a winner.  You don't have a ton of options (okay, now it's starting to make more sense as I type it lol)

[Oholibamah]

Random factlet: Jenna M and Shii Ann were likely on a tribe with Lex because Kelly Goldsmith was expected to replace one of them. And obviously production wanted to milk that feud. 

[ljenkins782]

10 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

I always thought that was weird, too, especially since Chapera had none (and Mogo Mogo had the other two).  In addition, Jenna's tribe had 2 people from Borneo and 2 people from Outback, while the other tribes seemed to have more of a mix.  Since there were 4 Outback people and 4 Borneo people, obviously they were going to have to double up somewhere, but just surprising Jenna's tribe was it (along with 2 winners).  Of course she got lucky since having Tina and Jerry together meant those two would not vote together.

I don't think there's any danger to targeting winners because they won, I guess I just never saw the point.  But someone had to go first, and in a tribe of six, it would make a more compelling argument to target a winner.  You don't have a ton of options (okay, now it's starting to make more sense as I type it lol)

Ah, I forgot all about Jenna M being there and being a winner. Considering that they'd only had 7 seasons prior, it's pretty impressive that they got 4 out of 7 to return. I think Heidik was invited, but asked for a huge appearance fee so they turned him down.

As far as putting two Borneo people together, it would have had to be Jenna because the other three were part of the original Tagi alliance. But if it had been Kelly Wiglesworth who had come back, you just know she would have been put on Sue's tribe, lol. 

Quote

Random factlet: Jenna M and Shii Ann were likely on a tribe with Lex because Kelly Goldsmith was expected to replace one of them. And obviously production wanted to milk that feud.

That would have been interesting, I wish that had worked out. Did Kelly drop out or did the producers decide to go with the others instead? I know they needed representation from Thailand, but I wouldn't have missed Shii Ann if she wasn't there and didn't need to see Jenna M a second time either. 

[LadyChatts]

5 hours ago, ljenkins782 said:

Ah, I forgot all about Jenna M being there and being a winner. Considering that they'd only had 7 seasons prior, it's pretty impressive that they got 4 out of 7 to return. I think Heidik was invited, but asked for a huge appearance fee so they turned him down.

As far as putting two Borneo people together, it would have had to be Jenna because the other three were part of the original Tagi alliance. But if it had been Kelly Wiglesworth who had come back, you just know she would have been put on Sue's tribe, lol. 

That would have been interesting, I wish that had worked out. Did Kelly drop out or did the producers decide to go with the others instead? I know they needed representation from Thailand, but I wouldn't have missed Shii Ann if she wasn't there and didn't need to see Jenna M a second time either. 

I believe Kelly was an alternate to Jenna M.  Which is kind of disappointing, since Jenna ended up dropping out anyway.  It would have been interesting had Kelly wound up on Lex's tribe and got him out early on in the game.  Might have spared us a season (and everything that came after) of Romber.  Oh, I forgot about the Tagi alliance.  Yeah, that would make sense. 

I think Brian also wanted to be guaranteed to finish past the merge, as he thought he'd be targeted early on (and if he wound up on Jenna's tribe, he would have been right).

Edited January 26, 2017 by LadyChatts

[Oholibamah]

21 hours ago, ljenkins782 said:

 

That would have been interesting, I wish that had worked out. Did Kelly drop out or did the producers decide to go with the others instead? I know they needed representation from Thailand, but I wouldn't have missed Shii Ann if she wasn't there and didn't need to see Jenna M a second time either. 

Kelly mentioned on a podcast that she was cast for the season, quit her job, bought supplies... Only to be told no the day before they left. Apparently the producers were 99% sure either Jenna (because of her mother) or Shii Ann (issues with the contract) would drop out. But both of them stayed. 

They hired Kelly as a casting director for the following season, so they obviously felt bad. They've also offered for her to return on both HvV and BvW, but she wasn't available for either. Fingers crossed for a future season!

[ljenkins782]

2 hours ago, Oholibamah said:

Kelly mentioned on a podcast that she was cast for the season, quit her job, bought supplies... Only to be told no the day before they left. Apparently the producers were 99% sure either Jenna (because of her mother) or Shii Ann (issues with the contract) would drop out. But both of them stayed. 

They hired Kelly as a casting director for the following season, so they obviously felt bad. They've also offered for her to return on both HvV and BvW, but she wasn't available for either. Fingers crossed for a future season!

WTF? That really sucks. I think I heard on a podcast that they did something similar to Shane Powers on HvVs. I believe he was bumped for Russell, who did in fact make a huge impact, BUT there were other super dull duds that they could have bumped. Like, did we need to see Colby (for the THIRD time) sleepwalk through that season? Shane would have been far more entertaining. 

As for this season, I would have much rather watch Kelly on a tribe with Lex, who was at his sanctimonious peak in this season, than have Jenna just huddled in the background for a couple of episodes before leaving. 

[Michel]

On ‎1‎/‎27‎/‎2017 at 8:40 AM, ljenkins782 said:

WTF? That really sucks. I think I heard on a podcast that they did something similar to Shane Powers on HvVs. I believe he was bumped for Russell, who did in fact make a huge impact, BUT there were other super dull duds that they could have bumped. Like, did we need to see Colby (for the THIRD time) sleepwalk through that season? Shane would have been far more entertaining.

Of the Villains, I'd have just dumped Randy since he ended up being a big nothing that season.  Or Tyson since his inclusion didn't make sense except as a backup for Coach.  Shane might've been interesting.

[fishcakes]

6 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

In Lex's minor defense, he had an alliance with BRob that was established before the game was played. Lex saved Amber because of that alliance. Lex was pissed that BRob negated that alliance.

Lex and Tom had a pre-game alliance, but even Lex didn't claim he had a pre-game alliance with Rob, at least not in his immediate post-show interviews nor on the DVD commentary which was a couple of years later. He only said that he was friends with Rob and that Rob's request that Lex save Amber was based on his friendship and "outside of the game," to which Rob very reasonably responded that if that was the case, then Lex had nothing to be mad about. And Rob was right. Either Lex saving Amber was a game move, he thought Rob would repay him by saving him in return and he was wrong, but it's all part of the game and "just business" as Lex was so fond of saying that season when he voted out his own allies Jerri and Ethan, OR Lex saved Amber out of his friendship for Rob, in which case he can't be mad that Rob didn't save him in the game when, according to Lex, saving Amber had nothing to do with the game.

29 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

The problem with pre-game alliances is that you don't know how the game is going to go. Had Lex and Boston Rob been put on the same tribe, maybe that would have worked, but the game didn't work out that way. Lex picked up Kathy (and Jerri, who he stabbed in the back after stabbing Colby and Ethan in the backs) and Rob picked up Amber. Lex also had a pre-game alliance with Big Tom, so the idea that he and Rob had a super-special agreement that Rob violated doesn't fly with me. I don't think he was planning to sit next to Rob at the end, so the fact that Rob got to FTC and he didn't is the source of his rage, not the alleged betrayal of friendship.

Yes, I think this is right. Rob even confronted Lex about his alliance with Tom during the game when he told him and Kathy that he couldn't save them and Lex and Kathy started weeping and gnashing their teeth and rending their garments and whatnot. Lex was claiming he'd shown loyalty to Rob and now Rob owed him; Rob basically laughed at that and said he knew Lex was planning on teaming back up with Tom and going to the end with him. Lex knew he was busted so he pretty much just made this face until he was voted out:

[Daisy]

What cracked me up with the whole "Let's vote out Jerri" thing was that Kathy + Lex (whom i liked in their other seasons) were flat out stupid here. "Rob will be mad." what exactly was Rob going to do? get mad at you for voting out his girlfriend? Vote you out twice? Vote out Amber and say it didn't work out, too bad so sad.

And when this was brought up during the commentary (which i have to say this is why i miss the official CBS dvds, because i love the commentary) -Rob basically said when this came up, why the heck was Kathy mad anyway. He didn't even talk to her. she wasn't involved with the thing. So her crying about how "oh mah gawd this is horrible, I don't want it." was completely stupid. 

 

[enlightenedbum]

Kathy fairly consistently revealed herself to be a self-absorbed, rather shitty person through this season.  See also Jenna's departure and what Rich did to Sue.  Which even Rob and Rupert, not exactly friends to women (and who would go on to cover themselves in shit later regarding Sue) thought was disgusting.

[simplyme]

I'm currently watching S20 HvV, and at one point Jeff is snarking at thr villains for how dysfunctional they are and he says, "...and you have one of the worst shelters ever built on Survivor."

At which point Jerri calmly raises her hand and says with a faint smile, "Oh, I was in that shelter."

I cracked up. I couldn't even explain how bad that shelter was to SimplyMom, who hasn't seen S8 (sadly not available via Amazon Prime). For some reason, that epic shelter failure is one of the highlights of the season for me.

[Daisy]

4 hours ago, enlightenedbum said:

Kathy fairly consistently revealed herself to be a self-absorbed, rather shitty person through this season.  See also Jenna's departure and what Rich did to Sue.  Which even Rob and Rupert, not exactly friends to women (and who would go on to cover themselves in shit later regarding Sue) thought was disgusting.

I agree. all the good will I liked about her, gone on a second viewing. (That's always the thing with all stars seasons) - they can either cement your love for a character (for Me, Sandra, Cirie), make you really fall in love (Parv, Eliza), or just.. hate them.  Lex and Kathy are there. 

3 hours ago, simplyme said:

I'm currently watching S20 HvV, and at one point Jeff is snarking at thr villains for how dysfunctional they are and he says, "...and you have one of the worst shelters ever built on Survivor."

At which point Jerri calmly raises her hand and says with a faint smile, "Oh, I was in that shelter."

I cracked up. I couldn't even explain how bad that shelter was to SimplyMom, who hasn't seen S8 (sadly not available via Amazon Prime). For some reason, that epic shelter failure is one of the highlights of the season for me.

I remember that. that was soo funny. How Rupert thought digging a hole in a ground would be a great idea. And the fact Ethan knew it was a dumb idea and just sat there and let Jerri and Rupert fight over it. 

[simplyme]

1 hour ago, southpaw said:

If you have a VHS or DVD player, you can probably get a copy of All Stars at the library.  It's available at Canadian libraries, so probably also in US libraries, if that is where you live.

Unfortunately, none of the libraries I have access to own copies or have any sort of streaming copy available. (I admit that as a former public librarian, I checked this-both my local libraries and the fairly large library where I used to work. They all own Call the Midwife, though. *mutters*)

Ah, well. We have to work our way through a bunch more before I start worrying about the ones I don't have access to yet. ;)

[fishcakes]

7 hours ago, enlightenedbum said:

Kathy fairly consistently revealed herself to be a self-absorbed, rather shitty person through this season.

I am proud to say that I thought she was a garbage person back in Marquesas too. All the sobbing and feeling sorry for herself and moaning about how "they're lying to me. They're all lying to me," followed by the bellyflop of self-pity at least had their humorous elements to take the edge off how unlikable she was, but comparing the final immunity challenge to sitting vigil by her dying dad's beside? GTFO.

[Nalan]

24 minutes ago, fishcakes said:

I am proud to say that I thought she was a garbage person back in Marquesas too. All the sobbing and feeling sorry for herself and moaning about how "they're lying to me. They're all lying to me," followed by the bellyflop of self-pity at least had their humorous elements to take the edge off how unlikable she was, but comparing the final immunity challenge to sitting vigil by her dying dad's beside? GTFO.

I take it you were more than happy that Vecepia beat her, then?

[fishcakes]

44 minutes ago, Nalan said:

I take it you were more than happy that Vecepia beat her, then?

I've always said Vecepia is an underrated player, so yes. Of the final 5, I think Vecepia played the best game, although Sean was my favorite person out of that group.

[LadyChatts]

21 minutes ago, fishcakes said:

I've always said Vecepia is an underrated player, so yes. Of the final 5, I think Vecepia played the best game, although Sean was my favorite person out of that group.

I've also always thought that Vee was an underrated winner.  In general, I loved Marquesas, and am disappointed that the only representatives we've ever had are Kathy and Rob.  And now Rob has pretty much defined that season, even though he was a pre-jury boot that started off on the losing-est tribe ever (at the time).  I do love my girl Neleh, though, and because I hated the Rotu 4 and their bitterness, I really wanted her to win.  But clearly that wasn't happening with that jury.  I'd always wanted Sean back, too.  I did like Kathy, but I realize now that was more to do with the underdog factor, and (again) disliking the Rotu 4, which she was not a part of.  After AS, though, I can't say I came out liking many people that I liked before.  After watching Outback again, Alicia seems like such a different person from that season to this one.  I never liked Lex, and was so glad to see him get owned.  

[fishcakes]

6 minutes ago, LadyChatts said:

I never liked Lex, and was so glad to see him get owned.

I went back and forth on Lex. I didn't like him or his gut in Africa, but for the first part of All Stars, he seemed like a pretty good guy. Then Rob didn't save him and he went insane and shaved his head, so I went back to thinking he was a dillhole. It's similar to my not liking/liking/not liking Brad Culpepper except Brad seemed far more vicious to me when he reverted to type. Lex being affronted was more cartoonish, although maybe only in retrospect.

I too, would have liked to see Sean play again, but I think he's moved on. He doesn't have any social media presence, although Boston Rob sometimes mentions on twitter when they hang out.

[Daisy]

I really have to wonder how much of a pull Jeff has on returning players because Vee has flat out said she is surprised they have had all these seasons with returning winners and she never has a callback and she is dying to play again, Neleh and John are jonesing to play as well, and nothing. (Neleh/John would have been perfect choices for second chances, and I think this is why i hated the vote in). 

Monica (who?!) needed a second chance? For what? Playing with Russell? 
Neleh (and I love Vee) easily could have won Marquesas if not for that jury. John deserved to go back too (under the whole premise they were building)

at anyrate to tie this back into All Stars. LOL it is really strange when you talk about Rob's first season people just think Kathy/Rob. Which kinda makes sense, because Rob kinda put the bug in Kathy's ear about the Rotu's before he got booted. Kathy couldn't make Neleh believe anything until the Coconut chop, so arguably. if Rob doesn't say anything, is Kathy aware? does Kathy hound Pappy + Neleh? (let's be honest, John and that trio were always going to be that arrogant during the coconut chop) - but they were not listening to Sean and Vee at the time. 

So i can see it (that and most people still believe Kathy should have won - and would have won had Neleh not disracted her about the boob falling out lolol).  why those two get "represented" even though it's a weak tie-in. 

I liked Lex until he cut Kelly over the stupidest thing (omg you wrote my name down). and It really suck that in game he never even apologised to Kelly about it like not even. "yah we found out Theresa voted for me and it sucks becuse Kelly should be here, thanks Kelly.)  - as this was an era people did things like that lol. 

[LadyChatts]

From what I understand, Probst is actually big on bringing back old school players, but CBS is the one who has the recency bias.  That's not to say Jeff suffers from that as well, but I think he does go to bat more for the old schoolers.  I heard he pushed to get Tina and Gervase on BvsW, and he wanted Varner back for S34 (let's not get into what a disaster that turned out to be).  I wouldn't be surprised if he pushed for Varner and Kimmi for Second Chances.  However, I don't believe he's much of a Vee fan, so I'd be surprised to see her ever return.  He's the one who said the big issue with an all winners season is that there aren't enough strong female winners, which I completely disagree with.  I'd kill to see Neleh again, and Kelly Goldsmith.  She was an alternate to Jenna M for AS, and I don't know what happened during HvsV, but it sounds like she was in as she quit her job, then was replaced. 

In terms of Monica-that's the only logic I've found for her being on the ballot in the first place, is that she was somewhat of a challenge to Russell.  My personal feeling is that some people were included on the ballot with the intent that they stood no chance to get on, and yet some campaigned more successfully than others and made it.

Edited June 6, 2017 by LadyChatts

[Nalan]

1 hour ago, LadyChatts said:

From what I understand, Probst is actually big on bringing back old school players, but CBS is the one who has the recency bias.  That's not to say Jeff suffers from that as well, but I think he does go to bat more for the old schoolers.  I heard he pushed to get Tina and Gervase on BvsW, and he wanted Varner back for S34 (let's not get into what a disaster that turned out to be).  I wouldn't be surprised if he pushed for Varner and Kimmi for Second Chances.  However, I don't believe he's much of a Vee fan, so I'd be surprised to see her ever return.

He pushed for Teresa, too, though she didn't make the cut.

[ratherbereading]

For anyone that hasn't seen Rupert's shelter? I did find this image. Keep in mind that the entrance leads down to a hole dug in the ground. There is a tree root/log that was so big they could not dig it out. So they used it as a foot rest iirc. It was worse than no shelter, tbh.

 

 

[Lamb18]

I'm watching this season right now. There was a huge rainstorm that totally flooded out the shelter. Rob made the best shelter of the three tribes--it stood up to the storm pretty well.

[enlightenedbum]

Best thing about this season might be one of the Rob's (I think it was Mariano, might have been Cesternino) described their tribe as the "buffoon tribe" and then they won like every challenge.

[Lamb18]

Question to those who've watched every season:

I just watched the episode where Ethan was voted out. Now I know that he and Jenna are married, but how did that happen? They were on separate tribes and both left before the merge so I doubt they ever exchanged words. (I assume Jenna went home right away so she would not have met in in the non-jury Ponderosa.) I could tell he felt for her and gave her a nice hug when she was saying good-bye to everyone, but that was their only contact.

Of course they could have met up before the show since both are winners, but I got they impression they didn't know each other. Were they together on a later season or just hook up after All-Stars?

It is interesting watching the Rob/Amber romance progress. For those of you who watched this as it was aired, how soon did you realize that this might become a serious relationship as opposed to a TV flirtation? This past episode gave an inkling but I'm already in the know.

[ljenkins782]

1 hour ago, Lamb18 said:

Question to those who've watched every season:

I just watched the episode where Ethan was voted out. Now I know that he and Jenna are married, but how did that happen? They were on separate tribes and both left before the merge so I doubt they ever exchanged words. (I assume Jenna went home right away so she would not have met in in the non-jury Ponderosa.) I could tell he felt for her and gave her a nice hug when she was saying good-bye to everyone, but that was their only contact.

Of course they could have met up before the show since both are winners, but I got they impression they didn't know each other. Were they together on a later season or just hook up after All-Stars?

It is interesting watching the Rob/Amber romance progress. For those of you who watched this as it was aired, how soon did you realize that this might become a serious relationship as opposed to a TV flirtation? This past episode gave an inkling but I'm already in the know.

Jenna and Ethan aren't married, they dated for a long time, but he got married sometime in the last few years and it was to someone else. I don't think they knew each other on this season, I think the relationship started later. The Survivor community is pretty incestuous, I'm sure there are plenty of events where casts from different seasons mingle. 

I thought Rob/Amber showed signs of long-term potential around the time that Amber got screwed by being the only person from their tribe to swap to the other tribe. They both seemed upset beyond pure game reasons. I thought Rob's feelings were pretty clear for most of the show, but with Amber being very reserved, it occasionally wasn't as clear whether she was playing him or not. 

[fishcakes]

I vaguely remember that Jenna and Ethan were dating before the season started, but I wouldn't swear to it. They were dating by the reunion show, though, because Jeff mentioned that Rob and Amber weren't the only couple and Jenna -- who I found pretty likeable that season -- rather snottily said that her and Ethan's relationship was about more than the show, which implied that Rob and Amber's was not, despite the fact that they'd gotten engaged just a few minutes earlier. She probably just meant that they had a lot of common experiences, like both having and losing a parent to cancer, but it came off looking like a dig.

23 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

The Survivor community is pretty incestuous, I'm sure there are plenty of events where casts from different seasons mingle.

Yeah, this was especially true in the early seasons when there were a lot of charity events and one-off TV shows where the various casts could get together. Ethan was rumored to have cut a wide dating swath through the designated hot girls of each season, but the only ones I know of who've been confirmed other than Jenna Morasca are Jenna Lewis and Amber. Jenna Lewis might have even mentioned it on the show that season, and the two of them certainly seemed to have a fair amount of animosity toward each other so I guess it didn't end well. Rob also made a couple of cracks about Ethan being conceited and man-whorey, which I took to be a bit of jealousy about his being Amber's ex.

2 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

It is interesting watching the Rob/Amber romance progress. For those of you who watched this as it was aired, how soon did you realize that this might become a serious relationship as opposed to a TV flirtation?

By the time they went on the movie/car date, I was pretty sure they were going to end up married. They seemed like such an established couple at that point. Mitchell from the Outback season has said that they were dating before the season started and that Amber was already in love with Rob, but they've never confirmed or denied it, so who knows? I hesitate to even mention it because whenever Rob's name comes up, Mariano Derangement Syndrome seems to overtake people and they have to cast shade on his win, Amber's win, their marriage, their alliance, etc. They've been married for more than ten years and have four kids, but there are still people who try to argue that it's all a conspiracy so they could share the million.

[Lamb18]

Thanks for the info, Fishcakes and ljenkins! I keep forgetting that these guys from different seasons probably knew each other before All-Stars. I don't know why I thought Ethan and Jenna were married. Is there another married Survivor couple? Someone who was on The Amazing Race?

[fishcakes]

32 minutes ago, Lamb18 said:

Is there another married Survivor couple? Someone who was on The Amazing Race?

Whitney and Keith from the South Pacific season are married now, and they were on The Amazing Race, but I think they went out fairly early? I'm not sure; I barely remember either one of them from either show.

Also, Alex Bell from Amazon and Kim Powers from Africa have been married since the middle 2000s, but as far as I know, they've never appeared on any other reality show.

[simplyme]

6 hours ago, fishcakes said:

Whitney and Keith from the South Pacific season are married now, and they were on The Amazing Race, but I think they went out fairly early? I'm not sure; I barely remember either one of them from either show.

I'm fairly certain both Whitney and Keith made the merge but not too long after. I remember them since they were on the same tribe with Cochran and Ozzy and were annoyed that Cochran wouldn't let them have the shelter to themselves to sleep (read as "to boff"). Everyone else fled the shelter but Cochran was pissed enough that he refused to and just laid there and cringed at night. 

The relationship was a bit scandalous at the time it aired because it came out that Whitney was married at the time to a country musician. They divorced. She and Keith dated for years and then got married.

[Star Aristille]

6 hours ago, fishcakes said:

Whitney and Keith from the South Pacific season are married now, and they were on The Amazing Race, but I think they went out fairly early? I'm not sure; I barely remember either one of them from either show.

Yes.  Keith & Whitney were on season twenty-five of TAR.  They were the fourth team eliminated after a U-Turn was used on them by mother/daughter flight attendants Shelley & Nici.  They were the third Survivor pairing to get on TAR.  Rob & Amber were the first, and Ethan & Jenna were the second.

[LadyChatts]

Jaime and Erik from China are also married.

At the time, I thought it was romance on Amber's part, more showmance on Rob's.  Even when he proposed at the reunion, I rolled my eyes thinking it was a publicity stunt.  But since I hated the bitterness of some of the AS jury, even if Amber was technically the winner, I'm glad Rob basically won too (in many ways) to stick it to them.  I really didn't expect their relationship to last, but I'm happy for them.  They still seem very much in love and they have beautiful children.  I had heard rumors that Amber and Rob were somewhat of a thing before the season aired as well, though I can't remember where.

I didn't realize Ethan had dated Amber, though I remember he had hooked up with the other Jenna.  They were on Mark Burnett's other show, Eco Challenge, together.  I can't remember who else was part of their team.  It's why it surprised me that there seemed to be bad blood between them by the time AS rolled around.  Just seemed like this season was personal on many levels.

[Lamb18]

I finally finished All-Stars including the reunion and the second $1,000,000 America's vote. Although I knew the outcome, it was interesting to see the way it played out. Rob was a much better player in All-Stars than he was in Season 4. (In Season 4 he seemed like a lot of hot air to me.) Now that was a bitter jury. I think the bitterness was not so much that they were friends before the show, but that Rob made specific promises to people in the show, then broke them all. If this was a season of strangers, people wouldn't have taken it so personally, but wow, those guys really took it hard except for ShiiAnn, Rupert and Jenna. Well, Tina probably didn't have anything against Rob either.  I could see all the Rob love become slobbery at the finale, especially with the proposal. I thought the genuine love they had was touching but the engagement usurped everything else. One thing - if anyone else had been up against Rob or Amber, that person would have won, except maybe Richard Hatch if he'd made it that far.

Questions to those of you who watched the season when it aired:

• Who did you vote for for sexiest male Survivor? (Colby won)
• Likewise for best villain? (Johnny Fairplay won)
• Likewise for sexiest female Survivor? (Amber won)
• For getting the $1,000,000? (Rupert won)

Also, I like Rupert so far. He has his negative moments, but everyone has those. I'll have to see how he is later on. I saw a little of him on Blood vs. Water. I remember him crying a lot and sacrificing himself for his wife, but I didn't watch the whole season.

[LadyChatts]

I can't remember who I voted for in the other categories, but I know I did not vote for Rupert for that other million.  I think I voted for Rob C.  I hated that he played so close to his previous season.  I wish they had waited until S10 to do an AS season.  Maybe that extra time wouldn't have made him such a threat.  

You can see Sue point to Rupert before Jeff even read the result. Everyone knew he was winning.

[ljenkins782]

On 6/23/2017 at 11:24 AM, fishcakes said:

I vaguely remember that Jenna and Ethan were dating before the season started, but I wouldn't swear to it. They were dating by the reunion show, though, because Jeff mentioned that Rob and Amber weren't the only couple and Jenna -- who I found pretty likeable that season -- rather snottily said that her and Ethan's relationship was about more than the show, which implied that Rob and Amber's was not, despite the fact that they'd gotten engaged just a few minutes earlier. She probably just meant that they had a lot of common experiences, like both having and losing a parent to cancer, but it came off looking like a dig.

Yeah, this was especially true in the early seasons when there were a lot of charity events and one-off TV shows where the various casts could get together. Ethan was rumored to have cut a wide dating swath through the designated hot girls of each season, but the only ones I know of who've been confirmed other than Jenna Morasca are Jenna Lewis and Amber. Jenna Lewis might have even mentioned it on the show that season, and the two of them certainly seemed to have a fair amount of animosity toward each other so I guess it didn't end well. Rob also made a couple of cracks about Ethan being conceited and man-whorey, which I took to be a bit of jealousy about his being Amber's ex.

By the time they went on the movie/car date, I was pretty sure they were going to end up married. They seemed like such an established couple at that point. Mitchell from the Outback season has said that they were dating before the season started and that Amber was already in love with Rob, but they've never confirmed or denied it, so who knows? I hesitate to even mention it because whenever Rob's name comes up, Mariano Derangement Syndrome seems to overtake people and they have to cast shade on his win, Amber's win, their marriage, their alliance, etc. They've been married for more than ten years and have four kids, but there are still people who try to argue that it's all a conspiracy so they could share the million.

I remember Ethan voting for Jenna L and saying something about "I hope [whatever] bites you in that big old butt of yours." Lol. Definitely some animosity there. I didn't know about that Amber, but that would certainly explain Rob's attitude toward him. Not that Rob was ever complimentary of any other guy in any regard, but it did seem a little personal with Ethan. 

That movie/car date seemed like such a great time. Aside from both getting cars, how nice to be able to be away from camp with the person you're dating and just hang out for awhile. Although I guess the 2 of them being away from camp at the same time could have been bad for their game, but it all worked out in the end. 

[Runningwild]

Rewatching this season now. Still feel the same - Love Boston Rob and can’t stand Rupert. Just howled at Rupert thinking his shelter was so wonderful when it was the worst ever. And Rob’s was awesome!  Also have always felt the Romber romance was the real thing. (Just finished episode where Ethan was voted out and saw them kiss.)

[auntlada]

On 6/5/2017 at 10:47 AM, enlightenedbum said:

Kathy fairly consistently revealed herself to be a self-absorbed, rather shitty person through this season.  See also Jenna's departure and what Rich did to Sue.  Which even Rob and Rupert, not exactly friends to women (and who would go on to cover themselves in shit later regarding Sue) thought was disgusting.

I'm rewatching this on Hulu and just watched the episode when Jenna M. left. When she was discussing it with her tribe, Kathy basically told her to stop talking about it because it was bringing everyone down and was "like a cancer" in the tribe. Now, I don't know if Kathy knew that Jenna's mom had cancer, but Jenna had mentioned to the tribe that her mother was very sick and might die any day. Any reasonable person would consider cancer as one of the possible diseases her mom might be dying from, and any reasonably tactful person would not tell someone her behavior was "like a cancer" in that situation. (Any reasonably nice person would commiserate and tell Jenna she should be with her mother if that was what she wanted.)

[fishcakes]

I'm pretty sure Kathy knew. Even if Jenna didn't talk to her about it, Kathy most likely had seen the Amazon season where it was talked about a lot when the letters from home were auctioned off.

[kittykat]

Good god after reading these comments I forgot much Kathy annoyed the bejezus out of me in both seasons.  I sort of started to like her in Marquesas when the R4 royally overplayed their hand on the Coconut challenge but she is also damn lucky Rotu dominated early on and that she benefited from the tribe switch because Kathy could've easily been one of the first three out but I should probably take that to Marquesas thread.

I seriously don't understand how Probst didn't catch more shit for the way the Sue incident was horribly handled.  Richard shouldn't ever be allowed to come back although if an all winner season is on the works (season 40?) It will totally happen :-(. 

Edited January 7, 2019 by kittykat

[auntlada]

31 minutes ago, kittykat said:

Good god after reading these comments I forgot much Kathy annoyed the bejezus out of me in both seasons.  I sort of started to like her in Marquesas when the R4 royally overplayed their hand on the Coconut challenge but she is also damn lucky Rotu dominated early on and that she benefited from the tribe switch because Kathy could've easily been one of the first three out but I should probably take that to Marquesas thread.

I seriously don't understand how Probst didn't catch more shit for the way the Sue incident was horribly handled.  Richard shouldn't ever be allowed to come back although if an all winner season is on the works (season 40?) It will totally happen :-(. 

After Sue left, Kathy was mad because Sue brought everyone else into her "circle of hate" (or something like that) and made everyone else uncomfortable. I didn't see her first season, but she is really unlikeable here.

[LadyChatts]

2 hours ago, kittykat said:

Good god after reading these comments I forgot much Kathy annoyed the bejezus out of me in both seasons.  I sort of started to like her in Marquesas when the R4 royally overplayed their hand on the Coconut challenge but she is also damn lucky Rotu dominated early on and that she benefited from the tribe switch because Kathy could've easily been one of the first three out but I should probably take that to Marquesas thread.

I seriously don't understand how Probst didn't catch more shit for the way the Sue incident was horribly handled.  Richard shouldn't ever be allowed to come back although if an all winner season is on the works (season 40?) It will totally happen :-(. 

I think a lot of it may have just been the times.  When you look at older seasons of Survivor (or really any reality show) there's a lot of things I tend to do a double take on because I know they wouldn't fly today.  I remember a few contestants who spoke out after they were voted off about the Sue/Rich incident and they said they didn't think much about it, and thought Sue was being overdramatic when she blew up at Jeff (it might have been Jenna Lewis who said she didn't realize she was really that upset at first and thought she was being a drama queen).  

If they do an all winners season, I'd be shocked if they didn't ask him.  Of course TPTB may not think much of him trying to say there was cheating going on and that they promised to pay the taxes on his winnings, so who knows.  They'd probably be likely to not ask him back for that reason over anything else.