General Gabbery: DWTS

[madpsych78]

11 hours ago, PTVjones said:

I think every season there is a shocking female elimination. Whether it be Sabrina Bryan from many moons ago, women who've competed and could've won but didn't (regardless of reason) can include (but is not limited to):

• Sabrina Bryan
• Tinashe
• Zendaya
• Normani
• Mel B
• Heather Morris
• Mya
• Paige Van Zant
• Laila Ali

I can also put it this way. The only female contestants to win who A: Are NOT a partner of Derek and B: NOT an Olympian are: Kelly Monaco (S1), Melissa Rycroft (S15) Rumer Willis (S20). The show has been on for 27 seasons with, 13 male winners, 6 Derek Hough-Female Celeb wins. Therefore, 19 seasons are accounter for. With the 8 seasons left, 4 of those female winners are Olympians (Kristi Yamaguchi, Shawn Johnson, Meryl Davis, Laurie Hernandez). The Non-Olympians include: 

I this this show needs a STRONG switch up. I propose either an All Star Season. If they could get one of the big fish who have actually gotten more famous since they've been on the show (Zendaya), that could be huge for the show. I highly doubt she'd do it as she seems to be BOOKED with Spiderman, that new show on HBO, designing for Tommy Hilfiger, about to start filming a movie with Jake Gyllenhaal according to IMDB. Highly doubt she'd ever do the show again, especially from what I've been told Val wrote about her in his book. However, there are some people who I'd really like to see on the show again. 

If not an All Star season, than an All Female Celeb season. I think it could be an interesting female empowerment type of season. Female Pros could serve as coaches for the female celeb and it can be a girl power season. It could also be a way to introduce some new male pros to the show which I think the show DESPERATELY needs. 

I wouldn't put all of those women on the same "shocking elimination" level. The shocking eliminations from that list are Sabrina Bryan, Tinashe, and Heather Morris. But Zendaya, Normani, Mel B, Mya, Paige Van Zant all made the finals and Lalia Ali was a semi-finalist. 

Good point though about The Power of Derek influencing female winners.

[Toonces464]

4 hours ago, Emily-D said:

ABC are obviously doing something wrong. It’s a soft excuse saying it’s heyday is over, the show has been on just as long in the UK and incredibly is getting bigger by the year. They treat it properly though, it gets a two and half hour slot on Saturday night with no adverts and is a long season with 16 celebs so they can get a range of different celebs, something for everyone so to speak. They also have a results show the next day with a dance off which ensures a sense of fairness when it comes to eliminations. ABC let pros like Derek leave for a rival network and have made awful decisions over the last 18 months which has absolutely killed the show. It was pulling high 1s in the demographic and at least 10 million viewers 18 months ago which is a staggering drop and ABC have to take responsibility for that. I think if ABC moved the show to summer and had an extended season rather than the 9 weeks it gets now then it could work out. Try and copy the formula which has worked in the UK.

Absolutely agree the lame cast and the money being funneled to American Idol's reboot are what's doing this show in.

I also think the show is incapable of being more than one thing. They seem to be catering to a munch younger fan base right now with this group of pros who spent years chatting up fans on social media and visiting with them outside tour venues and a lot of younger celebs. This unfortunately has been off-putting to a lot of the older and longer-term viewers. I don't know why they don't mix it up more. Bring back more than just one of the original pros each season and rotate the current group. Mix up the cast better...even if it means changing up the way you do things to get more people interested in doing the show. Make the judge's comments and the results more organic instead of so highly manipulated by the producers.

[spanana]

3 hours ago, Emily-D said:

Also recent breaking news is that the DWTS studio is being sold by CBS to a group who will more than likely demolish it for houses/retail. Another nail in the coffin I suspect.

I don't think the potential sale of the studio means anything.  Lots of shows film there and they aren't all going to be suddenly cancelled if the sale goes through.  They will just be moved elsewhere.

I don't think DWTS is quite in trouble yet because it's a cheap show to produce relatively, as compared to scripted things, so it can be sustained longer on lower ratings.  Also tv ratings across the board continue to decline steadily year to year so almost all broadcast tv ratings suck.  So it's always a bit of a misnomer to try and compare current tv numbers with even numbers from two years ago.

But I do think ABC or whoever is in charge needs to find a way to revive it and pump some new energy or blood or excitement back into the proceedings.  I don't think the problem is our pros, but rather the whole thing.  The format needs a kick in the pants and they need to cut some of the more obvious manipulation.

I'm not totally against the idea of moving it to summer where it would have less competition and people are usually looking for that sort of lighter fare to watch during the summer.  I also think it might become more appointment viewing if it's only on 1x a year.

Right now Jrs, which I was not looking forward to at all, feels far fresher in its format than the regular show.  It's also refreshing and fun to watch our some pros in a different role.

Edited October 17, 2018 by spanana

[Toonces464]

6 minutes ago, spanana said:

I'm not totally against the idea of moving it to summer where it would have less competition and people are usually looking for that sort of lighter fare to watch during the summer.  I also think it might become more appointment viewing if it's only on 1x a year.

I still believe very strongly that going to once a year will be the end of the show. Look what happened with the athlete's season and how many people they lost. When the show's not around regularly, people will find other things to watch that are.

[Bridget]

57 minutes ago, Toonces464 said:

I still believe very strongly that going to once a year will be the end of the show. Look what happened with the athlete's season and how many people they lost. When the show's not around regularly, people will find other things to watch that are.

This!

Also, summertime is a death wish on any show that wishes to remain relevant.  Most people are on vacation, out and about later at night, at the movies, camping and engaged in other non-TV watching activities. They’re not at home watching TV at all, let alone DWTS. 

Nerd alert: even if I don’t watch on Monday nights, I have my favorite contestant’s phone number already programmed in my phone each season. Wherever I am on Monday nights, I call & vote for them. It doesn’t matter to me how they danced; I know I did my part as a fan and voted. 

While I love the format of Strictly,  it would probably tank here. Many people aren’t at home on Saturday nights. Sundays are also incredibly rough, between family dinners in some cultures,  parents scurrying around while trying to get their kids ready for the week and then off to bed. I know the show ends at 10pm anyway, but I do think about younger viewers not getting to see Insert Disney Star here. (I say this as a grown up who is enjoying Milo, and liked Zendaya, but the rest have been forgettable for me.)

I love that DWTS airs twice a year AND on Monday nights.  It’s a great way to start off the work week and gives you something to look forward to after you survive Monday.  I realize it’s the teacher in me that benefits from the fall/spring schedule, but in the spring, it gives the fans some major “you can get through the hump” energy that carries over into the summer.

(Teachers DO work over the summer, as well as before and after the bell rings. Especially after the bell rings. It’s not uncommon for us to work until at least 5pm after arriving at 6:30-6:50am. We do get eight weeks off in the summer, but much of it is spent thinking about next year! Getting off of my soapbox now.)

I also love The Voice, and am always so damn happy when both shows are back on the air. If I’m honest, I don’t watch The Voice each week, especially during the first few rounds. It is so much easier, and much more fun, to binge watch that show; the viewer voting part doesn’t even kick in until the very end anyway. 

I know ratings matter, but may I gently point out that live ratings are probably down as most everyone I know has ditched cable? It’s Hulu or other streaming services for most people, so their viewing doesn’t even impact ratings. I’ve yet to ever meet or hear about anyone I know who actually is linked up with the Nielsen system. 

Lastly, for those of you who say things like “I want to love ___________, but I can’t stand their pro partner”, may I humbly remind us all that we are not necessarily voting for the pro?

I love Evanna. Keo? Nope. I’m with everyone else. He still has SO much to learn about teaching. I do wonder how Evanna would have done with Artem, not going to lie. Maybe they paired Evanna & Keo tgthr because she has some dance background and TPTB are hoping to endear Keo to the audience by hopefully keeping him around longer than week one? Who knows. 

I realize some diehard fans do vote for the pro and anyone associated with them, no matter who they are paired with. *Cough Cough Val/Jenna/Joe Cough*

That said, as we all witnessed this week, and have before in previous seasons, we have to vote to keep the celebs we like in order to keep them safe and allow them o improve. 

Lastly, I assume that those who post here and have strong opinions about their favorite celebs/pros are actually voting (save for the ones that have shared they don’t/can’t vote due to certain restrictions)! You can’t complain if you don’t vote! Even if you don’t have a horse in the race, I implore you to use up all of your allocated votes any way you see fit just to get Joe off of the show!

[spanana]

3 hours ago, Toonces464 said:

I still believe very strongly that going to once a year will be the end of the show. Look what happened with the athlete's season and how many people they lost. When the show's not around regularly, people will find other things to watch that are.

I don't really think that is why the show lost viewers, but of course who really can say.  I think the athlete season was a misconceived notion on many levels, including one being that most regular DWTS viewers care enough about athletes to watch an entire 4 weeks solely devoted to them.

I'd also argue that while I agree summer can be the kiss of death, I don't know that I really think DWTS is that relevant anymore.  The ratings have remained high enough until recently to maybe warrant a discussion on whether or not it is, but this show has not been the water cooler talk it once was since I don't even know when.  Ten seasons ago maybe?  It used to be a show that dominated media coverage in the following days, whereas now I can barely find post show interviews of the cast.  It used to be there were so many.  Not to mention we got interviews and press post performance show and results show.  It used to be that DWTS was all that anyone could talk about the next day, and short of maybe my mother, I don't hear many people mention it at all.  People have moved on to the newest or latest fad. 

Even the amount of press the eliminated couples do post elimination.  Now it's a quick GMA visit, and even finalists barely get much more than that.  That's about all the attention it musters.

[calipiano81]

Brought over from the episode thread:

I think "bias" is the more applicable word to use in terms of the voters' response to black female contestants. I think "racist" and "sexist" are too extreme, which is why there are so many posts trying to deny that race and gender play a role.

As humans, all of us (whether we are white, black, brown, yellow, red) have biases, whether we are conscious of them are not. One prominent bias is that we relate to people who we share things in common with or fit into our world. I don't think most people mean to hurt anyone else or make any kind of statement by it, it's just a natural thing most of us feel.

When you have a TV show or movie come out that has an all-black cast or an all-Asian cast or an all-Latino cast, which demographic would you expect to predominantly watch each?

The core demographic that is interested in ballroom dancing, and thereby DWTS, are white, middle-aged and older, conservative (southern and Midwest), women. Black male football players win this show because they play a sport that is HUGE with the demographic. However, it is logical that the type of contestant they are going to relate to the least is the young, black female like Tinashe who is a great dancer and lives/works in one of the major entertainment cities (e.g. Los Angeles or New York). 

Finally, in addition to the demographic issue, Pure pointed out that if only a small percentage of DWTS viewers vote, then more power is given to those whi actually do (we see this all the time in real-world elections). So it may not be that Bachelor Nation is so numerous, but it's that they are the most motivated to vote!

[Toonces464]

1 hour ago, calipiano81 said:

So it may not be that Bachelor Nation is so numerous, but it's that they are the most motivated to vote!

And when you add this to the fan bases of Val (their most popular male pro) and Jenna (his fiancee), who vote like crazy, that's why Joe is still around.

[tedd]

official dances for disney night next week. joe and jenna doing a jive? YIKES. that is gonna be another disaster waiting to happen. 

[McManda]

Didn't Maks and Meryl dance a samba to I Wanna Be Like You from the Jungle Book? I remember not liking that dance, but maybe a quickstep to that song will be better.

Edited October 18, 2018 by McManda

[vdw84]

OMG, this makes me wish even more that tinashe and brandon didnt get eliminated, I want see Princess and the Frog performed so badly on this show and they would have been perfect.

2 hours ago, Toonces464 said:

And when you add this to the fan bases of Val (their most popular male pro) and Jenna (his fiancee), who vote like crazy, that's why Joe is still around.

I honestly dont believe Val is trying to even garner votes for Joe. He was actually liking comments all night long Monday on sm about how Tinashe should not have gone home over some of the horrible dancers. He obviously didnt think it was fair she went home.

[Dancelove]

Quote

The core demographic that is interested in ballroom dancing,

I totally disagree, the core demographic want their favorite boy to win whether they can dance or not. In most cases it's not.  If they cared about ballroom dancing they'd care about the ones who can at least dance or even have rhythm. I'm interested in dancing expressed through some rudimentary mastery of technique.  Without that you might as well be that jackass who steps on peoples toes is a little too loud and a little less caring about dance, as long as he gets to hog the camera it's ratings  gold.  Oh wait, not so much.  Why is this show on? 

Edited October 18, 2018 by Dancelove

[Toonces464]

8 hours ago, Dancelove said:

 Why is this show on? 

Because lots of people enjoy it. There are lots of other things on TV for those who don't.

[howmanywords]

Again with the generalizations.  I consider myself the core demo since I'm watching since season 3 and I'm 43 years old (I never even heard of Tinashe except for Proactiv commercials). Last season Jordan I voted for, then before him Mirai, before that Rashad, Paige and Alfonso. A variety of men and women, some who were pegged ringers. Are you going to say they couldn't dance? I don't know why the taste of all viewers is being lumped together and questioned. Even the seasons when the best dancer won there are always those fans pissed off because their fave didn't win. This show will never please everyone.

41 minutes ago, Toonces464 said:

Because lots of people enjoy it. There are lots of other things on TV for those who don't.

Pretty simple!

[boyznkatz]

On 10/16/2018 at 8:12 PM, PTVjones said:

What makes a male D lister better than a female D lister I wonder? No different than who's casted every season if you ask me. if that's how you feel about the celebs, or the pros for that matter, I wonder why even watch the show at all lol... 

Well see, that's the problem. Who cares about D-listers at all. While I love the show and the dancing, I rarely get invested in the participants. Why don't they do a show for charity? Maybe some big-hearted B-listers or even A-listers would do it for charity. Those people would all have big fanbases and the shitty manipulation wouldn't even be necessary.

[spanana]

9 minutes ago, boyznkatz said:

Well see, that's the problem. Who cares about D-listers at all. While I love the show and the dancing, I rarely get invested in the participants. Why don't they do a show for charity? Maybe some big-hearted B-listers or even A-listers would do it for charity. Those people would all have big fanbases and the shitty manipulation wouldn't even be necessary.

Because A list and B list egos aren't going to ever do the show and their PR reps/agents, etc. aren't going to let them do the show.  There is too big of a gamble to their reputations in terms of how well they do, what sort of edit they get and etc.  Any agent of an A list or B list celeb is going to tell their clients not to go on any sort of reality show like this, except maybe in a judging/mentoring capacity where they are on the drivers seat.

[boyznkatz]

4 minutes ago, spanana said:

Because A list and B list egos aren't going to ever do the show and their PR reps/agents, etc. aren't going to let them do the show.  There is too big of a gamble to their reputations in terms of how well they do, what sort of edit they get and etc.  Any agent of an A list or B list celeb is going to tell their clients not to go on any sort of reality show like this, except maybe in a judging/mentoring capacity where they are on the drivers seat.

They wouldn't do it for charity? Even if they didn't, the people they got on previous seasons were at least sort of stars and more interesting. The last few seasons, they've really been scraping the bottom of the barrel.

[tedd]

as shocking as tinashe’s elimination was, no other shocking elimination will ever top sabrina bryan’s. she was absolutely incredible and is one of the best celebrity dancers to ever compete on this show. she got eliminated in the same week twice. five years apart! absolutely insane. imo, she is the most robbed contestant in DWTS history.

[spanana]

2 minutes ago, tedd said:

as shocking as tinashe’s elimination was, no other shocking elimination will ever top sabrina bryan’s. she was absolutely incredible and is one of the best celebrity dancers to ever compete on this show. she got eliminated in the same week twice. five years apart! absolutely insane. imo, she is the most robbed contestant in DWTS history.

I guess, but I'm not sure if I agree she was one of the best celebs ever.  She was very good for sure, but not to sound like Len, I agreed that she didn't have a light and shade.  At least in her original season.  I didn't pay enough attention to all stars.  Everything was hit very hard all the time.  But at some point when you are voted off early 2x, even after a season where you were supposedly shockingly robbed, it has to say something about how viewers aren't quite connecting to you.  Though all stars was weird because by nature of the type of season, obviously former favorites were going to make early exits when you have a bunch of favorites up against each other. 

[Toonces464]

13 minutes ago, spanana said:

I guess, but I'm not sure if I agree she was one of the best celebs ever.  She was very good for sure, but not to sound like Len, I agreed that she didn't have a light and shade.  At least in her original season.  I didn't pay enough attention to all stars.  Everything was hit very hard all the time.  But at some point when you are voted off early 2x, even after a season where you were supposedly shockingly robbed, it has to say something about how viewers aren't quite connecting to you.  Though all stars was weird because by nature of the type of season, obviously former favorites were going to make early exits when you have a bunch of favorites up against each other. 

Another reason All Stars was such a bad idea. It was more of a popularity contest than any other season and I think the pros had a huge influence in that.....especially when some of the celebs had their original partners and some did not. The perfect example is Gilles. Up until All Stars, he was probably one of the most loved former contestants in his partnership with Cheryl, but his partnership with Peta turned so many people off of him and he was an early exit. Had he been back with Cheryl, he might've won the whole thing (if you believe the season wasn't manipulated to give Tony his first and only win).

[spanana]

1 hour ago, Toonces464 said:

Another reason All Stars was such a bad idea. It was more of a popularity contest than any other season and I think the pros had a huge influence in that.....especially when some of the celebs had their original partners and some did not. The perfect example is Gilles. Up until All Stars, he was probably one of the most loved former contestants in his partnership with Cheryl, but his partnership with Peta turned so many people off of him and he was an early exit. Had he been back with Cheryl, he might've won the whole thing (if you believe the season wasn't manipulated to give Tony his first and only win).

I think I tuned out of all stars partway through because I just was not enjoying it at all.  It's especially not fun to watch former faves come back and be not as good as they once were or be less lovable.  Some were better, like a Shawn Johnson.  Melissa was fine, but I also think she was somewhat propped to get Tony his win.  Kelly Monaco made it to the finals by the skin of her teeth thanks to the showmance angle and Vally fans.

But this was me.  I LOVED Gilles/Cheryl on his original season and of course wanted him to win.  Found him obnoxious on all stars, which I don't know if his ego had gotten turned up since his original run or something about the new partnership brought it out of him. 

I understand that not everybody can have their original partners, especially if said pro had several of their former all stars competing or if there original person was no longer on the show, but it did change dynamics a lot.  I also have no idea how they decided which of the returning celebs got said original partnership.

I feel like there were so many big former DWTS male celeb winners or almost winners duking it out for fan fave that they wound up cancelling each other out and that is how we got a Shawn, Melissa and Kelly finals.

[vdw84]

If they do another allstars season, then they need to make sure the contestants they get can have their original partners. I think the switching up of contestants and pros is what did it over because some contestants didnt have the same chemistry with their new partnership and that caused an issue. Gilles and Peta was a great example of this  and so what Apollo who was with Karina. It just didnt work.

[vdw84]

2 hours ago, tedd said:

as shocking as tinashe’s elimination was, no other shocking elimination will ever top sabrina bryan’s. she was absolutely incredible and is one of the best celebrity dancers to ever compete on this show. she got eliminated in the same week twice. five years apart! absolutely insane. imo, she is the most robbed contestant in DWTS history.

I think Sabrinas will always be number one because it was the first shocking elimination ever. Even tho, I wasnt rooting for Sabrina that season, I was more a mel b fan, I still thought earlier elimination was bull  and not right at all.  Tinashe's elimination is right up there, no way in hell that beautiful and talented girl should have gotten sent home and in week 4 of all weeks, it just wasnt right, it wasnt right in at all.

[boyznkatz]

45 minutes ago, spanana said:

But this was me.  I LOVED Gilles/Cheryl on his original season and of course wanted him to win.  Found him obnoxious on all stars, which I don't know if his ego had gotten turned up since his original run or something about the new partnership brought it out of him. 

It wasn't just Gilles. I found Shawn Johnson and Drew Lachey obnoxious on All-Stars as well. They had different partners as well.  They were better with their original partners. 

Something about that whole season just rubbed me the wrong way. 

[vdw84]

18 minutes ago, boyznkatz said:

It wasn't just Gilles. I found Shawn Johnson and Drew Lachey obnoxious on All-Stars as well. They had different partners as well.  They were better with their original partners. 

Something about that whole season just rubbed me the wrong way. 

I vaguely remember much about allstars season because it was a horrible season. The only thing I enjoyed about that season was the team dances. Those were some of the best and most entertaining team dances I have seen on the show.

[tedd]

I wish they kept the Tuesday night elimination, but cut it to 1 hour, name the bottom 3, give them a 2nd chance to dance, and factor those judges scores in to determine who goes home. So percentage wise it makes it 60/40 judges scores vs voting. 

[vdw84]

4 minutes ago, tedd said:

I wish they kept the Tuesday night elimination, but cut it to 1 hour, name the bottom 3, give them a 2nd chance to dance, and factor those judges scores in to determine who goes home. So percentage wise it makes it 60/40 judges scores vs voting. 

Something needs to be done because its ridiculous someone as good as Tinashe got sent home over that disgrace Joe. Like I said, I think whoever is the lowest scorers need to automatically get bottom three or two and just have America duke it out on who should stay based on votes that way America can still have some power but u want be at major risk to lose someone really good.

[spanana]

58 minutes ago, boyznkatz said:

It wasn't just Gilles. I found Shawn Johnson and Drew Lachey obnoxious on All-Stars as well. They had different partners as well.  They were better with their original partners. 

Something about that whole season just rubbed me the wrong way. 

I don't have an opinion on Shawn because I didn't really pay much attention to her other than she had Derek and she obviously had improved since the first time she did the show she was a teen so she had more confidence here.  Drew made me sad but going in, I wasn't surprised.  Not his personality so much, but I think he had a chip on his shoulder being one of the earliest winners and feeling like he had a lot to prove and then ultimately sort of imploding.  I saw this as the biggest Drew/Cheryl S2 fan around, but also the dancing/expectations have improved over time on the show so things that were impressive on S2 (like Save a Horse), don't work in context now.  So yeah, I think he came in with a chip on his shoulder and left with one...which might have been exacerbated by the fact that he didn't get paired with Cheryl.  Though if anyone remembers the affair rumors that came out during one of the early tours saying supposedly they were cheating on their significant others with each other, I'm not sure the show would have put them together.  Or if Cheryl would have wanted to be paired with him.  Interestingly enough, the affair rumors came out and then Cheryl broke up with Matthew Lawrence, who she is now engaged to 10 years later, so clearly they got over whatever happened.

On note of this season, Bobby is busy playing victim on all social media outlets about how he's being criticized for existing and posting all the articles of Tinashe's surprise elimination while making it about how badly he's treated.  Talk about a victim complex.  And Jenna is busy trying to defend Joe and how it's about the journey and Joe has shown growth, which I get she has to defend her partner, but it's always amazing to me how pros when they are paired with those that have no experience are "all about the journey" and it's about people with no dance experience, yet when they have the ringers they shut their mouths and just accept their accolades.  If Jenna has a problem with dancers with experience, she can hand over her trophy with Adam.  The Normani fans are coming for her since they feel like she was shading the Normani type contestants too.  Have fun with that Jenna.

Edited October 18, 2018 by spanana

[boyznkatz]

I think I found all Derek's partners obnoxious except Amber and Brooke Burke, so I think his grating personality definitely rubs off on them.  

His choreography rocks, though, and his dances are the ones I remember the most.

Edited October 18, 2018 by boyznkatz

[Bridget]

1 hour ago, vdw84 said:

If they do another allstars season, then they need to make sure the contestants they get can have their original partners. I think the switching up of contestants and pros is what did it over because some contestants didnt have the same chemistry with their new partnership and that caused an issue. Gilles and Peta was a great example of this  and so what Apollo who was with Karina. It just didnt work.

I didn’t start watching until season 11, so I missed Gilles & Cheryl together. I will forever be bummed about that. However, your post reminded me of an amazing dance that I do remember from Peta & Gilles.

Many fantastic dances have stood out for me, but I still remember Gilles & Peta’s Bollywood dance and how damn great it was. I was exhausted after watching them perform! I know she had a lot of help and I liked that it wasn’t hidden during the rehearsal week video package.

I am not even a Peta fan, but I give her a lot of credit for working hard on that routine and to Gilles for being able to dance really well, especially given the difficult style. I can still remember what they wore, many of their moves and it still impresses me every time I see it. Ironically, I don’t remember their scores, but I remember that dance.

As an aside: I know why it’s not shown, but I really wish we saw more of the rehearsal week footage with the pros and how hard they work with their partners (except for Joe, because it’s Joe). We know there are only X number of steps in certain dances. Throw in the potential inability to teach something to someone, along with the fact that it’s not a secret not everyone is trained in ballroom - who helps them out?  I want to see collaboration on choreography or move set modification. I wonder who gets called to help coach a celeb partner, if at all. 

Also, why don’t all of the female pros have that upside down thigh-master looking thing that Cheryl uses to get her partners to work on their posture? 

I’d love to see more of the behind the scenes footage simply because of my sincere curiosity about how it all comes together.

[vdw84]

37 minutes ago, spanana said:

On note of this season, Bobby is busy playing victim on all social media outlets about how he's being criticized for existing and posting all the articles of Tinashe's surprise elimination while making it about how badly he's treated.  Talk about a victim complex.  And Jenna is busy trying to defend Joe and how it's about the journey and Joe has shown growth, which I get she has to defend her partner, but it's always amazing to me how pros when they are paired with those that have no experience are "all about the journey" and it's about people with no dance experience, yet when they have the ringers they shut their mouths and just accept their accolades.  If Jenna has a problem with dancers with experience, she can hand over her trophy with Adam.  The Normani fans are coming for her since they feel like she was shading the Normani type contestants too.  Have fun with that Jenna.

All of this, I saw her tweet. Like, honey was it about the journey and growth when u had big ringer Adam that u were so happy to get and won with??? Jenna needs to quit while she is ahead. I mean they are coming for her and im here for it. I have never cared for her as a person or pro. Bring in another troupe girl and demote Jenna back to the troupe. She can dance but cant teach worth a damn and last time a check Joe is not even growing and sure as hell don't have no journey because he doesnt want to be there.

[Bridget]

1 hour ago, vdw84 said:

Something needs to be done because its ridiculous someone as good as Tinashe got sent home over that disgrace Joe. Like I said, I think whoever is the lowest scorers need to automatically get bottom three or two and just have America duke it out on who should stay based on votes that way America can still have some power but u want be at major risk to lose someone really good.

I really do agree with your idea about those lowest on the totem pole being put on the block. I wish it was an option as it might start to make the show a bit more “respectable” again. 

I’m just throwing this out here: if the show did do a bottom 3, and Tinashe was in the bottom 3 & wasn’t saved by America, do you think you would you still be as upset (as you have the right to be) about her being eliminated early?

I know how I feel when ppl I really like get sent home early and it is disheartening, especially when it’s a show that one really enjoys. In fact, I stopped watching American Idol the week that Jennifer Hudson went home. I never watched  another episode again not have I seen the re-boot. 

The Voice allows fans to save people in jeopardy, but only during the east coast broadcast and via Twitter. As someone who is on the west coast, I hate that. 

If ABC did a “save a couple” format, they’d have to calculate:

-the west coast viewing audience

-those who don’t have a Twitter account

-those who don’t have satellite TV 

A few seasons ago, I tried voting online at abc.com and I found it to be a nightmare. I also elect not to engage in social media for professional reasons. 

I wonder if ABC can send out a mass text to its viewers to save XYZ, but now that I think about that, it ruins the show for the west coast because we will already know which couples were in danger by 5:50pm. That’s when a lot of ppl are at the gym, driving home, running errands and still finishing their day.

I do know I’m over thinking this way too much and I know it’s only a TV show. However, it can be a very, very long nine weeks with someone like Joe or Bristol Palin (twice! Ugh!) on your TV each week. 

[vdw84]

18 minutes ago, Bridget said:

’m just throwing this out here: if the show did do a bottom 3, and Tinashe was in the bottom 3 & wasn’t saved by America, do you think you would you still be as upset (as you have the right to be) about her being eliminated early?

I mean I will be upset but if its done the way I said earlier by scores only and not popularity of votes, I would be a bit more understanding . What happen to Tinashe was purely by votes because she a top scorer and noway did she need to be in danger of going home.

[calipiano81]

I think the format you are looking for is actually to have the bottom 2 couples (based on the combined total of scores and votes) dance off and have the JUDGES decide who will stay. This gives the better dancer of the two the highest chance of staying. 

So You Think You Can Dance over the years has used this format for the most part (judges picking who stays among the bottom 2 or 3 vote-getters). In fact, DWTS even did it for a few weeks during Season 9 and I thought they should have kept it.

Edited October 18, 2018 by calipiano81

[boyznkatz]

11 minutes ago, calipiano81 said:

I think the format you are looking for is actually to have the bottom 2 couples (based on the combined total of scores and votes) dance off and have the JUDGES decide who will stay. This gives the better dancer of the two the highest chance of staying. 

So You Think You Can Dance over the years has used this format for the most part (judges picking who stays among the bottom 2 or 3 vote-getters). In fact, DWTS even did it for a few weeks during Season 9 and I thought they should have kept it.

They also tried that in season 14 for a few weeks. They saved the good dancers for a couple of weeks, but then they got voted off the minute they went back to the regular format. I don't think it went over very well.

1 hour ago, vdw84 said:

All of this, I saw her tweet. Like, honey was it about the journey and growth when u had big ringer Adam that u were so happy to get and won with??? Jenna needs to quit while she is ahead. I mean they are coming for her and im here for it. I have never cared for her as a person or pro. Bring in another troupe girl and demote Jenna back to the troupe. She can dance but cant teach worth a damn and last time a check Joe is not even growing and sure as hell don't have no journey because he doesnt want to be there.

It isn't really her fault that Joe blows.

[spanana]

1 hour ago, boyznkatz said:

It isn't really her fault that Joe blows.

It’s not her fault that Joe sucks but it is her fault she’s on twitter talking about how it’s called DWTS and not So You Think You Can’t Dance and how it’s supposed to be about people that never danced before. As if she didn’t just win with Adam and as if she wasn’t up Normani’s butt when she was paired with Val. It’s also a very backhanded dig at Tinashe, whether she meant it that way or not.

[gohawks]

3 hours ago, vdw84 said:

All of this, I saw her tweet. Like, honey was it about the journey and growth when u had big ringer Adam that u were so happy to get and won with??? Jenna needs to quit while she is ahead. I mean they are coming for her and im here for it. I have never cared for her as a person or pro. Bring in another troupe girl and demote Jenna back to the troupe. She can dance but cant teach worth a damn and last time a check Joe is not even growing and sure as hell don't have no journey because he doesnt want to be there.

Stars who have previous dance training  experience growth  and also have a journey.  They work just as hard, if not harder. With Tinashe and Brandon you also get see this in the pro. 

Zendaya was someone who was a good dancer from the start and showed improvement.

Jenna needs to hush.

[boyznkatz]

1 hour ago, spanana said:

It’s not her fault that Joe sucks but it is her fault she’s on twitter talking about how it’s called DWTS and not So You Think You Can’t Dance and how it’s supposed to be about people that never danced before. As if she didn’t just win with Adam and as if she wasn’t up Normani’s butt when she was paired with Val. It’s also a very backhanded dig at Tinashe, whether she meant it that way or not.

Oh okay. I don’t do twitter so I didn’t know. Yes she does need to shut it.

[tedd]

BLOOP!!

[vdw84]

Jenna is really getting under my skin. I didnt care for her much anyway but now she is really sending me over the edge. She is right about one thing, its Dancing with the Stars not Walking with the Stars and that is what Joe is doing and has been doing for the past 4 weeks and I dont see this man getting any better, he doesnt want to be there and I get she wants to defend her partner but what she has to realize its going to be others that want to defend the people they voted for who got eliminated when they didnt derserve it. U cant just assume everyone that is attacking u didnt vote because im sure they did as many said they did.

[PTVjones]

Jenna is insecure and she always has been. There's a reason why Val clearly does not have the same type of relationships with his former female contestants like Zendaya, Rumer, or Normani. They threaten her in some kind of way. That's why I've only seen him communicate (via IG) with women like Ginger Zee, Tamar, or Laurie, women who she knows Val would never go there with. 

I remember when Fifth Harmony was having an album release party while she was on DWTS and I saw a picture of her with Val and Jenna at the party. Nowadays, I think I see Alan on Normani's IG page more than I see Val... 

I mean... I guess it's natural that could/should happen as men get more invested in monogamous relationships but they all work in the entertainment industry, I feel like maintaining connections with people, especially people who are on the rise in terms of star power, would be in more best interest. 

There's a video that Zendaya released a couple of years back that has Maks as one of the principal dancers, and this was well after her DWTS season. Zendaya and the brothers seemed legitimately close which I actually kind of liked, the genuineness of their big brother-little sister relationship. I wonder what happened with that... 

[MsJamieDornan]

14 hours ago, vdw84 said:

What happen to Tinashe was purely by votes because she a top scorer and noway did she need to be in danger of going home.

She had no fan base, no one knew who she was. She's gone.

[Toonces464]

7 hours ago, PTVjones said:

Jenna is insecure and she always has been. There's a reason why Val clearly does not have the same type of relationships with his former female contestants like Zendaya, Rumer, or Normani. They threaten her in some kind of way. That's why I've only seen him communicate (via IG) with women like Ginger Zee, Tamar, or Laurie, women who she knows Val would never go there with. 

I remember when Fifth Harmony was having an album release party while she was on DWTS and I saw a picture of her with Val and Jenna at the party. Nowadays, I think I see Alan on Normani's IG page more than I see Val... 

I mean... I guess it's natural that could/should happen as men get more invested in monogamous relationships but they all work in the entertainment industry, I feel like maintaining connections with people, especially people who are on the rise in terms of star power, would be in more best interest. 

There's a video that Zendaya released a couple of years back that has Maks as one of the principal dancers, and this was well after her DWTS season. Zendaya and the brothers seemed legitimately close which I actually kind of liked, the genuineness of their big brother-little sister relationship. I wonder what happened with that... 

It's always been so surprising to me how Maks maintains no relationships with his partners, other than Erin, when you look at how close most of the other pros remain with their partners.....Val included. I'm sorry that he's now following in big brother's footsteps with that and I'm even sorrier if it's because of Jenna because I think Val really did make some close friendships with his partners that lasted past their seasons. 

I know most partnerships don't end up in the super-close, members-of-each-others-families type of relationships Tony has with Leah Remini and Karina has with Ralph Macchio, but I saw Mark post pics in the last couple of weeks of both Paige and Kristi coming to see him at Kinky Boots. Derek recently did the intro and presentation for an award Amy Purdy received and if I'm not mistaken, he did Lip Sync Battle not too long ago with Nicole. I see Tony interact with so many of his former partners on social media. 

One thing I did find weird was Maks and Peta traveling last week to Victoria Arlen's charity event in Dallas and them coming back to LA all attached to her. This is the second partner of Val's they've glommed themselves onto that I didn't consider Val to be especially close with. The other one was Rumer who, to me, always seemed like she got closer to "the fam" than she did to Val.

Sadly, I think it all boils down to what seems to be the Chmerkovskiy way of life --- if they're not the center of your universe, they don't have a lot of use for you.

[vdw84]

9 hours ago, PTVjones said:

Jenna is insecure and she always has been. There's a reason why Val clearly does not have the same type of relationships with his former female contestants like Zendaya, Rumer, or Normani. They threaten her in some kind of way. That's why I've only seen him communicate (via IG) with women like Ginger Zee, Tamar, or Laurie, women who she knows Val would never go there with. 

I remember when Fifth Harmony was having an album release party while she was on DWTS and I saw a picture of her with Val and Jenna at the party. Nowadays, I think I see Alan on Normani's IG page more than I see Val... 

I mean... I guess it's natural that could/should happen as men get more invested in monogamous relationships but they all work in the entertainment industry, I feel like maintaining connections with people, especially people who are on the rise in terms of star power, would be in more best interest. 

There's a video that Zendaya released a couple of years back that has Maks as one of the principal dancers, and this was well after her DWTS season. Zendaya and the brothers seemed legitimately close which I actually kind of liked, the genuineness of their big brother-little sister relationship. I wonder what happened with that... 

I think the reason Val isnt so close to Normani, Zendaya and Rumer anymore because all three of these women were being shipped with him. Im still trying to wrap my  head around why 16 year old Zendaya at the time was being shipped with Val but that is another story at another time but im sure Val knew he couldnt be as open with these women and keep a close relationship being with Jenna even tho nothing romantic went on but because fans wanted them together it could cause some mess and with Jenna being the insecure chick she is want be able to handle it. That is why I dont  think Val will ever get another young, attractive and talented partner again.

1 hour ago, MsJamieDornan said:

She had no fan base, no one knew who she was. She's gone.

She had her own fanbase but we all know that is not enough to make it far or win this competition. She just couldnt get the GP on her side which is sad, u need that dwts main demo to back u as well. The same thing happen with Normani as she place 3rd place. With all her harmonizers and Val being a seasoned popular pro with a strong fanbase she still couldnt even atleast get 2nd place because GP never fully supported her like David and Rashad.  Same thing may happen to Alexis, she has a huge sm following but if she cannot get the dwts GP on her side, she will be out as well. Dwts GP is filled with middleage conservative white women, im just being honest and the its huge gamble in getting them to support you if u do not fit demo type.

Edited October 19, 2018 by vdw84

[vdw84]

1 hour ago, Toonces464 said:

It's always been so surprising to me how Maks maintains no relationships with his partners, other than Erin, when you look at how close most of the other pros remain with their partners.....Val included. I'm sorry that he's now following in big brother's footsteps with that and I'm even sorrier if it's because of Jenna because I think Val really did make some close friendships with his partners that lasted past their seasons. 

I know most partnerships don't end up in the super-close, members-of-each-others-families type of relationships Tony has with Leah Remini and Karina has with Ralph Macchio, but I saw Mark post pics in the last couple of weeks of both Paige and Kristi coming to see him at Kinky Boots. Derek recently did the intro and presentation for an award Amy Purdy received and if I'm not mistaken, he did Lip Sync Battle not too long ago with Nicole. I see Tony interact with so many of his former partners on social media. 

One thing I did find weird was Maks and Peta traveling last week to Victoria Arlen's charity event in Dallas and them coming back to LA all attached to her. This is the second partner of Val's they've glommed themselves onto that I didn't consider Val to be especially close with. The other one was Rumer who, to me, always seemed like she got closer to "the fam" than she did to Val.

Sadly, I think it all boils down to what seems to be the Chmerkovskiy way of life --- if they're not the center of your universe, they don't have a lot of use for you.

Maks was super close to Mel b, I remember he use to spend thanksgiving with her at her home alot but that friendship ended it seems like, maybe because Mel b has been having her own issues in regular life with her ex husband but I just remember how close they were and then poof nomore friendship.

[PTVjones]

22 minutes ago, vdw84 said:

I think the reason Val isnt so close to Normani, Zendaya and Rumer anymore because all three of these women were being shipped with him. Im still trying to wrap my  head around why 16 year old Zendaya at the time was being shipped with Val but that is another story at another time but im sure Val knew he couldnt be as open with these women and keep a close relationship being with Jenna even tho nothing romantic went on but because fans wanted them together it could cause some mess and with Jenna being the insecure chick she is want be able to handle it. That is why I dont  think Val will ever get another young, attractive and talented partner again.

She had her own fanbase but we all know that is not enough to make it far or win this competition. She just couldnt get the GP on her side which is sad, u need that dwts main demo to back u as well. The same thing happen with Normani as she place 3rd place. With all her harmonizers and Val being a seasoned popular pro with a strong fanbase she still couldnt even atleast get 2nd place because GP never fully supported her like David and Rashad.  Same thing may happen to Alexis, she has a huge sm following but if she cannot get the dwts GP on her side, she will be out as well. Dwts GP is filled with middleage conservative white women, im just being honest and the its huge gamble in getting them to support you if u do not fit demo type.

I remember Val and Zendaya being shipped, which was weird. Even though the first thing he told her was that she was beautiful and then asked her age, proceeded to immediately take it back when she said she was 16. I'll never forget that lol.

However, it's news to me that Val was being shipped with Normani

[boyznkatz]

Just now, PTVjones said:

However, it's news to me that Val was being shipped with Normani

I thought he had the hots for her all on his own. I don't remember fans shipping them, though.

While I agree with others that this particular demo won't vote for black women, I felt that Normani was pimped plenty on the show. Her band got to sing several times, and she got a lot of buzz. I don't think the show pimped David Ross. He was popular because he's the type of contestant that this show's demo loves.

As for Rashad, yes, they pimped him as well and the tour probably had a lot to do with that.

[spanana]

10 hours ago, PTVjones said:

There's a video that Zendaya released a couple of years back that has Maks as one of the principal dancers, and this was well after her DWTS season. Zendaya and the brothers seemed legitimately close which I actually kind of liked, the genuineness of their big brother-little sister relationship. I wonder what happened with that... 

I certainly can't speak to Jenna's role in Val's relationships with his former partners, but  Maks did that video over Val was because at the time Val was busy with DWTS and Maks wasn't.  However I think part of the Zendaya/Val growing apart were a few things.  First she's just gotten older and her season was five plus years ago already, second I think she can better clearly see Val for his bullshit.  Especially since she's a bit of an activist and Val's put a lot of stupid views out there over recent years.  But I truly think the final nail in that coffin was his book.  I think this was discussed at the time, but I've seen the chapter he wrote about her and it was oddly belittling considering how much he kissed her ass previously.  The tone was different.  There were some digs at her not having work ethic before she got to him (almost like he was trying to take credit for her success) and some weird lines about how she was more into her "little boyfriend" and wasn't putting 100% of her attention into him during early rehearsals and he had to have talk with her and her family.  Which none of it was horrible, but it was a little weird and demeaning.  Especially when I want to be like, really Val? A relatively shy 16 year old girl wasn't totally comfortable dancing with and hanging all over a 25 year old man at first? It took her some time to warm up to you and your ways and what DWTS was about? I'm shocked.  Anyway, I noticed even Zendaya's mother seemed to finally start distancing herself after the book.  Then on top of that, when Val did the book tour he stayed namedropping her as his fave partner in like every interview when what he actually said in the book didn't reflect that.  I think he did attend a general screening of The Greatest Showman that she held in LA and brought along one of the DWTS producers, but that is the last public intermingling I've seen.

One thing also Val is not good at is not pissing off the fanbases of his various partners.  He has plenty of his own fans of course, but he gained all of these PLL fans from Janel and they all hate him of course because of how he treated her, which is also made worse in his book since he basically owns up to it all being fake on his part, but Janel fell for him for real.  Though he never bothered to clue her in.  Zendaya fans started hating him because of a lot of his social views he posts on social media, but the book was the final nail in the coffin for them too since they were pissed about that.  Normani fans hate him, again mostly for his social views he's expressed online, etc.   Though the latter two fanbases greatly overlap. 

Oh, and the Rumer thing is weird too. Rumer has a relationship with Peta and maybe some of the other fam.  Though less than she used to years ago.  But she almost has zero relationship with Val. 

Edited October 19, 2018 by spanana

[vdw84]

39 minutes ago, boyznkatz said:

I thought he had the hots for her all on his own. I don't remember fans shipping them, though.

While I agree with others that this particular demo won't vote for black women, I felt that Normani was pimped plenty on the show. Her band got to sing several times, and she got a lot of buzz. I don't think the show pimped David Ross. He was popular because he's the type of contestant that this show's demo loves.

As for Rashad, yes, they pimped him as well and the tour probably had a lot to do with that.

Yes, Normani got pimped alot her season but she never got that GP on her side. It was her strong fanbase that kept her on. The GP was inlove with David and Rashad. The GP of course was calling cocky, stuckup, boring and standoffish, go figure.

[vdw84]

5 minutes ago, spanana said:

I certainly can't speak to Jenna's role in Val's relationships with his former partners, but  Maks did that video over Val was because at the time Val was busy with DWTS and Maks wasn't.  However I think part of the Zendaya/Val growing apart were a few things.  First she's just gotten older and her season was five plus years ago already, second I think she can better clearly see Val for his bullshit.  Especially since she's a bit of an activist and Val's put a lot of stupid views out there over recent years.  But I truly think the final nail in that coffin was his book.  I think this was discussed at the time, but I've seen the chapter he wrote about her and it was oddly belittling considering how much he kissed her ass previously.  The tone was different.  There were some digs at her not having work ethic before she got to him (almost like he was trying to take credit for her success) and some weird lines about how she was more into her "little boyfriend" and wasn't putting 100% of her attention into him during early rehearsals and he had to have talk with her and her family.  Which none of it was horrible, but it was a little weird and demeaning.  Especially when I want to be like, really Val? A relatively shy 16 year old girl wasn't totally comfortable dancing with and hanging all over a 25 year old man at first? It took her some time to warm up to you and your ways and what DWTS was about? I'm shocked.  Anyway, I noticed even Zendaya's mother seemed to finally start distancing herself after the book.  Then on top of that, when Val did the book tour he stayed namedropping her as his fave partner in like every interview when what he actually said in the book didn't reflect that.  I think he did attend a general screening of The Greatest Showman that she held in LA and brought along one of the DWTS producers, but that is the last public intermingling I've seen.

One thing also Val is not good at is not pissing off the fanbases of his various partners.  He has plenty of his own fans of course, but he gained all of these PLL fans from Janel and they all hate him of course because of how he treated her, which is also made worse in his book since he basically owns up to it all being fake on his part, but Janel fell for him for real.  Though he never bothered to clue her in.  Zendaya fans started hating him because of a lot of his social views he posts on social media, but the book was the final nail in the coffin for them too since they were pissed about that.  Normani fans hate him, again mostly for his social views he's expressed online, etc.   Though the latter two fanbases greatly overlap. 

I think Val realizes his popularity is falling off, as to why im sure he is hoping Dwts Jr. takesoff and continues to do well because I think his fanbase is losing interest with him. A good bit of his fans hate he is with Jenna and think he comesoff as a hypocrite which he does. I remember when he was saying something about women need to stop showing so much and some fans came in and said something about do u say this to all the female pros on dwts??