Season Four General Discussion

[AZChristian]

Except Browntown isn't anywhere near the dock.  I'd rather zipline, thank you.  But I DID see the famous Town Dump where they get all their supplies!  It was tidier than Browntown.

[Rock knocker]

Maybe the mayor is going to tell them that the town was going to start using Browntown as the dump, as a way of cleaning up the area

[SRTouch]

13 minutes ago, AZChristian said:

Except Browntown isn't anywhere near the dock.  I'd rather zipline, thank you.  But I DID see the famous Town Dump where they get all their supplies!  It was tidier than Browntown.

Guess after the "gunshots in the night" drove them out of the Copper River country the production decided to move further from neighbors. Too bad that neighbor didn't appreciate helicopters flying over, that cabin was sweet - and there was pizza half a mile down the road. Course, I think the deciding factor was that part of Alaska gets quite a bit colder than the Alaskan panhandle - they might have actually had to wear winter clothing, as there's only so much fur on Cupcake. (I wonder how far along Ami has gotten with that fur whatever.)

I do wonder how far their cove is from town. Sometimes it's a good boat ride away, yet remember those girls who came to visit had no trouble when they came by canoe. Maybe their dates knew a secret shortcut - like a power boat that towed the canoe and stopped right off camera.

[Beden]

Quote

Guess after the "gunshots in the night" drove them out of the Copper River country the production decided to move further from neighbors.

If we're to believe the promo for next week those pesky gun-totin' neighbors are back again with mysterious gunshots in the night. Another plot being recycled. And the morons spent an entire episode floating a derelict shack covered with slime/mold and inhabited by tiny crabs...then--somehow--towed it to their beach and only the good lord knows how they'll get it to high ground. In stead of actually clearing the flotsam from the shore, which is what they were supposed to be doing.

This is becoming unwatchable.

[mmmsoap]

Rain and Birdbrain showed us how much they live off the land by harvesting fiddle heads and eating them raw...except m understanding is that fiddleheads are poisonous raw (they give you bad diarrhea).  Source from a super quick googling to see whether I was misremembering. 

[mmmsoap]

Bah, now Noah. Okay, my chemistry is a bit rusty, but a hydrogen burner? It takes more energy to isolate hydrogen than he's going to get out of it, because no collection method is 100% efficient. Hydrogen is useful for things like rocket propulsion, not a Bunsen burner. 

[Rock knocker]

Your physics is correct, he will use more energy making the hydrogen than he will burning the hydrogen. But...

The heat (not the capital H that is used in physics), but the kind that burns your hand) from the bunsen burners could be much hotter and longer lasting than any heat Noah could generate from 12v electrical resistance heaters (stove top).  If he could collect the electricity slowly over time and store it like he is in batteries, then store the hydrogen it could be useful.  Could be is the operative here.  It would take quite a bit of hydrogen, probably pumped to a decent pressure for this to work.  Noah's glass jars and batteries charged off the gas generator fail both a safety test and the Laws of Conservation of mass and energy as far as being useful.

As has been pointed out many times, they are all emotionally and intellectually stunted.  Twenty seven year old Bear runs around like a 13 year old, and Noah's hydrogen experiment is worthy of a 12 year old.  Noah is twenty, there are twenty year old in college working on real science, not this crap.

[AZChristian]

Noah is at least 23.  If he were as smart as he professes to be, he'd be in grad school by now.  But he's so much smarter than people who went to college.

Not.

[Beden]

I admit that I know squat about making/refining hydrogen but my baby boy is a professional glass worker who majored in it in college and has been supporting himself with it for years. He specializes in torch work; working/ melting/shaping glass using a specialized torch; it's like a very high end Bunsen burner with more controls and costs a fortune for the good ones as opposed to glass blowing with a big furnace and the glob of molten glass on a long blow pipe. His torch uses either propane or acytelyn (sp, I know), usually mixed with oxygen.

Both are readily available or, in the bush, just go on down to the local dump...and both gases burn just fine, thank you. I'm assuming that the local plumbers or welders and the like could steer Noah in the right direction. Either that or he could clue them into the bush production of hydrogen. Another possibility would be for Noah to get a herd of cows; they produce milk and you can eat them. Their methane also burns well.

[SRTouch]

5 hours ago, mmmsoap said:

Rain and Birdbrain showed us how much they live off the land by harvesting fiddle heads and eating them raw...except m understanding is that fiddleheads are poisonous raw (they give you bad diarrhea).  Source from a super quick googling to see whether I was misremembering. 

Good catch. Not living around fiddle head harvesters that went right by me, but once you mention it in recall seeing something about people harvesting them in Maine, and now even remembering cautions about washing your hands after handling them and not eating them raw.

Like MMMSOAP, I then did a quick Google search. Something I read grabbed my attention. Seems one type, the bracken fern fiddleheads, usually found on the west coast, can cause cancer, and can inhibit the body's use of thiamin (vitamin B1) , which would affect brain cells activity. http://www.gracelinks.org/2296/real-food-right-now-and-how-to-cook-it-fiddleheads (could this be why the Brown children seem to get dumber as they age.) Oh, and cooking reduces the anti-vitamin B1 effect.

Edited June 11, 2016 by SRTouch
Correction

[SRTouch]

5 hours ago, Beden said:

If we're to believe the promo for next week those pesky gun-totin' neighbors are back again with mysterious gunshots in the night. Another plot being recycled. And the morons spent an entire episode floating a derelict shack covered with slime/mold and inhabited by tiny crabs...then--somehow--towed it to their beach and only the good lord knows how they'll get it to high ground. In stead of actually clearing the flotsam from the shore, which is what they were supposed to be doing.

This is becoming unwatchable.

All the useless prattle from Billy about how useful the lumber on the beach would be, and what do "kids" bring home? Too bad Billy hurt his knee, if he had been there I'm sure the hard working Billy would have salvaged all the crap ... Oh I mean useful building material. Besides that piece of dock and the shack, did they get any of that stuff off the beach? Maybe they can use some of that lumber from the dock and finally start building that boardwalk Billy told us they needed at the start of the season. You know all they need to do is build a few yards, go to commercial, and the construction fairies (contractors hired by production) will have a boardwalk done when we come back - or at the very least it will just magically appear by next week.

That reminds me, what ever happened to that homemade barrel barge? Is that thing still tied up at the Hoonah dock, or maybe it was part of the trash washed up on the beach and we just didn't see it? Surely they could repurpose the planks and some of those barrels? Matt could even make a deceit "bush BBQ grill". Well, I guess they won't need a grill until the next time Twila comes to visit.

I have to wonder what the good townsfolk of Hoonah think of their mayor promoting their town by showing this view of their pristine shore. I can see it now. An announcer comes over the cruise ship loudspeaker announcing the ship is arriving at Hoonah. Half the passengers decide to sleep in because they know the beach is full of crap the Browns didn't clean up. The other half go ashore hoping to catch Matt in his natural habitat stumbling out of the bar, or the other "kids" eating pizza while on their I phones or wearing earphones. Yep, the mayor is a leader in the Hoonah tourism industry.

[SRTouch]

As the time comes for Billy and Bam to report to Juneau to serve their sentence there has been more effort to spin the conviction. Part of the Hoonah mayor's appearance was spent telling Billy that "real Alaskans" don't believe the lies the "man" is telling, and that they still support the Browns. The mayor, after looking around at the disaster known as Browntown, says (with a straight face) he can see all the hard work the Browns have done. (In case you haven't picked up on it, I don't think much of the Honorable Mayor Skaflestad.) Tonight we got repeats of Billy telling us the confessions were done under duress and were only made to protect the family and put this horrible persecution of the honest Brown clan behind them. We hear from both Bam and Billy about how terrible "prison" is going to be for both of them.

Uh, yeah, as bad as those months living in a motel in Seattle. They'll be under house arrest, not jail - certainly not prison, wearing ankle monitors and ordering pizza. http://www.adn.com/crime-justice/article/father-son-alaskan-bush-people-ankle-monitors-juneau/2016/04/19/ They're even going to have to drink... tap (shudder) water - oh the horror. No beer with their pizza, either, as they aren't allowed any alcohol and have to submit to periodic piss tests - truely cruel and unusual punishment. Reports online are that the whole family is in Juneau, well except for Matt, who is rumored to be rehabbing.  http://radaronline.com/celebrity-news/alaskan-bush-people-live-in-hotel-billy-brown-big-city-juneau/  and  http://www.thebitbag.com/alaskan-bush-people-fake-family-lives-hotel-not-wild-eldest-son-rehab/156705 

Most times I ignore the preposterous back story and laugh at the portrayal of their attempts to live in the bush - sort of like the old Eddie Albert/Eva Gabor  comedy, Green Acres. But, when they start their anti-goverment crap, it stops being funny to me and, well, just pisses me off - which is probably being reflected in my posts this week.

[Rock knocker]

9 hours ago, SRTouch said:

The mayor, after looking around at the disaster known as Browntown, says (with a straight face) he can see all the hard work the Browns have done. 

 

Actually I think he said "I can see your crew has really been working".  Could be a crucial tell

 

9 hours ago, SRTouch said:

................We hear from both Bam and Billy about how terrible "prison" is going to be for both of them.

.............. They'll be under house arrest, not jail - certainly not prison, wearing ankle monitors and ordering pizza.

I wonder how many times they were raped in prison?

Edited June 12, 2016 by Rock knocker

[brgjoe]

All during this episode, I kept agreeing with good ol' Bam Bam.  And now I feels so dirty.  ;)   

I mean, trying to salvage that cabin was so completely stupid.  Never mind the danger in getting the thing jacked up and trying to put it on the barge.  As well as magically getting it on shore and dragging it to Browntown.  No, that cabin has got to be full of mold and who knows what other nasty little microscopic life forms.  *Maybe* you can salvage some of the wood from it.  But to actually live in that thing?  I'd take Noah's chicken coop over that thing.

And what about the other scrap wood and nails they were going to salvage?  Did they actually take them on that barge?  If so, I must have missed it.  All I saw was them floating that silly cabin back. 

Of course Billy gets hurt again.  And again, we didn't see how.  Supposedly on a walk and twists his knee.  Funny how that trick knee acts up whenever serious work is about to be done.  :)

Easily one of the more outlandish, totally non believable episodes of the season.  And that's saying quite a lot.

[Beden]

Quote

................We hear from both Bam and Billy about how terrible "prison" is going to be for both of them.

.............. They'll be under house arrest, not jail - certainly not prison, wearing ankle monitors and ordering pizza.

To be fair (and it kills me to write this) but didn't the house arrest/ankle shackle thing happen relatively late and they may have really thought that they were going to the hoosegow.

Hoosegow--now there's a word for you!

Seriously, how people can actually buy this steaming pile o'crap and believe it, feel sorry for these poor people under the oh too close eye of da man...I mean, c'mon...maybe there's a bridge for sale in Hoonah.

[brgjoe]

@Beden:  Normally I would also agree with you here.  It is plausible that could be the case.  But I'm sorry -- I have put up with too much bullshitttery with this bunch to give them the benefit of the doubt. 

My enhanced BS detector thinks that this "going to prison" stuff is just to garner them more sympathy with the "true believers" of this show.  I could very well be wrong, of course.  But normally my BS detector does a pretty good job of detecting the BS from these so-called reality-type shows.

[Beden]

It seems we're agreeing with one another here, Joe. BS is mother's milk in Browntown and, being the compulsive twit that I sometimes am, I was just trying to be fair (or something). I'll see your BS and raise you a load o'crap.

I'm constantly astounded by people who really do buy this garbage at face value. On the other hand, PT Barnum had it right about a sucker born every minute. On one hand it's sad, on the other--seriously? Grow a brain.

[DoctorK]

Quote

the "true believers" of this show

Now this is a truly depressing concept.

[Rock knocker]

I'm still betting that strong man got rid of all that extra testosterone at Billy's expense while he was incarcerated at the Holiday Inn and beset with convulsion, kidney ailments and bad knees.  

 

Strong man probably mistook the convulsions as a sign that Billy liked it.

[Beden]

Quote

the "true believers" of this show

Now this is a truly depressing concept.

One every minute....

[jumper sage]

On 6/11/2016 at 10:12 AM, AZChristian said:

Noah is at least 23.  If he were as smart as he professes to be, he'd be in grad school by now.  But he's so much smarter than people who went to college.

Not.

Billy will never let college happen.  It's like his cult.  He brainwashed his wife as a teenager and now they have their very own cult.  They would do well across the pond as travelers.

[SRTouch]

Once again the folks at Discovery put on a fake new episode designed to fool my DVR into recording it. This week we are treated to an interview with Billy featuring pop-ups and rerun clips. I must have watched a minute or two before deleting it. Just guessing, but maybe they sell advertising based on the fact people record the episodes, even though they never actually watch it.

[Beden]

On 6/14/2016 at 8:33 PM, jumper sage said:

Billy will never let college happen.  It's like his cult.  He brainwashed his wife as a teenager and now they have their very own cult.  They would do well across the pond as travelers.

This comment gt me thinking (along with recent national news and happenings). We've joked about Browntown and it's inhabitants being a cult and all of that but it occurred to me that, in a way, while they're certainly charlatans, cheats, thieves and BSers, they're basically harmless. Annoying and dishonest, vile lying slobs with no respect for the environment but relatively harmless. They're not murdering anyone. They're not protesting (ala Waynesboros Baptist Church), they're not, as far as I know, lodging endless lawsuits against anyone.

Not to misunderstand; they're not nice people and I don't want to sit down for dinner with them or have them move in next door but my take is that if you choose to buy the crap they're selling, it's on your own head.

Just saying.

[mmmsoap]

Watching some reruns today and I realized something: my least favorite Brown Clown (Noah, Bam, Bird) are the ones that pretty clearly believe their wn bullshit.  Noah actually thinks he's a genius; Bam seems to be aware of that in general the family is acting, but I think the squabbling with his siblings is real, because he thinks he's better at everything then them; Bird's in idiot, and really seems to believe that  she's an amazing crack shot, that she can teach her brothers things about shooting, that her dad actually put her "in charge" of things, etc. 

 

 Meanwhile, Bear  is kind of a spaz, but I am more and more convinced that he's doing it on purpose (especially when he makes a point to make fun of Bam for crashing into the docks). Gabe is pretty happy go lucky, and  not too crazy serious about the whole thing. Matt I'm convinced is fully aware that he's acting, and puts all of the "hyper" and "crazy" persona on purpose. 

[DoctorK]

Oh Lord, I am watching this episode now. Did that moron actually design a boat with mylar sails that will use the solar wind? The solar wind is a real thing but this moron is so ignorant that it is painful to watch (but I still watch, like looking at a train wreck).

[jumper sage]

27 minutes ago, DoctorK said:

Oh Lord, I am watching this episode now. Did that moron actually design a boat with mylar sails that will use the solar wind? The solar wind is a real thing but this moron is so ignorant that it is painful to watch (but I still watch, like looking at a train wreck).

I finally found the words to describe this mess.  It's as if they are 8 year old boys having adventures and inventions all the while a good mother is yelling at them that they will kill each other and to knock it off.  If only there was a good mother/father.  Are they in some kind of a time warp?  A welding helmet with a security camera?  Yep, that should work.

Edited June 18, 2016 by jumper sage

[DoctorK]

Quote

 It's as if they are 8 year old boys having adventures

To me that is the real tragedy here. These kids have been stunted in their intellectual and emotional growth by their parents' manipulative and dysfunctional parenting. I don't think any of these kids would be worth a shit even without their screwed up parenting, but they would not be as hopelessly screwed up as they are without bullshitbilly and spotlessami messing up their development.

[SRTouch]

A shot rings out, and the clan grab their guns and run around out in the dark. Course two or three of the idiots light up flares, so they stumble around not able to see 10 feet in front of them because the flares have destroyed any night vision they had. Next morning Billy wants to talk to everybody about the gunshot - too bad there's  not a signal to call everyone together, something like a bell made from propane tanks. 

All the boys demonstrate their creativity. In a stroke of genius Matt makes a boat out of an air mattress. Just a few kinks to work out, like steering and propulsion. Bam makes a swing out of pallets and an old mat, and does a bush patch job on a bouy with an old bicycle tire. Noah repurposes junk from the dump, and make a new security alarm for the boat, and night vision goggles that Billy has fun with. Bear makes an EXTREME zip line. It's  AWESOME! And Gabe.... well he doesn't run the Integrity aground. 

This week's hauling job has Matt, Gabe, and the girls off on a day job Matt found. With just the four of them they actually use a come along for some mechanical advantage - and almost run the Integrity aground because they fiddle fart around all day. Not sure what happened to all that rope they had when they towed that homemade barge, but they have to bring the Integrity dangerously close to shore to do their job. Just think, if they had thought to bring a chainsaw they would have had time for a picnic and maybe gone fishing - well if they have fishing licenses this year. Maybe they left the rope on the dock when they hauled Gabe's shack to Brown town. Where is that shack anyway, did it float back out with the tide?

Don't recall seeing Ami - must still be down at the creek trying to get that comforter white again. Wonder how the plumbing for the tub is coming? No hurry I guess, Ami has waited all these years already for an indoor tub.

Billy and Bam moaned about having to go to the Big House. This week Bam tells us how it tore him up having to make that false confession, but he did it to PROTECT THE FAMILY. Billy whines that he doesn't know if he'll survive being locked up. Wonder which Juneau hotel they'll end up serving their time in, and will they do their community service while they're in Juneau staying at the hotel.

[brgjoe]

You summed it up quite nicely, SRTouch.

Here's how jaded and cynical I am about this show.  When they showed Matt and his stupid raft (geesh, what a huge waste of resources that thing is), I actually thought it would wind up saving the day later on in the episode.  "Oh noes, the Integrity can't get any closer!  The water is too shallow!  And the skiff's motor won't start!  How can we get to the shore!  I know!  Matt has this awesome raft with SOLAR SAILS to come to the rescue for us!" 

Good thing I was wrong about that.  Probably would've lost my lunch, er, dinner if that happened.

After seeing Matt and the gang try to get those things off the shore, I kept thinking, "Who in their right mind would hire these people to do anything of importance?"  I realize that help out there in remote areas might be few and far between.  But you'd think even desperate folks could find better help than those incompetent Browntown fools.

No Ami in this one.  Maybe she's too busy baking a huge cake with nail files in it so Billy and Bam Bam could escape their jail cells.  ;)

[Beden]

5 hours ago, brgjoe said:

Matt has this awesome raft with SOLAR SAILS to come to the rescue for us!" 

Am I mistaken in thinking that solar sails are used in outer space for like satellites and space stations? Or am I hallucinating?

 

5 hours ago, brgjoe said:

After seeing Matt and the gang try to get those things off the shore, I kept thinking, "Who in their right mind would hire these people to do anything of importance?"  I realize that help out there in remote areas might be few and far between.  But you'd think even desperate folks could find better help than those incompetent Browntown fools.

Too true but the usual range of locals needing help with this and that probably don't have a budget from a production company to pay them for their trouble.

Air mattress boat? My son made one of those a number of years ago for use in the pool we had then. It worked great so long as a couple of kids were in the water pushing it. Until it got a hole in it. I recall my son was about 10 that year,

Edited June 18, 2016 by Beden

[AZChristian]

On 6/17/2016 at 10:37 PM, SRTouch said:

 

Billy whines that he doesn't know if he'll survive being locked up. Wonder which Juneau hotel they'll end up serving their time in, and will they do their community service while they're in Juneau staying at the hotel.

Rumor has it that they stayed at the Extended Stay America in Juneau.  And all I've heard for sure about the community service is that there will not be TV cameras to film that part of their penalty.  I'm not sure if they can do ANYTHING without video cameras.  They're like Disney animatronics - nothing works until the switch is flipped.

[SRTouch]

1 hour ago, AZChristian said:

Rumor has it that they stayed at the Extended Stay America in Juneau.  And all I've heard for sure about the community service is that there will not be TV cameras to film that part of their penalty.  I'm not sure if they can do ANYTHING without video cameras.  They're like Disney animatronics - nothing works until the switch is flipped.

Wonder what they bartered? Rumor has it the whole family went to Juneau. Guess there's lots of day labor for those big hardworking boys. I have the same question about they Juneau accommodations as Seattle. For a bunch of bush people, surely they could find a spot to camp. There must be campgrounds around Juneau that would have been lots cheaper, and I know Seattle has campgrounds. Maybe the campground managers have seen Browntown in that formerly pristine forrest on TV and wouldn't let them stay. No Juneau salvage yards either, I guess?

[AZChristian]

Why camp?  They don't LIVE anywhere near a real campground; they just film there.  And why barter?  They have PLENTY of money.

[SRTouch]

2 minutes ago, AZChristian said:

Why camp?  They don't LIVE anywhere near a real campground; they just film there.  And why barter?  They have PLENTY of money.

Well, they need to camp so Bear can start a fire and not going into smoke withdrawal like in the terrible lower 48. Otherwise they could just take the Integrity and sleep on board.

[CaptainRick]

Billy states that he signed the plea agreement to keep the family out of jail,  and that it was not true. Guess what Billy, that's called PERJURY! I hope the prosecutor was watching. I've had clients that do the same thing to avoid trial, but they weren't stupid enough to announce it on TV!

[Beden]

Quote

Billy states that he signed the plea agreement to keep the family out of jail,  and that it was not true. Guess what Billy, that's called PERJURY! I hope the prosecutor was watching. I've had clients that do the same thing to avoid trial, but they weren't stupid enough to announce it on TV!

Now that's an interesting catch--what could the possible ramifications be from that if anyone cared enough to press charges? Is it purjury if it's not in court under oath? I'm not sure, did Bam also make the same mistake? I also wonder how much hair their lawyer has on his/her head after pulling it all out over the last few months.

Inquiring minds want to know

[CaptainRick]

Yep, pleas are taken under oath. If he later says "nope, I wasn't really guilty," that means he lied unber oath. I guess it came natural to Billy, since he's paid to lie every week! I think they should have used a group insanity defence, using Bear as evidence.

[DoctorK]

Quote

If he later says "nope, I wasn't really guilty," that means he lied unber oath.

Does this mean that if the judge is sufficiently pissed off about the perjury, he can rescind the plea deal and send these losers to jail?

[CaptainRick]

The prosecutor would bring charges on the perjury, and hopefully Billy would spend additional time in jail. Never seen anyone in this situation, but maybe the prosecutor could move to invalidate the plea, giving Billy even more time. 

It would be a vacation from the bush. A nice heated bearproof cell, running water, a toilet, and decent meals instead of raw  fiddleheads. and clean clothes! Maybe that was Billy's plan all along!

[zoemom]

Quote

This is becoming unwatchable

Beden -ITA. I DVR the shows, since I'm at work (REAL work, I might add).  I settled in to watch the episode which should have been titled "The World According to Billy" I watched for about 5 minutes (5 minutes of my life I'll never get back!) and just couldn't take another minute of listening to his ignorant boasting.  The more I listened the more annoyed I became until "click" no more.

I watched the "Wolfpack Father's Day Special" last night (I'm not sure how I missed the Hoonah beach clean-up episode) but agree, didn't see much "clean up" performed - once again - another idiotic episode based around the Brown's - after watching this episode I am truly amazed that all of the clan have managed to survive to adulthood.

[Beden]

2 hours ago, CaptainRick said:

The prosecutor would bring charges on the perjury, and hopefully Billy would spend additional time in jail. Never seen anyone in this situation, but maybe the prosecutor could move to invalidate the plea, giving Billy even more time. 

It would be a vacation from the bush. A nice heated bearproof cell, running water, a toilet, and decent meals instead of raw  fiddleheads. and clean clothes! Maybe that was Billy's plan all along!

I'm not either a petty or vengeful person but the level of BS on this show has reached the point where I'd not complain if their lenient sentences were pulled and they had to actually face some real penalties for their non-stop grifting, lies and general lifestyle at the expense of you, me and whom ever else has to pick up their bills and mess. (Sorry for the run on sentence...) I mean, seriously, they're profiting from this bastardized version or their supposed reailty. I know--a sucker's born every minute but, c'mon; this is now insulting.

[SRTouch]

8 hours ago, DoctorK said:

Does this mean that if the judge is sufficiently pissed off about the perjury, he can rescind the plea deal and send these losers to jail?

We can only hope ?

Right now it's just two lying scammers who admitted their guilty in court, now claiming their innocence, like many others. If the great state of anywhere tried to go after everyone who tries to spin their testimony once they get out of court they'd need to double their judicial system.

[Beden]

8 minutes ago, SRTouch said:

If the great state of anywhere tried to go after everyone who tries to spin their testimony once they get out of court they'd need to double their judicial system.

Too true but so few seem to do it on national TV.

[Rock knocker]

All this talk of  them being charged with perjury because they pled guilty and claim be actually be innocent is as stupid as the Brown's.

[Beden]

Perhaps, Rock Knocker, but I'm one of many people who've have experience with our legal system (in a divorce and was the victim of random vandalism but neighbor junkies, turned states evidence--along with co-workers--against a boss who was guilty of forgery regarding paychecks for phantom employees) and know first hand the reality that our justice system isn't always about justice, fairness or anything close to it. It's often a chess game and a crap shoot. Cynical? Sure. But I've been there and sometimes you just want, for once, to see the result actually be fair.

Wishful thinking? Maybe, but there you go.

Edited June 21, 2016 by Beden

[Rock knocker]

They swore that they committed the crime.  What they say on TV, even if it contradicts an earlier statement, is protected by the Constitution.  So then you'd have to go to court and prove that they did not falsely claim benefits?  Or prove what they were thinking?  Without their testimony on the stand?  What would that do for the cost and time to prosecute something which would clearly be dismissed at the first hearing.

[Beden]

I'm willing to agree to disagree as I suspect that neither of us will convince the other. But having seen criminals whose crimes which were proven beyond a doubt walk away more than once, I'm a believer in the cliche of 'do the crime, do the time'. I'm aware of the problems of cost and overcrowding.

As my grandfather was fond of saying, you go to your church and I'll go to mine.

Edited June 21, 2016 by Beden

[Steff]

They aren't the first or the last to plead guilty to something & then tell people that they didn't really do it, it was...(add silly excuse or reason)...

[Ina123]

I feel certain Matt is about to admit his problem and go to rehab, or rather, because of the show delay time has already.

[Tukahar]

Ina123, I agree.  I was more interested in Matt than Billy and Bam (if interested is the right word).  This is the most serious acting Matt has done.  Why did he go to rehab?  Alcohol or drug abuse?  Billy mentioned that Matt was staying out late in town, which shoots down all this bunk about them never being separated and the 'boys' not liking to be 'out of the bush'.