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Spoiler Discussion Thread

Morrigan2575

By Morrigan2575
in Arrow

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Carrie Ann
Carrie Ann

Me for all of last summer hiatus and 5A: Me after reading the WM interview from a few weeks back about Felicity's arc giving her a more profound understanding of Oliver: Me after r

BkWurm1
BkWurm1

I tend to think that trying to make KC a place on the show had a ripple effect that did hurt the show pretty badly.  She's what turned Quentin stupid and into a creepy stalker.  So that wipes off the

calliope1975
calliope1975

Challenge accepted.

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Angel12d

Angel12d

(edited)

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. Just means yet again the costumes are more important. Ah well. Not like I didn't know that already.

 

He looks damn good though. ARMS.


I also just realised that he's not wearing paint around his eyes though. Why?!

Edited by Angel12d
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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. Just means yet again the costumes are more important. Ah well. Not like I didn't know that already.

 

 

I also just realised that he's not wearing paint around his eyes though. Why?!

 

Better an individual poster for everyone with a mask (if that is what they do) than to have a group photo with people being nasty about who's situated where, IMO. 

 

And yeah, IDK why he doesn't have eye black on. He's wearing it in the show - SA has filmed videos with it on. Weird.

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Angel12d

Angel12d

Better an individual poster for everyone with a mask (if that is what they do) than to have a group photo with people being nasty about who's situated where, IMO. 

 

And yeah, IDK why he doesn't have eye black on. He's wearing it in the show - SA has filmed videos with it on. Weird.

 

I agree individual posters are better. But someone will always get left out like they're not as important and I don't like that. But it's nothing new so...

 

Yeah, I don't know why the masks look so strange without the make up but they do.

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

(edited)

Ooh, that looks like Quentin's apartment, maybe?

 

Yep. It's beige on beige on beige depressing divorced dad starkness. All that's missing is a coffee table made out of a giant throw away cable spool or some milk crates.

Edited by apinknightmare
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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

I'm trying to hold back my utter hatred for the Lance Family Drama, because this time it's for Sara, the only Lance I give a crap about.  But man, once Sara's back and mostly okay and shipped off to LoT, it HAS TO STOP.  There is just absolutely no reason to have Lance Family Drama be such a major part of a show that isn't about the Lances.  I'm SO tired of it.

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Chaser

Chaser

I'm curious if the praise between SA and PB is related to Lexi's tweet about SA moving her to tears.

 

Maybe Oliver is asking for forgiveness for Sara being killed as a pawn.

 

Or begging him not do anything with Sara's body.

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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

The line of causation between the wrong Oliver actually did with Sara (banging her and inviting her onto his yacht for more banging) and her death is so attenuated as to be nonexistent.  In pure causation terms, Oliver was the cause of Slade's attack on the city and RAG's attack on the city, but he did not cause or carry any blame whatsoever for Malcolm's attack on the city in S1, unless his father's sins are his, which is a horrible primitive worldview.  Malcolm's attack on the city caused the LOA to come after Malcolm which caused him to come up with his BSC/stupid/would-never-have-succeeded-if-not-for-plot plan to make Thea kill Sara to get the LOA off his back.  Oliver screwed up so much, so very much in S3 that I legit want to punch him in the face, but Sara's death is not his fault and he doesn't need to ask for forgiveness for it.

Not to say he won't, because he has historically considered everything bad that ever happened in the history of the world to be his fault, but I am really hoping for a healthier outlook from him in S4.

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wonderwall

wonderwall

I wish I felt that way @wingster55. 

 

They DO go deep into characters. But they go deep into characters and ruin them. Lance and his overreaction last year, Laurel and her throwing glass at Sara (which is a huge overreaction), Dinah and her allowing Laurel to take down Sara's killer even though it's dangerous and might kill Laurel, Laurel not telling Quentin about Sara's death and impersonating her....

 

Lance stories are very character driven. I just wish that these character driven stories built said characters up and said relationships with said characters up instead of tearing them down consistently. 

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lexicon

lexicon

Okay I'm just going to come out and say it.  When news of Sara's return first hit, I was really happy to hear that CL's time in the Arrowverse was not at an end. She's a brilliant Canary and like Stephen Amell, is good enough at what she does, that it's believable that what you're seeing onscreen is one of the best fighters in the world going head to head with the baddies. A return of that to my screen was welcome. 

 

Since those first heady days, time (and spoilers) has adjusted my perspective and all I can see (and fear) now is more Lance family drama and lots of it. We're going to have to deal with some, or possibly all of the following during Sara's resurrection arc:-

 

  • Who decides to resurrect her? Odds are on LL or QL or both.
  • Did Oliver and the rest of Team Arrow know? If yes, then much discussion...meh
  • If no...the fallout from everyone finding out that she's been resurrected
  • The I-told-you-so after she starts to feel the effects of the Lazarus Pit
  • SL coming to terms with being dead for a year
  • SL coming to terms with LL stealing her life/costume and the whole range of emotions and Lance -sister heavy scenes that is sure to spawn
  • disappointment in LL following in her footsteps,
  • a fight scene where they face off against each other (TPTB are not passing that opportunity up)
  • giving her blessing to LL (saying she was always meant for a mask) and then
  • a side by side sister fight scene to book end everything and add the gloss to how much SL approves of LL's turn as a masked vigilante (aka TPTB hitting us over the head with the subtext that surely anyone who still disapproves of LL becoming BC is surely wrong)
  • SL coming to terms with LL/QL making the decision to resurrect her
  • SL reconciling with dear old dad
  • LL reconciling with dear old dad
  • QL and Oliver dealing with Oliver's role in what happened to SL, which would be welcome except that QL's approach to that issue at the end of s3 disgusted me with his hypocrisy/anger directed solely at Oliver while excusing the role that his own daughter(s) played in the whole debacle. It's a big ole no thanks from me to more of that.

 

Just typing up this list alone got me scared. I'm really not on board with the idea of more Lance family drama but honestly at this point I don't know how we can avoid it. 

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

(edited)

Recognizing, of course, that there are people who care about the Lance family and their trials, they've been the focus of storylines for the past three years, and I'd rather that time go to Diggle and/or Felicity this season. The writers do get pretty deep into the Lance family drama, but IMO, a lot of the time they wind up coming out looking like assholes. I've thought that about every single one of them. And Dinah, especially, isn't shit. Ugh.

Edited by apinknightmare
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wonderwall

wonderwall

(edited)

Recognizing, of course, that there are people who care about the Lance family and their trials, they've been the focus of storylines for the past three years, and I'd rather that time go to Diggle and/or Felicity this season. The writers do get pretty deep into the Lance family drama, but IMO, a lot of the time they wind up coming out looking like assholes. I've thought that about every single one of them. And Dinah, especially, isn't shit. Ugh.

To be honest though, if there wasn't any Lance family drama, there literally won't be anything for Laurel to do. Lance family drama is what sets her character apart and what gives her screen time which is unfortunate and a clear indicator of how much of a non-entity her character is. 

Edited by wonderwall
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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

(edited)

I'd rather the time go to that one guy who did that thing in that one episode than to the Lances (again, other than Sara).  We know more about every single thing in the Lances' lives than we do about anyone else on the show except Oliver.  What next, are they going to spend an episode with Laurel and Quentin arguing about which dish detergent is the best?  It's too frigging much.

 

To be honest though, if there wasn't any Lance family drama, there literally won't be anything for Laurel to do. Lance family drama is what sets her character apart and what gives her screen time which is unfortunate and a clear indicator of how much of a non-entity her character is.

We can watch her Canary-ing it up on the streets and occasionally in the courtroom, and she could get an interesting/chemistry-laden love interest.  If she's going to stay, I'd rather watch that than more arguing with her dad or resisting drinking or drinking or trying to get her dad to resist drinking or throwing stuff at poor Sara or arguing with her mother or God, anything else having to do with her family. 

Edited by AyChihuahua
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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

To be honest though, if there wasn't any Lance family drama, there literally won't be anything for Laurel to do. Lance family drama is what sets her character apart and what gives her screen time which is unfortunate and a clear indicator of how much of a non-entity her character is. 

 

They actually have something for her to do this year - she has a huge conflict in that she's a lawyer and going outside of the law to fight crime at night. That could provide her with a season's worth of issues - no need for played-out family drama at all.

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wonderwall

wonderwall

They actually have something for her to do this year - she has a huge conflict in that she's a lawyer and going outside of the law to fight crime at night. That could provide her with a season's worth of issues - no need for played-out family drama at all.

Sorry, I meant in the past (S2&3). 

 

But I feel like her conflict as a lawyer/crime fighter will be put on the backburner while all the lance family drama ensues with the resurrection of Sara. 

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tarotx

tarotx

I don't mind the Lance family Drama. Some of it is a bit it much with Laurel's blankness to melodramatic reactions and Quinton's continuing overlooking his Daughters's own fault in their life decisions to blame Oliver. I love Sara and used to love Quinton and could probably love his character again. It's just that I don't feel like they have connection to Oliver any more that makes me weary. Not the stuff concerning Sara because the show has forced that connection to the Queens with Thea drugged to kill her. Sara was a friend to team Arrow. But once she leaves I just don't know what's going to happen.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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Sorry, I meant in the past (S2&3).

But I feel like her conflict as a lawyer/crime fighter will be put on the backburner while all the lance family drama ensues with the resurrection of Sara.

I honestly don't even expect that to last more than an episode.
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wonderwall

wonderwall

I honestly don't even expect that to last more than an episode.

 

The resurrection of Sara or her conflict as a lawyer/crime fighter? Because if it's the latter then I agree. If it's the former then I disagree because it's a huge storyline. 

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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(edited)

The resurrection of Sara or her conflict as a lawyer/crime fighter? Because if it's the latter then I agree. If it's the former then I disagree because it's a huge storyline.

The whole conflict over Vigilante and DA. Honestly, the way WM talked about it, it didn't sound like a big thing. Edited by Morrigan2575
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Angel12d

Angel12d

If they had any sense, they'd make the conflict between their normal lives versus their costumed lives something everyone deals with. Oliver becoming Mayor and being GA. Laurel being a lawyer and a masked vigilante. Felicity (probably) being a CEO and a computer genius for a group of masked heroes and so on…It could be thematic but I don't trust the writers to link them that well. 

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Chaser

Chaser

I'm thinking Laurel is going to be a tagalong on Sara and Quentin stories this year. Sara is the real focus of the resurrection arc and Quentin seems to really be getting in on the action this year. The DA/Vigilante storyline could be tied to the Anti-Vigilante task force which should feature a lot of Quentin too. I'm not sure how much individual focus Laurel will have this year (beside the normal episodes every season).

 

That would work with MG answer about fans of the Laurel and Quentin relationship being happy.

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kismet

kismet

The fact that they put a period after "aim" makes it sound like instructions during sex, instead of superhero motto.

 

Sorry[notsorry].

I totally got what you were saying when I looked at it again. Perhaps my work mental filter was keeping my head outta the gutter. But it does sound a little dirty.

 

Although honestly on second glance his arms are amazing... but his chest is boxy in all the wrong ways. Not one of my fav Arrow posters. I think SA could do better. I think he's letting me down on his promo poster shots. At least it doesn't look constipated like the previous one. He needs to work his angles better.

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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

Although honestly on second glance his arms are amazing... but his chest is boxy in all the wrong ways. Not one of my fav Arrow posters. I think SA could do better. I think he's letting me down on his promo poster shots. At least it doesn't look constipated like the previous one. He needs to work his angles better.

I don't think it's a great pic, either. He's looking down, you can't see his eyes at all, and he looks a little lacking in neck. (Please note, my comments are ONLY re this pic, as I, in agreement with 99% of the human race, think SA is gorgeous.)

Overall I like the new outfit, except for the bare arms. Arm porn can't make me get over the stupid. Also, what's up with the shoulder things? What is the point there?

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DrSpaceman10

DrSpaceman10

Maybe they're trying to keep some spoilers under wraps, but it seems to me that a lot of the first half of the season will be about Sara's resurrection/Lance Family Stuff/and setting up LoT (including something with Ray, I'm assuming). I mean even the crossover (which I think was one of the best episodes last season and one of the few with any significant Oliver/Diggle/Felicity interaction) is basically just a backdoor pilot for the new spin-off. 

 

I was kind of on the fence about watching Season Four, but I figured (based on stuff MG/WM have said) that it would be a big year for Diggle and Felicity. But based on the spoilers we've gotten so far, it doesn't seem as though this season (or at least the first half) will have time to delve very deep into their supposedly 'big' arcs. 

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SmallScreenDiva

SmallScreenDiva

perfectlyandrogynousbitch asked:

Marc, I do want to give "Arrow" another chance. But when interviews say the return of a character I have no interest in is playing out across the first 7 episodes (Andrew Kreisberg, The Hollywood Reporter) my heart sinks. You sidelined Felicity and Diggle for that character in Season 2 and I (along with many friends and family) quit watching the show. Your SDCC interviews made us excited again because you said you were giving F/D deserved focus. Is this still true?

I think you’re gonna be very happy with the first seven episodes.

 

DrSpaceman10, I'm kinda clinging to this reassurance from Guggenheim from the Spoiler Thread.

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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

I don't trust Guggie at all. He's flat out lied several times, plus last season he was a douchecanoe every single time any valid/constructive criticism was raised. The only exception I remember was when they left Roy unconscious and face down in dirty water. Could not have been a bigger putz. And you know what, ratings backed him up. I'm actually pretty surprised he's doing a quasi-apology tour, because ratings were good. Better than S2.

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Traveller

Traveller

At this point of time, with limited information, we cannot assume anything. Maybe Lance family has a greater role or maybe not. The trailer might indicate where things are going to go. But, I am never going to believe what the producers say. They are prone to lying and exaggerating.

 

BTW will Nyssa die in episode 3? Katrina law didn't film a single scene for episode 5. She hasn't filmed a scene for episode 4 yet since she's been in Europe shooting for her pilot episode.Besides if I remember correctly, Guggenheim had said that there will be "a sort of" reunion between Nyssa and Sara. This makes me fear that Nyssa may die in episode 3 which will be a shame really.

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