Guest October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 Are we gonna start seeing different people with the same brand on their wrists or something? And they'll all be working for Prometheus or something dumb like that. Haha. IDK. Link to comment
calliope1975 October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 All the upvotes, @SmoaknArrow. You articulated beautifully what I've been feeling as well. 12 Link to comment
SonofaBiscuit October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 The EPs have been relentless with the "writing away from romance" stuff (not always stated in those exact terms, obviously), and despite falling ratings/social media numbers, they still haven't started to walk back any of their previous statements. I know that people watching the show are saying that there are plenty of Olicity moments in the episodes, but honestly, it feels like the rug is going to be yanked out from under shippers. At this point, I'm expecting to hear that EBR is leaving the show, or that GA/BC version 3.0 is happening in season 5B. Maybe things are going to get much worse for shippers, and that's why the EPs are not doling out much hope :( 4 Link to comment
kes0704 October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 (edited) To add to the discussion. I saw a comment by MG where he said they are writing Adrian Chase from the perspective of the audience having comic book knowledge and if the audience don't have that background some things will fly over their heads. I've never read a comic book and it hasn't ever affected my ability to understand and enjoy the show, but now a regular character is being written in a way that may leave me confused about the intent of a scene because I don't know comics. Talking points like that, along with all the points @SMOKENARROW mentioned, might be contributing to why non-comic book fans feel like they are being left behind by the show. Edited October 20, 2016 by kes0704 5 Link to comment
Chaser October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 15 minutes ago, SonofaBiscuit said: The EPs have been relentless with the "writing away from romance" stuff (not always stated in those exact terms, obviously), and despite falling ratings/social media numbers, they still haven't started to walk back any of their previous statements. I know that people watching the show are saying that there are plenty of Olicity moments in the episodes, but honestly, it feels like the rug is going to be yanked out from under shippers. At this point, I'm expecting to hear that EBR is leaving the show, or that GA/BC version 3.0 is happening in season 5B. Maybe things are going to get much worse for shippers, and that's why the EPs are not doling out much hope :( I'm not sure what kind of walk back they could do at the moment. I don't know if I would be out there promoting Olicity with Oliver sleeping with Reporter (supposedly) around the corner. That might piss people off more. I would readjust how I talk about Olicity (which I think is something they started to do by pulling WM) and wait until I know a positive development is coming. That may not be until 5x09. Also, I would tell SA to fan-out to his hearts content at Cons. 5 Link to comment
looptab October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 I don't know what happened with Wendy Mericle. She gave good interviews until last year. Link to comment
Nagevs October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 19 minutes ago, SonofaBiscuit said: At this point, I'm expecting to hear that EBR is leaving the show, or that GA/BC version 3.0 is happening in season 5B. This is what I've been thinking too, isn't one of the main reason EBR became a regular was because of her chemistry with SA? I definitely think plans are in place to introduce a new Canary/love interest for Oliver. IMO the producers do only want to appeal to people that read comics. I don't get that business model at all. Link to comment
apinknightmare October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 1 minute ago, nagevs85 said: IMO the producers do only want to appeal to people that read comics. Even if they wanted to, the people who actually call the shots would shoot that down with a quickness. 11 Link to comment
bijoux October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 3 hours ago, catrox14 said: I just want to weigh in and say I really miss the original suit so much. And yet after seeing the new suit and the old one in close proximity, the new one is a pretty good variation that feels like the original suit. I like the new suit fine now, but I still hate how the new hood makes him look. He looked really good during that green lit scene with Felicity last week. But the cowl goes up and it's meh. 1 Link to comment
Nagevs October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 2 minutes ago, apinknightmare said: Even if they wanted to, the people who actually call the shots would shoot that down with a quickness. I wish I had your confidence in the people that call the shots, but the way things are going on with Arrow right now, I don't. Link to comment
Morrigan2575 October 20, 2016 Author Share October 20, 2016 (edited) Another season of OMG! they're going to kill off Olicity for the EPIC GA/BC pairing? I dont think i can take this again Could people maybe consider moving some of their discussions to the bitterness thread? Edited October 20, 2016 by Morrigan2575 3 Link to comment
bijoux October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 Putting this here because of DR. It feels good to see Dig back in the bunker. 2 Link to comment
writersblock51 October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 It's been quite a long time since I've posted in the Arrow forum and I'll give my thoughts in the Bitterness thread, per Morrigan's request. That being said, I cannot like/upvote @SmoaknArrow 's post enough. From the interviews, pictures (thanks for the DR one, @bijoux - I agree, seeing him in the bunker is nice!), and clips, I think Diggle's arc will be very interesting. I also think having "Lethal Weapon" on a break for a few weeks could help Arrow with some viewers. 1 Link to comment
Belinea October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 Who is the person in the hat? 40 minutes ago, nagevs85 said: I definitely think plans are in place to introduce a new Canary/love interest for Oliver. IMO the producers do only want to appeal to people that read comics. I fear that might be the case as well. Because you just know that they'd think that would be epic!!!!!!! But honestly I do wonder what is better: Getting some praise while people aren't watching anymore or getting no praise while people are still staying put. 1 Link to comment
bijoux October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 Just now, Belinea said: Who is the person in the hat? I think it's someone from production. Link to comment
Nagevs October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 2 minutes ago, Belinea said: But honestly I do wonder what is better: Getting some praise while people aren't watching anymore or getting no praise while people are still staying put. That is why I said I do not understand their business model, unless Arrow has now become a vanity project for DC/CW... Link to comment
fromfeartohope October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 @SmoaknArrow That was beautifully stated. Also wanted to comment on your tumblr, but can't......moving the rest to the other thread 1 Link to comment
BkWurm1 October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 9 hours ago, Carrie Ann said: I'm not impressed by Evelyn (or MMcL), and my hope is that maybe she'll have a close call in the field and then decide not to throw her life away at age 16, and go to school and college and be normal for awhile. I certainly don't want her to die. I still think it's kinda bad and OOC for Oliver and Felicity to not be at least conflicted about sending a kid out to her possible death on a regular basis. But they've treated it as a non-issue. Well Artimis in Young Justice did at one point try to hang up that part of her life and just go to college. So maybe that is what they have in mind for Evelyn. 2 Link to comment
BkWurm1 October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 3 hours ago, SmoaknArrow said: Whenever I try to talk about this promotional disconnect, a lot of people say: Stop reading interviews and stop paying attention to the promotion and just watch the show. But that's my point:I can't get to the TV Screen through their talking points and misleading promotion. I hear you loud and clear and I think this season is a lot like how I was feeling after 4-08 last year. The stuff actually on screen with Olicity has been good for where they are. Great even but there is this sense of lingering dread over what might me coming that doesn't allow for full on enjoyment. I keep telling myself that year long ship stalls are pretty common and that no matter what happens this year, it isn't a referendum on what can still happen but it's hard to get excited because as you so very well expressed, the message that seems to get pushed is that this show isn't going to be the one that you thought you were watching. I am still watching and I haven't regretted that at all so far but I am aware of this ticking time bomb that might go off. It's why I had vowed after Smalllville never to watch a comic book show again (and now I'm watching them all) since comic book shows have this bad habit of reverting to the familiar in the comics vs building on the story that is built in the tv show. I thought that Arrow had proved that it wasn't bound to those kinds of restrictive thinking but now I am right back there wondering if I've misjudged everything and once again comic destiny might be given priority over what actually makes sense and works IMO on the show. I'm not quite to the point of giving up but I get the apathy. If the show was just a regular show I would have no doubts in where the narrative would eventually go. The showrunners built their success on certain things and under normal circumstances, there would be no reason to think they would do a drastic about face and basically reboot the show but this damned comic destiny leads to storyline choices that the show runners can justify when in any other case they couldn't and just the uncertainty about it all is hard to cope with. 8 Link to comment
MuuMuuChainsmoker October 20, 2016 Share October 20, 2016 Hi guys. @SmoaknArrow's post has been moved to the Bitterness thread where you can continue to discuss the issues raised (subject to the "no fan talk" rule). Link to comment
ComicFan777 October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 ...so I take it that Felicity is still dating mayo, judging by the episode description of 5x06, as she is thinking of telling mayo about her night-time activities... I was so looking forward to them being broken up early on... 8 Link to comment
apinknightmare October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 4 minutes ago, ComicFan777 said: ...so I take it that Felicity is still dating mayo, judging by the episode description of 5x06, as she is thinking of telling mayo about her night-time activities... Seems so. Guess spec that Felicity breaks up with him right as Oliver finds out about them was wrong. Yay? Link to comment
wonderwall October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 Just now, apinknightmare said: Seems so. Guess spec that Felicity breaks up with him right as Oliver finds out about them was wrong. Yay? Either that or they break up in 505 and since Mayo is working w/ the GA she feels weird about not telling him the truth. But I'm... whatever about that entire portion of the show so... 6 Link to comment
apinknightmare October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 Just now, wonderwall said: Either that or they break up in 505 and since Mayo is working w/ the GA she feels weird about not telling him the truth. Way to make it positive! 3 Link to comment
wonderwall October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 Just now, apinknightmare said: Way to make it positive! LOL I TRY I TRY. Although it's piss poor marketing to highlight THAT and make it ambiguous regarding whether or not they're still together especially with the state of fandom... But I won't elaborate because... fan talk... Link to comment
Morrigan2575 October 21, 2016 Author Share October 21, 2016 5 minutes ago, ComicFan777 said: ...so I take it that Felicity is still dating mayo, judging by the episode description of 5x06, as she is thinking of telling mayo about her night-time activities... I was so looking forward to them being broken up early on... Eh, he's barely in the episode and they didn't even have a scene together in 503. Not really sure I care that she's dating him. The show is working for me, i don't need Olicty to be together romanticly to enjoy the Olicty scenes. As long as the show keeps the angst and DRAMA to a minimum (wishfuly thinking, I know) I'm fine with Felicity dating and Olicity being partners in a non romantic sense. 2 Link to comment
calliope1975 October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 7 minutes ago, wonderwall said: Although it's piss poor marketing to highlight THAT and make it ambiguous regarding whether or not they're still together especially with the state of fandom... But I won't elaborate because... fan talk... Heh. I read that 30 seconds ago on Twitter and immediately thought, well, I guess I'll be sitting that one out, too. I'm a petty shipper, what can I say? I'm guessing it'll be after the break that I'll be back. 9 Link to comment
tangerine95 October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 I really think this is the episode where they finally break up but I don't get the writers thinking anyone will be invested in does Felicity tell her secret to this guy that she barely had screentime with and we didn't even see her meet. 7 Link to comment
Thundercatmary October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 Well I guess the "clarity" we're supposed to be getting for Oliver and Felicity in 5x5 won't be good, not that i'm surprised. 6 Link to comment
calliope1975 October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Thundercatmary said: Well I guess the "clarity" we're supposed to be getting for Oliver and Felicity in 5x5 won't be good, not that i'm surprised. I think it'll be yet another stall. I agree with those who think she'll confess she still loves Oliver to Human Target or some type of lame hijinks like that. Then, Oliver moves on to the reporter, probably a ONS, Felicity eventually throws her expired Mayo out, and they'll reunite at the beginning of next year. I just have no desire to watch that. So I'll catch the Olicity scenes on Tumblr and hope to be back when this nonsense is over. Maybe I'll binge the first part of the season when it hits Netflix. Edited October 21, 2016 by calliope1975 Removed the stuff that ventured into bitterness 11 Link to comment
BkWurm1 October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 Felicity "considering" telling Mayo about her work is great as long as she decides NOT to. That would be a very clear message (if his infinitesimal screen time didn't already speak to it) about how little of a real threat he is relationship wise. Of course these are the guys that hate keeping secrets (unless it's a super dumb one to keep designed to break Olicity up) so maybe she would tell him, but even if she did, chances are it's going to be in reaction to something Oliver does. It won't be completely about Mayo. 4 Link to comment
way2interested October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 I just hope at some point DTH has some point in the plot because at this point his biggest role was being part of the premiere "twist" and to remind the audience that Olicity aren't together. The new DA has just as much, if not more interesting, going into this season's plot (being the Vigliante already foreshadowed from 501) and he's only been in 2-3 scenes and in one episode. Side note I wonder how a secret connection to the victims/Prometheus could possibly "upend" the new team at all. I mean, would the fact that Oliver used to be a killer suddenly bother the newbies? 2 Link to comment
Sunshine October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 I am not surprised he's still around. We know he's in 5.09 and the EPs said all along he would be the new police contact similar to Quentin. I expect him to be around through the end of the season even if he and Felicity are no longer dating. IF the plan in early 5B is to put Oliver in a relationship it makes sense to keep Felicity sidelined in a relationship that they are basically giving lip service to. If said relationship doesn't work as planned she's still around to bring in off the bench. My concern, for lack of a better word, is will it change the way Oliver & Felicity interact in the lair? It's one part of the show I am really enjoying now. I am also curious about "upending" the team once they find out Prometheus' victims have a connection to Oliver's past. I know they are still around but do they start working independent of Oliver or what? Link to comment
apinknightmare October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 4 minutes ago, Sunshine said: My concern, for lack of a better word, is will it change the way Oliver & Felicity interact in the lair? It's one part of the show I am really enjoying now. It won't. Oliver will find out about the boyfriend and take Felicity aside-wrapping his arm around her in a very after school special kind of way-and tell her he just wants her to be happy. He'll give her some advice about telling her fave condiment about her extracurricular activities so that she doesn't make the same mistake with him that Oliver made with her. He just wants her to be happy! And then he'll pull a couple of strings at a hard-to-get-into restaurant and make some reservations for Felicity and her guy, then have some wine and a box of condoms sent over and wish them well. Crazy kids! And in the lair it'll be like nothing ever happened. 6 Link to comment
Sunshine October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 1 minute ago, apinknightmare said: It won't. Oliver will find out about the boyfriend and take Felicity aside-wrapping his arm around her in a very after school special kind of way-and tell her he just wants her to be happy. He'll give her some advice about telling her fave condiment about her extracurricular activities so that she doesn't make the same mistake with him that Oliver made with her. He just wants her to be happy! And then he'll pull a couple of strings at a hard-to-get-into restaurant and make some reservations for Felicity and her guy, then have some wine and a box of condoms sent over and wish them well. Crazy kids! And in the lair it'll be like nothing ever happened. Ha! You're probably right. I forgot we were redoing Season 1. Link to comment
Thundercatmary October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 Honestly i'm still hoping Oliver kills Mayo, accident or not. lol 13 Link to comment
Sunshine October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 Just now, Thundercatmary said: Honestly i'm still hoping Oliver kills Mayo, accident or not. lol Nah! I don't want Felicity to have a case of the sads over him. He's not worth it. 1 Link to comment
BkWurm1 October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 (edited) He can die in the line of duty, thus knowing the risks and taking them of his own free will. Being overly sad would dishonor his choice. It would be respecting him to get over it quickly. :D Edited October 21, 2016 by BkWurm1 6 Link to comment
foreverevolving October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 I say.. If I was able to make it through 3 or so years of Laurel Lance, I think I can survive a half a season of mayo dating Felicity. 5 Link to comment
way2interested October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 9 minutes ago, apinknightmare said: It won't. Oliver will find out about the boyfriend and take Felicity aside-wrapping his arm around her in a very after school special kind of way-and tell her he just wants her to be happy. He'll give her some advice about telling her fave condiment about her extracurricular activities so that she doesn't make the same mistake with him that Oliver made with her. He just wants her to be happy! And then he'll pull a couple of strings at a hard-to-get-into restaurant and make some reservations for Felicity and her guy, then have some wine and a box of condoms sent over and wish them well. Crazy kids! Plus, you'll have Oliver giving him some sort of support by putting him on the ACU in the first place because he was the one to tip off GA in 503 to push the bf as a "good guy." Honestly, with how unimportant the character/this subplot has been (along with the writers writing "away from romance"), I'm wondering how big this whole situation is actually going to be, 505 included. Link to comment
apinknightmare October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 3 minutes ago, way2interested said: I'm wondering how big this whole situation is actually going to be, 505 included. As big as his hands? Maybe? 8 Link to comment
lemotomato October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 I just find it ridiculous that the writers are dragging this out to try to make this look like a viable relationship and not just a ship stall. They've been dating for months and by 506 he still has no idea what she does all day? Never met her friends? Never wondered why she stays out late? Like, I get how someone like Ray Palmer would overlook these things about someone he's dating because he's presumably an absentminded inventor-type, but Mayo is supposed to be a detective! 16 Link to comment
looptab October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 We've known for a while that SCPD employees are not exactly competent at their job, haha. 8 Link to comment
Sunshine October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 (edited) It seems to me Malone either already knows and isn't letting on or is the worst detective ever. I don't think he should be investigating her but the rag and dumb lie should have sparked his interest. Maybe it did which is why he summoned Green Arrow to pass on information about Prometheus' agenda in 5.03 and this will come out in 5.06. Since Mericles said he loves Felicity he might be hoping she'll tell him on her own without him having to push it. If he knows it wouldn't be much of a leap to figure out who the Green Arrow is but not knowing for a fact might work better for him in the long run as a member of the SCPD (plausible deniability). None of this would take up much screen time to play out so he would still be a non-entity. There is still room for tension with Mayor Queen as a member of the ACU although I would think Lance might deal with that more. How long was it before Lance knew for sure that Oliver was Green Arrow? In 2.19 he didn't want to know. I am of the mind that he is exactly what they said he was...a straight shooter, a good guy who loves Felicity(5.01 & 5.02), and will be a police resource (5.02 & 5.03) now that Lance is no longer on the force. I wonder if hes in 5.04? He's in 5.05, 5,06 & 5.09. (Might be in 5.07 but don't know. Edited October 21, 2016 by Sunshine 1 Link to comment
TrueMyth October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 I know everyone is slating Adrian Chase, DA as Prometheus, and yeah he is totally telegraphed for that position. I really hope that it's not the case, because, while I found him passable, he just didn't match the casting call for me. He didn't feel comfortable in his skin, and he didn't have much spark on the screen (except briefly with Thea, maybe). Now I could say all this with Detective Mayo, too, and I know it starts to retread Cooper a little bit, but I think I'd rather have Mayo be Prometheus. It would explain how he knew what Prometheus said to Church. I also like the idea that he's been researching the Green Arrow/Arrow/Hood for so long that he is able to see past the cunning hood disguise and realize, much like the historian from the LoT premier, that Oliver IS the Green Arrow. Maybe that's why we didn't see how he met and started dating Felicity. Maybe we'll see some of that in flashbacks and find out that he targeted her to get a feel for Oliver's time table and such. I know he was massaging Felicity around the same time as Prometheus killed the cop, but they ask us to buy some pretty quick location/costume transitions on this show, so I don't think that is an impediment. It also gives me reason to hope that there were no sexy times in the loft that night. 4 Link to comment
way2interested October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 6 minutes ago, TrueMyth said: I know everyone is slating Adrian Chase, DA as Prometheus, and yeah he is totally telegraphed for that position. I really hope that it's not the case, because, while I found him passable, he just didn't match the casting call for me. He didn't feel comfortable in his skin, and he didn't have much spark on the screen (except briefly with Thea, maybe). Now I could say all this with Detective Mayo, too, and I know it starts to retread Cooper a little bit, but I think I'd rather have Mayo be Prometheus. It would explain how he knew what Prometheus said to Church. I also like the idea that he's been researching the Green Arrow/Arrow/Hood for so long that he is able to see past the cunning hood disguise and realize, much like the historian from the LoT premier, that Oliver IS the Green Arrow. Maybe that's why we didn't see how he met and started dating Felicity. Maybe we'll see some of that in flashbacks and find out that he targeted her to get a feel for Oliver's time table and such. I still think Chase is only going to be Vigilante, but now I'm sort of getting the feeling that DTH is going to end up having been working with Prometheus instead of actually being him (since he had that info and gets promoted to be part of that inner anti-crime unit). That way he would just be a misguided "sharp shooter" who might have good intentions and wouldn't be completely evil but would still give SOMETHING for his character rather than being the stall. It might be slightly re-hashing s2, but hey, it looks like that's what they want to do this season anyway. Link to comment
EmeraldArcher October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 I know it's a L-O-N-G stretch, but when Adrian Chase was ranting about how pissed he was to Oliver, he said "royally" pissed. I know that's a common phrase, but it reminded me of the speculation that Prometheus is a surviving Royal Flush family member. Given his known history with Oliver (Ollie stole his girl), I would have preferred he was Felicity's boyfriend just to spite Oliver. I just don't want real feelings involved in Felicity's extra-Oliver affairs, as this talk about DTH's "love" for Felicity makes me feel icky. 4 Link to comment
Sunshine October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 (edited) I am actually hoping Prometheus is someone we haven't seen on screen yet with a 5.09 reveal. (When I saw the tuberculosis outbreak Carter Bowen passed through my mind. Ha! I am actually guessing it's related to a name in the notebook.) I wasn't overly impressed by Adrian Chase but since he is going to be Vigilante 5.07 I think being Prometheus also is a bit of overkill. I am leaning towards Malone being exactly what they said he is. See previous post. He probably found out what Prometheus said to Church from his street contacts/confidential informants. I don't see Church going to the cops but I could see him telling his associates and it getting back to cops that way. Word on the street is.... Edited October 21, 2016 by Sunshine Link to comment
EmeraldArcher October 21, 2016 Share October 21, 2016 1 minute ago, Sunshine said: I am actually hoping Prometheus is someone we haven't seen on screen yet. (When I saw the tuberculosis outbreak Carter Bowen passed through my mind. Ha! I am actually guessing it's related to a name in the notebook.) Carter Bowen as Prometheus would be awesome! HAHAHAHAHA! (I love it when he shows up in fics to aggravate Oliver!) 7 Link to comment
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