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Social Media and Behind the Scenes: AKA Everything Else Not "News and Media"


Zalyn
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Oh the difference...SA and KC literally performed that scene word for word and there is no extra sauce in the writing. It literally says a farewell, compare to how they describe olicity scenes in the script.

Also lets not forget even in the alien induced world, Laurel still had doubts about Oliver being faithful to her and Oliver still ended up leaving her even before saying goodbye.

On that 5x20 scene, I really appreciate Stephen and Emily taking the time and effort to review the script and changing it to better suit their characters. It shows the devotion and respect they have for the roles they play. I also appreciate them for bringing up the HOTNESS level to a thousand. I don't know what they discussed to make it work but I am glad they did.

  • Love 13
24 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

I'd just like to know if they rehearsed it or did SA really just decide to spin her around and send us all to our deaths on a whim?! LMAO.

ME TOO. I want to know who I should thank, hahaha. The whole part also with him fumbling with the buttons then asking her to take it off was perfect..

  • Love 5
(edited)

I honestly don't deny that Stephen/Katie had better chemistry in the 100th than they ever did, but having more than negative chemistry isn't really a high bar or a big achievement...

The script pages do really say a lot about the chemistry we see on screen. I now think that the reason why Stephen/Katie have negative chemistry is because they stick to the script. And Katie is an actress who rarely ever goes off script. I can see why Stephen would find that (and KC) uncomfortable to act with. Whereas you can see how much freer he is when acting with Emily. It's like a breath of fresh air and Emily takes his ad libs in stride. It all reminds me of how Stephen always says how she's such a giving actress and I now see the importance of that in terms of elevating the material they're given.

And in that 100th script and episode 520 I found the difference between Olicity and Lauriver almost laughable

  • Felicity never let that relationship define her. She has always known her worth and that's why she's never settled for anything less when it comes to Oliver and her relationship with him.
  • Compare that to Laurel who was begging Oliver to stay behind and it's Oliver who had to tell Laurel what her worth was and even then she didn't listen. It's exactly how Laurel had no sense of self-worth in her death bed when she told Oliver that he was the love of her life. 

Regardless of how Oliver treats anyone he's with, the difference is stark... Felicity never loses her strength in her relationship with Oliver. Laurel, on the other hand, loses her strength and becomes this weak pathetic character. 

(And let's be real, there is no other woman Oliver has treated worse than Laurel. It's almost comical how terribly he treated her, how little faith he had in her, how little trust he had in her, how almost cruel he was to her)

Edited by wonderwall
  • Love 16
10 minutes ago, wonderwall said:

it's Oliver who had to tell Laurel what her worth was and even then she didn't listen.

To be fair, in that instance she was an alien induced vision who didn't know to be an alien induced vision, and who was convinced she was going to get married and had her man disappear on her. I'll cut her some slack for that one, haha.

  • Love 6
28 minutes ago, Midnight Lullaby said:

ME TOO. I want to know who I should thank, hahaha. The whole part also with him fumbling with the buttons then asking her to take it off was perfect..

and then him being a gentleman and thanking her for taking it off...AAARGH why do they do this to us.

  • Love 5
1 minute ago, looptab said:

To be fair, in that instance she was an alien induced vision who didn't know to be an alien induced vision, and who was convinced she was going to get married and had her man disappear on her. I'll cut her some slack for that one, haha.

I honestly took that alien thing as a reflection of their real world... Laurel still considered Oliver the love of her life after everything, and that's because she never really knew her own worth when it came to Oliver. Even if he would tell her she deserves better she would still never listen b/c who needs self worth when they can have the man!

Pretty sure Laurel would've immediately gotten into Oliver's bed in season 4 as soon as Oliver gave her any sort of indication he wanted to.

Pathetic. 

  • Love 3
(edited)

I don't think KC and SA had better chemistry in the 100th ep,I think what's different was that it was like the first time SA played Oliver as happy around LL so it wasn't as uncomfortable but imo still not even close to interesting or engaging. And wow it took aliens erasing his memories and brainwashing him and using Felicity lines for LL for him to lose the constipated look around her lol.

SA and EBR always make the scenes better than they seem in the script,I love that.I prefer the version we got on the show.

Edited by tangerine95
  • Love 18
22 minutes ago, wonderwall said:

I honestly don't deny that Stephen/Katie had better chemistry in the 100th than they ever did, but having more than negative chemistry isn't really a high bar or a big achievement...

The script pages do really say a lot about the chemistry we see on screen. I now think that the reason why Stephen/Katie have negative chemistry is because they stick to the script. And Katie is an actress who rarely ever goes off script. I can see why Stephen would find that (and KC) uncomfortable to act with. Whereas you can see how much freer he is when acting with Emily. It's like a breath of fresh air and Emily takes his ad libs in stride. It all reminds me of how Stephen always says how she's such a giving actress and I now see the importance of that in terms of elevating the material they're given.

And in that 100th script and episode 520 I found the difference between Olicity and Lauriver almost laughable

  • Felicity never let that relationship define her. She has always known her worth and that's why she's never settled for anything less when it comes to Oliver and her relationship with him.
  • Compare that to Laurel who was begging Oliver to stay behind and it's Oliver who had to tell Laurel what her worth was and even then she didn't listen. It's exactly how Laurel had no sense of self-worth in her death bed when she told Oliver that he was the love of her life. 

Regardless of how Oliver treats anyone he's with, the difference is stark... Felicity never loses her strength in her relationship with Oliver. Laurel, on the other hand, loses her strength and becomes this weak pathetic character. 

(And let's be real, there is no other woman Oliver has treated worse than Laurel. It's almost comical how terribly he treated her, how little faith he had in her, how little trust he had in her, how almost cruel he was to her)

Well said. Part of that reason why she was treated that way was because she never thought she was worth more. I don't think Laurel was pathetic but she acted pathetic because I think her love for Oliver wasn't genuine either, there was a materialistic sense to it. She came off as a gold digger.

I loved how Felicity said last week that she did love Oliver but that is why she couldn't settle for anything less than his full trust. Felicity knows her worth because her love for Oliver was genuine and had no other motive attached to it. 

  • Love 5
13 minutes ago, looptab said:

To be fair, in that instance she was an alien induced vision who didn't know to be an alien induced vision, and who was convinced she was going to get married and had her man disappear on her. I'll cut her some slack for that one, haha.

Yeah..I mean the aliens were trying to keep them all trapped in the hallucination as long as possible so it was her "job" to keep him busy..if she broke things off it wouldn't have made sense because she would have given Oliver more free time to figure out why things were weird and how to escape. Not that I think she would have acted all that differently if she was real and managed to get Oliver to almost marry her but that's not the point.

  • Love 3
(edited)
20 minutes ago, Midnight Lullaby said:

Not that I think she would have acted all that differently if she was real and managed to get Oliver to almost marry her but that's not the point.

Exactly lol it's funny how the aliens picked her for the dream. As if they knew they could make her sound really pathetically  desperate for Oliver and it wouldn't even make Oliver bat an eyelash or think something is up. Yikes. Lmao

Edited by wonderwall
  • Love 2
(edited)

Weren't the hallucinations informed by Oliver and the others? 

So Oliver really views her that way...?

Though the last thing she said to him was that he was the love of her life and she hoped he would get back together with his, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

Edited by leopardprint
  • Love 2
2 minutes ago, leopardprint said:

Weren't the hallucinations informed by Oliver and the others? 

So Oliver really views her that way...?

Though the last thing she said to him was that he was the love of her life and she hoped he would get back together with his, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

They said they were "alien induced hallucinations" but it's not like they stopped to explain the logic of the episode in depths, LOL. What I understood was that the aliens created that world to trap them so of course the people in there had to be as close as possible to what the characters experienced or they would have noticed right away it wasn't real..still both hallucination Laurel and hallucination Slade and friends were trying to keep the characters there..

  • Love 1
(edited)

@Midnight Lullaby, I meant the aliens took their memories and created a dream world from them since their brains were hooked up to the alien machine or whatever. So Oliver+co provided the source material as it were and Aliens created a reboot ?.

If I cared to watch the episode, I think there could be an interesting discussion about the dream world being Oliver's life if he wasn't consumed by guilt starting from the island and the hallucinations are basically what would have made everyone else happy if he hadn't ruined their lives (in his view). 

But I don't want to, I think they wrapped up Laurel's storyline and didn't need to revisit it and Felicity and Diggle were barely in it :(. Also, I really doubt Oliver would have basically been the same person without the Island? 

They should have done an alt universe were Oliver never teams up with F/D and it's horrible. 

Edited by leopardprint
  • Love 4

I wish they actually did the what would have happened if the gambit didn't sink storyline for the 100th,that they actually showed a realistic version of it based on what really happened and what the characters were truly like.What they did was some boring,fake happy fantasy where no one had any flaws and everything bad was erased.Not just the L/O stuff,we had Moira and Robert happy together when they weren't regardless of the gambit sinking or MM not being a villain or the undertaking not being a thing. I mean makes sense for a world meant to trap them but I think it was the less interesting way to go and was just a way to have Oliver hug a bunch of dead characters.

  • Love 15
(edited)
8 minutes ago, leopardprint said:

@Midnight Lullaby, I meant the aliens took their memories and created a dream world from them since their brains were hooked up to the alien machine or whatever. So Oliver+co provided the source material as it were and Aliens created a reboot ?.

If I cared to watch the episode, I think there could be an interesting discussion about the dream world being Oliver's life if he wasn't consumed by guilt starting from the island and the hallucinations are basically what would have made everyone else happy if he hadn't ruined their lives (in his view). 

But I don't want to, I think they wrapped up Laurel's storyline and didn't need to revisit it and Felicity and Diggle were barely in it :(. Also, I really doubt Oliver would have basically been the same person without the Island? 

They should have done an alt universe were Oliver never teams up with F/D and it's horrible. 

It wouldn't work though because Ray was with Felicity instead of his fiancée that wouldn't have been killed by mirakuru soldiers if there was no island and why would Dig be the GA instead of having a normal life with his family? It was half a what if and half a let's do what we want, it's just an alien hallucination, it doesn't have to make sense, LOL.

And I agree on Oliver..I doubt he would have woken up one day and become the man we know on the show out of nowhere..experiences shape us..

Edited by Midnight Lullaby
(edited)
5 minutes ago, Midnight Lullaby said:

It was half a what if and half a let's do what we want, it's just an alien hallucination, it doesn't have to make sense, LOL.

Well the Aliens were using Oliver's brain, cut them some slack, can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. ?

Edited by leopardprint
  • Love 2
(edited)

508 is my least favorite episode of the season and in my bottom 5 of the series in general, so it makes perfect sense that it's Marc's favorite. Because he is the woooooooorrrrrrst.

The logic of the alien dream world needed SOME explanation, because the world presented erases not just going on the Queen's Gambit (as the producers kind of implied in their few attempts to set the scene (I think they knew none of this would hold up under any scrutiny)), but also the previous 5 years of Oliver's life (and everyone else's), or however many years it would take for his relationship with Laurel to never become the toxic, one-sided disaster it was, but ALSO make Malcolm (and Robert and Moira) not turn evil, since he was still the Queens' friend. And William wasn't around, so in order to believe that this world represented Oliver's greatest wish, you have to believe that he would be more concerned about Malcolm being in his life than William. In truth, the show as usual had several items on a checklist to include (bring back the dead loved ones and big bads!), and it did it in the worst and hackiest way possible, IMO. And especially for the 100th episode of a series to focus on characters and story arcs that have been dead since the pilot or S1/2 instead of showcasing the thing that actually defined the show (Team Arrow, sorry not sorry, haters) for all five seasons was a mistake and a bummer for those of us who stuck around not to sulk about not getting a comic book dutifully transferred to screen but because we actually loved this show. I thought that's what they wanted us to do, but it seems like no matter what, we're all always watching the show wrong.

Edited by Carrie Ann
  • Love 17
(edited)

I 100% agree with you that 508 just sounded awful from the getgo BUT I think they could have done a full on, goatee, chilli, fishnets, comic book translation for the 100th. That could have been silly and fun to see the literal comic book versions for just one episode. 

Edited by leopardprint
  • Love 2
3 hours ago, Midnight Lullaby said:

ME TOO. I want to know who I should thank, hahaha. The whole part also with him fumbling with the buttons then asking her to take it off was perfect..

Happy thoughts -- I want to know if they came up with the spin idea because the top had buttons, or if they came up with the idea first and asked Wardrobe to provide a top that buttoned in the back.

I was so excited for the 100th episode, and it was such a letdown.  It was like the writers were still stuck in the mindset of the pilot episode instead of paying homage to what the show had been for the past 98 episodes.

3 hours ago, Cleanqueen said:

Well said. Part of that reason why she was treated that way was because she never thought she was worth more. I don't think Laurel was pathetic but she acted pathetic because I think her love for Oliver wasn't genuine either, there was a materialistic sense to it. She came off as a gold digger.

The impression of Laurel as a gold digger was something that came from both the writing and the acting.  In terms of the writing, we were never given a reason why smart, successful Laurel was not only coming back to Oliver in spite of his infidelities but actively pushing to marry him when he clearly wasn't ready to settle down to college much less a marriage.  And the acting failed to sell anything deeper than two people together for the sex.

2 hours ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

 The stunts get boring after a while for me because I don't give an eff about the masks and the suits.

This is me.  I'm in it for the story, and I get pissed off when people tell me to forget about characterization, there's a new mask coming.

  • Love 5

A few more nonspoilery posts at https://marcguggenheim.tumblr.com/ on May 9... 

fight--for--now asked:
Hey Marc, you don't have to answer this but I know you sometimes get some very very rude people on here. If it ever gets to be too much there's a block option when you click on someone's account on the person icon. Don't ever feel you shouldn't if people go too far, they don't deserve your time.

Thank you!  And I’ve used the block option once or twice.  ?

wintersoldier53 asked:
Do you own any Funko Pops of this TV Shows in your house or desk? If so, which ones? And, are Funko Pops of Season 3 The Flash coming? Thanks for replying to both of my questions, they didn't fit one page. Big fan of you and of Blake Neely, keep on the good work.

First, thanks.  I love the Funko Pops.  I have Atom, Green Arrow and Agent Carter (my wife’s show) on display in my home office.  And Arrow, Green Arrow and Atom in my work office.  And I can’t wait for the Trollhunters ones.

crycanarycry asked:
Just out of curiosity, i'm not a comic book fan but i'm a Lauriver shipper so,,, the fandom isnt just made of '80K' comic book readers,,,,

Good to know!  ?

alexiablackbriar13 asked:
Will you be coming to SDCC this year?

I plan to!

peryca asked:
Any chances of seeing you or Arrow's cast at de comic conParis 2017?

I don’t think I’ll be able to make it due to my obligations on the shows.  I don’t know what the cast’s plans are.  Sorry.

11 minutes ago, tv echo said:

wintersoldier53 asked:

 

Do you own any Funko Pops of this TV Shows in your house or desk? If so, which ones? And, are Funko Pops of Season 3 The Flash coming? Thanks for replying to both of my questions, they didn't fit one page. Big fan of you and of Blake Neely, keep on the good work.
First, thanks.  I love the Funko Pops.  I have Atom, Green Arrow and Agent Carter (my wife’s show) on display in my home office.  And Arrow, Green Arrow and Atom in my work office.  And I can’t wait for the Trollhunters ones.

So he doesn't have the Felicity or Diggle ones?  Not cool, Marc.

  • Love 3
(edited)
20 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

So he doesn't have the Felicity or Diggle ones?  Not cool, Marc.

My first thought as well, but then I just assumed at least with the Felicity one, they were always sold out.  ;)

And honestly, the Speedy one is super cute as well.  

Edited by BkWurm1
  • Love 2
(edited)

KC doesn't always stick to the script. I don't know if this was a KC addition or a director addition, but there's a significant dialogue difference regarding the Oliver/DreamLaurel scene in 508...

From 508 as aired:
Oliver: "I'm sorry. The person you fell in love with - that's not me. And I never deserved that love. And you always deserved better."
DreamLaurel: "Please."
(Oliver kisses her forehead.)
Oliver: "I love you."
DreamLaurel: "I love you. Don't go!"
(Oliver walks away, stops and looks back at her, and then leaves.)

From 508 script:
Oliver: "I'm sorry, Laurel."
DreamLaurel: "I don't understand any of this. I feel like I'm losing my mind."
Oliver: "Just know that... I'm not the man you fell in love with, Laurel. I've never deserved that love. And you deserved better. You deserved so much better."
(Oliver kisses her forehead.)
Oliver: "I love you."
(Oliver walks away, stops and looks back at her, and then leaves.)

Dialogue Addition: In the aired episode, DreamLaurel says, "I love you. Don't go" after Oliver's ILY. However, in the script, DreamLaurel says nothing after Oliver's ILY.

Edited by tv echo
9 minutes ago, tv echo said:

 

Dialogue Addition: In the aired episode, DreamLaurel says, "I love you. Don't go" after Oliver's ILY. However, in the script, DreamLaurel says nothing after Oliver's ILY.

so KC was trying extra hard to sell it...I legit didn't even remember her saying ILY afterwards thats how much it resonated with me. 

  • Love 3
(edited)

KC's additions made DreamLL even more pathetic. Figures.

Here's what I never understood about the party in the alien dream-- was it supposed to be the reception after the wedding (hence LL running around in the dress)? Did Oliver miss the ceremony and no one noticed?

Edited by lemotomato
  • Love 13
19 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

KC's additions made DreamLL even more pathetic. Figures.

Here's what I never understood about the party in the alien dream-- was it supposed to be the reception after the wedding (hence LL running around in the dress)? Did Oliver miss the ceremony and no one noticed?

yeah that party made absolutely no sense. I can't see them having a reception and oliver missing the ceremony. And i dont know what bride runs around in her dress before the ceremony.

  • Love 1

I guess the aliens weren't very superstitious and didn't know it's bad luck for the groom to see the bride in her gown before the wedding? IDK :P Yeah, the chronology didn't make sense at all.

But there's something actually cruel about those LOLiver scenes in a meta sense. Putting KC in a wedding gown in a scenario where Laurel Lance once again has Oliver Queen running away from her (with her sister, toward Felicity as represented by Smoak Technologies) came across to me as mocking. Then again, it doesn't seem like many of her fans actually understood that since they're posting the GIFs on Tumblr and presenting them as proof of Oliver's deep, abiding love for Laurel Lance. 

  • Love 12
(edited)

5x08 wasnt a love letter to fans like they tried to sell,it was a big fan service to a specific group of people imo. The episode spent so much time dealing with irrelevant L/O scenes trying to push the idea that if Oliver hadnt spent all those years away,he and Laurel were meant to be and would get their perfect ending,even having him ask for them to elope just after he remembered Felicity. Also,the episode spent more time focusing on Sara and Ray,while Felicity was stuck with newbies. They should have never made 100th a crossover episode. It wasnt for fans of the show,it was for fans who tuned in the show in the first place because of comics, since it went out of its way to please fans of a specific comic canon ship while shoving the main romantic ship of the show out of the way to do so(felicity wasnt abducted like Thea,Dig and Oliver, all core characters of the show,cause otherwise they wouldnt be able to give all those L/O scenes and sell their perfect love without real felicity interfering).

It was fan service, with the show even using for L/O scenes exact lines that were exchanged in olicity scenes("will you marry me", "havent i answered that already?"). I was already pretty tired of their writing with olicity last year,this just made me more apathetic towards their so called love story. How can a show manage to waste so much potential and turn a unique fan favorite dynamic into a cheap stereotypical soap opera ship? LOL

 

Also

Quote

 

forgetabouttheory asked:

If you could pick a name for Olicity's first kid...

If it’s a boy, I don’t see how it could be anything other than Robert.  If a girl, Moira.  But that would be true no matter who Oliver had a child with.

 

i realise the show is about Oliver but dear Lord,why would the olicity kid be named Robert or Moira? Next thing you know MG is gonna suggest Malcolm as the middle name. Cause family comes first. lol

Edited by theOAfc
  • Love 6
(edited)

All I know is that if Arrow gets to 200 episodes and pulls anything like they did with the 100th and focuses on the dead characters - especially if they think, hey, let's remember O/L - I'll be pissed. 

And really, what was the point of that ad-libbed ILY from DreamLaurel? Who thought that was necessary? 

6 minutes ago, theOAfc said:

i realise the show is about Oliver but dear Lord,why would the olicity kid be named Robert or Moira? Next thing you know MG is gonna suggest Malcolm as the middle name. Cause family comes first. lol

No, Thea will name her first son Malcolm

Spoiler

especially if speculation is right and he dies saving her in the season finale. 

Edited by insomniadreams88
  • Love 1
8 minutes ago, theOAfc said:

 

 

Also

i realise the show is about Oliver but dear Lord,why would the olicity kid be named Robert or Moira? Next thing you know MG is gonna suggest Malcolm as the middle name. Cause family comes first. lol

Marc should consider that the person carrying the child for nine months and pushing him or her out of her body might want a say in the name, LOL. It was the same with Dig's child..did Lyla even meet Sara?

  • Love 9
26 minutes ago, Midnight Lullaby said:

Marc should consider that the person carrying the child for nine months and pushing him or her out of her body might want a say in the name, LOL. It was the same with Dig's child..did Lyla even meet Sara?

forget Lyla, why Diggle would even want to name his child after a chick he had no connection to made no sense.

  • Love 8
2 hours ago, tv echo said:

KC doesn't always stick to the script. I don't know if this was a KC addition or a director addition, but there's a significant dialogue difference regarding the Oliver/DreamLaurel scene in 508...

From 508 as aired:
Oliver: "I'm sorry. The person you fell in love with - that's not me. And I never deserved that love. And you always deserved better."
DreamLaurel: "Please."
(Oliver kisses her forehead.)
Oliver: "I love you."
DreamLaurel: "I love you. Don't go!"
(Oliver walks away, stops and looks back at her, and then leaves.)

From 508 script:
Oliver: "I'm sorry, Laurel."
DreamLaurel: "I don't understand any of this. I feel like I'm losing my mind."
Oliver: "Just know that... I'm not the man you fell in love with, Laurel. I've never deserved that love. And you deserved better. You deserved so much better."
(Oliver kisses her forehead.)
Oliver: "I love you."
(Oliver walks away, stops and looks back at her, and then leaves.)

Dialogue Addition: In the aired episode, DreamLaurel says, "I love you. Don't go" after Oliver's ILY. However, in the script, DreamLaurel says nothing after Oliver's ILY.

Isn't more they cut her lines than an addition?

  • Love 2
3 hours ago, tv echo said:

KC doesn't always stick to the script. I don't know if this was a KC addition or a director addition, but there's a significant dialogue difference regarding the Oliver/DreamLaurel scene in 508...

 

Same with 5x10 when Siren plays with her prey

Script:

Black Siren: To be honest, I'm glad you discovered me. I couldn't pretend to her any longer. To be so weak so vulnerable...so pathetic.

You know what the one problem with my ability is? I can never hear my victims screams over my own...

Show:

Black Siren:  Finally, it's about time someone figured it out. I am so sick and tired of playing this weak and vulnerable Laurel. She's such a pill it's pathetic.

You know the one problem with my ability? I can never hear my poor little victims scream.

10 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

Same with 5x10 when Siren plays with her prey

Script:

Black Siren: To be honest, I'm glad you discovered me. I couldn't pretend to her any longer. To be so weak so vulnerable...so pathetic.

You know what the one problem with my ability is? I can never hear my victims screams over my own...

Show:

Black Siren:  Finally, it's about time someone figured it out. I am so sick and tired of playing this weak and vulnerable Laurel. She's such a pill it's pathetic.

You know the one problem with my ability? I can never hear my poor little victims scream.

she basically shortened it to remember it better. Kind of funny she added the "shes such a pill its pathetic" part I felt that made laurel look way worse. Was kC throwing shade at herself.

  • Love 1
(edited)
3 hours ago, Belinea said:

One of the behind the scene shots was in the hair/make up trailer with the little fluffy dog that KC used to own, (Felicia or something), thus answering an earlier question on if the dog actually had been given away as I'd heard or if KC just brought her to work a lot.  The behind the scene shots were for at least 513 (I get fuzzy on the numbers) so there'd be no reason for her to be on set, right?

Edited by BkWurm1
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