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Social Media and Behind the Scenes: AKA Everything Else Not "News and Media"


Zalyn
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6 minutes ago, EmilyBettFan said:

I think it might of been about Miley Cyrus?

So he thinks Liam Hemsworth is sort of, not famous? I might only think this because I'm Australian but I'm pretty sure Liam has way more name recognition then Stephen. 

 

Considering Stephen believes people should only be judge on face to face interaction I wonder if he met and got to know Miley before forming that opinion. Hmm ?

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SA is thin-skinned and gets offended when he thinks people think the worst of him (no matter how loudly he crows that he doesn't care) and he digs in his heels and he lashes out at individuals and yes, he keeps doing this and it plays out so dumb every time and he makes new versions of the same mistakes so that it DOES play out again and again.  

But I don't think that makes him a crappy human being.  It makes him flawed and this is clearly an ongoing flaw that may never be something he fixes completely, but I don't think it means he's at his core a bad person or a racist or even an asshole, just the that continual clueless white dude that gets defensive and doesn't know when to shut up. 

Based on his response to the fan that made a response video, I think he was genuinely and deeply offended that people were implying that he was trying to insult or be disrespectful of Muslim culture or religion and while I don't think anyone  here was really implying that was his intent with his comment about his wife, there were a lot elsewhere that pretty much did make that implication.  So that's where I think his harsher lashing out at a poster came from. 

I'm pretty sure at this point that SA has never had any social media training and it's frustrating to watch him make the same emotional fueled mistakes and he doesn't go about defending himself or handling the issues that arise correctly.  But I don't think he's shown he has any secret agendas or horrid hidden personality that's only now coming out. 

This doesn't change my opinion on who he is.  We've known he has trouble admitting he's wrong and letting things go for a long time.  He's far from perfect.  But I don't think he deserves to be written off as someone horrible.  There are just too many truly horrible people that enjoy the spotlight for me to get too upset over SA's hissy fits.  

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Imagine if you wrote a polite bland criticism  of something someone posted on this forum and someone replied calling you an idiot, then reiterating you're a stupid, stupid idiot and then to further mock and embarrass you for your opinion they posted a selfie of themselves- would you not decide that person is not worth interacting with and write them off? Would that not tell you something, even just a little bit, of their personality even without the face to face interaction? Would you not expect that person be banned or receive some kind of consequence? I don't think anyone on this forum would hold that person to a different standard. 

Sure he's not fundamentally an evil person and devoid of good and admirable qualities, and I don't think anyone is saying that. He has good qualities. But that doesn't excuse the overwhelming evidence of his less great qualities. 

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I haven't written SA off to a point where I can't watch and enjoy the show or his character on it, but I've been in fandom for long and seeing the deliberate meanness in his response to the fan who tried to explain how his original post could have offended people made me get my hackles up. While I haven't been on this forum since its TWOP days, I've been in fandom since early Season 2 and this is the first time I've seen SA mock and be deliberately mean-spirited in his response to a fan. 

I didn't have an issue with his original Instagram post other than it made me roll my eyes - which seems to happen a lot with SA these days - but the "You're an idiot" and "You stupid, stupid idiot" with an attached photo of him and his wife laughing at the fan/poster left me with an acrid taste in my mouth that's going to be hard to rinse off when it comes to SA. I've met him several times and mostly had pleasant experiences, but I was reminded of the saying about how you treat those that can do nothing for you says a lot about you as a person, and it's going to be hard to shake that's how he treats some of his fans. 

Edited by Soulfire
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Whatever many may think of SA here, out there he lost the narrative. Once you can make a mistake and be forgiven but there is a pattern developing where he is concerned and it is not a good one. 

 

The whole “he is white guy, he doesn’t know any better” card is not gonna work anymore. 

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So now Liz Hannah's female showrunners panel (which includes Beth Schwartz, Arrow, and Keto Shimizu, LoT) will take place on June 13, while Variety's new and improved writers' room panel (which includes no one from the Arrowverse, but does include Salim Akil, Black Lightning) will take place on June 14...

Variety Announces Updated List of Panelists for A Night in the Writers’ Room
By Variety Staff   June 8, 2018
https://variety.com/2018/scene/news/variety-night-in-the-writers-room-1202837839/

Quote

Variety is proud to announce its complete lineup for A Night in the Writers’ Room. The event, which takes place June 14th at the Jeremy Hotel, includes lively discussions with the top comedy and drama Emmy-contending writers. 

Earlier this week, Variety was called out on social media for the lack of women represented on both of its comedy and drama series panels. We take conversations about inclusion in the entertainment industry very seriously, and consequently we revised our panelist line-up to include parity among female and male writers. Variety will continue to strive to do our part in contributing positively to the all-important inclusion initiative.

The full lineup listed below: ... (read more)

Edited by tv echo
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9 hours ago, Mary0360 said:

Imagine if you wrote a polite bland criticism  of something someone posted on this forum and someone replied calling you an idiot, then reiterating you're a stupid, stupid idiot and then to further mock and embarrass you for your opinion they posted a selfie of themselves- would you not decide that person is not worth interacting with and write them off? Would that not tell you something, even just a little bit, of their personality even without the face to face interaction? Would you not expect that person be banned or receive some kind of consequence? I don't think anyone on this forum would hold that person to a different standard. 

Sure he's not fundamentally an evil person and devoid of good and admirable qualities, and I don't think anyone is saying that. He has good qualities. But that doesn't excuse the overwhelming evidence of his less great qualities. 

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SA was wrong to call a poster an idiot.  I don't defend that.  But I don't agree that the criticism was completely polite or bland.  It wasn't to the level of vitriol that the internet is very capable of but I know when I read it, I didn't feel the poster was calmly trying to explain but to scold and shame.  Again, SA response was in no way proper but I don't feel he went from zero to sixty without him reading it as an attack and as he has clearly shown in the past, he reacts emotionally and very defensively under those circumstances.  

Anyone is entitled to decide who they let into their life whether in person or through some sort of social media.  But as I said in my previous post, I don't feel this flawed side of SA's personality is anything revelatory.  And while it's a flaw, it's not the sum of the whole person and it does feel to me that the level of rage people on the internet can feel often is far greater than the crimes they are raging over.  Or that there are assumptions made about an individual beyond the behavior in question.  And judgment is often absolute without any kind of mercy.  

In the past when SA has done something stupid like this where his comments butt up against topics of sensitivity (and I am not implying anything with that phrase, just was trying to come up with a blanket term) he has come around and offered a more reasonable reaction, but that always comes later after he doubles down in his own defense.  It's how he reacts for better or worse.  Immediately after and at the height of the storm, he doesn't think or see clearly.  It's how he is.  We can all wish he'd work on himself to change but we all have shortcomings that I think in real life, if he was someone we knew as a friend or a real person, we'd still might get annoyed in the moment but it wouldn't be a make or break issue because it would be more about how he badly processes criticism than a reason to be hurt by his histrionics. 

We don't really have that kind of relationship so it's hard to not just view it in a cut and dried manner and that's probably true really with many cases of internet shaming. 

Edited by BkWurm1
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(edited)
4 hours ago, TwistedandBored said:

Whatever many may think of SA here, out there he lost the narrative. Once you can make a mistake and be forgiven but there is a pattern developing where he is concerned and it is not a good one. 

 

The whole “he is white guy, he doesn’t know any better” card is not gonna work anymore. 

I guess I disagree that there is a pattern of his behavior that indicates some deeper level of disrespect toward certain cultures.  I think we see that he can say problematic things about a plethora of subjects but that the ones that people, of course, fixate on are the ones that are more sensitive, but I don't see it as proof that he has a problem in that area but that he has a problem anytime he is criticized about something that he finds by implication offensive to himself.  (Lol, isn't that a confusing statement) 

What I mean is he's a bigger baby when what people are upset about could be viewed as racist or disrespectful toward other religions, the hot-button issues that I would hope any self-aware human being would balk at being accused of being.  I don't think that his pattern of behavior reveals underlying tendencies toward them but that he's especially sensitive about implications that he might have those tendencies.  And thus digs the hole even deeper for himself.  

The other things I want to say is that I think the explanation for his behavior that made sense for a first incident does remain true for multiple incidents because that is still how he is ingrained to think and while he learns better and becomes aware after the fact in regards to very specific issues, I don't think that it's an automatic to think that he'd be able to extrapolate and apply what he'd learned to what he'd view as totally different situations.  We can see the connecting factors but his IMO white male privilege paradigm that he looks at the world through isn't going to go away easily because we often don't see how our viewpoints filter the world.  To us, we don't see the filter in the first place so I can't dismiss as an explanation his filter for problematic behavior even multiple incidents later because he still has the filter.  

That's not to say I can't hope with each issue he doesn't get closer to erasing it or adopting a new one but changing one's whole worldview isn't a quick fix.   And even if he was a far more mindful and introspective person, I don't think it would be a change easily accomplished since it's akin to trying to hear new music without knowing how to turn down the volume of the old classic faves blasting in one's ears.  

Again, not a defense of his behavior but seeking to understand why he is still who he is and that him not fixing his flaws IMO shouldn't be seen as a provocative stance against culturally sensitive things that he has stepped on.  

Edited by BkWurm1
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11 hours ago, Mary0360 said:

So he thinks Liam Hemsworth is sort of, not famous? I might only think this because I'm Australian but I'm pretty sure Liam has way more name recognition then Stephen. 

I remember when he posted this (because Miley had recently moved past her Disney phase and there was a lot of BS slut-shaming being thrown her way, which SA fed into), and she wasn’t dating Hemsworth at the time. I’m pretty she she was with Arnold Schwarzenegger’s son.

11 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

I'm pretty sure at this point that SA has never had any social media training and it's frustrating to watch him make the same emotional fueled mistakes and he doesn't go about defending himself or handling the issues that arise correctly.

It actually boggles my mind that he hasn’t had any social media training, but it wouldn’t surprise me if the network/publicly offered and he refused. He thinks because he grew his FB page organically over the years he knows everything. He used to regularly say “I’m not hiring anyone to help with social because I know more than them” but when his visitor posts stopped working on his wall it took him weeks to figure it out (even though everyone who has ever ran a FB page could have told him how to go into his settings to fix it). And he mentioned that he was trying to get in contact with someone at FB, but as a verified page owner and advertiser he should have known that he can get tech support anytime via live chat in his business support tools. This is literally Facebook 101. 

He’s stubborn. I’m not saying he’s a racist (though I do find it increasingly curious that all of his biggest social blunders have racial undertones) but his stubbornness and defensiveness are really beginning to grate because he’s not learning anything despite it happening time after time after time. He’s the one who puts himself out there. He’s the one who chooses to share so much about his personal life and family. He’s been doing it long enough he should know how it works. 

Edited by Trisha
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1 hour ago, BkWurm1 said:

I guess I disagree that there is a pattern of his behavior that indicates some deeper level of disrespect toward certain cultures.  I think we see that he can say problematic things about a plethora of subjects but that the ones that people, of course, fixate on are the ones that are more sensitive, but I don't see it as proof that he has a problem in that area but that he has a problem anytime he is criticized about something that he finds by implication offensive to himself.  (Lol, isn't that a confusing statement) 

What I mean is he's a bigger baby when what people are upset about could be viewed as racist or disrespectful toward other religions, the hot-button issues that I would hope any self-aware human being would balk at being accused of being.  I don't think that his pattern of behavior reveals underlying tendencies toward them but that he's especially sensitive about implications that he might have those tendencies.  And thus digs the hole even deeper for himself.  

The other things I want to say is that I think the explanation for his behavior that made sense for a first incident does remain true for multiple incidents because that is still how he is ingrained to think and while he learns better and becomes aware after the fact in regards to very specific issues, I don't think that it's an automatic to think that he'd be able to extrapolate and apply what he'd learned to what he'd view as totally different situations.  We can see the connecting factors but his IMO white male privilege paradigm that he looks at the world through isn't going to go away easily because we often don't see how our viewpoints filter the world.  To us, we don't see the filter in the first place so I can't dismiss as an explanation his filter for problematic behavior even multiple incidents later because he still has the filter.  

That's not to say I can't hope with each issue he doesn't get closer to erasing it or adopting a new one but changing one's whole worldview isn't a quick fix.   And even if he was a far more mindful and introspective person, I don't think it would be a change easily accomplished since it's akin to trying to hear new music without knowing how to turn down the volume of the old classic faves blasting in one's ears.  

Again, not a defense of his behavior but seeking to understand why he is still who he is and that him not fixing his flaws IMO shouldn't be seen as a provocative stance against culturally sensitive things that he has stepped on.  

Like you said, I guess we will agree to disagree on this one. I am not gonna treat a man who is pushing 40 like he is a fragile flower. He needs to own up to his mistakes. 

Also, there is a pattern where he is concerned. Just this year there was that whole Beyoncè issue and now this. 

Anyways, All I have heard lately from his supporters is how he is flawed person and that he doesn’t mean to offend people. Like give me a break. 

He is a grown man who knows why the things he says offends people because those same people have tried to explain to him cultural and racial things but he attacks them. At some point, people are gonna give up trying to educate him and label him a racist and a bigot. In fact, that has already happened on certain platforms. 

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10 hours ago, TwistedandBored said:

At some point, people are gonna give up trying to educate him and label him a racist and a bigot. In fact, that has already happened on certain platforms. 

True, and I guess I just find that a shame.  In a perfect world, it would be nice to think that no one is given up on, especially when there are so many that display far worse and overt tendencies.  If we don't keep trying, how will they improve?  Sometimes it does take saying the same thing many times before it sinks in.  I'm not ready to write SA off.  

(I'm also not saying it is fandom's responsibility to educate him, but his interaction with fandom does provide an opportunity)

Edited by BkWurm1
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1 hour ago, BkWurm1 said:

True, and I guess I just find that a shame.  In a perfect world, it would be nice to think that no one is given up on, especially when there are so many that display far worse and overt tendencies.  If we don't keep trying, how will they improve?  Sometimes it does take saying the same thing many times before it sinks in.  I'm not ready to write SA off.  

(I'm also not saying it is fandom's responsibility to educate him, but his interaction with fandom does provide an opportunity)

 

In a perfect world, I expect not to have to deal with racism or misogynism crap but unfortunately we don’t live in a perfect world.

Also, I really hate this mentality that it is our responsibility as minorities to teach a grown men or people how to behave in public. No. We can tell a person when they do something wrong but it is that person’s responsibility to learn from his or her mistakes and not let it happen in the future. If the person not only refuses to learn from it but attacks people for continuing to educate him/her then that is on them now. 

And, just because someone is not as bad as other people out there doesn’t make them less of a terrible person. They can still be bad too. 

Edited by TwistedandBored
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4 hours ago, TwistedandBored said:

And, just because someone is not as bad as other people out there doesn’t make them less of a terrible person. They can still be bad too. 

I agree with the spirit of this but I guess my point was that SA wasn't really high enough on the terrible list to be written off as all the extreme things that he is now being labeled with.  As you said, agree to disagree.  

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55 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

I agree with the spirit of this but I guess my point was that SA wasn't really high enough on the terrible list to be written off as all the extreme things that he is now being labeled with.  As you said, agree to disagree.  

I am cool with this. Honestly, I am kind of tired of talking about him. Let's talk about something positive and happy like Emily or David. lol

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(edited)

Next weekend's comic cons (updated, with schedules)...

Supanova Sydney, June 15-17, 2018 (AU)
Stephen Amell, Juliana Harkavy, Matt Ryan and Summer Glau (also Carlos Valdes)
http://www.supanova.com.au/events/sydney-2018/guests/
Event Programme (panel schedule on page 40, photo op schedule on pages 42-43)
Sat. (6/16) at 11:30am - CV panel
Sat. (6/16) at 12:30pm - JH and MR panel
Sun. (6/17) at 11:00am - SG panel
Sun. (6/17) at 1:00pm - SA panel

Denver Comic Con, June 15-17, 2018 (CO)
John Barrowman (also DC comics writers, Marguerite Bennett and Mairghread Scott)
https://denvercomiccon.com/guests/
Programming
Fri. (6/15) at 12:00pm - "LGBTQ in Comics" panel (incl. MBennett)
Fri. (6/15) at 1:00pm - "Creating Transcendent Women Comic Characters" panel (incl. Mairghread Scott)
Fri. (6/15) at 4:30pm - "Using Comics in the STEM Classroom" panel (incl. Mairghread Scott)
Sat. (6/16) at 1:00pm - "Comics Are for Everyone" panel (incl. MBennett)
Sat. (6/16) at 4:00pm - "Careers in Writing Comics" panel (incl. MBennett and MScott)
Sat. (6/16) at 5:00pm - "John Barrowman Spotlight" panel
Sat. (6/16) at 5:00pm - "Writing Comic Script with Mairghread Scott" panel

Edited by tv echo
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It is highly unfortunate that so far 3/3 of Stephen's SM backlash was directed at POC and a minority religious group. It is now a pattern of behavior. And time and time again he refuses to acknowledge the issue and learn from his mistake.

Also like it was said above, yes he is a charitable person but none of his charities actually involve being at the forefront and physically being there for the campaigns. He organizes campaigns and hosts parties, all great work-but it is really easy to do that instead of actually partnering up with campaigns and being at the front lines for a lot of the charity events.

He also announced that he was going to be the Pride event in Vancouver-again you're not part of the LGBT community, if you're an ally then you don't need to announce that you'll be there and want your own float in you superhero costume-i.e I WANT ALL THE ATTENTION ON ME.

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Love Stephen and agree with both sides.   But wanna add that I've never considered Stephen all that intelligent and savvy.   He's the kind of guy that never had any interactions with multicultural and multi religious people,  so he knows what he knows and what he grew up with.   He's not so much a problem as he is a side affect.   He's what every straight,  white, dude bro is and was just fortunate enough to get to stardom.  When he's nice he's super nice he just seems so uneducated about a lot of cultural things and honestly I'm not sure being married to miss Texas helps matters. 

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On 6/11/2018 at 3:26 AM, Mellowyellow said:

I wonder if we'll get any pictures of David at Emily's play!

He doesn't live in Canada does he? So he'll need to fly in especially?

I don’t think David lives in Canada. I thought he lives in Atlanta but I could be wrong. 

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16 hours ago, TwistedandBored said:

I don’t think David lives in Canada. I thought he lives in Atlanta but I could be wrong. 

I think that’s right. I’m not sure if he’ll actually go to the play but I’d love for EBR’s costars to post their support of the play on social. I don’t think anyone has yet? [ETA: Not a costar but it’s nice that Carina is offering to buy fans tickets. She can sometimes be a little ... much but this is great.]

Edited by Trisha
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4 minutes ago, Chaser said:

RG looks very handsome. Rene should get that look for S7.

Yeah, he and his wife look great. If wearing a tux could make Rene stop being an asshole, I'd be all for it.

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Here's the live-stream of the panel that Beth was on:

There was audio issues at the beginning so they had to restart the stream. Beth didn't talk much but she did discuss being a new showrunner and how she trusts her people, and delegates as much as she can so she can spend time on the creative. She also "This season I've been making it very clear for everyone who works on my show that it's a huge priority that everyone works in a safe environment. That's number 1 over everything." 

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(edited)

Deadline reported on the female showrunners panel that Beth Schwartz participated in yesterday...

Female Showrunners Discuss Sexual Harassment, Inculsion, NDAs & Mentors
David Robb   June 14, 2018 
https://deadline.com/2018/06/female-showrunners-panel-twitter-sexual-harassment-inculsion-ndas-mentors-1202410353/

Quote

The crowd, mostly young women, cheered so loudly you could barely hear the names of the panelists as they were introduced – 19 of them altogether, all female showrunners.

There were so many female executive producers gathered at Twitter’s offices in Santa Monica last night that they had to be arrayed in rows in two back-to-back hourlong panels, and there was a fair amount of networking and drinking during a brief intermission in between. “I’d just like to say that our panel is drunker than the first panel,” joked Chance showrunner Alexandra Cunningham. “If we were men, we’d be talking about fighting the first panel.”
*  *  *
Moderator Liz Hannah, screenwriter of The Post, called it a “night of positivity, a night of not us-versus-them,” and the evening lived up to that for the most part, with panelists talking about how their mentors – many of whom were men – had been instrumental in guiding them in their careers. There was talk about inclusivity and about how it’s no longer the norm to be the only woman, or the only minority, in the writers room.
*  *  *
Everyone acknowledged that while the industry is changing for the better, aided greatly by the #MeToo and Time’s Up movements, there’s still a lot of catching up to do. Nondisclosure agreements, which shielded abusers and silenced victims for so long, still are widespread in the industry, said Counterpart EP Amy Berg. “They’re still in every writer’s contract,” she said. “NDA’s are the most destructive thing in the industry.”
*  *  *
“And we haven’t begun to discuss the emotional harassers who are hijacking the creative space in many cases, and they’re getting away with it,” said Lauren Iungerich, creator of On My Block, who described bullying and berating on set as “emotional terrorism.”
*  *  *
DC’s Legends of Tomorrow co-RP Keto Shimizu, a graduate of an industry diversity program, described her mentor as “amazing,” and said, “It’s so important to give that back and try to steer people in the right direction.”

Panelists also discussed changing attitudes about story and character. Veena Sud, executive producer of Seven Seconds, said she doesn’t want to see one more script “about a white guy who’s a genius. Surely there are genius women.” Many panelists also said they don’t want to see any more scripts about “a girl who doesn’t know she’s pretty” – a tired cliché that overemphasizes beauty and looks.

Others taking part in the panels included Alison Schapker (Scandal), Beth Schwartz (Arrow), Corey Nickerson (Black-ish), Gabrielle Stanton (The Flash), Laeta Kalogridis (Altered Carbon), Lauren Hissrich (The Defenders), Moira Walley-Beckett (Anne with an E), and Monica Breen (Midnight, Texas), and Sera Gamble (The Magicians).

Edited by tv echo
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(edited)

The Hollywood Reporter and Variety also reported on Liz Hannah's female showrunners panels (THR article contains links to both panels)...

'An Evening With Female Showrunners': Watch the Live Stream
JUNE 13, 2018 7:12pm PT by Lesley Goldberg
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/an-evening-female-showrunners-watch-live-stream-1120009?utm_source=twitter

Amy Berg, Sarah Watson, Lauren Iungerich Talk #MeToo, NDAs, Inclusive Storytelling
By Danielle Turchiano
https://variety.com/2018/tv/news/inclusion-cocktails-twitter-me-too-amy-berg-sarah-watson-lauren-iungerich-gloria-calderon-kellett-corey-nickerson-1202845792/ 

ETA: Keto Shimizu (LoT) participated in Panel 2:
https://twitter.com/i/broadcasts/1gqxvXvzYekGB 

Even the Writers Guild tweeted links to Liz Hannah's two female showrunners panels...

Edited by tv echo
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(edited)

Apparently there was a "DC Heroes & Villains" panel (with SA, JH, MR and CV) at Supanova Sydney today, June 15 (Sydney is 14 hours ahead of U.S. East Coast) - here are more fan tweets from that panel as well as from the con in general...

Edited by tv echo
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Just a short compilation of very brief video clips...

Stephen Amell, Carlos Valdes, Matt Ryan and Juliana Harkavy at supernova expo panel in Sydney
Published on Jun 15, 2018, by NC Videos

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Aww, I love Beth showing love!

 

This changes nothing (hoss), but I did crack a smile that he bought a Smoak Tech t-shirt because Smoak Tech needs to happen on my television screen.

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