One is the Loneliest Number: Unpopular GG Opinions

[FictionLover]

I've just finished a season 3 rewatch and it just makes no sense. In season 2 (and early in season 3) it was clear that Jess, despite his troubled life and resultant moodiness, was someone who connected with Rory on a mental level. They talked, got each others jokes and references, had a great time having dinner with Paris, etc. He was considerate of Rory, holding the umbrella over her during the construction work in the diner, bringing her food when she was alone, turning back on the sprinklers so Dean wouldn't know he'd helped her, etc. It was obvious that Dean wasn't right for her as they didn't have enough in common and, while Jess wasn't necessarily right for her long-term having a boyfriend who was an intellectual match was something that would be good for her.

 

Then they started dating and he was a cardboard cut out of a crappy bad boy boyfriend. We never saw them connect about anything again. They either kissed or had Dean related awkwardness or Jess wasn't bothered with talking to her. There was one scene where he liked the book she was reading and she bribed him with it, and that was their whole mental connection. They never felt like a couple at all. If this was supposed to be some guy Rory was physically attracted to that would have worked as a story. She loves kissing him, and is considering having sex with him but they have no emotional/mental connection and he's an ass, is something a lot of teenagers experience and would have made sense as a story. But the point of Jess was that he matched her mentally and shared many of her passions. They should have been a great couple who connected on many levels but Jess' anger and trust issues along with the appearance of his father prevented them from making it work.

They did the same thing to Luke and Lorelai; great friends that talk all the time to lovers that forget to communicate.

[CalamityBoPeep]

Then they started dating and he was a cardboard cut out of a crappy bad boy boyfriend. We never saw them connect about anything again. They either kissed or had Dean related awkwardness or Jess wasn't bothered with talking to her. There was one scene where he liked the book she was reading and she bribed him with it, and that was their whole mental connection. They never felt like a couple at all. If this was supposed to be some guy Rory was physically attracted to that would have worked as a story. She loves kissing him, and is considering having sex with him but they have no emotional/mental connection and he's an ass, is something a lot of teenagers experience and would have made sense as a story. But the point of Jess was that he matched her mentally and shared many of her passions. They should have been a great couple who connected on many levels but Jess' anger and trust issues along with the appearance of his father prevented them from making it work.

 

It seems like both the Rory/Jess relationship and the Lorelai/Luke relationship fell victim to the Palladinos lack of desire to explore what they'd created. Weirdly though, while Amy explicitly let it be known that she didn't want any schmoopiness for Luke and Lorelai, she went over the top with schmoopiness with Rory and Jess. Everything that made Rory and Jess attractive to each other disappeared in a wash of touchy-feely-kissing. And everything that made Luke and Lorelai work disappeared in enforced distance. So strange.

 

Does kind of make you wonder why the Palladinos were so uncomfortable with exploring the natural drama inherent in relationships. It was all lost in the symbolism and big dramatic splashes.

 

But this is probably my unpopular opinion about most products coming out of Hollywood, honestly. None of them seem to have a deeper sense of much of anything. It's all middle school, on tv. 

[solotrek]

Does kind of make you wonder why the Palladinos were so uncomfortable with exploring the natural drama inherent in relationships. It was all lost in the symbolism and big dramatic splashes.

 

I think this is why I enjoy the Rory and Logan relationship. For the most part especially in S7, they did have a normal adult relationship. He was there for her during Richard's hospitalization. And even though he regressed after the deal went bad, he went out of his way to apologize and try to be a mature person about everything. Logan would call her out on things and Rory would call him out on things, they talked about problems they had (aside from Logan hiding the deal going south until he did and that was a great scene), and they supported each other. Their arguments felt organic. No mysterious daughter from thin air or constant tension over an ex boyfriend (Luke/Christopher and Jess/Dean). It's no surprise the bulk of that adult relationship was from after the Palladinos left.

Edited April 2, 2016 by solotrek

[andromeda331]

Then they started dating and he was a cardboard cut out of a crappy bad boy boyfriend. We never saw them connect about anything again. They either kissed or had Dean related awkwardness or Jess wasn't bothered with talking to her. There was one scene where he liked the book she was reading and she bribed him with it, and that was their whole mental connection. They never felt like a couple at all. If this was supposed to be some guy Rory was physically attracted to that would have worked as a story. She loves kissing him, and is considering having sex with him but they have no emotional/mental connection and he's an ass, is something a lot of teenagers experience and would have made sense as a story. But the point of Jess was that he matched her mentally and shared many of her passions. They should have been a great couple who connected on many levels but Jess' anger and trust issues along with the appearance of his father prevented them from making it work.

You stated my problems with Jess and Rory dating so well. I mean they got together then it just

got weird. They never connected again as a couple. Not just Jess but Rory too. It felt like she

talked more about Dean when she was dating Jess or when Dean was married then she did when

she was dating Dean. When Jess didn't call or come by for their date she gets mad and talks about

how Dean always called. Even Lorelai points out not to compare the two and ask why Rory didn't

call Jess. The whole black eye thing where Rory believes Jess and Dean got into a fight and doesn't

believe Jess until she goes to talk to Dean. But then you also have Jess who won't admit that he got

attacked by a swan. I mean what's the big deal. I can see not telling everyone about it because they'd

have the same reaction as Luke, laugh and make jokes (okay so would I)  but Rory wouldn't. He cut

school so much but his girlfriend never picked up on it? Did they never talk about school? It seems

odd the Rory would never ask. She loved school and classes but never asked her boyfriend about

his classes or anything? 

[AllyB]

And weirdly she often talks to Dean, even after their break up, about his future educational plans. When he tells her he has applied for a 4 year college and when he tells her he was accepted they were broken up. When he tells her about his engagement to Lindsey, she is immediately worried he won't go to college. She never seems to care about Jess' education or post-school plans, despite the fact that, at a minimum, he's every bit as intelligent as she is.

[JayInChicago]

She just loved Jess for his body, I guess.

[txhorns79]

She never seems to care about Jess' education or post-school plans, despite the fact that, at a minimum, he's every bit as intelligent as she is.

 

I think she did care when they were dating, but once Jess was gone, she lost interest.  With Dean, she was kind of inappropriately falling back into her roll as his girlfriend (and honestly, laying the groundwork to justify their later affair to herself). 

[moonb]

Rory has problems seeing herself as the bad guy and with being liked. I thought her talking with Dean about school after their breakup was a way of making herself likable to him again. Rory did manage, after all, to avoid being the one who did the dumping in all 3 of her major relationships. Even if her behavior was such that at least Dean and Logan felt they couldn't be with her anymore.

 

And Dean was lying to himself as well - his feelings for Rory didn't exactly stop, and who gets over a person by finding a way to be around them all the time?  Lots of teenagers, because it seems like the right thing to do.  

Edited April 2, 2016 by moonb

[dustylil]

She never seems to care about Jess' education or post-school plans, despite the fact that, at a minimum, he's every bit as intelligent as she is

 

Do we know if Jess had actually formulated any plans for himself after high school? Not everyone - however intelligent he or she might be - does. Or has a career path chartered out for themselves not long after leaving the womb - as Rory appeared to have done. Given Jess' dislike of - if not contempt for -  the strictures of Stars Hollow High, perhaps  he wanted to take a break from formal education, at least for a while.  

 Rory offered to  help him with his schoolwork on more than one occasion. So I do think she genuinely cared about his education. And would have assisted him with any post-secondary plans he had. But Rory enjoyed high school, was looking forward to her dream of an Ivy League education and had a firm idea as to what her work life was to be. Jess was just the opposite. The contrast in what was apparently ahead for each of them was stark. Perhaps, out of fondness,  she thought the less said, the better.

Edited April 2, 2016 by dustylil

[txhorns79]

Rory did manage, after all, to avoid being the one who did the dumping in all 3 of her major relationships. Even if her behavior was such that at least Dean and Logan felt they couldn't be with her anymore.

 

In fairness, at least with Jess and Logan, I don't think Rory wanted to end either relationship.  With Dean, she was terrible to him.  She was too weak to end things, so she let them get to a point where Dean really had no choice. 

[katha]

The obvious way they telegraphed that the Rory/Jess relationship is in trouble so they could set up the spin-off was terrible and gimmicky in execution. I think the general idea behind it made sense for the two characters. They just laid it on way too thick. Jess didn't know how to be in a relationship, he had trouble opening up, trusting and communicating. And Rory was very sheltered and used to Dean's constant attention (that sometimes seemed to border on stalking...), she's also shown herself to be unwilling to engage in confrontations throughout the series. So when she didn't like things, she pouted about them without addressing the issue. And some of that SH resentment towards Jess left a mark IMO, since she also didn't trust him. And then you had Jess' life basically disintegrating within a few months, causing him to close off even more. Basically they were two teenagers unable to cope with all these complications. It seemed vaguely plausible, if cranked up to eleven for maximum melodrama.

 

Another unpopular (or perhaps not so much?) opinion: I think even the "good", "straightened out" version of Liz that showed up in season four was plenty terrible. So if she was selfish, flaky and irresponsible when she supposedy got her life together, how awful was she when she was off the rails during Jess' childhood? There's talk of constant changing boyfriends and husbands (one of them stole her TV! what an amusing anecdote...not), no steady employment, hints at casual drug use (at the least...). The totally oblivious and self-involved way in which she treats Jess also hints that she behaved that way all her life and seldom made him a priority. His resigned manner towards her also telegraphs that at this point he doesn't expect anything from her.

[AllyB]

Do we know if Jess had actually formulated any plans for himself after high school? Not everyone - however intelligent he or she might be - does.

I don't think he did but we don't know for a fact because Rory never discussed it with him. She asked him why he doesn't care about school, considering his intelligence. And simply accepts that he is bored. They talk about how choosing Yale will make it easier for them to continue their relationship, without any mention of what Jess might be doing. She never asks him what he thinks of doing next year. If he wants to go to college or is he going to work fulltime. Realistically I would have expected Jess to have some sort of idea about writing. Maybe the obvious plan of saving his money working at Walmart then go on a driving tour of North America to find inspiration to write. It seems like a very "Jess" sort of plan. And I'd expect him and Rory to talk about that and for her to maybe respect the idea even though it's completely not for her.

 

She talks to Dean at least 4 times about his post-school plans in season 3. 3 times after their relationship ended. She was very invested in Dean getting a degree of some sort. That doesn't mean Rory didn't care about Jess. She told him she thought she loved him. But their relationship was awfully presented and it made no sense given Jess' character.

[Taryn74]

In all honesty I think Rory said (and had started to actually believe) Jess treated her like crap more because Lorelai (and Dean) told her he did, rather than because of anything Jess had done.

 

In Face-Off, the first time Rory got mad because of "broken plans" it was due to a miscommunication.  She thought she and Jess had made actual plans when Jess said he'd call her after work.  Jess ended up working a double shift and it was midnight before he got off so he (reasonably) didn't call.  

 

The second time, her anger fueled by Lorelai's needling, Rory went to the hockey game not knowing that Jess was out getting special concert tickets for the two of them.  Jess came to pick her up and Lorelai went off on him.  To his credit (IMO) he didn't wash his hands of the both of them at that point, and went to wait outside the hockey game for Rory to get out so they could go to the concert.

[cuddlingcrowley]

In all honesty I think Rory said (and had started to actually believe) Jess treated her like crap more because Lorelai (and Dean) told her he did, rather than because of anything Jess had done.

 

 

BINGO! I would even go as far to say that one of the reasons Rory was unable to break up with Dean and also was unable to completely pull away from him after they were done was because Lorelai spent most of their relationship talking about how Dean was the most perfect boyfriend ever, entirely blind to his many, many faults.

 

 

In Face-Off, the first time Rory got mad because of "broken plans" it was due to a miscommunication.  She thought she and Jess had made actual plans when Jess said he'd call her after work.  Jess ended up working a double shift and it was midnight before he got off so he (reasonably) didn't call. 

The second time, her anger fueled by Lorelai's needling, Rory went to the hockey game not knowing that Jess was out getting special concert tickets for the two of them.  Jess came to pick her up and Lorelai went off on him.  To his credit (IMO) he didn't wash his hands of the both of them at that point, and went to wait outside the hockey game for Rory to get out so they could go to the concert.

 

 

Thank you so much for reminding me how the whole thing went down. Now I find Rory's reaction even more absurd than I already did.

 

 

I don't think he did but we don't know for a fact because Rory never discussed it with him. She asked him why he doesn't care about school, considering his intelligence. And simply accepts that he is bored. They talk about how choosing Yale will make it easier for them to continue their relationship, without any mention of what Jess might be doing. She never asks him what he thinks of doing next year. If he wants to go to college or is he going to work fulltime. (...) That doesn't mean Rory didn't care about Jess. She told him she thought she loved him. But their relationship was awfully presented and it made no sense given Jess' character.

 

 

This. I know a lot of this can get chalked up to immaturity and Rory being very much of a spoiled princess (and I don't mean in the everyone-deserves-to-be-spoiled-by-their-SOs-once-in-a while kind of way. I mean in the entitled and self absorbed kind of way) but we never getting to see Rory discussing with Jess his future? Come on. There's self-absorbed and there's completely out of character. Or maybe we're supposed to blame Jess for that one too. 

 

It also doesn't help that I have a hard time buying Jess flunking out of SHH. Not because I don't get some incredibly intelligent people aren't made for an academics. But because, whenever I rewatch S2, I kind feel it was building up to something diferent what with Jess bringing up having to go to school on time to Luke on 3 different occasions. Also, in his very first episode we see him leaving the school reading a book that could've easily have been homework and there's also his snarky comment about sharing a class with Dean and that making him think he's not Rory's type.

 

I don't know, I'm not saying any of that is settling a characterization of any type in stone but I guess I have a hard time accepting that Jess flunking out of school was the best story the writers could have picked to tell. I feel it would have been unexpected to have the too-cool-for-school character actually... liking school? Lorelai having to face that Jess could be someone who could add to the future Rory was working towards and not simply not get in the way like Dean, alone, would have been priceless to me.

 

(I mean, Jess was able to have a fun and fully engaged evening with Paris, after meeting her for the first time, for God's sakes. He could have rulled the world alongside Rory, imo.)

 

I even buy him not doing well in classes at first because he's angry at the move, which would permit "Teach me tonight" to happen but whatever else we had in s3? Reading a book in the middle of a test, missing school to work on Walmart (?????) and somehow being shocked he's gonna have to repeat the grade? Is anyone is the history of ever have ever been truly shocked at being told they're flunking out? Especially an apparently clever individual who we have every reason to assume would understand how being in school works and what it takes to graduate?

 

Or, again, Rory of all people being the girlfriend of said individual and not having any idea that was happening at all? Everything about that storyline just feels incredibly contrived. Hell, I'd sooner buy Jess being fully and completely aware he's flunking out and not giving a damn, because he has other plans, and I don't mean by that just buying a car, than what we got. Instead, the writers decided to write him as completely checked out from pretty much everything and everyone. Only not. 

 

I just don't get it.

Edited April 3, 2016 by cuddlingcrowley

[dustylil]

Rory of all people being the girlfriend of said individual and not having any idea that was happening at all?

 

Jess did tell her he had his schoolwork in hand, so I am not sure what else she could do about it - even if she had her doubts. If he didn't want to talk about it, there was precious little she could do to force him if he  wasn't the confiding type.

Why his uncle and guardian was clueless is another matter entirely.

[txhorns79]

Why his uncle and guardian was clueless is another matter entirely.

 

I think during one of the times this was brought up in the past, the question was asked what specifically Luke could have done if the school didn't inform him of Jess' absences and he had no real reason to know of the problem.  Obviously in hindsight, Luke could have kept a closer watch on Jess, but things always tend to look obvious in hindsight.  I mean, Jess was 17 or 18 by that point.  Was Luke really supposed to demand to see completed homework assignments or start following up with Jess' teachers without having any cause (at least that was known to him) to do so?  

Edited April 4, 2016 by txhorns79

[Ms Blue Jay]

Big Jess fan here , but Jess had a tantrum unrelated to Rory and then took it out on her by trying to get into her pants at a party even though Rory said "Wait -- Jess, wait" several times.  FInally he stopped, and then kind of yelled at her.  She left the party very upset.  He was kind of a jerk to her THERE.  That's when somebody -- DEAN -- said Jess treats you like dirt, and then Rory denied it but then accepted it to Lorelai's face later.  (I just watched that episode.  It is the one before the backdoor pilot.)

Edited April 4, 2016 by Ms Blue Jay

[shron17]

Is anyone is the history of ever have ever been truly shocked at being told they're flunking out? Especially an apparently clever individual who we have every reason to assume would understand how being in school works and what it takes to graduate?

But it wasn't so much that he flunked out grade-wise but he missed too many days to graduate.  Apparently he thought he could do just enough school work to get a passing grade and focus more on earning money for afterwards, but didn't know there was an attendance policy and ignored the warnings.  Jess already told Rory in Teach Me Tonight that he wasn't going to college and his future plans were to get out of Stars Hollow, live where he lived, work when he needed money and see where he ended up.  He was pretty defensive about discussing his future, so I'm really not surprised she didn't ask him again.

[txhorns79]

He was pretty defensive about discussing his future, so I'm really not surprised she didn't ask him again.

 

Very true.  I also think Rory had a very specific idea as to how someone's post high school life should be.  I don't know if she really could understand at that point in time that not everyone in her peer group went to college.  

[readster]

I think during one of the times this was brought up in the past, the question was asked what specifically Luke could have done if the school didn't inform him of Jess' absences and he had no real reason to know of the problem.  Obviously in hindsight, Luke could have kept a closer watch on Jess, but things always tend to look obvious in hindsight.  I mean, Jess was 17 or 18 by that point.  Was Luke really supposed to demand to see completed homework assignments or start following up with Jess' teachers without having any cause (at least that was known to him) to do so?  

Luke didn't know anything, he didn't even have an idea that Jess was skipping school to work more hours at Walmart until he got employee of the month as a result. However, even Walmart wouldn't have been able to do that with someone who was a senior in high school. For the last 15 years, a school has to ok if a student is working during school hours. Usually if they have a study hall or have met their hours for the semester at the END OF THE DAY! I don't get for one second that Jess was intercepting messages to Luke to have him be so clueless of Jess skipping school. Especially when Luke saw that Jess was hiding and then immediately running to his hidden car to head Walmart right after the last bell rang. 

[cuddlingcrowley]

Big Jess fan here , but Jess had a tantrum unrelated to Rory and then took it out on her by trying to get into her pants at a party even though Rory said "Wait -- Jess, wait" several times.  FInally he stopped, and then kind of yelled at her.  She left the party very upset.  He was kind of a jerk to her THERE.  That's when somebody -- DEAN -- said Jess treats you like dirt, and then Rory denied it but then accepted it to Lorelai's face later.  (I just watched that episode.  It is the one before the backdoor pilot.)

 

 

Yes, I know. I didn't mean to imply the episode it was said Jess treats Rory like dirt was the same episode that the drama with the not calling and the tickets went down.  Jess WAS a jerk to Rory in that scene. But I personally don't think any of the little we saw of Rory and Jess together warranted an observation like Dean's and Rory/The narrative confirming it. IMO, both of them weren't great to the other.

[Ms Blue Jay]

If we skipped school or were absent before age 18, our high school would call our parents/homes and leave automated messages about it.  (We had to go to high school in Grade 13 here, sigh, so by then a lot of us were 18.)  Anyways, just something interesting.  Luke obviously seemed to have no idea but I don't really blame him because he simply made the assumption Jess would go.  One would think he'd want to see his GF in class..... I even had classes with my high school BF and it was a lot easier to make out at school with no parents nosing around!

[Taryn74]

Big Jess fan here , but Jess had a tantrum unrelated to Rory and then took it out on her by trying to get into her pants at a party even though Rory said "Wait -- Jess, wait" several times.  FInally he stopped, and then kind of yelled at her.  She left the party very upset.  He was kind of a jerk to her THERE.  

 

See, I agree that Jess came off as a jerk in that scene, but I don't think he was being a jerk.  To me there's a difference.  He wasn't trying to force her to have sex even though she was hesitating, IMO, he was just in a really crappy mood due to the talk with the principal (not to mention his car had been "stolen" just a few days before, meaning he I assume had to quit his job at Walmart, or at least cut his hours way back because Luke wasn't going to be taking him during school hours, all that on top of just finding out he's not going to graduate is a lot) and he wanted to just forget about things for a while and make out with his girlfriend.  Yes, he was trying to go further than she was indicating she wanted to go, but we've always gotten the impression he was used to girls who were willing to be way more physical than Rory, and I think he just got a little carried away due to his mood.

[Ms Blue Jay]

I personally think he was being a jerk, and there's no way a 16 year old girl would be able to be so mature as to understand all the bullshit he was going through and why he was taking it out on HER and acting like a completely different person than she was used to, especially after they had shared such a great moment when he made it clear he wanted to commit to her even when she was going away to Yale, and researched the logistics accordingly.  Hence, Rory crying and running away and being very upset with him.  One could argue he was feeling powerless, so he wanted to exert some power over Rory.... jerk behaviour to me.  He didn't want Rory to reject her like he had felt rejected in other ways.  I'm sure he knew Rory better than to think she'd be okay with having sex with him at a house party.

Edited April 4, 2016 by Ms Blue Jay

[dustylil]

and there's no way a 16 year old girl would be able to be so mature as to understand all the bullshit he was going through and why he was taking it out on HER and acting like a completely different person than she was used to

 

She was eighteen at the time but I agree with your point.

[takalotti]

One would think he'd want to see his GF in class..... I even had classes with my high school BF and it was a lot easier to make out at school with no parents nosing around!

? Jess and Rory didn't attend the same high school.

[Ms Blue Jay]

Ok, I forgot.  I wonder what Luke could have done, or have been tipped off before he was, exactly.  Not sure.  Hard to parse.  I have never been a parent.

Edited April 4, 2016 by Ms Blue Jay

[dustylil]

I wonder what Luke could have done, or have been tipped off before he was, exactly

 

Inasmuch as Jess wasn't exactly Mr. Popularity in Stars Hollow, clearly had his own issues beyond ordinary adolescence  and that Luke himself had disliked his own high school years, I would have thought he might have contacted some of the teachers - as well as the principal - to see if his nephew was fitting in and coming along with his studies. Particularly since he may now  have been dealing with a different curriculum than he was used to in NYC. He could also have asked if there was anything he himself should be doing to help him. Luke might also have had a quiet word with Lane whom he liked and respected to get her perspective on how Jess was doing.

 

It was as if Luke left Jess in a big basket on the steps of the high school, expected the staff to deal with him and then present Luke with a high school graduate.

[txhorns79]

I would have thought he might have contacted some of the teachers - as well as the principal - to see if his nephew was fitting in and coming along with his studies.

 

I don't know if that is the most realistic expectation.  If there was nothing Luke was observing (until late in the game) to suggest Jess was having significant trouble in school, then there's no real reason to start cold calling teachers or the principal to track his progress.  My expectation would be that if my child's teacher was observing a problem, they would contact me, rather than just leave me in the dark on the off chance that I might call in to check. 

 

 

It was as if Luke left Jess in a big basket on the steps of the high school, expected the staff to deal with him and then present Luke with a high school graduate.

 

Isn't that typically how high school works?  Jess was a junior and senior during the time he came to Luke.  It's not as though this was his first experience with schooling, or there was any real suggestion that Jess was overwhelmed by the curriculum. 

[AllyB]

I had not watched season 2 and 3 through fully when they were first on and had dipped in and out of those episodes during reruns. So I never felt I had a full handle on Rory and Jess's relationship as they were always either making out like crazy or having some sort of argument that I assumed I'd missed lead-up to in a previous episode. But having just done a full rewatch of the season I feel like I have the same understanding of their relationship as I did before. There is no coherence to it and both Rory and Jess act out of character with each other. All the connection they have in season 2 is gone and it's just bad writing.

And I also have to have a minor rant about something else. In Ballrooms and Biscotti, Lorelai describes how they were in London and then got a train to Dublin to try to stalk Bono. Couldn't the writers have done some basic research on Europe like maybe looking at a map? Ireland and England are on two totally different landmasses.

[readster]

 

I don't know if that is the most realistic expectation.  If there was nothing Luke was observing (until late in the game) to suggest Jess was having significant trouble in school, then there's no real reason to start cold calling teachers or the principal to track his progress.  My expectation would be that if my child's teacher was observing a problem, they would contact me, rather than just leave me in the dark on the off chance that I might call in to check.

That's the problem too. It wasn't very common for elementary schools during the time, but middle and high schools, if there is such a large showing of absences, teachers or admin contact the parents/guardian. Its extremely common now a days. While I get that they could have pulled a Party of Five and had Jess deleting messages on Luke's answering machine (if he had one or caller ID). I just call the entire thing stupid and Jess even pointed out to Rory in not so many words, he was doing the homework and taking tests/quizzes. The principal even hit him up saying Jess's skipping was why he was going to repeat his senior year. Not because he was failing his classes. Of course, a school counselor would have been in on the meeting too. There would have even been the talk of just taking his GED as an alternative. That's been a common practice since 2000. It was just a contrive plot to get AS-P spin off series that even after casting and so forth, was apparently never going to get the final green light by the studio.

Edited April 4, 2016 by readster

[Taryn74]

I just call the entire thing stupid and Jess even pointed out to Rory in not so many words, he was doing the homework and taking tests/quizzes. The principal even hit him up saying Jess's skipping was why he was going to repeat his senior year. Not because he was failing his classes. 

 

It was utterly ridiculous.  I have two kids in high school right now, and one in middle school, and I start getting calls from the school if they've missed 5 or 6 days (even with excused absence notes signed by me).  Heck, even if they're tardy to their classes too many times I start getting calls and they have to do an after-school or Saturday school suspension.  There is NO WAY it would have gotten to the point of over 30 absences without the school finding some way to speak to Luke in person.  It just wouldn't happen.

[readster]

It was utterly ridiculous.  I have two kids in high school right now, and one in middle school, and I start getting calls from the school if they've missed 5 or 6 days (even with excused absence notes signed by me).  Heck, even if they're tardy to their classes too many times I start getting calls and they have to do an after-school or Saturday school suspension.  There is NO WAY it would have gotten to the point of over 30 absences without the school finding some way to speak to Luke in person.  It just wouldn't happen.

Exactly! I work in the education system and I tell you, if you have a student with 3 tardies in a row, there is a talk to why they are tardy. I know we are going a decade since this all happened, but Luke would have been contacted in one way or another. There is also no way Jess wouldn't have been taken to either the guidance counselor office or the principal after almost 7 days. As for being notified even after excused absences, schools want to know if everything is ok and if special needs have to be met due to the long absences so students don't fall behind or if there is possible forgery happening. Once again, extremely stupid that Jess ever got to this point and not only Luke not knowing, but word spreading in town that Jess was at Walmart more than school. Especially considering that word spread through ESP in Stars Hollow when something was going on. Usually with Rory, but many times too how something just happened, and BOOM! Someone knew from Taylor to Babbett.  

[andromeda331]

I wondered about the spreading around town too because it happened all the time in Stars Hollow,

Miss Patty and/or Babette seemed to find out everything so fast. Look at how fast they found out

about the split between Rory and Lorelai, or Lorelai and Luke, they put up those ribbons with

speed. But not just them but Lindsay mentioned at that party that Jess used to go to their school.

But I agree it makes more sense the school would have called repeatedly if Jess was missing

that many days until they got Luke on the phone. He got called down in season two to find

out had bad Jess was doing in school. Although in that case the school would have called

him a lot sooner. Its a small town if they weren't getting Luke on the phone you'd think

someone from the school would have dropped by.

[dustylil]

I wondered about the spreading around town too because it happened all the time in Stars Hollow,

Miss Patty and/or Babette seemed to find out everything so fast. Look at how fast they found out

about the split between Rory and Lorelai, or Lorelai and Luke, they put up those ribbons with

speed

 

Some items of gossip seemed to spread widely and quickly in Stars Hollow but not all. The split between Luke and Lorelai in Season 5, yes. Lorelai's marriage to Christopher in Season 7, not so much.

[ZuluQueenOfDwarves]

So, the episode where Dean has his first movie night with the girls was on this morning, and I hate, hate, HATE with the fire of a thousand suns the conversation between Dean and Lorelai about Lorelai's expectations for the relationship between him and Rory. It was so painfully patriarchal. Not that Lorelai's concerns weren't valid, but that was a conversation for mother and daughter, not an agreement to be made about the daughter by mother and boyfriend. Ick! I expect better from a purported feminist.

[moonb]

Yeah, in light of the discussion about the Lorelai/Dean/Jess/Rory dynamic going on in the rewatch threads, I'm watching the scene in A-Tisket, A-Tasket where Lorelai and Emily have one of their inadvertent mother bonding moments over Lorelai's dislike of Jess, and there's that same kind of language - Emily's line about "good girls going bad with the wrong influences." Lorelai trusts Rory not to go bad. (Jess is troubled for drinking/smoking/vandalizing/cutting classes/sexual activity; Rory is or would be bad, and in a different way from her accidental night with Dean in Rory's Dance.) The specter of teen sex did show up in surprising ways. And then there's that controversial "I got the good kid" line in season 3 after the Paris and Rory conversation about Paris sleeping with Jamie.  Thank God the show left that behind when Rory got to college. 

 

Which, if Jess is the worst the show can do in terms of troubled teens - and maybe teenage Christopher and Lorelai - , what must Stars Hollow High be like? That's another discussion though :)

Edited April 6, 2016 by moonb

[dustylil]

Emily's line about "good girls going bad with the wrong influences."

 

I guess Christopher wasn't the wrong kind of influence. Emily was singing his praises for years after Lorelai went "bad". I appreciate the fact that he was willing to get married. However, it doesn't take away from the fact that he got a fifteen year old girl pregnant. Perhaps it was some kind of secular virginal conception.

[Melancholy]

I guess Christopher wasn't the wrong kind of influence. Emily was singing his praises for years after Lorelai went "bad". I appreciate the fact that he was willing to get married. However, it doesn't take away from the fact that he got a fifteen year old girl pregnant. Perhaps it was some kind of secular virginal conception.

 

Emily's remark did about "good girls going back with the wrong influence" reeked of Emily talking about Christopher/Lorelai. Kelly Bishop's delivery of "I know Rory’s a good girl, but good girls can go bad with the wrong influences. We all know that" was quite pointed and loaded to Lorelai. For Emily, Chris was the wrong kind of influence at the time but he redeemed himself by wanting to marry Lorelai, use his breeding and name to continue Emily's idea of a fine family. I think that attitude is very wrong for a number of reasons- but you can't say that Emily wasn't saying Chris was a bad influence on Lorelai. She really, really was and it's a key subtext in the scene. It's in keeping with Richard's statement that he wanted to kill Christopher after he knocked up Lorelai, but Chris redeemed himself and wanted to be part of a solution of turning a bad situation into a respectable one by marrying Lorelai. 

[dustylil]

but Chris redeemed himself and wanted to be part of a solution of turning a bad situation into a respectable one by marrying Lorelai

 

Of course he could have been part of the solution by being a dutiful father to his elder daughter. That would also have improved a bad situation.

Although come to think of it, Emily was all in favour of Christopher not marrying Sherry and giving Gigi a father. So I guess there are degrees of redemption and respectability.

[txhorns79]

It's in keeping with Richard's statement that he wanted to kill Christopher after he knocked up Lorelai, but Chris redeemed himself and wanted to be part of a solution of turning a bad situation into a respectable one by marrying Lorelai.

 

That's true.  I know it's been discussed before, but I have always been curious about whether Lorelai ever discussed her plans to run away with Rory with Chris before she actually did so.  I think she didn't, and I would have been interested to know his reaction to what would have been a pretty huge event.  I did feel like Lorelai made lots of noises in support of the idea of Chris being an active part of Rory's life, only because she knew it was unlikely to happen.  That way she gets the best of both worlds.  She gets to look like a very good parent, while maintaining a pretty tight control over Rory's life.     

[shron17]

I know it's been discussed before, but I have always been curious about whether Lorelai ever discussed her plans to run away with Rory with Chris before she actually did so.  I think she didn't, and I would have been interested to know his reaction to what would have been a pretty huge event.

My thinking is that while Chris was still underage his parents probably sent him away to school somewhere where it would be difficult for him to see Lorelai and Rory. And I'd like to think that Lorelai let him know where they were fairly soon after she left, but who knows.  Chris did say in Presenting Lorelai Gilmore that he dealt with his parents fighting by moving to California, but the whole timeline in terms of what happened when is very vague. 

[Kohola3]

Although come to think of it, Emily was all in favour of Christopher not marrying Sherry and giving Gigi a father. So I guess there are degrees of redemption and respectability.

 

Emily, much like a dog breeder, seemed to be very invested in pedigree more than anything. Wealthy, good-genes Christopher should be matched with a show-quality female not a working class mutt.  And Lorelai was certainly not an appropriate breeding match with the Diner Guy.

 

She went that same route with Logan and Rory.  They were a perfect match in her eyes because of the Huntzberger pedigree. Neither the Marlon Brando wannabe or the bag boy made the cut.

[Melancholy]

I don't know that Emily thought Sherri was a working class mutt. That didn't seem like it was on Emily's list of reasons to resent Sherri. We do know that Sherri went to private school and she gives off a vibe like a perennially privileged, even spoiled girl. Sherri could have come from money. IMO, Emily didn't give a fig for Sherri and Gigi because they're not her family and thus, not her concern so she couldn't care less if Christopher made an honest woman of Sherri or co-raised Gigi as the married father. In fact given that in Emily's mind that it's a competition, she's just upset that Gigi/Sherri get the respectability and present father in Christopher that Rory/Lorelai didn't. Emily's not judging redemption and respectability on an abstract basis where all baby mommas are on the same level. In her mind, she's advocating for her daughter and granddaughter to have that. 

 

Again, I think Emily was wrong to feel this way. There's plenty respectable and redemptive in how Lorelai raised Rory as a single mom. Chris shouldn't have needed a marriage with Lorelai to step up as a father, and E/R should have judged him more on his bad parenting than his willingness to go along with the marriage plan at 16 as an excuse for future irresponsible, selfish choices. However, I do think it's consistent within Emily's head. Moreover, IMO, Lorelai felt the same way that she was jealous that Gigi/Sherri got the complete family and respectability and ease of having Chris around as the married father. Emily wasn't exactly imposing feelings that Lorelai didn't have. I think this exchange is very on-point:

 

EMILY: Christopher gets his life together with that woman.

LORELAI: So, that’s good.

EMILY: It should’ve been you!

LORELAI: What?

EMILY: Don’t play dumb, Lorelai. You know it too, and deep down I know you’re heartbroken.

LORELAI: I’m not heartbroken.

EMILY: Well, I am.

 

....Yeah, Lorelai *was* heartbroken- but just committed to not voicing it to appear like she's above such perceived jealousy or weakness. 

Edited April 6, 2016 by Melancholy

[dustylil]

Wealthy, good-genes Christopher should be matched with a show-quality female not a working class mutt

 

I think he should have been matched with another runt of the litter, much like himself. But that's just me.

My thinking is that while Chris was still underage his parents probably sent him away to school somewhere where it would be difficult for him to see Lorelai and Rory

 

I agree. And from their point of view, it would make a great deal of sense. The whole business might  be written off as an unfortunate youthful folly that he would soon get over and forget.

[txhorns79]

My thinking is that while Chris was still underage his parents probably sent him away to school somewhere where it would be difficult for him to see Lorelai and Rory. And I'd like to think that Lorelai let him know where they were fairly soon after she left, but who knows.  Chris did say in Presenting Lorelai Gilmore that he dealt with his parents fighting by moving to California, but the whole timeline in terms of what happened when is very vague.

 

You are right.  The timeline was kept very vague, and it's kind of difficult to figure out how certain things worked.  For example, I used to think the Haydens cut off ties to Rory and Lorelai due to Lorelai either refusing to marry Christopher, or Lorelai having run away from home.  However, Francine makes a comment in Christopher Returns about not having seen Rory since she was starting to speak in complete sentences, which would imply the Haydens were still seeing Rory after Lorelai became a maid since babies usually start talking around 18 or so months, and likely wouldn't be speaking in complete sentences until some point later.  Why did they suddenly cut off all ties then?  I know some of this was for plot convenience, but it would have been nice to see more explanation for why things were the way they were.       

[JayInChicago]

It's hard for me to imagine the Haydens, as written and portrayed, ever calmly visiting their grandchild even as a baby. Mr Hayden would have preferred Lorelai aborted Rory. Granted, I'm totally down for a woman's right to choose, and Lorelai chose to take the pregnancy to term and keep Rory.

Isn't time suppose to heal all wounds? Over 16 years later and they were still enraged.

[dustylil]

Some babies start talking before they are a year old, others later. Similarly, with speaking in sentences. I can well imagine Rory in a household of involved, highly verbal adults talking early on.

Isn't time suppose to heal all wounds? Over 16 years later and they were still enraged

 

But why not blame Lorelai and Rory and be angry at them though? It was much easier to do that than to look at any failings of their own or of their son. Be they shortcomings back in the mid-eighties or in more recent times.

[moonb]

Given that Rory was 18 months to 2 years old according to the timeline, I wonder if it had something to do with Christopher not getting into Princeton. (Did he even apply to college?) The Haydens suddenly flipping out over college admission and hanging on that for years is a real stretch, but apparently it was a big deal for them. During the flashback in Dear Emily and Richard, Straub and Francine are upset, but not as hateful as they come off in Christopher Returns. And they view Lorelai and unborn Rory as an embarrassment; Straub suggests an abortion, Francine wants to send Lorelai away, and they consider the situation more the Gilmores' problem than theirs. But they don't think of Lorelai as this seductress who swept Chris along in her plans to destroy both their futures (paraphrasing Straub in Christopher Returns).  So they could have reluctantly visited with Lorelai, Chris and baby Rory right after her birth.  And later on, I could see the Haydens concocting some sort of fiction about how Lorelai not marrying Chris put him on a road to a less than stellar academic record that ended in him not going to Princeton, and making that all Lorelai's fault. 

[txhorns79]

Isn't time suppose to heal all wounds? Over 16 years later and they were still enraged

 

It's a plot contrivance.  If Straub and Francine aren't seriously estranged from Rory and Lorelai, it gives Lorelai a source for the Chilton money outside of Emily and Richard, likely without their strings.  It would have been an interesting situation, with competing sets of grandparents, but I suppose it would undermine the premise of the show. 

Edited April 6, 2016 by txhorns79