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Agents Of S.H.I.E.L.D. and the MCU

Tarasme

By Tarasme
in Agents Of S.H.I.E.L.D.

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Raja

Raja

  On 3/18/2018 at 4:07 PM, shrewd.buddha said:


It would also be nice if AoS were allowed to mention any of the Avengers or even Nick Fury .. such as why Tony Stark cannot be contacted to help with stopping the Earth from being destroyed. 

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The easiest way to keep it all connected is the old school way of preventing friendly fire accidents, each unit has its own lane. ABC, Freeform, Hulu and Netflix all get their own characters that they get to play with and it seems that Disney is through with providing cameos from the movies as was done with Director Fury, Maria Hill, President Ellis, Lady Sif and Jasper SitwellI.If one of the TV shows mentions something that a movie director wants to use then the connections get broken as the potential billion dollar payday will trump an episode of TV. So AoS only mentions movie events in the past tense as part of a newscast of the big event in the background. About as close as the show has come is in Age Of Ultron you got the impression that Captain America was leading The Avengers on a series of anti-Hydra raids while on AoS you thought that all of Hydra and SHIELD while running from national security agencies  were in deep cover sniping at each other.

 

Back to the thematic tie in to Ragnarok. Deke played basically the same role Valkyerie did.

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Chicago Redshirt
Chicago Redshirt

I took this from the thread about "One Door Closes."   To sum up, the MCU is an acronym for "the Marvel Cinematic Universe,"  which is sort of a revolutionary concept. Prior to it, each comic book m

kennyab
kennyab

I don't think the show needs to justify its existence in any way other than being entertaining. And while I enjoyed Age of Ultron, I find Agents of SHIELD to be much more entertaining right now. The t

Kromm
Kromm

On the surface I believe the explanation that there just wasn't time to address it properly. When thinking about it though I realized that the "breezy" style of a lot of Marvel Movie dialogue could h

SnoGirl

SnoGirl

(edited)

They did talk about Fury a lot season one when Shield fell to Hydra. I actually think Hydra was the best thing that happened to this show. But as the show grew older, the references got less and less. It bums me out because this show is on Disney. And back when this show first started, the Movie Marvel actors all said that they would cameo on the show. Missed opportunities. Its still frustrating to me that they have never had Coulson crack a joke about Matt Murdock. You know Couslon would be all over the Devil’s in Hell’s Kitchen...from afar. I think he would be amused by him. 

Come on Disney, let everyone play in the sandbox. A reference will not ruin the Marvel TV/Movie universe.

Edited by SnoGirl
TVSpectator

TVSpectator

(edited)
  On 3/19/2018 at 2:57 PM, Raja said:

The easiest way to keep it all connected is the old school way of preventing friendly fire accidents, each unit has its own lane. ABC, Freeform, Hulu and Netflix all get their own characters that they get to play with and it seems that Disney is through with providing cameos from the movies as was done with Director Fury, Maria Hill, President Ellis, Lady Sif and Jasper SitwellI.If one of the TV shows mentions something that a movie director wants to use then the connections get broken as the potential billion dollar payday will trump an episode of TV. So AoS only mentions movie events in the past tense as part of a newscast of the big event in the background. About as close as the show has come is in Age Of Ultron you got the impression that Captain America was leading The Avengers on a series of anti-Hydra raids while on AoS you thought that all of Hydra and SHIELD while running from national security agencies  were in deep cover sniping at each other.

 

Back to the thematic tie in to Ragnarok. Deke played basically the same role Valkyerie did.

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AoS IMO has really moved into some jumping of the shark territory when it came to MCU lore. First was the Global Inhuman Panic that didn't even get a blip off the radar of anyone else's radar (no mentioned of them on JJ, DD, The Punisher, LC, IF, The Defenders, Runaways, and even the movies have ignored them. The only one that came close was Scott Buck's Inhumans series), Spider-Man: Homecoming actually set the MCU timeline with the "8 Years Later" time card (while AoS had Talbot referred the Battle of New York happening in the year 2012),  Dr. Strange estalsihed that the future isn't set in stone (pun intended) and that it can be changed, there was never a "Hong Kong Incident" that Sentaor Nadeer mentioned on AoS' 4th Season, and Homecoming also basically ingnored pretty much everything that AoS said that the Sokovia Accords allowed/outlawed (the registration of every powered person) and also ingorned the "outlawing of AIs" stated by AoS, etc....  Not to mention that they seemed to be throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks (again) and it seems like the proverbial shark that they jumped had puppies. 

 

Overall, the best thing that could happen for both the Movies and TV side is for them to unite into one division but as long as Feige and Perlmutter are there (Feige being the head of Marvel Studios and the movies while Ike Perlmutter is the head of Marvel Entertainment and the TV side) this is probably going to be nothing more than a pipe dream for some time. 

Edited by TVSpectator
TVSpectator

TVSpectator

(edited)
  On 4/28/2018 at 2:21 AM, kitlee625 said:

So I don't want to spoil Avengers: Infinity War, but having read some spoilers, I just have one question -- how is Agents of SHIELD going to possibly incorporate this into their story? Based on The Candyman's offhand comment in tonight's (4/27) episode, it seems like the show is occurring concurrently with the movie.

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I didn't see the film (yet) but assuming from the spoilers I heard I would assume that :

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Edited by TVSpectator
kitlee625

kitlee625

(edited)

It would be really ironic if

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On a non-spoilery note, I know it was just a throw away line, but I was annoyed that Daisy's response to something going down in New York was "I don't watch TV." Really? SHIELD isn't in the business of protecting the world anymore? Then what is the purpose of SHIELD? Because it seems like they only exist to make messes and then frantically try to clean them up.

Edited by kitlee625
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TVSpectator

TVSpectator

  On 4/28/2018 at 4:10 AM, kitlee625 said:

It would be really ironic if

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On a non-spoilery note, I know it was just a throw away line, but I was annoyed that Daisy's response to something going down in New York was "I don't watch TV." Really? SHIELD isn't in the business of protecting the world anymore? Then what is the purpose of SHIELD? Because it seems like they only exist to make messes and then frantically try to clean them up.

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In my opinion, they really have moved away from the whole, SHIELD is an organization that was once designed to protect the world/US.

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CTrent29

CTrent29

(edited)

I think we're a long way from the days of "Turn, Turn, Turn" in late Season One and "CAPTAIN AMERICA: THE WINTER SOLDIER".  For me, that period was the high point of the MCU.

 

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Then what is the purpose of SHIELD? Because it seems like they only exist to make messes and then frantically try to clean them up.

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SHIELD has been creating and cleaning up messes since its early days.  Operation: Paperclip anyone?  It took the agency over sixty years to clean up that mess.

Edited by CTrent29
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SnoGirl

SnoGirl

Omg. If Shield ends with

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Froippi

Froippi

  On 4/28/2018 at 6:22 PM, SnoGirl said:

Omg. If Shield ends with

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No way that is happening 

SnoGirl

SnoGirl

  On 4/28/2018 at 7:36 PM, Froippi said:

they just haven't had a big tie in since season 1 and I don't see that happening in season 5

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They did have the Darkhold, which tried in with Dr Strange. I just like speculating. With a comic book show, you just never know ??‍♀️ Disney kept Agents of Shield around for some reason. Why not because of another tie-in? Its not like Disney really needs Agents of Shield, I saw more commericals for the show all week than I think Agents of Shield played during their commericals. Miles may vary of course ☺️

TVSpectator

TVSpectator

  On 4/28/2018 at 7:44 PM, SnoGirl said:

They did have the Darkhold, which tried in with Dr Strange. I just like speculating. With a comic book show, you just never know ??‍♀️ Disney kept Agents of Shield around for some reason. Why not because of another tie-in? Its not like Disney really needs Agents of Shield, I saw more commericals for the show all week than I think Agents of Shield played during their commericals. Miles may vary of course ☺️

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Personally, I would say that is also more of a fan theory about the Darkhold being from Dr. Strange's library. We just don't know because the movies haven't confirmed nor denied anything.

 

As with the show being an MCU promo- well the theory goes that Disney wants a Marvel presence and also a Star Wars presence on their TV channels. So ABC has Marvel while the Disney XD channel (had) Star Wars Rebels. Now, the rumor mill is that there is a planned Star Wars TV show in the works to replace Rebels. 

 

  On 4/28/2018 at 6:22 PM, SnoGirl said:

Omg. If Shield ends with

  On 4/28/2018 at 7:04 PM, Froippi said:

No way that is happening 

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Well, if the show still wants to be in the MCU then it has to happen. Although, I won't be surprised if all the villains were the ones for that to happen and everyone else (a.k.a. our main characters) will just witness it. Which, IMO, would be another cop-out because nothing bad can happen to these characters. Its like they are just toy action figures while everyone else either dies and/or gets maimed, etc.... 

 

  On 4/28/2018 at 9:58 AM, CTrent29 said:

I think we're a long way from the days of "Turn, Turn, Turn" in late Season One and "CAPTAIN AMERICA: THE WINTER SOLDIER".  For me, that period was the high point of the MCU.

 

SHIELD has been creating and cleaning up messes since its early days.  Operation: Paperclip anyone?  It took the agency over sixty years to clean up that mess.

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Operation: Paperclip was a real thing and that (even in the MCU) pre-dated SHIELD. 

Overall, with all the spoilers (and I haven't seen the film yet), maybe Infinity War isn't all that hyped up it was to be?

ahisma

ahisma

  On 4/29/2018 at 12:36 AM, TVSpectator said:

Overall, with all the spoilers (and I haven't seen the film yet), maybe Infinity War isn't all that hyped up it was to be?

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I saw it yesterday and walked out of the theater in absolute shock. I think it will have to get resolved next May (they should have kept the names IW1 and IW2, because it is a two-parter) but in the meantime I have no idea how it will affect SHIELD. It has to if they're still in the same world.

More than at any Marvel movie, be sure to stay for the post-credits scene (there's just one at the very end) if you're a SHIELD fan.

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Froippi

Froippi

  On 4/29/2018 at 1:35 PM, ahisma said:

I saw it yesterday and walked out of the theater in absolute shock. I think it will have to get resolved next May (they should have kept the names IW1 and IW2, because it is a two-parter) but in the meantime I have no idea how it will affect SHIELD. It has to if they're still in the same world.

More than at any Marvel movie, be sure to stay for the post-credits scene (there's just one at the very end) if you're a SHIELD fan.

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I mean is it even possible that maybe Agents of shield won’t have a tie in at all I know what was said in the media but they can be misleading to 

TVSpectator

TVSpectator

  On 4/29/2018 at 1:35 PM, ahisma said:

I saw it yesterday and walked out of the theater in absolute shock. I think it will have to get resolved next May (they should have kept the names IW1 and IW2, because it is a two-parter) but in the meantime I have no idea how it will affect SHIELD. It has to if they're still in the same world.

More than at any Marvel movie, be sure to stay for the post-credits scene (there's just one at the very end) if you're a SHIELD fan.

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I have already gotten spoiled for this movie so I know what happens in the end credit scene. That was what I was talking about anyways to happen if the show is actually part of the MCU.

Froippi

Froippi

  On 4/29/2018 at 2:39 PM, TVSpectator said:

I have already gotten spoiled for this movie so I know what happens in the end credit scene. That was what I was talking about anyways to happen if the show is actually part of the MCU.

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I heard about this scene but it did not seem like it was to much from the way it was described 

TVSpectator

TVSpectator

(edited)
  On 4/29/2018 at 4:10 PM, Froippi said:

I heard about this scene but it did not seem like it was to much from the way it was described 

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The scene I was talking about was

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Edited by TVSpectator
Froippi

Froippi

  On 4/29/2018 at 10:00 PM, TVSpectator said:

The scene I was talking about was

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I just feel this show is better off distancing itself from the movies and be it’s own thing 

kitlee625

kitlee625

  On 4/29/2018 at 12:36 AM, TVSpectator said:

Well, if the show still wants to be in the MCU then it has to happen. Although, I won't be surprised if all the villains were the ones for that to happen and everyone else (a.k.a. our main characters) will just witness it. Which, IMO, would be another cop-out because nothing bad can happen to these characters. Its like they are just toy action figures while everyone else either dies and/or gets maimed, etc.... 

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Well they did introduce several redshirt characters in this past episode. Perhaps they will 

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TVSpectator

TVSpectator

(edited)
  On 4/29/2018 at 10:04 PM, Froippi said:

I just feel this show is better off distancing itself from the movies and be it’s own thing 

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But if it is in the MCU and takes place during the events of Infinity War (with their always tie-ins) then it can't ignore something this big, IMO. It's either show it and/or show the after effects, or to ignore it and people will go to the idea that this show isn't part of the MCU. Also, it will be a big ass cop-out if no one from the main characters (a.k.a. Coulson's team) was affected because it would greatly cheapen the show, IMO. The movies clearly went there (but I am sure that the action will be "undone" the case I am presenting is that this show is right now between a rock and a hard place with this event. 

  On 4/29/2018 at 10:07 PM, kitlee625 said:

Well they did introduce several redshirt characters in this past episode. Perhaps they will 

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And this is the cop-out that I was talking about. They probably won't have their main characters be affected but honestly,

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Edited by TVSpectator
Froippi

Froippi

(edited)
  On 4/29/2018 at 10:08 PM, TVSpectator said:

But if it is in the MCU and takes place during the events of Infinity War (with their always tie-ins) then it can't ignore something this big, IMO. It's either show it and/or show the after effects, or to ignore it and people will go to the idea that this show isn't part of the MCU. Also, it will be a big ass cop-out if no one from the main characters (a.k.a. Coulson's team) was affected because it would greatly cheapen the show, IMO. The movies clearly went there (but I am sure that the action will be "undone" the case I am presenting is that this show is right now between a rock and a hard place with this event. 

And this is the cop-out that I was talking about. They probably won't have their main characters be affected but honestly,

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Ok then how do you renew the show cause then you would have two or three characters who can’t show up in Season 6 assuming their is one I know it has not been renewed 

Edited by Froippi
TVSpectator

TVSpectator

  On 4/29/2018 at 10:38 PM, Froippi said:

Ok then how do you renew the show cause then you would have two or three characters who can’t show up in Season 6 assuming their is one I know it has not been renewed 

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Beats me but how can you have this show be in the same universe as Infinity War without breaking continuity?

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Lady Calypso

Lady Calypso

The reason this show turned around in the first place to get multiple seasons, in my opinion, is because they did the tie-in with Winter Soldier. If they hadn't have done that, the show might not have even made it to five seasons. At the very least, the hype wouldn't have been as big as it was back then. 

I'd love for them to tie in Infinity War with the series again, as it would certainly be a turning point and would cause stir again with the media in a positive way, but I don't see them doing it. Which sucks because

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I think they used to take these risks earlier, but now they seem too afraid to. It's a real shame because if anything, this show could use a risky move, especially if it is ending this season. I mean, why not, you know? It worked in season 1, even with it being a new show. That was a major risk they took because the show was still establishing itself and it didn't really click until the tie-in. They weren't afraid of turning the obligatory Hot New Agent into an evil Hydra agent. That was a huge and risky move, as evident by the Ward, and SkyeWard fans. 

Perhaps, it would have been better if this season ended in concurrence with Infinity War. Then, that way, they might have been more brave to make the move the show probably doesn't want to make.

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TVSpectator

TVSpectator

  On 4/29/2018 at 11:22 PM, Lady Calypso said:

The reason this show turned around in the first place to get multiple seasons, in my opinion, is because they did the tie-in with Winter Soldier. If they hadn't have done that, the show might not have even made it to five seasons. At the very least, the hype wouldn't have been as big as it was back then. 

I'd love for them to tie in Infinity War with the series again, as it would certainly be a turning point and would cause stir again with the media in a positive way, but I don't see them doing it. Which sucks because

  Reveal spoiler

I think they used to take these risks earlier, but now they seem too afraid to. It's a real shame because if anything, this show could use a risky move, especially if it is ending this season. I mean, why not, you know? It worked in season 1, even with it being a new show. That was a major risk they took because the show was still establishing itself and it didn't really click until the tie-in. They weren't afraid of turning the obligatory Hot New Agent into an evil Hydra agent. That was a huge and risky move, as evident by the Ward, and SkyeWard fans. 

Perhaps, it would have been better if this season ended in concurrence with Infinity War. Then, that way, they might have been more brave to make the move the show probably doesn't want to make.

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Yeah, maybe it's better if the show  ends with:

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Overall, you are right, the show just won't take any risks anymore. Maybe this is why they are showing the team breaking down in anticipation of the end?

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scrb

scrb

  On 4/29/2018 at 10:04 PM, Froippi said:

I just feel this show is better off distancing itself from the movies and be it’s own thing 

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Haven't the movies been ignoring what goes on in the show too?

Like Hydra almost taking over the planet or what was happening with the Framework?

Seems like the producers and writers of the movies aren't even bothering to coordinate with the Shield writers and show runners.  Or even giving them a courtesy consultation of story outlines.

Froippi

Froippi

  On 4/30/2018 at 3:45 AM, scrb said:

Haven't the movies been ignoring what goes on in the show too?

Like Hydra almost taking over the planet or what was happening with the Framework?

Seems like the producers and writers of the movies aren't even bothering to coordinate with the Shield writers and show runners.  Or even giving them a courtesy consultation of story outlines.

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Which is why they the show should be able to ignore it

Raja

Raja

I figure when the canary in the coal mine disappears Fitzsimmons will miss interpret it.  They would think the Simmons theory of time travel and loops now had empirical evidence. Season or series finale. Where as if they get a season 6 they can roll that back when the S.H.I.E.L.D. survivors find out what happened to the rest of the world while they were in the Lighthouse or space fighting the Confederation and Graviton. then Avengers 4 is released and the movies roll back on what just happened in the rest of the universe.

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scrb

scrb

  On 4/30/2018 at 4:16 AM, Raja said:

I figure when the canary in the coal mine disappears Fitzsimmons will miss interpret it.  They would think the Simmons theory of time travel and loops now had empirical evidence. Season or series finale. Where as if they get a season 6 they can roll that back when the S.H.I.E.L.D. survivors find out what happened to the rest of the world while they were in the Lighthouse or space fighting the Confederation and Graviton. then Avengers 4 is released and the movies roll back on what just happened in the rest of the universe.

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Yeah it seems like their theories of time would be rendered moot because there's an infinity stone which will rewind time, which is going to be used by the movies.

Raja

Raja

(edited)
  On 4/29/2018 at 11:03 PM, TVSpectator said:

Beats me but how can you have this show be in the same universe as Infinity War without breaking continuity?

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This one is simple, SHIELD is locked down in the Lighthouse or in space. I don't know if you have seen the movie or just gotten a few spoilers but Infinity War spoliers

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Edited by Raja
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TVSpectator

TVSpectator

(edited)
  On 4/30/2018 at 4:21 AM, Raja said:

This one is simple, SHIELD is locked down in the Lighthouse or in space. I don't know if you have seen the movie or just gotten a few spoilers but Infinity War spoliers

 

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But that won't protect them from the affects of the Infinty Gaulent. It affects literally all of space/the universe. Also

 

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Edited by TVSpectator
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Raja

Raja

  On 4/30/2018 at 4:47 AM, TVSpectator said:

But that won't protect them from the affects of the Infinty Gaulent. It affects literally all of space/the universe. Also

 

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Character death spoilers follow. It doesn't have to be justified why a few don't die as we saw in the movie 

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Zautruche

Zautruche

I just don't see a season 6 happening, not only the ratings are really low, but they are trapped between Infinity War and Avengers 4 (who is set 5 years after IW). Every other series and movies happening between are all set in the past. Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. can't since they just told us IW is happening right now.

They won't have the budget to show what would a post-IW world would look like, especially when everyone knows it's going to be undone after A4. They can't avoid that by having the team stuck in an alternate reality/timeline because they just did that for the last ~30 episodes. They can't set the season after Avengers 4 for obvious reasons. So the only way a season 6 is happening is if it's airing after A4.

Are we really expecting that ABC is going along with that ? When we know they had to be forced for a season 5, that they slashed the budget and the crew planned for a possible ending ?

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SnoGirl

SnoGirl

  On 4/30/2018 at 4:16 AM, Raja said:

I figure when the canary in the coal mine disappears Fitzsimmons will miss interpret it.  They would think the Simmons theory of time travel and loops now had empirical evidence. Season or series finale. Where as if they get a season 6 they can roll that back when the S.H.I.E.L.D. survivors find out what happened to the rest of the world while they were in the Lighthouse or space fighting the Confederation and Graviton. then Avengers 4 is released and the movies roll back on what just happened in the rest of the universe.

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Could you just imagine it? 

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I think it depends on how gutsy they are. Do they acknowledge Infinity Wars and tow the line? Or do they say we’re in an alternate universe bc of the time loop?

If Shield comes back, I wonder if they would move it to a winter/summer show....

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Raja

Raja

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I think it depends on how gutsy they are. Do they acknowledge Infinity Wars and tow the line? Or do they say we’re in an alternate universe bc of the time loop?

If Shield comes back, I wonder if they would move it to a winter/summer show....

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While the other TV shows on networks with a lower expectation they might play looser with the movie tie-ins for AoS it is their bread and butter and with ABC already balking at orders from Disney. Being a limited run summer show after Avengers 4 would solve a problem of how you go forward 

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SnoGirl

SnoGirl

(edited)
  On 4/30/2018 at 4:30 PM, Raja said:

While the other TV shows on networks with a lower expectation they might play looser with the movie tie-ins for AoS it is their bread and butter and with ABC already balking at orders from Disney. Being a limited run summer show after Avengers 4 would solve a problem of how you go forward 

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To be honest, the more I think about it, the more I want Shield to actually be gutsy and do it. I think they could swing a winter comeback by

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Edited by SnoGirl
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Raja

Raja

(edited)
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I have heard from a couple of people speculation that the movies will make a five year time jump. If true AoS could have it "series finale" and then jump into a future world along with the movies.  It would certainly be easier then to try to fit in the immediate aftermath of the Infinity War and mess up the "its  all connected"  on the TV end.

edit to add:

5 years because possible Avengers 4 spoiler

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Edited by Raja
found the 5 year jump source
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TVSpectator

TVSpectator

(edited)
  On 4/30/2018 at 4:04 AM, Froippi said:

I never agree with the tv shows and movies sharing the same universe I thought it was silly

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Yeah, I thought that DC had the better plan of having multiple universes so their shows and movies can do whatever the hell they want. Instead, they all have to aline if they are all taking place in the same universe. I am not going to count the number of times both TV shows and movies have conflicted with each other but overall, AoS has to show it, IMO, to be even in the same universe. 

  On 4/30/2018 at 4:39 PM, SnoGirl said:

To be honest, the more I think about it, the more I want Shield to actually be gutsy and do it. I think they could swing a winter comeback by

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My bet is that they won't show it but instead have the characters just comment on it happening. Although does anyone know when AoS was done filming their last episode of this season? 

  On 4/30/2018 at 12:15 PM, Raja said:

Character death spoilers follow. It doesn't have to be justified why a few don't die as we saw in the movie 

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In the movie

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Those are so pretty big names and also some original characters from their first movies.  If the movie had the balls to do it then the show should do it as well but I don't see the show doing in because, writing-wise, they don't take big risks on this show, IMO.  Also, I don't see any of this staying after Avengers 4, FYI, either. But again:


 

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  On 4/30/2018 at 11:14 PM, Raja said:
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I have heard from a couple of people speculation that the movies will make a five year time jump. If true AoS could have it "series finale" and then jump into a future world along with the movies.  It would certainly be easier then to try to fit in the immediate aftermath of the Infinity War and mess up the "its  all connected"  on the TV end.

edit to add:

5 years because possible Avengers 4 spoiler

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I have heard about that too. I have also heard that

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  On 4/30/2018 at 4:39 PM, SnoGirl said:

To be honest, the more I think about it, the more I want Shield to actually be gutsy and do it. I think they could swing a winter comeback by

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But that just doesn't solve anything.

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Edited by TVSpectator
TVSpectator

TVSpectator

  On 5/1/2018 at 12:56 AM, Froippi said:

I mean you could make it in the multiverse but doubt they will go their 

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Yeah, this show has been trying to tie itself to the movies for a long time and I just don't see them suddenly going, "psych we are actually a parallel universe" or something.

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TVSpectator

TVSpectator

  On 5/1/2018 at 6:45 AM, jhlipton said:
  Reveal spoiler
Expand  
  Reveal spoiler
 

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