Spoilers and Discussion

[Florinaldo]

That ET sneak peek, which is now available on YouTube, seems perfectly acceptable from a professional and technical standpoint, even though one might disagree with some editorial decisions, as usual with such material. It fits the probable parameters of the order that was placed with the promotion department, i.e. a clip with a BTS feel to it that will have a short shelf life, for posting on a media Web site and perhaps for broadcast in a shorter version, in order to perhaps hook some viewers for this week episode. It's also in line with the PR line of the week for Glee, which has been to play up the angle of an original song by a cast member (and collaborators) which others in the cast and crew have also tweeted about. I think that any impact on iTunes sales may just be a side benefit.

 

Although the song is selling; last time I saw numbers reported today it was #210 in U.S. singles sales. That may be the Starkid fanbase at work so we'll see if it peters out, or if things pick up again after the broadcast.

Edited March 3, 2015 by Florinaldo

[caracas1914]

Well one things the parameters don't change is that season 6 iTunes Glee sales of singles is in the crapper.

Edited March 3, 2015 by caracas1914

[fakeempress]

I don't follow the charting. The last Glee song I remember people talked about breaking the Top 10 on Itunes was Let Me Love You by Jacob Artist, and I think it was the only one which managed to do it back then (Season 4)? Was there a change in their rules of charting afterwards, idk?

Edited March 3, 2015 by fakeempress

[caracas1914]

The overall best selling record sales for a Glee episode from years 4 and 5 was " The Quarterback" by far. The second best selling episode was " The breakup".

Of the Noobs Jacob's single was the best seller for Season 4, though it was pretty much equaled by Lea's Season 5: " make me feel your love". The big difference was that both the EP " the Quarterback" and Lea's single cracked the top ten concurrently.

The biggest drop off in Season 4 was downloads. It was as much as 500-1000 percent less than previous seasons in the worst selling weeks.

Edited March 3, 2015 by caracas1914

[fakeempress]

Yeah, I was thinking as a single. Jacob was the only one to crack the Top 10 singles in Season 4. But I think all songs chart in some way as singles, even if they're released on episode EPs

[Craphole Island]

I'm guessing Pony and I Kissed A Girl are audition songs since well we already know Tinas is and the background on both sounded the same to me.

[indeed]

I don't get how they can have a Hummelberry duet in 2009 though. I don't buy these two talking to each other let alone singing together.

Maybe they're both shown singing the song, but they're not signing it together. So, Kurt can keep his season 1 Kurtness and not have much time for one Miss Rachel Berry, but they can show both of them having something in common early on that will help build their friendship later. There are a few ways to have them sing Popular without Kurt owing the rest of his life and married bliss to Rachel because she helped steer him toward glee club, but we'll see... Edited March 3, 2015 by indeed

[Ceeg]

I wonder if the writers even bothered to go back and watch the Pilot before constructing this episode, or if they said, eh whatever, and just wrote situations from memory.

[shantown]

I wonder if the writers even bothered to go back and watch the Pilot before constructing this episode, or if they said, eh whatever, and just wrote situations from memory.

Hah! Like any writer has watched ANY previous episode.

[SadieT]

As for "Popular", as annoyed as I am that Rachel dominates the song (playing the Galinda part) while Kurt is second voice (as Elphaba), it makes sense with their characterization. Rachel is far more a Galinda type - self-centered, selfish, a know-it-all who actually doesn't know much at all and who does a lot of really shitting things to those that she professes to care about because she thinks that she's right), whereas Kurt is much more like Elphaba - more sincere and caring than Galinda, and far, far stronger. Elphaba is the one who learns to find strength in her own uniqueness and never sacrifices those that she loves for her own benefit. It works with a pre-season one Rachel, who thinks that she's God's gift to the musical universe.

 

Interesting analysis. I’m sure you gave the lyric distribution much more thought than the writers and producers who were probably just going for what sounds best and chose the song because both characters weren't particularly popular and didn't have many friends before Glee. One tiny problem though, Popular isn’t a duet, it’s a Glinda solo that she sings to Elphaba, not with her, so neither Kurt nor Rachel are singing the Elphaba part. They’re splitting Glinda’s song, which I guess by your interpretation also makes Kurt the “self-centered, selfish, a know-it-all who actually doesn't know much at all and who does a lot of really shitting things to those that he professes to care about because he thinks that he's right.” But I don't agree, not completely at least. Sure Kurt could be insufferable and self-righteous at times, and in season 1 he was a bit of a snobby bully, but he wasn't so bad and he had his redeeming qualities. When Kurt and Rachel did sing a proper Elphaba/Glinda duet (For Good), Rachel took the Elphaba part and Kurt sang the Glinda part however, which makes sense because Kurt's the one who thinks he can make people over to fit the image he thinks they should be.

 

Anyway, the song sounds good. One of my favorites from the season. 

[caracas1914]

Good lord, trying to find "logic" as to who sings what on Glee is a fruitless endeavor.

Rachel and Kurt sound wonderful on "Popular", and it's irrelevant that it's not a duet sice 99 percent of Glee's duets were never meant to be. Case in point: Last season's Kurt duets with Blaine and Mercedes of " Love is a Battlefield" and " I am changing", it's just alternating lines on these things.

Irregardless, Kurt and Rachel were definitely NOT friends in Season 1 , Kurt thought of her as a selfish self centered diva and while Rachel wasn't mean spirited, she was offensively oblivious how she came across to others. ( Artie's retort " no offense but your obnoxious"). IIRC None of the Glee kids per the pilot actually liked her, whereas it appeared Kurt and Mercedes were tight, and even seemed to bond more with Artie/Tina.

However assigning Elphaba and Glinda roles is giving these shitty writers away too much credit, ie that they actually thought these things through.

Edited March 4, 2015 by caracas1914

[shantown]

However assigning Elphaba and Glinda roles is giving these shitty writers away too much credit, ie that they actually thought these things through.

Pretty much this. I'd be surprised if RIB spend more than five minutes on any this.

[caracas1914]

Who can forget " At the Ballet" which made absolutely no sense, other than Ryan was obsessed with the number.

[ComfySweater]

I'm going to ignore the rest of that mess and focus on getting at least one final Amber solo that is incredible. She can sing anything, and I will line up to buy it. That woman can sing.

 

I have various issues with the rest, but I'm going to ignore all of them and listen to Amber blow the house down some more.

[rlj67]

New Stills are out for the finale, Rachel is pregnant LMAO

[caracas1914]

Uh... Is Sam the father???

NOT...Jesse St. James is in the photo...LMAO

Edited March 4, 2015 by caracas1914

[Myrna123]

New Stills are out for the finale, Rachel is pregnant LMAO

And Kurt is apparently playing Liza Minelli in a presumably one-man show...

[tom87]

Yeah not a great job on Kurt's 2009 or 2020 hair. 

 

Not sure why they released pictures of the finale 3 week before .   Oh well it doesn't matter now I'm just gonna sit back and enjoy the show on and off the tv.  :)

Uh... Is Sam the father???

NOT...Jesse St. James is in the photo...LMAO

Haha just saw some Samchel fans actual saying she may just be Blaine and Kurt's surrogate.

[fakeempress]

"2009" - what pact could Kurt and Rachel have made, cause they didn't really seem to acknowledge each other's existence in the Pilot

I dreaded any kids for any couple not Wemma in the finale, and they managed to sneak one in. Rachel pregnant lmao.

Edited March 4, 2015 by fakeempress

[spiritof76]

 

 

Uh... Is Sam the father???

NOT...Jesse St. James is in the photo...LMAO

 

 

Haha just saw some Samchel fans actual saying she may just be Blaine and Kurt's surrogate.

Sigh.....why won't people just accept the inevitability and awesomeness of Samchel's love? 

[tom87]

I must have watched a AU pilot episode becasue the 5 original interacted in the one I watched.    Even after Mr Shue said he was leaving Rachel  was  (anointed herself) "interim director" and they were all trying to keep the group together and then Finn joined. 

[phoenixrising]

 

Haha just saw some Samchel fans actual saying she may just be Blaine and Kurt's surrogate.

 

Oh, dear God, no. Klaine would ruin a child. 

 

Seems to be a bit much, but hey, it's not Sam's so I'll take it. It's weird though. 

 

On the note of popular, although Lea and Chris both sound fantastic, I do find it a weird choice. The point of the song is a popular person guiding the way (which is why I wanted Kitty to do this song, because she's popular. . .). So. . .what context is this in? Is it just them fantasizing about being popular? And as everyone else has pointed out, they hated each other in season 1. They're totally retconning the crap out of this episode. 

[tom87]

Oh, dear God, no. Klaine would ruin a child. 

 

Seems to be a bit much, but hey, it's not Sam's so I'll take it. It's weird though. 

 

On the note of popular, although Lea and Chris both sound fantastic, I do find it a weird choice. The point of the song is a popular person guiding the way (which is why I wanted Kitty to do this song, because she's popular. . .). So. . .what context is this in? Is it just them fantasizing about being popular? And as everyone else has pointed out, they hated each other in season 1. They're totally retconning the crap out of this episode. 

they think glee club will make them popular?  

 

I actually do not think Rachel ever hated Kurt.  

[phoenixrising]

they think glee club will make them popular?  

 

I actually do not think Rachel ever hated Kurt.  

 

If that's the case, they really are retconning this pretty intensely. I'm pretty they didn't think that back in the pilot.

 

And yeah, my bad, I don't think Rachel hated Kurt either. But Kurt would not hang around Rachel long enough to talk to her about anything pre-Glee, and even then not until season 2. 

[fakeempress]

I must have watched a AU pilot episode becasue the 5 original interacted in the one I watched.    Even after Mr Shue said he was leaving Rachel  was  (anointed herself) "interim director" and they were all trying to keep the group together and then Finn joined. 

Did it seem to you that Rachel and Kurt had made a any kind of pact before, and that they associated outside glee club ? 

[camussie]

Looking at this picture in conjunction with this picture and this picture I think what happens is there is a let's support Rachel on her Tony night party at Rachel and Jesse's house.  They leave for the Tony's.  Her family and friends see her win it on TV,  She comes back for the celebration afterwards.  The only question I have is why is Roderick at the Tony celebration party?  Also it doesn't look like Sam is there.  Maybe he is off coaching a game in New Jersey.  Most likely though, he is out of shot from the picture.

 

Also since Rachel is pregnant and in that last song she isn't that tells me the last song is out of context like many people guessed.  

Edited March 4, 2015 by camussie

[phoenixrising]

 

Also since Rachel is pregnant and in that last song she isn't that tells me the last song is out of context like many people guessed.  

 

Well, it looks like they're all sitting around in the choir room together during Will's song in another picture, so I don't think it's out of context. They could still flashforward in a montage during the song to show the future beyond the 5 years? Or maybe the whole thing isn't 5 years in the future (just like I'm guess not all of 2009 is in 2009). 

[tom87]

Did it seem to you that Rachel and Kurt had made a any kind of pact before, and that they associated outside glee club ? 

I have no idea I just think they may have interacted more than some have implied.

 

I am also not arguing they will not recon because they are making up a whole scenario before the fact.  I just do not think if Rachel was one to spearhead the glee club it is a horrible thing or does it negate the importance the others had to the club.  Like I mention before she seemed to  be the one trying to keep it together after Shue was leaving trying to keep Finn involved at least,  so why would that be strange to  think she was trying to keep it together after Reyerson left ? 

Edited March 4, 2015 by tom87

[jaytee1812]

Ugh. Of course the last time we see these people there cheering on Rachel bloody Berry. I'm surprised they didn't go the whole hog and have the women in Cheerios uniforms. Looks like Tina is with Artie too. Double ugh.

Awful awful end for two fabulous women like Tina and Kitty.

Upside, looks like the rest of the ND could care less!

[camussie]

Well, it looks like they're all sitting around in the choir room together during Will's song in another picture, so I don't think it's out of context. They could still flashforward in a montage during the song to show the future beyond the 5 years? Or maybe the whole thing isn't 5 years in the future (just like I'm guess not all of 2009 is in 2009).

 

 

I never thought whole episode was the flashforward.  Just the final act. My guess is that Rachel makes her choice earlier in the episode and Will sings once last song to the group before she is off to NY.  We do a short flashforward with this year's nationals/rachel in NY and then a longer one to 5 years down the line.  

 

Also the last song isn't Will's song.  That is just the last song they recorded.  The last song is the group number which it appears will be out of context given that Rachel is pregnant in the fast forward but not in the group number.  

Edited March 4, 2015 by camussie

[indeed]

Seriously, five years into the future and Blaine's still wearing bow ties and Kurt's still sportin' the neck kerchiefs. Ugh. At least Blaine's hair looks decent. There's that.

Edited March 4, 2015 by indeed

[camussie]

so why would that be strange to  think she was trying to keep it together after Reyerson left ?

 

 

Unless I am misremembering there is no indication they were all in Glee together when Sandy Ryerson was the coach.  The only person  we knew was in Glee besides Rachel was Hank Saunders,  the student Sandy took "special" interest in.  Rachel used that to get Sandy fired,  Will took over.  Put up the sign-ups and the rest we know from the pilot.  

 

That means IF Rachel is a driving force to getingt the others to sign up, while it won't be a complete retcon I think it goes against the general feel of the pilot - that while the "losers" all knew each other none of them really liked Rachel or were open to listening to her.  Artie/Tina seemed to be actual friends when the pilot started as did Mercedes/Kurt but Rachel wasn't friends with any of them.

 

It would be even more of a retcon to say they were in a Sandy Ryerson run Glee club because I thought part of the point of those 4 signing up was that they were ready to take a chance on Glee while the point of Rachel signing up is she saw a chance to be a star.  

Edited March 4, 2015 by camussie

[Ann Mack]

Why are these Samchel fans now saying Rachel is a surrogate for Blaine and Kurt? Or that some how Sam ends up with Kitty. Are they really that desperate for Sam to be with anyone other than Mercedes? 

 

I don't know how it plays out but it may be that Sam and Mercedes gets the original Finchel ending. Right now it doesn't make sense to assume that he is with Kitty I mean he has interacted with her even less than he did with Rachel. But whatever this horrible show will be done soon enough!

 

Still the only one getting the bulk of the attention is Rachel. After 5 years the Glee Club members are still letting the lives don't have because they have been sacrificed to Rachel take precedent over anything they may have wanted for themselves!

[Myrna123]

Looking at Rachel's story, it really is like the last season has been conceived, plotted and written by a committee of eleven year old girls. Rachel's actually the one who put the glee club together, she's the one every single person worries about and cares about and works to make sure is happy, her biggest dilemma is that she has it choose between going back to the most prestigious performing school in the US or starring in a Broadway show, and in the end she ends up literally having everything in the world -- husband, baby on the way, and mind-blowing professional success--winning a Tony award. It's all just so stupid.

Edited March 4, 2015 by Myrna123

[spiritof76]

 

Are they really that desperate for Sam to be with anyone other than Mercedes?

Yes, they are.

 

I don't even care anymore. 

 

l'll just go with my head cannon of Mercedes goes on to be awesome and fabulous with no help or support from anyone. Well at least not anyone she went to high school with. She will have an awesome and fabulous guy, whom she will thank when she wins her Grammy (the first of many), and then they will get married (she always said she wanted to win a Grammy before getting married) and she will get to have her awesome and fabulous married sex. The End.

[camussie]

I do find it curious Sam isn't in that party picture where they all appear to be cheering on Rachel's win.  Either he is out of frame or he isn't there so I wonder what happened given that he has been written as a big part of Glee since mid season 4.  More so than Artie and Roderick, who are in that picture, for sure.  

 

I also wonder what the context of the outfits in this picture Tweeted by Lea are.   Maybe attends nationals after all.  Also given the Kurt/Blaine locker picture and the Kurt/Sam locker room picture I wonder if Kurt, Rachel, and Blaine are all going back to New York/NYADA and the rest of the grads are also leaving Lima and that is why there is a "farewell" song from Will

Edited March 4, 2015 by camussie

[tom87]

Unless I am misremembering there is no indication they were all in Glee together when Sandy Ryerson was the coach.  The only person  we knew was in Glee besides Rachel was Hank Saunders,  the student Sandy took "special" interest in.  Rachel used that to get Sandy fired,  Will took over.  Put up the sign-ups and the rest we know from the pilot.  

 

That means IF Rachel is a driving force to getingt the others to sign up, while it won't be a complete retcon I think it goes against the general feel of the pilot - that while the "losers" all knew each other none of them really liked Rachel or were open to listening to her.  Artie/Tina seemed to be actual friends when the pilot started as did Mercedes/Kurt but Rachel wasn't friends with any of them.

 

It would be even more of a retcon to say they were in a Sandy Ryerson run Glee club because I thought part of the point of those 4 signing up was that they were ready to take a chance on Glee while the point of Rachel signing up is she saw a chance to be a star.  

In one version ( maybe the screener) they show a scene of Sandy directing the song One from a chorus line and the kids are part of the "stool" choir.  You see Rachel, Mercedes, Kurt and Tina in this song.

 

As I said recon is gonna happen.  If the kids want the club bad enough maybe they think they can deal with her cause she has been in their classes for ages anyway.

Edited March 4, 2015 by tom87

[Ann Mack]

If you have to retcon so much of a shows history then maybe you should find another way to tell the story. TV viewers are intelligent enough to know when things did or didn't happen such as Rachel and Sam prom history that NEVER WAS!. So it just makes the show lose credibility (not that Glee has much left)  to try and rewrite history to fit a story line they want to tell when the viewers watching know it ALL or MOST OF IT IS LIES. 

Edited March 4, 2015 by Ann Mack

[fakeempress]

So the only point of "2009" is to retcon Rachel into the reason why everyone signed up for glee club ? Perfect. Good that the show's ending cause she'll be curing cancer and solving world hunger next. And I say that as a sort of Rachel fan.

Edited March 4, 2015 by fakeempress

[rlj67]

Chord didn't film on the day they filmed the group scene of them cheering Rach on, it was his B'day, they also filmed Rachel's solo on that day too, so he wont appear in that scene as well

[camussie]

To be fair we don't know what happens in "2009."  That said to me it looks likely they are going to retcon the episode to say Rachel was a driving force in getting them all to sign up for Will's glee club

 

Also from  this blog here are the scene numbers for the various pictures

Schue singing “Teach Your Children” in the choir room (includes pic of Mercedes, Kurt, Blaine, etc at the piano) - Scene 7

Blam locker room scene - Scene 10
Kurt and Blaine looking in Blaine’s locker - Scene 13
Blaine, Rachel, and Kurt (in that awesome black outfit) - Scene 25
Kurt, Blaine, Mercedes, etc. on the couch (watching Rachel win a Tony?) - Scene 30

Group selfie - Scene 34

 

 

Will's song is earlier in the episode than I thought it would be.  Also given that order I am going with my guess that:

• Rachel, Kurt, Blaine, and I guess  and Mercedes Artie are all leaving for NY with Tina going back to Providence so Will sings them off (scene 7).  
• Blaine says goodbye to Sam  even though they have barely spoken all season (Scene 10)
• Kurt/Blaine them reminisce at a locker that inexplicably still has their pictures in it (scene 13)
• Rachel/Blaine at Rachel's before the Tony's (scene 25)
• Tony win (scene 30)

 

Filling in the blanks I think the following happens 

• Rachel/Sam goodbye scene (sometime in the "real time" McKinley scenes)
• Current ND end up in NY for nationals.  Kurt/Blaine and Rachel are there (sometime after scene 13).  That was Lea's me and my boys photo which would explain Blaine having current hair.  The only caveat is people who were at Nationals filming said Blaine/Kurt were there but Rachel wasn't. So maybe it is a performance of Rachel's that they all attend,  Either way, given Blaine's hair it is probably near future than 5 years future.
• Flashforward 5 years to Kurt/Blaine on the street in their hideous outfits (after NND at nationals but before the Tony gathering)
• Flashforward 5 years to Will and future ND and Will/expanded family (after NND at nationals but before the Tony gathering)
• Rachel acceptance speech (after scene 30)
• Final song (scene 34)

 

At first I thought Rachel would go home after her Tony's to celebrate but now I think we will go straight from the acceptance speech into the out of context final number

Edited March 4, 2015 by camussie

[Ann Mack]

I'm really hoping Sam and Rachel have broken up before like in episode 10 or 11 before we get to the final 2 episodes. Jesse returns before that. 

[camussie]

I think even if they have broken up there will be one final scene between Rachel/Sam in the last episode, probably with her thanking him for helping her to open her heart again.  

[rlj67]

LOL I highly doubt there is a final Sam/Rachel scene in the finale, prolly in 611 but def a final Will/Rachel scene in the finale

[phoenixrising]

I'm still going to say it. It's really shitty that we aren't getting flash forwards of everyone, which I suspect. I'm LEAST invested in Rachel, Kurt, and Blaine right now. Like, they can spend more time on those three and Will, I don't care.

uuuugh.

[Ann Mack]

LOL I highly doubt there is a final Sam/Rachel scene in the finale, prolly in 611 but def a final Will/Rachel scene in the finale

I'm hoping in episode 10 Sue spills the truth about hypnotizing Sam. I know Glee isn't big on finishing out a story line but it would give closure with them able to part and go their separate ways while still maintaining their friendship. I go back to Jane speaking as Sue when she says there is "no relationship, just friends". They can bond their friendship over their hate for Sue I really don't care as long as the farce ends and ends soon. Its been drug out longer than it ever needed to be IMO. I really don't see Rachel "thanking" anyone other than those she mentions at her acceptance speech. I'm sure in her mind she accomplished ALL on her own.

[camussie]

LOL I highly doubt there is a final Sam/Rachel scene in the finale, prolly in 611 but def a final Will/Rachel scene in the finale

 

 

I think there will be both.  They have spent a lot of time on Sam/Rachel this season so I think they will get some sort of goodbye scene in the finale.  After all they are giving Sam/Blaine one even though they barely spoken this season.  

 

What is going to be a farce is all of these goodbye scenes at McKinley that are going to play like final goodbyes.  As often as these people come back to Lima are we supposed to think this time when they say goodbye they finally mean it?  That this time they won't be running back to Lima every few months.  

Edited March 4, 2015 by camussie

[tom87]

Why do we think they break up the last episode and not  we built this city?

[fakeempress]

 

Kurt/Blaine them reminisce at a locker that inexplicably still has their pictures in it (scene 13)

Looks like Blaine's locker? It got preserved for the future generations like Dalton had his blazer in a display case  LOL

[Ann Mack]

I think there will be both.  They have spent a lot of time on Sam/Rachel this season so I doubt they don't give them some sort of goodbye scene in the finale.  After all they are giving Sam/Blaine one even though they barely spoke this season.  

 

What is going to be a farce is all of these goodbye scenes at McKinley that are going to play like final goodbyes.  As often as these people come back to Lima are we supposed to think this time when they say goodbye they finally mean it?  That this time they won't be running back to Lima every few months.  

In retrospect I don't think they have spent that much time or at least not quality time. Episodes 4-6 was them putting them together with Sam still declaring his love for Mercedes. That is until the writers did an Invasion Of The Body Snatchers and wrote Mercedes as a pod person. Episode 7 they get together. In episodes 8 and 9 they had very limited interactions. I haven't watched but from what I have heard is most of Sam scenes were he gets to talk and not be shushed by Rachel has involved him trying to get her back to New York. As well as whichever episode it is were their talks again involve him trying to help her decide between NYADA or Broadway. So the show is letting us know they are together but without any emotional connection really between the two. So I'm sure he'll say farewell I just don't think it will consume too much time. But then again the show is on retcon steroids so he could have an emotional breakdown knowing he is losing the love of his life (sarcasm couldn't help myself).