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Spoilers & Speculation: Running Hot & Cold

formerlyfreedom

By formerlyfreedom
in Legends Of Tomorrow

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kismet

kismet

7 hours ago, Proteus said:

I like her with Cisco so I wouldn't want to see that ended so she could be on LOT.

Is she the woman IN the flash preview with the leather top that looks a lot like the nuBC? I was wondering who that was. I dont really watch Flash anymore. The muSical was a special event for me.

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Lokiberry
Lokiberry

I love Mick, he's a great character, but he tried to kill Sara and steal the time drive which would have stranded the team in whatever time period they were in. He did this because he was unhappy on t

Sakura12
Sakura12

Why do writers think fans want to see huge conflict? When has that ever turned out well for any show? Does he not watch Arrow, does he not see how that is hurting the show?  I liked Legends becau

Lokiberry
Lokiberry

Sara was treated horrifically on Arrow, but since she came to LoT, she's received the best treatment of any female character in the flarrowverse. She's been given plenty of screen time. She hasn't bee

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kismet

kismet

Can I ask why people don't like Stein?  Is it his age? I get the lack of firestorm. But honestly the only cgi fighter I feel the need to see is tiny ray. Personally I loved his duo with Mick. His comedy is so dry. The over the top break up was ridiculous and i give them  all a pass for plot purposes. 

For me victor garber provides some well needed gravitas and paternal figure. I just ddon't see an upside to cutting him.  So I wanna know why others want to cut him.

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Proteus

Proteus

48 minutes ago, kismet said:

Is she the woman IN the flash preview with the leather top that looks a lot like the nuBC? I was wondering who that was. I dont really watch Flash anymore. The muSical was a special event for me.

Yeah, that's her.

27 minutes ago, kismet said:

Can I ask why people don't like Stein?  Is it his age? I get the lack of firestorm. But honestly the only cgi fighter I feel the need to see is tiny ray. Personally I loved his duo with Mick. His comedy is so dry. The over the top break up was ridiculous and i give them  all a pass for plot purposes. 

For me victor garber provides some well needed gravitas and paternal figure. I just ddon't see an upside to cutting him.  So I wanna know why others want to cut him.

I love Stein as well.

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KirkB

KirkB

(edited)

I'm with Sakura12. I like Stein too (in fact, if I had to pick between the two halves of Firestorm I'd rather keep him and lose Jax). But if he left it wouldn't bother me as much as losing Sara or Mick.

Honestly, I don't DISLIKE anybody. I'm least interested in Nate and would actually be glad if he left because I think he's thrown off the dynamic they were building, but I don't hate the character.

Edited by KirkB
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Argenta

Argenta

(edited)

I like to see a range of ages in the cast rather than have everyone 'young' by default, so for that reason alone I would be sorry to see Stein go, even if his mannerisms grate a little at times.

I also don't actively dislike any character. The Legion of Doom is a huge part of this show's appeal for me, though, so next season will feel a lot less satisfying without them around.

Edited by Argenta
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Maverick

Maverick

 The Legion may still be around next year, just with some membership changes.  They are the counterpart to the Not So Superfriends so they may just swap around some villains like the Legends to.   I could see them wanting to keep Malcolm here.  I'm not an Arrow watcher, but I gather his character is fairly played out over there but they keep shoe horning him in because they like the actor.   I'm still not clear if he's even been on Arrow this year since he was supposedly pulled from the timeline at the end of season 4.  Keeping him on Legends could solve the problem.  

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kismet

kismet

I love the Legion and don't want them gone. However, I think one of the trio will meet his final destination. But I sorta hope they have another primary villain next year because I don't want another cat & mouse chase just with a different mystical object. Perhaps have the Legion meddle and be recurring troublemakers, but not have them being the sole reason for the Legend's mission.

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Starfish35

Starfish35

2 hours ago, Maverick said:

I'm still not clear if he's even been on Arrow this year since he was supposedly pulled from the timeline at the end of season 4.

I gather he showed up in a flashback in the last episode, but no, he hasn't been seen in the current timeline.  

I understand he's supposed to be in the last two or three episodes though, so I don't know what that means for how his storyline ends up on Legends.

This was posted over in the Mind Your Surroundings thread.  Apparently BR told a fan that only Sara and Amaya have scenes with Doomworld!Felicity. 

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tofutan

tofutan

The first things that jumped to my mind were: 

1.) She is a superhero and Amaya and Sara now being the enforcers of Team Evil find her and kill her (explaining why she doesn't have scenes with anybody else)

2.) She's actually has also been drafted by Darkh, works for Team Evil and gives Amaya and Sara information. 

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MarkHB

MarkHB

12 hours ago, squidprincess said:

Huh, I wonder if she'll be the superhero fighting them as Darhk's assassins then.

And if a character dies in the doomworld reality, would that kill them in the real one?  

I would say/guess that the nature of the Spear's power is such that what it creates is the "real reality."  It looks like Mick, at least, retains memories of the previous world, but in general my take on it is that, where the Legends can treat history like a whiteboard but they only have pens to work with (and Barry only has Sharpies that don't erase very well), the Spear brings not only an eraser but a spray bottle of cleaner to the table.  The writers can't take it too far as they need to be able to successfully resolve the story in favor of the Legends, but in essence death of a character in Doomworld should not affect them in the original reality, because unless and until the Legends gain control of the Spear and reverse it the original reality is no more than fanfiction.

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kismet

kismet

It will be interesting to see what the permanent ramifications of the Spear & Doomsworld are. And what rules are established around the whole entire Spear, how it works, how one resolves it. It does not appear to be a hallucinogenic state or altered plane of reality like Music Meister's world was. I will be curious to see how the writers write their way out of it, now that they have used the Spear. I think it will be considered more than fanfiction. I think certain things that happen in Doomsworld will have permanent repercussions on reality as we knew it before the Spear and as we know it after the Spear.

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Lokiberry

Lokiberry

I don't think there will be any residual reprecussions of Doomworld. It'll be a reality that the Legion created, and when the Legends get the Spear they'll change everything back to the way it was, and no one will remember except them. And maybe Cisco, if it's plot-convenient.

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Lokiberry

Lokiberry

I'm pretty sure this is all going to end with them going to Aruba instead of 1942 and this whole season never having happened, which means Amaya and  Nate never joined the team, and Evil Snart was never pulled from his own time.

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Proteus

Proteus

42 minutes ago, Lokiberry said:

I'm pretty sure this is all going to end with them going to Aruba instead of 1942 and this whole season never having happened, which means Amaya and  Nate never joined the team, and Evil Snart was never pulled from his own time.

Why would the season have to be erased?

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squidprincess

squidprincess

I doubt that they would reset the whole season.  They had to go to 1942 to stop New York from blowing up.  Though I suppose if they use the spear anything is possible.

My guess is that the team from Doomworld will meet the Fellowship Era team, and succeed in changing the past.  I think the Doomworld versions will die in the process or get wiped from existence though, with Aruba as some sort of metaphor.  Thus we'd get a soft reset, but not necessarily a full one.

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Miss Dee

Miss Dee

As I speculated in the Doomworld episode, maybe it's actually both Fellowship-Legends and Doomworld-Legends that get killed in the finale so that the crew boarding the Waverider at the end is a mix of each. I do think that would be a ballsy move...some of them remembering what happened and the others having no experience of it. Possible divided loyalties for the third season....

I'm really glad to hear Mick speaking the word "Aruba" in this episode to everyone, as it makes me hopeful that the tie in to his speaking it in the first episode of the season is going to show "Aruba" is meant as a group metaphor/symbol rather than an individual one for Mick. If the latter, I'd be certain Aruba represents either his death or his choice of a destiny away from the Waverider, neither of which I want to happen.

Please God, if Mick is alive at the end of the episode along with the other Legends (however it's mixed between the two groups), let there be a full and total reconciliation and acknowledgement by all (including Mick himself) that he is a fully equal and accepted crew member of the Waverider. Bonus points if it ends in a group hug. We need it.

Ooh, it just hit me! What if the only person who has both selves standing at the end is Nate?? One Nate can go back with Amaya, and the other stays with the Waverider: best of both worlds. (True, it doesn't make a lick of logical sense...but if you're watching Legends for logical sense, you need to rethink your priorities.)

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Lokiberry

Lokiberry

7 hours ago, squidprincess said:

I doubt that they would reset the whole season.  They had to go to 1942 to stop New York from blowing up.  Though I suppose if they use the spear anything is possible.

My guess is that the team from Doomworld will meet the Fellowship Era team, and succeed in changing the past.  I think the Doomworld versions will die in the process or get wiped from existence though, with Aruba as some sort of metaphor.  Thus we'd get a soft reset, but not necessarily a full one.

 

Yeah, you're probably right. If they wipeout Doomworld then that team should go with it, leaving the 1916 team with knowledge of anything that happened during that year.

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kismet

kismet

I can't remember is there a significance behind the word or place Aruba??

I do think there might be some type of reset using the spear not only of Doomsworld but the standard Flarrowverse reality/timeline. I also wonder if they will leave it on a cliffhanger while they work out ideas, details and contracts for next year.

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ItCouldBeWorse

ItCouldBeWorse

6 minutes ago, Proteus said:

I hope MG is overhyping in regards to lots of team members dying and being replaced:

http://tvline.com/2017/04/03/legends-of-tomorrow-spoilers-season-2-finale-deaths-sara-laurel-reunion/

 

On 4/1/2017 at 9:16 AM, Miss Dee said:

As I speculated in the Doomworld episode, maybe it's actually both Fellowship-Legends and Doomworld-Legends that get killed in the finale so that the crew boarding the Waverider at the end is a mix of each.

I think you have called it.

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Starfish35

Starfish35

Well we already know they're adding a couple of characters next season so at least a couple of our current characters have to exit somehow. 

I'm still pretty sure one of them is going to be Amaya.  I really don't know about the other one at this point, though.  

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Proteus

Proteus

Yeah, I think I may be out. Sounds like this is going to become a type of show I don't like. They should be careful. That 0.5 demo rating may be getting smaller if they dont realize they are not GOT and people watch CW shows like this for the characters.

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Miss Dee

Miss Dee

(edited)

They've done an awesome job with Season 2; I'm not going to condemn Season 3 before I've even seen what it's going to entail. I read the Entertainment Weekly article and I have the feeling there was a lot of tongue-in-cheek comments made there. I'm guessing they only have a vague idea of what Season 3 is going to look like and they're having a great deal of fun teasing.

ETA: Ugh, this particular article did NOT make me feel optimistic about Mick's continued existence, however. And I'm going to be snowbound away from my home so I don't think I'm even going to be able to watch it. Someone might have to PM me and tell me what happens to Mick!

Edited by Miss Dee
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Starfish35

Starfish35

5 minutes ago, Miss Dee said:

They've done an awesome job with Season 2; I'm not going to condemn Season 3 before I've even seen what it's going to entail. I read the Entertainment Weekly article and I have the feeling there was a lot of tongue-in-cheek comments made there. I'm guessing they only have a vague idea of what Season 3 is going to look like and they're having a great deal of fun teasing.

I hope you're right.  I'm sorry.  Not having a great day and that GoT comparison just rubbed me the wrong way. :(

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Proteus

Proteus

7 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

I hope you're right.  I'm sorry.  Not having a great day and that GoT comparison just rubbed me the wrong way. :(

Shows these days love to say they are going to be GOT because they think that makes their show so cool and badass. For me, it turns me off. 

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squidprincess

squidprincess

(edited)

I'm not too worried about the deaths honestly.  We've conveniently got doubles of almost all characters, and that's a lot of people to potentially kill off.  We're likely going to see a lot of people die, but very few of the deaths will actually matter.

I do wish there was a way to know what characters are leaving ahead of time.  I know who I think is going or staying, but it's still worrisome.

Edited by squidprincess
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Argenta

Argenta

1 hour ago, Starfish35 said:

I hope you're right.  I'm sorry.  Not having a great day and that GoT comparison just rubbed me the wrong way. :(

 

1 hour ago, Miss Dee said:

 

No worries! I'm not having the best few days myself.

 

Aww, you guys. I hope it will not be considered off-topic if I offer hugs. Hope things pick up for you both soon. 

Honestly, I find interviews like the ones linked to above almost useless in terms of what they actually tell you. They're so vague (with good reason, to be fair, because no-one wants spoilers) and full of technicalities and misdirection and the like, that trying to tease out anything meaningful just feels like an exercise in frustration. 

I hope that at least we get definitive answers as to who is and isn't leaving, and they don't leave the fate of any major characters hanging over the hiatus. 

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Proteus

Proteus

(edited)

Phil Klemmer always gives the worst interviews. From day 1 everytime he has spoken about the show, it's made me not want to watch.

At this point I think Rip and Mick are goners. I think they'll kill Firestorm off next season. Sara may get the axe as well for shock value.  I think her death will come next year.

Edited by Proteus
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Primal Slayer

Primal Slayer

4 hours ago, Starfish35 said:

Legends of Tomorrow EP Klemmer Compares Season 3 To Game of Thrones

I'm sorry but that sounds stupid.  They're not Game of Thrones and they shouldn't try to be. I hate it when producers get all up on the "no one's safe" bandwagon.  That's not what I watch this show for. :(

I hate it when they say that mainly for the fact that we know its a lie. Sara and Ray are safe as hell. 

But I am excited/sad/wanting it to over to see Sara/Laurel get a final goodbye, even if it will probably be exactly the same as Arrows big 100 goodbye.

56 minutes ago, Proteus said:

Phil Klemmer always gives the worst interviews. From day 1 everytime he has spoken about the show, it's made me not want to watch.

At this point I think Rip and Mick are goners. I think they'll kill Firestorm off next season. Sara may get the axe as well for shock value.  I think her death will come next year.

This show doesnt have the legs to stand on to really kill off Sara. Everyone is likeable but none of them really stand out that much as much as Sara does.

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