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Spoilers With Speculation

SueB

By SueB
in Supernatural

ohjoy
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Please keep your speculation and comments on the end of Supernatural in the Supernatural Ending topic. Use this topic here or the Bitter Speculation topic for discussion of the upcoming season only. As always, keep Bitch vs. Jerk discussion in its own topic.

Thank you.

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SueB

SueB

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The titles a mix of traditional and out-of-the-blue (I THINK) this year.  
Keep Calm And Carry On -- obvious and perfect
Mamma Mia - a song.. SPN 101
The Foundry -- not a song or movie as far as I can tell
American Nightmare -- bands, song, movie, and comic... but none with a religious theme
The One You've Been Waiting For - a song but not well enough known to be related (and lyrics are off)
Celebrating the Life of Asa Fox -- seems random to me
Rock Never Dies -- not sure if it's related to the song but it's in-family with other SPN titles
Lily Saunders Has Some Regrets - random

The two with the names really strike me as odd.  There's probably something there but I don't know what.

I'm a little worried about this latest one (Lily Saunders) because they've not really handled Angel-lore very consistently.  I'm hoping there's some way to reconcile why she has an actual name and also has a past with Cas. 

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PeterKahlke
PeterKahlke

NEXT ON SUPERNATURAL Sam and Dean search for the yellow-eyed thing that killed their mom.

devlin
devlin

I don’t care who JA is going to be playing. I could seriously watch this guy read the phone book and be completely enthralled. I am just looking forward to some powerhouse acting full of nuances by wh

gonzosgirrl
gonzosgirrl

So, so over it. You're a big boy - if you don't agree, put up or shut your judgey piehole.

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catrox14

catrox14

(edited)
16 minutes ago, SueB said:

I'm a little worried about this latest one (Lily Saunders) because they've not really handled Angel-lore very consistently.  I'm hoping there's some way to reconcile why she has an actual name and also has a past with Cas. 

It just occurred to me, could she have been Cas' vessel before Jimmy Novak? Maybe something terrible happened to her or her family as a result of being Cas' vessel? Or she's Jimmy Novak's sister or something? Or maybe a potential vessel that was refusing so the angels/Cas kind of tormented her?

Edited by catrox14
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DittyDotDot

DittyDotDot

2 minutes ago, pixelcat said:

Am I supposed to know who Alicia Witt is?  Or care?

I don't know if you're supposed to know or care who she is, but the only thing I know her from is her stint on the last season of Justified.

Why you might care in relation to Supernatural, I believe she's supposed to be in the Cass-centric episode and she's supposed to be some sort of enemy of Cass's....mwahahahahahah! ;)

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pixelcat

pixelcat

6 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

I don't know if you're supposed to know or care who she is, but the only thing I know her from is her stint on the last season of Justified.

Why you might care in relation to Supernatural, I believe she's supposed to be in the Cass-centric episode and she's supposed to be some sort of enemy of Cass's....mwahahahahahah! ;)

Just seems her name is being thrown around like I should know who she is, and clearly I have no idea.  But then again, I'd be lucky to identify Beyonce (Taylor Swift I got).

If Castiel gets to be badass and stab her, then bring her on!  Otherwise... meh.

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DittyDotDot

DittyDotDot

12 minutes ago, pixelcat said:

Just seems her name is being thrown around like I should know who she is, and clearly I have no idea.  But then again, I'd be lucky to identify Beyonce (Taylor Swift I got).

Yeah, I'm not sure why they made it sound like everyone should know who she is. I only know because it was announced some time ago and I looked her up because she looked familiar.

Funny, I might be able to identify Beyonce--most likely not, though--but I'm pretty certain could not identify Taylor Swift even if she was wearing a name tag. ;)

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RulerofallIsurvey

RulerofallIsurvey

2 hours ago, SueB said:

American Nightmare -- bands, song, movie, and comic... but none with a religious theme

I thought this was a nod to American Horror Story.  Which, season 2 of AHS, I think, was in an asylum run by nuns/clergy, so that was the religious connection.

I got nothing on the others.  

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SueB

SueB

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Okay, it can't be a Wendigo.  Maybe that's what killed Asa.

And ouch.  Dean is not dealing with Mary being a rolling stone.  But Jodi! JODI IS PRACTICALLY PERFECT IN EVERY WAY.  Her joy, the hug, the cottoning on to a not-happy vibe, and her awkward departure.

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Aeryn13

Aeryn13

Bracing myself for the inevitable apology/lesson-learning/grovelling from Dean. Too bad because I think he is right. Does Mary not listen to herself or what? She is basically telling them how she is interested in catching up with everyone and everything BUT them. I would have walked away too to get some air.

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pixelcat

pixelcat

So it looks like Lucifer gets out from the bottom of the ocean by being summoned?

Please let tonight's episode BE GOOD because this week has been craptastic and I need something I've been looking forward to turning out right!

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MysteryGuest

MysteryGuest

4 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

Bracing myself for the inevitable apology/lesson-learning/grovelling from Dean.

Yeah, it's beginning to look like a recurring theme this season.  Dean over-reacts like a child, and then needs to be reprimanded and shown the error of his ways...yawn!

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Demented Daisy

Demented Daisy

Lotus press release

Quote

“Lotus” — (9:00-10:00 p.m. ET) (TV-14, DLV) (HDTV)

THE CHASE CONTINUES – Lucifer’s search for power and influence in a vessel lands him in the White House. The President of The United States (guest star David Chisum) unknowingly makes a deal with the devil, leading Sam (Jared Padalecki), Dean (Jensen Ackles), Castiel (Misha Collins), Crowley (Mark A. Sheppard) and Rowena (guest star Ruth Connell) to band together to fight the Dark Lord. Directed by Phil Sgriccia the episode was written by Eugenie Ross-Leming and Brad Buckner (1208). Original airdate 12/8/2016.

I can't.  Maybe I'm jumping the gun, but this does not sound good at all.

"The Dark Lord"?  Someone is definitely a Potter fan.  I thought it was Robbie Thompson, but maybe it's Dabb.  Or both!

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catrox14

catrox14

27 minutes ago, Demented Daisy said:

Lotus press release

I can't.  Maybe I'm jumping the gun, but this does not sound good at all.

"The Dark Lord"?  Someone is definitely a Potter fan.  I thought it was Robbie Thompson, but maybe it's Dabb.  Or both!

This sounds completely ridiculous. Sigh. I hope it's not as terrible as the synopsis makes it seem. 

I immediately thought of Darth Vader the "Dark Lord of the Sith" and Sauron "The Dark Lord" in Lord of the Rings. Dark Lord is a pretty common trope.

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Diane

Diane

40 minutes ago, Demented Daisy said:

Lotus press release

I can't.  Maybe I'm jumping the gun, but this does not sound good at all.

"The Dark Lord"?  Someone is definitely a Potter fan.  I thought it was Robbie Thompson, but maybe it's Dabb.  Or both!

So are the Winchesters really going to DC?

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catrox14

catrox14

3 minutes ago, Diane said:

So are the Winchesters really going to DC?

I'm really not excited for this at all.

I would find interesting if they bring back Jesse the Anti-Christ and go for "The Omen" redux and have him be like a White House Intern or something and he's ascending to power this way.

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Diane

Diane

Just now, catrox14 said:

I'm really not excited for this at all.

I would find interesting if they bring back Jesse the Anti-Christ and go for "The Omen" redux and have him be like a White House Intern or something and he's ascending to power this way.

I just think it's way out of the box and not plausible what so ever.  Way Way Way to much security.

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goldy

goldy

1 hour ago, Demented Daisy said:

Lotus press release

I can't.  Maybe I'm jumping the gun, but this does not sound good at all.

"The Dark Lord"?  Someone is definitely a Potter fan.  I thought it was Robbie Thompson, but maybe it's Dabb.  Or both!

That sound absolutely HORRIBLE! Lucifer is going to the white house? the president is making a deal with the devil? What are they (the writers) thinking??? I thought we were going small this season!!!

Can we end that stupid Lucifer storyline already? I want them to go back to the BMoL storyline. At this point, it sound less stupid.

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RulerofallIsurvey

RulerofallIsurvey

1 hour ago, Diane said:

I just think it's way out of the box and not plausible what so ever.  Way Way Way to much security.

Maybe Cas gets some more mojo back (siphons it off Vince?) and can zap them straight in past security.  Then there's always Crowley.  He could do it too, right?  (Still, I agree - sounds a little whacky).

Just now, goldy said:

I thought we were going small this season!!!

Well...no matter how big the president's ego is, he's not God.  ;)

1 minute ago, goldy said:

I want them to go back to the BMoL storyline.

Maybe this is how they get intel on HMSS?  It could play into that storyline.

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goldy

goldy

(edited)
14 minutes ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

 

Well...no matter how big the president's ego is, he's not God.  ;)

lol, I know. But I feel like that even with the president being very "small" compare to God, he's still a pretty big deal.

I don't know, I just feel like when they do smaller storylines and focus mainly on the brothers relationship the show is always better. IMO, there is no way there're gonna make lucifer going to the white house look anything but stupid! 

I hope I'm wrong though.

Edited by goldy
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DittyDotDot

DittyDotDot

2 hours ago, Demented Daisy said:

Lotus press release

I can't.  Maybe I'm jumping the gun, but this does not sound good at all.

"The Dark Lord"?  Someone is definitely a Potter fan.  I thought it was Robbie Thompson, but maybe it's Dabb.  Or both!

I would bet they all are Potter fans to some degree, but I think Dabb is the most likely source for this. I seem to recall him talking about Harry Potter in an interview a few years ago. I might have it mixed up with another writer though.

Anyhoo, of course it doesn't sound good...it's says it's written by the Horrible Duo! If Chuck could only smite them from his universe far, far away. ;)

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RulerofallIsurvey

RulerofallIsurvey

36 minutes ago, goldy said:

lol, I know. But I feel like that even with the president being very "small" compare to God, he's still a pretty big deal.

I don't know, I just feel like when they do smaller storylines and focus mainly on the brothers relationship the show is always better. IMO, there is no way there're gonna make lucifer going to the white house look anything but stupid! 

I hope I'm wrong though.

Oh, I agree completely!  I'm just holding out hope that it's not as stupid as it sounds. 

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SueB

SueB

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Lotus.  Hee.  Although DUDES, it needs to be capitalized LOTUS (Lucifer Of The United States).

I agree, "the President" is not small.  Like, not at all.

But I think they really are on the "humans are the bad guys" kick.  I think Crowley could pop into the oval office but no one else.  Which isn't going to do squat.  So... this is definitely going to be a creative writing exercise.  

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Wynne88

Wynne88

I think it would have been smarter not to do anything at all connected with the Presidency during an election year.  It's too easy to make a misstep when the election is so fresh and people are still worked up about it, and these writers don't have the greatest track record of even recognizing potential missteps.

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RulerofallIsurvey

RulerofallIsurvey

10 hours ago, SueB said:

I think Crowley could pop into the oval office but no one else.  Which isn't going to do squat.  So... this is definitely going to be a creative writing exercise.

Can't Crowley take someone (or multiples) with him?  I thought he'd done that before, but I could be wrong.  My memory these days...

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MysteryGuest

MysteryGuest

I've wanted Lucifer gone since I first heard he'd be back for last season, and that opinion hasn't changed.  So we get rock star Lucifer followed by a trip to the White House?  Since they are all teaming up in this episode, can it please mark the end of Lucifer?  

It's almost difficult for me to watch earlier episodes lately because the writing was just so much better then in comparison to now.  Are talented writers really that hard to find?

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SueB

SueB

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Quote

 

Samantha Smith ‏@SamSmithTweets  Nov 18

Wrapped tonight just in time to say, the Winchesters DO LOVE their #bacon. #supernatural

 

 

Which puts Sam Smith (Mary) in EP 12.  WELL past the mid-season finale/premier.  Color me surprised.

I still think we have a heavy tip towards end-game with Billie's confrontation in the hunter funeral ep.  But it looks like "later" is the answer.

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goldy

goldy

Catching Up With #Supernatural ‘s Samantha Smith

https://thenerdygirlexpress.com/2016/11/21/catching-up-with-supernatural-s-samantha-smith-via-stacyamiller85-samsmithtweets/

Samantha Smith has returned to Supernatural in Season 12 as Mary Winchester to the delight of fans.  The character is a beloved part of the history of Supernatural.  Mary is having a difficult time adjusting to the changes in the thirty-three years since she’s been gone.  After all, Mary left a four-year old and an infant and now she has to get to know her sons as grown men and hunters. But she is determined to put the pieces together and find her place in a different world (and life) she left.

I had the pleasure of interviewing Samantha in May.  Despite her very busy shooting schedule, she graciously agreed to a brief follow-up interview to talk about Mary in Season 12.  Read below to see what she had to say.

 Even though Mary Winchester was killed in The Pilot, she is such a pivotal character and a guiding force in Sam and Dean’s lives and, of course, the Supernatural landscape. Throughout these past 11 years, fans have been fortunate to see you return to the show in numerous episodes. When you learned that Mary would be resurrected in Season 12 not as a ghost or in an alternative reality scenario, what challenges did you face in how you approached Mary in Season 12?

“It was quite a shock to learn Mary would be alive—REALLY alive—again! Unlike in previous appearances, my focus this season has been on embracing Mary as a full person, not just the canonized “perfect mom,” and not just within whatever parameters the temporary appearance called for (as in “Eve,” for example). Mary is a whole person who we haven’t seen since she was played by Amy Gumenick in the flashback episodes. I’ve actually pulled a little from that, as well, since it is a big part of who the character is! The greatest— well, I don’t know if challenge is the right word, but it’s certainly been a huge consideration, has been to show the conflict in Mary’s heart without letting her be morose all the time. Hunters are resilient and pragmatic, and Mary is a Hunter. But she’s having to deal with a whole heck of a lot.” 

Of course, Mary wrestles with her memory of Dean as a 4 year old and Sam as a baby. What would you say is the difference in Mary’s interactions with each of her sons?

“I think that she naturally treats Dean as more of an equal, as he’s the oldest, and even though he was only four when she died he was a little person with a personality and with whom she had a relationship. Sam was an unknown entity, an infant who now has no memory of her from that time. He’s essentially a stranger. I think she intuitively navigates Dean’s hard shell, and sees how, at least overtly, Sam is more empathetic. So the different sides of Mary will be drawn to each of them depending on what’s going on with her.”

Which son do you feel more closely mirrors Mary’s personality?

“Interesting! I think Mary is essentially more like Dean, she has an iron core, is strong willed and determined. (And likes to drive fast and eat bacon.) However, I think she is also compassionate and can be sensitive, like Sam. But both boy are fighters, and both would give it all for their family, and Mary is the same. It’s a pretty nice blend of the two.”

In an upcoming episode, Mary will meet Sheriff Jody Mills.  Both of these strong women share a bond as mothers and as hunters.  What do you hope that Supernatural fans will take away from your scenes with Kin Rhodes?

“AHHH! What a joy THAT was. Kim and I have been talking about this possibility for literally years. Jody and Mary meeting each other was everything it should have been. We also got to have the scene (at the end, by the bonfire) that we knew was needed, illuminating how, without it actually being said, Jody had taken over as somewhat of a surrogate parent to the boys, and now that Mary is back she might need a little guidance in how to navigate a relationship with her grown up sons. I really hope that Jody and Mary stay friends!! I don’t see any reason they wouldn’t! I hope that the fans got all that and were as thrilled with it all as we were.”

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

On 11/18/2016 at 2:27 PM, Demented Daisy said:

Lotus press release

I can't.  Maybe I'm jumping the gun, but this does not sound good at all.

"The Dark Lord"?  Someone is definitely a Potter fan.  I thought it was Robbie Thompson, but maybe it's Dabb.  Or both!

Press Releases are written by someone in the CW PR department. It has nothing to do with the show, writers, producers, etc

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SueB

SueB

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BTW: Technically I think (the real) Lucifer had the "Dark Lord" title before Voldemort.  I think Rowena might have called him that last year too.  BUT, the Harry Potter connection could be the only reason they thought of it as well.

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DittyDotDot

DittyDotDot

I've never even read Harry Potter or seen any of the movies, but I think the connection was made more because "Dark Lord" isn't the only Harry Potter reference they've had over the last couple years. No matte,r who is writing the press releases, the show seems to be paying a certain homage. So many of these "themes" are all over literature and movies, but there just seems to be so many Harry Potter references as of late, I'm thinking it's not a coincidence.

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catrox14

catrox14

(edited)

I was re-watching Mamma Mia,  written by BuckLeming, wherein Rowena addressed Lucifer  as My Dark Lord so make of it what you will.

To make matters worse, it's the mid season finale according to a tweet from Jim Michaels. Let the death pool begin.

Edited by catrox14
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SueB

SueB

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NSFW for language.

Minor spoiler, Jensen's hand has a classic "knife slash" on the palm.  The Vancouver press tour was on 3 Nov so this is EP10 I think.  The one where Cas has an enemy? from his past show up.

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SueB

SueB

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Oh how fun!  I'm guessing:

- The bunny rabbit is a person, transformed by a witch into a rabbit.  Sam? Is that you???
- That's a de-aged Dean holding onto a pet bunny.  
 

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pixelcat

pixelcat

14 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Someone on Tumblr spec'd it's a Velveteen Rabbit thing...and now I want to cry

I seriously hope not. That book made me bawl my eyes out. 

19 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

He looks so beautiful!

I want a widescreen HD version of this for my computer background.  GIVE IT TO ME NOW.

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ahrtee

ahrtee

2 hours ago, SueB said:

Oh how fun!  I'm guessing:

- The bunny rabbit is a person, transformed by a witch into a rabbit.  Sam? Is that you???
- That's a de-aged Dean holding onto a pet bunny.  
 

I'm going with your second guess.  The caption says "coming to you 2/9/17" which (by my count?) should be episode 11...about the right time for the "de-aging" ep mentioned upthread.  Besides, he does look pretty young/unguarded (and maybe a little scared), doesn't he?   (Maybe not a pet bunny, but one he rescued from a "hunter"?)

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catrox14

catrox14

(edited)

https://twitter.com/pursuit23/status/803632551017398272
 

@What's Filming retweeted filming location.

Because I'm weird, I google mapped River Road and it's in an industrial zone with big swaths of fields, looks like an industrial/agricultural area, abutting the Fraser River. Interesting.

 

Quote

 

Ken ‏@pursuit23

#Supernatural signs up on River Road in delta #yvrshoots @olv #SPN

 

Edited by catrox14
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