Spoilers With Speculation

[DittyDotDot]

1 minute ago, catrox14 said:

Dean cooks mac and cheese, egg dishes, burgers, the chili recipe from their family, which is what I think Sam made in s8.

I'm sorry, I've only seen Dean make burgers and John's "cure-all" soup which sounded like it was just whatever one had on-hand thrown into a pot. The chili Sam made in S8 was from a can. I'm not sure when Dean made mac n' cheese, but are you sure it wasn't from a box? That's not home cookin' if you ask me.

[Diane]

14 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Dean cooks mac and cheese, egg dishes, burgers, the chili recipe from their family, which is what I think Sam made in s8.  If Dean makes a variety of things why does that variety end at a baked chicken, mashed potatoes and green beans?  Even if neither made such a meal, Dean very likely would have enjoyed a meal like this with Lisa and Ben at least ONCE in a year, surely.  I would think.  Maybe not Sam with Amelia since they were living in a hotel...until they shared that house.  Hmm not sure about Sam and Amelia.

Even allowing for the boys never having had this kind of family dinner even once in their lives is there something inherent in a quasi-family dinner that would trigger bad table manners and oafish behavior as guests in another person's home?

Also, I have brothers, nephews etc two of whom are quite challenged in the table manners department at times but when at a family dinner like this? They manage to keep their shit together even when the food is delicious. 

I understand the sentiment they were attempting to show here. That Sam and Dean never got that family dinner so I guess they just didn't know how to behave or became overly excited 12 year old boys out of the blue.  I didn't care for that aspect of the dinner scene and don't believe it to be indicative of them at this point of their lives.  

But with Mary back maybe they will just want Mom to take care of them to finally have that which they never had.  Meh.  Who knows.

I gotcha.  Maybe someone could ask the boys at the convention this weekend how that went. Although that's probably a question for the writers.

I just went back and watched the scene from "We Need to Talk About Kevin" if that is the chili scene you are talking about there is an empty can next to the pot that Sam is stirring. I am assuming he opened a can of chili to eat.  I could be wrong. Pretty much agree with everything else you are saying though.

[Aeryn13]

If the food stuff is truly an acting ad-lib, there are two choices. A) the director does their godamn job and reigns that in and/or b) the writers don`t make "eating scenes" the setting for easy jokes like that anymore or at least to a much smaller degree. However, going by some remarks and other stuff I have seen/heard from the writers, there seems to be a real lack of taste and humor. Occasionally it`s like some weird bastardization of quirky British humor but it falls way short. For years now, they`ve flanderized the eating thing and it left humorous or charming or adorable several planets ago.

Unfortunately, I will not be surprised if that scene is in the episode exactly like in the promo because they had something quite like it in Season 10 when Cas and Charlie were at the dinner table. Yikes. I highly doubt they can refrain themselves from cheap laughs with Mary "mothering" slovenly Dean. How that will suck. Hopefully the character will do something else, something far better to offset the comic relief side.  

That said, I don`t really think there will be a plan. Dean probably goes in alone because he wants to "protect" Mary, is shown to be cocky and incompetent and easily captured. To teach him a lesson Mary will swoop in and save the day in badass glory. Though maybe I should actually give the dreadful duo some benefit of the doubt. Their episodes were actually among the least horrible in Season 11.  

[catrox14]

38 minutes ago, Diane said:

I just went back and watched the scene from "We Need to Talk About Kevin" if that is the chili scene you are talking about there is an empty can next to the pot that Sam is stirring. I am assuming he opened a can of chili to eat.  I could be wrong. Pretty much agree with everything else you are saying though.

Yeah I thought  that was just a can of beans to be use to make the chili like Dean made later in the season. But maybe it was just a can of chili. Thanks for checking.

[Diane]

1 hour ago, DittyDotDot said:

I'm sorry, I've only seen Dean make burgers and John's "cure-all" soup which sounded like it was just whatever one had on-hand thrown into a pot. The chili Sam made in S8 was from a can. I'm not sure when Dean made mac n' cheese, but are you sure it wasn't from a box? That's not home cookin' if you ask me.

There is a Wiki subject for this:

http://www.supernaturalwiki.com/index.php?title=Food#Dean_and_Cooking

[goldy]

This guy works as a compositor at the Supernatural set:

Supernatural Season 12 Episode 4 - Official Description:

http://www.thetvaddict.com/2016/10/14/the-cw-teasers-supernaturals-off-the-grid-case-supergirls-alien-fight-club-and-jane-the-virgins-big-guest-stars/

SUPERNATURAL 12.04 “American Nightmare”: Sam (Jared Padalecki) and Dean (Jensen Ackles) investigate a case that leads them to a devout religious family that lives off the grid. The brothers realize that the parents are hiding a huge secret that could destroy them all. Meanwhile, Dean struggles to accept Mary’s (guest star Samantha Smith) latest decision. Davy Perez wrote the episode directed by John Showalter.

2 hours ago, catrox14 said:

Back on topic. IMO Mary's return was an idea that existed before this episode was written.  Maybe it was all just a happy coincidence but I don't think so. I think Mary's resurrection was an idea in the room before the mid season finale and this episode was written with that goal in mind and secondarily a back door pilot for a possible Wayward Daughters spinoff. 

Why was the episode titled "Don't You Forget About Me"?  IMO, it was two fold. The vampire didn't forget Alex and moreover, the role of a mother.  Jody is the mother to the boys and Alex and Claire.  IMO the dinner scene exists to set up the kitchen scene where Dean says "Well, me and Sam could have used a little bit of that when we were growing up".   It seems innocuous enough but it always stood out to me because Dean has not really been in that mind set about Mary. I thought it was an odd line that kind of dropped out of nowhere but was dismissed as a musing of Dean's to show his support for Jody.

I agree. I noticed that too. There's also that scene where Sam is talking to Claire and she says something like; "You always do what your mother tells you?" and he says; "I actually never knew my mom, she died when I was a baby" and then Claire apologise and Sam reassure her and tell her that being a hunter allowed him to meet his mom even after she died. 

[Partly]

I grew up and live in a rural area surrounded by farmers and construction workers and other people (women as well as men) work with their hands for a living and I got to tell you that Dean and Sam would be more then welcome at my table and in that company any time.   They were so very pleased and complementary over a meal that obviously took time and effort to prepare.  They ate everything they took, didn't complain that something was wrong and didn't completely freak out or become gross when they started talking about sex.  Not only that, but they helped cleanup and do the dishes afterward.

Now, since I grew up in a farm household where dinner conversation wasn't "polite" most times and I still work with men who don't wear suits for a living, I'm not what you would call a sensitive soul. Hell, I'm a woman who can run with the wolves (and have, actually).  I understand that YMMV, but I'll happily serve an entire crew of men who behave the way Dean and Sam did at Jody's house.

[catrox14]

54 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

I'm sorry, I've only seen Dean make burgers and John's "cure-all" soup which sounded like it was just whatever one had on-hand thrown into a pot. The chili Sam made in S8 was from a can. I'm not sure when Dean made mac n' cheese, but are you sure it wasn't from a box? That's not home cookin' if you ask me

 

Dean made scrambled eggs with Lisa.  Dean made an egg white omelette with something green probably kale that  Sam loved and Dean hated in s10.  Thus,  I extrapolate that  Dean makes eggs at the bunker somewhat regularly.  Dean said he made 100 different versions of Mac and Cheese, maybe the base was mac and cheese from a box or some velveeta over macaroni he boiled but he did add stuff to make it them all different. 

Given their weird life to me, Dean taking the time to prepare a hamburger patty, grill it and make it into a tasty cheeseburger served on a fancy bun with onions, tomato is home cooking.  Does take it 3 hours to prepare,  no but he is taking time out to do it.  Same with Sam taking the time to make Dean a grilled cheese sandwich.  To me, home cooking is taking some time out of a busy day to prepare and make a meal of some kind with your own hands.

[catrox14]

1 hour ago, Partly said:

grew up and live in a rural area surrounded by farmers and construction workers and other people (women as well as men) work with their hands for a living and I got to tell you that Dean and Sam would be more then welcome at my table and in that company any time.   They were so very pleased and complementary over a meal that obviously took time and effort to prepare.  They ate everything they took, didn't complain that something was wrong and didn't completely freak out or become gross when they started talking about sex.  Not only that, but they helped cleanup and do the dishes afterward.

The criticisms I've been reading are mostly centered around what some think is either OOC behavior, especially from Sam, that has not particularly been seen from the boys. Or just being tired of Dean being portrayed as a slob when he's not really that at all. 

I've not seen anyone here suggest they aren't welcome at the table nor that the boys were unappreciative of the meal nor that they didn't help with the cleanup nor that they are not good enough to be at Jody's table. There was no implication that Sam and Dean are lesser beings.

Edited October 19, 2016 by catrox14

[DittyDotDot]

1 hour ago, Partly said:

I grew up and live in a rural area surrounded by farmers and construction workers and other people (women as well as men) work with their hands for a living and I got to tell you that Dean and Sam would be more then welcome at my table and in that company any time.   They were so very pleased and complementary over a meal that obviously took time and effort to prepare.  They ate everything they took, didn't complain that something was wrong and didn't completely freak out or become gross when they started talking about sex.  Not only that, but they helped cleanup and do the dishes afterward.

Now, since I grew up in a farm household where dinner conversation wasn't "polite" most times and I still work with men who don't wear suits for a living, I'm not what you would call a sensitive soul. Hell, I'm a woman who can run with the wolves (and have, actually).  I understand that YMMV, but I'll happily serve an entire crew of men who behave the way Dean and Sam did at Jody's house.

Yeah, this is where I'm coming from too. I thought they were very polite dinner guests and if someone sat down at my table and enjoyed the meal I had prepared for them like they did here, I would be thrilled. I didn't see anything wrong with how they acted, nor did it seem out of character to me.

[mertensia]

Eating as Dean did at the table =/= slob.

[Partly]

1 hour ago, catrox14 said:

Or just being tired of Dean being portrayed as a slob when he's not really that at all. 

I completely agree that Dean isn't a slob, however, I have no problem with him occasionally acting like one.  In fact, with how he was raised and the type of life he leads, I'd find it out of character if never acted in ways that "polite company" would find offensive.

[Aeryn13]

I think those scenes are just largely jokes about the character being "dim". It`s pretty much a stereotype about the guy with no brains, class or manners. They might be goodhearted but compared to refined and cultured folk, they are rough, gluttonous and "slow". It`s just completely unfunny to me.

And now with a "mother" figure in the mix, even literally this time, it is a recipe for disaster. I find it superweird enough if grown people get "parented" by older adults, be they their actual parents or not. I understand the cultural difference about "Sir" and "Ma`am"-ing those adults but that doesn`t mean I don`t find it freakish and alien. And stuff like a grown man being regressed enough that food falls out of their mouth or - even worse - hangs out of their mouth at the table just means such weird parenting scenes are coming. I even thought the car ride way back when with Ellen in  No Exit? was weird. This has the potential to be so much worse.

[MysteryGuest]

The scene at Jodi's table would have been fine had it just shown them eating faster than normal, taking additional portions, basically being single-minded about the task of eating, since they were enjoying it so much.  Where it crosses the line for me is the talking with their mouth open, food hanging out of their mouths, etc.  That's what's out of character for me, and that's what takes me out of the scene.  They aren't pigs.

As for whether it's Dean or Jensen who does all of the gross food scenes, it really doesn't matter to me.  If it's written in, they need to stop doing that, and if it's Jensen ad-libbing, they need to stop him from doing it.  It's not funny.  But that's just my opinion.

[Demented Daisy]

This reminds me of last season, when the discussion was Baby's tape collection.  *sigh*

[catrox14]

Criticism of Dean being portrayed with slovenly eating habits (talking with his mouth full, letting food actually hang out of his mouth in s10, barely stopping to breathe when he eats)  has nothing to do with Dean no longer rebelling against polite society.  It's not the argument being made nor implied with said criticism. It's about Dean being almost 38 years old and being regressed for the sake of a gag or scene as the plot dictates.

The food gags in the past were not gross  It was funny in Tall Tales because that was part of an exaggerated story of how Sam saw Dean because of the Trickster, not a true reflection of Dean's eating habits.  It was funny when Dean ate pigs in a blanket dressed as a priest because it showed that maybe Dean back then didn't have food as much as maybe he would have liked and Dean being cheeky. Dean eating little roast beef sandwiches and taquitos on the movie set in Hollywood Babylon funny but again not OTT or gross.

They were silly and well placed like the beerstache and the giant pretzel in Monster Movie because Dean was happy being out of Hell. Even in s8, when Dean got out of Purgatory he cherished his burger but he didn't eat it slovenly. He bit aggressively into a french fry, but again, not gross but funny. Kind of like Sam aggressively eating his chicken in Mystery Spot. Something has changed where now the food gags are bigger and more gross.  Bigger is not always better in this case.  

[MysteryGuest]

I admit that part of my problem with some of these scenes is that I personally find them gross.  I don't like to watch people eat with their mouths open, or have food falling out of their mouths while they're talking.  It's never really been funny to me, it's just disgusting.  But I admit that that's just my personal reaction to it.  Sometimes I totally get the humor in it, and sometimes I think it's over-the-top and not right for that particular scene.  Again, these are all subjective opinions.  

[DittyDotDot]

On 10/14/2016 at 9:41 PM, goldy said:

Supernatural Season 12 Episode 4 - Official Description

http://www.thetvaddict.com/2016/10/14/the-cw-teasers-supernaturals-off-the-grid-case-supergirls-alien-fight-club-and-jane-the-virgins-big-guest-stars/

SUPERNATURAL 12.04 “American Nightmare”: Sam (Jared Padalecki) and Dean (Jensen Ackles) investigate a case that leads them to a devout religious family that lives off the grid. The brothers realize that the parents are hiding a huge secret that could destroy them all. Meanwhile, Dean struggles to accept Mary’s (guest star Samantha Smith) latest decision. Davy Perez wrote the episode directed by John Showalter.

I expect them to return to the regular format of the show--Sam and Dean hunting things--and realize Mary will probably only be in a handful of episodes, but yesterday it hit me we haven't had any spoilers with Mary in them after Jodi's episode, right? And that's episode 6 or 7? So, what do you guys think might be Mary's "decision" in episode 4? This episode follows on the heels of what looks to be a creepy ghost baby episode. Maybe she decides to go track down some of her old contacts and learn what happened to them? It also could be how they meet back up with her in the hunter's wake episode? Is she in the Hitler episode?

[SueB]

Sam Smith is filming now (twitter comment about missing Kim).  I think she's definitely a presence until EP 9.  The REAL key will be if she is in episodes AFTER the mid-season finale and mid-season opener.  I suspect her story may be downshifted or wrapped after that. 

[DittyDotDot]

1 minute ago, SueB said:

Sam Smith is filming now (twitter comment about missing Kim).  I think she's definitely a presence until EP 9.  The REAL key will be if she is in episodes AFTER the mid-season finale and mid-season opener.  I suspect her story may be downshifted or wrapped after that. 

Oh, I know she has a presence, probably throughout the season, but I expect it to be like they do with Cass and Crowley or what they used to do with Bobby and Kevin. They were around-ish, but off-screen living their lives while Sam and Dean hunt randoms.

I'm guessing, at first, she's going to try and step up and do the job with them just to be with them, but I'm wondering if it will just be too much for her after The Foundry, so she finds some excuse to excuse herself and that's why Dean is grappling to understand her in episode 4? We know she's in the hunter's wake episode, but I seem to remember she wasn't in the Hitler episode. Then she's back for the Jodi episode. It didn't seem like she's in the rock concert episode, but I wouldn't expect her to have a heavy presence in the Lucifer storyline. 

Anyway, I'm actually expecting her to stay with Jodi for an episode or two. It could be Jodi offers her a place to stay and get her bearings so Sam and Dean can focus on the job instead of Mary for a bit? 

[Demented Daisy]

Can't Mary get Rowena to turn over a new leaf so they can hunt monsters together?  I'm sure a hunter could use a powerful witch at her side.  Add Jodi to the mix and they'd have a hell of a team.

No?  Too much fun, you say?  Yeah, I thought so, too.  *sigh*

(ETA That sounds like the beginning of a joke.  A cop, a hunter, and a witch walk into a bar....)

Edited October 20, 2016 by Demented Daisy

[DittyDotDot]

2 minutes ago, Demented Daisy said:

Can't Mary get Rowena to turn over a new leaf so they can hunt monsters together?  I'm sure a hunter could use a powerful witch at her side.  Add Jodi to the mix and they'd have a hell of a team.

No?  Too much fun, you say?  Yeah, I thought so, too.  *sigh*

(ETA That sound like the beginning of a joke.  A cop, a hunter, and a witch walk into a bar....)

Hee! I think Mary and Rowena together would be just hilarious. Rowena can blather on about how she was a career woman all these years, Mary can talk about what it feels like to be a revenant...you're right, they need Jodi to roll her eyes at them and tell them to suck it up! ;)

[goldy]

1 hour ago, DittyDotDot said:

I expect them to return to the regular format of the show--Sam and Dean hunting things--and realize Mary will probably only be in a handful of episodes, but yesterday it hit me we haven't had any spoilers with Mary in them after Jodi's episode, right? And that's episode 6 or 7? So, what do you guys think might be Mary's "decision" in episode 4? This episode follows on the heels of what looks to be a creepy ghost baby episode. Maybe she decides to go track down some of her old contacts and learn what happened to them? It also could be how they meet back up with her in the hunter's wake episode? Is she in the Hitler episode?

We don't have spoilers for episode 7, 8 and 9 but, from the candid pics we saw from the set while they were filming episode 7 some of us have speculated that episode 7 is the "LA episode" that was mentioned in one of the sneak peak interviews. 

As for episode 8 and 9; I don't know for sure but since I read somewhere that the Lucifer storyline will be the one they'll be focus on in the first half of the season (and later the focus will move to the MoL storyline) my speculation is that those episodes will be the ones where Sam and Dean will be busy chasing after Lucifer and maybe be able to lock him up in the cage again and put an end to the Lucifer storyline for good.

Mary's decision - since I've been following Samantha Smith's twitter, I know that she was in LA when they were shooting episode 4 and possibly also episode 5, so I'm guessing she's not in those episodes and so my guess is that Mary's decision is to stop hunting -- and since she's in later episodes I'm also guessing that she will change her mind later on in the season.

[companionenvy]

Since this is Supernatural, it could always be "I need to leave because you'll be safer without me because of (insert reason here)."

[Partly]

1 hour ago, DittyDotDot said:

I'm guessing, at first, she's going to try and step up and do the job with them just to be with them, but I'm wondering if it will just be too much for her after The Foundry

I'm thinking that it's already too much for her.  She finds out that she's been dead for 33 years and that tons of crap has happened to her family in that time, and even before she can adjust to that she finds out Sam has been taken. Then she's forced to kill someone -- not a supernatural creature, but an actual PERSON.  She's holding it together remarkably well, but that's gonna change once she has a moment of down time. 

My thought is that she will want to stay hunting with them because -- whether she wants that life or not -- its the only familiar thing she has in this crazy future world.  But even hunting is going to be so very different than she new before. She's going to have to step away just to find a way to ground herself with everything that's happened. I'm not sure she can do that while being around Dean and Sam, especially since she would be constantly learning bits and pieces of what's happened to them.  It would end up pulling the characters backwards instead of them moving forward. 

[goldy]

[catrox14]

I'm trying to figure out what decision Mary is making that Dean would not be happy about.

Whether she wants to hunt or not, I think he will support either decision she makes. If she wants to move away, I can see him being worried about her safety since Lady KillHerNowKThxBai  will have seen her and knows she's alive. And if she knows all about the boys like she claims then she should recognize Mary right away.   But those seem like pretty obvious reasons for Dean to be upset, which they may go with but maybe will be surprised with something different.  

I've been thinking that  Lady WhyAreYouStillHere!!? somehow convinces Mary to join the Men of Letters, which IMO Dean would be against since they are pretty well not to be trusted. 

I'm still putting some money on Mary moving to Sioux Falls with Jody and starting the Wayward Daughters Academy. 

[catrox14]

[rue721]

Sorry, this is going back mostly to yesterday, but I didn't get a chance to look at the thread until now!

On 10/19/2016 at 0:27 PM, catrox14 said:

Also,  Dean and Sam were raised by John, an ex Marine.  If they were made to address him with "Yes, Sir/No,Sir"  I'm thinking table manners were also part of their upbringing as much as it could be on the road.

Or maybe he just made them eat really fast! ;)

That said, I WOULD be shoving food in as fast as possible if I were living with Sam. Sorry, but that giant had to have been eating like Gaston when he was growing up! Can you imagine someone that tall and skinny as a teenage boy?!

On 10/19/2016 at 1:29 PM, catrox14 said:

I understand the sentiment they were attempting to show here. That Sam and Dean never got that family dinner so I guess they just didn't know how to behave or became overly excited 12 year old boys out of the blue.

I don't think that that was the sentiment of that dinner scene at Jodi's. I think the point was how girly/feminine Jodi, Alex, and Claire's household is, and to contrast it with how boyish/masculine Sam and Dean are. The girls are sitting there picking at their food, having meaningful conversations about boys and birth control, etc, and meanwhile, the guys are busy just chowing down. I don't think that Sam and Dean's behavior was meant to be gross. (And imo in that scene I don't think it was gross).

23 hours ago, Partly said:

I grew up and live in a rural area surrounded by farmers and construction workers and other people (women as well as men) work with their hands for a living and I got to tell you that Dean and Sam would be more then welcome at my table and in that company any time.   They were so very pleased and complementary over a meal that obviously took time and effort to prepare.  They ate everything they took, didn't complain that something was wrong and didn't completely freak out or become gross when they started talking about sex.  Not only that, but they helped cleanup and do the dishes afterward.

Now, since I grew up in a farm household where dinner conversation wasn't "polite" most times and I still work with men who don't wear suits for a living, I'm not what you would call a sensitive soul. Hell, I'm a woman who can run with the wolves (and have, actually).  I understand that YMMV, but I'll happily serve an entire crew of men who behave the way Dean and Sam did at Jody's house.

Yeah, I love it when people enjoy their food, and when they can really put it away! Well, I love it at mealtime. Not so much when grocery shopping ;)

I think Jodi seemed to like how Sam and Dean put it away and were appreciative, too. She roasted a whole second chicken for them! They walked in the door, and she said, "I'll put a second chicken on." I was like, DAMN JODI that's awesome.

I didn't read it as motherly, at least not toward Sam and Dean. Just that she REALLY has her shit together.

19 hours ago, Demented Daisy said:

This reminds me of last season, when the discussion was Baby's tape collection.  *sigh*

I liked that discussion ;) Well, if it's the one I'm thinking of. When we were debating what specific tapes would be in the collection?

So anyway, I do think that there are times when Jensen WAY overdoes the "gross eating" thing...not that I have some philosophical problem with it, I just think it's disgusting and not funny. I don't think that the scene at Jodi's was really an example of that, though. Sam and Dean were enthusiastic and I guess kind of acted like roughnecks, but their behavior wasn't especially weird or even ~unseemly~ in that particular episode imo. YMMV.

Someone on this board said once that Jensen sometimes plays Dean cruder than he is, iIrc, and that really stuck with me because imo it's true. It's not often, but imo the "gross eating" is one aspect (the main aspect, tbh) of that.

[goldy]

[DittyDotDot]

Romance? Interesting choice of word for this show, but I'm always down for some delightful alliteration!. ;)

[goldy]

I'm guessing Lucifer is gonna do the romance in this episode:

[catrox14]

Romance? Really? The one thing all TPTB say the show is not about. What?

But I guess one person's seduction-for-possession is another person's romance.  Whatever. LOL

Unless Lady YouReallyNeedSomePracticalShoesIfYoureGonnaTortureSomeone has given poor Sam a "love"  potion in that drug cocktail.

[DittyDotDot]

33 minutes ago, goldy said:

I'm guessing Lucifer is gonna do the romance in this episode:

Sorry, I was just making a word-o joke.  I really, really do dig alliteration! ;)

[Binns]

INAPPROPRIATE THOUGHTS

 

[Partly]

4 hours ago, rue721 said:

Someone on this board said once that Jensen sometimes plays Dean cruder than he is

I don't understand the reasoning behind this.  Could someone explain?

[Binns]

3 minutes ago, Partly said:

I don't understand the reasoning behind this.  Could someone explain?

I know I've heard that he sort of plays comedy stuff more broadly...the only example I can think of is the episode with the banshee where he pockets the viagra. That wasn't scripted. 

Edited October 20, 2016 by Binns
Husband?

[SueB]

Seriously bummed about no tattoo.  That needs explaining.

[Partly]

1 minute ago, Binns said:

I know I've heard that he sort of plays comedy stuff more broadly...the only example I can think of is the episode with the banshee where he pockets the viagra. That wasn't scripted. 

So, is the belief that Jensen plays Dean cruder than the writer's write Dean?  Would that mean that the writers are the arbiters of what Dean is like?

[catrox14]

Oh good, more gratuitous Sam torture.  JFC, show.  It's really kind of fucked up they keep doing this.  I mean is there a segment of viewers and/or writers who get off on damseled, tortured Sam. I mean it's EVERY fucking season in some way shape or form.  And then it veers from damseled, tortured Sam to super!Sam who walks 2 miles after being shot in the gut, nearly dying and being attacked by werewolves.  Honestly, it's pretty close to turning Sam into a cartoon. I don't like it.

2 minutes ago, SueB said:

Seriously bummed about no tattoo.  That needs explaining.

He hasn't had the tattoo since it was burned off to let Gadreel.

[rue721]

32 minutes ago, Partly said:

So, is the belief that Jensen plays Dean cruder than the writer's write Dean?  Would that mean that the writers are the arbiters of what Dean is like?

I wasn't the person who originally wrote it, so I can't say what they meant.

But why it resonated for me is because sometimes Dean will seem OOC because of Jensen's performance rather than b/c of the writering -- not a whole lot, but it does/has happened before -- and imo when that's an issue, it's usually because Jensen is going a little too broad with the humor, is playing Dean as a little too crude.

I figure we each judge for ourselves whether a character seems OOC (to us) in a certain scene or not. There's no final arbiter imo.

[MysteryGuest]

Yeah, I'm pretty much over tortured Sam, too.  Moving on...  

I wonder if Mary's "decision" will be that she wants to leave hunting.  She told Dean again last week that she absolutely wanted to get a way from hunting.  Not just because she didn't want her sons raised that way, but because she didn't like it.  Maybe she decides she still can't do it.  She could have occasional guest appearances, but that's all.  They wouldn't have to kill her off then, which I really don't want them to do.

[AwesomO4000]

40 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

He hasn't had the tattoo since it was burned off to let Gadreel.

The question for me is why hasn't he had it replaced? There are still demons around that could possess him. Or maybe he has had it replaced, but it's somewhere we - and maybe demons - can't easily see. Or if I remember correctly, there are now tattoos that are made of "invisible" ink - it can only be seen under black light or something. That would actually be a good choice, because it couldn't be seen easily to get burned off by someone.

[catrox14]

3 minutes ago, AwesomO4000 said:

The question for me is why hasn't he had it replaced? There are still demons around that could possess him. Or maybe he has had it replaced, but it's somewhere we - and maybe demons - can't easily see. Or if I remember correctly, there are now tattoos that are made of "invisible" ink - it can only be seen under black light or something. That would actually be a good choice, because it couldn't be seen easily to get burned off by someone.

Yeah, that's a good question. It's so stupid. My head!canon is they needed to not add it back because Sam carries around his exorcism recording on his phone so he can just whip it out when he wants to avoid possession. 

See also: Plotonium for when Sam needs to be possessed by Lucifer or something.  I got nuthin

[Diane]

1 hour ago, SueB said:

Seriously bummed about no tattoo.  That needs explaining.

Shouldn't there be at least a scar

[DittyDotDot]

1 hour ago, SueB said:

Seriously bummed about no tattoo.  That needs explaining.

He has a shirt on in the scene, so I figure you can't see enough on-screen to need the tattoo, but will need to be able to see some "wounds" through the holes in the shirt. I guess we'll see.

44 minutes ago, AwesomO4000 said:

The question for me is why hasn't he had it replaced? 

I'm sure he did replace the tattoo, but we've just not had an opportunity to see that he has before now.

[Binns]

50 minutes ago, Diane said:

Shouldn't there be at least a scar

Cas burned it off and left his skin pretty pristine. No scar that i remember. 

[SueB]

2 hours ago, Partly said:

So, is the belief that Jensen plays Dean cruder than the writer's write Dean?  Would that mean that the writers are the arbiters of what Dean is like?

So I was the one that made the initial comment.  I'm not sure I'm tracking your second sentence.  But yes, Jensen has mentioned several times that he's ad-libbed the gross eating thing in a couple of episodes.  Perhaps at ATLCON this weekend we'll get more confirmation.  And as to the writers versus Jensen, if Jensen had an issue with some Dean characterization, he'd call the writers and frankly, they'd listen.  Not a one of them have been on the show longer than Jensen.  He doesn't always love every aspect of the plot (based again on convention comments) but he's very protective of the character.  And for whatever reason, he likes the gross eating comedy from what I can tell.

[MysteryGuest]

11 minutes ago, SueB said:

And for whatever reason, he likes the gross eating comedy from what I can tell.

I love Jensen, but if these scenes are ad-libs of his, then someone needs to take him aside and tell him to tone it down.  It's not funny.  

[Binns]

Has this Mr. Ketch or whatever been announced (the actor)?