Spoilers and Spoiler Discussion

[RedVitC]

7 hours ago, Trini said:

I think they are since Wally went to visit her at least once (offscreen).
 

Right! I completely forgot about that. Thanks.

22 hours ago, ruby24 said:

Oooh, I like that idea! But how does it affect people to erase a city from their minds? Do they all just think they live in another city or do they lose memories of the people there too? 

I like the idea of Barry and Iris coming back from their honeymoon to a place that doesn't remember them and they have to fix it. That'd be awesome.

If I have it correctly

Spoiler

people outside the city forgot about the existence of the people in the city too. The people in the city were in a sort of stasis/timelessness

It could be a fun plot that's a little different than usual as well as show what the Thinker can do. They could have the rest of the team working from the inside, while Barry and Iris work from the outside of the City.

 

How do you guys think they'll introduce The Thinker? After all the comments they get about the villain always being their friend or someone they know first they might want to try something different, but what could that be? Introducing him as a villain from the start it would be very hard to sustain for a full season.

[Trini]

22 hours ago, RedVitC said:

How do you guys think they'll introduce The Thinker? After all the comments they get about the villain always being their friend or someone they know first they might want to try something different, but what could that be? Introducing him as a villain from the start it would be very hard to sustain for a full season.

This is the first time they've actually announced the casting of the villain before the season starts, so they might actually introduce him as the villain at the start. But I can see them not having the team know his identity until later. Mid-season?

[Trini]

'Dragon Con 2017: Danielle Panabaker drops 5 hints on THE FLASH Season 4'

I think the only new thing is this tidbit:

Quote

... But Caitlin is not a part of Team Flash at the top of the season.”

... which seems to contradict what we saw of Caitlin in the Comic Con teaser. Hmmmmmmm.....

[Trini]

From EW: http://ew.com/tv/2017/09/07/flash-barry-iris-couples-therapy/

Quote

“Barry and Iris keep comically clashing inadvertently because she’s used to being in charge, and he’s used to being in charge, and so they wind up going to couples therapy to work through it,” executive producer Andrew Kreisberg tells EW. “The two of them with the therapist is some of the funniest stuff we have ever done on this show, but it also leads to a deepening of their relationship.”

Their journey to couples counseling is actually suggested by Caitlin (Danielle Panabaker), whose relationship with Iris will strengthen this season. “Caitlin has been through so much herself in relationships, and if anyone can offer advice, it would be her,” Patton says. “She’s there quite often to give Iris advice on her relationship with Barry and how to move forward. It’s actually more her idea that they go to counseling and get help.”

I'm actually looking forward to them butting heads for a bit!

Edited September 8, 2017 by Trini

[Trini]

EW Spoiler Room:

Quote

Will Barry and Iris definitely get married this season on The Flash? — Micah

Good news: Yes. Bad news: “They are finally going to get married this season and then it’s going to be: Can they stay married with everything that’s coming up against them?” EP Andrew Kreisberg teases.

 

And a crossover spoiler:

Quote

When I pressed EP Andrew Kreisberg on whether more of the Supergirl characters would get to take part in the upcoming four-way crossover event, he dropped quite a tease. “Kara and Alex are at the center of it through all four hours,” Kreisberg says. “One of the things we’ve been doing a lot this season is getting back to season 1 and really making it Danvers sisters-centric, so a lot of what’s going on this season is Kara and Alex doing things in tandem, and the crossover won’t be any different.”

[ruby24]

Not sure about that Supergirl crossover spoiler. I still think the wedding is the crossover, so it's hard to imagine Kara and Alex really being at the center of ALL four hours. I think the second part of his statement is more believable, that they're doing things in tandem, so that probably means Alex is crossing over with Kara.

Although Alex has never even met Barry.

[Trini]

I don't think he meant that they're the center of everything, just that Kara and Alex will be more involved this time. I really hope so; I'd love to see Kara and Iris have some scenes together, and Alex meeting the rest of the characters from the multiverse!

 

4 hours ago, ruby24 said:

Although Alex has never even met Barry.

Yeah, she missed out on all three (3!!) crossovers before; she's not letting Kara travel to another dimension without her this time!

Edited September 8, 2017 by Trini

[Trini]

From TV Line:

Quote

“There’s a lot of love in the air this season,” previews executive producer Todd Helbing, likening Barry and Iris’ eventual reunion to “somebody going off to war for six months and coming back. There’s a lot that Iris experienced that Barry didn’t when he was gone, and it’s really [about] the fun and the emotional component of making up that time when they weren’t together.” In the cross-Earth romance department, Wally and Jesse’s relationship goes through an “evolution,” while Cisco and Gypsy are “still together, and they’re going to be for a while” (even though Jessica Camacho is now a series regular on NBC’s Taken). And despite the Scarlet Speedster facing another worthy foe in The Thinker (The 100‘s Neil Sandilands) in addition to all that he’s been through recently, Helbing promises a less angst-ridden Barry, whose time in the Speed Force “let him deal with all of the baggage” from three seasons. “When he comes out, he’s sort of left that all behind,” the EP says.

BONUS SPOILER!: Killer Frost-plagued Caitlin “has done some soul searching and figured out exactly how to deal with her demons,” Helbing teases.

I glad to hear there be more Barry/Iris moments, and them working through their issues. Little concerned about that Wally/Jesse note, especially with Keiynan absent for a few episodes. (Will Jesse even get a cameo this year? I don't think I've heard anything about Violett Beane filming.) And still keeping my expectations really low about Caitlin/Killer Frost.

Edited September 11, 2017 by Trini

[Trini]

Now that I have more time to respond to this:

Quote

“They are finally going to get married this season and then it’s going to be: Can they stay married with everything that’s coming up against them?” EP Andrew Kreisberg teases.

Ughhhhh! WHY would you even put that out there Kreisberg! You CANNOT promote a marriage AND a break-up at the same time!

 Not that I expect that they would actually break them up* after marrying them, but that really doesn't need to be out there before the season starts.

On the other hand, this seems to indicate that Barry and Iris are getting married sooner rather than later. I wasn't pinning my hopes on a wedding during the crossover, but now it seems much more concrete. So we might be seeing them as a married couple for most of the season.

*(maybe another separation, amnesia, mindwipe, but NOT a divorce)

[ruby24]

I think he's probably just trolling there, tbh. No way they get divorced, lol.

[Trini]

I mean, it's TV, so there'll always be some type of drama, but way to word that in the worst way!

Anyway, I wonder why we haven't heard a little more about some of the villains this year? Maybe they are not really going to play that big a role until mid-season?

Also quoting myself because...

On 9/5/2017 at 8:05 PM, Trini said:

On 9/4/2017 at 9:15 PM, RedVitC said:

How do you guys think they'll introduce The Thinker? After all the comments they get about the villain always being their friend or someone they know first they might want to try something different, but what could that be? Introducing him as a villain from the start it would be very hard to sustain for a full season.

This is the first time they've actually announced the casting of the villain before the season starts, so they might actually introduce him as the villain at the start. But I can see them not having the team know his identity until later. Mid-season?

... I remembered that Savitar already mentioned a "DeVoe" to Barry/Iris in the finale; so if the show doesn't completely retcon that, they might know sooner rather than later.

[Trini]

From TVLine:

Quote

Any idea on how Julian’s absence will be addressed on The Flash? —Jen

When the CW hit returns on Tuesday, Oct. 10, “You’ll see pretty quickly — there’s a reason why he’s no longer with the team,” showrunner Todd Helbing tells TVLine. As for whether Tom Felton will put in an encore, “There’s always the chance that we can see anybody on this show return. We’ve had a lot of characters come and go for various reasons, and I don’t think this will be any different.”

So at least they'll give a reason for him to be away.

----------------

And Season 4 info from the Helbing/Kreisberg video interview: (I omitted filler words)

• "The circumstances of [Barry's] return, and what he's like when he comes back from this experience is part of the fun and the surprise of the season premiere."
• "We really wanted to pivot and lean into fun and light and brightness.  ... for us, it's a little bit like a restart. ... Diving into more comedy, more fun, and more brightness and more excitement."
• "Gypsy will definitely be back in episode 4.02. ... Episode 4.04 is probably one of my favorite ideas we've ever come up with that involves Cisco and Gypsy. I think the fans are gonna die."
• "[The Flash] is up against a villain this season that he can't outrun, it's somebody that he has to outthink. And it's going to take him, and Cisco, and Caitlin, and a few other surprise people to be able to get one step ahead of The Thinker."

[Trini]

From TVGuide according to tvecho:

10 hours ago, tv echo said:

I just got my new TV Guide Magazine (Double Issue, Sept. 18-Oct. 1, 2017) in the mail. This is their "Returning Favorites" issue, where they run through the old shows returning this fall on each day of the week.  I've posted the Arrow blurb on page 6 of the New Spoilers thread, but here's what was said about the other Arrowverse shows...

The Flash - AK: "[Caitlin is] continuing to struggle with the cold monster lurking inside of her... But she will definitely come back into the fold in the premiere episode." Regarding Ralph Dibney, a/k/a the Elongated Man (Harley Sawyer), AK: "There's going to be a lot of conflict between [him and Barry] in terms of how to be a good guy... Ralph is hitting on everybody all the time. He's brash and loud and doesn't listen." He's also hiding something about how he acquired his powers of malleability. AK: "That's one of the big mysteries of the season." Regarding the Thinker (Neil Sandlands), he is "an intelligence threat" who actually isn't out to foil the Flash. AK: "He has a need for him, I would say is more accurate."

[Trini]

I kinda of feel like I've reached the 'too many spoilers' point with the new promo. ... I'm surprised that it looks like Barry is back fairly early in the premiere. Of course, they won't have the lead character be absent for long, but everyone knows he'd be coming back somehow, so I think they could have waited until the very end of the premiere. Seeing the team without Barry for a while is something they could explore, and then they could go into more about Barry's re-adjustment to coming back to Earth.

[RedVitC]

On 9/8/2017 at 6:11 AM, Trini said:

... I remembered that Savitar already mentioned a "DeVoe" to Barry/Iris in the finale; so if the show doesn't completely retcon that, they might know sooner rather than later.

And Savitar also mentioned the way they stop him (the neural inhibitor). I wonder if that will come up. I suppose Savitar never said that was the way they actually defeated him so there's some room for the writers, but it would be strange if it was never brought up.

 

Well, well, well, so much to unpack, not sure where to begin. I won't be able to go into it all at the moment anyway, so I'll just make a quick comment. Excited to see Barry and Iris' wedding and marriage (BARRY AND IRIS ARE GETTING MARRIED!!!). It had become pretty clear with all the bts stuff and comments, but it's confirmed now. I'm a little peeved Andrew felt the need to add that extra comment. Not just the comment, but also the timing. The lead up to the wedding should be filled with fun and comments about the couple etc, not will they be able to stay married comments. Never mind that it doesn't ring true especially after season 3. But I guess he's trying to build in suspense or something, but the first episode of the season hasn't even aired and they don't get married for a while in the season so why start giving spoilers for the second half of the season? Unless it's more of a general comment on the storytelling/writing switch from the challenges of a couple getting together/married to the challenges of a married couple staying together.  

[Trini]

From a set visit from Argentine(?) media, a closer look at the new suit:

I

[Trini]

I'm excited about the wedding too, but I just feel like there's going to be some sort of twist; and not just because of the crossover. Out of all the CW/DC weddings so far, only Diggle and Lyla's turned out kinda normal. Caitlin got married then Ronnie died the same day; Oliver and Felicity had a fake wedding; Oliver married the daughter of an enemy; and Mon-El and Lena Luthor were forced to marry.

I think Barry and Iris will get married for real, but I can see them throwing in some complication - I don't know what. There are several ideas from the comics.

[ruby24]

6 minutes ago, Trini said:

I'm excited about the wedding too, but I just feel like there's going to be some sort of twist; and not just because of the crossover. Out of all the CW/DC weddings so far, only Diggle and Lyla's turned out kinda normal. Caitlin got married then Ronnie died the same day; Oliver and Felicity had a fake wedding; Oliver married the daughter of an enemy; and Mon-El and Lena Luthor were forced to marry.

I think Barry and Iris will get married for real, but I can see them throwing in some complication - I don't know what. There are several ideas from the comics.

Of course what they have on their side is the history of Barry and Iris actually being married in the comics, which none of those other couples have. This is what they're supposed to be, so that's good.

Imo, they have a lot they can do after marriage, especially regarding bringing in their kids from the future. Tornado Twins, Bart Allen. They can do some kind of Back to the Future-esque storyline. Or maybe a  better comparison would be what happened with Connor on Angel (if anyone watched that show), where he shows up as an adult. I can see that happening with Bart- they bring him on from the future to help  his parents and the gang stop some catastrophic event.

That'd be pretty cool, actually. Maybe he gets trapped in their time for a while or something. And it works because he can be a recurring character. He can show up and then go back, and it doesn't prevent them from having an actual baby at some point on the show as well (or babies, if they want to do the twins). Curious to know if they will make Bart their son but still include the twins in there too- like maybe Barry and Iris have three kids in this universe eventually.

Edited September 15, 2017 by ruby24

[Karlophe]

13 hours ago, ruby24 said:

Curious to know if they will make Bart their son but still include the twins in there too- like maybe Barry and Iris have three kids in this universe eventually.

Regarding Bart, this has been coming up quite a bit lately, and I'm a bit at a loss as to where exactly it's coming from. My guess is innocent musing elsewhere that somehow mutated into a prospective future plot point and gravitated to wider fandom, but I've seen no indication, none at all, that they plan to do this or even know anyone is expecting it. I think the back to the future situation you mentioned is more likely, and in a world where time jumping it is in fact one of the cornerstones of the Flash mythos and a major, major part of Barts story specifically, why should they change it?  What would that accomplish, besides crippling all related storylines?* Where is the appropriate thread to discuss this, I have thoughts? 

(*to be clear, this isn't at all an attack on you, Ruby - I'd just like a better idea of the where's  and why's if you can help since I have no idea where this theory originated from, so I can better explain why changing Barts origins is a hard no for me.)

[Karlophe]

Super Season trailer! AKA "Flash Pass":

[Trini]

15 hours ago, Karlophe said:

Regarding Bart, this has been coming up quite a bit lately, and I'm a bit at a loss as to where exactly it's coming from. My guess is innocent musing elsewhere that somehow mutated into a prospective future plot point and gravitated to wider fandom, but I've seen no indication, none at all, that they plan to do this or even know anyone is expecting it. I think the back to the future situation you mentioned is more likely, and in a world where time jumping it is in fact one of the cornerstones of the Flash mythos and a major, major part of Barts story specifically, why should they change it?  What would that accomplish, besides crippling all related storylines?* Where is the appropriate thread to discuss this, I have thoughts? 

Probably the 'Spec. w/o Spoilers' thread. In any case, I think it's just speculation that has caught on; they haven't alluded to Bart being a son instead of a grandson in the show at all. But it seems a possibility since they've played around with the details of the Flash family in the show already. (Barry dating Linda Park, and Wally being Iris' brother instead of nephew, for instance.)

------

Grant talks about the new suit in a new interview:

 

Besides that, I'm wondering what this set is -- is it specifically for Flash, or what?

[Trini]

There's info on social media from the convention panel with Candice and Carlos this weekend; The Flash Podcast did livetweeting. Season 4 info: Iris and Cisco butt heads about Barry in the premiere; Candice will also appear on the other shows in the crossover (Yay!!); no journalist Iris though Candice has asked for it. ?

[Trini]

Aaahh - I just realized I gotta look up what are Danny Trejo's most famous movies, because you know they're going to make a reference, if not several.

[Trini]

Speaking of Trejo, his episode (4.04) falls on halloween - would they reference that kind of like what they did when Valentine's day was on a Tuesday? I'm wondering if they'd work it into the plot, or just have some background extras trick-or-treating?

[ruby24]

They ought to. They haven't done that before. I wonder why Christmas is the only holiday they reference? They could easily do Halloween and Thanksgiving.

[Trini]

From EW magazine:

4 hours ago, JJ928 said:

Since my mother is visiting me and subscribes to EW, here the Flash preview blurb.

Nothing new, really.

[Karlophe]

On 9/16/2017 at 10:51 PM, Trini said:

----*snip*----

But it seems a possibility since they've played around with the details of the Flash family in the show already. (Barry dating Linda Park, and Wally being Iris' brother instead of nephew, for instance.)

--- *snip*----  

Besides that, I'm wondering what this set is -- is it specifically for Flash, or what?

Thanks, Trini - that does make sense. I think for me it's that bending the origins of Wally and Linda (and Eobard with Eddie especially, though I didn't see that as 'bending' so much as 'illuminating newly important history') are okay with me because they allow them to tell this story, this interpretation, in a fresh and unpredictable way, without erasing who they are, or even necessarily all they bring - it leaves the door open to tell those stories or bend them to this one. With Bart, bending his origins in this particular way not only erases where he comes from (important!) but who he comes from, the past/future/past between the families/the family, and every single storyline that comes along with it. Could there be ways to bend them around a new status quo, it's possible...but yes. A conversation for the comics or speculation threads.

I'm pretty sure the print on the wall says "I.D must be visible at all times" - county lockup or mental health hospital? If Barry's found wandering a road naked and mentally unresponsive I'd believe the truck drivers would be kind enough to pick him up or stay with him and call for help. Central City just seems like that sort of place.

 

On 9/17/2017 at 2:28 PM, Trini said:

There's info on social media from the convention panel with Candice and Carlos this weekend; The Flash Podcast did livetweeting. Season 4 info: Iris and Cisco butt heads about Barry in the premiere; Candice will also appear on the other shows in the crossover (Yay!!); no journalist Iris though Candice has asked for it. ?

Argh. They have made such a point of stressing that Iris and Barry's butting heads is going to be a humorous affair that will resolve their issues and strengthen their relationship that, fandom wise, this is what I'm more worried about. The soon-to-be wife and best friend butting heads where the groom is concerned is a time honored, often funny, character revealing tradition that eventually brings all parties closer. In-universe, it's going to show us exactly how they're deflecting and coping with Barry's loss and solidify the team dynamic going forward. Outside? It's going to be yet another outlet to funnel character hatred through and fuel complaints for months.

The issue itself will likely be met, worked through, and resolved with hugs and stronger bonds and new clarity in two odd hours of t.v. time, but seventeen episodes later it's still going to be, "remember when Iris had the nerve to question Cisco about something she knows nothing about in a space she has no place in?" When the issue - I assume about how or whether to (try) to get Barry back - will have never really been about her way over his, but about deflecting her pain where the entire situation is concerned. Cisco, once that becomes clear, will understand this. The viewership...won't always show her the same consideration.

Which is fine, honestly. Everyone has their opinions, and simply finding her uninteresting or resenting her existence doesn't make them wrong, even if I don't agree. Granted some people wish she would fall off a cliff, but by all means, to each their own.  No one is being forced to like or even tolerate her, but keeping in mind that this is all speculation it is still tiring sometimes knowing that no matter how well explained or even justified her actions or reactions are, the hatred directed at her will just keep getting tossed around, and we will just keep getting hit with it.

But onto happier subjects...I saw that video! I thought she was just referring to the girls night, but if it means outside of that then I'm all for it. I'd love for her to meet the other casts. Just toss them all into a snow globe and shake it and see what happens. When it comes to crossover newbies, I don't care who meets who as long as it's someone they've never met before. So excited. Less excited about the rest, but not feeling hopeless just yet.

Grant and the E.P's have all said the season is planned out from start to finish. We already have alot of information about the first part, and it's going to be absolutely packed with great stuff - and we haven't even started filming the crossover yet. But we know nothing about what the storyline is or where the characters are going after Christmas break. No plans regarding that as of yet doesn't mean no plans at all. I'm willing to wait to see what they are. And if all else fails, it's early enough days that they can still incorporate that into the existing plans for her in the back half.

And yes to Breacher's introduction being in the Halloween episode! That is perfect. And unless I'm mistaken, isn't that also where they're going to introduce Elongated Man's powers? I think we're meeting him as Dibney beforehand,  but the actor was in that episodes set photos with Danny Trejo so maybe that's when we see him in his alter ego? Bonus points if someone references or carries a machete. 

[Trini]

No episode description yet, but season premiere photos are out!
http://www.superherohype.com/news/404655-the-flash-season-4-premiere-photos-released

Caitlin's been working at a bar? And sad WestAllen:

And a new trailer!

[Trini]

2 hours ago, Karlophe said:

Grant and the E.P's have all said the season is planned out from start to finish. ....

I really hope so; the back halves of the last two seasons were uneven at best. I'm not worried about not hearing about after Christmas break yet; we still need to get to the premiere and through this crossover!

Quote

And yes to Breacher's introduction being in the Halloween episode! That is perfect. And unless I'm mistaken, isn't that also where they're going to introduce Elongated Man's powers? I think we're meeting him as Dibney beforehand,  but the actor was in that episodes set photos with Danny Trejo so maybe that's when we see him in his alter ego? Bonus points if someone references or carries a machete. 

I haven't heard too much about Dibney, as in, which episodes he's in. But that makes sense.

---------

Re: new trailer;
I like that they're focusing on the everyone else besides Barry for a change. And even though we know he's coming back, there's still still a bit of mystery (how? why?). But I really do wonder what they told everyone about Barry Allen's absence - and whether that lines up with how he returns.

... And I'm guessing I'll have to add "apple truck driver" to The List of who knows the Flash's secret identity.

[Trini]

Bridal shower confirmed!!

Looks like they are doing reshoots(?) for 4.05.

[Trini]

Crossover directors:

I think Dermott Downs (far right) will be doing the Flash episode.

[Karlophe]

New episode titles released:

http://www.spoilertv.com/search?&max-results=50

4.06: When Harry Met Harry

4.07: Therefore I am

Is Harry meeting new Harry and commiserating with him about the previous incarnations demise over coffee? How very meta. 

I think, therefore I am? The Thinker reveals himself? Caitlin takes full control of her powers (therefore I am)?

[Trini]

Yeah, that second title does sounds like it will be a big episode for the Thinker.

NOT looking forward to yet another Harrison Wells; if that is what 4.06 is about. Ugh - just make Cavanugh recurring, so they can use him well when he does appear.

-------------

From EW:

Quote

There will be some sort of tension between Iris and Cecile, but probably not for the reason you’re thinking. “They have their own interpersonal relationship drama that will go down this season,” says Candice Patton, who explains that it doesn’t necessarily have to do with them being the two women in Joe’s life. “Iris really respects Cecile. I think she knows how much Cecile makes her dad happy, so in Iris’ eyes, she’s a welcome addition to the family. You’ll just have to wait and see how that whole thing between them plays out.”

This actually sounds fairly vague. I'm guessing it's something wedding-related, or best case, something work-related. I'm just really glad Iris will be having more scenes and stories with other women!

Edited September 21, 2017 by Trini

[Trini]

Season premiere description is out!

Quote

"The Flash Reborn" - (8:00-9:00 p.m. ET) (TV-PG, LV) (HDTV)

COMING HOME - With Barry (Grant Gustin) in the speed force, Iris (Candice Patton), Kid Flash (Keiynan Lonsdale), Joe (Jesse L. Martin) and Vibe (Carlos Valdes) have taken over protecting Central City. However, when a powerful armored villain threatens to level the city if The Flash doesn't appear, Cisco makes a risky decision to break Barry out of the speed force. However, the Barry that comes out isn't the same Barry that went in.

Glen Winter directed the episode with story by Andrew Kreisberg and teleplay by Todd Helbing & Eric Wallace (#401).
Original airdate 10/10/2017.

 

We'll see how it plays out, but I'm still a little disappointed that Barry has to be 'broken out' instead of getting out himself.

[cambridgeguy]

Looks like we know what will happen during the crossover

The bad guys look outnumbered in the picture.

[Trini]

2 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

Looks like we know what will happen during the crossover

The bad guys look outnumbered in the picture.

After years of being ignored during the crossovers, Iris (and Barry) is at the center of the poster!!

 

But no Kid Flash... did Keiynan get bumped to recurring? He's missed several episodes.

[ruby24]

Yeah, I can't see any other explanation for KL's absence. Missing four episodes in a row has to mean he's been pushed to recurring. Right?

[Trini]

[Ack-- I hit submit too early]

Theory: Wally is the Reverse Flash(??) from Earth-X.

Description:

Quote

The crossover is officially described as follows: “With all of the heroes in town to celebrate Barry and Iris’s wedding, villains from Earth-X crash the festivities with a deadly agenda.”

http://www.superherohype.com/news/404871-crisis-on-earth-x-is-the-title-for-the-cw-november-crossover#

[Primal Slayer]

53 minutes ago, ruby24 said:

Yeah, I can't see any other explanation for KL's absence. Missing four episodes in a row has to mean he's been pushed to recurring. Right?

No but it is his sister getting married so it makes zero sense for him to be a non factor in this. 

I am still wondering why all the bad guys are covering their faces as if their robots.

[Trini]

2 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

I am still wondering why all the bad guys are covering their faces as if their robots.

They want to surprise the audience with the "it's their doppelgangers!" reveal? Except HAHA -- no. Someone else mentioned it, but it probably to help filming, since having actors act and do stunts against themselves is complicated.

----

Okay; so those are probably not the actual wedding outfits, I think. Since the poster had to be made from before the show wardrobe could finalize that.

Surprised that they made the crossover announcement so soon. I thought it would be next week, since the promo for the premieres came out this week.

[RedVitC]

Ah, so much new stuff, and I haven't even responded to the other stuff yet!!! First of all, the poster looks really cool (but characters like Felicity not being on it seems off to me tbh) and I'm happy to hear that Iris will finally be crossing over. And I've mentioned before how excited I am about the WestAllen wedding so seeing them in wedding clothes makes me happy/ But I'm not here for The Ray universe crossing over to live action. I don't like the idea of dopplegängers fighting on the side of nazis in cartoon form, and I don't like the idea in live action either, alternate universe or not.

 

On 9/16/2017 at 4:23 PM, Karlophe said:

Regarding Bart, this has been coming up quite a bit lately, and I'm a bit at a loss as to where exactly it's coming from. My guess is innocent musing elsewhere that somehow mutated into a prospective future plot point and gravitated to wider fandom, but I've seen no indication, none at all, that they plan to do this or even know anyone is expecting it. I think the back to the future situation you mentioned is more likely, and in a world where time jumping it is in fact one of the cornerstones of the Flash mythos and a major, major part of Barts story specifically, why should they change it?  What would that accomplish, besides crippling all related storylines?* Where is the appropriate thread to discuss this, I have thoughts?

I'm not sure if this is the start of it, but back in season 2 a Freelance Flash episode writer (she did the episode with Trajectory) did a podcast in which she speculated (while making completely clear that she was speculating and had no idea) that perhaps they would make Bart Barry and Iris' son instead of grandson (I think they were talking about Wally being Iris' brother instead of her nephew, but I'm not sure). That podcast also had some other stuff where she talked about how she was a big fan of Barry/Iris and she kept trying to put in stuff but was told to tone it down because they wanted to stretch it out more (It's been a long time since I listened to it, so  this is mostly my recollection of what she said, not sure what she said exactly anymore)

I'd also like for them to keep Bart Barry and Iris' grandson if they introduce him. I think there's a lot of story for the show to explore in his backstory and also with

Spoiler

him being both an Allen and a Thawne.

[phoenics]

That last trailer used reprised music from one of the Wonder Woman trailers.

[cambridgeguy]

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Yeah, I can't see any other explanation for KL's absence. Missing four episodes in a row has to mean he's been pushed to recurring. Right?

The line between regular and recurring can be blurry.  Over on Arrow Thea and Quentin would vanish for a while but they were still credited as regulars.  Rip Hunter missed the first chunk of the season on LoT but he was still in the opening credits whenever he was in an episode.

[DearEvette]

15 hours ago, RedVitC said:

First of all, the poster looks really cool (but characters like Felicity not being on it seems off to me tbh)

It seems like the poster is only showing super-hero characters.  Not regular people.  Iris is the only non-super being shown because, well it is her wedding.  But everyone else is in their super hero/villain guise. , i.e. VIbe but not Cisco, KF but not Caitlyn, Firestorm instead of Jackson & Stein etc....    No Joe.  No Harrison Wells dopp.  So no Felicity either. 

But... that does make the absence of Kid Flash rather glaring. 

Edited September 23, 2017 by DearEvette

[Trini]

Another tidbit from TVLine:

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The Big Bad is motivated by something personal that he experienced” rather than a desire for world domination, per showrunner Todd Helbing, who adds that there’s a “psychological component” to Season 4 (premiering Tuesday, Oct. 10). The Thinker “literally is the smartest guy on the planet, so there’s a lot of chess pieces that he’s moving around simultaneously. As our team is figuring out who he is and what they think the plan is, there’s a lot of fun [as we] show the audience information and then have our team catch up to that information or surpass it. It’s a big mystery.”

However, last season they talked about Savitar as a "psychological" villain, and I don't think that word means what they think it means.

[ruby24]

As long as it's not another personal grudge towards Barry. I've had enough of that.

[Trini]

Back to the wedding for a minute -- supposedly Diggle will be officiating (according to statements from David Ramsey). Hey, I like Diggle, but there a few other people I'd rather see marry Barry and Iris before him: Random, anonymous clergyperson, Captain Singh, Joe, Professor Stein, or even Jay Garrick. They all have closer ties than Diggle. I'm not going to be upset if he does officiate; it just seems an odd choice when there are several better choices. (Then again, these writers loooove to squander opportunities that are right in front of them.)

[Trini]

Kreisberg is saying that Barry/The Flash is going to be a more mature hero this season, but what would really help is if they didn't have him be handicapped by STAR Labs so much of the time. The show could really change things up by not having him so reliant on STAR Labs/Team Flash. They could still have stuff for the supporting cast to do, just not always on that set. CCPD and Barry and Joe's actual jobs really should used more often.

[RedVitC]

Well, well, well, the plot thickens yet again ?

The paps spoiled that there will be two weddings (WestAllen and Olicity) and a funeral (some of the hints point to Stein). I like both couples and have been on board for two weddings during the crossover so that doesn't phase me. I just hope they handle the how of it all with care, because on the face of it a couple going to another couple's wedding and then also getting married themselves is kind of a jerk move. But I think they'll make it so that after all everyone has gone through it will be understandable.

I wouldn't be surprised if Iris is the one that notices their faces or something and brings it up. Just because weddings are usually seen as the bride's special day, so if the bride is ok with it, that softens the awkwardness of it. Felicity is coming over for Iris' party (probably Iris' party) and one of the paps said that Iris, Felicity and Kara have a scene with just them so I think they're trying to establish that friendship because of this development.  I think when the people go do their thing in the crossover like they usually do during the crossovers, Iris and Felicity will be in the same group. Maybe Oliver and Felicity get engaged at some point ('if we live through this, promise me you'll marry me' etc) and Iris is there when it happens so that's how she knows later on.

I'd be sad if it was Stein (or anyone really). And he is one of the legends characters that has a family waiting for him at home. 

I also think it's an odd choice to have Diggle be the one performing the ceremony. Have Iris and he ever even spoken to each other on screen? But I think it just means that Barry and Iris will get to say their own vows since Diggle wouldn't necessarily have a speech, so I guess I could be ok with that.

[ruby24]

I really despise these new spoilers.

I feel like it's shortchanging WA 100% to have their wedding take place on someone else's show and also be a last minute, ridiculous double wedding. It cheapens their relationship/marriage and equates it to Oliver/Felicity, who WILL be getting divorced.

There's just no way Arrow lets that couple stay married. So I already know they're splitting up, so of course it doesn't matter where/how they get married. But doing that to WA and equating them with those  two is super ominous.