All Episodes Discussion

[Ohmo]

On 3/15/2025 at 6:29 PM, JudyObscure said:

I wish Josh had reported this one, it called for some snark.

++++++++++1

3/21 episode: It was actually an update of the Katie Connolly case from 2015.  As Dateline went through it, the case came back to me.  I know we talked about it here.

Katie's been released from prison because her conviction was overturned due to how authorities searched her cell phone.  DA has to decide whether or not to try her again.

It's been several years.  Maybe it's the influence of watching more Dateline and 48 Hours in the intervening years, but it does feel like a stretch for Katie to have killed Mary to get Adam to return to her.  Seems rather drastic given the fact they had been on again/off again several times before that.  Why not simply wait for that cycle to repeat?

Katie worked at the office, but the practice was the Yoder family business.  Either Adam or Bob using their access to the building to frame Katie seems more plausible.

[pdlinda]

3 minutes ago, Ohmo said:

Either Adam or Bob using their access to the building to frame Katie seems more plausible.

I'm still mulling this one over.  20/20 had a similar scenario of false "suicide" cause of wife's death  and family pursuing justice for their loved one no matter how long it took!  In both cases, it turned out to be that the wife was murdered.

Bob got that $400K inheritance from his parents and was a philanderer, but not a murderer, so I'm left with Adam as my most likely suspect.  He had the computer skills and was smart.  He also seemed like a skillful liar on the stand.  Who knows about motive.  The State doesn't have to present motive although juries like to hear one.  

Katie did not come across as the killer no matter how hard they tried to present her as having a "dark side."

[Blissfool]

Katie came across guilty to me! There was so much evidence against her. I also noticed that when the detective was being hard on her she said "I didn't mean to kill her" then quickly corrected herself to say "he didn't mean to kill her." Also, I hated her sweet-speaking voice and her cadence. It reminded me so much of the villain in another show I watch.

[badgerwoman]

5 hours ago, Blissfool said:

Katie came across guilty to me! There was so much evidence against her. I also noticed that when the detective was being hard on her she said "I didn't mean to kill her" then quickly corrected herself to say "he didn't mean to kill her." Also, I hated her sweet-speaking voice and her cadence. It reminded me so much of the villain in another show I watch.

I think she's guilty, too.  The whole sending the letter about where the bottle of colchicine is pretty suspicious.  and she lied.

 

There was a hulu documentary about this case, I didn't see it but I found writeups of evidence dateline didn't include.  Katie  was stealing from the practice, using the practice money to pay her own bills.  She admitted to buying the prepaid credit cards used to buy the drug.  Her DNA was on the bottle.  She lied about being pregnant after a breakup with Adam.  Her pictures to prove he was abusive to her were downloaded from the internet.  She has lied about a lot of stuff, and it is pretty clear she and Adam had a pretty toxic relationship.

 

 

[Sarahsmile416]

I think Katie is guilty as well - I think her first lawyer was pretty pathetic and I can definitely agree with the ineffective assistance of council defense on that one.  

Also, the police interrogation did not seem as bad as they were making it out to be.  

That being said, nobody came out particularly great in this episode- the daughters were annoying, the husband seemed pretty slimy, the son had issues...the only ones I liked in this episode were her sisters (but not the one who got together with the husband) even if I disagreed with them about their theory.  

[TVbitch]

If Katie was stealing money from the practice, I can't believe Dateline left that out, because that could clearly be a big motive. If Mary had caught on that something wasn't right with the books, Katie could have killed her to avoid getting found out. Did the prosecution present that at trial?

The way the son was acting, I could also believe the two of them were in on everything together. Did they rule that out before they gave him immunity?

[Blissfool]

7 hours ago, badgerwoman said:

 Katie  was stealing from the practice, using the practice money to pay her own bills. 

 

If this is accurate, there's her motive! I had thought maybe she meant to kill the boyfriend and Mary somehow ended up drinking the poisoned drink.

[ridethemaverick]

Those daughters and their fake crying and whiny voices, ugh! Almost ruined my viewing experience. 

Add me to the list of those who believe Katie is guilty. However, I'm not sure I could rule out Adam's involvement, so I can see why two juries struggled with the verdict.

[Sarahsmile416]

6 minutes ago, ridethemaverick said:

Those daughters and their fake crying and whiny voices, ugh! Almost ruined my viewing experience. 

Add me to the list of those who believe Katie is guilty. However, I'm not sure I could rule out Adam's involvement, so I can see why two juries struggled with the verdict.

That fake crying got on my nerves...that and their whiny voices.  Ugh.  

[pdlinda]

1 hour ago, Blissfool said:

Katie  was stealing from the practice, using the practice money to pay her own bills. 

 

How do you know that?  Did I miss something??

[pdlinda]

17 hours ago, pdlinda said:

Katie did not come across as the killer no matter how hard they tried to present her as having a "dark side."

After reading subsequent posts on this board about that Hulu documentary that portrayed Katie as engaging in theft from the practice, I have changed my opinion about her.  If those allegations are true (how will we ever know??), I think that Katie had the evil intent to kill Mary.  

I think if the State wants to develop these theories as to why Katie was motivated to kill Mary, they will retry her.  If the State Atty chooses, instead, to consider the case "resolved" and not put the $$$ and resources into prosecuting her for the 3rd time, she will never be retried.

Katie spent 7 yrs in prison...so there's that...chances are, she may re-offend in the future AND she's still a CONVICTED FELON for LIFE, so there's also that.  There are MANY COLLATERAL CONSEQUENCES to being a convicted felon.

[Ohmo]

3 hours ago, Sarahsmile416 said:

That being said, nobody came out particularly great in this episode- the daughters were annoying, the husband seemed pretty slimy, the son had issues...the only ones I liked in this episode were her sisters (but not the one who got together with the husband) even if I disagreed with them about their theory.  

Agreed. The vibes from the husband and son were "off" to me as well.  It'd be easier for me to believe Katie, Adam, and Bob were all involved. Bob and Adam just don't seem purely innocent in all of this. Katie could have written the letter to double-cross Adam, but Bob could have typed the order on Katie's typewriter to double-cross Katie.  Adam could have done the same with Katie's phone.

Katie may be guilty, but I don't think she's the only one who is.

2 hours ago, TVbitch said:

If Katie was stealing money from the practice, I can't believe Dateline left that out, because that could clearly be a big motive.

Also agreed, and why not bring up the pregnancy angle if Katie did that?

[12catcrazy]

This case really had me puzzled - I think that the letter to the police telling them where to find the bottle of the drug in Adam's car had me thinking that she probably did it.   That guy's car was a total pigpen, but why would he keep the bottle of pills if he had been guilty?  I keep thinking that Dateline must have left out a bunch of info about this.  Badgerwoman above mentions a Hulu doc about this guy and info about Katie that Dateline didn't tell us.  I also wonder if Katie hadn't been so young, pretty, and angelic-looking (and sounding) if the jury would've gone harder on her.  

[Blissfool]

12 minutes ago, 12catcrazy said:

That guy's car was a total pigpen, but why would he keep the bottle of pills if he had been guilty? 

 

Also, why would he order the colchicine with an email that so obviously incriminates him "mradamyoder"

16 minutes ago, 12catcrazy said:

Badgerwoman above mentions a Hulu doc about this guy and info about Katie that Dateline didn't tell us.  

I'm watching it right now and, 30 mins in, there is so much info that Dateline left out.

Her rape injury pictures were fake. One juror that led to the hung jury was a tenant of the Conley family. She searched many different poisons on her phone. Makes me mad that she's out living life as if nothing ever happened. 

[pdlinda]

23 minutes ago, Blissfool said:

Her rape injury pictures were fake. One juror that led to the hung jury was a tenant of the Conley family. She searched many different poisons on her phone.

Well, she was convicted in the 2nd trial so, apparently, unless there's a 3rd trial, those facts would have no bearing on the outcome.

[badgerwoman]

59 minutes ago, pdlinda said:

How do you know that?  Did I miss something??

found it in other discussions of the case.  The DA decided to concentrate on the murder charge and dropped that part.

[UsernameFatigue]

So often Dateline leaves out pertinent information in cases they are covering. The show often goes out of its way to leave the viewer wondering how the accused was convicted, but a google search will usually find several pieces of evidence that Dateline did not disclose. It is extremely annoying.

I had a hard time believing that Katie was guilty based on the Dateline episode, save for one thing. The fact that she bought the prepaid credit cards that were used to purchase the medication used to kill Mary. 

I haven't seen the Hulu documentary, but wonder if Mary discovered that Katie was stealing from the practice? 

Poor Mary, to think that three people close to her,  her husband, son and office manager were all creepy enough (at least that label applies to son and husband) to be viable suspects in her murder. 

And I agree with others about the two annoying daughters. I am sorry their mother was murdered, but listening to them was like chalk on a black board. 

Edited Monday at 04:30 AM by UsernameFatigue

[Medicine Crow]

I must say that I was not an Andrea Canning fan, but she's grown on me (& I like her look) these days.

[JudyObscure]

I've always watched Dateline the morning after, on my computer, through Spectrum, my cable provider.  

Now I can't do it because NBC is insisting I go through some rigmarole and join a NBCUniversity thing.  I called Spectrum although I knew it wasn't their fault.  I can still watch CBS and PBS online.  I ended up buying a whole new package and someone has to come out to set it up.

NBC may lose a lot of viewers over this.

[Realitystarr]

On 3/16/2025 at 10:55 AM, UsernameFatigue said:

Not sure why Dateline left that info out, but I find that Dateline often omits info that doesn't fit the narrative they are presenting. It seems Scott may not have had anything to do with his kids while he was with Desiree as there was no mention of her being a step mom to three kids. Very odd.  The article I read didn't say how old Scott's son was when he died in 2019, only that is was a sudden death.

Not to beat a dead horse but his son's obituary clearly states he died  at 39 years of age.  I also went and found Scotts Sunfords info that corresponded with all his kids etc etc and he is  much older then stated in the Dateline show.   And on his facebook there is  photo of him with Jeffrey which was also included in the above article I posted AND on his facebook he posted that photo 4 years after Jeffrey died so they did spend time together and his other kids commented on the photo too so they do have a relationship.

Either way I'm not going to debate it or share much more of the links to their personal info. Anyone who  knows how to google and wants the facts can do it themselves.

[Tdoc72]

On 3/23/2025 at 7:40 AM, badgerwoman said:

I think she's guilty, too.  The whole sending the letter about where the bottle of colchicine is pretty suspicious.  and she lied.

 

There was a hulu documentary about this case, I didn't see it but I found writeups of evidence dateline didn't include.  Katie  was stealing from the practice, using the practice money to pay her own bills.  She admitted to buying the prepaid credit cards used to buy the drug.  Her DNA was on the bottle.  She lied about being pregnant after a breakup with Adam.  Her pictures to prove he was abusive to her were downloaded from the internet.  She has lied about a lot of stuff, and it is pretty clear she and Adam had a pretty toxic relationship.

 

 

We Thought We Knew You by M. William Phelps is a great book about this case. I highly recommend it. He commented during the Hulu doc. 
 

She also did something to a previous boyfriend, but I can’t remember if it was stalking or falsely accusing him of abuse too. (It was in the book.)

And I never thought Bill the husband was having an affair before the wife died. I think he was an old man, saddened by the loss of his wife and got w/her sister, who was also recently widowed. Just two lonely sad people. 
 

I wish they would retry her but a lot of the more compelling evidence is from the cellphone is now excluded so I’m not sure they will. 7 years may be all the justice the family gets. 

[iMonrey]

On 3/23/2025 at 12:35 PM, TVbitch said:

The way the son was acting, I could also believe the two of them were in on everything together. Did they rule that out before they gave him immunity?

I guess? Because that's what I sort of gravitated to as well - that Katie and Adam were in on this together. And she framed him/turned him in when they broke up. I'm still not entirely convinced Adam didn't play a part in this, and I could even be persuaded he was behind the whole thing and framed Katie.

EXCEPT. The drug found under the passenger seat. With Katie's DNA on it but not Adam's. I have a hard time getting past that. Why would Adam put it under the passenger seat? Isn't it far more likely whoever was sitting in the passenger seat would slip it under there? Every time I go back to that I circle back to thinking Katie is guilty and tried to frame Adam.

There's also the fact that Adam was 300 miles away the day his mother was poisoned. I understand it's possible she was poisoned some time earlier than that day, but it seems far more likely it was done that day.  All the patients said she was fine up until lunchtime. And that really only leaves Katie as the most likely suspect. Also she changed her story multiple times while being questioned by the police. If she were just innocent and trying to do the right thing by turning Adam in why would she need to keep. changing her story?

Quote

So often Dateline leaves out pertinent information in cases they are covering. 

A lot of times I think that's because they have to negotiate with the suspect's lawyer about what they will and won't cover in order to get an interview with said suspect. That was clearly the case here. They also have to be very careful about what they can prove or risk a lawsuit.

Edited Tuesday at 01:24 AM by iMonrey

[TVbitch]

After thinking about it, I'm leaning toward Adam being in on theft from the practice with Katie, but then when they thought they were about to get busted by Mary, Katie took it upon herself to solve their problem. Maybe that's why the son was so destroyed and bedridden for weeks and drinking heavily afterwards. He knows his part in it set events in motion. Then when the police ruled it a murder, Katie realized she better frame Adam.  

[UsernameFatigue]

13 hours ago, Realitystarr said:

Not to beat a dead horse but his son's obituary clearly states he died  at 39 years of age.  I also went and found Scotts Sunfords info that corresponded with all his kids etc etc and he is  much older then stated in the Dateline show.   And on his facebook there is  photo of him with Jeffrey which was also included in the above article I posted AND on his facebook he posted that photo 4 years after Jeffrey died so they did spend time together and his other kids commented on the photo too so they do have a relationship.

Either way I'm not going to debate it or share much more of the links to their personal info. Anyone who  knows how to google and wants the facts can do it themselves.

You are right. I did some more googling, and came across an article by The Cinemaholic. It describes the then upcoming Dateline episode, and even in the article describes Desiree and Scott as high school sweethearts. It then goes on to name Scott's children and their partners, just as were named in Jeffrey's obituary. It is shocking that this article didn't figure out that Jeffrey would actually be a year or so older than Desiree, so no way could his father and Desiree have been high school sweethearts as the Dateline episode claimed. 

I haven't seen anything stating Scott's age, but yes he has to be a couple of decades older than stated in the episode. And obviously the picture shown of Desiree in high school was not with Scott. (Though I must say for being in his likely early to mid 40s when they married, he looked very young and fresh faced).

Good on you for figuring it out, and yikes on Dateline for making such a huge error. Makes you wonder what else they might be reporting in other episodes that is totally inaccurate. 

Thanks for posting about this again, Realitystarr. Dateline should hire you to do their research, as whoever is doing it is, or at least was for this episode,  incompetent. 

Edited Tuesday at 02:23 PM by UsernameFatigue