S09.E14: Tech Monopolies

[PrincessPurrsALot]

Main topic: Tech monopolies

Also: News coverage (or lack thereof) of the January 6th hearings; mailbox boners; Arizona midterm elections and TV ads; Sean Hannity's favorite joke

Original air date 2022.06.12

[scarynikki12]

Ollie and the team should really write soap operas. Days Of Dolphins was hilarious.

Of course those companies only make changes when they’re forced to. Being shitty in the name of making as much money as possible before being forced to improve is how businesses operate in this country.

The Peak Design snark video was great.

Unsettling Man was definitely unsettling.

[Annber03]

God bless that third party seller who replied to Amazon's suggestion they oppose these bills. "We are not morons, we know how to read and think for ourselves." That is just...*Chef's kiss*  Amazon sure has a hell of a lot of nerve, don't they? 

So...hold up. Bernie Sanders and Josh Hawley are on the same page in supporting a bill? And it's a GOOD bill at that? *Looks outside to see if hell has frozen over* 

But ugh, of course there's all that conflict of interest involved - rather ironic, considering all the conflict of interest the big tech companies themselves are guilty of, that John discussed in this episode. I very much understand his uncertainty and doubt regarding whether these bills will be passed, but it would be fantastic to be pleasantly surprised for once and see them go through, especially with that kind of strong bipartisan support, so, yeah. Here's hoping. 

I loved John's analysis of the ads he showed in this episode, first the one of the family with the son who was looking up, uh, surfing spots :p, and then the weird one with the guy and his truck. I love how so many political ads in which someone's railing against the government always seems to involve a pickup truck. Like that's some kind of symbol of blue-collar Americans or something. You know blue collar people drive other kinds of vehicles, too, right, people? 

Good lord, those ads from the Republican candidates for the Arizona primaries. The one with the guy shooting Mark Kelly - uh, yeah, "tasteless" is one way to describe it. Same with him shooting at Nancy, considering, y'know, a bunch of nutjobs stormed the Capitol last year with the intent to kill her. 

But hey, the GOP wouldn't be the GOP if they weren't out there doing their macho "tough guy with a gun" fantasy bullshit. Respect and sensitivity in a time of mass shootings and violence? Pah, who needs that, right? I've said it before and I'll say it again, I would love it if we could put a permanent ban on politicians firing off weapons in their political ads. It's not cute, it's not clever, it's not funny, it doesn't make you look all tough and badass. It just makes you look like a total asshole whom I wouldn't be able to trust to resolve problems in a calm, rational way. 

We're not even going to talk about num-chuks guy. 

[ahisma]

Pray for us in Arizona during the general election. The good news is that all the Rs are way nuttier than Senator Kelly. The bad news is that Brnovich has already been elected in a statewide race (currently our Atty General). Possibly good news? YouTube played me an ad for Senator Kelly during this show featuring a prominent local businessman who is a Republican. His message was that he’s supporting Kelly because Kelly has been fighting for local small businesses and recovering the economy. 🤞

Fully agree that the big tech companies need to break up. I’m glad John went the Senator Klobuchar route and mentioned the AT&T breakup history. 

I admit I do feel better about Apple having a lot of checks and security around their App Store. A phone is fundamentally different from a desktop computer in that it’s way too easy for unscrupulous apps to literally track your every move. But a 30% hit is way too high for every add-on or subscription. 

As someone who has checked Amazon’s alternate sellers many, many times, there’s a reason to not bother scrolling. Amazon has made sure that Amazon’s price including shipping is lower than, or at least within a couple of cents of, the competitor’s price plus shipping. Oh, look, the item is $3 cheaper at seller XYZ! Aaaaaand, shipping is $2.99…

That ad was… something. On the one hand, it was carefully crafted to put tech bro billionaire libertarianism into the voice of down home, good ol’ boy libertarianism. But then the ad makers committed the cardinal sin of distracting the viewer from the message by getting them engaged in a mystery. “WHAT is under that sheet?!” Then the guy just drives off? It’s like Chekhov put a gun on the mantel and then no one ever fired it.

[paigow]

2 hours ago, Annber03 said:

So...hold up. Bernie Sanders and Josh Hawley are on the same page in supporting a bill?

Tech billionaires managed to offend both parties... nothing else seems to do that

[Ailianna]

8 hours ago, Annber03 said:

You know blue collar people drive other kinds of vehicles, too, right, people? 

I think it's more they think no non-rural people drive pickups than they think rural people only drive pickups.

[peeayebee]

One thing I liked about this ep is that there were so many big laughs. I needed that.

When someone says "1997," my first reaction is that it wasn't too long ago. But the people in that internet commercial made me realize that it WAS long ago. I recently went to a birthday party that was 90's themed. I didn't bother dressing up for that decade, but many people did. Some looked like the family in that commercial.

What a creepy commercial with that guy with the pickup truck. Aside from his whole threatening demeanor, what the f was he hiding? The ad came across as an appeal to anyone who wants to buy shady stuff on the internet.

Again showing my age, when I first started using the internet, my search engine of choice was Altavista, sometimes Ask Jeeves. Then I read on some site that Google was the way to go. A few years ago I tried Duck Duck Go. It was fine, but I used that only a handful of times. Anyway, John provided a lot of interesting info for me. I didn't realize that Google tries to keep you on its site. I do, however, scroll down, avoiding ad-sponsored links, but I will now try to get to the point of my search quicker and not get distracted. Of course that won't even be a grain of sand in Googles massive bucket.

And Amazon... Many years ago I avoided buying stuff on Amazon because they DIDN'T charge sales tax. Then they changed, so I ordered from them again. The free shipping is a major deal for me. Even when I go elsewhere online to buy something, I hate to pay for shipping. 

I hope Schumer does the right thing and brings this up for a vote. 

[PrincessPurrsALot]

I have noticed that many smaller suppliers on Amazon are doing their own free shipping and slipping a card with their website into their boxes.  There are two I now go to regularly, avoiding Amazon altogether. However, I really liked how John pointed out the other sellers listing.  I always thought they were all still selling through Amazon. 

[paigow]

1 hour ago, peeayebee said:

And Amazon... Many years ago I avoided buying stuff on Amazon because they DIDN'T charge sales tax. Then they changed, so I ordered from them again. The free shipping is a major deal for me. Even when I go elsewhere online to buy something, I hate to pay for shipping. 

So you would refuse to buy something if there was Free Shipping AND 0 Sales Tax? Bro.. you are a [non immigration related] patriot 

[peeayebee]

I'm complicated. :)

[peeayebee]

Question:

The two bills that have been introduced are 1) the Open App Markets Act and 2) the American Choice and Innovation Online Act. Briefly checking these out online, I think the first one is a Senate bill, and the second one is a House bill. So Schumer would bring up the Open App Markets Act for a vote, while Pelosi would bring up the other bill. Do I understand that correctly?

[ahisma]

37 minutes ago, peeayebee said:

So Schumer would bring up the Open App Markets Act for a vote, while Pelosi would bring up the other bill. Do I understand that correctly?

Yes, Schumer for the Senate and Pelosi for the House. Assuming that both bills have made it out of committee and gone to the floor. 

[Annber03]

9 hours ago, peeayebee said:

When someone says "1997," my first reaction is that it wasn't too long ago. But the people in that internet commercial made me realize that it WAS long ago. 

Recently, at work, I was working on something involving someone who was born in 2004. It took me a second at first to remember that meant they were nearly twenty years old, not ten. 

Yeah. That was fun :p. 

I too remember Ask Jeeves. I remember us learning how to use it in school on occasion, when we needed to look up information and answers about various things. 

[Lugal]

19 hours ago, ahisma said:

But then the ad makers committed the cardinal sin of distracting the viewer from the message by getting them engaged in a mystery. “WHAT is under that sheet?!” Then the guy just drives off? It’s like Chekhov put a gun on the mantel and then no one ever fired it.

And we're all left wondering what crime has that guy committed or is about to commit.  Because he's clearly up to some shady shit.

11 hours ago, Ailianna said:

I think it's more they think no non-rural people drive pickups than they think rural people only drive pickups.

And that looked like a pickup that people in the suburbs drive.

19 hours ago, ahisma said:

Pray for us in Arizona during the general election. The good news is that all the Rs are way nuttier than Senator Kelly. The bad news is that Brnovich has already been elected in a statewide race (currently our Atty General). Possibly good news? YouTube played me an ad for Senator Kelly during this show featuring a prominent local businessman who is a Republican. His message was that he’s supporting Kelly because Kelly has been fighting for local small businesses and recovering the economy. 🤞

Another Arizonan here and...yeah.  We already have Paul Gosar and Wendy Rogers.  Isn't that enough crazy?

[Annber03]

11 minutes ago, Lugal said:

Another Arizonan here and...yeah.  We already have Paul Gosar and Wendy Rogers.  Isn't that enough crazy?

As someone from the state that gave the country Steve King, all of you in Arizona have my sympathy. 

[Lantern7]

I know I'm late. Not much I can add, save for Sean Hannity still being annoying. And he's probably not as cloying as that one OAN guy at the end of their salute to Trump. You know . . . the thing before we got the image of a mailbox getting enhancement drugs and getting aroused by that. I'd have to throw that out.

Not much I think of doing to combat tech monopolies. I try not to use Amazon that often, but that's more about how their workers are treated, which John has covered in detail. I am a bit grateful John went o the tangent about dolphins. He really needs to ease up on animal obsessions, though.

[Kel Varnsen]

I watched the tech monopolies part on YouTube and it was kind of mixed for me. Some parts were super messed up, like how much of a cut apple takes from everything at the app store, including subscriptions. Not letting people download apps from wherever seems weird. Although I guess google is slightly better in that regard since I used to have a Samsung phone and you could get apps from the Play store or the Samsung store. Although I don't think I ever got anything from the Samsung store.

But other things like Amazon having their own in house brands like Amazon basics is something I am not sure I care about. Because John never really said why an Amazon Basics product is any worse than a Kirkland product or a Walmart house brand product. Or how every grocery store I have ever gone to has had their own in house, usually hilariously named, knock off version of Dr Pepper. I am sure all those stores do the exact same thing; look at what products are selling and see which ones they can cheaply copy.

I also feel like John could have talked about other stuff instead of store brands like how Amazon controls so much servers space for so many different companies. It seems crazy to me that a lot of Netflix is run off of Amazon servers, and at the same time Amazon has their own competing streaming service.

Edited June 29, 2022 by Kel Varnsen

[netlyon2]

On 6/29/2022 at 9:36 AM, Kel Varnsen said:

[snip]

But other things like Amazon having their own in house brands like Amazon basics is something I am not sure I care about. Because John never really said why an Amazon Basics product is any worse than a Kirkland product or a Walmart house brand product. Or how every grocery store I have ever gone to has had their own in house, usually hilariously named, knock off version of Dr Pepper. I am sure all those stores do the exact same thing; look at what products are selling and see which ones they can cheaply copy.

I also feel like John could have talked about other stuff instead of store brands like how Amazon controls so much servers space for so many different companies. It seems crazy to me that a lot of Netflix is run off of Amazon servers, and at the same time Amazon has their own competing streaming service.

The difference here is that Amazon abuses the fact that it owns the marketplace and boosts its own brand to the top of searches. In a physical space, the store brand generally has the same shelf space/prominence as other product options. Things might vary or rotate depending on demand and promotions, but the store brand isn’t consistently the first (or even only) option you see.

Amazon’s practices are basically like making their own knockoffs of every product in the store and then shoving the other brands to the back of the shelves while putting the Amazon version at the front. 

[Welshman in Ca]

3 hours ago, netlyon2 said:

The difference here is that Amazon abuses the fact that it owns the marketplace and boosts its own brand to the top of searches. In a physical space, the store brand generally has the same shelf space/prominence as other product options. Things might vary or rotate depending on demand and promotions, but the store brand isn’t consistently the first (or even only) option you see.

Amazon’s practices are basically like making their own knockoffs of every product in the store and then shoving the other brands to the back of the shelves while putting the Amazon version at the front. 

There is a HUGE difference between shelf space & an internet listing, of course they're going to show theirs among the first, not sure how that's abuse, it's called good placement. If you think that the things at eye level in a store are there by accident then you need to do some reading, companies pay the supermarkets millions every year to have their product front & center to get you to buy them instead of a competitors brand and the supermarkets brands are usually close by so that they're second in your line of sight. People should really try & find out who makes the store product as often it's the same as their favourite brand or on the internet read the damn reviews and make an informed decision, but most people are too lazy to actually make an informed decision and will pick the first they see.

Edited July 2, 2022 by Welshman in Ca

[netlyon2]

On 7/2/2022 at 11:58 AM, Welshman in Ca said:

There is a HUGE difference between shelf space & an internet listing, of course they're going to show theirs among the first, not sure how that's abuse, it's called good placement. If you think that the things at eye level in a store are there by accident then you need to do some reading, companies pay the supermarkets millions every year to have their product front & center to get you to buy them instead of a competitors brand and the supermarkets brands are usually close by so that they're second in your line of sight. People should really try & find out who makes the store product as often it's the same as their favourite brand or on the internet read the damn reviews and make an informed decision, but most people are too lazy to actually make an informed decision and will pick the first they see.

Of course there's a huge difference between the two; I simply offered a comparison to someone who was equating them. And a lot of that difference creates the gray area where "good placement" slides right on into abuse of market power, which is literally what the segment was about. 

[marina to]

Was disappointed that there was no talk about AWS but I guess the bills don't address that.

The other thing that wasn't mentioned here about Amazon practices was how Amazon used to go after companies, offer to buy them at a low ball price, and if they didn't sell, make a knock-off and drive them out of business. I remember this in connection with a diaper service. Looks like they aren't even bothering with the first part anymore.