Heather & Rayna conflict

[Italy Girl]

With all due respect...i am a little confused as to why Rayna was even upset when Heather used the "N" word: Rayna is the one who used the "word" first, Heather just repeated & agreed with what Rayna said...what's good for the goose is good for the gander - Get a grip!!

[Boo Boo]

Um, white people should keep that word out of their mouths. Period.

[kassa]

The word carries the weight of too much history to be used by white people, even casually as part of a song or a slang expression. I do think it was an ignorant and completely cringe attempt at comradery with Rayna, and I think Rayna handled it well in that initial galley discussion. It's not her job to educate every random white girl who oversteps, but I thought she did just that when she told her she needed to never do that again. 

Since Rayna seems to have trouble remembering things that happen when she's drunk, I wonder if the word just stuck in her head (understandably) but she forgot that Heather literally was parroting her in the moment.  

At any rate, I would have been fine with Rayna cutting off anything but cool professionalism between them from the get go, but she did that weird ping pong between offering forgiveness and apology acceptance to Heather's face and continuing to snipe about it behind her back. She has past trauma to work through, but maybe having found cooking as a career path she can work things out and find some genuine happiness.

And as for Heather, she's old enough to know better, and I'm not convinced that half her apologies weren't driven by "OMG I said that on national television and I have ruined my life." I think she was genuinely regretful, but also that Rayna's continued cold shoulder scared the hell out of her in terms of how she was going to forever be portrayed in what she had thought was her big break. 

Similarly, Rayna was clear that she was holding back a lot of anger so as not to be that stock reality tv character of the angry Black woman.  I wonder how this situation would have played out if no cameras were ever present. Maybe Rayna would have blown up initially, Heather would have learned a hard lesson, and both would have moved on to a frosty professional relationship?

Edited February 3, 2022 by kassa

[aghst]

It was a big part of the season.

They chose to emphasize it when they could have dropped it.

Rayna accused Heather of apologizing so she wouldn't get cancelled from the job.

Why didn't Heather just drop it?  She apologized and Rayna chose to be cold to her.  So you let that go, you can't make people like you or accept your apology.

Her dropping to her knees in the finale was ridiculous.  If the producers didn't suggest it, the presence of cameras probably made her (and other people in general) act in ways they normally wouldn't.

In any event, Heather and Rachel were talking about how they'd both like to do another season with each other.  That would suggest the producers have told them they'd like them to do more seasons or that's the plan unless Heather did something stupid or some old tweet comes back to haunt her.

Rayna will probably never be cast again.  Her story is now supposedly about wanting to learn to be a chef herself.  She may appear on ancillary shows like Gallery Talk or whatever nonsense Bravo is  trying to push.

So Heather probably knew even when the incident first blew up that she'd be doing more seasons while Rayna would be gone in a week or two.

 

[Booger666]

No one should use that word, EVER.  If saying that word is grounds for firing then everyone who says it should get fired.  There is no gray area for “that word is OK in some situations” or “OK for some people to say it”.  

[Sunnykm]

I am trying to recall how Rayna initially said the N word...was it a song lyric?  and the Heather repeated it?

 

Lizzo has a song "Juice" which so fantastic and a fun one to sing along with it on the radio.  It includes the N word.  So when I sing in my car should I edit myself and not sing the lyric?  Really just want to know, not trying to stir the sh!t at all.

[Passing Strange]

Throughout the discussions on this topic people have kind of spoken in absolutes without much context. For those who would like some, there's a college professor who has developed a course about the word. Here are links to an interview with him and a quick video. In terms of the Heather-Rayna conflict, the first paragraph under the last topic "What should teachers keep in mind as they teach about the n-word?" addresses a similar situation. To avoid any well meaning pearl clutching, please note that the question uses the euphemism while Professor Lester, who is Black, uses the actual word in his answer.

[kassa]

On 2/5/2022 at 2:01 AM, Sunnykm said:

I am trying to recall how Rayna initially said the N word...was it a song lyric?  and the Heather repeated it?

They were out on their night off and I think Rayna made the dismissive comment about the moustached guy (never remember his name, don't care to). Something like "THAT n__" and Heather, walking behind her, repeated it, laughing.

Then later when they were in the galley, they were singing some song that used the word and Rayna set her straight. 

Just as family and friends get to speak to one another in certain ways that are way out of line if outsiders attempt them, so too can racial/ethnic/religious groups.  I assume it's a lot harder to avoid if you're consuming music that uses it that you want to sing along to, but maybe self consciousness of the weight of that word isn't that bad a sacrifice to make to not casually inflict insult/pain on others. 

 

[Booger666]

But who decides who is an “outsider”?  Rayna said that Wes wasn’t black so is he an outsider?  Genuinely asking as I’ve heard this said for other groups as well.  What if the outsider is offended by the word?  Do their feelings matter?  This is why I struggle with the ‘it’s OK for some’ because there is so much room for judgement and misunderstanding that often leads to anger instead of discourse.

[WhatAmIWatching]

4 hours ago, kassa said:

They were out on their night off and I think Rayna made the dismissive comment about the moustached guy (never remember his name, don't care to). Something like "THAT n__" and Heather, walking behind her, repeated it, laughing.

Then later when they were in the galley, they were singing some song that used the word and Rayna set her straight. 

Just as family and friends get to speak to one another in certain ways that are way out of line if outsiders attempt them, so too can racial/ethnic/religious groups.  I assume it's a lot harder to avoid if you're consuming music that uses it that you want to sing along to, but maybe self consciousness of the weight of that word isn't that bad a sacrifice to make to not casually inflict insult/pain on others. 

 

Wait, so Jake (is that General Custer's name?) sang it, too? If yes, then why didn't Rayna get upset with him as well as Heather?

[kassa]

I don't know the song so I couldn't follow who was singing what. Could have been more than one song or she sang the offensive part and he muted himself? Or it was just too much, too soon?

[ihartcoffee]

Rayna says Heather should be careful because of cancel culture,  then sets out to ensure it happens.  At least it seems that way.  Heather should not have repeated Rayna's rude comment,  but I'm not sure what Rayna wants?  2 apologies were not enough. 

[TexasGal]

Please remember our site Golden Rule - be civil to each other.  I have removed a few posts that violated this.  Snark on the show/crew members, not each other.  I’m trying to not let a few bad apples spoil the thread, since most of y’all have discussed a hot button issue respectfully, but if this behavior continues I’ll lock this thread.

 

[Corry]

On 2/3/2022 at 5:12 AM, Boo Boo said:

Um, white people should keep that word out of their mouths. Period.

Here's an idea; black people should stop using it too!! 

[Al Turner]

I’m a black guy as well. Now if someone is singing a song, they’re doing JUST THAT. If the song said trailer trash or something and I was singing it, I’d hope no one would get angry. Rayna needs to concentrate that energy on her JOB.

[Chatty Cake]

That season was on this morning. Rayna was a real asshole. There’s nothing wrong with correcting someone but the way she accepted the apology and then brought it up on the last night out was unnecessary. Her smoking at the table was more offensive than anything else that season. Very gross behavior.

[Lady of nod]

I just re-watched this season. I thought a lot about this whole Rayna Heather thing. Should Heather have said the N-word of course not. Did she say it in a malicious way , no. They were all drinking. She was getting along fine with Rayna. Rayna dropped the bomb and Heather repeated it. I don’t even think she was thinking about what she was saying. When Rayna brought it up later, she apologized. She apologized again. Rayna just couldn’t let it go. Why ? Well I think her feelings were hurt   She’d already had her feelings hurt when Jake announced he was engaged. She was offended and I get that but I also think it went on to become her storyline. And she used it for her excuse every time she got called out for her poor attitude. She seem to get more and more incensed as time went on. She got offended when Captain Lee told her she was doing a good job. And from what I read long after the show was over, she wanted bravo to cancel the whole show.

I think Heather was sincere in  her apologies and that Rana was right to call her out on it. But in my opinion, it just escalated way beyond it where it should’ve been.

I just watched the last scene in the van, so I wanted to add how awful Raynas treatment Wes was. His feelings were hurt, and I would consider what she said to him a form of racism too. 

Edited August 30, 2023 by Lady of nod
Addrd

[RoseAllDay]

I’ve seen this season here and there, including today. My impression of Rayna has always been that of an angry young woman who sees issues in everything.

 

[maggiemae]

Hence her constant eye-rolling.