The Great But Abbreviated GG Rewatch!

[amensisterfriend]

Taryn, please feel free to suggest any episode from S1 or the beginning/middle of S2!!! I'm dying to do another one before moving on to There's the Rub. 

[Taryn74]

Taryn, please feel free to suggest any episode from S1 or the beginning/middle of S2!!! I'm dying to do another one before moving on to There's the Rub. 

 

Gladly!  I'm always up for Double Date!  And Concert Interruptus.  And The Third Lorelai.  And Emily in Wonderland.

 

LOL.

 

PiB - parts of it I still really, really hate.  I actually kind of swing back and forth with how I feel about Max in this one.  Sometimes he's being ridiculous.  Sometimes he's being far more mature and sensible and likable than Lorelai.

 

Hey!  There was no Dean in this one, was there?  Bonus.

 

Rory comforting Lorelai at the end kind of choked me up this time.  Watching this show while I have a daughter that's exactly Rory's age really brings out different aspects of their relationship.  I can appreciate more of the nuances now.

[amensisterfriend]

Hey!  There was no Dean in this one, was there?  Bonus.

 

The fact that I *just* rewatched the episode and can't even remember whether he was in it speaks volumes about how essential and interesting a character I find him :) 

 

I vote for either CI or The Third Lorelai! Or both :) (I LOVE Double Date, but it's one I've already watched and chatted about way, way too many times!) 

[junienmomo]

I need something in the background while I do some paperwork so I came to see what ep we're on here.  Paris is Burning, oh yay LOL.  Not.  Maybe I'll see it with fresh eyes since it's been a while?

It worked for me, Taryn.

Turns out there were a couple of gems for me, particularly the refrigerator cleaning dialog.

[junienmomo]

How about one last Season 1 episode before moving on to our beloved Season 2?

 

I propose Breakup part 2 because of the variety of events:

• Lorelai runs interference to shield Rory
• Luke wrestles with Dean
• Lorelai visits Max
• Rachel helps at diner
• Jackson cooks for Sookie
• Lane meets Henry
• Tristan kisses Rory

 

Oh, yeah, also because your insights will help me with my fanfic A Really Nice Man. :)

[amensisterfriend]

Sounds great! How about we combine suggestions and watch CI and then Breakup Part 2??? 

[Taryn74]

LOL this was my exact reaction to all the different points -

 

I propose Breakup part 2 because of the variety of events:
•Lorelai runs interference to shield Rory - awww, yeah that's true
•Luke wrestles with Dean - HA!  I NEED to see that again
•Lorelai visits Max - ugh
•Rachel helps at diner - *noncommittal noise*
•Jackson cooks for Sookie - HA! I forgot about that
•Lane meets Henry - awww, Henry!
•Tristan kisses Rory - *sympathetic face*

[junienmomo]

Sounds like a plan:

CI, then

Breakup,

 

 

then consider if we want to continue with S1, using

Double Date

Third Lorelai

Emily in Wonderland

 

I'm totally OK with lovin' on S1 a while longer.

•Rachel helps at diner - *noncommittal noise*

 

Don't underestimate this point. AFAIK Rachel was in the diner when Luke, *her BOYFRIEND*, ran outside to ridiculously annoy a naive teenage boy over the daughter of a person Luke curiously refused to discuss with Rachel. What in the world would she have said to him afterward?

[Taryn74]

Oooh, what a great point!  I never even thought about Rachel witnessing Luke and Dean's tiffle.  Interesting.

[amensisterfriend]

My typically odd and disjointed thoughts on CI:

 

What I Liked: 

 

All things Paris/Rory...I know, I know. Try to contain your shock ;) I like the gentle mislead here re how we think Rory is forming friendships with Madeline and Louise only to ultimately find out that it's really Paris who she can rely on. 

I love how Paris' bitchy behavior is again somewhat explained---albeit not fully excused----by her insecurities and her need to self-protect rather than pure malice. The way she lit up at the concert is just magic. She's had so little joy and fun in her life that it was somehow both funny and sad to hear her refer to their evening the best night of her life. 

 

 I love the rummage sale. It's one of those times when the show successfully evokes the sense of unity and community in SH without obnoxiously overdoing the quirk. 

 

I love super enthusiastic, generous Sookie. I'm always happily surprised all over again by how much I adore her friendship with Lorelai in those first couple of seasons---and how much natural affection I also see between Sookie and Rory. 

 

I feel like Lorelai's immaturity and vanity are overemphasized in S1 to the point where I find her annoying for much of the season, but Lorelai snapping into 'mom mode' and storming off to retrieve the wayward teens showed the character at her finest. 

 

It's weird----I expected the list of things I really about this episode to be a lot longer, because I do really like this one overall. I guess it's more that the few basic things I listed above are things I happen to like A LOT.  

 

Things I Didn't Like:

 

Be gentle with me, SP fans, but I think he really overacts in this episode while freaking out over Rachel's sweatshirt. In his defense, his reaction was somewhat overwritten as well, so there's probably not all that much he could have done. I totally get the reasons for that plotline: they wanted us to know about Rachel so that her arrival a few episodes later could have more of an impact, it was time fill in a bit more about Luke's past, they wanted an opportunity to remind us that Lorelai is jealous about and still somewhat interested in Luke despite not being ready to 'go there' yet, etc.  So I'm all for that storyline in theory, but in execution I found it really clunky. More subtle writing and acting would have made it a whole lot more effective and enjoyable for me. 

 

Louise is more annoying than amusing to me. (I'm weirdly fond of Madeline, though!)

 

Fanfic Ideas: 

 

Exploring the memories that Luke associates with that sweatshirt and his conflicting feelings over Rachel and their relationship

 

Showing Paris reflecting on what Rory said re her deserving better than Tristan and examining why---and whether!---she truly likes him for who he is or who she has imagined him to be 

 

Lane's resentment over not being able to go to the concert and her mixed feelings about Rory becoming more involved with the kids from Chilton while she's still at Stars Hollow High 

 

The amusing stories behind at least a few of the weirder articles of clothing Lorelai is so reluctant to part with 

 

Overall grade: B+ (though much closer to an A- than a B!)

Edited January 22, 2015 by amensisterfriend

[junienmomo]

I'll dare to javajunkie jump in and say that, based on ASF's opinion, I gave the sweatshirt reaction another look, and you're right. There were realistically too many sentences to be in character for Luke, and SP apparently had no place to go but to escalate volume and energy, which was again OOC for Luke when communicating with Lorelai. Kill the yelled sentences and it would have been a better moment.

 

My rewatch comments still to come after an actual rewatch, and not just an "aw, isn't Luke cute" pass through all the tasty parts. :)

[amensisterfriend]

There were realistically too many sentences to be in character for Luke, and SP apparently had no place to go but to escalate volume and energy, which was again OOC for Luke when communicating with Lorelai. Kill the yelled sentences and it would have been a better moment.

 

Terrific insight---as usual :) You actually just pinpointed a recurring issue I have with S1 despite how awesome it is in many ways: There's too much spell-it-all-out dialogue, heavyhanded exposition and, as a result, excessively lengthy scenes and conversations. Starting in S2, the show goes more with the 'less is more' subtlety in those type of scenes that makes it even more fabulously effective :) 

Edited January 22, 2015 by amensisterfriend

[Taryn74]

I watched CI and TBP2 both today!  Go me!

 

As much as I love CI, I do find it completely unbelievable that there would be college kids - boys, especially - at a Bangles concert in 2001 LOL.  A whole bunch of people Lorelai and Sookie's age, absolutely.  But I really cannot see college kids shelling out the kind of money they were talking about those tickets being worth for a band that hadn't been popular for 20+ years.

 

Lorelai and Sookie both snapping into angry mom mode, love it.  All the different people they eavesdropped on and ran into while looking for the right apartment was really funny.  My daughter and I use "I don't talk to anyone. People annoy me." all the time.

 

I love Miss Patty.  "I wore bananas."

 

TBP2:

 

Hate, hate, hate, hate, HATE the Max stuff.  GUH.  Why couldn't he just stay gone?  And WHY are they acting like their biggest problem was just a compatibility issue or something?  I wish the Headmaster would have fired his ass.

 

I want one of those tubs of ice cream.

[junienmomo]

CI

Definitely agree with what has been written by others, so I won't reiterate here.

This could easily go in my list of perfect episodes.

Liked

Production value - it was a well-put together show. Everyone had beautiful makeup and appropriate costumes.

Rory was so charming in this episode that I began to wonder if the Dean storyline was helping or hurting our appreciation of her.

My absolute favorite Rory/Luke moment of the whole series is her teasing him about the rummage sale poster. Both were absolutely in character and adorable. It was Luke's best ersatz Dad moment, because I can just see any kid going to a beloved Dad and saying exactly the same thing, and getting the same response.

Paris was gorgeous, vulnerable and I love her for responding to Rory by giving her debate time. Loved that Paris detected Tristin's true intent in talking to her.

Lorelai and Sookie were the best of best friends here.Sookie's absurd clumsiness was only a little over the top here.

The possible relationship between Luke and Lorelai here was really believable.

The quilts. (I'm a quilter)

Didn't Like

The interchange in Lorelai's and Sookie's concert seats. If they were going to pretend to have people high around them, they should have made it more obvious

Fanfic

what happened with those drums

Luke processing the sweatshirt. Did he keep it and why

Lorelai, Sookie, Rory and Luke going to the concert instead of the girls. That friendship circle deserved to be investigated more, especially with the Rachel thing hanging over Lorelai

Wanted to see

Rory attracted to Tristin at least a little

More everyday moments like the repair of the clothing for the sale; really good discussions between friends

Edited January 24, 2015 by junienmomo

[amensisterfriend]

Lorelai, Sookie, Rory and Luke going to the concert instead of the girls. That friendship circle deserved to be investigated more, especially with the Rachel thing hanging over Lorelai

 

This brings up another question I've never quite been able to answer: What was Luke and Sookie's friendship supposed to be??? (Probable answer: This is one of the many, many things the writers never bothered thinking about one way or the other and that only fans as I obsessive as I am would wonder about!) I ask because at times there seemed to be a sort of vague dislike between them, at other times they seemed to have a good-natured rivalry/bond over food and a certain familiarity, and then at other times they seemed like virtual strangers. I also had the vague sense that Sookie seemed to vacillate between being a Luke/Lorelai shipper to not especially believing in/rooting for their relationship at all. It doesn't really matter, but I'm just curious about whether others viewed Luke and Sookie as friends. 

 

The quilts. (I'm a quilter)

 

That's so cool! It just seems like an awesomely GG-esque type of activity to me :) 

 

I love her for responding to Rory by giving her debate time.

 

Yes! And I like how Rory knew this was what passed for a conciliatory, sentimental gesture by Paris' standards...and that Rory wanted that debate time more than she would have wanted an emotional, girly-girl bonding moment. They so get each other.  

[junienmomo]

ASF wrote:

This brings up another question I've never quite been able to answer: What was Luke and Sookie's friendship supposed to be???

This is a better fanfic idea than any of my lame ideas for this episode!

[HeySandyStrange]

This brings up another question I've never quite been able to answer: What was Luke and Sookie's friendship supposed to be???

 

 

Though  the question isn't one I have pondered a whole lot, it is pretty interesting to think about. Other then what you said about the writers never taking the time to define Sookie and Luke's relationship, amensisterfriend, my head cannon would be that they both grew up in the Hollow, where possibly different ages and in different classes so they didn't interact that much, but knew each other growing up. I could image tiny bubbly Sookie annoyed the younger stoic that was Luke, and vice versa. That could've established the vague dislike that was glimpsed when one or the other was stepping on each other's toes, especially about cooking. They probably grew to respect one another from afar and slowly interacted more once they were adults and out of school. That is just my opinion, I would love to read a fanfic that explored the pre-Lorelai and Rory lives of Sookie and Luke.

[junienmomo]

Points from TBP2 (second half additions in italics)

All in all, an excellent episode for Rory, blech for Lorelai.

 

Liked

• Rory. I found her to be sweet and long-suffering with respect to the townies attentions
• Rory's costumes. Pretty, yet vulnerable
• The house interior shots. I got fresh views of the living room and Rory's room
• That Luke broke away from Lorelai, ready to start again before she dragged him inside. Funny.
• Babette's awful men list ("peppy little anecdotes")
• Sookie as a human being
• Paris' hello to Rory, that she connects with Rory
• That Rory confirmed to Paris about the breakup and not to Madeleine and Louise
• In general I love Rory's and Paris' relationship here
• Actually the party is the best part of TBP2 for me
• Tristan's pain; not overdone, he did vulnerable very well

 

Disliked

• Rory. This was all her fault. I never got the impression that he actually broke up with her. Mad yes, disappointed, certainly, but I think she assumed they broke up because she didn't say ILY
• the fact that Lorelai took her jacket and purse outside to break up the fight. Bad continuity - a normal person would go back in and *pay* for her coffee and pancakes
• Igitt. Max
• Lorelai's 'hypocrite' speech. She was talking herself into this. Why? Boredom? Lonely? No clue
• The whole Max apartment scene. I could not detect any attraction at all between the characters
• 'soup is good food' line. Seems more pathetic than funny

 

fanfic

• Rory's thoughts, starting with her sleepless night and continuing with her internal responses to the townies reactions.
• The night Luke 'got some' He looked pretty pleased with himself the morning after Rachel came (and not smutty, really what is going on in their minds)
• What Rachel and Lorelai were really thinking right after Lorelai came in for breakfast. There was a subtle curiosity/dissatisfaction on Lorelai's part when she learned that Rachel planned to stay
• I'd probably also go a little smutty when Lorelai pulls Luke off Dean ;)
• Tristan and Rory date for a while. Could have been fun to see how Lorelai dealt with young Rory dating a rich kid.

 

Different

• would like to know what Luke's cough was about during the fight. Plot point? accident?
• Tristan and Rory date for a while. Could have been fun to see how Lorelai dealt with young Rory dating a rich kid. Would have made the transition to Jess very interesting
• That Emily had a chance to weigh in on the Dean breakup and that Emily knew about the party. I can see her lining up potential new boyfriends for her.

Edited January 26, 2015 by junienmomo

[amensisterfriend]

Hee---Junie, how much do I love that you managed to write that awesome analysis without mentioning Max?! Will he pop in part two, or are we just ignoring his existence? ;) 

 

This one is actually in the same category as episodes like Teach Me Tonight and Wedding Bell Blues for me. What in the world do I mean by that, you may ask?! Just that this is one of those episodes that has some scenes I really, really, really love and others that I really, really, really need to fast forward through :) 

 

What I Liked: 

 

1) I've said it before and will probably be tedious enough to say it again, but I think GG captures that heavy, dazed, heartsick post-breakup feeling better than almost any show I've ever seen---and certainly a lot more effectively than it depicts romance between couples who are still together and allegedly happy :) And this was such a characteristically Rory way of coping: denial, focusing on tasks and activities instead of her feelings, etc. 

 

2) I love how Lorelai tried to get Rory to come to terms with her feelings about what happened while still ultimately accepting that she just wasn't there yet and going along with her lists and plans. 

 

3) I always enjoy the scenes at Madeline's party more than I expect to. I like Lane having so much fun, Paris enjoying large and crowded parties every bit as much as I do and leaving the first second her mother will allow her to do so, and even the scenes between Tristan and Rory. Do you guys think she kissed him PURELY out of confusion, insecurity, missing Dean etc, or do you think she was genuinely drawn to him on some level as well? I'm glad they didn't go with the cliche of having Paris happen to wander in JUST in time to see Rory and Tristan kiss. 

 

4) The final scene: "I'm ready to wallow now." 

 

What I Didn't Like: 

 

1) The very (for me!) unwelcome return of Max. Did she just miss the physical contact? I just couldn't ever get the sense that there was a true connection between them. 

 

2) I apologize in advance to Junie and Taryn, but...*whispers*...I really don't like Luke grabbing Dean in a chokehold. I get that this is GG, where things are constantly exaggerated for comedic effect, but I just really don't like the scenes in which Luke is written like a violent  brute. And Dean was just a teenager, and not one who Luke had any right whatsoever to lay his hands on! A teenager I personally can't stand, but still :) It's just too bizarrely inappropriate for me to find it funny. I love that they were trying to convey Luke's protectiveness towards Rory, but I wish they could have done it in a slightly less over-the-top way. 

 

3. Their breakup annoys me even more now that I know 1) Lorelai will be not-so-subtly blamed in P.S. I Lo  for Rory's 'tragic flaw'---her failing to declare her love for a drippy guy she's been dating for just three months and 2) Rory and Dean get back together anyway. And then break up again. And then get back together... :) 

 

There are some great lines and scenes in this one, but I sort of have to be in a certain mood for it---it's not one of those "go to" GG episodes I can just pop in at any time and regardless of what I'm in the mood for that day. 

[Taryn74]

 

2) I apologize in advance to Junie and Taryn, but...*whispers*...I really don't like Luke grabbing Dean in a chokehold. I get that this is GG, where things are constantly exaggerated for comedic effect, but I just really don't like the scenes in which Luke is written like a violent  brute. And Dean was just a teenager, and not one who Luke had any right whatsoever to lay his hands on! A teenager I personally can't stand, but still :) It's just too bizarrely inappropriate for me to find it funny. I love that they were trying to convey Luke's protectiveness towards Rory, but I wish they could have done it in a slightly less over-the-top way. 

 

Oh I freely admit I'm being hypocritical in loving the Luke/Dean slapfight, because normally I'd argue against something that's so blatantly over-the-top and this-would-never-happen-in-real-life-or-someone-would-be-in-jail, but there's just something about Lorelai trying to calmly tell Rory that of course the entire town does not know (or care) that she's broken up with Dean, and that she needs to relax about it, while Luke and Dean are whaling on each other in the background that leaves me howling in laughter.

 

And, fwiw, Dean did start it.  ;)  Luke was fairly calmly (rudely, but calmly) telling Dean that he wasn't welcome in the diner, and Dean was the one that tried to push past him anyway.  (Why, Dean, why?  Did you really think you were going to get service with a smile once you got in there?  Sheesh.  Maybe he had a thing for Rachel.  Hee!)

[junienmomo]

 

Why, Dean, why?  Did you really think you were going to get service with a smile once you got in there?

 

I maintain that the breakup happened because Rory thought they were broken up, and Dean did not break up with her.

The last dialog we heard was

RORY: Dean, please don't be mad.

DEAN: I'll take you home.

RORY: Dean, tonight was amazing. It was perfect. Please, I swear, I just need a minute to. . .

DEAN: Whatever, it doesn't matter, all right? Let's go.

 

TPTB used this technique later at the post-vow renewal L/L breakup. All Luke said was he thought he couldn’t, but she interpreted it as breakup, just like Rory seems to have done here. When they talked later about the answering machine tape, Luke reacted with confusion to her words about being broken up.

 

Under those conditions I can easily imagine Dean thinking he could pick up a cup of coffee at the local diner, even if it were the hangout of his (possibly ex-)girlfriend.

 

Oh, and the wrestling was absolutely inappropriate and over the top, but still one or two levels below cowgirl boots at Chilton on Rory's first day. I still loved it and thought it was funny and shocking both at the same time.

Edited January 26, 2015 by junienmomo

[junienmomo]

 

Do you guys think she kissed him PURELY out of confusion, insecurity, missing Dean etc, or do you think she was genuinely drawn to him on some level as well?

I think she wanted to. Rory is an empathetic person when she doesn't have the Lorelai "my daughter is perfect" spotlight on her. Tristin's pain was real, played out before her eyes and in public, which is just what Rory had gone through all day. He would have been a great rebound guy.

[Taryn74]

 

Under those conditions I can easily imagine Dean thinking he could pick up a cup of coffee at the local diner, even if it were the hangout of his (possibly ex-)girlfriend.

 

It's not Dean initially thinking he would head into the diner that I thought was crazy, it was him trying to physically push his way past the diner's owner to go in there that was nuts.  I mean, if Luke had just ran into Dean at Doose's and started a verbal fight that turned physical, that would be way different.  Or if Luke had told Dean he wasn't welcome in the diner and Dean started to leave, but Luke followed him and kept harassing him, that would be different too.

[Taryn74]

Do you guys think [Rory] kissed [Tristan] PURELY out of confusion, insecurity, missing Dean etc, or do you think she was genuinely drawn to him on some level as well? I'm glad they didn't go with the cliche of having Paris happen to wander in JUST in time to see Rory and Tristan kiss.

 

 

Ugh.  Me too.

 

I think Rory was genuinely attracted to Tristan, though she probably didn't fully realize that until she saw him during a vulnerable moment and realized he wasn't quite the cocky jerk she always assumed he was.  I think understanding that 1) he really had been interested in her for a while, and 2) she might be a tiny bit interested in him too, confused and upset her and that's why she broke off the kiss and ran home ready to wallow.

 

Honestly, I think her entire relationship with Dean probably confused her, because she never really felt about him the way she thought she was supposed to.  She had everybody telling her what a perfect boyfriend he was, and she was trying to convince herself she felt for him what she assumed she was supposed to, but she just didn't.  So then any time she was genuinely attracted to someone else (Tristan, and later Jess) she didn't know how to handle it and just tried to convince herself it was something else.

[amensisterfriend]

Phenomenal responses, guys---as usual! 

 

Are we ready to move on to our S2 episodes now? Should we do a couple of earlier ones before diving into There's the Rub?

[Taryn74]

If I had my way we'd skip Sadie, Sadie and watch the rest of S2 >.< so I'm no help.

[junienmomo]

If I had my way we'd skip Sadie, Sadie and watch the rest of S2 >.< so I'm no help.

 

I'm with Taryn, as long as we give a nod to Rory's sweet defense of Dean as Richard shreds him in Sadie, Sadie. It was the perfect politely assertive response to rude behavior.

 

RORY: Dean is special too, Grandpa.

DEAN: Rory.

RORY: You don't even know him.

RICHARD: I know enough.

RORY: No you don't. Dean is incredible and he's special to me and I bring him here and you attack him.

RICHARD: I will not be spoken to like that in my house.

EMILY: Richard here, give her the book.

RICHARD: This family has standards. You live up to them, and you should expect that everyone that you spend time with live up to them also. You are a gifted girl with immense promise, and you should learn very early that certain people can hold you back.

RORY: Grandpa, stop it! You cannot treat Dean this way.

RICHARD: I'm sorry, excuse me, I have to work. [leaves the table]

RORY: Grandpa! Thank you for the dinner and the gift Grandma, but I really think we should be going. [leaves]

DEAN: Thanks. Sorry. [leaves]

[Taryn74]

Rory did do a pretty good job there, didn't she?

 

I wonder how BIAG! would have gone if she still had that backbone when she and Logan were ripped to shreds at the Huntzberger dinner?  Hmmm.

[Aloeonatable]

 

TPTB used this technique later at the post-vow renewal L/L breakup. All Luke said was he thought he couldn’t, but she interpreted it as breakup, just like Rory seems to have done here. When they talked later about the answering machine tape, Luke reacted with confusion to her words about bein

 

And again with the Logan/Rory misunderstanding in LMHYBRO. Logan thought they were broken up, Rory thought they were on a break. The lack of communication, sympathy/empathy, and just plain listening, seemed to destroy or interfere with every relationship, romantic or otherwise, on this show. 

[amensisterfriend]

I don't think I can commit to watching all non-Sadie Sadie episodes of S2, but you guys know I'll chime in with annoying frequency :) 

 

 

 

And again with the Logan/Rory misunderstanding in LMHYBRO. Logan thought they were broken up, Rory thought they were on a break. The lack of communication, sympathy/empathy, and just plain listening, seemed to destroy or interfere with every relationship, romantic or otherwise, on this show.

 

Weirdly enough, there was actually quite a lot of communication, listening, understanding etc between Logan and Rory in  S7 IMO...it really makes me wonder how DR would have written L/L as a couple if given the chance. And, yes, this sort of praise for S7 probably belongs in the UO thread ;) 

Edited January 28, 2015 by amensisterfriend

[junienmomo]

How about a free-for-all S2? 

You watch an episode and comment on it, and anyone who wants to can chime in. 

All topics are optional, but let's keep thinking about Likes/Dislikes fanfic and what should have been different.

 

Or is this too loosey-goosey?

[amensisterfriend]

I love it! 

[junienmomo]

Let me start by commenting on the episode we aren't going to discuss.

Lorelai, thanks to LG's acting here, is very funny in the first scene (newsstand through Kirk faints)

Everyone around her assumes she's going to say yes to Max, but she says it's not certain and her body language and facial expressions scream uncertainty.

Even when she looks at the magazine, she's not completely enthralled with her Barbie Princess wedding.

 

When she tells Luke, she's even funnier. She stumbles around, swayed by the "whole town knows Luke has a thing for you" before she comes out with it. She's surprised by the "I figured" answer, and that's when LG's facial expressions really show her consternation.

Think about it, she's been bombarded with the following:

• the proposal
• everyone presuming she'll say yes
• the fantasy barbie dream wedding
• she must, per the town, break it gently to Luke
• when she does, he doesn't seem to have that 'thing' for her
• he also knew before she told him

Her face when Luke turns to heat the muffins seems to be her trying to accept that Luke really doesn't have a thing for her. Well done, LG.

All this before Luke launches into his (possibly planned) passive-aggressive challenging, which confuses her even more.

At the very end, she seems to be unhappy that he doesn't have a thing for her.

 

Why does she accept Max finally? More the passive-aggressive questions, or more the Rory is being treated special by Emily and Richard?

 

Now back to your regularly scheduled rewatch of every episode except this one.

Edited January 29, 2015 by junienmomo

[junienmomo]

Here's my take on Hammers and Veils, ep 2.02

 

Weird

• Rory with her hair pulled back looking at Lorelai's newspaper veil  - she looked like a Bobble head doll

 

Liked

• Paris as an unwilling mentor to Rory about getting into college. A little surprised she didn't just blow her off
• Emily and Lorelai really talking about feelings in this episode. Sure looked like growth to me, and lasted all the way until the episode ended
• The tap girls were adorable and not overdone. 
• The image of Luke on the bench with the tap girls is one of my favorite GG images
• The L&L interaction in come to my party hit all the right emotional notes for me: discomfort, awkwardness, sadness
• Dean and Rory - he really worked to understand her needs

 

Disliked

• the party was way over the top, costing clearly more than the couple planned to spend on the whole wedding
• Lane's whole storyline. It would have been so much more interesting if they'd followed through on Henry. 

 

Would have liked to see

• More Tom throughout the whole series. Now he would have been a great brother-in-law to Luke
• a fanfic filling in Patty's and Kirk's history of dance
• more extracurricular activities of the high school students
• Emily and Lorelai going up to look at the tiara
• Mrs. Kim dealing with Henry as a boyfriend for Lane. She'd really have to put her money where her mouth was

[GreenScreenFX]

I just watched "So... Good Talk" 5.16. Somehow I managed to skip over this episode originally and 2 rewatches. I never knew it existed. Wow....it was kind of cool to see a "brand new" episode. I was always so confused in "Pulp Fiction".... So many questions have been answered! I thought it was bad writing. Or a long hiatus....where a lot happened "off camera."

Edited February 25, 2015 by GreenScreenFX

[GreenScreenFX]

Besides answering the Luke/ Lorelei reconciliation question. I always thought it was kind of presumptuous for Lorelaii to assume Rory was sleeping with Logan in"Pulp Fiction."

Their conversation in the coffee shop cracks me up....Lorelai looks like a defeated mom, trying to be cool, and then finally resigning to the fact her daughter isn't a child anymore and wants to buy her daughter a shot .....of rum balls.

Edited February 25, 2015 by GreenScreenFX

[amensisterfriend]

After several months without watching any GG at all---not an especially long hiatus for some, but an incredibly extended one for an insane GG fanatic like yours truly---I just fell back off the wagon :) I'm rewatching my special favorite, S2. I skipped Sadie, Sadie, though...I just CAN'T with that episode! 

[Anela]

I started watching from the beginning, just a few nights ago. I've just finished the episode in which Rory and Dean break up the first time. 

 

Rune always cracks me up - I watched that episode a little while ago. I can't remember if I noticed this once before, but after his freaking out over Lorelai's height, the movie being shown at the bookstore was Attack of the Fifty Foot Woman. 

 

I'm actually feeling sad, and wanting to start watching again with my mother. We ended up fighting today, of all days, but she's the one I started watching the show with, three years ago - just before big trouble made itself at home in our lives. We made it through so many DVDs before I started watching on my own, on ABC Family, later that year. But she used to be a bit like Lorelai - always there with the witty remark, everybody loved her. 

[amensisterfriend]

Just a heads up that ABC Family is finishing up S7, which means they'll start from the beginning of S1 again by the middle of next week. (Yes, I own the DVDs AND several of my favorite episodes on my computer but sometimes feel compelled to watch on ABC Family anyway...it's a sickness without a cure!) I never end up having to discipline to do a complete rewatch since I end up skipping ahead to my favorites, but for those who have said they want to eventually watch again from the very beginning and may not own the DVDs, next week is our chance :) 

[cheezwhiz346]

I've been rewatching season 7, and just got past "Introducing Lorelai Planetarium" where Rory writes the scathing piece on Logan's trust fund friends and he (rightly) calls her out on it; the thing that most caught me off guard (other than the general money issues that I have to suspend my disbelief for within Gilmore Girls) was Rory's insistence that she didn't realize the article was mean, no matter how much she was told otherwise. I suppose it's similar to "Die, Jerk," but that was three years prior, and you'd think she'd have learned by then to notice when she was being to mean in her writing. IDK, something about Rory not being able to tell when she was being really cutting and hurtful (even in "Die, Jerk") just bugs me. Maybe it goes with her lack of self-awareness  overall as a character, but she always seemed to me to be more generally aware of the feelings of the people around her. Any thoughts?

[junienmomo]

I think there was a subtle but steady drumbeat indicating that Rory was not a very good reporter/writer. She didn't seem to be able to fit her writing style to what people wanted, yet she wasn't being mean deliberately, I think she simply didn't know how to choose the tone like she should.

She got kudos for being a hard worker and a good assistant, but I'm guessing Mitchell Hunzberger was more right than her loved ones wanted to believe.

FWIW, I suspect jess' first book was similar, but he seemed to acknowledge the fact.

[Anela]

I wonder if the actress asked them to have her appear to be less perfect in ways. I read a quote from her somewhere, in which she states that she thought that Rory was too perfect. 

[Kohola3]

Apropos of nothing, I was watching Forgiveness and Stuff today and Emily asks Rory to take a drink to Gigi. ASP must have liked the sound of that name.

[readster]

Apropos of nothing, I was watching Forgiveness and Stuff today and Emily asks Rory to take a drink to Gigi. ASP must have liked the sound of that name.

I agree, considering her real name was: "Georgia" but at the same time, GiGi was never explained where that nickname came from outside ASP liked it.

[eledgy]

I managed to take a few-months break from recording and watching GG returns on ABCFAm, but somehow got sucked back in the week before last, with a few episodes left of season 7 and now back to season 1 again...

 

Anyway, I noticed something new today in one of my favorite episodes, Emily in Wonderland. 

 

Look how awkwardly Luke and Lorelai pass each other behind the counter, earlier in the ep (he's almost fending her off):

 

 

and then how comfortable he and Rachel are in the same type of passing maneuver (much more open body language):

 

I know that these moments of ease with Rachel are short-lived, but I find it interesting. That in spite of his misgivings about her past behavior, there is a comfort level with her that he is temporarily willing to slip back into. And, that he is so uncomfortable with Lorelai. The whole dynamic of her 'invading' his space--her developing even a little bit of a friendship with Rachel; when she's in the apartment; when she's behind the counter and in the storeroom... I think there's an interesting dynamic of how having Rachel back makes him more conscious of his feelings for Lorelai, and how awkward that is, and how he's maybe picking up on Lorelai's awkwardness/jealousy as well, but that's not so much reassuring as discombobulating at this point?  Who knows...I just think there's a lot of complexity in this particular triangle at this stage (love and loss and putting it out there and getting hurt...), and I hadn't noticed before how these two parallel 'moments' in the episode show that...

[nolieblue]

Rewatching P.S. I Lo.. today it's amazing how wonderful Alexis Bledel was in the early seasons and how completely awful she was in the last couple of seasons and S7 in particular. Watching S7 recently I noticed she rushed through all her lines like she was out of breath and just trying to get it over with. I wonder if she was just worn out or like many others didn't like Rory as much. Too bad. She was so good in the early seasons. 

[lulu1960]

I totally agree, Nolie. Lauren did the same thing. Even her voice seemed different.

[junienmomo]

I managed to take a few-months break from recording and watching GG returns on ABCFAm, but somehow got sucked back in the week before last, with a few episodes left of season 7 and now back to season 1 again...

 

Anyway, I noticed something new today in one of my favorite episodes, Emily in Wonderland. 

 

Look how awkwardly Luke and Lorelai pass each other behind the counter, earlier in the ep (he's almost fending her off):

and then how comfortable he and Rachel are in the same type of passing maneuver (much more open body language):

I know that these moments of ease with Rachel are short-lived, but I find it interesting. That in spite of his misgivings about her past behavior, there is a comfort level with her that he is temporarily willing to slip back into. And, that he is so uncomfortable with Lorelai. The whole dynamic of her 'invading' his space--her developing even a little bit of a friendship with Rachel; when she's in the apartment; when she's behind the counter and in the storeroom... I think there's an interesting dynamic of how having Rachel back makes him more conscious of his feelings for Lorelai, and how awkward that is, and how he's maybe picking up on Lorelai's awkwardness/jealousy as well, but that's not so much reassuring as discombobulating at this point?  Who knows...I just think there's a lot of complexity in this particular triangle at this stage (love and loss and putting it out there and getting hurt...), and I hadn't noticed before how these two parallel 'moments' in the episode show that...

 

Brilliant observation, eledgy. Sort of a physical manifestation of 'symmetrical eyes.'

Luke's whole life has been thrown into an uproar. He had just connected with Lorelai teasingly (I'm glad to have someone to share this hate with), although I tend to believe that when early Luke teases like that, it's fairly meaningful. Then the Rachel discontinuity occurs and it's not too hard to see that Lorelai is uncomfortable with her being here, while Luke is simply thrown for a loop.

Then Lorelai starts her hedging maneuvers, so it's not really surprising for him to give the Rachel relationship a try. I do wonder if he's reading subliminal messages from Lorelai. I can't remember when or how he flipped. It wasn't like either woman really asked him to forget about the other woman.

[junienmomo]

I went back and checked when Luke flipped. It happened between her dressing him and the belt wearing when Lorelai tells Luke about Rory running away. That means it quite possibly happened on the night her took Rachel out for her birthday.

Can you imagine a birthday like that? First the "friend" is pretty intimately dressing him. Then he presumably wears the new clothes to the birthday dinner and the gifts are fabulous, and Rachel isn't stupid.

On the next day he's wearing Lorelai's belt.he's definitely flipped. He's just lucky Rachel didn't chew him to bits that evening when they presumably went out.

[lottiedottie]

So, thanks to EHG, I tuned into the Again with This podcast about 90210, where I learned that season 1 of 90210 was available on Amazon Prime. (made my day!) So of course I diverted my GG watching time to reliving the glory of the pilot of 90210 today. 

 

Watching Andrea in action, I had the realization that her character could very well have been the template for Paris Geller. They have similarities, although Paris is much more abrasive and crazed at times. I wonder if the Andrea character served as a template for Paris?