Jump to content
Forums forums
PRIMETIMER

Tara Ariano

Dylan: The Other One

Recommended Posts


This is from green in the S02.E05: The Escape Artist thread:

Dylan has already murdered by pick-up truck someone when he killed his first buddy's killer last season which wasn't self-defense at that point as I recall.  The deputy I give you.  But the other dude wasn't trying to kill Dylan even by a Florida stand your ground definition.  Then he is accessory to first degree murder with Zane shooting the stuffed-in-the-trunk guy.  Now he goes all crazy shooting at the drive-by guys in the middle of town endangering innocent bystanders.  He is already a moral and ethical goner at this point.

I have no problem if people find Dylan sympathtic due to his background story.  But I'm sure at least 95% of all real murderers have similiar hardluck stories so he isn't some sort of unique exception to the rule case.  These are his choices.  He doesn't suffer from blackouts.  He chose this path.  And he could have hopped his own version of the "bus to Boston" himself.  But he didn't.  Everyone has problems in other words but not everyone kills trying to solve them.

Imagine some lowlife killed your best friend right in front of your eyes. You're driving along with your best friend's blood still all over you. The killer appears in front of you, on foot. Would you run him over? Even I can't say for sure I wouldn't. And I've never even killed anything bigger than a bug. (Dylan apparently has mad hunting skillz - I forgot about this until I rewatched those early episodes.)

I'm part way through rewatching season one on Netflix, and oh man, it's definitely hitting me more clearly now that when Asian dude (we hardly knew ye) was killed, he was Dylan's only friend in the world. And trusting Dylan enough to lend him that $5000 was the nicest thing anyone has ever done for Dylan.

Running the killer over was definitely not legal by any stretch. But whether it was moral or ethical is kind of debatable.

And then, okay, doing a shoot out in the middle of town was definitely bad. He did that because he didn't have any craps left to give at that point. Not a great justification. It's kind of like when a suicidal person jumps off a building and doesn't think about the harm they could cause for other people - like if they land on someone on the ground. I'm not sure what to call that kind of thing (temporary insanity might fit), but I can't call it a moral or ethical failure. Doesn't make it okay to do stuff like that, but still, this one wasn't exactly a very conscious choice.

Yes, the writing is putting him really close to being another case of someone who snapped and started killing random people because they had a bad life. But no innocent bystanders died in the shootout as far as we know, so the writing flirted with the idea but left enough room for him to come back from it.

Saying he's a goner morally and ethically implies he can't sink any lower and we can already fully expect him to do any bad thing without question. I don't think the character is quite there just because he has killed before. What keeps things interesting (and dangerous) is that he still has scruples. The possibility that he can change course for the better is still there. Not that I'm waiting for that to happen because he's obviously doomed. I bet he will be morally ambiguous to the end. It's part of what makes him such a tragic character.

Edited because I failed to spell "conscious".

Edited by Bec
  • Love 2

Share this post


Link to post

He is so doomed it's ridiculous. Max is really good at playing a character that is so doomed but having something about him that makes you want to root for him regardless.

 

The casting of Dylan's father/uncle was amazing. It really was. I kind of hope we see Caleb again.

Edited by methodwriter85
  • Love 3

Share this post


Link to post

Saying he's a goner morally and ethically implies he can't sink any lower and we can already fully expect him to do any bad thing without question. I don't think the character is quite there just because he has killed before. What keeps things interesting (and dangerous) is that he still has scruples. The possibility that he can change course for the better is still there. Not that I'm waiting for that to happen because he's obviously doomed. I bet he will be morally ambiguous to the end. It's part of what makes him such a tragic character.

In season 2, episode 10 (the season finale), Dylan spoke the titular "immutable truth" to Norma: If Norman killed Miss Watson, "then he needs to be somewhere he can be protected—someplace other people are protected. You need to know the truth, Norma. If you really love him and you want to protect him, then he needs to take the [polygraph] test."

Dylan is the best of a bad lot.

  • Love 3

Share this post


Link to post

I've been re-watching because A&E has been having a marathon and struck me afresh what a man Dylan is.  And by that I mean what I was always taught a man should be: brave, honest, strong, but gentle.  I will miss him because as you all say he is doomed.

  • Love 4

Share this post


Link to post

I love Dylan and I watch this with the hope that he will somehow escape this town. I know that will mean leaving Norman behind, and that will be very hard for Dylan, but I hope he escapes and manages to have a life away from White Pine and his crazy family.

  • Love 2

Share this post


Link to post

Max Theriot's big wet eyes and tremulous lips crack me up, I can't help it.  I used to sit and watch the show thinking "how can you be so mean to your tender little grownup son, Norma? It's like taking it out on a Keane painting."  I likewise hope against hope that Dylan survives, I particularly love how he is with Norman.  He could easily scapegoat and be mean to Norman because of Norma's favoritism but he does not, which shows some greatness of mind.

  • Love 2

Share this post


Link to post

Max Theriot's big wet eyes and tremulous lips crack me up, I can't help it.  I used to sit and watch the show thinking "how can you be so mean to your tender little grownup son, Norma? It's like taking it out on a Keane painting."

 

I've always assumed that Max wears scruffy facial hair to try and toughen up his face. He's never clean-shaven unless it's for a part.

 

That is NOT a face you'd want to go to prison with, all I'm saying.

Edited by methodwriter85
  • Love 5

Share this post


Link to post

I started watching the show, currently at S2E2, and I can not stand this boy. His whole attitude to Norma is so annoying to me. Yes, she is clearly not the best mother, but if that's the case then at 20 odd years of age, you don't have to move in with her and give her grief. I hope he does move out soon, he's a brat who I hope dies. 

  • Love 1

Share this post


Link to post

I'm now at the point where Dylan is mad at Norma for having him. rme He's mad at her for getting pregnant from the abuse, and not telling her brother but instead convincing her then boyfriend that Dylan was his son, which helped her get out of the abusive household. Why is he mad at this? Since he arrived, he's just been stomping around being angry at her, never showing any understanding despite learning about all this abuse that she suffered. Yeah, we get it, she's troubled and he likely had it rough, but c'mon, it's not all about you Dylan! You learn your mother has been raped, and all you do is attack her. Charming.

  • Love 2

Share this post


Link to post

Since you are watching this for the first time, it would be interesting to read your take on other things as well the Dylan situation.  Hopefully, you can post some of your thoughts in the episode threads.  

Share this post


Link to post

Even though the actors are adults, you have to remember that Dylan is the CHILD and Norma is the PARENT.  Understanding Dylan's relationship with his mother means you have to remember that she has also been abusive to him his entire life, that she has never shown him love, and that sh has always pushed him away.  Dylan loves her, but he has to protect himself from her lack of love, and her sometimes vicious behavior towards him.  Treating this relationship as something that started with episode 1 is a mistake, because from the first time we see Dylan's caller ID, everything about them has been colored by the 20+ years of Norma's mental and emotional (and in my opinion likely physical sometimes) abuse of Dylan.  It isn't a normal adult relationship, t isn't a normal parent-child relationship.  And frankly, given how much of Norma's victimhood attitude we see, I have a feeling that she has used problems, real or imagined, as emotional weapons in the past.  This time it was different on Norma's part, but how is Dylan supposed to know this?

Also, his whole world has just been rocked, and his identity shattered.  Imagine for a moment suddenly finding out not only that you're the child of an abusive asshole (which Dylan seems to have already known about his "father"), but that you are the product of incest as well as someone who is an abusive asshole.  Blaming Dylan for not ignoring all of that and immediately falling to his knees to worship at the altar of Norma is looking at their story entirely from her side, I think, without any acknowledgment of Dylan's side of their dynamic.

  • Love 8

Share this post


Link to post
On 10/2/2016 at 7:24 PM, Ailianna said:

Even though the actors are adults, you have to remember that Dylan is the CHILD and Norma is the PARENT.  Understanding Dylan's relationship with his mother means you have to remember that she has also been abusive to him his entire life, that she has never shown him love, and that sh has always pushed him away.  Dylan loves her, but he has to protect himself from her lack of love, and her sometimes vicious behavior towards him.  Treating this relationship as something that started with episode 1 is a mistake, because from the first time we see Dylan's caller ID, everything about them has been colored by the 20+ years of Norma's mental and emotional (and in my opinion likely physical sometimes) abuse of Dylan.  It isn't a normal adult relationship, t isn't a normal parent-child relationship.  And frankly, given how much of Norma's victimhood attitude we see, I have a feeling that she has used problems, real or imagined, as emotional weapons in the past.  This time it was different on Norma's part, but how is Dylan supposed to know this?

Also, his whole world has just been rocked, and his identity shattered.  Imagine for a moment suddenly finding out not only that you're the child of an abusive asshole (which Dylan seems to have already known about his "father"), but that you are the product of incest as well as someone who is an abusive asshole.  Blaming Dylan for not ignoring all of that and immediately falling to his knees to worship at the altar of Norma is looking at their story entirely from her side, I think, without any acknowledgment of Dylan's side of their dynamic.

No where in my comment did I even suggest that Dylan should "fall on his feet and worship at the altar of Norma". That's a massive ball of straw you have in your hand there.

And I am well aware that Dylan's relationship with Norma is dysfunctional. It may be the reason for Dylan's own abusive behaviour, but I don't see it as an excuse.

Dylan is not a child anymore. He's a 20 something guy, in a gang and who's killed someone. Like most adults, he has agency and choice. And with Dylan I see an angry hurt guy, who has chosen to move into his mother's home to torment and abuse her because he feels aggrieved at how she treated him. He feels like Norma owes him. I don't see someone protecting himself, I see a bitter guy lashing out at every opportunity. 

There are kitchen scenes that remind me of the Johnny Depp video. Dylan stalking around the cupboards, shouting, being angry and belligerent. Emotionally and verbally abusive. He's no peach and as character he adds little to the story. 

Edited by greenbean
  • Love 1

Share this post


Link to post

I like Dylan too. In fact, I'm shocked he's not even more damaged than we've seen so far. Whatever his issues with his mother, he's seems to have gone past them in a huge way. He's reached out to his mother more than he's ever reached out to Norma. And despite his troubled past and abandonment, he seems to be aiming to do the right thing by others. How he got to that state is pretty amazing. 

Edited by pancake bacon
  • Love 3

Share this post


Link to post
On 11/11/2016 at 2:29 AM, pancake bacon said:

I like Dylan too. In fact, I'm shocked he's not even more damaged than we've seen so far. Whatever his issues with his mother, he's seems to have gone past them in a huge way. He's reached out to his mother more than he's ever reached out to Norma. And despite his troubled past and abandonment, he seems to be aiming to do the right thing by others. How he got to that state is pretty amazing. 

I thought Norma was his mother?

Share this post


Link to post
14 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

I thought Norma was his mother?

Typo, sorry! Good catch! 

That should be: Dylan's reached out to his mother more than Norma's reached out to him. 

  • Love 1

Share this post


Link to post

Dylan's journey so far has been quite amazing, from the time he came to live with his mentally deranged family, mother and brother, getting involved in the dangerous local drug business, then finding love with Emma (surprisingly). And now he has become a father, too.

Will this end his personal journey of physical and emotional violence though? If it was only up to him, then possibly. But then there is still Norman, his beloved brother who has gone murderously bonkers.

As Dylan did not appear in person in the very first episode of the show, and the male half of the show creators used to be LOST in symmetry (mostly in a good way), I have a feeling that Dylan will die in the penultimate episode of the show, either be killed by Norman, or trying to protect him. I like the character and lot and definitely would love to see him get out of all of this alive, together with wife Emma and daughter Kate. But then his death could factor in Norman getting caught in the act. Maybe Dylan's death will be the reason why Norman will finaly end up behind bars or in a mental institution for good.

Spoiler

In one of the current promos for the final season, we can see Emma watching Norman behind a window, possibly her visiting him at a police station or a in a room in a mental institution maybe. I have a feeling that Dylan will not be alive anymore at that point.

Now that Marian Crane is in the picture, I am definitely curious how tptb will handle the fact that Dylan is a non entity in the film.

Edited by IDFfm0870
  • Love 1

Share this post


Link to post

I didn't much like the initial "blame the victim" reaction when Dylan found out Norma was raped, either, but I can still sympathise with his denial since, well... he's just been told he's a product of incest and rape. That's after 20some years of believing a totally different guy is his father, who split because his mother cheated on him. And she did make an abusive asshole his stepfather.

By mid season one he did try to move out. His desperation to get his own place was pretty much the entire reason he joined that gang. And then he scrapped those plans to stay and help out with crazy Norman. If I were him I would have been like "Bye! See you again never!" after Norman tried to kill me with a mallet and Norma dated a human trafficker who also tried to kill me. I sure as hell wouldn't sneak onto a creepy human trafficker's boat to help get rid of evidence that Norma murdered a dude!

Yeah, Dylan acted like his mother owes him, I didn't blame him too much for that. Kids don't ask to be born, if you have them, you owe it to them to give them some love at the very least. Norma had Dylan because she was trying to get away from her crazy family - getting her high school boyfriend to marry her because she was pregnant was her way out. She used him as a means to an end and then resented him for existing. At the same time, I can see why she would have a hard time loving this kid. To her he's a reminder of the abuse she suffered as a child. It's just a whole big mess all around.

My sympathy for Norma grew a lot over the seasons, but so did my sympathy for Dylan, even though he got the most boring-ass story-lines sometimes. He seemed like an asshole when he first showed up, but before the end of season 1, I was moved by how much he not-so-secretly yearns to be loved by his mother and his brother. Poor guy is willing to risk his life for them! Meanwhile Norma would totally let Dylan die to save Norman, as we've seen when Shelby was trying to kill them all.

So it's kind of a surprise that someone can still hate Dylan that much at season 2.

Maybe it helps that I know how it feels to have one parent cheat on another, I can relate to Dylan's anger over that. I also know what it's like to have a "special" sibling who gets more love and attention - it struck a chord with me when he said to Norma "it was always what you were trying to do for Norman" (neither one of my parents ever said "I hate you!" to me like Norma said to Dylan, though, my childhood is nowhere near as bad as his!)

  • Love 2

Share this post


Link to post

I've been watching the series for the first time via Netflix, and I feel like my thoughts are different from most here on Dylan. (I'm through the end of S4 right now, about to start the final season.) I don't think Dylan is normal or better than Norma or Norman whatsoever and I honestly feel like his feelings for Norman are not very genuine. Norman and Dylan seem to be screwed up in completely opposite ways. Norman was smothered while Dylan was pushed out--and they both ended up obsessed with Norma because of it. Norman treated her like he was her husband/protector, while Dylan was wanted her to love him the way she does Norman (ie, that very creepy too-intimate relationship).

The episode that really confirmed it for me was the one where Norman finds out Dylan is "harboring" Caleb and not telling Norma about it. That whole episode, and a couple episodes prior to it, Dylan was clearly enjoying being Norma's new confidant and especially getting to shut out Norman out the way the two of them once shut him out. I found myself strangely satisfied at the end when Norman acted as if he was going to implode their new relationship at the end of that episode, since Dylan was doing the same to Norman that he'd hated Norma and Norman for doing to him in the first season. After that, I couldn't help but see that those 1st season interactions between Dylan and Norman (that practically vanished after Norma became accepting of Dylan after the S1 finale) as inauthentic on Dylan's part; he just wanted to take Norman away from Norma because it would hurt her and he was jealous of them, not because he really cared about Norman's wellbeing. 

Don't get me wrong, I think Dylan does care about Norman, but past season 2, he treats Norman like he's in the background. His scenes with the family from that point onward are always focused around Norma. If Norma had not come back after her blowup over Caleb, I really did not expect Dylan would stay with Norman longterm--because Norma is the reason he's stayed around as long as he has, and why he followed them to their new address even though he hated her. That's why when Dylan described himself as somehow superior to Norma and Norman around the end of season 4, I just had to roll my eyes. He had spent the past 4 seasons obsessed with Norma just like Norman. His last conversation with Norma pretty much hit the nail on the head in describing their entire relationship. And that's the reason I could buy that Norma found it difficult (on top of her own unwillingness to see the truth about Norman) to decide if Dylan wanting her to put Norman in an institution was really for her and Norman's well-being or just another tactic to separate them so Dylan could have Norman's place. I don't hate Dylan so much as feel sorry for him--which is the same way I feel about nearly every character on this show. Emma is probably the best of the lot, but even she was a bit pathetic wanting so desperately to be accepted by the Bateses.

EDIT: And now that I'm thinking about it more, that explains his relationship with Emma and the interest he and Bradley had with one another at one time. He couldn't take Norman's place with Norma, but he could with Emma. Thankfully his relationship with Emma so far seems relatively healthy, but I don't doubt her connection with Norman is couched somewhere in his initial attraction to her. I mean, it even began when Norma had walked out and Emma briefly filled Norma's role and played pseudo parents with Dylan to Norman.

Edited by TheGreenKnight
  • Love 1

Share this post


Link to post

So I was having this very random sequence of thoughts today that led to this show, which led to me thinking about how ridiculously happy I was that Dylan was allowed to not only live but to also get a happily ever after, normal life. 

  • Love 2

Share this post


Link to post
×
×
  • Create New...

Customize font-size