Starry

This! And isn't Nora and Bart's existence proof that in the end, everything is going to work out for the best (which is something Nora "spoiled" last year as well)? If they wanted to make people worry about Iris, I don't think bringing Nora back was a smart idea. I skipped so many episodes this season but I decided to check out this one because I heard it was going to be important for the time sickness storyline. Except Iris wasn't even there (something I would have known if I had bothered to watch 8x14 I guess). Does Joe even have a daughter? What reason did he have to not trust Deon and risk it? Barry admitting that he should have looked for a cure and prioritized Iris despite her martyr attitude was nice but at the same time, it's too little too late and I don't like how the show keeps lampshading the fact that their priorities are out of wack. And Barry is doing this because he owes it to Iris? What is this writing? This isn't my WestAllen! If this is happening because CP requested to appear in less episodes after she renewed her contract they should have sent Iris away to work on a story in another city instead of making Barry look like a negligent husband. Chester is out of his mind broadcasting that stuff! And what is Allegra's purpose outside of pep talking him? Because that's what she's done in every episode I've watched. Caitlin is another one who has lost her marbles. Didn't Frost die because she believed she could have Ronnie back? And now she's trying to "resurrect" Frost too? Maybe if someone dies she'll finally learn her lesson! The science on this show is even more crazy now! And I don't understand what Barry was doing meditating in the Still Force but let me roll with it. Now that he and Iris are "connected" and he KNOWS Iris is fine (?) the show can drop this and move on to the next plot without making Barry and the team "look bad". How convenient...

Sorry I didn't mean to imply that you or anyone on this board was blaming Iris. It's just something I see on social media and other forums every time the writers have her mention Oliver's name. It's exhausting. That doesn't happen with Barry which is why I'd rather they leave the Oliver mentions to him (Barry gets more hate for Flashpoint). I don't think the Flash writers have watched their own show. What happened to all the Earth-2 metas Barry offed? Did that get retconned by Flashpoint/Crisis too?

I think the point is that heroes can't carry out executions or just let someone die. Iris shooting Savitar in defense of a third party is acceptable because if she hadn't acted in that moment, Barry would be dead. And I find that season 2 scene with Joe and Harry extremely dumb. My problem is that everything that happens on the show has to be the result of a moral debate between the team. You don't want to be done with Thawne? Come up with something else to make him escape. Enough with the preechy speeches! I liked it much better when these people were just forced to act on the spot (Iris shooting Savitar to protect Barry/Eddie killing himself to stop Thawne). Now every time Thawne manages to one-up the team it's because "Barry's not a killer". It got boring ages ago. The next time Mia pays them a visit, I would like the writers to have her interact with Iris with no mention of Oliver. Every time Iris says (or doesn't say) something about that man, that fandom comes down on her like a ton of bricks. Leave the Oliver mentions to Barry, Joe or even Caitlin who's someone who can say or do whatever and suffer no consequences with the writers and fans.

They kissed in the season 7 finale but the "ban" takes me out of their scenes. They must think that if WestAllen kiss there will be a COVID shutdown or maybe there's something else at play but whatever the reason, it makes me want to stay away from the show forever. I've only watched a few scenes and to me it sounds like they are recycling the same themes over and over again. Barry and Iris already had plenty of lightning rod moments. Except in the past they got a better pay-off than a hug in STAR Labs in front of the entire team. Though I did like Candice's acting when she shot Thawne and reacted to Barry and Grant's happy cry when he reunited with Iris. That was emotional. Of course they did 🙄 I have a feeling that even if Barry kills Thawne, he won't stay dead. Because of their time travel shenanigans, that man seems impossible to kill.

Is that what happened when they made Felicity pregnant? I don't mind overprotective Barry and I don't find him to be an asshole. It's actually a nice contrast to Iris' SBW writing. People complained before the wedding when they made Iris a "bridezilla" stereotype ( 🙄 ) but it was her detractors who found the writing unflattering and not her fans. My issue is that they are already doing some obnoxious things with Iris like sidelining her in her own storylines or giving her random powers (I can't stress how much I HATE this time sickness nonsense). If I have to suffer through this, I might as well get some pregnancy fluff out of it even though Barry and Iris already knowing they are going to have kids makes it less special. I guess this is a YMMV situation because on another show I watch I was only able to tolerate the main couple after they got pregnant.

I was satisfied with this to be honest. Kara didn't die, move away, quit her job or give up her powers. The show hasn't been good for a long time so I couldn't ask for anything more. The wedding was really nice and they all looked super pretty even though I wasn't a fan of Alex's or Lena's style. Sweet scene with Kara and Mon-El at the funeral. Cat was a nice surprise.

I don't care either. The pregnancy announcement is going to be the last scene of the series so why should I bother? I am curious about the crossover event because I like Ray, Jefferson and Ryan but nothing I've heard about the regular characters interests me. Granted, I didn't hear much but to me it looks like this time sickness nonsense is just an excuse to write Candice out of some episodes.

Didn't Eric say that they are not dealing with Iris' time sickness until after the crossover or did I dream of it? "Determined to prove Despero wrong, Barry doubles down on proving his innocence". I am definitely confused.

I am holding on to my theory that season 8 is NOT the last despite the long break. Even if they consider Armageddon a separate event January is when the network usually renews its shows. If season 8 is the last, they would want to announce it before then. Besides, Eric said that they hope to get more seasons and seemed to be optimistic about their renewal chances. IMO showrunners don't like to admit that their shows got canceled. They usually say that it was a mutual decision and that it was best to call it quits after x number of seasons. So unless something goes terribly wrong during contract negotiations, my guess is that they'll get renewed. As for the ratings, the live numbers are in the toilet for all their shows. I doubt this is going to have a significant effect on the ratings but I consider the March "premiere" more of a problem than the time slot change.

I think they didn't want to get back to Iris' time sickness until season 8 and that's probably part of the reason why the scene with Nora got cut. Though I wish they had kept it in. The WestAllen one? They are flirting at home instead of discussing the villain. Sorry guys it had to go 🙄

So tired of the heroes talking down the villains. So tired of the technobabble. How many times are these characters going to talk about "reverse engineering" something? I swear it's like I hear that phrase every other episode. I was here for the adorable giant kitten and the dragon. Also, searching for the totems is equivalent to searching for the Paragons. Lena's plot held my attention. I know it's random but I didn't hate it at all. Let's defeat the big bads with the power of magic for once. Enough with the power of love and compassion and the power of "science". I can't help but smile every time Barry and Kara try to look imposing and intimidating. It's not their fault they look like adorable puppies.

For the first time since early season 1 I am so invested in the show I can't wait for the next episode. The pacing works for me. If they managed to keep it up, I would be grateful. I couldn't stand Jason and his drama before but Red Hood? I love him! If turning Jason into a scary criminal mastermind is their way of making me care for the character I am all for it. I never had a problem with Hank and Dawn and was sad about Hank's death. Yes he was dumb, reckless and stubborn but I still felt for him and I am sure giving him touching interactions with other characters like Dick and Gar helped a lot. Still, I hope they won't undo everything that's happened in this episode and bring him back through some comic booky shenanigans. Death has to mean something. I don't know what this means for Jason. Killing is one thing. Murdering a team member? You don't come back from that. Or at least you shouldn't but we'll see how the show handles it. I like Barbara just fine and think she was right about Bruce. Sure he feels for Jason and his death but he was being toxic about the whole thing. He was already planning on recruiting other kids. I hope there's more to Scarecrow because his scenes are the only thing that's not working for me. The Titans are supposed to be smart and resourceful. They shouldn't need to go to him for help. Can we get more Dick and Kory scenes? He said he was going to check on her in the last episode but then found her with the group and they never talked again. I miss their interactions. What I didn't like in the past was the show's obsession with trying to juggle too many characters and too many plots at the same time. I hope they won't make the same mistake again. The cast is bloated and some of them are underused. I think that's why I am not really missing Rachel even though I've always liked her.

Except Barry and Iris as characters didn't ruin anyone's wedding and that's not what they are saying here either. Ava thinks that they are a magnet for supervillains and that's why she doesn't want them at their wedding. It's a reminder that the WestAllen church ceremony got interrupted by Earth-X Nazis but the joke falls a bit flat when you consider that the supervillains only attacked because they were looking for Kara. Maybe it's her they shouldn't invite. I love WestAllen and didn't find this offensive at all. This show has said worse things about Wally and his family and had Ava make the most tasteless joke about Oliver after he sacrificed himself in Crisis. This is perfectly in character for Ava. She acts a little bit like a control freak but I felt bad for Sara because it sounded like she wanted Barry there but her fiancée told her "no thanks he and his wife are bad luck".

I didn't care for the singing but the vow renewal was badly needed because Barry and Iris didn't get a wedding. If both their ceremonies hadn't been ruined in the most offensive way I don't think people would have asked for a vow renewal and the writers wouldn't have come up with the idea either. I am sure many would argue that it's "shipper nonsense" that doesn't advance the plot and that villains interrupting a wedding is what should happen in a superhero story but I like seeing the humanity in my characters. The human element has been sacrificed at the altar of plot too many times before so I am not going to begrudge them for this kind of filler content that doesn't relegate the characters to unrelatable plot devices. By this logic Barry and Cisco shouldn't have sung karaoke in the WestAllen loft either because what did that do for the story?

Exactly. Barring any shenanigans. Eric wants the pregnancy to be a series finale thing but he also plans on continuing the show past season 8. There's no way he's married to that date if he wants both things to happen. That line should have been cut. They use the human element to further their sci-fi stories. Trying for a baby is a very "normal people" thing to do. Meeting your adult children from the future is not. The purpose of the first graphic novel and the interlude was to prepare us for Nora II and Bart's arrival. I also think they weren't sure if they would get renewed when they planned that arc. If not, they could have ended the season with a pregnancy announcement after spending all those episodes planting the seeds.