emarasmoak

I used to like Oliver when he progressed, apologized to people when necessary, listened to others, was a leader and a good fighter, cared about his sister/family/partners (=OTA, Teen Arrow, Sara). I don't like him much now. Mostly I am bored by him and most of his dudebros/ masked new friends that are taking time from other characters that I care about. The only one that (was) mildly interesting is Ragman. And I am (vaguely) intrigued by the DA. I can't stand WildPuppy and I am bored by Evelyn, MrNOTerrific, Detective Mayo and Unprofessional Reporter

Agreed that the character calling Felicity Blondie against her wishes is in the writers/ TPTB. As I said before, I don't care if WD does it with others as long as they don't ask him to stop. Regarding the line "Stop asking", this is on the actor. He may be joking, but still is asking me (as a fan) to stop making questions. I don't like it.

Couple of comments about the Blondie thing. I don't like that someone uses a nickname when the person specifically asks them not to (consent matters). I don't like it with Blondie, I didn't like it with Speedy, and I don't like it with Wild Dog. And 2 of these could be offensive for the person being called this (yes, Blondie comes across as derogatory, similar to Bimbo). Said that, I don't like that RG said "Stop asking". I think that it is a fair question and I don't like a bit that someone is telling me what as a fan I should or should not be caring about. Specially in a season when I feel that a lot of people behind the scenes is telling me that I don't understand their wonderful work (particularly the writing). And particularly in a season where female characters are having mimimal roles. Felicity, the certified genius, is comms operator and has a boyfriend. Thea is helping 2 men to do their jobs. Evelyn is there for almost nothing. Reporter did her reporter work at the beginning but now is not reporting and is either unprofessional (starting a relationship with someone that she should be reporting about) or using sex/ romance to get information. As a female, I don't like any of this. And I don't like having a man telling me as a fan to stop asking why a fictional man is using a potentially derogatory nickname when the fictional woman is telling him (repeatedly) not to. I don't care if he does it with others as long as they don't ask him to stop. If this had been season 1 of Arrow I would have never watched it. I still don't watch live or buy merchandising. I still haven't seen the last couple of episodes.

I have seen a theory in Tumblr: Human Target is Prometheus and Det. Mayo. Details to support this: Boyfriend doesn't use his right arm (the one cut by Evelyn) to embrace Felicity after she tells her secret. Chance knew Oliver but said nothing and mentioned Oliver preferring being The Hood. Both men are similar. Thoughts?

I am not watching live. There is nothing in the episodes or the promos or the spoilers that make me be interested in this show anymore. I don't care about the newbies (maybe just a little about Ragman). Felicity's only storyline is Detective Mayo as Havenrock seems to be over. Thea and Quenting stories are not particularly engaging. Digg is just one of the fighting masks who is now paying attention to one of the newbies instead of his friends. Olicity is in major stall mode. Oliver will bang someone. I don't care about any of this. I cared about Arrow when it had a smart and competent Oliver that was progressing and not regressing, a clever Felicity that was allowed to do something else than comms, team members that were more interesting (I mean Roy, Sara & Thea - as Ray and Laurel were booooooring), and I got OTA/ Olicity feelings. I cannot find any of this anymore, and good stunts are not enough for me to watch. LOA/ Talia/ Malcom? No thanks. A thousand new characters? I don't care. I will read spoilers and then will come back to this forum to find out your opinions so I can decide if I want to watch a recorded episode. I may wait to watch full season until it is in Netflix (or maybe will skip this boring part until the Olicity reunion at some point of 2017). By the way, I used to buy DVD and merchandising, but I am not doing it until I like the show again. I will not buy the S4 DVD or the Oliver's Diaries. #sorrynotsorry #tptbdonotdeservemymoney But I am not abandoning this forum. Reading you guys is comforting. Even when I am angry about Arrow, it is nice and mostly fun to read your rants and opinions.

Regarding the conversation about getting back fans, jbuffyangel points that they may be trying to get new viewers using syndication in TNT the same way that they use the crossovers (attracting new live viewers -and DVD/ merchandising buyers- after watching old chapters). Making it easier with all this back to basics stuff, even copying scenes from S1. And that would be also the reason of the Fight!Fight! promotion, as TNT would be a channel more oriented to a male demo. I found that this was an interesting theory and one of the possible reasons for this year's promotion (lack of?). That and that it is cheaper just using the same approach for all shows: watch CW, the superhero network!

I absolutely agree with this. I think that this is a WB/DC mandate to make everyone forget that the last live iteration of Black Canary wasn't as successful as TPTB hoped (it was such a failure that they had to remove her of the LI role and then have her killed). So I think that they hope that when Black Canary gets to be in a movie (Harley Quinn's?) there would be a positive buzz about the character (this could happen if we get a good and likeable actress that can be believable while fighting, such as CL or KL, and does not get the LI treatment with Oliver). I think that this is similar to the rumours about a possible movie including Wild Dong, pointing that the reason that such an annoying character is getting so much time is that they hope we love him so they could use this positive buzz to promote the movie and sell merchandising.

I have just noticed that in the family tree, Olicity is married <3, LOL. Which in my opinion is totally appropriate as this is the only future (and past) that would make sense

You can add my name to the list of potencial hat-eaters. I am convinced that Olicity is still endgame, that they are stalling it for at least the whole season, and that they are Nothing of all this will work because no one will have the same chemistry with SA as the one existing between SA/EBR. If they interact = we get Olicity moments, they just can't help it. And I also agree that the show is writing them as exes that will be back as they are improving their relationship just now (specially OQ willing to change and prove himself as trustworthy). It is clear to me that they are working towards a slow burn Olicity. Each of them is THE ONE for the other. It just is, and watching them is my main reason for watching the show (not live any more). This endgame would change only if EBR decides to leave the show. This would be a signal for me to stop watching as my other favourite 2 relationships are OTA first and Digg/ Oliver second (I just don't want Arrow without Felicity, Olicity and OTA). My main reasons for watching this show are character and relationships driven. Action can be fun and stunts are better this season, but it is not enough (e.g. Batman vs. Superman) and there are many other movies and TV shows that I can watch for the action. I love the Avengers movies because they have developed and great characters, I care about them, action is awesome and they are fun and funny. Right now, depending of the day and the last spoilers, I am mostly meh but can be sometimes annoyed or mildly interesed in Arrow. I don't watch live any more. What makes Arrow especial and what made me be obsessed about It was Olicity, Felicity, Oliver, OTA and Digg, in this order. I love Lyla/ Dyla, I very much like Quentin, but only mildy like Thea and Curtis. About the 2456385 new characters this season, the only ones that are mildly interesting to me are the DA, Prometheus and Ragman. Everyone else is boring or annoying and I don't want them in Arrow. I don't care about other shows and the crossover. I just hated the last crossover as the Hawk people was boring and the BMD was infuriating. I am extremely annoyed that they dared to swap a girl (love you, baby Sara) for a boy. It is just wrong and infuriates me as a woman. TPTB are convincing me that they think that women are 2nd rate people. I would enjoy getting a storyline with Moira, Noah or Deadhot, or 1-2 episodes with Esrin Fortuna, Malcom, Sara, Barry, Supergirl, Slade, Constantine, Vixen, Donna, Tatsu or Nyssa I don't want to watch even a cameo from LL or Black Siren and I don't want to anyone to wonder again WWLD as this character was annoying and unnecessary when she was alive. I don't want to hear again anything from the LOA, Samantha or William. I have hated all the promotion for this season and stopped watching live so I won't watch again something that I will hate (e.g. after watching unprepared the BMD I was very angry and only continued watching because I was convinced that LL was in the grave and hoped that Olicity would be together at the end of the season). Incidentally, all the real life people that I know have stopped watching Arrow, and this happened because they were stalling Olicity either with Ray or the BMD. And most of the Olicity fandom people that I know from social media are not watching live, and are quite annoyed and unwilling to promote the show, because no one cares about this new show with a million new boring people.

Another source for the complete Superhero Fight Club 2.0 still working: twitter, @TheArrowSource, divided in 2 parts

Yes! Moira! Something really good! Also, I still cannot believe that they gave us OTA in the Superhero Fight Club 2.0. BTW, if you cannot download the CW app, it is still available in twitter at @TheArrowSource, divided in 2 parts

Well, the admin that wrote the tumblr post said literally that as one of the 2 authors is an OFFB admin she can do whatever the hell she likes. So yes, this is like the definition of favouritism to me (=because one has the power, rules aren't applied to them). Also, her post is harsh, and came across as annoyed that someone dares to criticise her friends and the admins. If I were an OFFB writer, I would be annoyed, as the first writers would get the best spot to be read by people waiting for new Olicity fics. For me, rules are rules, and if you have the power, you shouldn't use it to favour yourself or a friend

I am not sure about this. All the people that I know (in person) that watch the show, are not hardcore fans and do not comment online, like Felicity, OTA and Olicity very much, and think that these are the best parts of the show. But I know that this may not be representative sample (as most of them are women and TV viewers, but not comicbook fans).

I am reading your very detailed and well-thought comments on Felicity's feelings and her POV and I just wish that you were in the writers' room, as I dread that no one there is going to give her a fair chance to not look like a shallow woman who just got a new boyfriend after dumping the nice hero who lost his son. And the writers and producers are probably convinced that this new season will be great because our hero is going to be "mean" and he will have new masked worshippers. I just think that TPTB are so busy trying to get more comic-dudebros loving the show that they will fail Felicity. Again. I hate this boyfriend storyline. I just hope that it is Barry because of Flashpoint. (I thought that this was "Felicity and Friends" but no... they are clearly not pandering to me) I have also recently start thinking that Lance (Quentin) is going to die soon. They have a younger cute policeman that can connect the team to the police force, he will have no connection with the female lead if he has indeed broken up with Donna, and also could give Oliver another moment of losing a father figure that would be dramatic and "organic". Also he is one of the few older cast members and this is CW. And also because PB was clearly unhappy in the SDCC. I would like this not to happen as I very much like PB but... Does anyone think that this will happen?

In the M&M's photo, EBR's friend reminds me of SA's wife, Cassandra

I didn't want this Flashpoint story or Barry's actions affecting Arrow... ...until I started thinking that maybe some of the permanent changes to the timeline could be good/ interesting ones, such as: 1) Sara Lance is the Black Canary in LOT/ Arrow in the present timeline. This would make sense with all the comments about a new costume for CL (and I would love it) 2) Felicity is the CEO of Palmer Tech (or Smoak Tech or Queen Consolidated or Queen Incorporated). Possibly the last one because of the future newspaper in S1 of Flash? This would make sense for S5 of Arrow 3) Oliver didn't propose during the BMD, so they were never engaged. This would make sense with the slow burn that has been mentioned to jbuffyangel 4) Roy was not outed as Arrow and is dating Thea 5) The LOA marriage never happened. 6) Tommy is back (he could even back as Dark Tommy). This would be awesome but wouldn't think that happen because CD's show 7) Moira is back. 8) Walter has regular contact with Oliver and Thea (and we can watch it) 9) Sin is back 10) Slade is free 11) Isabel is alive. 12) The BMD never happened (or "William Clayton" never happened), or Oliver didn't lie. 13) Nyssa is still Ra's Al Ghul. 14) Malcom is still Ra's Al Ghul 15) Deadshot is alive 16) Captain Cold is alive and dating Sara 17) Nyssa is dating Sara 18) Ray never dated Felicity 19) Malcom has never been outed as Thea's father. 20) Oliver and Laurel were never together before the undertaking (or didn't kiss after Tommy's death) There are infinite possibilities (good and bad) I am cautiously optimist. I have chosen to believe that (1) is true, (2) is possible, and Felicity's boyfriend is Barry but this will not stick during the present timeline. ... of course they could be deciding that the sticking events after Flashpoint are thinks that I would hate. I don't really think that it would happen, but (10) Laurel Lance could be alive and BC/ BS, at which point I would stop watching the show. I think that this will not happen because the producers are saying repeatedly (including comments from MK's to jbuffyangel, that were accurate) that Laurel Lance will not be alive in the present timeline. So many possibilities. Seriously, I would forgive Barry for everything if they give me (1)

Wow, @quarks, that summary of love interests in the Flarrowverse is really impressive. The only character that I cannot see in the list and which could be interesting to discuss is Lyla. I don't know if she was teased as a potential love interest for Digg initially (I binged-watched seasons 1 and 2 and the first episodes of 3 during the hiatus for season 3). I know that while watching the episodes I saw sparks between them when she scolded him for trying to use her to hunt down Deadshot. When they told each other that they were single again she was clearly being treated as a potential LI. I think that all this happened in S1 but I don't remember the episodes. I remember that we discovered that she was her ex-wife in S2 during the Russia episode (S02E06?). I also noticed that "Carly" appeared in a different show (OUAT) but I am not sure if this happened during S2 of Arrow (and I don't know if she left the show or was replaced because of their better chemistry Felicity-style, which I love because I didn't like Digg with his sister-in-law because eww... relationship that of course was never mentioned to Andy when he came back to live). I would be grateful for any info about how Lyla ended up one of the most loved couples in Arrow. Speaking of love interests, I could never understand why the horrendous douche-DJ that was Thea's LI ended up being the lead for another show (The Shannara Chronicles, that you may know because Manu Bennet is there).

Well, I don't think that Neville did the final kill. Neville killed the snake but then Harry had a final battle usng the wand and this is when Voldemort dies. Similar to S2 end: Felicity took away Slade's "magical" protection so Oliver could defeat him. And I would also be surprised if the final victory is not Oliver's. This is Arrow, not Felicity and Friends (I would totally watch that show, btw)

And after he imitated Constantine and his British accent, Felicity smiled to him and (just for a second) Oliver looked so pleased with himself... So cute, these two

Oh, I see! Thank you for the clarification, @dtissagirl. Much appreciated

The nominación for EBR is LEAD performance by a female in a dramatc series. So she was the lead female in that episode for them, wasn't it?

Hi all! I have been a regular silent visitor since the second half of S3 when I finished binge-watching Arrow and I just needed to find a place to find others' views about it. This place is the best for respectful conversations and I mostly agree with most opinions: I love Olicity and OTA, hated BMD and most of S3, I am SO glad that Buckles is gone, waiting for Oliver to stop being dumb... Can we be friends even if I enjoy Barrowman so much that I like Malcom? I missed this forum so much in the last couple of days that I just wanted to say hi and thanks. I don't know if I will write much as English is my second language but I will be here :-)