SueB

Yes! Sorry for delayed response.

I would say that it's amazing how much psychological damage physical pain does. And it doesn't matter if it goes poof every 24 hrs, you just want it to stop. So, you'll give in to make it stop. Test of wills.

The height strip on the door is put there to help businesses when bad things happen.

-- The Mentalists -- Out With The Old -- How to Win Friends and Influence Monsters 45 - Slash Fiction 41- Time After Time 39 - Hello, Cruel World 33 - Plucky Pennywhistle's Magical Menagerie 23 - Meet the New Boss 23 - Reading is Fundamental 21 - Death's Door 19 - The Mentalists 19 - The Born-Again Identity 15 - How to Win Friends and Influence Monsters 13 - Of Grave Importance 13 - There Will Be Blood 11 - The Girl with the Dungeons and Dragons Tattoo 11 - Repo Man 09 - Out with the Old 07 - Adventures in Babysitting 03 - Survival of the Fittest 03 - Defending Your Life Bibbed: Season Seven: Time for a Wedding! Shut Up, Dr. Phil Party On, Garth The Girl Next Door The Slice Girls

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Slumber Party

I knew you'd get it catrox14. It's a little unearthly isn't it?

Never having done this before...(I think...) here goes:

Ah the promo monkeys. What, no way to suggest eating babies or hot monkey sex? They must be disappointed. I swear, I really appreciate the Dada-esque Mad Man promos. Mathew Weiner somehow got control of them so they usually consisted of people opening doors, answering phones or saying 'what?' These CW guys make equally irrelevant to the plot promos but they also mislead. I think it's worse this year because it's less action and more character driven.

Soul Survivor

I'm not so sure anymore. He seems himself as a LOST CAUSE. But that's not the same as his description of himself as "poison" last year. I really think he believes that because of the Mark he can't be salvaged. But I think this season has shown him where he's done good. His "It's too late for me" to Cole is not saying (IMO) that he (Dean) is a worthless person. He's saying that he can't recover from what has happened to him. I am probably not explaining this well. Dean has not remotely forgiven himself for all the bad things he's done. And I think he thinks he DESERVES being condemned. Like Osiris said - people want to be judged. Dean feels he's BEEN judged. He's gotten his comeuppance (the Mark and demonhood). Now all he wants is to limit the damaged. BUT...and this is the important part...he also recognizes that he has done some good. He is IMO finding that he's been a hero in the past (and not just 5 years ago). So far this season he's been focusing on doing good as much as he can. He recognizes his capacity for good. Last year he was just "poison". He felt he destroyed everything around him. He's not acting like that. Now he's acting like someone who wants as many opportunities to do good before he implodes again. And he's DONE that. What's he (and Sam, working as a team) accomplished thus far? - Forced Kate to deal with her sister. No more werewolf deaths there and Kate has demonstrated some pretty good control of her monsterhood. - Saved three people in the musical. Got Marie in touch with her inner hero. - Cleaned up a Bobby leftover. Sure, the shifter killed two more people while they were "on the case", but the rest are alive. - Saved two of three women who were being exploited by first a demon and then a witch - Pulled Cole back from the ledge. - Took out a hippy vampire nest that's been around since Woodstock. Yes, another death happened just when they arrived, but they closed the case pretty quickly. And Donna's inspired now. Jody gets most of the credit for that last bit, but then THEY inspired Jody. - Even though Claire was saved, it's tough to call this last one a "win" as there are five dead scumbag bodies. BUT at least he got Cas to go after saving Claire. There's an openness to Dean that we've never seen before. Yes he was trying the "fake it" approach to allow him to still work cases, but he's letting himself rely on others. One of Dean's critical flaws is taking everything on himself. It's healthy that he's leaning on Sam and Cas. REALLY healthy. So, I see Dean in a better place mentally based on his actions and reactions. It's an odd juxtaposition of fatalism and improvement. But I'm okay with it. Because I have faith the show is going to prove him wrong about his future. He will be saved. And I don't care if he does it all himself or if it takes a village. I just want him to believe he's WORTH saving. He's not nearly there yet but the episodes thus far have IMO, taken him down that road and away from where he was when he took on the Mark.

...From the S10 "Things We Left Behind" episode thread.... Technically we are not at a mid-point, but they use the "fall finale" as a way of transitioning from one place towards the next. Reviewing where we are at, I think they've actually done a helluva lot from a character perspective. This may not be as thrilling as a cosmic-impacting mytharc but I'm kinda thrilled that they are taking time to really sort out what our main characters want/need and who they really are. I'll go in reverse credits order... Crowley: He's the one who I think is the most variable in terms of outcome. His mother's manipulations were SOOOOOO transparent. I just have to believe he didn't just simply fall under her spell. She may be good, but he's Crowley. I don't know if he knows what he's going to do with her, but he's going to explore it. I think Dean's rejection was a gut-shot. Not because he was in love with the guy but because he thought he could have a purpose there. At least it would be more fun. He's absolutely BORED. The blood addiction (which he doesn't seem to be feeding anymore), sort of took away his hunger for the kill and enjoyment in mayhem. What do you do when you've gotten to the top? No one is a threat to him. His last great mission-- kill Abaddon -- is done. He put out a generic "up the soul corruption production" because that's his job. But he's not happy with it. Go figure. He wouldn't be the first person to get to "the top" and find it unsatisfying. Where we leave him: Vexed. But with a new challenge/diversion -- mother. Where he needs to go: Decide how to make his job meaningful or figure a way out that doesn't actually result in chaos. Castiel: I worry about him most. He's just trying to do good and make amends til he dies. He seems to have (for the moment) decided Heaven needs to sort out Heaven. That was his mission up until Hannah left. And she indicated it was really winding down. So he'll work on Claire, Dean, and probably Sam too. He sees no purpose for himself except to clean up his messes I think. And he adores Sam and Dean. So he's going to do everything he can to square these two away. He told Hannah they were the two best men he'd ever known. And he knows that Angel & Demons have screwed their lives over. So... I can see him feeling an obligation to get them sane and healthy. TALL FREAKING ORDER. Made worse by the constant need to push him offscreen (bitter TFW fan here who feels external forces are driving Cas to the sidelines). Where we leave him: with a emotionally scarred teenager who he's abducted and a best friend whose grasp on control is iffy at best Where he need to go: Decide to live. Get his freaking grace back without freeing Metatron. Dean: Oy. What a mess. But it's a hopeful mess in many ways. Okay, so he's carrying around a massively evil Mark. But by showing him this uber darkness, it really has helped Dean to see what he really would have LIKED to have been. He'd like to be back to Saving People, Hunting Things, The Family Business. And this first half of the season has been for both he and Sam's benefit. It's been a retrospective of the good and bad they do. How often do we really sit back and reflect on what has gone right and what has gone wrong. The MOTW (as mirrors), revisit of old event, and the musical have laid out their lives for them. And I think Dean is actually getting a healthier understanding of himself while simultaneously completely giving up hope for his future. His advice to Cas about letting go and moving forward was excellent. And I loved how Dean laughed and said it was the opposite of what HE does. Dean's always had a self-awareness that he ignores. He's actually TALKING about it these days. It's like a different version of "nothing to lose". He, like Cas, is just trying to clean up what he can. He expects it to go bad and he's desperately hoping Cas or something else will stop him when he goes off the deep end. Where we leave him: Admitting that he's not really in control. The "break" time is over and they'll have to deal with his nature. Where he needs to go: Get rid of the Mark or cease to exist. I'm obviously hoping for the former. Sam: Like mizkat said, he's been in the best position he's been in a LONG time. For one thing, he's focused on Dean and not himself. Sometimes that's just what you need. You can get wrapped around your own axle of what and who you are. By focusing on Dean (without the initial desperation), Sam has a clarity. He's silently panicked that Dean is not good but at least for from the time he got rid of the black eyes until the last 3 minutes, Sam was able to take things day by day and feel like there was healing going on. Was this the first time Sam actually MADE food for Dean? I swear it might me. It was such a nice change of pace for him. To legitimately feel like he was NOT the problem child. Of course he's ignoring things he did that will come back to haunt him later. But that's okay, Sam NEEDS this. He needs this parity with his brother (as whack as the circumstances are). And Dean is relying on him. That's huge. Where we leave him: Full blown panic. Dean's not in control and is looking at Sam to help him Where he needs to go: He needs to help his brother get rid of the Mark so that he lives. He also needs to reconcile his actions and find that "line" again. Personally, I'm pleased with the luxury of taking the time to explore these characters. I don't know what Carver's end game is. I suspect much depends on if there is a S11 pick up and what Carver's role is going to be. To some extent, the show belongs more to Jared and Jensen than it does anyone else. And neither are looking at a happily ever after ending. But, looking at the crystal ball, S11 seems likely (numbers are good, J2 seems willing). If no one screws up, they will have at least one more season to wrap up the story. With that in mind, finishing the season with the characters in a less ambiguous state would allow a variety of future storylines. There's a lot of mytharc they could go back and square away; Heaven (get it back up to full capacity, but less memorex, and no dick angels), Hell (have it serve it's purpose but stay inside it's box, less demons roaming the earth), and Earth (back to a natural order with a decent balance between Hunters & Monsters...okay, maybe a little nicer than before).* *My apologies to English majors. Grammar and sentence structure NOT MY SKILLSET.

Pete Martell really hit the fundamental point: emphasis added But I'd like to add a couple of others points: - Heaven is not back to original recipe Heaven. The Angels don't have wings. They can only go back and forth thru a guarded backdoor. They resurrected Sam and Dean plenty of times -- they only remember the events of Dark Side of the Moon. But I don't know if resurrection is in the New Heaven playbook. So many angels have died, all the big-hitters are gone as well. - Metatron took Cas' grace and he became human. So, as Pete said, Cas's body is now Cas. But Cas screwed up something about his human body when he took in a stolen angel grace. He's not going to be just human Cas again when the grace batteries run out. He's going to be dead. - It might make it easier for Claire to have Jimmy back, but Jimmy doesn't deserve that. Jimmy is at peace and suffered enough. There's other solutions for Claire. The Who song "Who Are You" keeps going through my head. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdLIerfXuZ4 There's an earworm for you. Sorry, not sorry. It's a great tune (weird video, they may be high). I''m going to run the conversation over to All Episodes thread because I think we're due for some "mid" season thinking. I'll give you my bottom line: I think we're heading for crystallization of EACH of our four main characters and I'm thrilled that they are taking the time to explore them even if I don't know the outcome.

All Dogs Go To Heaven. Soulless!Sam was ready to hall the Mom in and Dean wanted more proof.

My Slice Girl theory is that she bit a hole into the condom while putting it on....hence Dean's "good times" face. ++ The Born Again Identity -- Out With The Old ++ Reading Is Fundamental 41 - Slash Fiction 37 - Time After Time 35 - Hello, Cruel World 31 - Plucky Pennywhistle's Magical Menagerie 23 - Meet the New Boss 23 - Reading is Fundamental 21 - The Mentalists 19 - Death's Door 19 - The Born-Again Identity 17 - How to Win Friends and Influence Monsters 15 - Of Grave Importance 15 - There Will Be Blood 13 - The Girl with the Dungeons and Dragons Tattoo 13 - Repo Man 11 - Out with the Old 09 - Adventures in Babysitting 05 - Survival of the Fittest 01 - Defending Your Life Bibbed: Season Seven: Time for a Wedding! Shut Up, Dr. Phil Party On, Garth The Girl Next Door The Slice Girls

Yes this. There are days I hate John Winchester. But not so much for the nomadic life. I hate that he instilled a sense of worthlessness in Dean. There are three moments that crossed the line for me: - When he bitched out Dean for not taking care of the Impala -- that criticism was given and taken so EASILY - When he bitched at Dean about not calling about Sam's visions and Dean reminded him that he failed to call back when Dean was dying - When he bitched at Sam for not taking the shot So, it's not the nomadic lifestyle, it's that he treated them more like warriors than a father (by his own admission) and that he was so CRITICAL of them. Some of that comes from knowing that tiny details get you killed. But not washing the car? Bitchy. The other bit is Sam going to college. If he thought Sam was at risk, he needed to say something THEN. If he just was pissed Sam was abandoning the family mission then he can jump off a pier.

Did anyone else give a wee *sob* when Claire said she prayed to Cas every night and he said "I know."? He's pining for Demon!Dean. I'm sure of it.

Found a better spoiler summary source (Jessica on Tumblr: "I believe in the little tree topper"): http://ibelieveinthelittletreetopper.tumblr.com/post/104847883843/season-10-spoiler-sheet Key points for next few episodes (formatting adjusted for ease of reading). Jessica's list is longer but everything is unclear post 10.14 So I was WRONG about Charlie being it two episodes (at least right away, Thompson definitely implies she lives thru this first episode and could be back in an interview), it's Claire. Which makes sense because Claire's story was not wrapped up last night. Which makes me think that it'll at least spend the first part of the episode wrapping up the mess they were in when the credits rolled. I really hope they address some of the logistics (like bodies, what to do with Claire, etc...). It's also mytharc heavy based on the writing duo. Robbie, of course, is writing Charlie. The next duo (Charmelo and Synder) don't have the best episodes IMO - Ask Jeeves (2014) ... (written by) - The Purge (2014) ... (written by) - Dog Dean Afternoon (2013) ... (written by) - My Heart Will Go On (2011) ... (written by) - Mannequin 3: The Reckoning (2011) ... (written by) - You Can't Handle the Truth (2010) ... (story) / (teleplay) But Bobo is writing the Cain episode so I'm excited for that.

I think Dean slaughtering regular humans is always supposed to be disturbing (#Thinman and last night). Since the opening of the Devil's gate at the end of S1, they've made it clear that the demons were riding the humans hard. And it got worse when Lucifer rose. The abject lesson Ruby taught them was one loose demon kills many. So kill unless the are trapped and they can take the time AND they think the person is still viable. Most times the conditions aren't meant. So, I've sort of got desensitized to those deaths. But regular humans should not be killed. They aren't the law, they are monster hunters. Which brings me back to my question earlier: how are they going to clean up that crime scene and what are they going to do with Claire (who knows about the deaths). This really was a mess. If it was Dean, he's put Sam in the dungeon and re-apply purified blood or something. At the end of the day, I know there's enough "gray" in the situation that we the audience are able to move past it. Not just because they were assholes but because it was 5 to 1 and they were threatening Dean. Original recipe Dean would have likely used less deadly force but MoC Dean? That kick to the head was like the dinner bell -- it wants to be sated.

Excellent insights rue721, about Dean becoming what he's afraid of. I need this now too.

I wish I had a nickle for every time something like this happened when the should have known better.

I think Dean is setting himself up to die. Big time. It feels like he's saying goodbye, slowly.

Actually, it's not the writers at all. It's the promo monkeys. They probably thought it was cool and primitive or something.

Thanks for the video! Personally I thought it was an excellent scene at the bar. But I could see how it could have been written more maudlin or sappy. Honestly, when Cas directly asked them if they loved their father, it was like a record scratch moment and I held my breath. Only Cas could ask them that question and get an answer. I thought how they answered it was perfect. I could see how it may have been a longer answer in the original script. OTOH, it's possible that the story of the time in New York was more sappy. Or they made a bigger deal out of Deans feelings regarding the creepy stuff. I can see them tightening that up too. Whatever they did, I thought it was effective in showing three thing: - your parent has to be your parent and not your friend - teens will typically not be always obedient and kind to their parent - you still love your parents (in most cases) even if it's it always great. I presume that was the message Dabb wanted and I think they delivered it. On another topic: they really left a potential shit ton of evidence plus a major crime scene. First, Cas illegally took Claire from the transition place. Dustin knows they were looking for Claire. And there are 5 bloody bodies and NO Claire. Why would there not be a nationwide manhunt? Is Cas going to have to clean up that scene? I supposed they could have Cas put Claire to sleep and dispose of the bodies. But there are 5 bodies and the trunk is not that big. Then they have two rooms full of evidence. And so many places that they were at where people might ave seen them. I just don't know how they get out of this one without causing trouble.

Yes. Possessed?