MatildaMoody

I believe the harridan in question was Brandi.

I kind of love that she calls him Harry Hamlin. In my mind, I hear Angela Chase rhapsodizing over Jordan Catalano.

Are we talking about in real life or on the show? Because IRL Yo was posting photos of herself working out at the gym 3 weeks post explant surgery. That would definitely mean that she was improving rather than declining. I may have missed this, but my understanding was that Brandi claimed Mo told her that directly and LisaV was a witness. Both LisaV and Mo deny this though and last I heard were being called to either be deposed or testify in legal proceeding.

I have been rewatching episodes from Season 1. While I thought Camille was a great villain that season, she now seems more obnoxious and arrogant than downright evil. But, I am also remembering why I had such an intense dislike of Kyle, and it had very little to do with Kim. There was something about Kyle that was just so organically mean girl. I had so much fun snarking on her and the nostalgia has been overwhelming. What I especially liked about Season 1 was how just how stunning Lisa VanderPump was in a lot of her scenes. She wasn't nearly as made up as she is now and I miss that. Plus, Paul. I really liked Paul.

I love LisaV. I have loved her since season 1. That said, I am not blind to her faults. I know that she is just as shady as the other women on the show. The thing that I like about her is that she still manages to come out the other side strong - sure she is showing more and more battle scars at this point - but she still comes back strong and keeps it moving. That being said, I also love LisaR and Eileen. I like LisaR's upbeat attitude and that she was such a shameless fan of the show before she ever got offered the gig. I like Eileen, because seriously? Kristen was the best character ever and I love that she has no shame about her dated fashion and unwillingness to spend money just because of labels. What I don't like is the perception that I as a LVP fan I am not aware of her shortcomings. I read a lot of blogs recapping the show (shameless plug: Please read Ronnie Karem's recaps at TrashTalkTV! Yes, he is a friend of mine, but he is also HILARIOUS), and I hate when certain bloggers assume that just because I am a fan of LVP, I do everything I can to defend and minimize her behavior. I feel like as a fan, I can also clearly see where she is the wrong. I find it offensive to my intellect that there is an assumption that as a fan, I believe she can do no wrong. I can list plenty of times when I thought that she was in the wrong, but I can also still love the fact that she played it just right. All of these women have publicists, PR staff, and most likely, at least one person helping them out with their Social Media accounts. They are all trying to manipulate the image they portray to the audience. Just because I respect the way LVP uses her resources to stay relevant on this show, and keep her other show, and manage her business interests, doesn't mean I am a blind worshiper at the feet of LVP. I like that when LVP feels wronged she may resolve the issue and move on but not be as trusting of the person she felt wronged her. I don't think that is holding a grudge so much as being smart. She is strategic, which many people label manipulative. I get it. But, I have always felt that the only thing she manipulates is her own television image. The other women, complete with their publicists, PR staff, and possible social media helpers, have the same ability and just never use it to their advantage. I don't think that automatically makes LVP more manipulative than the other women, it just makes her savvy enough to use the resources at her disposal in the right way. I love and respect that about her. When it comes to Eileen and Rinna, I think that they both believed they could do the same thing since they have both navigated Hollywood for years. Rinna thought that she could leverage her friendship with Kyle and LisaV, and Eileen thought that she could leverage her friendship with Rinna and her burgeoning friendship with LisaV to keep them both from looking bad. The problem is that they both jumped the gun. They each had a moment on camera when they felt like they had said too much. They both went into an immediate mode of "how is this going to play out when the season airs?" So, they both started trying to find a way to make it more about LisaV being manipulative than they did about letting things drop so as not to give them more life. I think that Rinna was initially fine and saw no malice in any of the conversations she had with LisaV and Kyle. But, as she got more and more uncomfortable with the idea that SHE was the one who brought Munchies on camera, her perception of all of those conversations she participated in seemed more and more sinister. I think that Eileen was uncomfortable talking about how she and Vince got together on camera, but not enough to actually say so until she stewed on it for a few days. I think that while she was stewing on it, she imagined how the conversation would play out when she addressed it with LisaV (haven't we all done this before?) and didn't get the response she wanted and so she kept stewing and each time she met with LVP she got more and more angry - at herself at first - for accepting the initial apology and again not speaking up when it was actually happening - and then later as LVP refused to play into it she started projecting that on the LVP. I think both reactions are reasonable. They are the kind of responses that I have dealt with most of my life. In Eileen's case, I can name at least 50 instances where I personally wish I had spoken up in real time about how uncomfortable I was rather than stewing on it. In Rinna's case, I can also identify with having hung myself out on a limb and realizing that the people I thought were my cohorts were watching me dangle rather than getting a ladder. In Rinna's case it is weird because she actually saw LVP and Kyle defend her to Yolanda and seemed to express gratitude for it in her blog in real time, only backtrack (while still trying to own her behavior) on her blog as we enter the last part of the season. Also, Rinna is no stranger to reality television, so it seems weird to me that she feels she was manipulated when she knows that they are all being manipulated by production and their off camera alliances. This isn't to say that I think Rinna is lying or that I think she was actually manipulated by LVP. I think Rinna made a conscious decision to bring up Munchies on camera in the hopes that it would be similar to her asking Kim point blank if she was drunk or high in the limo. She came into the show completely familiar with the players and even being friends with a lot of them. She knew Kyle for years and defended Kyle about limo-gate when she appeared on WWHL before she was ever a cast member. One of the reasons I used to love seeing her as a guest on that show was because she called out everyone's bad behavior as a fan would. I just think in this instance of Munchies she took it to a level that neither Kyle or LVP ever expressed any interest in going, and then realized why they wouldn't go there after the fact. I think if there had been prior discussions about Munchies with Kyle and LVP, Rinna would have said so in her blog after "The M Word" aired. Instead she takes full ownership of what she said and that she had discussed it with her hairdresser. Does anyone else think that there is actual footage of that conversation somewhere? I mean if they filmed her getting her ass waxed, they most likely filmed her getting her hair done too. In short, I don't want either LisaR or Eileen to leave the show. I really hate that they are getting so much backlash, mainly because as LVP supporter, I get grouped in with people who think LVP can do no wrong. In a perfect world, I would love to see all of the women minus Yolanda come back next season. Even though, I don't feel like we have gotten to know Ericka, I have a sneaking suspicion that she and LVP would have been friends if she weren't so closely tied to Yo's view of things. And I would like to see that relationship develop with out Yolanda there. I would like to see Rinna having fun with LVP and Kyle - separately or together. While I find Kathryn boring, I think we could see more of her shady side in the way she immediately played runtelldat on Ericka to LVP. I also like the fact that she seems to be the only woman on the show who realizes that any two people are going to remember the same situation/conversation differently - especially as time passes. Sorry for the rambling post, I just wanted to get that off my chest before bedtime.

This is the funniest part of that whole mess to me. Rinna came to LisaV and Kyle saying she had been involved in a conversation about Munchies. That conversation could have ended there. It may have ended up only being a "lost footage" clip if it had been left there. But, Eileen told Yolanda about it before Rinna ever said anything to Yo. Then Eileen told Rinna she needed to go and talk to Yo about it. LisaV admits she also told Rinna that if she was so bothered she should talk to Yo. But, the fact that Eileen blew up Rinna's spot and then told Rinna to discuss it with Yo, is so much more manipulative to me. Both Eileen and Rinna have said that they leaned on each other outside of filming. Eileen claims that she knew all about the "bring Kyle into it" from the jump. To me, this feels much more like Eileen manipulating the 4th wall than LVP pushing Rinna to discuss something she wasn't comfortable with on camera. This whole thing takes me back to the Amsterdam trip. The morning after that big dinner blow up, Rinna seemed shell shocked. She apologized to Kim and pretended that Kim also apologized to her and then just wanted to get some "retail therapy." Eileen basically asks Rinna why she made up with Kim - knowing full well that they were stuck in a foreign country with an unstable addict (well two actually) and that the whole "make up with Kim" thing was production influenced. I suspect, and this is just my speculation, that Eileen was already aware that Rinna was going to make up with Kim because of production, but asked her that on camera to either put her on the spot re the 4th wall, or to get Rinna to rant a bit about Kim. And, I only say that because I do suspect that Rinna spent a good deal of time after that dinner ranting to Eileen about Kim. I think the two of them made a pact this season to support the other no matter where the story line took them so as to avoid awkward situations like the scene they had in Amsterdam. I suspect Eileen dealt with a lot of ravings from Rinna about Yo, Kim, Munchies, and the LisaV/Kyle alliance and Eileen wanted some of that to come out on camera. The problem was that they weren't always coordinated on when some of Rinna's ravings would come to light while on camera. The party where LisaR dismisses Ericka's assertion that LVP is a sniper from the side, and the conversation they had on the beach both seem to show some shock on Eileen's part that Rinna hadn't gotten the memo about what they agreed to when it came to supporting each other. Eileen was so disappointed when Rinna said "Ericka doesn't even know Vanderpump" at that party. And she was also shocked when Rinna said that Yo was the most manipulative of all of the women during their beach conversation. What's weird about all of this ridiculousness is that I actually Like Rinna, Eileen, and LisaV. I have an on again off again with Kyle (there are times when I am totally on her side, and times when I actually yell at the television for her to stop being so awful), but I love the fact that she is on this show because she is just so fun to snark on.

This was one of the very early conversations that Kyle had with Yolanda and Ericka. It was the conversation where Yolanda revealed the non-Gigi's were also diagnosed with Chronic Lyme.

Yes, Kyle did. And when Kyle offered up her own experience with depression, Yolanda dismissed it as her disease being more than "just depression" as though depression weren't a serious illness.

I want to mention one thing about this. Obviously no one "forced" LisaR to go and confess to Yolanda, but she was prompted to do so by Eileen. Does anyone else remember that initially, Eileen told Yo about the Munchhausen talk before LisaR had a chance to talk to Yo about it? Then, Eileen told Rinna that she should "clear the air" with Yolanda to make sure she understood that it was just that she engaged in a convo and felt guilty about it? LisaR brought up Munchies all on her own, but the fact that it has continued to play out over and over again has Eileen's fingerprints all over it.

I don't know if it is true that LVP doesn't make mistakes on camera. During that particular conversation you could actually see that she was uncomfortable with the questions and was trying to minimize her responses. She knew she was making a mistake and couldn't control the narrative. LVP is controlling when it comes to how she portrays herself on screen and in that instance, you could see that she knew she was losing control of the conversation was doing her best to shut it down. She even resorted to her standard onscreen defense mechanism of "jokingly" saying, "don't make me come over there" because she really knew that she had said too much and didn't want to have to explain what she said or elaborate on it. I don't think it is really about LVP not making mistakes on camera. I think she has a way of minimizing her mistake by shrugging it off, or making a joke out of the situation to keep it from escalating into something that she can't control. Because, the one thing that Lisa truly does manipulate is her television persona. She can tell a housewife "well if it bothers you so much you should bring it up" or as she did with Taylor in season 1, tell the HW they need to "sort it out." That doesn't mean she is manipulating the other HW's - they are still free agents to do what they want and control their own onscreen narrative. But, she is trying to manipulate her own image when it comes to fans. And that is what I think the other HW's resent. They most likely think that LVP's fans feel that she can do no wrong - remember when Brandi tweeted that LVP could barbecue babies and people would still love her? LVP's fans see her and her flaws, and they still admire and love her. What the other HW's don't see is that even though her fans love her and will defend her, they also see her flaws and call her out on them on Social Media. But, LVP is smart enough to take that feedback from her fans and apply it to her next blog post, or reunion, or season. The other HW's want her to have a massive fan backlash - not realizing that she has had plenty of them because their own backlashes have been so painful while hers has never gotten her down. In other words, when LVP makes a mistake on camera, she usually recovers gracefully enough for her fans to find a plausible reason to still love her and the other HW's haven't figured out how to do that. Kyle finally seems to get it and that is why, IMO, she is not trying to make herself a victim of LVP the way that Eileen and LisaR are demanding. Kyle has finally figured out what is most important when it comes to which fights she wants to be a part of. For her, LVP trying to control her image on the show is not some major thing - because she knows that is what is happening. I think that is why Kyle didn't back down at all with her questioning LVP about what Mo said. And I also think that is why she thinks that Eileen and LisaR are being ridiculous. LisaR may say that she has "known" LVP for 26 years, but Kyle has filmed with her long enough to KNOW how LVP operates and she not only understands it she has learned from it. How much do you want to bet that Kyle finds a way to call LVP out while still continuing to be her friend? And how much do you want to bet that she is going to defend LVP at the reunion? Kyle is finally learning how to play the HW's game LVP style. It's funny, I am one of the minority who actually really likes LisaR. But, I am totally with LVP on this. LisaR is trying to spin as fast as she can because she was trying to second guess audience reaction. She thought people would be pissed that she was questioning a "sick" person, and started to worry that her own truth cannon was going to cause some fan backlash, so she tried to backtrack and make it someone else's fault. Then, she tried to backtrack to make Kyle take her side against LVP.

This is the exact opposite of what Lisa Rinna is stating in her blog.

I'm loving the actual baby - Nicky Hilton - in her photo with Rick James. She has such a WTF look on her face. As for Kim, from the rest of the photos, she definitely seemed to be partying. I have always wondered if the reason Kathy has always brushed Kim's addictions under rug was because she was a huge factor on Kim's habit. Kathy and Rick were pretty obvious in their partying, but they both seemed to pull back from it and treated it like a fad that had gone out of favor.

Do you mean the pictures found here: Kathy Hilton's 1984 Birthday Party

While I also don't see the big deal in missing Ericka's dinner party. It is more than just her having good and bad days. Yolanda has said that she was so sick prior to the wedding that she had problems getting the last minute prep done the night before. The Dutch version of the Housewives shows none of that to be the case. Her story about when she got sick whether it was prior to the wedding or just after the wedding also changes depending on whether she is giving a speech or giving an interview. At the time that Yolanda says she was diagnosed and had been unable to do much of anything, we saw her doing a very strenuous workout with a trainer so that she could stay in shape and make her marriage last twice as long as David's second marriage. At the time that Yolanda claimed she was only at 40% brain function and hadn't driven a car for over a year, we saw her leading a scavenger hunt that included driving a car, running around LA, and chastising LisaR for being greedy because she ordered a chocolate shake instead of vanilla and making LisaR drink the entire thing by her self. We also saw her fly to Amsterdam and ride bicycles all over the city. That would have been a good time to suggest that she has good days and bad days as it could have proven that statement. We saw her doing the scavenger hunt, but she was too tired to join the women after that dinner from hell in Amsterdam - where she lay in bed lecturing Kyle on how she should be there for Kim. Then there was the fact that she has instagram photos of her at the gym 3 weeks after her explant surgery, only for her to say that she hadn't been to the gym in something like 3 years. Some of this can be excused as good versus bad days or "running out of spoons", but it is her own timeline that makes her sound so ridiculous and suspect. It is like Kim changing the number of days she was in the hospital 5,7,9. In Kim's case, it is reasonable that she wouldn't remember because of her substance abuse. In Yo's case, where she is tracking everything through Instagram, Interviews, and film footage, makes less since even if you factor in "Lyme Brain".

Actually, the Chinese government has been trying to crack down on this celebration for a while now and Social Media is helping the cause. I won't post links because they are too disturbing, but the numbers of dogs that have been tortured and killed, have decreased tremendously because of the information being put out there on Social Media.

Which is why Eileen should not have interrupted LVP's conversation to inject her past into the conversation in the Hamptons. And which is also why she should have stopped the direction of the conversation once she felt the questions were getting too inquisitive and making her uncomfortable. And it is also why she should have simply either accepted LVP's first apology or not. We can compare Eileen to Kim all we want, but IMO, Eileen had plenty of opportunities to avoid her and Vince's relationship origins. Eileen interjected her past into a conversation that she wasn't a part of and then was uncomfortable but said nothing about it until later. And once she did say something about it, she didn't get the response she wanted (how often does anyone ever get the response they want when it comes to an apology?) and now she refuses to let it go. She could teach LisaV a thing or two about holding grudges.

Nope, Brandi just reads Ronnie Karem's recaps is all. Ronnie has joked about Lisa Rinna wearing wigs for a couple of years now.

I don't want to quibble, but I think Kim Fields probably has more name recognition even if it is just from her days playing Tootie. But, yes I don't judge Eileen on how she and Vince got together. Things happen and she was at least up front for her part. I could also see her being uncomfortable being asked multiple questions about it from a tipsy coworker on television. What I don't understand is why she didn't simply say to said coworker that she wasn't comfortable talking about it as it was a part of her past and not really relevant anymore. I also don't understand why she didn't accept Lisa's first apology and say something like, "you are right, I should have said something to you at the time." or, "I feel like that was a shitty thing to do and I may need some time to deal with it." More importantly, I don't understand why she insists on bringing up this uncomfortable matter over and over again - especially after saying they were good. Either say "no, I am not ok with it, I will need some time before I am comfortable around you." or "yes, we are good" and leave it at that.

That is the Camille I want back on the show. She had no self awareness at all and truly thought that she was going to "win" at being the ultimate BH housewife. That is reality tv gold right there. Her recent Twitter rant about Kelsey - while in bad taste - was totally the Camille that I believe sobered Kelsey up and got his money right through real estate. Yes, she will always have the "kinder, gentler" angle working, but she can't help herself. More importantly, looking back on season 1 Camille, she was the kind of villain this show needs. Or, and this is what I think is what would really happen if she came back, she would be the one with no fucks to give when it came to setting the record straight. One thing I really liked about season 2 Camille was that she never let any of the other women dictate her story. When Taylor was trying to drag Camille into her mess, Camille called her out on it. When Adrianne tried to get Camille to say that LVP sold stories, Camille said, she had been told the same thing but knew they said it to everyone. When Brandi said that Adrianne was suing her, Camille said it never happened, and she did it all over Twitter. That is the Camille I would love to see come back. Because you know she will inundate us with real estate porn, and still *TRY* to stay humble, but she won't be able to hide her true self. And, considering what we have seen in the 5 seasons since Camille's debut, that would be a welcome change.

I agree with most of this. But, I do think that LisaV was into Ericka Jane. She has been much more welcoming to Ericka than she has been to any prior newcomer. The two seemed to enjoy each other. I think Lisa wanted to become friends with her and was open to it. I think even after Kathrine told Lisa what Ericka said, Lisa wasn't really that put out about it. She asked Ericka about and still seemed to enjoy her company afterwards. I think the disconnect between them is coming on the trip to Dubai though.

I am so confused. What do Kyle and LisaV have to do with Ericka and her son? The situations are not in the least bit comparable. Isn't the whole point of this thread for us to judge Ericka? I am not personally passing judgement on her about this (yet) because I don't know the details, but I do think that it is totally fine for people to look at her differently now that she has put this out there as part of her Reality Persona. I mean if we can snicker and make fun of the other wives in their respective threads based on what they put out to the public, shouldn't we be able to do the same with Ericka? I judge Ericka on the fact that she never comments in the moment and only saves it for her talking heads - I think it is a cowardly move. Doesn't mean that I don't judge the others for their behaviors either.

So, if Lisa had paid for a different vet to come out and look at the horse and they found that the horse would need to be put down because of other issues or because the limp would get worse, what then? How does this in any way make her a hypocrite for championing a different animal rights cause?

But, every newbie in every franchise who actually makes a mark with the group gets asked this at some point. It is part of the deal. it's how they establish their dynamic with the group. Brandi was asked how long she knew both Cedric and Adrienne by different members of the cast, and no one thought that someone was trying to use that to discredit her in anyway. Kelly and Luann were questioned about how long they knew each other on New York. Heather was asked how she and Tamra knew each other (and WE all knew that was a fake friendship). It only becomes a big production when the person asked the question makes a big deal out of something that they knew they were going to be asked at some point during filming. Does anyone have any doubt that Ericka wasn't expecting to be asked how long she and Yolanda knew each other? I feel like Ericka was the one that tried to manipulate that random throwaway moment into something malicious and Machiavellian, not the other way around.

I could buy this if Yolanda hadn't rebuffed the efforts LVP made to see her in the off season. Sounds like LVP reached out to her several times to see if she was up for a visit and each time Yolanda declined. We know that Kyle did make the efforts to go see Yolanda once filming began, but it also seems that Yo really didn't want LVP to show up for her and show support so much as she wanted to be able to complain about LVP "not being there" for her.

Tom was telling the table that he wanted to be a lawyer because he loved watching Perrry Mason growing up. Lisa asked if he actually went to law school or if he got all of his legal expertise from watching Perry Mason. It was a quick little joke and Tom seemed to get it, but Ericka was immediately "Of Course he went to law school." Like there was a single person at that tablet who actually thought that Tom wasn't a real lawyer.