S03.E09: Chapter Forty-Four: No Exit

[WhosThatGirl]

1 hour ago, Diapason Untuned said:

I dunno, when the town's ruler is the one running a rival gang, avoiding trouble sounds like a good move. In any case, the rest of the Serpents either managed to obey or do crime quietly. The two people who don't need to do crime were the ones causing trouble by thumbing their noses in Hiram's face and leaving calling cards.

 

Yeah. I’m sorry but Cheryl and Toni were beyond awful this episode. I mean honestly Cheryl is bad and clearly always has been and always will be and only slows loyalty to people she can gain things from(in the case of toni it’s affection and love so itll be interesting to see how Toni fares when/if they break up)  but Toni is surprising. Not only that she was along for the ride with Cheryl robbing and not doing a thing but also that she sold out Fangs secret drug dealing to Cheryl and then allowed Cheryl to announce that at the meeting as a bargaining chip. 

Maybe the show had it right when they first introduced her and in her second or third episode she made a move on Jughead ten seconds after his breakup with Betty. She’s terrible. It doesn’t help that I’m not a fan of the actresss either.

And I get that people like that the two female  lgbtq characters aren’t picture perfect but what they did in the last episode was pretty insufferable. And it bothers me that Bughead gets crap just for being on screen. If they did half of what Choni did last night, people would be mad that they weren’t killed off. Sorry, facts.

Also yeah I feel bad for now hoping there’s a Choni breakup in the future. I want to see Toni what does after that. I don’t think there will be unfortunately. I think RAS is too scared to break up that pairing. And now I’m assuming there’s going to a “Choni vs everybody” thing and I’m going to wish that I didn’t have a need to watch live so I can fast forward.

Edited January 18, 2019 by WhosThatGirl

[HunterHunted]

I feel like I was the only one howling when Betty and Sierra McCoy were trying to brainstorm to find a way around the Sister's religious vow of silence. When they discovered that the Sister's hadn't been affiliated with their previous church in 60 years, I guffawed because that still wouldn't necessarily invalidate their religious vow of silence and more importantly there's already a "vow of silence" built into our constitution. It's called the 5th amendment. It allows you to not testify about things if you believe you'd incriminate yourself. The Sisters would definitely be incriminating themselves if they testified. This show can be so dumb sometimes. It honestly would have been a bigger kicker if the Sisters seemingly went along with Betty's plan and then got up on the stand and plead the 5th. 

One of the biggest problems with this show is that they're trying too many genres at once. This season is mostly gothic horror, but we still have massive diversions from this with the gang war stories of the Serpents, Ghoulies, Gargoyles, and dueling Lodges. On top of that, there is still an ongoing vein of pulpy exploitation with most of Archie's prison plot and the flashbacks of people sort of tweaking while playing G&G. Tonally, it's a mess.

American Horror Story, which has its own problems, tries and mostly succeeds in having a single style each season or least it did in earlier seasons. Marvel is even more successful at switching styles: Winter Soldier is a 70s style political thriller, Spider-Man: Homecoming is a John Hughes-ian 80s comjng of age comedy, Ant-Man is a heist film, and Guardians is filled with a group of Han Solos and slightly reformed rogues. But the show that is best able to switch styles and genres every season is Archer. It started as a spy show. It managed to have a couple early divergences with space and under sea adventure stories. They then had a Miami Vice/Scarface inspired season, a noir inspired season, and another set in a pre-World War II South Pacific.

It's the inconsistency of the execution that's killing Riverdale.

[WhosThatGirl]

8 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

I feel like I was the only one howling when Betty and Sierra McCoy were trying to brainstorm to find a way around the Sister's religious vow of silence. When they discovered that the Sister's hadn't been affiliated with their previous church in 60 years, I guffawed because that still wouldn't necessarily invalidate their religious vow of silence and more importantly there's already a "vow of silence" built into our constitution. It's called the 5th amendment. It allows you to not testify about things if you believe you'd incriminate yourself. The Sisters would definitely be incriminating themselves if they testified. This show can be so dumb sometimes. It honestly would have been a bigger kicker if the Sisters seemingly went along with Betty's plan and then got up on the stand and plead the 5th. 

One of the biggest problems with this show is that they're trying too many genres at once. This season is mostly gothic horror, but we still have massive diversions from this with the gang war stories of the Serpents, Ghoulies, Gargoyles, and dueling Lodges. On top of that, there is still an ongoing vein of pulpy exploitation with most of Archie's prison plot and the flashbacks of people sort of tweaking while playing G&G. Tonally, it's a mess.

American Horror Story, which has its own problems, tries and mostly succeeds in having a single style each season or least it did in earlier seasons. Marvel is even more successful at switching styles: Winter Soldier is a 70s style political thriller, Spider-Man: Homecoming is a John Hughes-ian 80s comjng of age comedy, Ant-Man is a heist film, and Guardians is filled with a group of Han Solos and slightly reformed rogues. But the show that is best able to switch styles and genres every season is Archer. It started as a spy show. It managed to have a couple early divergences with space and under sea adventure stories. They then had a Miami Vice/Scarface inspired season, a noir inspired season, and another set in a pre-World War II South Pacific.

It's the inconsistency of the execution that's killing Riverdale.

I mean yeah... this show is all over the place and that shows in Che stories but I’ve come to accept it. I think season one was the only liner season and a lot of that has to do with how it was 13 episodes. It works better as a short season show. 

I assume that somehow all the stories and plots are going to be connected but I wouldn’t be surprised if they drop a plot and then pick it up it again five episodes towards the end of the season ala last season. I asked a few pages back isn’t half the town playing the game still it are we just not going to mention that? Jughead and the serpents were playing and Kevin Reggie and started to play.

So are they still playing? Not to mention I’m pretty sure Kevin and Moose were shown to be doing jingle jangle in 3x08, they were making out and moose asked Kevin if he wanted another hit. This to me implied they we’re doing drugs. I assume we will venture back to that. Or not.

[secnarf]

Not gonna lie, when Archie started his "vision quest" I nearly stopped watching. This show is ridiculous. It's passing the point of being ridiculous in a good way.

[rmontro]

Is it wrong that I'm almost hoping that Archie is really dead?  My suspicion is that he is going to send back word to Riverdale somehow that he is dead, and that will lead to certain circumstances and allow him to sneak in and accomplish whatever he needs to accomplish with Hiram to make it safe for him to return again.

I'm a little bugged about Veronica developing a relationship with Reggie.  Mainly because I do NOT want Archie and Betty to end up having a romance.  I like Jughead with Betty too much, and I like Betty too much to see her with Archie, who I just can't warm up to.

The other thing that bugged me is does it seem likely that Veronica's speakeasy is going to be able to pay enough to gainfully employ all those Serpents?  Supposedly they all needed money, are they going to be able to be paid enough to support them?  I'm not sure the economics work out here.  I did enjoy them popping out and surprising the Gargoyle Gang though.

[WhosThatGirl]

12 minutes ago, rmontro said:

Is it wrong that I'm almost hoping that Archie is really dead?  My suspicion is that he is going to send back word to Riverdale somehow that he is dead, and that will lead to certain circumstances and allow him to sneak in and accomplish whatever he needs to accomplish with Hiram to make it safe for him to return again.

I'm a little bugged about Veronica developing a relationship with Reggie.  Mainly because I do NOT want Archie and Betty to end up having a romance.  I like Jughead with Betty too much, and I like Betty too much to see her with Archie, who I just can't warm up to.

The other thing that bugged me is does it seem likely that Veronica's speakeasy is going to be able to pay enough to gainfully employ all those Serpents?  Supposedly they all needed money, are they going to be able to be paid enough to support them?  I'm not sure the economics work out here.  I did enjoy them popping out and surprising the Gargoyle Gang though.

Yeah. I don’t want Barchie to ever happen(I think it will at some point) and I too think betty can do better than Archie. I never see any romantic spark between them. Sometimes I can see their friendship but even then I can’t even see that sometimes. I’m not even sure why Betty liked him. That’s just me though.

Im meh on Veggie. I really hope it isn’t happening just because the actors happen to be dating in real life, I know there’s source material because of the comics but I do have to say before this season Reggie and Veronica did not like each other one bit the last two seasons and then all of a sudden they’re best friends and now there’s a romance. I have to side eye that.

Also I know some people are excited about this thing with the serpents protecting the speakeasy being a bromance for Reggie and Jughead but how long can that last? One Reggie and Jughead have never been friendly, in fact most of their moments before this season was like them almost fighting and two once Veggie becomes public or everyone finds out, Archie is Jugheads best friend, hopefully there’s loyalty there towards that pairing.

I still can’t get over the lack of any sort of reaction scene with Alice and her sending Betty to the sisters. I know I write about it all the time but it’s really messed up. I get that they sped up how many weeks it’s been so of course we couldn’t get Jugheads initial reaction but all the same, no one even had a line about it. It was all about Betty having to find homes for the other kids. But nothing about having to deal with her nutcase of a mother who sent her there. Like what the hell? This really is just another example of the writers writing something that they throw in there dramatic effect without thinking of the end part of it and hoping we forget about it, but not realizing it’s actually a big deal. It’s a big deal Alice sent Betty there. Betty shouldn’t be staying in her house with her. Betty should be filing out Emancipation papers. But no. We’re just going to ignore it and Alice is hell about all the kids and then send them off to the farm because they need new members anyway so win-win. For her. Seriously.

Again I know people enjoy the evilness of a character but it would be nice if one of the characters(besides Archie) could have at least one decent parent. And Archie gets two of them actually! Betty already has a psycho serial killer father, it would be nice for her to have a decent mother. It’s not really fun to continue to watch her mother ruin her life as well.

Just like how Veronica May have won this round with her father but I fully expect him to have the upper hand by next weeks episodes end. Again it’s not really fun to watch people climb up a mountain only to keep falling and I feel like that’s the plan as long as Hiram is around. They won’t ever win and after a while that gets kind of tired.

[rmontro]

20 minutes ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Im meh on Veggie. I really hope it isn’t happening just because the actors happen to be dating in real life, I know there’s source material because of the comics but I do have to say before this season Reggie and Veronica did not like each other one bit the last two seasons and then all of a sudden they’re best friends and now there’s a romance. I have to side eye that.

I like this show, but that's one thing about it.  It's wildly inconsistent.  Things appear one way for a few episodes, and then a few episodes later everything is switched around.

"Barchie" sounds about right for their ship name because it sounds like barf.

By the way, I forgot to add I didn't care for Cheryl and Toni being sexy cat burglars.  I know Cheryl is a villainous character (much of the time), but the show almost seemed to be suggesting there was something cool about what they were doing, and there isn't.  Even with the cat ears.

[WhosThatGirl]

23 minutes ago, rmontro said:

I like this show, but that's one thing about it.  It's wildly inconsistent.  Things appear one way for a few episodes, and then a few episodes later everything is switched around.

"Barchie" sounds about right for their ship name because it sounds like barf.

By the way, I forgot to add I didn't care for Cheryl and Toni being sexy cat burglars.  I know Cheryl is a villainous character (much of the time), but the show almost seemed to be suggesting there was something cool about what they were doing, and there isn't.  Even with the cat ears.

I agree with all this. And yeah the Cheryl and Toni scenes were.. something. I think we were supposed to enjoy it, find it sexy and super cool and sweet because they said I love you. When it annoyed the hell out of me(even before Jughead called a meeting and said stop doing illegal things and they kept doing it), it bugged because Cheryl’s stupid line “stealing from the rich and giving. It to us..” and her hee hee laughing like isn’t that so fun? Look at all these fun things we don’t need while we live it up In my mansion and that gang were both in, yeah let’s let sleep in tents because screw them! Yeah.. Cheryl’s so awesome, you guys.

Edited January 19, 2019 by WhosThatGirl

[PeekaBoo]

3 hours ago, rmontro said:

I like this show, but that's one thing about it.  It's wildly inconsistent.  Things appear one way for a few episodes, and then a few episodes later everything is switched around.

"Barchie" sounds about right for their ship name because it sounds like barf.

By the way, I forgot to add I didn't care for Cheryl and Toni being sexy cat burglars.  I know Cheryl is a villainous character (much of the time), but the show almost seemed to be suggesting there was something cool about what they were doing, and there isn't.  Even with the cat ears.

I'm feeling you there! I love this show, I really do, I finally am just taking a step back and let all the crazy come on its own but the pace and inconsistency, I mean, they can do better than that! 

2 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I agree with all this. And yeah the Cheryl and Toni scenes were.. something. I think we were supposed to enjoy it, find it sexy and super cool and sweet because they said I love you. When it annoyed the hell out of me(even before Jughead called a meeting and said stop doing illegal things and they kept doing it), it bugged because Cheryl’s stupid line “stealing from the rich and giving. It to us..” and her hee hee laughing like isn’t that so fun? Look at all these fun things we don’t need while we live it up In my mansion and that gang were both in, yeah let’s let sleep in tents because screw them! Yeah.. Cheryl’s so awesome, you guys.

Gah, booh Cheryl! Really!

You know what she's doing now will soo bite her in the ass at one point! Despite Toni being TOO silent and pussy-whipped, I think there will come a point where she'll have enough and will have to put a stop to this! 

[WhosThatGirl]

I don’t know about Toni. She’s awful now too. One for telling Cheryl about Fangs and allowing Cheryl to sell him out. Some serpent loyalties there for all of her talk about serpent blood. I am so hoping for a Choni breakup when Toni has nowhere to go. Sorry, not sorry.

[PeekaBoo]

1 hour ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I don’t know about Toni. She’s awful now too. One for telling Cheryl about Fangs and allowing Cheryl to sell him out. Some serpent loyalties there for all of her talk about serpent blood. I am so hoping for a Choni breakup when Toni has nowhere to go. Sorry, not sorry.

If and when that should happen, you know sp and fangs will welcome her back in. They are her true family/friends. Now that's being part of a Serpent. 

[WhosThatGirl]

4 hours ago, PeekaBoo said:

If and when that should happen, you know sp and fangs will welcome her back in. They are her true family/friends. Now that's being part of a Serpent. 

She should have to have some repercussions. She allowed Cheryl to treat her family pretty bad. 

[PeekaBoo]

1 hour ago, WhosThatGirl said:

She should have to have some repercussions. She allowed Cheryl to treat her family pretty bad. 

Yeah.... she should.... but this is riverdale! If alice is able to get away with what she did, what toni did is nothing. 

[WhosThatGirl]

3 hours ago, PeekaBoo said:

Yeah.... she should.... but this is riverdale! If alice is able to get away with what she did, what toni did is nothing. 

Yeah, I’m still super bothered by nothing happening to Alice and no one even mentioning it. To me it’s because it’s they realize they wrote themsleves into a corner with it and don’t know how to mention it because it shows Alice is truly awful and for some reason we can’t just dismiss Alice as an awful parent the way we can with others. I mean whatever but it’s really bad writing.

[HunterHunted]

On 1/18/2019 at 11:44 PM, rmontro said:

I like this show, but that's one thing about it.  It's wildly inconsistent.  Things appear one way for a few episodes, and then a few episodes later everything is switched around.

The first season was great, in part because it was only 13 episodes long as @WhosThatGirl said. The other reason is because the writers and showrunners understood the genre they were playing in better. That genre was 50s Douglas Sirk-ian melodrama. It was a little bit Splendor in the Grass and East of Eden with modern plots and meta awareness grafted on top of the genre. And it worked because of Archie comics nostalgic arrested development in the 50s.

I think their current trip down gothic horror boulevard is still solidly within the wheelhouse of what the show can pull off. However, it's also clear that the show does not know what it's doing with its mob and gangland stories. Unsurprisingly, the hey day for those stories was the 1930s and the 70s and 80s. Even when the films are made in the 90s or aughts, they are still usually set in the 30s, 70s, or 80s. This does not square up with the aesthetic of Riverdale so there's a major disconnect when they tried to execute it.

I think they might be able to pull off some of the homages to public morality propoganda films and pulpy exploitation despite the golden ages of those genres being before (morality films in the 30s and 40s) and after (exploitation and grindhouse in the 70s) Riverdale's sweet spot is fantasy 50s. The reason why is because these film genres explicitly reference a sort of idealized time or normalized version of America and for much of American pop culture that's the 50s. However, this show needs to be so much more deft or conversant in film and tv language to be able to pull off the genre shifts.

The other thing is that they can't keep superficially focusing on two sets of parents (Coopers and Lodges) to the detriment of the others. FP is busy being the improv comedy of parents; he's all "yes and" to everything with absolutely no story of his own. And that's one of the biggest issues with this show. They make the parents do things that impact the kids and the larger world, but there is no real exploration of why the parents do the things they do or any of their interior life.

When you look at some of the best teen dramas of all time, the parents and adults frequently had their own storylines that never really involved the kids and were often resolved without the kids. We knew the adults motivations; they had their own agency that never involved their children. Friday Night Lights, Gossip Girl, the OC, Gilmore Girls, Veronica Mars, Everwood, and others frequently had large story arcs with the adult characters. The Vampire Diaries did that and it actuality deepened Damon's character by giving him a bunch of adults to care about and battle against.

We get a LOT with the Lodges and Coopers, but it's so shallow and superficial. If they're going to devote so much time to them, they need give it some teeth and substance. Hiram is just this mustache twirling shithead doing monstrous things for...reasons. The show doesn't think enough of Hiram to deepen his characterization.

Spoilers for Young Justice Outsiders

Spoiler

I just watched this episode of Young Justice: Outsiders that was an exploration of the motivations of Vandal Savage. He is one of the big bads for most of the series. Because it's a superhero genre show, you just assume his goals are world domination, which they are to an extent. However, this episode explored his history and motivations. He's experienced 3 massively cataclysmic world ending events in his life. They've shaped what he's done and how he thinks. All of them were extraterrestrial. The first was a meteor that made him immortal and increased his intelligence. The second was an alien parasite that took almost all of his and most of the resources of the known world to defeat. The last was an alien warlord bent on conquering Earth and Vandal manages to intrigue the warlord enough that the warlord postpones his effort to conquer earth. After that Vandal spends thousands of years consolidating power and secretly manipulating the resources and culture of earth so that it's ready to take on the warlord when he comes back. So he comes across as cruel and ruthless, but it's because he's the only person alive who knows what their real challenge is. Yes he's an arrogant asshole who could share the burden with more people, but doesn't. However at the end of 24 minutes, you get a better understanding if where the bad guy is coming from. It's still monstrous, but also a little sad and slightly sympathetic.

Edited January 21, 2019 by HunterHunted

[Richness]

Everyone seems to be getting upset over their favorite ship either being broken or formed, the horrible out of character turn for their favorites, or the continued glossing over of past actions. That's still just the usual bat shit crazy hot mess this show wallows so gloriously in. However, I'm rather taken aback by two very dark issues presented in this episode, murder and suicide, as the path to redemption/improvement.

 

Telling Archie to kill the enemy that ruined his life was bad enough, but it was infinitely worse to tell him to kill himself/worst qualities. Sure, it was within the context of very poorly written storyline with a preposterous set-up, but it doesn't change the fact that's what was presented. The only good thing about this is that he killed off his naive, stupid self with a baseball bat in Neegan style. While someone might not be able to end their own life with a baseball bat, it doesn't mean they won't try another method, say cutting it out. Regardless, the show was being horribly irresponsible to send either message to the highly impressionable and emotionally troubled teens that watch this show.

[WhosThatGirl]

29 minutes ago, Richness said:

Everyone seems to be getting upset over their favorite ship either being broken or formed, the horrible out of character turn for their favorites, or the continued glossing over of past actions. That's still just the usual bat shit crazy hot mess this show wallows so gloriously in. However, I'm rather taken aback by two very dark issues presented in this episode, murder and suicide, as the path to redemption/improvement.

 

Telling Archie to kill the enemy that ruined his life was bad enough, but it was infinitely worse to tell him to kill himself/worst qualities. Sure, it was within the context of very poorly written storyline with a preposterous set-up, but it doesn't change the fact that's what was presented. The only good thing about this is that he killed off his naive, stupid self with a baseball bat in Neegan style. While someone might not be able to end their own life with a baseball bat, it doesn't mean they won't try another method, say cutting it out. Regardless, the show was being horribly irresponsible to send either message to the highly impressionable and emotionally troubled teens that watch this show.

I mean I don’t think we’re supposed to be looking at this show to be that deep but I liked your comment because you are right. The show pretty much insinuating killing themsleves is something. 

The murder aspect I have to just let go because from the beginning this show has been about murder. And the teen characters have always been at the center or suspected of it. Both Cheryl and Jughead were considered suspects  for killing Jason. So yeah.. while these things weren’t true, the show has always made it something. 

Not to mention whatever the hell Dark betty was and how this show presented that as a way of dealing with things. 

So yeah this show has had many problematic storylines for how they have the teens deal with the problems. Because yeah while this show is fantasy,  I agree with you some of the choices they have the teens make do have real life attributes that teenagers could do.

Thats why I as an adult don’t focus too much in that. If I did, I wouldn’t be able to watch the show at all. I do 100 percent get what you are saying but like I said this isn’t the first time they’ve had a teenager character make a choice to deal with something that has real life consequences if a teenager did it in real life and that they could possibly do in real life.

Edited January 20, 2019 by WhosThatGirl

[galax-arena]

It's nauseating how the show loves writing Betty and Jughead as the milky white saviors of the downtrodden. First Jughead's the Serpent King, and now Betty's the Griffin Queen? And everyone just mostly steps in line, unless they're an antagonist. And Betty's also sitting in on legal/prosecutorial meetings between Attorney McCoy and the Sisters of Mercy? Whatever you say, show. 

And now Cheryl and Toni are cat burglars, because of course they are. LMAO. Honestly as much as I hate Jughead in his masturbatory Serpent King role, Cheryl really did deserve to get kicked out for being such a goddamn idiot with her calling card. I just don't like how Toni got wrapped up in it; the optics of the white boy kicking out a WOC from a gang with POC roots are not good. But this show has always been a racist mess on that front anyway, and Toni's characterization completely fell by the wayside by the time she became Cheryl's gf.  

Veronica & Sexy Squidward finally hooked up. Okay. 

Betty just walks completely alone into the building to discover mass suicide by nuns. Sure. 

Edited January 21, 2019 by galax-arena

[HeatLifer]

1 hour ago, galax-arena said:

It's nauseating how the show loves writing Betty and Jughead as the milky white saviors of the downtrodden. First Jughead's the Serpent King, and now Betty's the Griffin Queen? And everyone just mostly steps in line, unless they're an antagonist. And Betty's also sitting in on legal/prosecutorial meetings between Attorney McCoy and the Sisters of Mercy? Whatever you say, show. 

Yeah, I can’t lie. That’s one of the most ridiculous angles of this show...that anyone would follow anything Jughead or Betty do. Although it reminds me of a theory a fan had on social media: Riverdale, its players and all that jazz, is basically a  story written by Jughead. I totes see it.

Edited January 21, 2019 by HeatLifer

[WhosThatGirl]

I get what the two above posts are saying but I really dislike the so much hate Betty and Jughead hate. That’s just how I feel.

That said the did ruin the Toni character but honestly imho opinion they’ve ruined her from the very first moment we met her when she was clearly introduced as a foil for Bughead. Even before the episode with her Kissing Jughead it was clear that the show was testing the waters for her to be bugheads obstacle. And then when they finally allowed her and Cheryl to become a thing she stopped having any sort of character development. And now we’re here. Where she allows Cheryl to treat her serpent family like trash.  That’s why I’m really hoping for a Choni breakup(and this is coming from someone who shipped Choni). I want to see Toni get a repercussion for her choices. I doubt she will, hell Alice isn’t getting any for sending Betty to SOQM so thinking Toni will is hilarious thinking on my part.

[methodwriter85]

Toni really does seem like she's there to be Cheryl's Mammy and kept girl all in one.

[Mabinogia]

15 hours ago, HeatLifer said:

Yeah, I can’t lie. That’s one of the most ridiculous angles of this show...that anyone would follow anything Jughead or Betty do. Although it reminds me of a theory a fan had on social media: Riverdale, its players and all that jazz, is basically a  story written by Jughead. I totes see it.

At this point, the only interesting ending to this would be if they do reveal that the whole show has been Jughead fanficing his own life and none of this really happened. 

[WhosThatGirl]

8 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

At this point, the only interesting ending to this would be if they do reveal that the whole show has been Jughead fanficing his own life and none of this really happened. 

I know some people want this to happen, I don’t. I do think the ending will be that it was all Jugheads book but I don’t want the ending to be that it was all fake and not reality, that means that certain relationships never happened and that makes me kind of sad.

[HeatLifer]

1 hour ago, Mabinogia said:

At this point, the only interesting ending to this would be if they do reveal that the whole show has been Jughead fanficing his own life and none of this really happened. 

His fanfic would counter their boring/Pleasantville-like reality. It would be interesting to see a twist like that revealed, to say the least.

[Moxie Cat]

I love the shot of all the teenagers sitting around a '30s-style club, absolutely transfixed by one of their classmates singing old standards. Without alcohol. Yep.

Was this the first episode where we heard the name of the club? They said Belle Nuit over and over in this one, and I can't remember hearing it before.

[secnarf]

3 minutes ago, Moxie Cat said:

I love the shot of all the teenagers sitting around a '30s-style club, absolutely transfixed by one of their classmates singing old standards. Without alcohol. Yep.

Was this the first episode where we heard the name of the club? They said Belle Nuit over and over in this one, and I can't remember hearing it before.

La Bonne Nuit - and I think they mentioned it in the episode where the bar made its debut? I feel like I had heard it before.

[WhosThatGirl]

2 minutes ago, secnarf said:

La Bonne Nuit - and I think they mentioned it in the episode where the bar made its debut? I feel like I had heard it before.

Yes they mentioned it in the episodes debut. But I had heard it before when CM and LR we’re doing a fan event, they said the name.

[SourK]

On 1/18/2019 at 10:50 AM, PeekaBoo said:

Hmmm... wouldn't like the us government or the fbi or you know someone realize how many murders there has been in a short amount if time in a small american town and find it strange?

Maybe that's the real reason for the quarantine. The rest of the world was just like, "No. Riverdales stay in Riverdale. That place is too insane."

On 1/19/2019 at 4:19 PM, HunterHunted said:

FP is busy being the improv comedy of parents; he's all "yes and" to everything with absolutely no story of his own. And that's one of the biggest issues with this show. They make the parents do things that impact the kids and the larger world, but there is no real exploration of why the parents do the things they do or any of their interior life.

FP and Being a Serpent are the great, turbulent love story of this show. When he's a serpent, he doesn't want to be one, and when he's not a serpent, he wants to be one. They break up, they get back together, they break up again. Is he still on parole? Is he still not allowed to associate with gang members? If so, it's a forbidden turbulent love story.

[WhosThatGirl]

That’s interesting you bring up FP and his feelings about the serpents. I’m not sure if it’s like a lot of this show, being terribly inconsistent or if it is a conscious choice for FP to have feelings like this.

Jughead sort of goes though it too. He didn’t want to be a serpent then he did and he was excited when FP got out of jail and told him he was stepping down as king and thinking he would be the king and then FP didn’t retire. Granted FP started drinking again as well but I think Jughead was disappointed he wasn’t going to be king. And each and every time Jughead has been on the outs with the serpents in some way, he goes to extremes to prove himself to them, even though he really wanted nothing to do with them. 

So maybe it’s a trait that both the Jones have. They both wanted nothing to do with the serpentsat first  and when they are in it they both seem agitated by it and when they’re out or in the fringes, all they want is back in.

[jay741982]

On 1/21/2019 at 2:33 PM, Mabinogia said:

At this point, the only interesting ending to this would be if they do reveal that the whole show has been Jughead fanficing his own life and none of this really happened. 

I've been saying the ending of the series will probably be that life in Riverdale is more like the tamer Original comic book source but with a few Exceptions like Him and Betty are very much together same with Archie and Veronica and some of the really crazy shit like this seasons storyline and Betty's dad being a Mudering Psycho, Archie Banging his teacher, Veronica's parents being essentially Mobsters etc are stuff he created for a book he wrote which is a best seller. He created all the really batshit stuff cause real life isnt exciting enough 

On 1/21/2019 at 2:43 PM, WhosThatGirl said:

I know some people want this to happen, I don’t. I do think the ending will be that it was all Jugheads book but I don’t want the ending to be that it was all fake and not reality, that means that certain relationships never happened and that makes me kind of sad.

Like I said they can easily reveal that he and Betty are together just that their lives arent  filled with Batshit crazy stuff 

Edited January 23, 2019 by jay741982

[WhosThatGirl]

30 minutes ago, jay741982 said:

I've been saying the ending of the series will probably be that life in Riverdale is more like the tamer Original comic book source but with a few Exceptions like Him and Betty are very much together same with Archie and Veronica and some of the really crazy shit like this seasons storyline and Betty's dad being a Mudering Psycho, Archie Banging his teacher, Veronica's parents being essentially Mobsters etc are stuff he created for a book he wrote which is a best seller. He created all the really batshit stuff cause real life isnt exciting enough 

Like I said they can easily reveal that he and Betty are together just that their lives arent  filled with Batshit crazy stuff 

I like this theory. I would very much like some things to be fake and some to be real.