Law & Order: Criminal Intent - General Discussion

[WendyCR72]

On 8/20/2020 at 12:56 PM, peacheslatour said:

There was a moment when he made one of his weirdo remarks and she didn't react and he goes "Eames would have gotten it." Classic Goren.

I think that was during Goren's meltdown in "F.P.S." with some callback to Wally Stevens in "Probability" the season before. I recall there was a line that some court records of the Stevens case were downloaded or leaked or something and it somehow tied in (CI was pretty decent at callbacks!)

That's when Goren got uptight and stated how "Eames would have known." (Then proceeded to throw a ball of wadded-up paper at her empty chair.) Goren also had fun with Judd Hirsch's racist newspaper editor in "Pravda" in front of a crowded restaurant. As they were walking away, Bishop told Goren how she didn't enjoy that and he was all, "Really? Eames would've."

And yeah, Wheeler did not show up 'til Season 6. Eames did her surrogacy in Season 3, when Bishop filled in.

[peacheslatour]

Quote

That's when Goren got uptight and stated how "Eames would have known." (Then proceeded to throw a ball of wadded-up paper at her empty chair.) Goren also had fun with Judd Hirsch's racist newspaper editor in "Pravda" in front of a crowded restaurant. As they were walking away, Bishop told Goren how she didn't enjoy that and he was all, "Really? Eames would've."

That's the scene I was referring to.

[WendyCR72]

10 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

That's the scene I was referring to.

I liked the scene when Goren was at the computer and wasn't scrolling fast enough for Bishop and he was all, "Do you want to scroll? Eames likes to drive, so she drives..." and Bishop declines.

[peacheslatour]

I'm watching Anti-Thesis right now and I must say I love Goren when he is being effete. The little scene in the fancy show store with he and Eames pretending to be some rich, trust fund assholes warmed my cold. black heart.

[WendyCR72]

10 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

I'm watching Anti-Thesis right now and I must say I love Goren when he is being effete. The little scene in the fancy show store with he and Eames pretending to be some rich, trust fund assholes warmed my cold. black heart.

My favorite scene from that episode, as I have said before. Goren/Eames as the yuppie couple cracked me up. Loved Goren shoving the ankle boot back at the sales guy when Eames pooh-poohed that style.

[balmz]

on reddit someone mentioned this episode on ci

 

there was an incapacitated 10yr old boy who was smothered by his older teen sister who was fed up and desperate to get her family life back together. I think he had a brain injury in a skiing accident, and his health issues and CP and TBI took oved the entire family dynamic and changed everything, the parents refused to hire a nurse or home health aide and put the older teen sister in charge.....it was abuse to her to ask her to parent while the parents were at work, and she just snapped one day

what episode was that, fairly new to the series

[Broderbits]

2 hours ago, balmz said:

what episode was that, fairly new to the series

That sounds like the episode entitled "Burden", from original Law & Order, not Criminal Intent. The only CI episode I can think of with a young incapacitated family member is "Wrongful Life", and the plot of that is totally different since she doesn't die and her sibling doesn't resent her at all.

[Xeliou66]

4 hours ago, balmz said:

on reddit someone mentioned this episode on ci

 

there was an incapacitated 10yr old boy who was smothered by his older teen sister who was fed up and desperate to get her family life back together. I think he had a brain injury in a skiing accident, and his health issues and CP and TBI took oved the entire family dynamic and changed everything, the parents refused to hire a nurse or home health aide and put the older teen sister in charge.....it was abuse to her to ask her to parent while the parents were at work, and she just snapped one day

what episode was that, fairly new to the series

This was definitely not a CI episode - it sounds similar to the Mothership episode Burden except in that episode it turned out the boy’s doctor was the one who suffocated him and the sister didn’t do it. So it could be Burden, or it could be from another crime show. 

[Gramto6]

8 minutes ago, Xeliou66 said:

This was definitely not a CI episode - it sounds similar to the Mothership episode Burden except in that episode it turned out the boy’s doctor was the one who suffocated him and the sister didn’t do it. So it could be Burden, or it could be from another crime show. 

I thought the doctor poisoned him with hemlock. I just watched this a couple days ago and already forgot about the smothering part of the death...Covid brain...

[Xeliou66]

6 minutes ago, Gramto6 said:

I thought the doctor poisoned him with hemlock. I just watched this a couple days ago and already forgot about the smothering part of the death...Covid brain...

Yes that’s right the doctor did poison him with hemlock, I thought he was suffocated as well but he might not have been. It’s been a while since I’ve seen that full episode. 

I’m not sure what episode the poster above is referring to, Burden sounds similar but it could be another crime show entirely.

[Broderbits]

18 minutes ago, Xeliou66 said:

it turned out the boy’s doctor was the one who suffocated him and the sister didn’t do it.

As I recall she was briefly considered a suspect, so the original Reddit poster may just have been confused. Some of these L&O episodes go through suspects like Kleenex!

[balmz]

huh interesting, thanks for the answers

[Xeliou66]

31 minutes ago, Broderbits said:

As I recall she was briefly considered a suspect, so the original Reddit poster may just have been confused. Some of these L&O episodes go through suspects like Kleenex!

Yes the sister was suspected, so it definitely could be Burden the poster was thinking of. 

 

21 minutes ago, balmz said:

huh interesting, thanks for the answers

No problem, I’m an expert on the L&O franchise, having seen every episode multiple times, so I’m always willing to help others with finding an episode. 

[WendyCR72]

Yeah, that description doesn't match anything on CI. As mentioned, I think "Wrongful Life" and "Inert Dwarf" were the only episodes to feature disabled people and nothing like that happened to either.

It does sound like "Burden" from the Mothership, but as other shows tackle similar material, it's hard to say.

[WendyCR72]

After all the years on the MyNetwork schedule, I guess people are not only NOT tired of CI, the ratings must be enough for more! The 2020-2021 schedule has it remaining on Thursday nights, but only one episode (Dateline takes the 8:00 p.m. Thursday slot), but it will also now air on Fridays from 8:00 p.m. to 10:00 p.m. (Although in my area, the blocks are broken up for an early news at 9 from my local NBC affiliate, so it'll be the usual 8 to 9, then 10 to 11!)

Still, the show must still generate $$$ for this change. (SVU remains on Mondays.)

The only show to exit the schedule is CSI: Miami (which previously held the Friday slot).

Here is the 2020-2021 MyNetwork schedule.

 

[peacheslatour]

After watching umpteen million cop shows in my life, Alex Eames is the only cop who, when she says "I'm sorry for your loss" comes across as sincere.

[WendyCR72]

1 hour ago, peacheslatour said:

After watching umpteen million cop shows in my life, Alex Eames is the only cop who, when she says "I'm sorry for your loss" comes across as sincere.

Kathryn Erbe is a good actress. If you can, check her out in the Homicide: Life On The Street episode, "All Is Bright" from Season 6. She played a woman named Rita with AIDS (and the makeup job was disturbing but effective) given to her by a boyfriend that knew he had the disease but never told her on purpose. She was great there.

Ironically, her episode aired only a week after the episode, "The Subway", featuring VDO as a man who either slipped or was pushed [pretty much pushed, and by the actor, Bruce McVittie, who was the perp, Arnie, in "Semi-Professional" on CI in S1 and played the corrupt judge in the S7 episode, "Courtship" with Steve Guttenberg] into a subway track and faced certain death. Of note, "The Subway" even got a BTS featurette and won a Peabody. It was a disturbing episode, but good.

[peacheslatour]

5 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

Kathryn Erbe is a good actress. If you can, check her out in the Homicide: Life On The Street episode, "All Is Bright" from Season 6. She played a woman named Rita with AIDS (and the makeup job was disturbing but effective) given to her by a boyfriend that knew he had the disease but never told her on purpose. She was great there.

Ironically, her episode aired only a week after the episode, "The Subway", featuring VDO as a man who either slipped or was pushed [pretty much pushed, and by the actor, Bruce McVittie, who was the perp, Arnie, in "Semi-Professional" on CI in S1] into a subway track and faced certain death. Of note, "The Subway" even got a BTS featurette and won a Peabody. It was a disturbing episode, but good.

I've heard nothing but good things about H:LOTS. I can never find it. Will I have to watch it online?

[WendyCR72]

Well, @peacheslatour, it'll be a blind buy, but IMO, worth it. But Amazon has the entire series here. There is one left here on eBay for $20 less.

[WendyCR72]

By the way, last tangent, but Robin Williams also did a memorable turn on HLOTS in S2. Original Law & Order did some crossovers, so the resolutions to some of those can only be found on these DVDs as, for some reason, only the L&O parts are ever televised.

[peacheslatour]

33 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

By the way, last tangent, but Robin Williams also did a memorable turn on HLOTS in S2. Original Law & Order did some crossovers, so the resolutions to some of those can only be found on these DVDs as, for some reason, only the L&O parts are ever televised.

He was chilling in SVU as well.

[zoey1996]

I just found this on Peacock (free with my cable subscription).  I always liked it; just watched S1:E1; looking forward to more.

[WendyCR72]

6 hours ago, zoey1996 said:

I just found this on Peacock (free with my cable subscription).  I always liked it; just watched S1:E1; looking forward to more.

Yep, all 10 seasons!  😊 It's also free on Peacock itself [i.e. not through cable].

[coffee drinker]

I am a CI junkie!  I've watched all 10 seasons several times on WE.  I am not a fan of the Jeff Goldblum/Saffron Burrows seasons.  The acting was fine, the stories were horrible, imo.  Was glad Vince and Kathryn returned for that final season.  But even then, the stories were bad.  

I just recently learned that Oscar Isaac did an episode of CI before gaining his breakthrough in the Star Wars movies.  I don't the name of the episode, but it's the one involving voodoo with Sherrie Saum as the villian.  It was a Logan/Barek episode.  

 

[Broderbits]

27 minutes ago, coffee drinker said:

I just recently learned that Oscar Isaac did an episode of CI before gaining his breakthrough in the Star Wars movies.  I don't the name of the episode, but it's the one involving voodoo with Sherrie Saum as the villian.  It was a Logan/Barek episode.  

It was "The Healer" from season 5. I always thought Oscar Issac's breakthrough was "Inside Llewyn Davis", plus a lot of other stuff he did way before the Star Wars spin-offs.

[WendyCR72]

6 hours ago, coffee drinker said:

Was glad Vince and Kathryn returned for that final season.  But even then, the stories were bad.  

Aww, I loved Season 10. "The Last Street In Manhattan" was my favorite from that season.

[WendyCR72]

Did we know that Courtney B. Vance is the current SAG-AFTRA president? (I didn't.) He paid tribute to the late Chadwick Boseman.

[Dirtybubble]

On 7/24/2020 at 7:53 PM, Xeliou66 said:

I’ve said before one of my biggest pet peeves with this show is how Goren would point out something on the body in the morgue that Rodgers had apparently missed, it made no sense and was just done to make Goren look even smarter - there’s no way a thorough and competent ME like Rodgers would’ve missed this stuff, but they made it like they needed Goren to do the job. Happened several times throughout the show and it drove me nuts. 

Something similar is happening now in an episode I'm currently watching,  Ill-bred (the horse episode)  Detective Goren went thru this whole ordeal about pointing out how the names on the white board had been rearranged for the morning ride.  Why in the hell did Goren feel it necessary to point out that he could see certain letters had not been fully erased so he could see who was in last position.  The guy was sitting right there, he could have told you in 2 seconds who and why the names were rearranged.  There was no need for Bobby to waste his time and breathe pointing out the obvious.   Not to mention anyone that could read could clearly see the names had been changed. 

[WendyCR72]

14 hours ago, Dirtybubble said:

Something similar is happening now in an episode I'm currently watching,  Ill-bred (the horse episode)  Detective Goren went thru this whole ordeal about pointing out how the names on the white board had been rearranged for the morning ride.  Why in the hell did Goren feel it necessary to point out that he could see certain letters had not been fully erased so he could see who was in last position.  The guy was sitting right there, he could have told you in 2 seconds who and why the names were rearranged.  There was no need for Bobby to waste his time and breathe pointing out the obvious.   Not to mention anyone that could read could clearly see the names had been changed. 

One scene I do like from that episode is when G/E meet with that prisoner in Wallkill Prison as G/E list all the perks the guy had when caring for Mariah and how he lost them when the horse went missing. At some point, Goren made a neighing sound and it cracked me up. Also liked his little exchange with Eames:

Goren: "That would piss me off,. Wouldn't it piss you off?"

Eames: "That would piss me off."

And the whole car exchange and the rolling tire Goren sets in motion to distract the dirty vet as G/E search his car and Alex remarking how even she can read his facial expression.

Funny how the whole episode was about a horse that the viewer never even saw!

Someone here before said the younger black female vet in the episode is Chris Noth's wife.

Ironically, the actress (Bronwen Booth) playing the horse owner who had the affair with Paige's dim hubby is an accomplished horseback rider! I thought she looked familiar waaaay back when this aired originally, then I recalled she started on soaps on One Life To Live in the early 1990s (and had longer hair you can see in this soap magazine article about horseback riding).

[Jaded]

On 9/1/2020 at 12:17 AM, WendyCR72 said:

Did we know that Courtney B. Vance is the current SAG-AFTRA president? (I didn't.) He paid tribute to the late Chadwick Boseman.

He's president of their foundation while Gabrielle Carteris is still the SAG-AFTRA president.

[WendyCR72]

9 hours ago, Jaded said:

He's president of their foundation while Gabrielle Carteris is still the SAG-AFTRA president.

Whoops! Didn't know there were two separate things. Thanks, @Jaded!

[WendyCR72]

Besides the Law & Order franchise trifecta on Peacock, the old '80s cop show, Hunter, is also streaming. And a young Tony Goldwyn (Frank Goren), even before Ghost!, was in an episode from Season 4 in 1988, the very episode prior to the finale, called, "Murder, He Wrote".

Efrem Zimbalist, Jr. (of Remington Steele -where his daughter was the female lead! - and 77 Sunset Strip fame), was playing Goldwyn's character's father.

And as an aside, Goldwyn's hair here is the epitome of the '80s: King of longish and poufy!

[WendyCR72]

Just stumbled upon the show on WE now. Been a while since it has been on in late night. Right now, it's S4 and "Death Roe" is on with Tommy the homicidal chef.

[Xeliou66]

21 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

Just stumbled upon the show on WE now. Been a while since it has been on in late night. Right now, it's S4 and "Death Roe" is on with Tommy the homicidal chef.

That episode is one of the most chilling, like I’ve said before - Tommy was a complete sociopath, one of the worst monsters in the entire L&O universe IMO - brutally killing 2 innocent people all so he could keep his daughter to himself and keep raping her, what a piece of shit. Great episode though, Goren was at his best in it and Tommy was quite a compelling villain. The thing that bugs me about the episode, like I’ve said before, is Duke and his wife and how they apparently either had no clue about how evil Tommy was and that he was abusing Beatrice or they knew/had an idea and did nothing, I couldn’t figure them out. And Duke’s wife apparently never told anyone about Tommy assaulting her. I wonder what their reaction was when Tommy’s crimes were exposed? 

As I’ve said before, season 4 took a turn into the weird, dark, creepy and twisted - it was a really good season but a lot of the episodes were extremely dark, strange and weird. 

[WendyCR72]

5 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

And Duke’s wife apparently never told anyone about Tommy assaulting her. I wonder what their reaction was when Tommy’s crimes were exposed? 

I got the impression Duke's wife was petrified of Tommy. They did try to help Beatrice by taking her in, but as the wife said, she was a bad influence on their own kid. And without proof that Tommy was molesting his own daughter, maybe the wife figured there wasn't much else she could do.

She did tell Alex about her own assault when Alex mentioned helping Beatrice again. And as the wife said, Duke really did think Tommy was innocent. So I can only imagine - especially if everything spilled out - that he would be furious and maybe feel like a fool for trusting Tommy at all. Duke and the wife actually seemed like decent people.

[Xeliou66]

9 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

I got the impression Duke's wife was petrified of Tommy. They did try to help Beatrice by taking her in, but as the wife said, she was a bad influence on their own kid. And without proof that Tommy was molesting his own daughter, maybe the wife figured there wasn't much else she could do.

She did tell Alex about her own assault when Alex mentioned helping Beatrice again. And as the wife said, Duke really did think Tommy was innocent. So I can only imagine - especially if everything spilled out - that he would be furious and maybe feel like a fool for trusting Tommy at all. Duke and the wife actually seemed like decent people.

Yeah Duke and his wife seemed decent but I was just puzzled as to how Duke had no idea how evil Tommy was and why Duke’s wife never said anything about Tommy assaulting her - they both should’ve had an idea that Tommy was abusing Beatrice, especially the wife after Tommy assaulted her, but they did nothing, and Duke seemed convinced Tommy was a good guy, and Duke’s wife seemed to have no issue with Duke still working with Tommy. Those dynamics just puzzled me a bit, since like I say both seemed decent but neither did anything about Tommy. 

[WendyCR72]

On 9/8/2020 at 1:55 PM, Xeliou66 said:

Yeah Duke and his wife seemed decent but I was just puzzled as to how Duke had no idea how evil Tommy was and why Duke’s wife never said anything about Tommy assaulting her - they both should’ve had an idea that Tommy was abusing Beatrice, especially the wife after Tommy assaulted her, but they did nothing, and Duke seemed convinced Tommy was a good guy, and Duke’s wife seemed to have no issue with Duke still working with Tommy. Those dynamics just puzzled me a bit, since like I say both seemed decent but neither did anything about Tommy. 

Maybe with his celebrity status (I get the feeling Tommy was supposed to be an Emeril type or something as G/E talked about books, etc.), Duke's wife (as Duke was oblivious) figured it would be "he said, she said" and she couldn't fight all his lawyers and money.

[WendyCR72]

So, I was watching the Oxygen crime channel and there was an episode from Prescription For Death about a former pharmacist named Robert Courtney, sentenced in 2002, for diluting cancer drugs for massive profit! I guess Criminal Intent capitalized on this case rather quickly, then, since "Malignant", the episode this appears based on, aired in November 2002.

Assuming it was this case because the similarities were right on target.

For the record, Courtney was sentenced to 30 years.

[peacheslatour]

I just finished watching Shandeh and Con-Text. Apparently Goren did the post-mortems for both episodes himself. Was their budget so tight they couldn't afford Leslie Hendix's salary?

[WendyCR72]

14 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

I just finished watching Shandeh and Con-Text. Apparently Goren did the post-mortems for both episodes himself. Was their budget so tight they couldn't afford Leslie Hendix's salary?

Linda Lavin was appropriately cold and creepy in "Shandeh". As for "Con-Text", that one was just STRANGE. Rodgers became a quasi-regular, I'd say, starting around...S6. Before that, sometimes she'd show, other times we'd get the exposition fairy about the results, as was the case here.

"Baggage" comes right after, I think. And this is a case where fantasy topped reality as, at least, the murderer in the fictitious case was caught (hi, Keith!), but the case of the woman it was based upon, Susan Taraskiewicz, has never been solved.  😞

[Xeliou66]

Yeah Rodgers didn’t appear as often in the first couple of seasons - she only appeared 3 times in season 1. Rodgers added a lot to the show, as we were talking about on the Mothership forum, she had a lot of charisma and really added to the show, I’m glad she became almost a regular on CI in its later years. 

[WendyCR72]

Oh, good. The second MyNetwork episode is the start of S10! (For some reason, they show that season rarely.)

[WendyCR72]

For those that may have Peacock to stream Law & Order: Criminal Intent (or anything else!) and a Roku, a deal has been reached. You can now add Peacock via the Roku Channel Store to your Home screen.

[Dirtybubble]

11 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

For those that may have Peacock to stream Law & Order: Criminal Intent (or anything else!) and a Roku, a deal has been reached. You can now add Peacock via the Roku Channel Store to your Home screen.

Loaded the app on my Roku last night!  I am a happy little clam; now I don't have to clog up the DVR with L.O. C. I. episodes.  I can get my Goren fix anytime I want 😃

Besides I've been hesitant to buy the entire series on dvd/bluray--too expensive

[WendyCR72]

13 hours ago, Dirtybubble said:

Loaded the app on my Roku last night!  I am a happy little clam; now I don't have to clog up the DVR with L.O. C. I. episodes.  I can get my Goren fix anytime I want 😃

Besides I've been hesitant to buy the entire series on dvd/bluray--too expensive

Since bonus material (an alternate dead Nicole scene as one - yay!) stopped after S4 (I believe - been some time since I dug out my DVDs!), you're not missing much not having the DVDs.

[Xeliou66]

1 hour ago, WendyCR72 said:

Since bonus material (an alternate dead Nicole scene as one - yay!) stopped after S4 (I believe - been some time since I dug out my DVDs!), you're not missing much not having the DVDs.

There are a couple of deleted scenes I really like - one being the dead Nicole ending to Great Barrier, I really really wish the Nicole storyline had ended there, if it had it would’ve been much more bearable and a lot less ridiculous. The other deleted scene that comes to mind that I love is the scene with the always awesome franchise psych expert Dr Skoda in Tomorrow, it was really nice to have a scene with him where he helped shed light on the nannies motivations, it’s too bad Skoda only appeared in that scene and in season 1’s Crazy on CI, there were plenty of cases where they could’ve used his insight on this show.

[WendyCR72]

2 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

There are a couple of deleted scenes I really like - one being the dead Nicole ending to Great Barrier, I really really wish the Nicole storyline had ended there, if it had it would’ve been much more bearable and a lot less ridiculous. The other deleted scene that comes to mind that I love is the scene with the always awesome franchise psych expert Dr Skoda in Tomorrow, it was really nice to have a scene with him where he helped shed light on the nannies motivations, it’s too bad Skoda only appeared in that scene and in season 1’s Crazy on CI, there were plenty of cases where they could’ve used his insight on this show.

Yeah, I remember you telling me about the Dr. Skoda deleted scene before. Saw it and wished it was kept in! Especially since CI often seemed like it was off on its own island and sort of disconnected from the franchise.

[Xeliou66]

12 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

Yeah, I remember you telling me about the Dr. Skoda deleted scene before. Saw it and wished it was kept in! Especially since CI often seemed like it was off on its own island and sort of disconnected from the franchise.

Agreed - no idea why they cut it, it was great to see Skoda in another episode and the scene did a lot to help shed light on the psyche and motivations of the 2 nannies. 

I loved whenever they had crossover appearances from the different characters and that’s something CI never did enough of - aside from ME Rodgers of course, CI rarely had crossover appearances. They could’ve used more appearances from psych experts like Skoda and Olivet. 

[peacheslatour]

11 minutes ago, Xeliou66 said:

Agreed - no idea why they cut it, it was great to see Skoda in another episode and the scene did a lot to help shed light on the psyche and motivations of the 2 nannies. 

I loved whenever they had crossover appearances from the different characters and that’s something CI never did enough of - aside from ME Rodgers of course, CI rarely had crossover appearances. They could’ve used more appearances from psych experts like Skoda and Olivet. 

Man, I wish I had seen that. I saw that episode last week and all I could think of was the Papin sisters of France who killed their employer and her daughter. I would love to know more about their motives. Also I thought the actress who played Hannah was amazing.

[Broderbits]

3 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

Also I thought the actress who played Hannah was amazing.

That was Merrit Wever, she's always good.