Twin Peaks - General Discussion

[Aethera]

This topic replaces the old Twin Peaks forum which has been vaulted at the location below:

http://forums.previously.tv/forum/634-twin-peaks-v/

[Pete Martell]

Peggy Lipton has passed away. 

https://www.latimes.com/entertainment/movies/la-me-peggy-lipton-dead-20190511-story.html

I think this sweet just about says it all for me.

 I loved her work as Norma - so much of the show's style and emotional underpinnings came from her work. It was criminally underrated work and so true to the noir spirit that the best of Peaks exuded.

My two favorite Norma scenes, aside from her reunion with Ed, were when she disowned her mother, and her car scene with Ed in FWWM, where you feel like you were there with them, enjoying that stolen moment.

(it's about 2 minutes and 50 seconds in)

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Laura Dern discusses her movie Trial by Fire:

[Pete Martell]

This makes me feel so sad 😞

[Pete Martell]

Ray Wise and Sheryl Lee convention appearance.

https://ilovesplatter.com/2019/06/22/crypticon-2019-sheryl-lee-ray-wise-twin-peaks-interview/

[WAnglais1]

I just finished S3. I have no idea what to say. I watched in on Blu-ray and some scenes were so dark, I couldn't see a darn thing. Just sound. Was it supposed to be like that? I feel like I wasted 18 hours or so. I've been told, "You need to watch it two or three times to get it." I don't have that kind of time. 

And still, the season ends with Audrey in some kind of peril. 

Edited August 12, 2019 by WAnglais1
Added a sentence.

[Affogato]

23 hours ago, WAnglais1 said:

I just finished S3. I have no idea what to say. I watched in on Blu-ray and some scenes were so dark, I couldn't see a darn thing. Just sound. Was it supposed to be like that? I feel like I wasted 18 hours or so. I've been told, "You need to watch it two or three times to get it." I don't have that kind of time. 

And still, the season ends with Audrey in some kind of peril. 

I think GOT taught us that the settings on your tv can make a huge difference. Still, some scenes were very dark. I still hope to see it in a theater some day. 

Edited August 13, 2019 by Affogato
Spell

[Bastet]

Did anyone like the revival season?

Because I finally re-watched the original series and movie, and, wow, I'd forgotten just how off the rails it went.  No one I know who watched season three as it aired liked it, and the Blu-Ray of it is ridiculously expensive, so no way I'm springing for that, and I'm not even sure if I want to spend $17 on the DVD at this point.

As bad as things got, though, the "Who Killed Laura Palmer?" batch of episodes are really great.  I had forgotten so much, but who did it being one of the few things I did remember did not at all lessen my enjoyment watching it all unfold the second time around.

My favorite thing about the series, that existed all the way through, is the relationship between Dale Cooper and Harry Truman.  I love that they never once went down the tired road of friction between local law enforcement and the FBI (like they did in the movie, to a ridiculous degree with the deleted scene of a fistfight), that Sheriff Truman was happy to have him there from jump and Agent Cooper was charmed by the town and population.  I mean, I enjoyed Miguel Ferrer's character coming in and complaining about everyone and everything, too.  But I love that the fundamental relationship of the show is one of professional cooperation that quickly grows into friendship.  

So that Michael Ontkean isn't in the revival is one of my  hesitations about it.  (That Lara Flynn Boyle is also absent thrills me, though - she bugged!)

I'm sure curiosity is going to win out and I'm going to want to see it, even if I wind up not liking it any better than my friends did.  But it's disconcerting how universally disliked it was among them, so I'm curious if the same holds true here or I just have a particularly negative circle of viewers in my life.

Edited August 25, 2019 by Bastet

[Fable]

14 hours ago, Bastet said:

I'm sure curiosity is going to win out and I'm going to want to see it, even if I wind up not liking it any better than my friends did.  But it's disconcerting how universally disliked it was among them, so I'm curious if the same holds true here or I just have a particularly negative circle of viewers in my life.

You can always visit the original forum that has been vaulted.  There were a lot of mixed reactions.  I personally didn't like it.  It seemed too cryptic and messy for me with no real cohesive storytelling, but everyone has their own cup of tea.  

[Bastet]

Thanks.  I don't want to look at the vaulted forum, because I don't want to be spoiled to that extent, but you reporting that reactions were very mixed gives me the general sense I was looking for.  I don't stream, so I think I'll see if I can rent the DVD from Netflix and, if not, just go ahead and buy it (and if it turns out I love it, I'll donate the DVD and treat myself to the expensive Blu-Ray, assuming it has exclusive features).

[Guest]

OMG PLEASE LET THIS BE TRUE!!

[Simon Boccanegra]

On 8/25/2019 at 2:10 PM, Bastet said:

Thanks.  I don't want to look at the vaulted forum, because I don't want to be spoiled to that extent, but you reporting that reactions were very mixed gives me the general sense I was looking for.  I don't stream, so I think I'll see if I can rent the DVD from Netflix and, if not, just go ahead and buy it (and if it turns out I love it, I'll donate the DVD and treat myself to the expensive Blu-Ray, assuming it has exclusive features).

@Bastet, if you're still wondering about this and haven't moved on it, I found a lot of the Showtime series very beautiful. I've seen it twice and will again. It certainly has the stamp of a major artist in every episode, many of the actors (both the familiar faces and the new ones) are as good as they've ever been in anything, and there's even a lot of good music. And it's very funny sometimes, touching at other times, or creepy. It's the work of a master at evoking feelings in images and sounds, not only in what can be put on a page.  

I found it more even-toned than the ABC series of 1990-91, which had a lot of painful hours when more conventional television people tried so hard to "do" David Lynch. I won't dwell on specific storylines to support the point. If you've seen that deadly middle-to-late stretch of season 2, you probably have your own list.  

With the Showtime series (or season 3, whatever we're calling it), you just have to take what you can from it, and be prepared for unanswered questions and ambiguities. I did love it, though, and some people did. It's quite a ride. 

Quote

So that Michael Ontkean isn't in the revival is one of my  hesitations about it.

Robert Forster (RIP!) makes the best replacement possible. His sad, decent Sheriff Frank is a real asset, and Forster works well with the returning actors from that part of the show.  

Edited October 14, 2019 by Simon Boccanegra

[azshadowwalker]

Finally got around to watching this. I have seen most Lynch movies. Never felt like they didn't make sense. And loved them...until I was about 25.

Now, I remember why I stopped watching his movies. Masturbatory dreck. I shouldn't need Cliff Notes to figure out what the fuck is going on, and I never have before, but this is mostly just Lynch being self-indulgent. I had a difficult time even staying awake it was so tedious, and a screeching Audrey didn't fix that. 

I guess Showtime has money to waste these days. 

[punkypower]

Last minute, but I wanted to share for any other diehards.

To celebrate the 30th anniversary of the pilot today, Kyle will be doing a live tweet party beginning at 11:30PST with Mädchen and then following up with an IG Q&A:

ä

[Tachi Rocinante]

OK, so I finally binged Season 3 over the course of a week or so.  Since this is about something from David Lynch, my thoughts may scatter occasionally. (I read the vaulted discussions so I may be parroting other people.  My apologies in advance.)

1. 4-5 hours of actual plot over the course of 18 hours does not a masterpiece make.  Waaayy too much filler with extended shots of scenery, pregnant pauses, and nighttime driving.
2. Some scenes were absolutely brilliant, but they were few and far between. Too much filler with the occasional "goofy shit for the sake of goofy shit".
3. Of the roadhouse shows, only the NIN performance was tolerable. Eddie Vedder was awful. Someone should be sued for the "Lynch Remix" of American Woman.  "Hey, we slowed it down!  Aren't we clever??"
4. MacLachlan as dougiejones was good acting, but it became Forrest Gump on Valium after awhile. Miguel Ferrer and Laura Dern were excellent, and Robert Forster was perfect.
5. Fuck you, bubblegum-head tree.
6. Was hoping for cameos from Kiefer and/or Isaak. 
7. The Mitchum Brothers deserve a spinoff, with Mullins as their goofy pal.
8. Too many now-dead cast members {sniffle}

Lynch has always been polarizing.  Personally, while I can appreciate the efforts he makes, I find myself not really liking most of his finished products as a whole.  Pretentiousness disguised as artistic vision can be an insult to the audience.

[ClassicShowsFan]

Clark Middleton, who played Charlie, the husband to Sherilyn Fenn’s Audrey Horne, has passed away:

https://deadline.com/2020/10/clark-middleton-dead-actor-twin-peaks-the-blacklist-63-1234591880/

[Pete Martell]

On 10/5/2020 at 9:06 PM, ClassicShowsFan said:

Clark Middleton, who played Charlie, the husband to Sherilyn Fenn’s Audrey Horne, has passed away:

https://deadline.com/2020/10/clark-middleton-dead-actor-twin-peaks-the-blacklist-63-1234591880/

He was great. That whole plot was iffy, but he managed to add a great deal of mystery and darkness to the role.

[Affogato]

On 10/5/2020 at 9:06 PM, ClassicShowsFan said:

Clark Middleton, who played Charlie, the husband to Sherilyn Fenn’s Audrey Horne, has passed away:

https://deadline.com/2020/10/clark-middleton-dead-actor-twin-peaks-the-blacklist-63-1234591880/

I’m sorry to hear it. 

[Affogato]

On 6/8/2020 at 10:12 AM, Tachi Rocinante said:

Lynch has always been polarizing.  Personally, while I can appreciate the efforts he makes, I find myself not really liking most of his finished products as a whole.  Pretentiousness disguised as artistic vision can be an insult to the audience.

I don’t think it can be called pretension. Lynch clearly can do exactly what he wants and has nothing to prove. He can build a desk or make a tv show. You can like it or not. The opposite of pretense. 

[Bastet]

Hoo boy.  The Blu-Ray set of the revival was on sale dirt cheap last month, so I bought it, and last night finally started in on it.  I've watched the first four episodes, and so far this is excruciating.  I can appreciate a slow pace, but this is beyond - I do not need to see the whole process of five shovels being spray painted.  And I keep asking "what the actual fuck?" not in an enjoyable way, but in an aggravated one. 

I don't think I've seen any of David Lynch's work other than Twin Peaks, and I only like the first season and a half of the original series, so maybe I'm just not a David Lynch fan.  I'll keep going, but so far this is nothing like what I loved of the original series and it's not interesting/intriguing me at all; I hope that changes, but so far I understand why my friends who watched it on Showtime all hated it.

[Bastet]

Wow.  I  had to wait until part 16 to like this damn thing.  (There were scenes in previous parts I enjoyed, certainly, but on the whole it was a tedious slog for me until part 16, when it finally became Twin Peaks again.)   I’m going to watch the final two parts tonight, so I hope that continues – and it will be interesting to see if I’m right about some theories I have in my head (if we actually get answers on those things) - as it's so nice to finally be excited.

The real Cooper returning was such a joyous thing!  “I am the FBI.”

In part 15, the Log Lady’s death hit me even harder than I’d anticipated; having someone who is knowingly days away from death sit in her living room and film that “I’m dying … there is some fear” call to Hawk yielded an incredibly powerful scene.  What a final gift for Catherine Coulson to leave fans with.

I read an article that says Mark Frost's novel reveals Hawk has her log; he keeps it on his mantel, and, while it has not spoken to him, he keeps an ear open, just in case.  That makes me smile.

[Bastet]

Well.  I should have stopped at part 16 and made up my own ending.  I liked some stuff in part 17, but as it went on and then part 18 ... not my jam.  We'd just got real Agent Cooper back, and then he was gone again.

I think it's pretty clear now, from reading old discussion in which those who like a lot of Lynch's work (which I have not seen) love the things I hated most about this revival, that I am not a fan of Lynch, I am a fan of the "Who killed Laura Palmer?" portion of Twin Peaks.  The rest of season two and season three, though, are not my thing, and I only like scattered moments of them.  That's okay; now I know, and I can just re-watch season one and season 2a whenever the urge strikes and be happy.

I watched some of the behind-the-scenes special features, and I'm impressed actors can work the Lynch way, knowing so little about the context in which their scenes are occurring.  It's not just that they didn't know what was happening in the other parts of the script, they didn't even have information about some of their own scenes.  Actors want to know what their character knows that the audience doesn't, so they can be sure to be playing the emotion properly; when the information is later revealed, and the audience looks back on the scene, it's all there in their face and mannerisms in retrospect.  (Like how Gillian Anderson is still miffed that Chris Carter didn't tell her Scully knew Mulder was faking his death in the season four finale of The X-Files, as she would have played the scene in which Scully tells the FBI panel Mulder is dead very differently.)

At one point, Sherilyn Fenn starts to ask him about the contract Audrey and Charlie are discussing, then says, "Never mind, you won't tell me."  And I laughed when Lynch was explaining the Mitchum brother's mood in the showdown scene in the sheriff's office to Jim Belushi, saying "you [meaning the character] have no idea what is going on here", and Belushi responded, "So, just like in real life, because I have absolutely no idea what is happening in this scene."

Edited November 18, 2020 by Bastet

[Hiyo]

Quote

Pretentiousness disguised as artistic vision can be an insult to the audience.

Amen to that.

Part 17 was a good ending for the show. Part 18...not so much.

[BetterButter]

Al Strobel, ‘Twin Peaks’ Actor, Dies at 83

[One4Sorrow2TooBad]

Great series,wish it was shown in reruns somewhere. 

[Black Knight]

I finally got around to binging this on Showtime.

It took me a little bit of time to get back into the Lynchian headspace, as it's been a while since I've watched anything of his. It did make sense to me that the show started with Cooper in the Lodge and that it was mostly about his getting out and back to himself. As much as I have affection for the Twin Peaks characters, I didn't particularly see where most of them could go anyway, so I wasn't upset that there wasn't the soap opera stuff of the TV series and that this was mostly about Cooper's journey out of the predicament he was in the last time we'd seen him, 25 years before.

Early Dougie was hard for me because I suffer secondhand embarrassment easily, but once he was able to start being effective in his own weird way, the storyline got a lot more enjoyable.

I'm fascinated by the idea that Cooper actually succeeded in pulling Laura out of that universe before she was murdered, but then of course the Black Lodge got involved and kidnapped her and stuffed her into a timeline where the year is unknown. I read through the vaulted TP threads and there was some thinking expressed there that Cooper trying to save Laura was an example of Cooper trying to do too much, being messianic - and essentially that it was obviously a mistake for him to try to do that.

But we don't know what Laura whispered into Cooper's ear at the start of S3, and I think it's significant that a snapshot of that moment was the image that S3 closed on. Cooper might have been acting on some information she whispered to him. Man, I really wish I knew what happened next...maybe someday.