Criminal Minds Unpopular Opinions

[Knittzu]

I actually think Hotch has been every bit as marginalized and sadly underutilized as Reid (which, granted, is saying a lot!). I always surprise myself with just how much I love the Hotch of earlier seasons and how compelling a character I think he was.

 

 

He's almost as invisible as Reid is these days. Reid is my favorite character, but the near-total absence of Hotch would be even more infuriating to me if I actually cared about this show anymore -- because he's supposed to be the team's leader! FFS, writers. He doesn't even get to be the one who decides when it's time to deliver the profile anymore. 

 

I totally understand why people hate Gideon, but despite/because of his melodramatic narcissism, I kind of miss him-

 

 

MP is annoying and full of himself and a hypocrite to boot, but I also miss Gideon. Irritating as I find MP as a person, he's a gifted actor with the charisma to carry a show. Gideon was a fascinatingly messed-up person and I was always on edge waiting to see what he was going to do next. Contrast that to their perfect bland, utterly dull new lead character. She's never done or said a single interesting thing ever.

 

[amensisterfriend]

Well said, Knittzu :) 

 

Here's a question for you guys: Do you think they should split the team up more often in order to give each team member more to do and some of the individual intra-team memberships more development? I'm genuinely torn on this one. I think this worked great in Damaged---IMO, both the inmate interview and even Rossi's 'unsolved case that still haunts him' (a trope I normally dislike!) were really engaging, and splitting up the team seemed to give more team members a chance to shine than when they're all stuck in one homogenous, interchangeable group, mechanically reciting random lines from the prepared profile with no regard to who's saying or what. On the other hand, splitting things up sometimes means that neither storyline is given enough substance or development, and this show tends to have enough problems with pacing as is :) I'm curious to hear what you guys think! 

[alexvillage]

To me the thing that is missing is profiling. If that had not gone off the rails, I think I would not be complaining so much. I don't care about personal stories. I do appreciate some relationships and the banter (not the sassy and ridiculous from you know who) but I could easily live without them if the show were about what the show is supposed to be about: profiling

[Knittzu]

Do you think they should split the team up more often in order to give each team member more to do and some of the individual intra-team memberships more development?

 

 

That's basically what the show does now, right? The team is split between the characters that EM likes (Garcia, JJ, Morgan) and the ones she doesn't (Reid, Hotch, Rossi). The problem is that one group gets all the action, stories, lines, etc. while the other gets to vanish. Presumably they're doing something while we don't see them -- it's just that the writers don't care enough to show it. (Or maybe they're not. Maybe the FBI is paying these people to sit around at their desks playing Angry Birds and dreaming of the days when they used to be FBI Profilers.)

 

Officially dividing the team into two groups wouldn't change a thing. We'd still be watching the action-adventure show starting JJ and Morgan, with Garcia popping in at the key moment to solve the "mystery." Reid, Hotch, and Rossi would still be featured as little as possible. At this point I have little doubt that EM would fire all three of them if she could.

[zannej]

No, I've seen them divide teams on other shows and they do divide them a lot on the show currently. It reminds me of Brown vs the Board of Education. Separate is NOT equal. So even separated, they do not get equal time.

 

I know that maybe they can't always get everyone on set at the same time, but it would be nice to see more things with the team as a whole where everyone gets to contribute.

[SSAHotchner]

I actually think Hotch has been every bit as marginalized and sadly underutilized as Reid (which, granted, is saying a lot!). I always surprise myself with just how much I love the Hotch of earlier seasons and how compelling a character I think he was. 

 

I totally understand why people hate Gideon, but despite/because of his melodramatic narcissism, I kind of miss him---he had clear flaws to counterbalance his strengths and such a dynamic personality, both of which are, IMO, lacking in the way today's flatly perfect, interchangeable team is usually written. And for some reason I would have loved to see Rossi and Gideon on the same team, snarking and clashing and maybe eventually arriving at common ground. 

 

Speaking of people with flaws and personality, I still miss Elle. And I would have loved to see her and Emily working together and eventually becoming friends. JJ, Garcia and Morgan can leave ANY time. In fact, I'd have been fine with none of them on the show in the first place. 

 

I actually think Season 3 is underrated---at least by me, who used to rank it as the worst of the series' first four seasons :) I'm always surprised by how good a lot of the episodes are, and the original incarnation of Rossi as a more abrasive lone wolf added an interesting dynamic to the team for me.

 

I know most people are in it solely for the characters and definitely understand that, but as a lifelong mystery fan, I do (did?!) care about the cases and the profiling, and replacing plotting and pacing and anything resembling psychological insight and suspense with relentless torture porn has been just as disappointing to me as the show's characterizations. 

I agree with a lot of what you said. But I actually liked Garcia and JJ in the early seasons. Now I can't stand either of them. Look at the pilot, Extreme Aggressor. It's one of my favorite episodes. Garcia has one tiny scene where Morgan calls her to try and get the password on one of the unsubs' computers. I love that exchange where she says, "Well, gorgeous, you've been rerouted to the office of Too Frickin' Bad." Even though she couldn't provide any help, it was a nice moment of levity and it showed us her character. If the current writers were writing that scene, Garcia would be able to come up with the password in a matter of seconds. There'd be no chance for Reid to figure it out by using the CDs.

[DiamondDoll]

I preferred the much hated Seaver to JJ. I also adored the father/daughter type bond she had with Rossi. Actually he had more parental chemistry with her than he has with his soap opera-esque long lost daughter.

 

Unpopularly I also love Will. I love the actor and I think he's done a great job with the role. Can JJ be stay-at-home mom now and Will joins the team instead?

[normasm]

You sexist!!!!!

 

*jk*

[idiotwaltz]

 

  I also adored the father/daughter type bond she had with Rossi. Actually he had more parental chemistry with her than he has with his soap opera-esque long lost daughter.

 

I agree. The only times I liked Seaver were when she was with Rossi and he was being all papa-like to her. 

 

 

Can JJ be stay-at-home mom now and Will joins the team instead?

 

Can we have HENRY join the team? Out of the three, I find him the least annoying. He'll need a proper haircut though, if he plans to be a LEO. 

[Knittzu]

Can we have HENRY join the team? Out of the three, I find him the least annoying.

 

 

He's probably the best actor of the trio, too.

[alexvillage]

I don't know where to put this, but I think it will fit. 

I am giving up on the show, for good. I have been feeling pretty uncomfortable about how the writers depict the unsubs for a while. I have been snarking about the show, I think in part as a way to put some distance from my discomfort. But I can't. I think we all reach a breaking point at something. I hit mine.

As you all probably already know, I live disabilities 24/7, literally. I am not disabled myself, at least I am privileged and don't' experience any of the inaccesibilities, lack of accommodations and especially the lack of understanding about disabilities that my friends do. But my best friend is disabled, people closest to me are disabled, or are in the same position I am, living disabilities 24/7.

So, the show: I have not gone back and count, but I believe I am pretty close when I say that at least 80% of the unsubs are mentally ill or have a deformity. When the team says "the stressor", it implies that the mental illness is there, lingering and wiring for something to trigger it and then the very "normal" person becomes a monster. In reality, only about 4% of mentally ill people are violent criminals, while over 90% are victims of violence. This, to me, is lazy writing.

More than that, it hurts me. It is more than offense. I know people who are mentally ill, I do know how their day to day is and what happens when they have bad moments, day or days. I know people who are deformed, I know dwarfs, I know them and the are my friends.

Why is that a person who is deformed has to have some sort of evilness inside? Why dwarfs are "creepy"? Why a depressed person will break down and kill people? These things do not happen in the way the writers show us.

Serial killers are evil people, psychopaths (and this is one mental illness that fits the awful interpretation of the writers. No conscience, no remorse, no ability to form relationships). The proportion showed in CM is skewed, and while most people don't see this, I do and I am very uncomfortable keep watching the show when my friends are being depicted as monsters. and this is not hyperbole. Not saying that after an episode things get bleaker for a group of people, but these messages do get subliminally into people's mind and then, when something happens in real life, the scapegoats are "the mentally ill". Case in point, the events in Sydney. It took a couple of hours for BBC (which I consider much better than any american news) to blame mental illness for the hostage taking. Then other muslims, a marginalized group that gets targeted often, blamed mental illness. And nobody ever disputes that. Once a person did say that mental illness are not a cause of mass murder, only to add, without missing a beat, that the perpetrator dis look like a mentally ill person. "look like". It doesn't even make sense, since they barely knew the criminal.

Friends of mine lost jobs or were denied entrance in public places because they "looked like they could be that guy who killed a lot of people". Seriously, this happened more than once.

Then there is the movement that encourages the active killing of disabled children, and parents murdering their children because they d=fear they will become a "creep", a murderer, a weirdo that all hurt people (those are close quotes)

CM is not the cause of all this and I cannot stop them. But I cannot watch this anymore. Consider this a boycott, like I did with SVU (similar reasons) and other shows. 

Each day I get more involved with disability activism, each day things affect me more personally.

 

This is not intended to be dramatic, and it is all true. It is not intended to guilty anyone into not watching or feeling bad about watching and liking it. I do hope that it gives you all a little insight and some information about how things seemingly so minor can have a huge effect. And I do hope that you all learn a little about ableism. 

 

you guys are cool.

end of rant

Edited December 17, 2014 by alexvillage

[Cobalt Stargazer]

I know I've referenced him a couple of times, but it seems appropriate to do so again. Attorney and writer Andrew Vachss says on his website that there's a difference between being sick and being evil. Vachss, who has worked with abused children both within the legal system and in private practice, has seen first-hand the damage that molestation and other horrors can do, While it's true that not all abused children become abusers themselves, some do. I don't have a percentage or anything, nothing to either prove or disprove it, but it does happen.

 

As it relates to the show, yes, many UnSubs have had some sort of mental illness. Samantha Malcolm, Nathan Harris, and even Owen Savage were all damaged in one way or another, and Samantha and Owen acted on their impulses - Samantha because she didn't know she was doing any harm, and Owen because he'd been bullied, abused, and neglected by almost everyone. Nathan probably would have acted on his impulses had he not attemtpe3d to kill himself instead, and at the end of Sex, Birth, Death Reid questions Gideon as to how many people he put in danger by saving his life. Reid identified with both Nathan and Owen, but he still wondered aloud if people would be put in jeopardy due to Nathan surviving. He doesn't ask himself that about Owen, but IMO circumstances made Owen what he was, not anything internal.

 

In the other column, we have Frank Breitkopf, George Foyet, and Floyd Ferell. I suppose in some ways, Floyd is an arguable case, since it's mentioned at the beginning of Lucky that he was on some kind of medication that suppressed his urges, but once he was freed from the institution he ceased taking the pills and returned to his old ways. Sure, he was ill, but he had a choice to remain on the medication and he rejected it. Foyet and Frank didn't even have that option, I don't think. Frank chose to commit suicide and take the innocent, if broken, Jane with him, and Foyet killed Hotch's wife and intended to kill his son just because he wanted that much to break Aaron emotionally. Did they have a choice? I don't have the answer to that. If they did have a choice, they, like Floyd, may well have rejected it. If so, what does that say about their mental state?

 

And then there's Reid himself, who is the character most often chosen for Agent--As-UnSub fanfics, and whether it's because of Diana's illness manifesting in him, the bullying he got coupled with his father's abandonment, or something totally unrelated, is up for debate. As I said, ill isn't the same thing as evil. I'm not a psychiatrist/psychologist, so I don't have a degree. The above is the impression of a layman, and I mean no offense to anyone.

[zannej]

I do think that far too often people want to put those diagnosed with mental illness in a box and that there is not much understanding or sympathy in general. I've had arguments with people who just didn't understand mental illness and they would get angry when someone who was mentally ill did not behave logically or rationally. There is, unfortunately, a stereotype of mentally ill people "snapping" and killing or harming people. I don't think its ever just mental illness alone that causes the few cases. I think there are always other factors. Remember Professor James Fallon? He recognized that many serial killers had atypical brains where the parts controlling empathy and morality were switched off. He also documented a specific "warrior gene" that made them more likely to be violent. But he had those things himself and was not violent because he had been properly nurtured. It was a matter of nature AND nurture. 

 

I remember seeing a commercial on TV that I at first thought was a joke, but I was appalled when I realized it was serious. Some guy came on and said that illnesses like multiple personality disorder and schizophrenia were actually demonic possession and that taking them to the doctor and giving them medication would do not good. That instead they had to pay money to this guy's church and pray. That sort of thinking has led to so much harm and even the deaths of mentally ill people.

 

I think until society changes to have more understanding, the stereotypes are going to continue. I will say that while some of the people on CM have been shown to be mentally ill to begin with, I do think there are a good chunk of them who just snapped due to stress-- something that could happen to "normal" people given the right circumstances. Other times the people were just sociopaths or psychopaths from the beginning.

 

I do think that the writers struggle with reasons for the unsubs to commit their crimes and they do often take the lazy way out.

[normasm]

 In reality, only about 4% of mentally ill people are violent criminals, while over 90% are victims of violence. This, to me, is lazy writing.

More than that, it hurts me. It is more than offense. I know people who are mentally ill, I do know how their day to day is and what happens when they have bad moments, day or days. 

 

 

alexvillage, I take all of your points to heart, and I hope you will continue to speak out, because people need to hear your POV. The writers frequently don't deal with reality within the context of a very serious subject, and I think it's all too glib when they claim the show is entertainment. Absolutely no excuse for telling lies or twisted versions of the truth. What CoStar and zannej said is true, too. I especially responded to 

 

Remember Professor James Fallon? He recognized that many serial killers had atypical brains where the parts controlling empathy and morality were switched off. He also documented a specific "warrior gene" that made them more likely to be violent. But he had those things himself and was not violent because he had been properly nurtured. It was a matter of nature AND nurture. 

 

 

I saw an interview with him after he had discovered his "psychopath" genetics, and it was powerful. As you say, most people with mental illness (and i daresay we are a bunch more than the populace might be comfortable acknowledging exist) will more likely be victimized than victimizing.

[alexvillage]

Thank you, greatly appreciated and happy people here do see what I see even if not experiencing what I experience (as an observer, a very close observer) or what my friends live every day.

[DiamondDoll]

I'm a SpencerFF but I absolutely hated the whole Maeve storyline. It was ridiculous, insulting and waste of everyone's time. MGG can usually have chemistry with a blook wood but even he couldn't salvage this fiasco. When she was killed off, I cheered. Now would it be too much to ask that Spencer got a real, adult love interest instead of whatever that mess that was supposed to be?

[amensisterfriend]

This is probably unpopular, but I think Reid had more chemistry with the bartender from "52 Pickup" than any other female we've seen him with. I really liked her and their dynamic, though admittedly we saw very little of it! 

 

I recently rewatched Zoe's Reprise for the gazillionth time, and was reminded of a couple of UOs:

 

I REALLY wish the team were smaller and that Rossi was focused on a lot more as one of the 4-5 team members who remain. 

 

I love Rossi and I love Hotch, but somehow the friendship between them always feels really awkward and forced to me. Whenever one has to comfort the other, I cringe my way through the scene. 

Can we have HENRY join the team? Out of the three, I find him the least annoying.

 

Ha! Sad...but true :) 

[KatWay]

 

There was a Cheerio found at the crime scene? Then he must have been served Cheerios by his mom, and she made him eat them every day, to the point he hated Cheerios, and that made him hate breakfast. If he hated breakfast, he hated diners. If he hated diners, he hated waitresses.. And if he hated waitresses, he hated those little notepads they write the orders on, and that's why he has a problem with authority, because they give orders, and that's why he kills people in authoritative positions.

 

Time to give the profile!

 

Hotch: This unsub

Reid: Will have a distaste for breakfast cereal

Rossi: So when you spot him

JJ: don't offer him Cheerios

Garcia, find me people who eat Cheerios and frequent diners.

Tap. Tap.

Got it! George Smith. He lives at 123 Elm Street. He's there now with his Golden Retriever, Spike, and he's watching Brooklyn Nine Nine.

 

Just wanted to say: Best post ever.

[zannej]

I actually thought that Reid had more chemistry with Dr. Kimura than with any of the potential love interests. I did think he actually had good chemistry with Maeve though. I think he had more chemistry with Maeve over the phone than Hotch ever had with Beth.

 

There was something I didn't quite like about the bartender, Austin. (IIRC, the actress is married to Brandon Routh? one of the guys who played Superman). I thought that Lila was pretty but she was very inarticulate. I had to use CC to find out WTF she was saying half the time. I did like Maeve, but I thought the story was dumb and I hated the way it ended.

 

Reid also had chemistry with one of the female agents from the crimes against children group in "P911". He actually initiated the handshake with her.

 

That cheerios thing really cracks me up.

[Droogie]

I actually thought that Reid had more chemistry with Dr. Kimura than with any of the potential love interests. I did think he actually had good chemistry with Maeve though. I think he had more chemistry with Maeve over the phone than Hotch ever had with Beth .

Ohmigosh, Zannej! GMTA! I was literally just thinking the other day that they should bring Dr. Kimura back as a love interest for Reid! I think I may have read a fanfiction about the two of them, or else I dreamed it (Yeah, I dream about CM. Don't judge me.) but I did think they had a certain chemistry and pairing the two of them could make all kinds of sense. In reality I think the actress is about 10 years older than MGG, but I could absolutely see that not being a thing in Reid's mind.

I liked Reid's and Maeve's chemistry over the phone and then in the loft, but the flashback/memory scenes were stilted, IMHO. I thought MGG was excellent in them but not so much Beth Reisgraf. Although I did love their dream dance -- I thought she nailed that one.

I need to take a moment to reiterate how much I haaaaaaate Zugzwang, though. I will never forgive them for that (even if MGG was OK with it).

Edited December 19, 2014 by Droogie

[Cobalt Stargazer]

I liked Reid's and Maeve's chemistry over the phone and then in the loft, but the flashback/memory scenes were stilted, IMHO. I thought MGG was excellent in them but not so much Beth Reisgraf. Although I did love their dream dance -- I thought she nailed that one.

 

"Dance with me,"

 

"Why?"

 

"I want to hold you once before I'm a ghost of a memory."

 

Gah.

[Droogie]

"Dance with me,"

 

"Why?"

 

"I want to hold you once before I'm a ghost of a memory."

 

Gah.

Kills me even to read it.

[SSAHotchner]

I actually thought that Reid had more chemistry with Dr. Kimura than with any of the potential love interests. I did think he actually had good chemistry with Maeve though. I think he had more chemistry with Maeve over the phone than Hotch ever had with Beth.

 

There was something I didn't quite like about the bartender, Austin. (IIRC, the actress is married to Brandon Routh? one of the guys who played Superman). I thought that Lila was pretty but she was very inarticulate. I had to use CC to find out WTF she was saying half the time. I did like Maeve, but I thought the story was dumb and I hated the way it ended.

 

Reid also had chemistry with one of the female agents from the crimes against children group in "P911". He actually initiated the handshake with her.

 

That cheerios thing really cracks me up.

I think Amber Heard is just a poor actress. Her diction was terrible and her line delivery was pretty wooden, too. I didn't mind the bartender, but she didn't strike me as someone who would hold Reid's attention for long. I understand what you're saying about Dr. Kimura, but she seemed a bit too old for Reid, to me. 

[normasm]

Say what you will about Amber Heard and her acting, but I wasn't really looking at her 99% of the time. I watch that episode for one and a half reasons: Reid and his awkward sexyness and Elle giving him the sideglance 2 or 3 times. I really enjoy that. 

 

As for Kimura, I could see where Reid and Kimura would have been attracted to each other, and i've read at least one steamy and sort-of plausible ff with them as such. But, yeah, she's too old for him. Maeve was perfect in age, temperament, intelligence, everything but what a relationship needs the most of, trust.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

As for Kimura, I could see where Reid and Kimura would have been attracted to each other, and i've read at least one steamy and sort-of plausible ff with them as such. But, yeah, she's too old for him. Maeve was perfect in age, temperament, intelligence, everything but what a relationship needs the most of, trust.

 

I don't know about Kimura being too old, normasm. Tamlyn Tomita was forty-three at the time Amplification first aired, and I think Reid responds particularly well to older women - Elle, Emily, Alex. Maybe she stayed and watched the techs scrub him down after Morgan bailed. (j/k)

 

As for Maeve, as much as Zugzwang and Alchemy hurt, outside of that I didn't really know her. In retrospect she seems ideal for him to me, but OTOH he seems so alone that I wish anyone would take an interest in him.

[normasm]

Oh, yeah, she was there for the scrubdown, baby! I think that's what gave a lot of people ideas, along with the statement "well you look nice" he made when she came in in hazmat getup. That certainly sets me afire. I love a woman in hazmat uniform…..

[Monx]

Oh yeah she definatley stayed, professional concern you know.

My fan fiction addled brain has made me think that every person who has showed kindness towards Reid also got some nerd action: Lila, Austin, Kimura....Ethan.

I can't help it. So rarely do characters appreciate him that when they do I feel like the writers are setting up something, which is so sad.

I didn't love Maeve though. Sweet girl, but purely there as a damsled love interest. I liked Dr Kimura and Austin, but assumed she wouldn't be able to keep up with him.

I hate those 'everything is great now that I have a girlfriend' plots. Just show him being appreciated and happy dammit!

[amensisterfriend]

So many of us (including me!) have tended to rank S2 as the least awesome of the show's golden S1-S4 years, but I'm developing the UO that it's actually got some of the absolute high points of the series and is much, much better than usually given credit for. I'll never be a fan of the mercifully short-lived addiction arc, and S2 probably does have more episodes I'd be fine skipping than S1 or S4 does, but it also highlights CM at its very best IMO.

 

The Fisher King Part II, The Perfect Storm, North Mammon, Empty Planet, The Last Word, Sex, Birth and Death, No Way Out, Legacy, etc are all among my favorites of the series. (Granted, I have a lot of series' favorites, but you get the gist!)

 

S2 also gives us my very favorite incarnation of my beloved Emily: adorkable, a little nerdy, Vonnegut-loving, personally a little insecure but professionally brilliant, etc. I even like Honor Among Thieves purely because we get awesome insight into Emily's relationship with her mother (yes, I know Honor Among Thieves is an otherwise terrible episode, but the mere appearance of Elizabeth Prentiss elevates it in my weird little mind!) 

 

Elle's meltdown is hard to watch, but we get some amazing scenes from it, particularly the hotel room scene with Reid and her farewell to Hotch. If only she had kept her S1 hair! ;) 

 

S2 also gives us a few great Gideon/Reid scenes, some of the series' best quotes (yes, I care way too much about the quotes!), a really fun chance to focus on a slightly smaller team in those episodes after Elle's departure and prior to Emily's arrival, AND, perhaps most importantly, some of my very favorite Reid hair of the series ;) S2 has got its downsides, but I'm finding that I'm surprisingly attached to it. 

[Old Dog]

I like a great deal of S2 as well - but then I can watch most of the first 4 seasons endlessly. The Last Word is one of my all time favourite episodes with Reid doing his thing, 2 unsubs, lots of profiling and Emily's first appearance - but much of season 2 is equally good. I think I would put it above season 3 actually but the first four years are the best.

[SSAHotchner]

I actually think of season 2 and season 3 as about equal in the number of eps that I really like. 

[amensisterfriend]

S3 is probably the more consistent season for me, but I feel like S2 had higher highs. Plus, the mere fact that Emily's kind of adorably dorky in S2 and that we get to see glasses-wearing Reid pushes S2 Even higher in the rankings for me :)

[Watermelon]

My unpopular opinion is Season 5 Spencer headache hair is his best hair. The floppy can be cute, but short hair looks more like a babyfaced doctor/agent aiming for professionalism. His long hair looks so much like "Mommy didn't take me to the barbershop this month."

[normasm]

Season 5, until the next to last episode The Internet is forever, was the season of the longest hair, what I think you're saying you don't like. Maybe you mean season 6? which was also yummy. I love it long (as you can see by my icon), and any other length but shaved-in-the-back. 

[amensisterfriend]

Judging from fanvids and fanfic this one is really unpopular, but I never saw any sexual/romantic chemistry at all between Emily/Morgan, Emily/Hotch OR Emily/Reid. I could, however, totally see Emily/Rossi. (See, I told you this was unpopular---at least I'm in the right thread!) 

 

The only team member I could have ever seen Reid with is---much to my own surprise---Elle. I'm not sure if I'd call their chemistry romantic, exactly, but they had a certain connection and dynamic that I really loved. But my even more UO here is that I don't care whether we ever see Reid in a long-term romantic relationship and disagree with the idea that that's the only way to show he's found happiness. I'm all for giving Reid peace and joy, but I think some people can and do find that while contentedly single, and I actually see Reid as one of those people. I don't even necessarily see him as someone who would truly *want* to be paired off in a serious relationship. I wish I could better explain it! 

 

I'm all for witty banter and warmth, especially as it adds levity to an understandably grim show, but somehow the Morgan/Garcia dynamic always felt incredibly forced and phony to me---even during the beginning seasons when most seemed to adore them. 

[normasm]

Amen, I agree with you about Reid and Elle, there was something there, maybe not romantic, but clearly a regard for one another on a deep level. 

 

I do think that Reid has resigned himself in the wake of Maeve to being alone, but i disagree that he's "fine" with it, I think he really wants a family, but will be OK if it doesn't happen. I see him perhaps finding a mate when he hits his forties.

[Droogie]

I tend to agree, Normasm. I think he has come to believe and accept that he will remain alone, even if that is not actually the case. But he seems profoundly lonely to me. His reaction to Gideon's death for example: even though they hasn't had contact in a long time, it was someone he loved who loved him in return who existed and then didn't anymore.

I wish the show would have snippets of him turning heads or being on the receiving end of flirty banter. He's a brilliant and successful profiler with the FBI who comes in contact with many people on a regular basis. Am I supposed to believe that no one except for Lila Archer and Austin ever noticed him? Even though his persona isn't written to be blatant Adonis-like, like Morgan (if that's what floats your boat), the man is straight-up beautiful. He would certainly turn my head, and I'm happily-married. What red-blooded man in his 30s wouldn't want love and companionship? My gosh, we even have Rossi constantly trolling for tail and bringing Hotch along for the ride. I know Reid probably wouldn't want a casual fling, but we aren't talking about a 24-year-old boy anymore. It's becoming a caricature.

The writers are the ones who gave him the gripping and tragic backstory and now, to continue to leave him alone -- well, if the series ends without Reid having someone to go home to, I might just flip my shit. (In direct proportion to the fact that this is a television show and Spencer Reid is a fictional character and all that, of course.)

...gee, I'm sorry. I get carried away...

Edited March 13, 2015 by Droogie

[Cobalt Stargazer]

The only team member I could have ever seen Reid with is---much to my own surprise---Elle. I'm not sure if I'd call their chemistry romantic, exactly, but they had a certain connection and dynamic that I really loved.

 

That's not unpopular with me! :-D

 

I didn't start shipping them until way late in the game, long after Elle left, but now I could really see them together. If only because she's the only one who treated him with the regard he deserves.

[ForeverAlone]

Count me in as well to the IDEA of Reid/Elle. She consistently showed him respect and regard, and he did the same for her. While it would have been weird in the early seasons, if for some reason Elle came back into his life (unless she was radically different), it would be an interesting dynamic.

I do think Reid was more okay with being single and likely celibate before Maeve. But with her, he got a tiny taste of what is possible out there, and I don't think he is as contentedly alone anymore, though in no way do I think he is desperate. While I don't think he is actively looking, I think he is open to the possibility and probably hopeful he finds love again, even if he is doubtful he actually will.

[ForeverAlone]

The show seems to want the audience to believe that Reid is unattractive and unfit. It's like they want us to see Reid as he was originally conceived and not the direction they ultimately went. I mean, just look at that silly subplot in Rabid. We were supposed to honestly believe that Reid was so unfit, he couldn't keep up with Penelope on a run. Yeah freaking right. They want us to ignore Matthew's body and face and see someone else instead. Or they completely ignore how rabid Matthew's fanbase really is, because Shemar is basically the only one pushed as a male sex symbol on that show.

[Watermelon]

Season 5, until the next to last episode The Internet is forever, was the season of the longest hair, what I think you're saying you don't like. Maybe you mean season 6? which was also yummy. I love it long (as you can see by my icon), and any other length but shaved-in-the-back. 

Specifically I mean the hair in the Miami episode with the Santeria and the witch doctor and Spencer's headaches.  I thought that was season 5 but A&E doesn't go in order.  Whenever it was, best hair ever.

Edited March 14, 2015 by Watermelon

[normasm]

That was Corazon in Season 6, and i agree, he was so beautiful! I always watch that one for Spencer Beauty, and i like the guy who played Julio.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

The show seems to want the audience to believe that Reid is unattractive and unfit. It's like they want us to see Reid as he was originally conceived and not the direction they ultimately went.

 

This. So much this. Even if I accept that CM happens in some alternate universe where there are 576,000 serial killers running around, I do have eyes that are functional. I suppose that Morgan is more conventional eye candy, but still, its ridic that Reid is unattractive.

[amensisterfriend]

I'm so loving the pro-Reid/Elle sentiment here! A lot of the CM fans I know in real life love Emily but hate Elle (as if somehow one can't genuinely like both) And while Reid/Emily were obviously coworkers for a far longer time, I actually saw a much better defined, more natural and compelling connection between Reid and Elle. They just had such great chemistry, whether one sees it as romantic or otherwise, and seemed to so instinctively and genuinely 'get' and care for each other. When Elle teased Reid, it seemed affectionate to me. (By contrast, when JJ teases Reid, it just seems snotty, self-superior and Mean Girls-esque.) 

 

Another one re my beloved Elle: I thought her S2 arc was actually well done. Even the terrible haircut is growing on me ;) Despite parts of her exit storyline being hard to watch, it felt wholly 'in character' for me, which seems to be a UO. I find it totally understandable that the trauma she endured would have deepened and triggered the unresolved anger and impulsiveness that were already part of her makeup. I love that she was clearly in the wrong, yet also somewhat sympathetic and still, in my admittedly biased Elle-loving perspective, totally redeemable.

 

I'm always surprised all over again by how great the first third or even half of S2 is in general---it's easily one of my favorite stretches of the whole series, which seems fairly unpopular. And part of me is almost relieved that Elle left when she did, before TPTB could make her character totally dull and generic or just plain unlikable as they IMO did with many others! This way we get to have fun speculating how she might have redeemed herself--or not---in fanfic :) 

[amensisterfriend]

...You guys, I'm officially scaring myself: I think I like the much reviled S6 a lot more than I thought I did! I know this is a VERY unpopular opinion, so be gentle :) 

 

For one thing, I've always liked Seaver and will take Rachel Nichols' acting over AJ Cook's any day. I love the rapport that Seaver had with Rossi in particular. 

 

Once I get past how weirdly out of nowhere and over the top Emily's super secret spy storyline is---and lord knows that's a lot to get past!---I actually kind of enjoy getting to see Prentiss/Paget Brewster doing something different and find many of those scenes really compelling. 

 

Even a lot of the individual cases are more interesting than I'd recalled. 

 

Perhaps most importantly, I like Reid's S6 hair :) 

 

Maybe S6 just looks better now as compared to much of what followed it, but I'm happily surprising myself by how much I'm liking it. I'll show myself the door!  

[MCatry]

Here is my unpopular opinion:

I wish Gibson and Gubler would just decide to not come back, so I would stop putting myself in the annoying position of wasting an hour a week trying to see criminal minds with Hotch and Reid, and instead watching painful forty something minutes filled with non-sense crimes, girl power and dumb action arrests. Even Rossi is getting annoying for me nowadays..

[amensisterfriend]

McCarty, I'm thinking your opinion is more and more popular :) 

 

You reminded me of another really unpopular one I have, though, which is that while I've gushed and raved about how compelling I find Hotch in earlier seasons, it's been a very long time since I've consistently enjoyed his character. On screen (where you're not directly privy to a character's inner life as you are in a novel, for instance), there's a really thin line between being the 'still waters run deep', brooding, intensely intriguing introvert he used to be and merely stoic and flat in a depressingly one-note, relentless sort of way. (One reason I hold the UO of not enjoying 100: the events of that episode gave the already grim Hotch yet more reason to be angry and depressed for the remainder of the series!) For large stretches of time, he seems more like a zombie who sucks the energy from the scene than the quietly simmering, sneakily deep, slyly witty character he used to be. Fortunately, I watch the earlier seasons often enough to recapture my love for the character :)   

Edited April 3, 2015 by amensisterfriend

[Cobalt Stargazer]

5. Aftermath (painful in some ways, but so compelling, a treat for those of us who love the Reid/Elle dynamic...and those of us who like good cases. And Reid in glasses. :)) And can I count Boogeyman here too, as I always think of these as a two-parter?! That one has a creepily compelling case as well, and I adore Hotch and Elle's goodbye.

 

I didn't really know where to put this, but I was thinking about it (again, still, some more) and it occurred to me that the only reason Elle was written out the way she was - her lingering trauma from nearly dying, shooting William Lee - is that Glaudini decided she wanted to go back to New York. And as much as it hurts me every time I see her leave, in light of the later JJ-shaped fuckery I prefer Elle's more realistic exit. At least that way it leaves it open to the possibility that she recovered, whether it was getting counseling or just getting away from her old line of work.

[normasm]

Well, CoStar, that's not unpopular with me, at least! I always wanted them to find a way to bring her back in an Aaron episode or a Reid episode (if there is another, ever) to explore how she recovered from her PTSD, and to make amends all around with those two.

[missmycat]

I didn't really know where to put this, but I was thinking about it (again, still, some more) and it occurred to me that the only reason Elle was written out the way she was - her lingering trauma from nearly dying, shooting William Lee - is that Glaudini decided she wanted to go back to New York. And as much as it hurts me every time I see her leave, in light of the later JJ-shaped fuckery I prefer Elle's more realistic exit. At least that way it leaves it open to the possibility that she recovered, whether it was getting counseling or just getting away from her old line of work.

I agree 100%. The way Elle's PTSD was handled over having gotten shot in her own home and almost dying was a hell of a lot more realistic, including the part where she shot the guy in the back and got away scott free, than the ridiculous over the top way JJ's PTSD was handled in the "Forever People". Not to mention that unlike JJ, who up until that ridiculous episode had seemed unfazed over what had happened to her, we could see that Elle was still very much affected by what had happened to her. In fact so much so it affected her job in a negative way. Where as JJ's job performance seemed to be enhanced to the point where she became better at it than her team mates and ends up solving a case single handedly as well as bringing down the unsub and saving the victim,again single handedly.

[SSAHotchner]

MCatry, I understand completely, and I kind of agree, but I don't know what I do without my weekly dose of Hotch & Reid if TG and MGG left. But I definitely consider them worthy of better material than the current writers are giving them/us.

 

Amensister, I don't agree. Although I found season 8 to be worse than season 6, I still don't care to watch most of the episodes from season 6 when they air on ION or A&E. I do have the DVDs because I bought them back when having the complete set of CM was important to me. Once season 8 finished, I decided that was no longer important. And I totally disagree about Seaver/Rachel Nichols. I found the character ridiculous and RN's acting, as well as her idiotic tweets, obnoxious. And as much as I love Prentiss/Paget, the spy arc was silly and took away from what Criminal Minds was supposed to be, just as the silly 200 episode about JJ did. But we all have our likes and dislikes. While some consider season 6 to be the worst, I do not, but it's almost the worst for me. I think the introduction of the Seaver character is where the writers and show runner really screwed the viewers. After telling us for 5 seasons what an elite unit the BAU was and we saw Hotch (and Gideon) really crack down on Elle, Prentiss, Jordan Todd and even Reid and Morgan, there's no way we could accept that he would have allowed a cadet or a newbie agent on the team. But I'm beating a dead horse. This debate's been going on since season 6. I just wanted to say that these are the reasons I dislike season 6, but I still rate it a tiny bit higher than season 8.