S02.E08: Appropriately Sized Pots

[El-Cubano2224]

Question for you all - has it been your experience that all Spanish-speaking people are referred to as "Spanish?" I lived in California for 15+ years and worked mostly in social services, and we always used "Latino/a" for those from Latin American, and "Spanish" for Europeans. Now I'm thinking I really missed something!

You're Not Wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I get soooooooo PISSED when people say Latinos are, "Spanish" ~WE ARE NOT~ Spanish is for Latins from Spain. Sure We May be of ~Spanish Decent~ but We also have genes from other Races........ For Instance ~IM CUBAN~ (Like Rosa) I am 1/3 Spanish (From Spain) 1/3 Polynesian (Native Cubans), &, 1/3 Nigerian(Slaves that the Spanish took to Cuba) I'm only Part Spanish.............. In other Words you Confused people are Calling Me the Spanish Language................~IM A FUCKING LATINO BITCHES~

Edited June 28, 2014 by El-Cubano2224

[DangerousMinds]

Thanks, El Cubano! I'm kind of shocked that the show has been so off in this area.

[Iseut]

I don't know that the show has been off, necessarily, so much as they've shown how ignorant people are about race and respectful monikers, especially in prison. The prison is depicted as somewhat of a "throwback" in terms of race, wherein segregation is not only acceptable common practice but institutionally encouraged, and the people in power regularly throw around racial slurs and just plain ignorance. I think that Bennett referring to the Latina inmates as the "Spanish girls" shows not only how institutionally racist he and the prison system are in general, but also how he specifically is completely ignorant of the cultural heritage of Daya, his supposed beloved (and his baby-to-be).

[Lovecat]

It also goes back to the source material--in the book, Kerman says that the Latinas were always collectively referred to as the Spanish Mamis, regardless of their ethnicity.

[Misstify]

I never thought the show was "off" in that respect…I thought the show was showing us (accurately) the ignorant things people say.  Let's not forget, as far as Healey's concerned, Chang's ethnic group is "Other"!  (From season 1)

[TeresaDee]

I had a Puerto Rican friend who referred to herself, and anyone else from a spanish-speaking culture, as "spanish"..YMMV. As for Rosa, I always thought that her gravelly voice was due to her illness and chemo, making it harder to pick out the accent. All I can say about the spanish spoken in the flashback is that it did not sound Puerto Rican to me. It appears that she has been incarcerated for a very long time...does anyone know what sentencing there tends to be for bank robbery?

As for Soso, I think the not showering thing, while perhaps initially about bucking the societal status quo...ended up being all about having a shred of control over her life. The shower is what "broke" her IMO.

[Kel Varnsen]

It appears that she has been incarcerated for a very long time...does anyone know what sentencing there tends to be for bank robbery?

Not sure what the sentences would be for bank robbery, but it was armed robbery of 3 or 4 banks with hostages (as opposed to just handing someone a note and walking out with money). Plus someone died during the course of one of the robberies (her first boyfriend) so I could see her getting a pretty stiff sentence for that sort of thing.

[questionfear]

Not sure what the sentences would be for bank robbery, but it was armed robbery of 3 or 4 banks with hostages (as opposed to just handing someone a note and walking out with money). Plus someone died during the course of one of the robberies (her first boyfriend) so I could see her getting a pretty stiff sentence for that sort of thing.

IIRC, if anyone dies when you're committing a felony, it's considered a murder and you're responsible. So Rosa may have very well been given a life sentence due to the combo of a string of bank robberies plus a felony murder in the mix. 

[TeresaDee]

I didn't think about her being charged in relation to her boyfriend's death too. Wow, that's a mess.

[Hanahope]

Hah, so Rosa really was a bank robber.  But she's a bit of a black widow.  Well she got one last high.

 

Red was sure smart to clean up ahead of time.

 

Nikki was right, Fisher could do much better, though $18 an hour is pretty good these days.  If the prison is federally funded/run, isn't there an union?  Or other requirements before simply firing someone?

 

Huh, an episode that I can finally feel sorry for Piper.  She goes through the crap of getting furlough, then misses seeing her grandmother.

 

Ah crap, pornstache is back.

[smcallah]

It took me the longest time to figure out that we were seeing Rosa's backstory because I could have sworn her present day self was Russian while the flashback her was Latina.

 

What bothered me most about Young Rosa vs. present Rosa was the lips.  Young Rosa had these big yummy, kissing lips, and present Rosa has thin lips.  I don't believe that when you get older your lips shrink.

[Blakeston]

I've been holding off on the Rosa's accent debate because I want to test something and I haven't had time: I want to listen to her accent with my eyes closed. 

 

I'm wondering if part of the reason people are hearing her accent a little strangely is because she looks so otherworldly, post-chemo (bald head, no eyebrows, etc).

 

And she speaks in a low, gruff register that is somewhat reminiscent of Red's voice, without actually sounding like a Russian accent either. So without any visual cues as to her ethnicity, PLUS her voice 'sort of' sounds like Red's...I think that's how people are arriving at Russian/eastern European. But I suspect her accenting actually is Latin in essence.

 

Or it's that her accent just sounds a lot more Russian than Latina.

 

I know what a Russian accent sounds like, and I know what a Spanish accent sounds like, and the way present-day Rosa was speaking doesn't sound Spanish at all to me. And I've seen comments all over the internet from Spanish-speakers wondering why present-day Rosa doesn't sound Spanish at all.

Edited September 27, 2014 by Blakeston

[CherithCutestory]

I was thrown at first by Fischer getting fired and then I realized she was relatively new. My guess (wank?) is that maybe she was in her probation period.

 

 

Yes, in government jobs you are usually not in the Union for the next three to six months. Until then you are at-will like everyone else. Even then it still isn't this easy to fire someone but it isn't that big of a stretch. She really was bad at the job.

 

I mean if Chapman can get a furlough for 48 hours without any kind of escort, or even an ankle monitor, when with her families wealth and connections around the world she has to be a massive flight risk (especially after Chapman recently spent a month in solitary), I can totally see how someone with years of good behavior would be allowed to sit in a car for a few hours without supervision.

 

 

I don't think Chapman's family is extraordinarily wealthy. She is obviously better off than 99% of the inmates but they are upper-middle class not rolling in dough. It would also be insane for someone like her to ruin her life by escaping prison. She had a sentence of a little over a year in a minimum security prison. If she fled she would be doing twenty in max.

 

And Chapman isn't a deluisonal stalker, which the administation had to know Morello was. Delusional stalkers sometimes make irrational choices.

 

When Brook started crying about having to shower, I thought that we would find out she had a huge scar on her back or something but nope, she just hates water?

 

 

I am pretty sure she just didn't feel comfortable or safe being naked around other people. Not because of anything revolting but because it just wasn't within her comfort level.

 

I have always thought Healy gets kind of a bad rap on the show.  He really does care about the girls, he is just powerless at times to do anything about it due to him not being high enough in the chain of command.  Its kind of the same with his wife as well.  Yes their situation is kind of weird, but he does try with her and just gets rejected.  I truly think he means well, he just can't show it all the time like he did with Piper in this episode.

 

 

He threw Piper in solitary (and was willing to leave here there indefinitely) for dancing with a woman. As has been pointed out through out the series, that is a pretty serious punishment and shouldn't be overused. When even Pornstache said that was unacceptable. He called a fiance about uncomfirmed lesbian rumors. He, an official responsible for her safety, was willing to leave her to die as she begged for his help. Because she likes have sex with women and because he got in very mild trouble for his own actions.

 

I don't think he has anyone's best interests in mind. He wants to be thought of as a nice guy. But he isn't one. He just wants the girls to like him.

Edited December 17, 2014 by CherithCutestory

[Hanahope]

And Chapman isn't a deluisonal stalker, which the administation had to know Morello was. Delusional stalkers sometimes make irrational choices.

 

We know she was/is a delusional stalker, but I don't think the administration knew that.  I got the impression she got convicted for mail fraud.  Even if there was some testimony about her stalking at her trial (assuming she just didn't plead out), such information isn't contained in her court/prison records.

[CherithCutestory]

There shouldn't be testimony concerning unconfirmed accusations of stalking at a trial for mail fraud. And it would be uncomfirmed if there had never been a trial on it. Christopher also pointed to copious evidence of it (texts and letters) so I don't see why they wouldn't put her on trial.

 

Crossing state boundaries to stalk and harrass, as she did when she followed them on vacation to Jersey, is a federal crime.  And that is what we saw her on trial for. So, I think it is safe to assume she was convicted of it at some point. Even if she was later convicted of mail fraud and is serving a split sentence with a state sentence. If she was ever convicted of it, even if that isn't why she is in Litchfield, then it would be on her BOP and they would be well aware of it.

 

http://www.victimsofcrime.org/our-programs/stalking-resource-center/stalking-laws/federal-stalking-laws

 

It would be horrible writing to show a scene in a court room discussing evidence of stalking and have that be completely unrelated to what she was convicted for.

Edited December 23, 2014 by CherithCutestory